147 replies
Just a note for all you marketer's out there.

I know that the men outnumber the women in this business quite significantly, but if you call me Dude, I will unsubscribe from your list.

Just a thought

Di
#call #dude
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    • Profile picture of the author DianaHeuser
      Originally Posted by daleron View Post

      dude....chill
      :p :p :p

      Clever
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    • Profile picture of the author Steve B
      I get that same reference in emails all the time and to be honest, I think it shows a lack of respect on the part of the marketer regardless of the gender of the subscriber.

      What's wrong with addressing your emails to the first name of the subscriber? Most reputable email programs have the ability to merge the recipients name in the greeting.

      If not, I personally think addressing a subscriber as "friend" or "reader" is a lot less offensive.

      Just for the fun of it, I asked Mr. Webster what "dude" meant. The definition is "an urban Easterner visiting a western ranch."

      How many subscribers does that really fit?

      Sure, the word is used in fun, usually with no malice intended. But just like telling jokes, talking politics, or mentioning religions, it's bound to be offensive to some portion of the audience . . . and therefore, best not used at all.

      Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author James Clark
      Well it sounds like some of you are not accustomed to being around sales people. Honestly, its been my experience they actually talk like that sometimes. I would like to tell you a story. One of my moms sister’s daughters had twins and she asked my mom to buy her twins bulk beds.

      So, as usual she sent my Father and me to pay for the thing. Now my father is 6’ 3” and weights about 270lbs. And I’m not a small man.

      We walked in the store. And the salesman walked up to my dad and said can I help you Hoss?

      My dad turned around and said to him. How did you know my name was Hoss? The salesman’s replied well I didn’t. Is it? My Dad said no! And don’t call me that anymore F****** more and walked out of the store. (LOL)

      To me that was stupid and he lost the sale. You have to be careful what you say to people these days.
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    • Profile picture of the author darren13
      I agree always add dudette.....
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    • Profile picture of the author RogueOne
      "But you're a chick, Dude." - Eric Cartman
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      • Profile picture of the author markwilson4074
        Originally Posted by RogueOne View Post

        "But you're a chick, Dude." - Eric Cartman
        Sure, sounds good to me.
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    • Profile picture of the author Brains Gone Wild
      Originally Posted by fin View Post

      I hear ya,

      That's why I always include dudette
      me, too! In almost every email or video we do, we say dudes and dudettes
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  • Profile picture of the author Randy Bishop
    Banned
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Randy Bishop View Post

      Lighten up Dude.. I'm sure there's worse things a woman can be called... In fact, I'm positive
      I can think of quite a few unflattering, but highly feminine names that "we" could call you, since you don't seem to be sensitive to marketing to women.
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      • Profile picture of the author Randy Bishop
        Banned
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        • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Randy Bishop View Post

          Please do... I enjoy flirtatious exchanges
          s'up biatch?
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          • Profile picture of the author Bill Hugall
            I wish they had an "awesome comment" button. This would be it hands down. If I saw an email with that headline. I would buy just because that is awesome


            Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

            s'up biatch?
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  • Profile picture of the author daleron
    Just jokin

    EDIT:

    You lobbed it out there right over the plate. I think it set the tone for the rest of this thread nicely!
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  • Profile picture of the author thatkeywordguy
    I think it's rude too.

    That's why I call everyone on my list "bro"
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  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
    Banned
    Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

    Just a note for all you marketer's out there.

    I know that the men outnumber the women in this business quite significantly, but if you call me Dude, I will unsubscribe from your list.

    Just a thought

    Di
    Get ready ... It's coming ...

    Howdy Dudes and Dudettes,

    Boy do I have a doozy of an offer for you
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  • Profile picture of the author TheArticlePros
    [DELETED]
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  • Profile picture of the author Mwind076
    From another woman...THANK YOU!

    I can't stand "Dude" or "Hey man" or "Dear Sir" - yes, you just got deleted and added to spam.
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    • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
      Originally Posted by Mwind076 View Post

      From another woman...THANK YOU!

      I can't stand "Dude" or "Hey man" or "Dear Sir" - yes, you just got deleted and added to spam.
      Unsubscribing is fine, but to report somebody as a spammer for a list you subscribed to, just because you don't like the salutation he used, is a bit overboard and not very ethical. Don't ya think, dude?
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  • Profile picture of the author HKSEO Jonbones
    Once I called a woman I thought was a man 'dude'. She said, "thanks, dude"
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  • Profile picture of the author alpinewood
    Banned
    dude is usually a compliment depending on the context , it's like referring to a group of people as "guys" regardless of gender ;-)
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    • Profile picture of the author RogueOne
      Patterns emerge...they have a sort of "language." The newcomer starts with "how wasted am I?" and the group replies with a resounding chorus of "Duuude..." - Sheldon Cooper
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
      Originally Posted by alpinewood View Post

      dude is usually a compliment depending on the context , it's like referring to a group of people as "guys" regardless of gender ;-)
      There is the way something is intended, and then there is the way that it's received. Just as a reader can't always judge intent, the sender can't always predict how the message will be received.

      I, for one, do not like being called "dude". I find it disrespectful, and certainly don't think of it as a compliment. However, it doesn't bother so much that it would make me unsubscribe from someone's list IF the rest of the content was good.

      On the other hand, if they address me as dude and then engage in overly-casual speech throughout their message, then THAT could be a problem.

      We are often told to "build a relationship" with our lists, but there still needs to be a certain level of professionalism in most cases. "Dude" is too casual, and may not come across in the way it is intended.

      To be clear, I'm not slamming anyone for using the word, but rather cautioning them to think twice before doing so.

      All the best,
      Michael
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  • Profile picture of the author Tim Franklin
    I was reading this thread and just could not help myself.

    Aerosmith - Dude looks like a Lady - Live 2007 - YouTube
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  • Profile picture of the author Joe Mobley
    Yes ma'am. I'll take that under advisement.

    Joe Mobley


    Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

    Just a note for all you marketer's out there.

    I know that the men outnumber the women in this business quite significantly, but if you call me Dude, I will unsubscribe from your list.

    Just a thought

    Di
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  • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
    I just use, "Hi there"......seems to work.

    RoD
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  • Profile picture of the author magiclouie
    Nice one buddy.
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  • Profile picture of the author IMSince2003
    The way most marketers fling out their spam, they might as well open their email with: "Hey friggin' idiot," Really. Oh, and I don't want to know it's your birthday or where you are taking the family for your next trip on my dime......
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  • Profile picture of the author brentb
    All jokes aside, he should continue to address his subscribers as "dudes" if that is effective towards his demographics, if not then he should change it. Makes no difference if you personally like it or not.
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    • Profile picture of the author RogueOne
      Originally Posted by brentb View Post

      All jokes aside, he should continue to address his subscribers as "dudes" if that is effective towards his demographics, if not then he should change it. Makes no difference if you personally like it or not.
      I agree.

      I have a guitar lessons list and I often open with "Hey, future rockstar!"

      No one un-subs from this list, under 0.5%, so it must not bother them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Robert Michael
    Whoaaaaaaaaaaa, calm down! Sorry dude!

    LOL (this post isnt serious in case anyone was wondering)
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  • Profile picture of the author czilbersher
    I have the same problem in reverse! I call everyone 'biATCH!' but I'm pretty sure that's a feminine form and need the male equivalent. Would that be biOTCH'?
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    • Originally Posted by czilbersher View Post

      I have the same problem in reverse! I call everyone 'biATCH!' but I'm pretty sure that's a feminine form and need the male equivalent. Would that be biOTCH'?
      The male equivalent (perhaps ironically) is a$$hole.
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  • Profile picture of the author successpaving
    Dude, don't be Rude!
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  • Profile picture of the author Black Hat Cat
    Banned
    Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

    Just a note for all you marketer's out there.

    I know that the men outnumber the women in this business quite significantly, but if you call me Dude, I will unsubscribe from your list.

    Just a thought

    Di
    I disagree. Not much thought goes into a silly decision like that at all. Next thing you know you'll be unsubscribing over the word apartment, or the word binders.
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  • Profile picture of the author louie6925
    I dont get why anyone would address their potential customers with 'dude' anyway! Regardless of what sex they are, if you want them to buy from you ever, then you need to look like a pro!...........'dude' makes you look like such an amateur!
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      • Profile picture of the author BillyBee
        This is just a sign you're getting old. If you listen to girls aged 17 to 25, you'd hear them calling each other dude all the time.
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        • Profile picture of the author LarryC
          Originally Posted by BillyBee View Post

          This is just a sign you're getting old. If you listen to girls aged 17 to 25, you'd hear them calling each other dude all the time.
          Yes, I just saw a movie where two young women (not even teens) were constantly calling each other "dude." It's also common to say, "you guys," even when referring to females.

          Some people don't like being called "friend." "Sir or Madam" is very formal, and is usually used in scam emails. I suppose all that's left is constantly using the recipient's name, which is a bit fake since it's all done with software.

          This is just one reason why I don't like email marketing. Too much risk of offending people without even trying
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  • Profile picture of the author celente
    Hey dude,

    If you actually bothered to do some reaseach on what the meaning of DUDE is, you would be so much more pissed right now.....Bwwwhahahahahah!

    I will leave it up to you!....LOL...good luck dude! *winks*
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  • Profile picture of the author noahamsterdam
    Point taken!!
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  • Profile picture of the author Devin X
    Banned
    Goes to show that some people want the personal touch. There's discussion about whether or not collecting and including your subs' firstnames in your emails will help you out. Some say yes, others say no, and to keep it generalized as if you're addressing a crowd.

    Personally, some lists I only collect an email address and I keep the emails general with no "dude, dudette, bro, sis, etc". Other lists where I collect first names, I use your name and speak in a conversational manner.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      If "The Real Dudeman" is going to start objecting to being called "Dude", I'm definitely unsubscribing ...
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      • Profile picture of the author Indecision
        I think the worst is when they call you "friend". Bitch please, if you were my friend a) you would know my name and b) you would't be trying to sell me your shitty affiliate program!
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        • Profile picture of the author Mwind076
          Originally Posted by Indecision View Post

          I think the worst is when they call you "friend". Bitch please, if you were my friend a) you would know my name and b) you would't be trying to sell me your shitty affiliate program!
          I think you and I could be friends...for real.
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      • Profile picture of the author Devin X
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

        If "The Real Dudeman" is going to start objecting to being called "Dude", I'm definitely unsubscribing ...
        Not at all, lol. I'm just including the discourse on email marketing etiquette. I say something like "hey there" or "I have a new gift for you" or etc. If it's on my list where I collect your firstname, then I'll use the firstname_fix so it makes it a bit more personal.
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  • Profile picture of the author J Bold
    While "dude" is more often used between males or to refer to males, the term is not technically gender specific, and can be used to refer to woman, as well.

    But I'm glad it was important enough to make a whole thread about this. Good to know. I'll be sure to call everyone "dude" in my next email.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mwind076
      Originally Posted by J Bold View Post

      While "dude" is more often used between males or to refer to males, the term is not technically gender specific, and can be used to refer to woman, as well.

      But I'm glad it was important enough to make a whole thread about this. Good to know. I'll be sure to call everyone "dude" in my next email.
      Always nice when someone "gets it." I'm thinking you haven't been around any women, or you'd have a different opinion.
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    • Profile picture of the author Missionmarketer
      Originally Posted by J Bold View Post

      While "dude" is more often used between males or to refer to males, the term is not technically gender specific, and can be used to refer to woman, as well.
      .
      That's silly.

      Of course it's gender specific.

      Women are not called dudes and they do not refer to each other as dudes. Only men are called dudes and refer to each other as dudes.

      "Dude" is very gender specific.
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by J Bold View Post

      While "dude" is more often used between males or to refer to males, the term is not technically gender specific, and can be used to refer to woman, as well.

      But I'm glad it was important enough to make a whole thread about this. Good to know. I'll be sure to call everyone "dude" in my next email.
      That's not what ***I*** heard over DECADES! NOW, they are even calling women SIR!!!!! The average male does NOT want to be called female, and OBVIOUSLY, the average female does NOT want to be called MALE!

      Dude is a term used by SOME males to refer to certain males in an informal way. It is generally NOT proper in business or advertising!

      BTW I RESENT strangers calling me friend or honey. Call me that and I can BARELY hear you over the SCREAMS of "SCAMMER" in my head!

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author cypherslock
    Being called Dude is better than being called DUD....IJS.
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  • Profile picture of the author sirtiman
    Who's calling "dude" anyway? Expose a little bit. Let's smile today.
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  • Profile picture of the author hustlinsmoke
    You got it, Dudette.
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  • Profile picture of the author LarryC
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  • Profile picture of the author Mwind076
    If I EVER send out an email blast...which I won't. I'm going to go with "SUP Bitches?!" Since dude is all encompassing, I think mine'll work just fine.
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    • Profile picture of the author Missionmarketer
      Originally Posted by Mwind076 View Post


      If I EVER send out an email blast...which I won't. I'm going to go with "SUP Bitches?!"
      How respectful, mature and professional of you.
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      • Profile picture of the author Bill Hugall
        Originally Posted by Missionmarketer View Post

        How respectful, mature and professional of you.
        How sensitive and over the top of you. Like really:confused: Some fun has crept into this thread.:rolleyes:
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      • Profile picture of the author Mwind076
        Originally Posted by Missionmarketer View Post

        How respectful, mature and professional of you.
        I was kidding...as most people are on this thread...how unperceptive of you.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mr. Ken Russell
    but dude.. I was only trying to be polite
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  • Profile picture of the author cooler1
    Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

    Just a note for all you marketer's out there.

    I know that the men outnumber the women in this business quite significantly, but if you call me Dude, I will unsubscribe from your list.

    Just a thought

    Di
    Didn't you like Hurley from Lost then?
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  • Profile picture of the author seobro
    Hi Diana:
    Dude use to mean tender foot, so it is a bit disrespectful. Still, look at the intent of the person.

    Hi thatkeywordguy:
    I like calling people bro, but I am the SEO BRO.
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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    I can understand the disconnect but did you really think that marketer who called you dude was sending an individual email to everyone on their list?
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      There is the way something is intended, and then there is the way that it's received.
      Yep. And we get to choose how we receive it. If we want to be offended, we will be, even when there's no real reason for it. If we want to look for the positive, we'll find it, even when we have to look outside the message.
      "Dude" is too casual
      For... what?

      For your preferences? Okay. No argument there. But beyond that, you aren't in a position to make that judgment. The writer or speaker may well have decided in advance that they're looking for people who want a specific style of communication, or who just don't dislike casual conversation too much.

      I used to have a policy for my first conversation with prospective clients, back when I had clients. It was simple: If they didn't laugh twice in the early part of the first conversation, we didn't do business. Nothing wrong with people who want business to be formal, obviously. They just aren't the people I want to spend my time with.

      As far as the whole, "using their first name" thing in bulk email... For me, it's only with customers. I feel that's appropriate, although some would disagree and have just as much basis for their opinion. But when I send out my newsletter, it's "Hi, folks."
      Of course it's gender specific.
      It WAS. But that was when women were commonly addressed as "chicks" and didn't take exception to the label.

      I think people really need to learn to spend less time looking for reasons to defend their egos, and more time making an effort to understand what's being said.

      If anyone wants to decide I'm sexist for that position, feel free. It will make just about as much sense as the rest of this thread.

      Oh... Keith Giffen came up with the non-gender-specific vulgarity for one of these words years ago: Bastich.


      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
        Banned
        Originally Posted by WillR View Post

        I can understand the disconnect but did you really think that marketer who called you dude was sending an individual email to everyone on their list?
        Do you really think an email marketer is so stupid that they don't know that there are other greetings and salutations that are not gender specific or that they could take advantage of technology and insert first name here?

        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        Yep. And we get to choose how we receive it. If we want to be offended, we will be, even when there's no real reason for it. If we want to look for the positive, we'll find it, even when we have to look outside the message.For... what?

        Paul
        I'm a bit surprised by your take on this. I get your newsletter and it never gives me the momentary "jar" that being called a dude does. It isn't serious ...but it is an automatic response to being referred to by a male name.

        Happens in the threads here all the time and occasionally in email. Thanks dude. Yeah ... I just spent 5 minutes of my time uploading a screenshot to illustrate how to solve your problem and you can't take a second to notice that I'm a female? Forget the avatar jokes, please ... My first name is right above it and I don't think it can be mistaken for one of those names that could go either way.

        Maybe the men don't think it's a big deal, because they aren't routinely referred to by a feminine name. While it's not an earth shattering thing, as I said, every time it happens, there's this momentary thing in my head .... Dude ... I'm not a dude. My initial thought on those that routinely do this is that they're a kid and teen/early 20s slang is all they know. It might be wrong or right. Doesn't matter. It's the impression I'm left with.

        Of course we can choose to be offended or not offended by being called by a male name, and normally, I don't go the whole offended route because it's so damned common that I'd spend too much time feeling offended :p ... but is it that hard to come up with something that offends no one?
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        • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
          Suzanne,
          I'm a bit surprised by your take on this. I get your newsletter and it never gives me the momentary "jar" that being called a dude does.
          That's because I live by a simpler philosophy: A gentleman tries not to offend others accidentally.

          I don't mind offending people ON purpose, WITH a purpose. But casual rudeness is something I try very hard to avoid.

          That said, I'm not sure how my comments about giving the other person the benefit of the doubt create a conflict?


          Paul
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          • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
            Banned
            Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

            Suzanne,That's because I live by a simpler philosophy: A gentleman tries not to offend others accidentally.

            I don't mind offending people ON purpose, WITH a purpose. But casual rudeness is something I try very hard to avoid.

            That said, I'm not sure how my comments about giving the other person the benefit of the doubt create a conflict?

            Paul
            It doesn't create a conflict really and I do sort of give them the benefit of the doubt. In reality, I have a mental picture in my head of a kid/teen or in famous words of "Vinnie", a yewt.

            What Is A Yewt? Sound Clip and Quote - Hark
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        • Profile picture of the author seasoned
          Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

          Do you really think an email marketer is so stupid that they don't know that there are other greetings and salutations that are not gender specific or that they could take advantage of technology and insert first name here?
          You have THAT right! Next thing you know, people will say that using BCC or copy is FINE to send out bulk mail, and nobody should be concerned that there email is made public in such a way.

          I'm a bit surprised by your take on this. I get your newsletter and it never gives me the momentary "jar" that being called a dude does. It isn't serious ...but it is an automatic response to being referred to by a male name.
          I just hate the informality of it. It is like a stranger calling you "FRIEND" to try to sell you something. Ironically, I generally don't like sir, for the same reason. If someone walks that ******BROAD****** road in between, I am FINE!

          And as for OUR being too easily upset by it? YEAH! Us and MILLIONS of others! I thought they idea of such things was to convey info, and sell. It is best to try to find a way to approach the most people.

          Maybe the men don't think it's a big deal, because they aren't routinely referred to by a feminine name. While it's not an earth shattering thing, as I said, every time it happens, there's this momentary thing in my head .... Dude ... I'm not a dude. My initial thought on those that routinely do this is that they're a kid and teen/early 20s slang is all they know. It might be wrong or right. Doesn't matter. It's the impression I'm left with.
          Well, I'm a man, and I don't like the informality. And when I say informal, I DON'T mean I want it formal. In some languages, like German, you have formal and familiar pronouns. It IS changing, but HISTORICALLY.... If you don't want to be formal, you should stay away from the familiar pronouns. The familiar are HISTORICALLY for FRIENDS and COLLEAGUES, UNLESS they are KNOWN peers, younger relatives, animals, or PETS! Now, it IS changing! Germany and Denmark, and probably others, that USED to have such a clear line, see it broadening, but it can STILL be offensive. Even FRIENDS at some point in germany ask... "Darf ich Ihnen Duzen"(Can I use familiar grammer with you?) BTW I say FAMILIAR, rather than the common informal, because it is clearer. ANYWAY, I found a good explanation that even covers the topic HERE!!!!!!

          „Darf ich Sie duzen?â€" or German intimacy issues « my german diction

          Replace DU, with DUDE, and SIE with "NOT FAMILIAR", and the next paragraph makes MY case!

          "I once had a job where I had to work for a man who was in every respect a horrible person. Unfortunately, before I realized that, I had agreed to address each other with "Du" and first names. From that point on I cringed every time I heard him call me "Du". I didn't want this guy to think we were friends. I wanted to make clear that we were very different people and that I don't want him close to me in any respect. I kept wondering whether there was any polite way to return to the formal address. Unfortunately there is none. So I guess my personal rule of thumb and advice is this: When in doubt, start with "Sie", if only because it is much easier and more pleasant to go from formal to informal."

          Of course we can choose to be offended or not offended by being called by a male name, and normally, I don't go the whole offended route because it's so damned common that I'd spend too much time feeling offended :p ... but is it that hard to come up with something that offends no one?
          I don't know.... Ever hear the song called "a boy named sue?"


          Steve
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      • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        For your preferences? Okay. No argument there. But beyond that, you aren't in a position to make that judgment. The writer or speaker may well have decided in advance that they're looking for people who want a specific style of communication, or who just don't dislike casual conversation too much.
        I think most people, even in this thread, would agree that dude is casual.

        But, you grabbed only a few words and that allowed you to counter a point I wasn't really making.

        For the record, I said...

        We are often told to "build a relationship" with our lists, but there still needs to be a certain level of professionalism in most cases. "Dude" is too casual, and may not come across in the way it is intended.
        I was not using the word casual in the sense of familiar, but rather as a different from professional (as in casual Friday).

        I thought the overall tone of my post made it clear that I was only speaking about my opinion, but...that just goes to show how intent and reception can differ.

        The point I got from your response was that people shouldn't be so touchy about their reception. My point is that writers should give some thought as to how their words could be received.

        - - - - - - - -

        As to the debate about whether or not dude is gender-neutral? Well, we have had several women mention that they do NOT consider it to be neutral, so that gets us back to intent/reception.

        Anyway, if someone has a list that responds well to Dude, or Sir, or Maestro, or Conquistador, or Cupcake, then that's cool.

        All the best,
        Michael
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  • Profile picture of the author DianaHeuser
    Good grief.

    Well that opened up a hornets nest. I particularly enjoyed the "You must be old" comment which is true by the way.

    Interesting viewpoints which made me think about the way I send out my emails. It's possible that my 'age' makes me too formal in my emails.

    I might have to take some lessons from my teenage girls on how to address a younger generation.

    I wonder if this would work?

    "Hey Ho's and Bro's.

    How's it hanging? Got this g8 product 4 u."


    Yes? No?

    Ok that was a joke. I would not feel remotely comfortable writing that but you guys and gals have given me food for thought on how I address my list.

    Thank you.

    Sincerely,

    Diana Heuser
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    • Profile picture of the author BillyBee
      Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

      "Hey Ho's and Bro's.
      "Don't bro me if you don't know me"

      --Something I saw on a T-shirt and perhaps words to email by.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Diana,
      It's possible that my 'age' makes me too formal in my emails.
      Piffle. I'm quite a bit older than you, ma'am, and I ain't all that formal.


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      • Profile picture of the author brentb
        I personally hate emails or people for that matter calling me sir, friend is somewhat cheesy IMO...

        I feel like people from my age group (mid-20's) would be more likely to respond to "Dude" or similar informal speech etc. I actually am on a few lists that address the list very informally.

        Its a generational thing, a few decades ago, you wouldn't be covered in tats and have facial piercings working at a bank and you would be expected to wear a suit and men would have a clean shave. Now, at one of my banks, people there have tats, facial piercings, beards and they wear more stylish clothes, skinny ties, no jackets etc. This is expected now and the same goes for how we talk. Formality is over rated.

        BTW: Dude definitely goes for both men and women. Many females call each other dudes.
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    • Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

      Good grief.

      Well that opened up a hornets nest. I particularly enjoyed the "You must be old" comment which is true by the way.

      Interesting viewpoints which made me think about the way I send out my emails. It's possible that my 'age' makes me too formal in my emails.

      I might have to take some lessons from my teenage girls on how to address a younger generation.

      I wonder if this would work?

      "Hey Ho's and Bro's.

      How's it hanging? Got this g8 product 4 u."


      Yes? No?

      Ok that was a joke. I would not feel remotely comfortable writing that but you guys and gals have given me food for thought on how I address my list.

      Thank you.

      Sincerely,

      Diana Heuser
      No problem, sweet-cheeks!
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  • Profile picture of the author Sagar Mehta
    Last I remember, this guy, and ONLY this guy has the right to be called 'dude':

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  • Profile picture of the author Will Edwards
    That's why we could do with some neuter pronouns in English.

    Will
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by Will Edwards View Post

      That's why we could do with some neuter pronouns in English.

      Will
      We HAVE them! It s just that the third party neuter is ALSO inappropriate. I LOVE it, there is a movie about a boy that has been augmented such that all consider him a robot. (daryl) I believe he is in EVERY way a boy, looks like a boy...Given a chance will act like a boy...etc....

      Everyone refers to him as IT, They see him as a ROBOT! One person calls him HIM, and you know what he says? "THANK YOU"!

      Be happy we have neuter first person pronouns. Did you know that in SOME languages, like Hindi and Arabic, that first person pronouns have gender?

      Steve
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      • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
        Funny, I tried to think of a greeting that offended me so I could participate here but I couldn't remember any. As a matter of fact, I couldn't remember any that didn't offend me either.

        I can only remember the ones that do start out with Terra. Yes, I know it is just a script that inserts my name and everyone else gets one with their name on it too. But yet, it obviously has made an impression on me. So don't toss out that method just yet if you use it too.

        Oh, and Steve honey, I mean friend, er, um...Heck, I blew it, never mind. :p

        Terra
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        • Profile picture of the author seasoned
          Originally Posted by MissTerraK View Post

          Funny, I tried to think of a greeting that offended me so I could participate here but I couldn't remember any. As a matter of fact, I couldn't remember any that didn't offend me either.

          I can only remember the ones that do start out with Terra. Yes, I know it is just a script that inserts my name and everyone else gets one with their name on it too. But yet, it obviously has made an impression on me. So don't toss out that method just yet if you use it too.

          Oh, and Steve honey, I mean friend, er, um...Heck, I blew it, never mind. :p

          Terra
          At least YOU seem nice, are a woman, and I believe from around such areas, so it's fine. And YOU aren't trying to sell me anything.

          HEY, it isn't like I will just IGNORE, or throw it out. Consider this a TEST! You PASS, and I pay you! Familiar addresses mean you have to otherwise get a higher score!

          Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    Cant believe no-ones posted this one.

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  • Profile picture of the author Janice Stacy
    We should call you "Didi" which means "Sister" in Hindi.
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  • Profile picture of the author datingworld
    Simply start your emails with "Dear Subscriber"
    End of the story
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  • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
    Kewl! I'm a yewt!

    (Is that better than being an old bastich?)
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Whenever you log into the internet you should leave your ego offline.
      Give that man a Klondike Bar!
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      • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
        DM,

        Yep. This is like the people who go to my 2200+ word sign-up page and opt in to get the 100+ page ebook, then complain because the emails they get are too long. Someone missed the memo. That doesn't make them bad, but I'm not losing sleep over their unsubscribes.

        Or, to use a different example, it's like someone seeing one of Caliban's videos and signing up, then griping because he's raw in his emails.

        DOH!

        You may or may not like the style, but he tells you right up front what you'll be getting, and he is absolutely consistent and honest about delivering it.

        Too many people are confused about the difference between "not my style" and "must be wrong." If it were up to me, they'd all need to re-take first grade...


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  • Profile picture of the author priyankeshu
    reminds me of Pamela Anderson

    Don't call me babe
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    • Profile picture of the author DianaHeuser
      Originally Posted by bassem View Post

      i would ask aweber to put the sex field in their from ! clever huh
      Actually that's a brilliant idea. Then have a script that allows us to call them something based on their gender (assuming of course that they put one in).

      Or you could create a custom field to do that and then just send out two different emails with a different tone of voice.

      Nice!!
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      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

        Actually that's a brilliant idea. Then have a script that allows us to call them something based on their gender (assuming of course that they put one in).

        Or you could create a custom field to do that and then just send out two different emails with a different tone of voice.

        Nice!!
        At the place I am at now, I am on an HR project. I looked at the first like 90 people. Only ONE was MALE!!!!!!! DOZENS were FEMALE! The rest? UNKNOWN! It REALLY makes you wonder!

        Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author brentb
      Originally Posted by bassem View Post

      i would ask aweber to put the sex field in their from ! clever huh
      Then you could make it say "Dude" to dudes and "Female Dude" to female dudes! Genius!

      There actually is a script out there that analyzes the name and tells you with like 95% accuracy if its a male/female. I mean if you really think its that important.
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      • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
        Originally Posted by brentb View Post

        There actually is a script out there that analyzes the name and tells you with like 95% accuracy if its a male/female. I mean if you really think its that important.
        Hear that, Alice Cooper, Michael Learned, Glenn Close, and Mandy Patinkin?



        (Sorry, couldn't resist.)

        ~Michael
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        • Profile picture of the author wordwizard
          Tellman Knudson was the first one who addressed me as DUDE (often in the subject line, which went: "DUUUUUUDE!"

          Which annoyed me enough to banish him from my inbox after a few repeats.

          Originally Posted by joseph7384 View Post

          Here is a list of both opening Salutations, as well as, closing Salutations.

          Opening Salutation Greetings

          Source: List of greetings - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



          Closing Salutations


          Source:List of Letter Closings and E-mail Goodbyes | Suite101
          LOL. I especially liked "How art thou?" That should go over REALLY well ;-)


          Originally Posted by Will Edwards View Post

          That's why we could do with some neuter pronouns in English.

          Will
          I totally agree that we should have some of those...

          Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

          Hear that, Alice Cooper, Michael Learned, Glenn Close, and Mandy Patinkin?



          (Sorry, couldn't resist.)

          ~Michael
          LOL! There's "Robin" too - From Robin Williams to Robin Gibb to all the female Robins (Givens, Wright Penn, Quivers, etc.) All the American Robins I know are women BTW!

          Elisabeth (which I have yet to see mistaken as a male first name, which hasn't stopped people from addressing me as "Dear Sir" or, yes, Duuuuude!
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        • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
          Michael,
          I think most people, even in this thread, would agree that dude is casual.
          Indeed. My objection was to the modifier 'too.' That moved the comment from an observation about common usage to a judgement.

          I am always intrigued by the way people use the word 'professional.' Everyone seems to have their own definition for it (no surprise there), and they seem to think anything outside of that definition is somehow 'bad,' or undesirable.
          My point is that writers should give some thought as to how their words could be received.
          I got that. I was asking, "By whom?"

          There is no absolute definition or standard for "the right way" to speak to everyone. What you've said here applies very well to some audiences, and to others... Not so much.


          Paul
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          • Profile picture of the author NicheMayhem
            I think it's too casual as well.

            Having worked in a service industry like home computer repair, I am always very cautious when it comes to my wording. The goal was always right between friendly and professional which granted me many compliments and repeat customers. Friendly enough for them to be comfortable and professional enough for them to trust me. Perhaps that is partially due to the need for explanation specific to the services provided without getting too technical. But, having been in business for awhile now I find my customer's satisfaction is heavily influenced by the interaction while there. They need to like me and trust me first with quality of service coming in second on their importance meter.

            Email marketing is typically a crucial part of your online business so, to me, it comes down to how professional you would like your audience to perceive you. Also, to me, a person's inbox is no different then their front door so it is extremely important to come across trustworthy, capable and professional. I correlate professionalism with confidence which translates into me trusting your offer, product or service more. Almost as if using the word "dude" or anything like it conveys you just happened across whatever it is your selling. Where as having a more professional attitude, greeting, etc etc conveys you are confident that this product will do whatever it does. Make sense?

            Not that I won't trust you just based on using a casual word like "dude" but I definitely won't get the impression you are as capable as another business or product creator might be who comes across more professional.
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            • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
              I think it's too casual as well.
              And I think words like 'mayhem' (and apocalypse and hurricane and all the rest) indicate a tendency toward the chaotic and destructive.

              Perspective...

              If you believe that professionalism requires maintaining distance, you're free to operate on that belief. You will attract people who want the same thing. That may be exactly who you want to attract, in which case you've chosen the right approach. For you.

              I think you'd be surprised, though, at the people who are comfortable with more familiar speech patterns in their business dealings.


              Paul
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              • Profile picture of the author seasoned
                Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

                And I think words like 'mayhem' (and apocalypse and hurricane and all the rest) indicate a tendency toward the chaotic and destructive.

                Perspective...

                If you believe that professionalism requires maintaining distance, you're free to operate on that belief. You will attract people who want the same thing. That may be exactly who you want to attract, in which case you've chosen the right approach. For you.

                I think you'd be surprised, though, at the people who are comfortable with more familiar speech patterns in their business dealings.


                Paul
                Apocalypse is actually a Greek word meaning revelation. But HEY, you are talking about PERCEPTIONS there! People believe apocalypse means disaster because the NT book called revelation(or sometimes left with the old name of apocalypse, because it was originally in Greek) talks about a dystopia.

                Steve
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                • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
                  Steve,
                  Apocalypse is actually a Greek word meaning revelation. But HEY, you are talking about PERCEPTIONS there!
                  True and true. Also largely irrelevant within this specific context.

                  Still, a useful reminder.


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              • Profile picture of the author NicheMayhem
                Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

                And I think words like 'mayhem' (and apocalypse and hurricane and all the rest) indicate a tendency toward the chaotic and destructive.

                Perspective...

                Paul
                As usual Paul, you bring up a good point. However, I feel there is a difference between the way the word 'mayhem' would be perceived referring to a 'niche' as in "I enter a niche and destroy it" and greeting your audience with "dude" right before you pitch an offer. Which, I guess, now that you made me think about using 'mayhem' the way I meant it is sort of a slang way of speaking that is probably specific to my generation. For some reason, we refer to something we physically do as 'destroying it' which means we did it well. lol Sorry to clarify that but you're just so dang old I thought I had to. Truthfully though, there is just no way I'm going to let you change my mind about how clever my user name is.

                To even further argue against my comparison between casual and professional, your post made me think of something. Remember the "Dude, you're gettin' a Dell" ad campaigns? Made them A LOT of money. I definitely can't argue with that, especially since I have serviced tons upon tons of those model Dell PCs from all walks of life. Those ads were very successful for them.

                So, yeah, MY preference is:

                Calling me 'dude' taps into a personal preconceived notion that calling anyone dude in any sort of business related setting conveys hippy, druggy, surfer lack of intellect. But, apparently, that's just me.

                By the way, I've never bought a Dell and now I might know why. Interesting.
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            • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
              Banned
              Originally Posted by NicheMayhem View Post

              I think it's too casual as well.
              I don't see the issue as an issue of casual vs professional. I don't mind casual. In fact, I'm more casual than not and swearing in emails doesn't bother me at all. I just don't like being referred to by a male nickname. Simple as that.

              It's like addressing a man as hey ... ladies. How's it going?
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              • Profile picture of the author NicheMayhem
                Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

                I don't see the issue as an issue of casual vs professional. I don't mind casual. In fact, I'm more casual than not and swearing in emails doesn't bother me at all. I just don't like being referred to by a male nickname. Simple as that.

                It's like addressing a man as hey ... ladies. How's it going?
                Yeah I gotcha on that one. Totally agree and there isn't a male in this thread who would be okay with being referred to as "Ma'am"

                I was just giving my opinion on the impression I personally get being greeted with "Dude" in an email.

                Of course, it is relevant to consider how foolish I am before taking my opinion to heart. I just hopped into the lion's den and poked a big, burly, overly articulate lion in the eye with a stick by calling Paul Myers old. I'm sure I'll pay for that one here shortly.
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              • Profile picture of the author LarryC
                Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

                I don't see the issue as an issue of casual vs professional. I don't mind casual. In fact, I'm more casual than not and swearing in emails doesn't bother me at all. I just don't like being referred to by a male nickname. Simple as that.

                It's like addressing a man as hey ... ladies. How's it going?
                It's not quite like that, since "dude" is now used by many people to refer to either gender. Of course, not everyone approves of this usage.

                Check out the Urban Dictionary to see how many ways this term has been used over the years. But one of their definitions is:

                dude

                1) n. a name for anyone (stereotypically used by male surfters/skaters but now accepted by any race, sex, religion, and wealth)
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                • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
                  Banned
                  Originally Posted by LarryC View Post

                  It's not quite like that, since "dude" is now used by many people to refer to either gender. Of course, not everyone approves of this usage.

                  Check out the Urban Dictionary to see how many ways this term has been used over the years. But one of their definitions is:

                  dude

                  1) n. a name for anyone (stereotypically used by male surfters/skaters but now accepted by any race, sex, religion, and wealth)
                  Race, sex, religion, and wealth does not = gender.
                  Sorry, I don't buy it at all. It's as male as chick is female.
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                  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
                    Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

                    Race, sex, religion, and wealth does not = gender.
                    gen·der
                    [ jéndər ]
                    1. somebody's sex: the sex of a person or organism, or of a whole category of people or organisms
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                    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
                      Banned
                      Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

                      Correct. I didn't notice "sex" but none the less, I don't use the "Urban Dictionary" as reference material. Whether it's generational or urban or just plain thoughtless, Dude is a male nickname in the minds of many.

                      Again, I think that if men were routinely addressed by a feminine nickname, the responses here would be somewhat different.
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        • Profile picture of the author seasoned
          Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

          Hear that, Alice Cooper, Michael Learned, Glenn Close, and Mandy Patinkin?



          (Sorry, couldn't resist.)

          ~Michael
          Let me make this simple. There is ******NO****** way a program can have a 95% success rate! NO WAY! and 5% is 1 in 20, so THAT is too high.

          And Michael. YOU are being unfair! THOSE names are TRADITIONAL, and usually F,M,M,F. But what about UNTRADITIONAL! The ones that used to represent MAYBE 5% of Americans may now represent OVER 20%! Between the ages of 5 and 17 I may have personally dealt with maybe ONE indian. At the place where I am at now, I have to deal with maybe 10, and MANY there are INDIAN! In the past decade, I have had to PHONE over 2000 different indians! I'm not counting the THOUSANDS of spanish, polish, armenian, iranian, etc.... Throw the general patterns OUT! ALL that works are accurate matches. And how can you do THAT? What happens if you have a name like PETRA? PETRA in SOME cultures is FEMALE! In others, it is MALE!

          BTW did you know that MICHAEL is actually a hebrew phrase?

          MICHA= LOVED BY
          EL=God

          I don't know if there is even an implied gender.

          Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author JeremiahSay
    Imagine having your spouse calling you "dude" for 40 years.

    I'll give my future wife a shawn michael's kick if she calls me "dude." I rather have no wife than a wife who calls me "dude." lol, just kidding.
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  • Profile picture of the author johnben1444
    Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

    Just a note for all you marketer's out there.

    I know that the men outnumber the women in this business quite significantly, but if you call me Dude, I will unsubscribe from your list.

    Just a thought

    Di
    No worries dude for the last time, i just got WF to include "dude" in their list of blacklisted words.

    You can say dude and dude over and over again but it won't appear on any female members thread anymore.
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  • Profile picture of the author contentwriting360
    Banned
    Nice and light discussion going on here.

    I agree with Di, however. It's always my preference to call a person by his or her first name. If I don't know the person's name, I make sure to add a "P.S" in my email to mention the person's name so I can address him or her appropriately.
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  • Profile picture of the author IMSince2003
    Diana, thanks for starting a thread that I was sure would not be here still and stealing 30 minutes of my life because of "Dudes" out there.

    Lesson learned. Don't bring up politics, religion, or DUDES in your promotional emails!
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  • Profile picture of the author James Clark
    Sorry to hear that. I just say Hello there.
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  • Profile picture of the author m4dcoder
    It seems i have to implement a custom radio selection to my opt in form.
    Mr
    Miss/Mrs
    Name
    Email
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  • Profile picture of the author LarryC
    If nothing else, this thread illustrates the importance of building a targeted list. The internet is a vast entity that includes people of all descriptions and preferences. Some people, male or female, object to the informality of "dude." With a younger or less uptight audience, it may help the marketer bond with the audience. As long as you know who you're targeting, you can use the appropriate voice.

    I barely pay attention to these issues anymore and try to focus on what the message is really saying.
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  • Profile picture of the author sunray
    If you don't know your subscribers' name (why didn't you ask?), you have only one decent solution left: use 'To Whom It May Concern'
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  • Profile picture of the author Harry Nguyen
    If you hang around with lot of dudes, I'll treat you like a dude if you know what I mean. Don't take it the wrong way.
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    This is ME, this is WHO I AM... http://iamharrynguyen.com/

    "Take delight in the LORD, and he will give you the desires of your heart." - Psalm 37:4

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  • Profile picture of the author Steve L
    Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

    Just a note for all you marketer's out there.

    I know that the men outnumber the women in this business quite significantly, but if you call me Dude, I will unsubscribe from your list.

    Just a thought

    Di
    Thanks for the tip. My gf hates when I accidentally call her "man" or "dude". lol
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  • Profile picture of the author RogueOne
    So how many people are now going to remove the "name" field from their squeeze pages and just start every email with hello?

    That may even offend some hyper-sensetives.
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  • Profile picture of the author NeoGills
    Hey Dude! i will never call you dude
    sorry dude
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  • Profile picture of the author samsogee
    Point taken dude!
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  • Profile picture of the author RedShifted
    When I was in college it was pretty typical for women to call each other "dudes".

    It just sounds cooler than "dudette". Because generally speaking, men are cooler than women. But women shouldn't be mad. They're still the more powerful sex. They control wars, territory, money and sex. They can snap their fingers and basically have a man do whatever they want.

    Which in a way is a lot cooler than being a man. So maybe women really are dudes afterall. lolz.
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  • Profile picture of the author dorothybaez
    I'm 41 and my 22 year old son has called me dude since he was about 14. I called both my boys dude when they were little.

    This thread made me chuckle. I needed it - love this forum!
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  • Profile picture of the author Weedy92
    Feminist sloot bish Better? Seriously though you're asking for drama making this post, so I'm going to reply like this, which I rarely if ever do.
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  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
    Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

    I know that the men outnumber the women in this business quite significantly, but if you call me Dude, I will unsubscribe from your list.
    "Dude" has been a gender-neutral term for well over a decade. There was a short period of "dudes and dudettes" during the 1980s, but even the kind of people who say "dude" thought that was stupid and awkward.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      CD,
      There was a short period of "dudes and dudettes" during the 1980s, but even the kind of people who say "dude" thought that was stupid and awkward.
      Not to mention the women who thought 'dudette' was demeaning, because the 'ette' is a diminutive suffix.


      Paul
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      .
      Stop by Paul's Pub - my little hangout on Facebook.

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  • Profile picture of the author pyrosalad
    Why not just stay classy. "Ladies and gentlemen..."
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  • Profile picture of the author ProServices
    I wouldn't mind at all if people called me 'dude'. That wouldn't upset me but what did upset me was when my ex-boss harassed and called me 'my crumpet' meaning the bit on the side in Britain. So I told my ex-boss where to shove my Secretarial job, gave him a huge slap in front of other staff and stuffed a banana in his car exhaust (... I was tempted into stuffing the banana up his own exhaust but the angel inside of me calmed me down......lol). In fairness most men I have come across online and offline are really nice Gentlemen. It's only a small percentage that are out of order.

    All I need now is a step by step blueprint to making consistent income online to show my ex-boss that I can succeed without his job, as well as the other non believers.
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    • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
      Originally Posted by Rossy WF Members Rock View Post

      ...but what did upset me was when my ex-boss harassed and called me 'my crumpet' meaning the bit on the side in Britain.
      Hah. Haven't heard that term since the '70s - your boss wasn't Sid James, by any chance?

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      TOP TIP: To browse the forum like a Pro, select "View Classic" from the drop-down menu under your user name.

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      • Profile picture of the author ProServices
        Lol Frank. I've seen some of the 'Carry On' films with Sid James. He thought about Crumpet 24/7 and I think my ex-boss was a devoted fan of Sid. Believe me they still use the word 'crumpet' in East London even today.

        Originally Posted by Frank Donovan View Post

        Hah. Haven't heard that term since the '70s - your boss wasn't Sid James, by any chance?

        Profile Vid - YouTube
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  • Profile picture of the author Hackbridge
    Can't stand getting emails that say "Hello {FIRSTNAME}"


    Posted from Warrior Forum Reader for Android
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  • Profile picture of the author summerm
    i get called "Sir" by every overseas contractor. i think it's hilarious and i don't correct them!
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  • Profile picture of the author franktwin
    This must be a big list...lol
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  • Profile picture of the author aizaku
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    >> 2018 Money Making Method Video Guides [NO OPTIN] <<
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  • Profile picture of the author shawoon98
    While subscribing, some people write bad words in place of names and definitely they forget it afterwards. So when you address them with Hey {name!}, they get addressed with a bad name. I'm getting very lowered number of unsubscription.

    I imagine what I'll do if someone calls me "Duddette"...

    Originally Posted by DianaHeuser View Post

    Just a note for all you marketer's out there.

    I know that the men outnumber the women in this business quite significantly, but if you call me Dude, I will unsubscribe from your list.

    Just a thought

    Di
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  • Profile picture of the author marthaswares
    Oh you are so right....sooo corny !
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    MonsterMarketingSecrets.com
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  • Profile picture of the author skibbz
    Check this out, THIS IS A MUST SEE!! LMAO!
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  • Profile picture of the author eternalsongbird
    [DELETED]
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  • Profile picture of the author dsouravs
    most of my employers call me Dude
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    I can convert your Non-Responsive website to Responsive website ... How sweet is that? :)

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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by dsouravs View Post

      most of my employers call me Dude
      How alarming. But your Facebook page says you're a dude.
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      • Profile picture of the author dsouravs
        Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

        How alarming. But your Facebook page says you're a dude.
        owww....why so ?
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        I can convert your Non-Responsive website to Responsive website ... How sweet is that? :)

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  • Profile picture of the author xeko
    There are a lot of hilarious posts in here, lol.

    If this is a serious issue for people though list owners might want to consider simply using more generic greetings in order to avoid offending anyone.


    Thu
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  • Profile picture of the author Snatch
    Just received an follow up email from Frank Kern today with this same subject line, for me it doesnt matter cause I love Frank's stuff and I will open his emails no matter what the subject line is.
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