The Refund Policy is the Root of Almost all Failures !

29 replies
I had a very serious conversation with myself and was shocked when I came across this Fact that Refund Policies are what stops a Person from being Successful most of the Time.

Lets take a look at

The Demerits of Refund Policies :

1.If the Buyer finds the Information a bit difficult to implement than what he thought while Purchasing,then he would subconsciously Reject the WSO or product without even giving it a single shot.And he/she does it "VERY EASILY". Why ? Because He can have a Refund.

2.Now,Because the Buyer is Not Productive,the Seller gets a Chargeback and have to Refund the money.

So What can we do ?

1.Turn the "No Questions Asked Refund Policy" into a "Show the Proof you took action and Failed Refund Policy"

The Buyer will have to show the Proof that he took some action but he Failed.

The Advantages if we Don't have this "NO QUESTIONS ASKED REFUND POLICIES" here at the Warrior Forum are :

1.The Buyer will have to take action to get a Refund , And chances are,he will succeed.

2.The Seller will get a heck less number of Refunds.

3.Most of the Buyers will get Productive.

I understand that most of the Products are Crap.But Guess what ?
The Seller will sell only that information which worked for most of the people.
Why ?
Because his Respect is on the Line.People will send him proofs that the Product didn't worked.And he will lose his RespectSo now,there will be a lot of quality products launched everyday on this Forum or Clickbank.And Not those shitty CB 1 click softwares.

This is just what I think.I don't think the Old Refund Policy will change ever but if it does,A revolution will take Place.

So till then,Keep your Hopes ON

Peace
ShubhAshish
#failures #policy #refund #root
  • Profile picture of the author Sue McDonald
    Good post and there are so many people who ask for a refund. I recently sold a course through my affiliate link and after 4 days the guy asked for a refund. The owner of the course said he did not even open the course so how could he know whether it was for him or not?

    The owner of the course is arguing with PayPal that he did not even look at the product so he took no action so it will be a wait and see if PayPal give the refund or not.

    There are so many people get the download and still ask for a refund. I had that when a girl claimed she could not download a product of mine but I know that there was nothing wrong with that download. I could not be bothered arguing and gave here the refund.
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    • Profile picture of the author theaccountant
      that's the breaks

      A fews years ago I offered a life time gaurantee and guess what only 1% requested a refund

      When you sell to desperate people hard up for cash looking for el dorado,don't be surprised if they have buyers remorse when they find the ebook whatever you are hyping does not live up to expectation or they even suspect that it might not.

      What many do is to go to the review areas of various forums, ask questions about the purchase that they have just made - any hint of a negative review scares that hard up for cash customer .. refund requst soon after.

      I am brutal offline and online , I only bother to speak to people who will not feel it money wise. If some-one start's quibbling about price , I CUT THEM LOOSE.

      I am never the cheapest. That way you get less business but more secure revenue for the longterm

      Period.
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  • Profile picture of the author jimvol
    Great Post! I think you are very right, a lot of people do use the refund policy against us marketers. This is really sad too.
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  • Profile picture of the author drewfioravanti
    I disagree. If, for any reason someone is not happy with whatever I sold them, they are entitled to a 100% refund. I don't care why. If my product did not help them achieve what they thought it would, then I would rather they get their money back.

    Serial refunders are a part of doing business. I don't lose sleep over it.

    Guarantees are used to help in the selling process.
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  • Profile picture of the author Malcolm Thomas
    Refunds are just an aspect of doing business. There will ALWAYS be customers who are unsatisfied and request a refund no matter how great of a product that you make.
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  • Profile picture of the author theaccountant
    I mean who in their right mind can believe that there is any real earth shaterring value in a $7 course!!

    Seriously!!

    I almost bought an ebook today through an e-mail offer , but when I saw that the price was $7, I knew that that offer itself would be useless on its own and there would be atleast 2 upsells on the backend.

    So I decided not to allow the vendor to insult my intelligence.
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  • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
    Originally Posted by Shubh Ashish View Post

    I had a very serious conversation with myself and was shocked when I came across this Fact that Refund Policies are what stops a Person from being Successful most of the Time.

    Lets take a look at

    The Demerits of Refund Policies :

    1.If the Buyer finds the Information a bit difficult to implement than what he thought while Purchasing,then he would subconsciously Reject the WSO or product without even giving it a single shot.And he/she does it "VERY EASILY". Why ? Because He can have a Refund.

    2.Now,Because the Buyer is Not Productive,the Seller gets a Chargeback and have to Refund the money.

    So What can we do ?

    1.Turn the "No Questions Asked Refund Policy" into a "Show the Proof you took action and Failed Refund Policy"

    The Buyer will have to show the Proof that he took some action but he Failed.

    The Advantages if we Don't have this "NO QUESTIONS ASKED REFUND POLICIES" here at the Warrior Forum are :

    1.The Buyer will have to take action to get a Refund , And chances are,he will succeed.

    2.The Seller will get a heck less number of Refunds.

    3.Most of the Buyers will get Productive.

    I understand that most of the Products are Crap.But Guess what ?
    The Seller will sell only that information which worked for most of the people.
    Why ?
    Because his Respect is on the Line.People will send him proofs that the Product didn't worked.And he will lose his RespectSo now,there will be a lot of quality products launched everyday on this Forum or Clickbank.And Not those shitty CB 1 click softwares.

    This is just what I think.I don't think the Old Refund Policy will change ever but if it does,A revolution will take Place.

    So till then,Keep your Hopes ON

    Peace
    ShubhAshish
    This from the guy whose sig reads "Sell dreams, not products"???

    Really?

    Don't forget to feed the unicorns...:rolleyes:
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    • Profile picture of the author emb1781
      Here is the wrench in your idea. Lets face it most of these WSO's are top secret information. A person doesnt know exactly what they are getting until they buy it in a lot of cases. Some of the things inside the WSO strategy could be things that are simply not right for the individual. Had the person knew in advance what these things were they would not have purchased the WSO to begin with. Like for instance if in a WSO you tell somebody to get in front of the camera and make videos. Or you tell people on the inside they need to spend tons of money on paid traffic and they dont have the budget for it. Now these are things that are not right for everybody. But the buyer had no idea that the method involved these things. You'll notice in a lot of these WSO threads if a person asks for more details the seller will tell them oh I cant reveal anymore without giving the method away. So I think the top secret nature of a lot of these things is what leads to refunds. Buyers simply do not know exactly what they are in store for until they buy the product in a lot of cases. When they find out the details it simply just may not be the right type of plan for the individual. But of course they couldn't possibly have known that without buying it and finding out the top secret information. After all the sales page said even a chimp or an 8 year old can do this
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      • Profile picture of the author lilc800
        Originally Posted by emb1781 View Post

        Here is the wrench in your idea. Lets face it most of these WSO's are top secret information. A person doesnt know exactly what they are getting until they buy it in a lot of cases. Some of the things inside the WSO strategy could be things that are simply not right for the individual. Had the person knew in advance what these things were they would not have purchased the WSO to begin with. Like for instance if in a WSO you tell somebody to get in front of the camera and make videos. Or you tell people on the inside they need to spend tons of money on paid traffic and they dont have the budget for it. Now these are things that are not right for everybody. But the buyer had no idea that the method involved these things. You'll notice in a lot of these WSO threads if a person asks for more details the seller will tell them oh I cant reveal anymore without giving the method away. So I think the top secret nature of a lot of these things is what leads to refunds. Buyers simply do not know exactly what they are in store for until they buy the product in a lot of cases. When they find out the details it simply just may not be the right type of plan for the individual. But of course they couldn't possibly have known that without buying it and finding out the top secret information. After all the sales page said even a chimp or an 8 year old can do this
        You are somewhat right in Some cases and that only accounts for 5% of the refunds going on..

        First off the whole point of a WSO is to learn and gain knowledge so as long as you learn something you shouldn't refund.

        But there are a Growing number of "Serial refunders" that refund everything they get so they can get the method and also get there money back.

        Most of them either do it because they seen a similar method before (not the exact) the new method they bought mostly likely has changes and add content.

        But the Biggest reason is because they don't get the same results as they seen on the thread right away. I'm not too sure who to blame for that maybe the "so called" gurus that have lead people to believe there is a "fast money online" Or whatever
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    • Profile picture of the author Robert Michael
      Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

      This from the guy whose sig reads "Sell dreams, not products"???

      Really?

      Don't forget to feed the unicorns...:rolleyes:
      LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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  • Profile picture of the author asiriusthoth
    Refunds make sense in a lot of cases, except when a service was provided that, it in it self, cost money; which most do. A paying customer can't expect a refund if all services were provided and agreed to unless there is a physical product to return.

    If you purchase web hosting, then 8 months down the road aren't happy, I don't see you entitled to an 8 month refund. Just as if you purchase website development and after 10 months demand a refund because you aren't "happy" with the site. Business is a cost; just about everything has a cost. If you run a "results driven business", expect a lot of refunds. If you run a business of deliverables (like most people do); refunds should be on a minimum.
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  • Profile picture of the author kaymehelp
    totally agree with you, more badly is the refund asked from paypal
    i had this situation many time; when selling a service the buyer once he gets it ask immediatly for a refund from paypal
    this is just pissing me off
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  • Profile picture of the author lilc800
    This is Why many people are Shifting over to sites like Payza that don't have a refund process as weak as Paypal.

    Honestly Refunds has kept me from selling many of my methods and Software I've created, I would be better off just using them for myself then Selling it and getting refunds and having to deal with them.
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    • Profile picture of the author writeaway
      Originally Posted by lilc800 View Post

      This is Why many people are Shifting over to sites like Payza that don't have a refund process as weak as Paypal.

      Honestly Refunds has kept me from selling many of my methods and Software I've created, I would be better off just using them for myself then Selling it and getting refunds and having to deal with them.
      If enough buyers feel they got stiffed, and can't get a satsfactory resolution, Payzaa might hit a wall.
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  • Profile picture of the author writeaway
    Here's something REVOLUTIONARY... Why not create REALLY USEFUL PRODUCTS?? Sure, there would always be a minority that refunds but if you focus on QUALITY, you would get less refunds overall.

    Your real worry should be the TONS of blackhat rips of WSOs posted almost at the same day the WSO launched. Focus on that not the refunders.

    Refund policies push producers to FOCUS ON QUALITY.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
    I had someone do a charge back to Paypal earlier in the week for a $1 product which had a refund policy in place. They didn't even bother to request a refund just went ahead and did a chargeback.
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  • Profile picture of the author ckbank
    This is where I stopped reading rest of the article "I had a very serious conversation with myself."
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    • Profile picture of the author butters
      Ok, so let me put my thoughts across that scenario... I go out and buy a product, lets say a WSO to keep it local, I read said WSO and I find it a pile of re-hashed crap (Plenty of them in there). For me to get a refund on this WSO I would need to show them that I took action on the inaccuarte, poorly made, bad informational report? Yeah right, that isn't going to happend is it.

      It is simple, a refund doesn't take long to do, if someone wants a refund, give it to them! If they want to fail, thats THEIR choice and something you should not care nor worry about. If you create a product which actually helps people do what it says, you don't over hype it with a load of crap, then your refund rate wont be so high... So, to sum this post up...

      1) Make a decent product which is actually good.
      2) If someone wants a refund, give it to them, move on and focus on something else.

      Edit: The refund policy is there to protect buyers, you do not have to advertise a no questions ask policy. You can simply not offer one in your sales letter, I know of plenty of warriors who do this. That way, if the buyer wants a refund they need to go through a dispute to get their money back, then it is up to you to fight it if you want.
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  • Profile picture of the author konakid
    I think that offering a satisfaction guaranteed refund would attract more people then you would lose through refunds.

    You will have more refunds, sure, but you should also get more sales overall to make up for it. People are just more likely to buy something if they think there is no risk.
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    • Profile picture of the author Tina Golden
      Originally Posted by Shubh Ashish View Post

      I had a very serious conversation with myself and was shocked when I came across this Fact that Refund Policies are what stops a Person from being Successful most of the Time.
      Your premise is faulty right from the start as that is most certainly NOT a fact. If giving refunds keep you from success, then either your products are complete crap or you are not selling very many to begin with.



      Originally Posted by theaccountant View Post

      I mean who in their right mind can believe that there is any real earth shaterring value in a $7 course!!
      By lumping all low-price products like this, you have missed out on some great information. Many of us sell ebooks with excellent content at around that price point. I've purchased ebooks in this range that have given me ideas and techniques that I've made hundreds of dollars with (or more).


      Originally Posted by kaymehelp View Post

      totally agree with you, more badly is the refund asked from paypal
      i had this situation many time; when selling a service the buyer once he gets it ask immediatly for a refund from paypal
      this is just pissing me off
      Services are not refunded by PayPal so you handled that one incorrectly. Unless they claim it's an unauthorized charge, which is a whole different ball of wax, all you need to do is state in your response that this was a service and that you fulfilled that service (with any documentation you have).

      Originally Posted by lilc800 View Post

      This is Why many people are Shifting over to sites like Payza that don't have a refund process as weak as Paypal.

      Honestly Refunds has kept me from selling many of my methods and Software I've created, I would be better off just using them for myself then Selling it and getting refunds and having to deal with them.
      This is just silly. You all realize that it's YOU who decides your refund policy, correct? Except in the case of chargebacks, which again, are a different ball of wax altogether. PayPal does NOT require you to give refunds, only that you have a stated refund policy. That policy could be NO REFUNDS. If you choose to offer any type of refund, then you must honor it, but it's your choice to make that offer to begin with.
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  • Profile picture of the author RachelLily
    I think having refund policy is ok. it would just show that your product is really effective, and if it isnt, you'll have to get them back the money. i think its just right to avoid scammers.
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  • Profile picture of the author MartinPlatt
    Is this more of a case of hyping up a product, then the buyer realises that they have to do work, like for example opening the instructions up, and decides that it is not for them?

    I wonder if this is more a case of having sales copy that spells out what is involved so that there are no 'shocks' to the buyer? Less hype more reality?

    The refund is to protect the customer from poor quality products. That's for example clickbank protecting themselves.

    If the product truly is quality, then the odd person doing that, well it is going to more negatively affect them by them not being able to get the support and help, than it will you, who most people will appreciate.

    If a lot of people were ripping you off this way, then that would be really bad.

    Some people just can't be helped, and are therefore destined to fail.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tsnyder
    Originally Posted by Shubh Ashish View Post

    I had a very serious conversation with myself and was shocked when I came across this Fact that Refund Policies are what stops a Person from being Successful most of the Time.

    Uh... no.

    That's very shallow thinking. If your refund rate is more than
    about 2-3 percent during your next conversation with yourself ask
    yourself why people refund you more than what can be attributed
    to flakes and serial refunders.

    The fact is if your refund rates are higher than normal it's because
    you're either writing ad copy that appeals to flakes or you're sales
    information is promising something your product fails to deliver.

    I promise you nobody is failing because they offer refunds. They fail
    because their stuff doesn't live up to their schtick.
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  • Profile picture of the author Curtis2011
    Originally Posted by Shubh Ashish View Post

    But Guess what? The Seller will sell only that information which worked for most of the people.

    Why?

    Because his Respect is on the Line.
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    • Profile picture of the author AffNinja
      To be perfectly honest. unless a service like Clickbank requires a product with a refund policy, you should never have one if you truly want the most money out of it.
      I'd say a lot of people that buy online products have no intention of a refund unless there's something really wrong with it. If you parade the word refund guaranteed around the site, that'll attract most people with greed who'd just take your product and then ask for a refund.
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      • Profile picture of the author theaccountant
        Originally Posted by AffNinja View Post

        To be perfectly honest. unless a service like Clickbank requires a product with a refund policy, you should never have one if you truly want the most money out of it.
        I'd say a lot of people that buy online products have no intention of a refund unless there's something really wrong with it. If you parade the word refund guaranteed around the site, that'll attract most people with greed who'd just take your product and then ask for a refund.
        Completely agree
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  • Profile picture of the author Alex Blades
    You can't force people to keep something they don't want, it's a bit greedy if you ask me. Having a refund policy will increase sales, and nobody should have to do a charge back before you give them a refund.

    Refunds are part of the business,and if you are pulling your hair out over it, then you are in the wrong business.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tim_Carter
    Make it simple.

    Implement a "No Refund" policy.

    Don't listen to those that say you shouldn't. I have used this successfully from day one. (Except where I have to like Clickbank - but removed my products from there).

    Give it a try. If you find it doesn't work (doubtful) then switch back.

    If you give them a sample or use some other technique to show your product is good it won't be an issue.

    ** edit - this gets easier as you get a reputation for providing quality stuff.
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