Google images, can we use them as a normal stock image?

15 years ago

No - you cannot legally use them without getting permission from
the owner, usually the photographer. There are quite a few
sites that have public domain images on them - you can use those
instead obviously, but if your whole sales process hinges on
using a copyrighted image you are advised to secure the rights to
use it.

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S Bhaskar

15 years ago

I agree with loren. You cannot use images from google just like that. Even google images say so when you click on the images in the search to go to the source site. It says that the images may be copyrighted. So if you are to use the images for commercial purpose you better get the permission for such use.

Originally Posted by Loren Woirhaye

No - you cannot legally use them without getting permission from
the owner, usually the photographer. There are quite a few
sites that have public domain images on them - you can use those
instead obviously, but if your whole sales process hinges on
using a copyrighted image you are advised to secure the rights to
use it.

Thanks

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LB

15 years ago

Nope, using them is a violation of copyright and could potentially cost you a lot.

Your competition was actually pretty kind in notifying you!

istockphoto is my favorite place to get royalty-free photos. Usually just a few dollars per each.

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tpw

15 years ago

Originally Posted by LB

Nope, using them is a violation of copyright and could potentially cost you a lot.

Your competition was actually pretty kind in notifying you!

istockphoto is my favorite place to get royalty-free photos. Usually just a few dollars per each.

A friend of mine got sued for $10,000 for using a photo on his website without permission.

So make darn sure that you have permission to use any photo before including it in your digital properties.

Google Images only provides links to existing photos. Once you find a photo, then you need to track down the original copyright holder of that photo, usually by contacting the site who originally posted the image, and contact them for permission.

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Vince Courtney

15 years ago

Hi Gordon

I have used: public-domain-photos.com/ for some excellent Public domain photos with no restrictions but agree with, LB, istockphoto.com is my fav place to get quality photos too.

try searching the dollar bin at istock, many times there is something good in there.

regards
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adamv

15 years ago

I'm an artist and IMer and most of my drawings can be found on Google images but that's simply because Google scrapes the internet for content (sounds a little black hat to me)

.

I never submitted my drawings to Google for them or anyone else to use. Because some people think there's nothing wrong with using the images I've put my website address right across the middle of each drawing so that no one would really want to use them to illustrate an ebook and if they did they would be advertising for me.

A lot of people seem to think that Google images is a free stock photo site but it's not, it's just a search engine that returns images as results. Some of the images could possibly be public domain but most are not.

Not being aware that an image is copyrighted is not an excuse for breaking the law so be careful.

There are plenty of public domain images as well as free and low cost stock photos available on the internet that you can use, it just takes a little more time researching to find them.

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Linda Van Fleet

15 years ago

Originally Posted by adamv

I'm an artist and IMer and most of my drawings can be found on Google images but that's simply because Google scrapes the internet for content (sounds a little black hat to me)

.

I block the google bot (and other bots) from accessing my image directory. Have you tried that?

Linda

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adamv 15 years ago

Originally Posted by Linda Van Fleet

I block the google bot (and other bots) from accessing my image directory. Have you tried that?

Linda

No, because I do get some traffic to my site via Google images (not that they buy anything). I have my website URL across the front of the drawings so I seriously doubt anyone would steal the images.

I may block the bot from the image directory in the future just because of the bandwidth that's being used up without much monetary pay off.
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- Sean Kelly 15 years ago
  
  Go to Flickr, open the advanced search and click on the 'creative commons' checkbox, also click on the checkbox next to it 'for commercial use'.
  
  This way you can search for creative commons pictures on Flickr that can be used commercially for free.
  
  Sean
  
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johnng

15 years ago

Originally Posted by adamv

I'm an artist and IMer and most of my drawings can be found on Google images but that's simply because Google scrapes the internet for content (sounds a little black hat to me)

.

I never submitted my drawings to Google for them or anyone else to use. Because some people think there's nothing wrong with using the images I've put my website address right across the middle of each drawing so that no one would really want to use them to illustrate an ebook and if they did they would be advertising for me.

A lot of people seem to think that Google images is a free stock photo site but it's not, it's just a search engine that returns images as results. Some of the images could possibly be public domain but most are not.

Not being aware that an image is copyrighted is not an excuse for breaking the law so be careful.

There are plenty of public domain images as well as free and low cost stock photos available on the internet that you can use, it just takes a little more time researching to find them.

I am not sure I totally agree with this, if images are copy right protected as in books. All literature publications has a copy right mark on them plus a very menacing statement just to frighten anyone thinking of copy right infringement. Doesn't that applies to images too, needing the copy right mark? I admit ignorance and not sure of my fact. Anyone to clarify please?

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stevenh512 15 years ago

Originally Posted by johnng

All literature publications has a copy right mark on them plus a very menacing statement just to frighten anyone thinking of copy right infringement.

As noted above.. check with the U.S. Copyright Office or a competent attorney for any copyright issues you're unsure of.. but to give you a layman's answer to this issue. Copyright law in the United States (according to the letter of the law, and the U.S. Copyright Office's interpretation of it) says that copyright protection exists as soon as a work is created in fixed form. There's generally no requirement to register the copyright or to provide any kind of copyright notice, but those do provide some extra protection and without them (especially without registering your copyright) it can be difficult if not impossible to enforce your copyright protection in court.
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adamv

15 years ago

Originally Posted by johnng

I am not sure I totally agree with this, if images are copy right protected as in books. All literature publications has a copy right mark on them plus a very menacing statement just to frighten anyone thinking of copy right infringement. Doesn't that applies to images too, needing the copy right mark? I admit ignorance and not sure of my fact. Anyone to clarify please?

I don't know about the UK but here in the US if you create something it is automatically protected by copyright laws. If you draw or paint a picture, take a photograph, write an article it's copyrighted automatically.

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bigcullie 15 years ago

I agree Adam, I was always under the impression that if you created a drwing, photo etc, your were automatically the owner, however you had to prove you are the owner.

I heard one story when once you had created a "piece of work" you snail mailed yourself a copy under recorded delivery, then once you received it back, do not open it, as it is proof of the date you created it.

This methode has been used sucessfully in a court of law to prove authenticity.
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bigcullie

15 years ago

Thanks Loren,

That certainly clarifies the matter. Not the answer I was hoping for but I can live with it.

Thanks also to LB and Vince, for your leads however my competition did not inform me out of kindness, he was extremely abusive, hence my concern. However, I am appreciative of for any constructive criticism and it has made me review my site and upgrade and improve it.

All the best, Gordon.

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Tina Golden 15 years ago

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- bigcullie 15 years ago
  
  Hi Tina,
  
  I removed the site until I clarified matters, and get my competition off my back. I will now have to change a few images to get it going again. My ebook cover was excellent the best I have seen, but the image was not my own, so that to will have to be changed. I am in the process of modifying the report.
  I will be happy to sent you a copy once it has been modified.
  
  Thanks for your help, Gordon.
  
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bigcullie

15 years ago

Thanks Adamv,

I was certainly one of those niave people who thought they were stock photographs. i work in education, and I can assure your that every student uses these photographs for there own ends. It only seams to be a problems if there are widely published or somebody is using them to make money from them, indirectly.

Scots law says ignorance of the law is no excuse, but use of google images is very confusing. Google freely uses them to their advantage, but put no warning on them for others. It is certainly black hat for Google.

Anyway I have learned my lesson before to much damage was done. I like how you have turned your images to your advantage, but it is a pity you have to. BTW: I had a look at your site, and they are fantastic drawings, good luck with your sales.

Anyway, thanks for your advice, I appreciate it.

Gordon

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SteveJohnson

15 years ago

One only has to follow the ongoing story of the 'HOPE' poster that an artist created with the blessings of the Obama campaign. Turns out the image was taken by an AP photographer and the creator of the poster just lifted it from a website after being led there by a Google search. Here's part of the story: AP says Obama poster infringed copyright - Arts, books, more- msnbc.com

Moral: whoever takes a photograph owns the copyright to it unless they specifically modify or relinquish the ownership. Doesn't matter whether it's marked or not. Doesn't have to have a copyright notice. Sometimes you can use an image for 'fair use' - but fair use doesn't involve any kind of commerce.

Bottom line is that before you use an image, you'd better know where it came from and have permission to use it or you could end up wasting time fighting some battles that could better be used to grow your business.

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LB

15 years ago

but fair use doesn't involve any kind of commerce.

Not true. While commercial purpose is one of the things that may be considered in determining fair use, commercial use does not exclude fair use. It's a huge debate that even the courts can't seem to get straight. If commercial use prohibited fair use, it could easily squelch freedom of speech such as movie reviews, instructional books, training videos and the like simply because they were commercial in nature. In fact- Google Images is commercial in nature.

However, using Google images for an ebook cover or something similar is clearly not fair use whether commercial or not as the work is not transformative.

To the OP: If you have an image that you absolutely love, you could try contacting the owner and asking for permission or to pay a small licensing fee to use it.

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adamv

15 years ago

Originally Posted by bigcullie

Thanks Adamv,

I was certainly one of those niave people who thought they were stock photographs. i work in education, and I can assure your that every student uses these photographs for there own ends. It only seams to be a problems if there are widely published or somebody is using them to make money from them, indirectly.

Scots law says ignorance of the law is no excuse, but use of google images is very confusing. Google freely uses them to their advantage, but put no warning on them for others. It is certainly black hat for Google.

Anyway I have learned my lesson before to much damage was done. I like how you have turned your images to your advantage, but it is a pity you have to. BTW: I had a look at your site, and they are fantastic drawings, good luck with your sales.

Anyway, thanks for your advice, I appreciate it.

Gordon

I don't blame you, and I agree that it's VERY confusing. It does seem like you could just go on there and use whatever you want. I'm glad you figured it out early enough to avoid any serious problems.

With a little digging though, you can find lots of good public domain photos as well as free and low cost stock photos. Where ever you get your images from though, you should do everything you can to make sure you are allowed to use the images for a certain purpose before using them to make sure you can avoid any issues.

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koolphoto

15 years ago

I think everyone should check the US copyright office about fair use and copyright. Most people who build websites and think that they can use images under fair use because they are not commercial are mistaken.

You can't use an image under fair use and stick it on a website. One of the tests is if the image has been significantly altered. There are many other tests. In general most people who market on the internet cannot use images under fair use.

I have found that a majority of people on this forum with the exception of a few are totally in the dark when it comes to copyright law. For your protection, If you are going to build sites and use images then it is your responsibility to understand the copyright law. The best place to find out about it is through the US copyright office, your own countries copyright office or a lawyer who specializes in copyright law.

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stevenh512

15 years ago

Originally Posted by koolphoto

I think everyone should check the US copyright office about fair use and copyright.

That's always one of the first places I look when I have any kind of question about copyright law.

I have found that a majority of people on this forum with the exception of a few are totally in the dark when it comes to copyright law. For your protection, If you are going to build sites and use images then it is your responsibility to understand the copyright law.

I'll be the first to admit, copyright law (like most laws) can be confusing.. kind of makes you wonder where "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" came from when the laws are written in a way that can only be understood by lawyers and judges most of the time.. lol.. but the US Copyright Office does a pretty good job of making things clear, and anything you can't understand after looking there can usually be cleared up by consulting with a good attorney who deals with copyright law (but that could get expensive).

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John Ritz

15 years ago

I think everyone should check the US copyright office about fair use and copyright. Most people who build websites and think that they can use images under fair use because they are not commercial are mistaken.

...and...

As per TOS for Google Images you canot use them for any commercial purposes, even if you didnt intend to resell the images.

While it is definitely true that you should get legal advice about such issues, and that it's almost always a violation of copyright laws, I still wonder how Google is able to freely scrape sites and use them for THEIR own commercial purposes, then they have the gall to put in their TOS that no one can use them for commercial purposes, when they don't even own the copyright to them.

But then again they have an army of lawyers and bottomless pockets.

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SiteSeller52

15 years ago

If I remember correctly there is a warning on the google images page about the copyright on some if not all of the images provided by google images.

I use sxc[dot]hu These images are free to use as long as the photographer says it's ok. Most of the pictures have open licenses I don't think I have ever run across an image I couldn't use these are the best free pictures I have found.

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bigcullie

15 years ago

Yes there is a warning, but it is very hard to see.

But it is only a warning, giving absolutely no information whether the image is copyright or not. And if it is copyrighted, there is no information as to who owns the copyright to contact. Fair and reasonable in this case seams to go out the window.

I can only concluded that the owner of the copyright will complain only if the user is making money with the picture, directly or indirectly, or somehow defacing that picture.

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yourreviewer

15 years ago

Hey guys, is it true that you cannot use the photos from istock for your ebooks because they can be used only once? All these rules and laws are so confusing. What do you guys use for pictures in ebooks?

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bestIMtools

15 years ago

I would advice you to remove all Google images from your site NOW!!! and I mean NOW!

When we first got started 3 years ago that was one expensive mistake we made. We downloaded some images, put them on our website, and got a nice $10,000 bill with a lawyer's notice right to our door!

So do yourself a favor and buy stock images. At STOCKXPERT - Royalty free stock photography community you can get them for as low as $1 or 750 images for $249.

All the best!

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iTechSolutions

15 years ago

I am a member of one membership site and owner paid $6000 to settle a unauthorised picture use on his site.

Better use PD sites if you want free or stock image sites if you want some good images and wish to pay small amount.

If they don't have any sign on store to pay, will you bring a box of beer without paying? Same with google images

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nmh

15 years ago

What about the ones on Microsoft under the clipart? What can you use those for? They have photos also.

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Kay King 15 years ago

In google images, if you click on the image you will find copyright info for that image or at least where to find the info about use of it.

It's true courts have a hard time determining what constitutes "fair use" but unless you have a lot of money for attorney fees, probably not a good idea to test it. Fair use was designed primarily to allow use by educational and news organizations. "I thought it was fair" doesn't cut it.:rolleyes:

You can buy use of excellent images for $1-2 - not worth risking everything just to use a pretty picture without checking the copyright.

kay
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Kerry Finch 15 years ago

Originally Posted by nmh

What about the ones on Microsoft under the clipart? What can you use those for? They have photos also.

I was thinking the same thing - what are the rules for Microsoft users, can the images in their library be used?
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yourreviewer

15 years ago

Guys, I still haven't got any response for my question. Can you use istock images for ebooks? Because ebooks are sold over and over again, would it cause any problems?

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Nonny

15 years ago

Originally Posted by yourreviewer

Guys, I still haven't got any response for my question. Can you use istock images for ebooks? Because ebooks are sold over and over again, would it cause any problems?

If you aren't sure, the best thing to do is to go to the stock photo site and read the license agreement.

here is what istockphoto's says:

iStockphoto License Agreement | iStockphoto.com

(a) You may only use the Content for those advertising, promotional and other specified purposes which are Permitted Uses (as defined below). For clarity, you may not use the Content in products for resale, license or other distribution, unless (i) the proposed use is allowable under an Extended License which is available for the Content; or (ii) if the original Content has been fundamentally modified or transformed sufficiently that it constitutes an original work entitling the author or artist to copyright protection under applicable law, and where the primary value of such transformed or derivative work is not recognizable as the Content nor is the Content capable of being downloaded, extracted or accessed by a third party as a stand-alone file (satisfaction of these conditions will constitute the work as a "Permitted Derivative Work" for the purposes of this Agreement). For example, you cannot superficially modify the Content, print it on a t-shirt, mug, poster, template or other item, and sell it to others for consumption, reproduction or re-sale. These uses will not be permitted as or constitute Permitted Derivative Works. If there is any doubt that a work is a Permitted Derivative Work, you should either obtain an Extended License or contact iStockphoto's Client Relations for guidance. Any use of the Content that is not a Permitted Use shall constitute infringement of copyright.

You would likely want to purchase the license for Electronic Items for Resale (unlimited run). It costs more than a standard single-use license, of course.
iStockphoto Extended License Provisions | iStockphoto.com

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bigcullie

15 years ago

Originally Posted by yourreviewer

Guys, I still haven't got any response for my question. Can you use istock images for ebooks? Because ebooks are sold over and over again, would it cause any problems?

This has been a great thread, plenty of active discussion, and genuine replies, however I am still confused. I now know what I cannot use, but I have no idea what I can, other than my own photographs, which are not always suitable.

So here is three blunt questions:

1. Could I buy a photograph from a stock agencies, and use it for an ebook cover?

2. Can I use similar photographs in an ebook to brighen up the pages?

3. Can I use similar photographs in the ebook, but modified to show the use of photoediting techniques?

Thanks, Gordon.

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Nonny

15 years ago

Actually rereading the license agreement I'm getting confused, since the prohibited uses for a Standard iStockphoto license seem to include:

you may not:
# incorporate the Content in any product that results in a re-distribution or re-use of the Content (such as electronic greeting card web sites, web templates and the like) or is otherwise made available in a manner such that a person can extract or access or reproduce the Content as an electronic file;

But you can use it for:

on-line or electronic publications, including web pages to a maximum of 800 x 600 pixels;

So, is an e-book the former or the latter. I was pretty sure the former, but now I'm not so sure.

Disclaimer: I've been researching this very issue for my own purposes, so I'm not any sort of expert.

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bigcullie

15 years ago

For my new eBook cover, it will definately be my own photograph.

Photographs to be used in the ebook are still to be defined.

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Star Riley

15 years ago

This thread has surely helped clear up a few questions I didn't even know I had thanks.

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spearce000

15 years ago

For over 4 million free to use stock photos, try this site: Wikimedia Commons

Some images are Public Domain or copyright expired (meaning you can use them however you wish), others are Creative Commons (meaning there are some restrictions, but they're still free).

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bionictortoise 15 years ago

Another way to prove the work is yours is to shoot wider than you want the final frame to be.

Then crop it to how you want it to be framed. Keep the original file (straight from the camera, not resized or anything) and only ever publish the cropped version.

Then if you find you have to prove it's yours, you can. I showed my original photo to someone who was using it without asking or paying. As mine was uncropped he couldn't argue.

And yes you can use photos from the stock sites, as long as you read the individual usage for each one and use them correctly.

Also remember: Royalty-free does not mean uncopyrighted!

And only download headers and graphics from people you trust. They could have been created without proper usage rights. And ignorance will not save you in court.

The author of a photograph does not have to have a watermark or Copyright symbol on it. They are automatically the Copyright holder.

Where does Google images give the Copyright info? I have only seen 'Image may be subject to copyright.'

The purpose of Google images is for people to find information easier. Not for people to use the images.

I only know how to stop the Google Bot going to pages, not folders. Does anyone know how you stop it going to your image directory?

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Google images, can we use them as a normal stock image?

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