Why you need to be in Southeast Asia

I've been seriously thinking about doing this...either there or possibly south america (someplace like Chile possibly).

Chile has a great startup scene...the government recently started the "Startup Chile" program that basically pays you to start businesses there...not an investment, not a loan, a flat out grant of like 40K to start a business there.

Of course, you have to sign up and be approved...but it looks awesome.

It seems like there are simply more and more opportunities abroad these days while the US increases taxes, regulations, and nonsense...

Nice post and I agree 100%

Never been to Thailand, but would like to at least visit 1 day.

Since I don´t speak Thai, but do speak Spanish fluently, I chose Peru. And the food, Pisco and women are top notch !

$800 a month here is fairly good, not great though. With $1,500 a month you can live very, very comfortably here in Lima.


Or...

Use your earnings from I.M. and buy/build a house or apartment(s).

I built one, and now live rent-free / mortgage free. That is a huge benefit.

Now I am in the process of building another apartment for the purpose of getting monthly rent from tenants. So I will be getting income from the local economy.

My fiancee (born and raised in Lima) also earns from the local economy and does pretty well herself so we pool our resources.

We also find deals on eBay on makeup and clothing, mainly from Hong Kong, sometimes from the good old USA (things that are not available here, or if they are, are very expensive here) and have them shipped here, then re-sell for a profit.

It can be done. I do admit I have a big advantage by being with a girl who was born and raised here though... Not everyone has that advantage.

Great post !

you can enjoy the luxurious lifestyle with $800..

I lived in Cancun, Mexico for almost a year. I plan on going back, but only 6 months/year.

As others have mentioned, there are good and bad things about living abroad. You know how people say, "If you think America sucks, try living in another country"?

Well, I did and in some ways they're right and in some ways they're wrong.

Some specifics for Cancun, Mexico

Cancun is NOT typical from an expense point of view. It is fairly expensive to live in Cancun if you live in the Hotel Zone, where I did. If you live in the city, it can be much cheaper. I knew people paying about $400/mo for rent but you wouldn't catch me dead where they were living.

My condo:
~2,000 sq ft 2bdrm 2-1/2 bath
10th floor Maralago
Marble floors, 2 covered balconies, one off the master overlooking lagoon, one much larger overlooking Caribbean
Excellent security
Cost: $25,000 pesos/month or a about $2,000 USD

Utilities
Electricity - ~$150/mo in summer
Telmex Internet/Phone 10mb - $99USD / mo with free calls to USA
Telcel phone - I had my Samsung Galaxy unlocked from AT&T for $20 and then bought the Amigo Plan which is a pay as you go plan. You just recharge it at any convenience store. Texts are very expensive. Minutes were cheap. Data was 500 pesos /month which is about $40.

Car
2006 Ford Explorer paid $6,000 (in general, cars are a bit more than in US)
Full-coverage Insurance - $600/yr
Gas - EXPENSIVE! Close to $5/gallon

Groceries
If you're used to typical american grocery stores, you'll be shocked in Cancun. Even though we have a Walmart grocery, the variety is much less. For example, only 1 type of jelly and peanut butter. If you like strong or exotic cheeses like gorgonzola, blue, etc, forget it. Very hard to find anything but white cheese.

The beef is awful. It looks good but has no flavor. But it is cheap. I bought ribeyes for about $3.50/lb but no matter how I cooked them, they never tasted like American beef.
Before I left, I found an American beef store but you paid through the nose for it.

Overall, grocery pricing is not bad.

Health
This is where Mexico really shines. 49 years old, smoker, I got great health insurance for $94/month with prescription plan. My girlfriend walked into Hospiten Cancun and got an MRI for $200 cash. Her deductible in the states is over $2,000 for the same MRI.

The Bad
It's not the USA. You have to get used to machine gun toting guys. We drove to Hol Box, and island about 100 miles from Cancun. We passed through 5 military checkpoints. We were never stopped but it's still scary to people not used to it.

The Myths
I got so sick of people telling me how dangerous Mexico is. It's a huge country and parts of it are dangerous, such as the border towns. Even Cancun is dangerous for a certain class of people.
For example, right after we moved there, 2 drug dealers got their heads cut off by Los Zetas for dealing in their territory. But they have a hands-off policy on Americans. If you don't deal or pimp, you'll never even know los Zetas run things down there.
The last thing they want is to scare off all the tourists aka money and they sure don't want the FBI down there investigating things.

Summary
You won't really save much money living in Cancun compared to cheaper areas of the USA, but you will live in luxury on one of the most beautiful oceans in world.

I was just laughing at how credulous and guileless your previous post appeared to be.

Great thread !!!
There are some valid points raised for both sides of the discussion although I am amazed at some of the comments about the "Third World" maybe 20+ years ago some of the comments could be accepted. There are just as many undesirable places to live in the UK (my home country) and the USA, it's not all like the movies would have people believe. When locals here in Malaysia speak of how wonderful it must be in the USA they need to look at the Michael Moore movies to get a balanced view as I remember thinking after watching Roger and Me how depressing it would be to live in Flint, Michigan, I cannot recall even in the poorest parts of Bali or Penang anything so horrible. Also no matter how poor people might be in S.E. Asia - The petty crime rates are nothing here compared to the Western world. Main reason seems to be that there is zero tolerance on Drugs, which was reported to be the biggest factor (feeding the habit) on the increasing crime rates (in the UK at least) I can't speak about the other countries (S. America etc) BUT the thread was entitled "Why you need to be in Southeast Asia" so maybe "The Great American Passport Myth: Why Just 3.5% Of Us Travel Overseas!" could be true after all? FYI - S.E. Asia is made up of just 11 countries marked in green here here .. not sure how Dominican Republic and Columbia, Brazil etc. managed to be relocated..This isn't I'm sure a true picture anymore than the urban myth that only 10% of Americans have a passport. BUT I would recommend travel as it does broaden the mind. That's the problem with stereotyping other countries.



Having lived in France, Spain and now Malaysia, I moved here for work as the economy in 2007 was so bad in Europe. Despite having no mortgage or debts I sold up and moved out to Asia as it's a growing economy.
I love the UK but there's no argument that it is a very expensive place to live. When I speak to friends back home they all have been affected in some way by the depressed economy, triple dip recession reported this week. One friend cannot retire for years despite having planned meticulously and with a low risk share portfolio (ironically he's a regional bank manager so not naive) Other skilled people thrown into unemployment and even "safe" government jobs disappeared because of "cut-backs".
Medical costs here are definitely cheaper and as good quality, from what I understand there as many doctors being sued in the USA as in the UK. Many of the doctors in the UK are from overseas so I don't see the argument about quality of medical care being relevant. As for "developed" I don't see any issues with shopping, transport, electricity supply here (but I am in KL not a village). I think its a case using your own personal experiences and go with your own intuition.

World's 'best value' countries: Live on less than a grand a month, retire on the cheap and still get endless sun! | Mail Online

So how was ur trip to the ermm sex change doc?

Not in some places like Singapore where everything is sky high, Thailand and Malaysia I can understand.

Yep - i am in Hong Kong... much the same. Rent is CRAZY... you wont find any apartment for less than 1500 USD ( that would get you maybe 600 sq ft ). If you want to live in something more like you are used to in the west you're looking at more like 3 or 4000 USD a month and still only around 1200 sq ft).

On the plus side though... taxes are only 15%. As a business owner no dividends tax, capital gains or corporate tax. Eating out can be very cheap if you are ok eating asian food. The travel makes up for it also - only a couple hours from Thailand,Indonesia, Philippines, Vietnam etc and it's real cheap to do so... so it's quite possible to do that once a month or every other month for a long weekend. I myself love Muay Thai so i try go to train in Thailand once every 3 months.

Also something else that i would never have considered before as a bonus is the transport system. Possibly the best in the world. The MTR is very efficient and cheap way to travel around the city (I believe over 90% of the population use it every day)

Most apartments are small and have no kitchens as the culture is more eating out... if you want to eat western style or drink beers - well that is super expensive also.

I have to say i do love living in Hong Kong it's an amazing and unique city - however pollution is getting worse and the rise of the mainland tourists is really raising costs across the board.

If you want to work in the digital industries (Not IM - but work in an office doing design, SEO etc) - you can do very well at the moment - particularly Singapore or Hong Kong as it's boom time with the internet world here. Singapore is miles ahead of HK so far for it but HK is rising fast - you could probably expect around 25 - 30% extra money on top of what you get in the west for those jobs if you have the skills.

I have been thinking of my next move and I think Penang might be my next location - still very cheap and on the up.

Go go go...

I was stationed in Okinawa in the early seventies, and went to the Philippines, and Thailand, several times. Gas was 22 cents a gallon, and American cigarettes were 19 cents a pack, on base. Those were the days.

It was nice in all of those countries, and I would like to go back for a visit, but I think I would miss the good old USA, even with all it's problems.

Glenn

Guys, guys...

Asia? I know many gurus live there. It is cheap.

But go to Belarus - Central Europe. I live here. I earn good money online and I can live in luxury hotel here for this money=)

Our average salary is $400 a month. If you earn more you can a be a rich man here and live like a king=)

Interesting topic!

Taking advantage of currency exchange rates is just plain SMART.

But there is NO WAY on God's green earth that I'm ever moving to Southeast Asia to save a few bucks. (Or South America for that matter.)

Chris Kent makes some good points. For me, legal and medical issues come to mind. Can I trust the police and judicial system? What kind of medical care can I expect if necessary, especially on an emergency basis? (I already have ongoing medical issues.) Even if the medical care is good (in one instance), is it consistent?

One Warrior I know of said she had her hip replacement done in India for $6K. She said it would have cost $60K here in the States.

Both of my hips were replaced and cost about $80K EACH (here in the States). I DON'T CARE if I could have had it done cheaper in India. For me, peace of mind is worth the difference.

No, foreign medical care isn't necessarily inferior. But what if something goes wrong? Is there someone competent to fix it? What if I need to pursue legal action? Can I get satisfaction (legally) if necessary?

As a single woman with medical issues, there is NO WAY I'm moving to a non-Western country (or even South American country) to save a few bucks. (I might be willing to move to England or France or another European country under special circumstances, but even then...)

I'd far rather be smart about money (using cheap labor, etc.) by NOT putting myself at risk, either physically or legally. I dunno. I read a lot of books and maybe I've read too many: Midnight Express, Not Without My Daughter, etc. Not to mention all of the books about women in Islamic societies. (And yes, I know Thailand and Mexico aren't Saudi Arabia.)

I happen to like being an American and am keenly aware that the moment I step off of American soil, my rights and liberties as I know them are suspended and I'm completely subject to the laws and decrees of the land I occupy.

For me, moving to a foreign country just to live like a queen for cheap is selling out, being a bit lazy. My goal is to do VERY well -- by American standards (and keep my American rights and liberties, as well as all of my very American amenities).

I know I can do it.

Of course, I live in South Florida... I guess that makes me and Jose Jalepeno Cuban. (Jeff Dunham reference.)

Michelle

Hi Gaz,

Are those properties owned under your name or your wife name?

In some countries, foreigners are not allowed to own properties, like houses or stuff, unless you register a foreign business which will be hugely taxed, and the people from government will really watch you for it.

Some people will have their properties on their wifes name, but I have some friends who were dumped, get divorced, and the wife runs away with everything he once had.

Yeah, pretty sure that's not true in terms of life expectancy. Are you talking about just the area you were in?

Life expectancy Philippines = 68

Life expectancy United States = 78

I too love SE Asia and the more laid back lifestyle but the facts are you can usually live longer in Western countries.

If you're a bachelor, $1000/month here in the Philippines will give you a lifestyle that's similar to the lifestyle of a bachelor in California who earns $3000/month. That's because $3000/month in California will buy the same things in California that $1000 can buy in the Philippines.



Blue collar employees here in the Philippines are paid among the lowest wages. If you were in the Philippines with the same job that you have in the US, then you'd be paid here a third of what you earn in the US (in terms of the $ buying power in the US and not forex value) and would have a lifestyle here that's a third of your lifestyle in the US. However:


Executive posts in international corporations here that need creative labor, such as global advertising firms, are paid really well. Aside from good insurance from a global private insurance corp as well as government and private benefits, along with having good bank credit ratings, you'd earn enough money to have a lifestyle here that's similar to the lifestyle you'd get with $15000/month in California.




Yes, you get that in provincial cities and areas here. In Manila, the capital of the country, it's entirely different. My American and European traveler friends, most of whom are executives of international non-government organizations like the United Nations, consider Manila as a big city like NYC, and they've been to NYC and spent more than 3 years there. They also consider the suburban communities here in Manila as very similar to the suburban communities in California. As for the culture, we're so much "Westernized" here that even 3-year old children can fluently speak and understand English, because TV, print, book publication houses and schools among other media groups here all use English as their main medium. I know many people here in Manila who never went to school (yes, N E V E R), and they still understand English, enough to converse with someone who only speaks English. And, my traveler friends consider the provincial cities and areas here in the Philippines as quite similar to some rural areas in the US, such as certain areas in Kansas and Texas.



Yes, our hospitals and doctors here advise people to go to certain hospitals outside the country for certain treatment and surgeries, and they also arrange things for you with those foreign hospitals and their recommended doctors and surgeons in those hospitals. For example, after I was gunned down twice and permanently lost 100% of my eyesight in 2003, the top neurosurgeon of the Philippines operated on me, with the supervision of the top neurologist here in the Philippines (contacts of my father and mother). I was advised to contact some of their colleagues abroad for the latest developments in stem cell technology (to possibly regenerate my optic nerve). I also have a good family friend who went to Australia during my recovery just to speak with her colleagues there about certain software and gadgets that would be useful to me (that's where I learned about the applications, digital devices and electronic equipment that I now use to assist me in my daily activities at home, in my travels and while doing business), and she also hooked me up with her geneticist and medical scientist friends in the EU and Australia. My point is, each country has a different medical specialization, and it'd be best for a person to know which country to go to, for which type of specific treatmet.



This varies from person to person. Someone who owns a big construction firm here and does all big contract negotiations and biddings on his or her own won't be as relaxed as someone who owns a couple of buildings in the capital that are rented out to offices and companies. Also, people up north (Ilocos region) have been documented to have the longest life expectancy in the country (I think it's 85), though like what others said above, the average life expectancy of a country or even a small area doesn't necessarily apply to anyone who lives there. What would be a more usable statistic to consider that'd affect life expectancy is crime rate. Here in Manila, if you rarely go out at night, or take the necessary precautions when you do, like avoiding high crime rate areas (which I overlooked and unfortunately got gunned down when I went out midnight with my wife to buy fried rice and "lechon kawali" at a local food stall in a high crime rate area with lots of hypes and drunk people), then you'd most likely be safe.

Philippines is not so cheap as few years ago. At least not in bigger city.
I did visit last year and everything is lot more expensive then when I live there few years ago.
Most that is imported in Philippines is similar price and in Europe. At least phone, tv and such thing.
5 years ago I could take 10 people to KFC for same price and one in Europe.
Now it is 3:1
I need at least 1500 usd to live there but 2000 would make a good life for me

However I´m still aiming to move back one day

Booyah...have fun, man. I was there in late October last year for a week and had a great time. There's a really cool expat entrepreneurial culture up there that's totally worth checking out.

Cool if you need any help or pointers feel free to drop me a PM and if your up for a coffee sometime always up for meeting fellow warriors

Gaz Cooper

Chiang Mai is starting to become the home from home for all the cool Internet Marketers

This thread is not about "South-Asia" or "South Asian".

Nobody in this thread suggested that South Asian countries are desirable.

This is where the needs of the individual come into play again...


Colombia is at a crossroads right now... They have always followed
the Washington Consensus, but there are powerful forces right now
trying to move them toward the Beijing Consensus. In my opinion,
this would be disadvantageous for them as a country, and catastrophic
for the poor and lower middle class citizens of their country. They
are at an important crossroads as they try to overcome several
natural challenges while mining their natural resources in an
effective way-- I want to be a part of the solution that helps
them to grow in a way that helps all of their people, and not
just the rich and powerful.


Argentina is a case that is particularly close to my heart... They
have made college completely tuition free and open to everyone
in an attempt to help young people have a better chance for
upward mobility.

Sadly, college is still far too expensive for many young people.
Books, living space, food-- to say nothing of computers and
other basic needs. Many businesses are price-gouging and there
is little the government can do to control it effectively.

Likewise, there is not a solid standard for exams and those who
do graduate from the public Universities have their credibility
hurt. To me, this means there is massive opportunity here.
Not only to start scholarships for these young people to help
pay for basic needs of going to college, but also to develop
teaching programs that take advantage of their naturally
strong skills in mathematics while avoiding the dogmatic
lack of critical thinking skills that tends to permeate their
society as a whole. More than any other struggling,
developing country in the world right now, Argentina has
the chance to literally educate itself into a 1st world country
over the next two or three generations. Stop and think
a moment about how amazing that possibility is.

I want to be a part of that!!




A basic value of human life should probably be an
important factor for anyone thinking of moving to
any country. Great point!

Visa issues for Thailand is one of the lets say challenging issues for long term stats depending on your situation but where there is a will there is a way.

here are the options

1.) For just visiting you get a visa upon entry which is valid for 30 days as long as you fly into Thailand, if you come over one of the land borders it is just 15 days

2.) If you are a young person (under 50) then the easiest one will be a multiple entry tourist visa, triple entry if you can, a double entry is easy and can be obtained from your in country Thai consulate.

The Tourist visa allows you to stay for 2 months with each entry, at the end of 2 months you can go to the Immigration office and get a one month extension so a double entry can be extended from 4 months to 6 months

3.) If you are over 50 you can apply for a 12 month O Visa which allows you to stay in the country for 3 months then you must leave the country but can come right back in when I had this visa it was a great excuse to see the surrounding countries such as LAOS, CAMBODIA, MYANMAR, VIETNAM, MALAYSIA SINGAPORE then when you come back in you have another 3 months before having to leave again.

The O Visa can be extended at the end of it for an additional 3 months by visiting immigration prior to it expiring making it a total of 15 months

Once people know they want to stay many will enroll in a Thai Language course and apply for a year long ED Visa (education visa) you only have to attend 4 hours a week to qualify and the school you sign up with provides you all the paperwork for your visa, all you need to do is visit one of the surrounding countries and apply for your ED Visa.

4.)A lot of us are married to thai women so if you happen to get Married then you have the option of staying year round, you will need to provide all the paperwork Marriage cert etc and get an O Visa based on married to a Thai there is a list of requirements but once it is issued you can travel to Thailand and it will be for 3 months only prior to the end of 3 months you will need to visit Immigration with your wife along with a bank book showing 400,000 thai baht (about $15,000 USA in your account and it must of been in your account for 2-3 months and cannot fall below that amount (cant remember) once all your paperwork and money is checked you will receive an extension of stay based on married to a thai.
'
What that means is you no longer have to leave the country all you have to do is report to Immigration every 3 months to report your current address. At the end of 12 months you just go back to Immigration with your bank book showing you have $15,0000 in there and it has been there untouched for at least 2 months and they will extend your visa for another 12 months without having to leave the country.

If you did want to leave the country you just purchase a re entry permit for $30 which allows you to leave and come back without it affecting your Marriage extension.

RETIREMENT VISA

If you are over 50 you can also apply for a retirement visa which is the same as above except you have to deposit 800,000 thai baht (about $28,000 USD) in a bank account and dont touch it for 2 months and you will get a retirment visa which allows you the same as the Marriage visa.

Most people do visa runs and live on a tourist visa although its technically not the correct visa but its the easiest method for most that want to stay a year or 2

Hope that helps

Gaz Cooper
Amz Training Academy

Geez, and you'd think they'd waive this to encourage tourism.

30% tax on business too right? What do they think of their country? Canada?

I can only really comment on Thailand, It's certainly a mans world out here but they still have a woman Prime Minister as well as lots of women in high government positions.
I wouldn't say there's the same sexual equality as the west but as a female expat you would be treated with respect.

Up here in Chiang Mai I would describe as very safe and there are a lot of expat single ladies living here.

Hi,

Blimey, read the whole thread and no one mentions the UK.

* We have great weather throughout the whole of the last week of June. Occasionally.

* the borders are completely open to anyone (returning British are subject to stringent checks though) - any problems can be solved easily with cheap, plentiful sham-marriages

* expats here don't need to worry about legalities like driving licence/car tax/insurance/law in general, especially if they own a bank

* expat communities here have their own thriving black-market economies

* the government will bend over backwards to provide interpreters, assistance with claiming benefits and will move any British people down the housing list to make way for foreigners

* it's virtually impossible for a foreigner to be removed from the country (for foreigners, it's like the 'Hotel California')

* foreigners have more rights than indigenous British, who are at the bottom of the ladder in every way, but pay the most for being here

* food is available from almost every country in the world on most high streets, just be careful when buying 'beef' burgers from British shops. If you like Halal meat, you're in luck. If you don't, you're not. If you look hard enough, you might find a few lettuces that haven't been ritually slaughtered.

.............

Just be aware that if you walk down a typical street, you may have to spend time giving directions to confused local indigenous types, who will be completely lost, incapable of recognising the streets they were raised upon. There is also a bit of a problem with locals begging off rich expats.

:rolleyes:

Fixed that for you -

'I wouldn't say there's the same sexual inequality as the west.'

LINK LINK LINK LINK etc

The environment is important. Moreover-
- All kinds of foods of your country comes with poisonous chemicals, fish with formalin, fruits with chemicals, vegetables with insecticides - no govt to see.
- There is no security in your country, not even inside of home, not in your bedroom. Where the prime minister itself says, they can't provide security inside of bedroom.
- All drivers are illiterate, they don't have knowledge of driving, they don't recognize any driving signs, civilized people can never drive (guaranteed).
- Air full of toxic pollutants and carbon monoxide. You can't live without dust.
- No health insurance, no pension insurance, no social security, in one word nothing. Don't compare this life with civilized western life, you don't even have knowledge about what is life.

I was in Cambodia early Jan for the second time and it really is cheap but very far behind Thailand in many ways. If Thailand throws me out Cambodia will be the next spot or Phillipines