Refunds ratio with wsos

26 replies
Hi guys,

I normally see that almost all wsos offer a 30 to 60 refund policy, but since many wsos are reports will a good percentage of buyers after reading request for a refund? What is your normal ratio of refunds? I was wondering since there are lots of people that only wants free stuff and probably will follow this path so i was wondering about it.
#ratio #refunds #wsos
  • Profile picture of the author datingworld
    I have never asked for refunds on any WSO I have bought.

    I believe it is quite unethical to ask for refunds once you have been through the report..
    The second is its only few bucks by the way.

    One should always read reviews of other warriors before buying any WSO, Once you buy it, then never ask for refund.

    People who use unethical ways to get hold of free stuff........they are failed people, they have never made any money on the web and will never make.
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    • Profile picture of the author batchos
      If the report provides value, yes.



      Originally Posted by datingworld View Post

      I have never asked for refunds on any WSO I have bought.

      I believe it is quite unethical to ask for refunds once you have been through the report..
      The second is its only few bucks by the way.

      One should always read reviews of other warriors before buying any WSO, Once you buy it, then never ask for refund.

      People who use unethical ways to get hold of free stuff........they are failed people, they have never made any money on the web and will never make.
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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    Over 8 products my average refund rate is 1%. Majority of my WSO products have a 0% refund rate. It has more to do with the product being sold rather than the place it is being sold. The more hyped up and blind your sales copy is, the more refunds you are likely to get. On the flip side, if people receive more value than they expected they are very unlikely to refund.
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  • Profile picture of the author mbacak
    Here's interesting stats when I mail affiliate offers:
    (meaning these are not my offers, they are others)

    Clickbank refund rates avg for me: 25%
    Clicksure refund rates avg for me: 60%
    WSO refunds rates avg for me: 2%

    To me that says a lot.
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    • Profile picture of the author MikeLantz
      Originally Posted by mbacak View Post

      Here's interesting stats when I mail affiliate offers:
      (meaning these are not my offers, they are others)

      Clickbank refund rates avg for me: 25%
      Clicksure refund rates avg for me: 60%
      WSO refunds rates avg for me: 2%

      To me that says a lot.
      Great stats, Matt. Very interesting for sure.

      For all refunds across the WarriorPlus system, the refund rate is about 3%. So, it looks a lot like you say.

      And, for sure, from what I know about other systems (like Clickbank), 3% is a VERY low number.

      WSOs FTW!

      Mike
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      • Profile picture of the author Geeked Labs
        2% sounds about right. I can't imagine someone refunding WSO's in some attempt to game the system. That's like admitting to yourself you're a failure.
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      • Profile picture of the author mbacak
        Originally Posted by MikeLantz View Post

        Great stats, Matt. Very interesting for sure.
        Thanks.

        Originally Posted by MikeLantz View Post

        WSOs FTW!
        I had to look up what "FTW" stood for... love it... "For The Win."
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  • Profile picture of the author visimedia
    people are looking for free stuff and you'll always get that in online marketing. lol . yOu can take alook in warriorplus.com when they track all wso launched with refund rates, etc there.
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  • Profile picture of the author Steve Moore
    From what I have heard and researched, if your refund rate is below 2%, you're doing pretty good. I have to agree with some of the responses already made. The refund rate will be higher if your product doesn't offer as much value as you promise it to.
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  • Profile picture of the author J Bold
    Mike Lantz has the best data of anyone and he's nicely shared it with us.

    Don't think there's much more to be said, really!
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  • Profile picture of the author godinu
    Unfortunately there are scammers who want something for nothing. I've just had someone claim a paypal dispute and the reason was "missing parts." First refund request ever. How can a WSO have missing parts? LOL. The paypal user has an unverified address, is "new," so apparently this person has a history of doing this sort of thing. It is unethical, really. Once you read a WSO, or a magazine for that matter, it's yours.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jonathan Mizel
    I've seen similar results as Matt. I won't even promo a product sold on ClickSure, and we are getting wary of ClickBank as well unless we are promoting to one of our internal lists with a strong relationship. For whatever reason, the platform used by the merchant makes a big difference, probably because 3rd party processors are so much easier to refund.

    A friend of mine just told me he split tested a large promo, with 1/2 the traffic going into a page processed by CB, and the other half going into a page processed by his merchant account. The results were pretty shocking... 20% refunds for CB and 4% through his merchant account. There's something about having to ask for a refund directly from the merchant that makes it more awkward.

    On WSOs, the price points are usually lower, and because there's a community aspect to them (with posting feedback and a degree of transparency) I think that makes them stick better.

    Moving forward, we all need to do a better job of properly describing what we are selling, delivering it quickly, and pricing it competitively. Refunds and chargebacks have the potential to pretty much put you out of business, or at least make it harder to collect money.

    Jonathan
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    • Profile picture of the author 1byte
      Originally Posted by Jonathan Mizel View Post


      Moving forward, we all need to do a better job of properly describing what we are selling, delivering it quickly, and pricing it competitively. Refunds and chargebacks have the potential to pretty much put you out of business, or at least make it harder to collect money.

      Jonathan
      Good advice. Although I don't like to request refunds, I will request one if I find the product is greatly misrepresented by the seller, falls short of its promises, or is defective, such as software that doesn't work right.
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    • Profile picture of the author batchos
      I would also add: encourage sincere reviews

      Originally Posted by Jonathan Mizel View Post

      I've seen similar results as Matt. I won't even promo a product sold on ClickSure, and we are getting wary of ClickBank as well unless we are promoting to one of our internal lists with a strong relationship. For whatever reason, the platform used by the merchant makes a big difference, probably because 3rd party processors are so much easier to refund.

      A friend of mine just told me he split tested a large promo, with 1/2 the traffic going into a page processed by CB, and the other half going into a page processed by his merchant account. The results were pretty shocking... 20% refunds for CB and 4% through his merchant account. There's something about having to ask for a refund directly from the merchant that makes it more awkward.

      On WSOs, the price points are usually lower, and because there's a community aspect to them (with posting feedback and a degree of transparency) I think that makes them stick better.

      Moving forward, we all need to do a better job of properly describing what we are selling, delivering it quickly, and pricing it competitively. Refunds and chargebacks have the potential to pretty much put you out of business, or at least make it harder to collect money.

      Jonathan
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  • Profile picture of the author paul nicholls
    The reality is, you will get some buyers that request a refund even if they likied the product, they will just say they didn`t get any use out of it

    This is the problem with low price products, you get less serious buyers

    1 or 2 refunds per 100 sales is quite normal because there are serial refunders out there

    If you start getting 5, 10 or more refunds per 100 sales ie a 5 or 10% refund rate then it could be that your product was not that good

    Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author kencalhn
    to reduce refunds, I like to offer things that drip bonus content over time for a one-time purchase, so they get "the thing" upfront, but bonuses delivered after 30/60/90 days to keep them around w/o refunding... and make sure the bonuses are actually high quality worth getting; strategically bonuses in that approach should have higher perceived value than the upfront product.
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    • Profile picture of the author icoachu
      Originally Posted by kencalhn View Post

      to reduce refunds, I like to offer things that drip bonus content over time for a one-time purchase, so they get "the thing" upfront, but bonuses delivered after 30/60/90 days to keep them around w/o refunding... and make sure the bonuses are actually high quality worth getting; strategically bonuses in that approach should have higher perceived value than the upfront product.
      Very interesting strategy. Is this kosher with the Terms of Service?
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  • Profile picture of the author J. Barry Mandel
    Normally I average less then 2% for items as high as over $100, however I have done 0% before too.

    It's critical that ALL the elements are in place so you don't get a refund:
    1. Risk Reversal
    2. You Provide Exactly What you State
    3. What you provide has value
    4. Your product is polished
    5. You deliver your product within a satisfactory amount of time
    6. Your product does what you say it does
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  • Profile picture of the author icoachu
    If it is a worthless WSO report, expect a refund. This 30/60 day period is a GREAT THING. It pushes people to produce HIGH QUALITY stuff.
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  • Profile picture of the author elperuanito
    I have requested a refund for one product and have bought a quite a few wso products the past few months. I've wanted to get refunds for others that have been utter junk but in the end I couldn't be bothered. I am mostly happy with the purchases I make.
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  • Profile picture of the author bloomingrose
    Interesting post. I think something is being missed in the talk about refunds - because people feel that they can return the item sales are increased.

    I am trying to remember who I was listening to who said that having an exceptional refund policy is one of the main ways that you can increase sales. I have seen double the money of the product refunds, or refund for life of the product. I make note of those products.

    I am a LL Bean and Lands End customer, and one of the reasons is because of the exceptional no questions asked return and exchange policy both of these groups have. Ironically, either Germany banned LL Bean from selling in their country or tried to - because they could not compete with the refund policy. I have sent back a few items from these companies that didn't fit - and sometimes that is the case with Internet Marketing products. Sometimes I have purchased something and known that it just wasn't for me. I appreciated being able to return the course. And I hope that the product creator is mature enough to not take it personally.

    Sometimes, I have sent a product back - and bought a product that I DID keep - that did fit from the same marketer.

    And Matt Bacak - you know I really respect you ( I do!) but I suggest that one reason the WF refunds are lower is that Clickbank products are usually higher in price. You will put up with a little disappointment for seven dollars - seventy-seven, not so much.

    I have definitely purchased products - especially off of Clickbank - because I am reassured by the ability to refund the product if it did not work for me. I may go into product creation at some time, and I will definitely offer a generous refund policy.

    One final note to this posting that turned out to be lengthy - when I have what feels like a "relationship" with a marketer I am much less likely to refund the product, even if it doesn't feel perfect. For instance Travis is brilliant in keeping relationships with this customers, I have purchased and kept many products from him.

    So - my advice - when you see your refunds be grateful. Know you are still making sales, many that were probably brought about because of the refund policy.
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  • Profile picture of the author Micah Medina
    The thing that gets me is how few of the refunds are for any kind of reason. There are way way too many customers that will email you with "sry, refud thx" and when you ask them "hey, what was wrong with this, what can I improve" - they just go "refund thx".

    It's annoying! But it's also a cost of the biz, and I'll put up with that in order to serve my genuine customers. If a Wal-Mart manager has to deal with breakage.. what makes us think we're any better than they are?
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  • Profile picture of the author bloomingrose
    Thanks for you few brave souls who admitted you have asked for refunds. I have spoken about asking for a refund because the product was crap or it ended up not fitting into my business model - and I have been mightily attacked.

    I think the OP just wanted some statistics, and he assumes that there are some refunds. What I find disingenuous is that sellers will announce that you can refund for any reason - any reason is any reason.

    The point about feedback is real. If you have a crappy product you will have refunds.
    BTW -I used LL Bean as an example. Beans first product was a hunting boot to keep feet dry - and it was defective. 92 out of the first 100 were returned, Bean told it as "feedback" rather than "criticism" and refunded the money and changed the design of the shoe. And now they have the business they have today.

    So I guess if you are getting more than 3-4 percent you should look to see what is going on with your product. Otherwise, wait until the dust settles before you go spending all your money!
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  • Profile picture of the author mknowles2262
    ive never asked for a refund on a wso some have been junk but they were only a few bucks anyway
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  • Profile picture of the author sunray
    The number one reason for refunds with WSO-s most likely has nothing whatever to do with the quality of the WSO itself, although the majority just repeat the old truths in their own words, adding nothing new. But, it's not the reason. The reason is the buyer did not intend to buy your product from the start. He is not even interested in it. So, why did he order it? He just wanted a copy for a black hat forum.
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  • Profile picture of the author Shining JS
    I think the refund rates depend on two major factors :
    1. Customer Value
    It is the difference between the value that the customer gains from owning and using a product and the costs of obtaining the products.

    2.Customer Satisfaction
    It depends on a product's perceived performance in delivering value relative to a buyer's expectation
    here's the formula:
    Perceived performance higher than expectation = very low refund rates
    Perceived performance lower than expectation = medium refund rates*

    *depend on the buyers' available capital.
    sorry for my grammar
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