by JL8
67 replies
Let's say I'm writing an article on weight loss, and to show the reader empathy, I say something like:

"I used to be overweight and unhappy, but I slowly changed my bad habits and now I am skinny".

But what if I was never "overweight".

Is this completely bad?

Is it frowned upon, but somewhat acceptable?

Is everyone doing it so it's not a big deal, just do it?


What do you think?
#unethical
  • Profile picture of the author RogueOne
    Is everyone doing it so it's not a big deal, just do it?
    You're the one that has to live with your decision.
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  • Profile picture of the author hustlinsmoke
    Yeah. Thats up to you. I don't write but I would not let my writers say something that wasnt there either.
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  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Canfield
    I write articles all of the time for other people. Sometimes I am an overweight person who lost weight. Sometimes I write from the perspective of a single woman who was beaten and battered by her ex-husband. Sometimes I write as If I spent 2 years working at a fast food restaurant.

    In short, I write what my clients want. I do not think it is immoral. I do however draw the line at offering pseudoscience medical advice that could actually harm somebody such as if you get breast cancer rub this cream on your chest and you do not have to go to a Doctor.
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    • Profile picture of the author The Herm
      Originally Posted by Daniel Canfield View Post

      I write articles all of the time for other people. Sometimes I am an overweight person who lost weight. Sometimes I write from the perspective of a single woman who was beaten and battered by her ex-husband. Sometimes I write as If I spent 2 years working at a fast food restaurant.

      In short, I write what my clients want. I do not think it is immoral.
      I think that writing what a client wants and writing copy for a product that you are promoting (or developing yourself) is a little bit different. Sure, maybe your client really was overweight, or a beaten and battered woman. Some people want their story told but, don't know how to tell it. That's where you come in and there is nothing wrong or immoral about that.

      Personally, writing from the perspective of someone who was once overweight even though I never was would not make me feel comfortable about putting that out there for others to read or use with my name on it. Just think, someone might take heart in your story and look up to you for something that isn't the truth.

      But, in the end it's your call.
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    • Profile picture of the author ExRat
      Hi Daniel,

      Originally Posted by Daniel Canfield View Post

      Sometimes I write from the perspective of a single woman who was beaten and battered by her ex-husband.

      [snip]

      In short, I write what my clients want. I do not think it is immoral. I do however draw the line at offering pseudoscience medical advice that could actually harm somebody such as if you get breast cancer rub this cream on your chest and you do not have to go to a Doctor.
      Just out of interest, I presume in the above example, the article would be offering other battered women advice if they found themselves in the same situation - how do you source the information for this in terms of squaring this with your conscience? How do you avoid 'pseudoscience' in this instance?

      For example, I did a quick search and found this -

      http://powertochange.com/experience/life/batteredwives/

      Some might say that the above article is deliberately trying to twist the advice they give in order to promote a certain agenda.

      EG -
      Kay is now happily married to a good Christian man. She took no chances on this one. After working through her own issues, she prayed to the Lord for wisdom and guidance and asked Him for a good husband. And that’s exactly what God gave her!
      Would you happily write an advice article aimed at battered women which promoted an agenda?
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  • Profile picture of the author craigvdb
    I'm not sure if there is a standard for the definition of the word overweight. It is a term that is somewhat in the eyes of the beholder.

    I know of a person (who happened to be anorexic) and at 120 pounds she thought that she was overweight. Clearly she was not by everyone else's standards. She also had to go through counseling before she realized that she was not overweight.

    Just another perspective.

    The ethical question you posed - that is for you to answer.
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  • Profile picture of the author miklanderson2
    What you do when you aren't afraid of people finding out defines the type of person you are. If you want to mislead people, no one will ever know the difference. You will. It's up to you to decide whether or not it's ethical.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rob Whisonant
    If you have never been overweight, do you know someone that has been? Get them to relate their feelings to you and tell their story to your reader.

    My close friend was overweight and felt...

    Re's
    Rob Whisonant
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    • Profile picture of the author johndetlefs
      Originally Posted by Rob Whisonant View Post

      If you have never been overweight, do you know someone that has been? Get them to relate their feelings to you and tell their story to your reader.

      My close friend was overweight and felt...

      Re's
      Rob Whisonant
      You just beat me to the punch!

      Just find a "fat" friend and ask them about their story. It'll probably end up being better, more empathetic and closer to the mark for your target audience anyway, seeing as it will come from a real live person who actually deals with the issues in their life.

      As someone said before, if you have to ask about something like that, then you probably already know the answer...

      Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

      If the article is used to promote a weight loss product you claim to have used to lose the "excess," it's illegal. I believe the technical term is "fraud."


      Paul
      That's funny. Can't believe I didn't think of that... man this forum is getting to me...
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    • Profile picture of the author Nile Vincent
      This is one of the best answers to this thread...they're all pretty good...and depending on your perspective...it's all good!...

      There's usually no trouble getting "interviews" with anyone re: your specific topic...

      Just be sincere, down to earth and hopefully the content you put together will give
      the reader answers...and solve their problems...


      Originally Posted by Rob Whisonant View Post

      If you have never been overweight, do you know someone that has been? Get them to relate their feelings to you and tell their story to your reader.

      My close friend was overweight and felt...

      Re's
      Rob Whisonant
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    • Profile picture of the author icandi
      Originally Posted by Rob Whisonant View Post

      If you have never been overweight, do you know someone that has been? Get them to relate their feelings to you and tell their story to your reader.

      My close friend was overweight and felt...

      Re's
      Rob Whisonant
      That sounds to me a lot better way to go. Although I do have a problem with claims from persons claiming to have been "broke and penniless until they stumbled upon some miracle software / system" I guess it depends what the objective or agenda of the article is, generally it's for people who are at best lacking confidence and at worst in difficult situations and more susceptible to part with hard-earned cash in the hope of some easy solution, whether it's for this topic, earning fast cash, relationships. I've heard arguments that "people should know better" or "there's no harm in it"
      This is just my opinion, doesn't mean it's correct, but the question was asked and difficult to say a straight yes or no but if I had to say in one word it would be no.
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  • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
    Originally Posted by JL8 View Post

    Let's say I'm writing an article on weight loss, and to show the reader empathy, I say something like:

    "I used to be overweight and unhappy, but I slowly changed my bad habits and now I am skinny".

    But what if I was never "overweight".
    If the article is used to promote a weight loss product you claim to have used to lose the "excess," it's illegal. I believe the technical term is "fraud."


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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
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  • Profile picture of the author Nicolas01
    I think you are the only one who knows whatever you write is ethical or not.
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  • Profile picture of the author kaposzta
    I think it's not unethical. If the article contains any unique or new idea on how to lose weight, and your article can help people, then it's okay. If you lie to people, then it's unethical.
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  • Profile picture of the author john01a
    Originally Posted by JL8 View Post

    Let's say I'm writing an article on weight loss, and to show the reader empathy, I say something like:

    "I used to be overweight and unhappy, but I slowly changed my bad habits and now I am skinny".

    But what if I was never "overweight".

    Is this completely bad?

    Is it frowned upon, but somewhat acceptable?

    Is everyone doing it so it's not a big deal, just do it?


    What do you think?
    Whether something is ethical or not is probably something that you're going to decide for yourself

    That being said, the fact that there are a lot of others doing something, doesn't change it from being ethical or not. You have to decide whether it's ethical based on the principle.

    If you're saying that you were overweight out of empathy... you have to think about it from the reader's point of view. Would the reader really appreciate that empathy if they knew that it was fake?

    What if, the only reason why the reader listened to the advice in the article, was because they knew it came from someone in their position... only problem is, that it's not from someone in their position.

    So, I think you'd have to be very careful if you're giving advice in your article. You could be misleading the reader into thinking that the advice works, because it came from someone who was overweight and no is no longer overweight.

    Instead of saying that you were overweight when you weren't, you could rather focus on the feelings or emotions that someone who is overweight could be feeling, and then relate that to something that you have experienced. In other words, you can understand where they are coming from, because you've experienced similar feelings.

    Or, you could empathize with them, based on what you have seen. If you have or had someone close to you who was overweight, then you could recall what that was like and what you have witnessed them go through.

    So, you don't need to say you were overweight went you weren't, because there are ways for you to genuinely empathize with the reader. But, the choice is really yours. In the end, you have to be comfortable with what you write.
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  • Profile picture of the author emini_guy
    Originally Posted by JL8 View Post

    Let's say I'm writing an article on weight loss, and to show the reader empathy, I say something like:

    "I used to be overweight and unhappy, but I slowly changed my bad habits and now I am skinny".

    But what if I was never "overweight".
    I would feel very uneasy pretending to be someone I am not.

    But, here is something you may want to think about.

    I learned from my doctor that based on the standard health metrics, I am OBESE! I never thought about myself as obese, perhaps SLIGHTLY overweight. I don't look obese at all.

    The thing is you might actually be overweight or perhaps even obese, by medical standards, and you even don't realize that.

    Heck, just a thought.
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  • Profile picture of the author Qamar
    Yes it is unethical to do so.


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  • Profile picture of the author HKSEO Jonbones
    I mean, it is sales, so I would imagine that most customers take what they read with a grain of salt, and understand that artistic license has been taken with the copy.

    That's how I read most sales copy anyway, I suppose there would be someone out there who would feel that they were lied to if that was not the 100% truth
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    • Profile picture of the author emini_guy
      Originally Posted by HKSEO Jonbones View Post


      That's how I read most sales copy anyway, I suppose there would be someone out there who would feel that they were lied to if that was not the 100% truth
      Perhaps you read it that way because you are a marketer, but I doubt that's how most people read it.

      I think it's much better to show plenty of evidence that you have something to offer and let the buyer decide than to "stretch" the truth. But as I said in my previous post, you may be obese (or overweight) and not even realize that!
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      • Profile picture of the author HKSEO Jonbones
        Originally Posted by emini_guy View Post

        Perhaps you read it that way because you are a marketer, but I doubt that's how most people read it.

        I think it's much better to show plenty of evidence that you have something to offer and let the buyer decide than to "stretch" the truth. But as I said in my previous post, you may be obese (or overweight) and not even realize that!
        Very true, hard to step outside the box once you are in.
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        • Profile picture of the author connorbringas
          It is unethical, but then again you are the one living with that "decision." Write what would make you feel..good..if it makes you question your morality then dont write it.
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    • Profile picture of the author cashp0wer
      It is unethical but if you feel all right about it then go for it. If it doesn't feel unethical to you then don't worry about it.
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      • Profile picture of the author Steve B
        Originally Posted by cashp0wer View Post

        It is unethical but if you feel all right about it then go for it. If it doesn't feel unethical to you then don't worry about it.
        I'm sorry, I don't for a minute think this is good advice.

        If your marketing is untrue and you know it, it's wrong, period. You are lying to your audience.

        Just because you as the marketer feel OK about something you know is wrong, that doesn't justify your peddling lies.

        If you know it isn't true then don't try to fool your customers. It's wrong and as Paul says, it's fraud.

        Steve
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      • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
        Originally Posted by cashp0wer View Post

        It is unethical but if you feel all right about it then go for it. If it doesn't feel unethical to you then don't worry about it.
        Ooooh! That's not the best advice to follow at all.

        Not only did Paul already state that it is fraud, but the OP in posting this thread will have many eyes watching him now making it more likely than not that he would be busted.

        Terra
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      • Profile picture of the author HeySal
        Originally Posted by cashp0wer View Post

        It is unethical but if you feel all right about it then go for it. If it doesn't feel unethical to you then don't worry about it.

        Um...........as you can see by comments above - -when being sarcastic you need to post a smilie of some sort or people are going to miss the intent of the comment.
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  • Profile picture of the author Troy_Phillips
    Granny always said "If you have to ask if the shirt is wrinkled .. don't waste your and my time .. just get out the iron."
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  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
    Banned
    As Paul mentioned, it is illegal. The FTC has been very active in taking action against sites making false claims and fake testimonials, which is what your statement of weight loss amounts to.

    Federal Trade Commission Resources for Reporters
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  • Profile picture of the author lastreporter
    It is called lying, stating a falsehood, building your house on a foundation of sand. There are thousands of prisons filled with individuals who asked themselves the same question and answered: "Sure why not?"

    Why not instead build your business on providing a valuable product or service, digital or otherwise based on quality and truth?

    Wouldn't that make more sense?

    Do you like it when people lie to you and try to scam you with worthless info and junk products? Do you want others to hustle you and pick your pockets? If the answer is yes, then go ahead and lie.
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  • I don't do it, but I know people who tell others to do it, I think it's not good. But when you look at most people who is true, very few from what I can see.
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  • Overweight is a sensitive topic and a very touchy subject for those who are experiencing this. If you wanted to reach out to your readers by writing a similar experience to them, it is best that you just ask someone, who really experienced such, to relate his/her story. This is better than creating your own experience.
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  • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
    Originally Posted by JL8 View Post

    Let's say I'm writing an article on weight loss, and to show the reader empathy, I say something like:

    "I used to be overweight and unhappy, but I slowly changed my bad habits and now I am skinny".

    But what if I was never "overweight".

    Is this completely bad?

    Is it frowned upon, but somewhat acceptable?

    Is everyone doing it so it's not a big deal, just do it?


    What do you think?
    You already know the answer. Yet, I think you want to do it anyway, and you want someone to pat you on the head and tell you it's okay.

    Not going to play that game.

    Lie or don't lie. Your choice, your conscience, your karma...
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  • Profile picture of the author Reno Van Boven
    By saying you "used to be overweight" and you were in fact, not overweight, is a lie. That is misleading and yes indeed unethical.

    It is better to find someone who was indeed overweight and lost weight with this product, then talk about that person and telling the truth.

    You will find that by telling the truth, you will sell more and build up a bigger and better reputation.

    -- Reno
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    • Profile picture of the author RDInfo
      It is unethical because you are lying consciously in order to influence the reader. It is deceiving and thus against the law. (At least in several countries)
      Is it moral ? Well, it is your choice to make, and you will have to live with the consequences and the damages it can do to your reputation.

      Before writing anything, always ask yourself :
      If i am concerned by a specific problem and i am searching for a solution,
      Will i appreciate to read concepts/solutions from a person who has knowledge and experience on the subject, and proofs that his solutions work if applied properly ?
      or
      Will i appreciate to read concepts/solutions from a person who has no knowledge and no experience on the subject and is lying to me in order to make a sale ?

      What you are trying to do is the second choice... Is it cool if you are the buyer ?

      Why not try to write about a subject you are interested in or concerned about ? This way you can present yourself as a researcher and an experimenter and your readers will appreciate your thoughts/solutions.
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  • Profile picture of the author David Micheal
    Lying is unethical. You can use other words to encourage your reader to trust your article.
    If you want to live with your lying empathy, just do it.
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  • Profile picture of the author magiclouie
    Honesty is always the best policy.

    So for me, it is unethical. You're lying to your own self and to your target audience.
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  • Profile picture of the author Matthew Anton
    Business weeds out nonsense like this anyway. How popular / big can you get based on lies? I'm sure it can happen but it's much harder.
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  • I would say it is not advisable, and it is unethical. You're just fooling yourself AND your future customers. It's like giving out help and advices even though you don't know anything and has never experienced it. Just because almost everyone is doing a certain wrong, doesn't mean it becomes right. What is wrong is wrong, at least to a certain point in human ethics.
    I have an idea, though. Why don't you go overweight so everything'll be all legal now? (kidding)
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  • Profile picture of the author Young Financier
    Why are you seeking validation from others? Do your thing and care less what others think. Besides, the people you're getting opinions from are probably doing worse things than you're worrying about.
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    • Originally Posted by Sean T Alexandre View Post

      Why are you seeking validation from others? Do your thing and care less what others think. Besides, the people you're getting opinions from are probably doing worse things than you're worrying about.
      The OP asked about this in here probably because he has doubts about that strategy. He asked us and he wants an answer from an audience's standpoint, and we delivered an answer from the viewpoint that he wanted us to be. I really feel he did what is right, asking from a crowd, before proceeding and maybe doing something reckless. He's cautious. I respect and admire him for that. Also, I don't think we are doing worse things. We might be crazy, sure, but we won't do something unethical, to say the least.
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    • Profile picture of the author Demian V
      Originally Posted by Sean T Alexandre View Post

      Why are you seeking validation from others? Do your thing and care less what others think. Besides, the people you're getting opinions from are probably doing worse things than you're worrying about.
      This is a terrible attitude and bad advice, in this instance.

      This forum is a place to ask questions, get opinions and answers, and connect with others and see what they have to offer you and offer what you have to them.

      And to generalize by saying that everyone responding to the OP is doing "worse things" than he's concerned about is a blatant insult to all that have given their opinions on this thread.

      Maybe someone out there reading this thread has had their mind changed about what is ethical or not in a marketing sense (or a general sense, in regards to lying to others).

      As to the OP's question, yes, I do think it's unethical to lie in a "review" or "testimonial". Not to mention fraudulent, as others have already pointed out.

      Wouldn't it be better to follow the advice of many of the responses in this thread and tell the TRUE story of someone who has gone through the experience of being overweight and use that to pre-sell prospects?

      Phony stories always give themselves away anyway, IMO.
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      • Profile picture of the author Young Financier
        Originally Posted by Demian V View Post

        This is a terrible attitude and bad advice, in this instance.

        This forum is a place to ask questions, get opinions and answers, and connect with others and see what they have to offer you and offer what you have to them.

        And to generalize by saying that everyone responding to the OP is doing "worse things" than he's concerned about is a blatant insult to all that have given their opinions on this thread.

        Maybe someone out there reading this thread has had their mind changed about what is ethical or not in a marketing sense (or a general sense, in regards to lying to others).

        As to the OP's question, yes, I do think it's unethical to lie in a "review" or "testimonial". Not to mention fraudulent, as others have already pointed out.

        Wouldn't it be better to follow the advice of many of the responses in this thread and tell the TRUE story of someone who has gone through the experience of being overweight and use that to pre-sell prospects?

        Phony stories always give themselves away anyway, IMO.
        Learn to read. I said they are PROBABLY doing worse things.
        **** ethics...get money.
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        • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
          Originally Posted by Sean T Alexandre View Post

          **** ethics...get money.
          Good... Another name for my "never buy from" list.:rolleyes:
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          • Profile picture of the author seasoned
            Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

            Good... Another name for my "never buy from" list.:rolleyes:
            YEAH, WOW! Some say ethics=honest/nice. Some say ethics=a meaningless buzzword. Some say ethics=being a good liar. Some say ethics=dishonest/loyal(to THEM). Some say ethics is something you can buy. I WOULD name names. I HAVE about the "ethics=dishonest/loyal(to THEM)" one before. They even have an "ethics officer". But they are pretty rich, and sue happy, so I guess I won't state that COS name.

            YIKES!

            Steve
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          • Profile picture of the author Young Financier
            Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

            Good... Another name for my "never buy from" list.:rolleyes:
            You don't have to because I have nothing to sell.
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  • Profile picture of the author jbhappy15
    Hi JL8,

    I don't know how to prove it but people have some sort of instincts to tell if facts are bluff.. It's the same as with the products you promote.. They somehow feel that you're just trying to sell them
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  • Profile picture of the author eladwin1
    I think you have to decide yourself if you write that you were previously overweight or not
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  • Profile picture of the author zxboss
    If you think about it, nearly ALL the people on tv advertisements for the 'ab swing' , 'weight watchers' etc are all fake. Before and after photos are photoshopped and people say what they are being paid to say. Most of them, if not all of them, havent even used the products they are being paid to advertised. People on steroids are used on display advertising some cheap machine. There are many more examples i can use, but i think you get the point
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    • Profile picture of the author eplanellas
      Originally Posted by zxboss View Post

      If you think about it, nearly ALL the people on tv advertisements for the 'ab swing' , 'weight watchers' etc are all fake. Before and after photos are photoshopped and people say what they are being paid to say. Most of them, if not all of them, havent even used the products they are being paid to advertised. People on steroids are used on display advertising some cheap machine. There are many more examples i can use, but i think you get the point
      Yes, there is a lot of lies floating around in the world (especially on the internet) so why contribute to it?

      OP, how would you feel about being lied to about a product you are considering? Chances are, it probably has happened to you...to all of us; even on some of the WSOs.

      I am a writer.

      I am also overweight (but not by much) :p. There are a lot of product reviews I have to write for clients and a lot of reports that they ask me to do. I can write convincing copy that converts without having to cross the line.

      It is possible to come up with some great content that sells the product without you having to act like someone or something that you are not.

      Besides, if you have never had the experience of being overweight and loosing it, something will be lost in the description. Since you don't actually know what it feels like, creating the most passionate, convincing content is just not going to happen.

      If you were to write that article and some one else who happened to have really gone through the experience wrote a similar article, I am confident that the sincere person's writing is going to be more moving (assuming that all writing skills are equal).

      I suggest you just focus on writing a great article with the fact you have or get someone to write it for you who has actually lost weight.
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  • Profile picture of the author ProServices
    At least your honest and deserve a medal for your honesty.

    I've read 10 sales pages today on different niches and the bull I've read makes me cry. They actually spill out the bull on 4 pages and as IMers, we are fully aware of the tactics e.g. I was reading a sales page on an IM niche where the person had lost everything, was severely depressed, got divorced but now making thousands online using some unknown software. It might fool the layman out there but not us.
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  • Profile picture of the author Sooner
    Originally Posted by JL8 View Post

    Let's say I'm writing an article on weight loss, and to show the reader empathy, I say something like:

    "I used to be overweight and unhappy, but I slowly changed my bad habits and now I am skinny".

    But what if I was never "overweight".

    Is this completely bad?

    Is it frowned upon, but somewhat acceptable?

    Is everyone doing it so it's not a big deal, just do it?


    What do you think?



    The standards for 'right' and 'wrong' are NOT in the eyes of the beholder. Truthfulness is established by God. And, according to His standard telling someone something that is not true is WRONG (a.k.a., a lie)

    Nonetheless, you can always write a WSO and sell it here ... after all, other people don't seem to have trouble selling 'trash' and 'photoshopping' Clickbank earning statements.

    Your character should be more important than your next sale. Is it?
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  • Profile picture of the author abdul786
    From the way you wrote the post and the concern you have showed, i appreciate your honesty in asking public opinion and would like to recommend you to use the way you mentioned but not with "I used to be..." but maybe "A colleague of mine" or "any third party/friend etc". That's what most of the people are doing.

    Because there's always a friend of everyone who has suffered from overweight (and all known issues of life).
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      Originally Posted by zxboss View Post

      If you think about it, nearly ALL the people on tv advertisements for the 'ab swing' , 'weight watchers' etc are all fake. Before and after photos are photoshopped and people say what they are being paid to say. Most of them, if not all of them, havent even used the products they are being paid to advertised. People on steroids are used on display advertising some cheap machine. There are many more examples i can use, but i think you get the point
      You have proof of this? You might want to forward it to the FCC for investigation. Otherwise, I'd be careful with statements that could be considered libel.

      Saying 'everybody fakes everything' is one thing. Saying that the vendors of specific products, by name, are committing specific illegal acts is something else. The first is just cynical spew, the second would land you in court if this forum and you personally were important enough to the companies you named...
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      • Profile picture of the author emini_guy
        Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

        You have proof of this? You might want to forward it to the FCC for investigation. Otherwise, I'd be careful with statements that could be considered libel.

        Saying 'everybody fakes everything' is one thing. Saying that the vendors of specific products, by name, are committing specific illegal acts is something else. The first is just cynical spew, the second would land you in court if this forum and you personally were important enough to the companies you named...
        Very good points. Need to be repeated more often.
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  • Profile picture of the author rockong
    If you have to think about it, then there's your answer.

    If you're building up a long term brand and it can become something big, then I wouldn't lie about anything because the truth can easily be uncovered
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  • Profile picture of the author kkll78
    Honestly, that decision is up to you and what type of mind you have. Some people may have no problem with that. Go with what you think is best.
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    The fact is that a lot of the sold items CAN work, so you never know if they are 100% fake. Because of the way you feel about this, I would say STAY AWAY! Besides, suppose everyone did what you suggest. It is STILL illegal! You talk like you don't even have the FIRST idea of how a person may gain weight or how hard it may be to lose it, etc... And people that want to lose weight don't so easily trust ads ANYWAY because so many under state the problem or overstate the effectiveness of the proposed solution.

    What you COULD do is give it to 20 plus people for free, with a sound diet, and have them try it for 2 months or more. If they ALL lose weight and the MEN lose an average of .5-1pound(1.1-2.2KG)/day, with the women losing at about half the rate, BOTH with no decline in mood or health, ****THEN**** you can talk!

    You can say your results, be totally truthful, and you will have the gold standard! I didn't pick those numbers out of a hat. Doctors agree that is about the quickest rate you can safely lose. And 2 months is probably enough time to start seeing ill effects if it is bad. It ALSO means that a man could lose 60 pounds and a woman could lose 30 pounds. That is respectable.

    And Sorry if this sounds sexist, but testosterone speeds up weight lose, and estrogen helps store fat and a woman's endocrine syste can be messed up by losing weight too quickly, so that is just the way it is. Both COULD lose twice as much as I stated, but then some doctors start disagreeing about how safe it is.

    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author mark healy
    yes this is unethical
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  • Profile picture of the author Elion Makkink
    I think it's not unethical as long as your product or course provides true value.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jonwebb
    If u have to ask, then you already have your answer.
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  • Profile picture of the author Corey Geer
    Honest salesman go hungry. I don't get why everyone is so against "lying" to achieve sales. That's what salesman do... that's how businesses work...

    *sigh* I'm done trying to explain that point.
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      Originally Posted by Corey Geer View Post

      Honest salesman go hungry. I don't get why everyone is so against "lying" to achieve sales. That's what salesman do... that's how businesses work...

      *sigh* I'm done trying to explain that point.
      So you're saying that no one should believe you, because you are a salesman and all salesmen lie?

      That's the logic you just put out there...

      > All salesmen lie to make sales.
      > I am a salesman.
      > Therefore, I will lie to you in order to make sales.

      Have I got that right, Corey?

      Did you catch that, Corey's customers and prospects?

      :rolleyes:
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    • Profile picture of the author Cali16
      Originally Posted by Corey Geer View Post

      Honest salesman go hungry. I don't get why everyone is so against "lying" to achieve sales. That's what salesman do... that's how businesses work...
      Another erroneous sweeping generalization. Sigh......... :rolleyes:

      Many of the best (and highest paid) salespeople know how to:

      1) listen and communicate very well
      2) read people quickly
      3) honestly and ethically present their product or service in such a way that their prospective customer can see how it will truly benefit them

      Dishonest salespeople often find that their lies come back to bite them in the end, via things like lots of refunds, disgruntled customers, and a damaged reputation.

      I feel very sorry for you if you truly don't understand why everyone is so against "lying" to get sales. How would you feel if your unsuspecting mother (or other loved one) fell prey to a sleazy, dishonest sales person and ended up getting in a serious car accident or stranded along the side of the road out in the middle of nowhere after dark because he/she knowingly sold her a defective set of tires? Does that help put it in perspective?

      To the OP; yes, it's dishonest and unethical. You can be empathetic without having walked in someone else's shoes, and without lying and saying you have.
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      If you don't face your fears, the only thing you'll ever see is what's in your comfort zone. ~Anne McClain, astronaut
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by Corey Geer View Post

      Honest salesman go hungry. I don't get why everyone is so against "lying" to achieve sales. That's what salesman do... that's how businesses work...

      *sigh* I'm done trying to explain that point.
      WOW, a lot of companies go BROKE doing that ALSO! Gee, legally Blond deals with a point almost EXACTLY like this. The person WAS fat, and apparently DID lose weight, and had LOTS of happy customers, with her weight loss methods, but she married another rich person, and her step daughter framed her for MURDER!

      She had an EXCELLENT provable iron clad alibi but declined to use it! She was going to go to jail for LIFE! WHY? Because some of the weight she got rid of in the end was through LIPOSUCTION!!!!!

      This world would be SO much simpler without dishonest salespeople. Ironically, it would be easier to sell also!

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Gengis
    Yes you would be lying. Get yourself a couple far people who have lost the weight with your method and make the product with their experience and maybe give them a percentage of sales.

    Good luck!

    Gengis
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    ALSO, look at http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...nuary-2nd.html , if it is still there. Clickbank is obviously tired of dishonest marketers. at least they managed to strike the balance between affiliates and marketers. If an affiliate lies trying to sell a decent product, THEY get punished. If a good affiliate sells a bad vendors product, the vendor is punished.

    Steve
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