Think You Are Going To Be Rich Selling WSO's? Think Again

103 replies
Hey Guys,

Shawn here and today I wanted to share with you the real truth about selling your own WSO's. If you have sold your own WSO's or are thinking of doing so in the near future, this may be eye opening.

Seems like every other day there is a new course or WSO that comes out about how you can create your own WSO's and make Zillions of Dollars overnight.

That Is Simply Not True!

The truth is (and I'm sure a lot of WSO creators will agree with me) the whole WSO section has changed over the past year or so. Gone are the days where you could put up your product and 100's of sales would come in almost instantly just from the people searching the WSO section of the forum.

Nowadays to make any type of significant sales, you need to rely on JV partners and other affiliates to promote your offer to their lists, but that is starting to have it's challenges as well.

With so many new offers coming out each day, JV's (at least the good ones) are becoming more selective on what they promote as they have much more to choose. On top of that they are becoming more demanding on their compensation as well ...

Back in the day, it was ok to offer 50% across the board to affiliates, but with the low cost front end WSO's ($7-$10) the new standard seems to be 100% commissions on the front end and 50%-100% on the OTO.

Don't Believe Me?

Let's look at some numbers and you decide

Let's say you were going to sell a WSO at $10 with an OTO of $27. Let's also assume you were going to stick with the new standard of 100% on front end and 50% on OTO to affiliates. Finally, let's also assume you did pretty well and sold 500 copies on the front end and your OTO converted at 30%. These numbers are a bit high nowadays, but let's just assume you were able to secure a bunch of good partners to promote you.

Here's what this would look like:

500 WSO Sales X $10 = $5000 - You Keep $0 (100% goes to affiliates)
150(30%) OTO Sales X $27 = $4050 - You Keep $2025 (50% to affiliates)

So when it's all said and done you now have 500 customers (buyers) & $2025. Don't forget to take away all of your expenses for developing the product from that $2025.

Not The Life Altering Money That You Were Promised ... Is It???

So now what? Well you do have 500 new buyers. What most people do is just start promoting other offers as an affiliate to this list. Sure you will make a few bucks, but it won't be long before these buyers show up on everyone else's list, get burnt out and unsubscribe...

Now I'm really no here to be a dream crusher, but I just wanted to share with you some of the realities of running your own WSO's.

I actually think that WSO's are a useful marketing tool to generate leads, but if you are going in with the expectation that you are going to make a lot of money from selling them ... you need to rethink your business.

Instead, if you use them as a great inexpensive way to get people in the door and then if you have a sales funnel that pushes them through to a high ticket webinar or high ticket coaching program, you will probably do very well.

Unfortunately, most marketers are short sited and don't have such a system in place and end up being disappointed from their WSO results.

Would love for other WSO sellers to chime in on this.

- Shawn
#rich #selling #wso
  • Profile picture of the author Malcolm Thomas
    He's right. Relying Solely on WSO's as a source of your income is a high mistake that many people (newbies especially) are guilty of. The best way to use WSO's is to use them as a way to gather leads and build your list. And of course only sell or promote high quality products.
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    • Profile picture of the author eGranny
      Originally Posted by Malcolm Thomas View Post

      He's right. Relying Solely on WSO's as a source of your income is a high mistake that many people (newbies especially) are guilty of. The best way to use WSO's is to use them as a way to gather leads and build your list. And of course only sell or promote high quality products.
      Hi! Newbie here...
      So far, I'm following quite well on the subject matter of this thread EXCEPT for 1 thing... What on Earth does WSO stand for? If 'newbies' are the usual prey, I really would like to be informed.
      p.s.: I fully understand the usage of accronyms to shorten commonly and repeatedly used terms, but is there a lexicon somewhere to help ease the pain for uninformed people, like myself?
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      • Profile picture of the author J Bold
        Originally Posted by eGranny View Post

        Hi! Newbie here...
        So far, I'm following quite well on the subject matter of this thread EXCEPT for 1 thing... What on Earth does WSO stand for? If 'newbies' are the usual prey, I really would like to be informed.
        p.s.: I fully understand the usage of accronyms to shorten commonly and repeatedly used terms, but is there a lexicon somewhere to help ease the pain for uninformed people, like myself?


        Warrior Special Offer (WSO). It's part of the Warrior Special Offers Forum on here.

        You can pay $40 to Warrior Forum for an advertisement thread and on that thread and sell software, your money making case study, method, etc. to do with making money online, getting traffic, and more.
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      • Profile picture of the author bigjasonellis
        Originally Posted by eGranny View Post

        Hi! Newbie here...
        So far, I'm following quite well on the subject matter of this thread EXCEPT for 1 thing... What on Earth does WSO stand for? If 'newbies' are the usual prey, I really would like to be informed.
        p.s.: I fully understand the usage of accronyms to shorten commonly and repeatedly used terms, but is there a lexicon somewhere to help ease the pain for uninformed people, like myself?
        Hi eGranny. Someone else explained WSO, basically a place on this forum to promote products to other marketers.

        I have used this and this to define terms you see all the time. I also google specific terms with "Internet Marketing" after it to narrow it down.

        Thought it would help. Good luck.
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  • Profile picture of the author World Marketing
    Yea you will never make zillions of dollars overnight....So many people buy into these "get rich quick" deals when it is not possible overnight....
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  • Profile picture of the author datingworld
    I have only seen only few WSOs which are continuously in the WSO from years, others disappear after sometime, which probably means it didnt work well for the seller.

    I dont think it is wiser to depend on WSO earnings solely..
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  • Do you know that there are some people around here running 7-figure businesses based on WSOs and ultra-low ticket products?
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  • Profile picture of the author Greedy
    The term "Rich" is variable.

    To some newbies reading this, they maybe thinking WOW, I've got to make a WSO.

    But yes I agree.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jarrett
    Banned
    Here's what I can tell you.

    I've helped about 50 people recently all create 6 figure+ businesses in the WSO section alone.

    Several of those recently hit the 7 figure mark from WSO's + list building alone..

    so yes. WSO section is alive and well and there's tons of money to be made for everyone.

    no. you don't have to do 100% commission.

    I never have. never will. if your product converts and gives a high epc, that's good enough to get alot of big affiliates on board. So there's still plenty of money to be kept for yourself on the front end and oto.

    Even if you did give away 100% commission.. who cares?

    find someone else who has an awesome high quality WSO related to your niche that is doing 100% commission, promote his the very next day.. and CRUSH IT! BOOM!

    you just made 100% commission for yourself.

    where's the problem?

    Or like you hinted on.. find some one with a webinar.. let him set up everything. you sit back and get paid.

    I co-hosted a webinar.. I did nothing. literally. lol. I showed up and did a 3 minute introduciton. he took care of the rest.

    I made $85k from it... and this was from a tiny list of 700, and sold his product..

    So that list of 500 customers/buyers that you get from selling your WSO that you just talked about.. just got BAD ASS!

    Affiliates. Schmilliates.
    If you got a hot offer that converts... it's not hard to get affiliates to promote it at all.
    I help newbies who do their first product line up tons of affilaites.. all the time.

    but even if you don't have affiliates promoting for you.. doesn't matter. you can still crush it. There is so much more traffic out there..

    facebook ppc, solo ads, banner traffic, ppv, signature traffic, youtube, etc..

    so yes. I agree with you. if people think they're going to get rich by quickly slapping together a half-ass report and just listing it in the WSO section..

    and then believing that money will magically fall out of the sky.. they're crazy.

    But don't be such a negative nancy, Shawn, when it comes to WSO's..

    There is TONS of money to be made. The sky is not falling.

    Just be smart. think outside the box. do the opposite of what everyone else is doing.. and you'll do fine
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    • Profile picture of the author Chris Silvey
      I agree as far as not getting rich part, but usually handing out 100% commission is usually in exchange of a new contact that the Vendor can add to their mailing list.

      As an Affiliate, I get a bit upset at some of these Vendors that are Here today, gone tomorrow. They may have a great product, but do a limited sale, then it is off to the next launch, or the Vendor does not keep up maintenance on the Host site and links get broken.
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    • Profile picture of the author Not So New
      My intention with this thread was not to say WSO's are useless.

      In fact there are a great way to get started and get some exposure if you are just getting started with product creation (much easier than Clickbank in my opinion)

      Just that the real money comes from the back end funnel (webinars etc ..) which you touched on

      Originally Posted by Jarrett View Post

      Here's what I can tell you.

      I've helped about 50 people recently all create 6 figure+ businesses in the WSO section alone.

      Several of those recently hit the 7 figure mark from WSO's + list building alone..

      so yes. WSO section is alive and well and there's tons of money to be made for everyone.

      no. you don't have to do 100% commission.

      I never have. never will. if your product converts and gives a high epc, that's good enough to get alot of big affiliates on board. So there's still plenty of money to be kept for yourself on the front end and oto.

      Even if you did give away 100% commission.. who cares?

      find someone else who has an awesome high quality WSO related to your niche that is doing 100% commission, promote his the very next day.. and CRUSH IT! BOOM!

      you just made 100% commission for yourself.

      where's the problem?

      Or like you hinted on.. find some one with a webinar.. let him set up everything. you sit back and get paid.

      I co-hosted a webinar.. I did nothing. literally. lol. I showed up and did a 3 minute introduciton. he took care of the rest.

      I made $85k from it... and this was from a tiny list of 700, and sold his product..

      So that list of 500 customers/buyers that you get from selling your WSO that you just talked about.. just got BAD ASS!

      Affiliates. Schmilliates.
      If you got a hot offer that converts... it's not hard to get affiliates to promote it at all.
      I help newbies who do their first product line up tons of affilaites.. all the time.

      but even if you don't have affiliates promoting for you.. doesn't matter. you can still crush it. There is so much more traffic out there..

      facebook ppc, solo ads, banner traffic, ppv, signature traffic, youtube, etc..

      so yes. I agree with you. if people think they're going to get rich by quickly slapping together a half-ass report and just listing it in the WSO section..

      and then believing that money will magically fall out of the sky.. they're crazy.

      But don't be such a negative nancy, Shawn, when it comes to WSO's..

      There is TONS of money to be made. The sky is not falling.

      Just be smart. think outside the box. do the opposite of what everyone else is doing.. and you'll do fine
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    • Profile picture of the author angela99
      Originally Posted by Jarrett View Post

      Here's what I can tell you.

      no. you don't have to do 100% commission.

      I never have. never will. if your product converts and gives a high epc, that's good enough to get alot of big affiliates on board. So there's still plenty of money to be kept for yourself on the front end and oto.

      Even if you did give away 100% commission.. who cares?

      find someone else who has an awesome high quality WSO related to your niche that is doing 100% commission, promote his the very next day.. and CRUSH IT! BOOM!

      you just made 100% commission for yourself.

      where's the problem?
      Brilliant, Jarrett.

      The takeaway from this is: you don't have to do what everyone else is doing.

      Just DO SOMETHING. It may "work", but even if it "fails", you will learn a lot.

      Spending $40 to learn something that makes money for you down the road, or even something that changes your life, is the cheapest learning experience you'll ever get.

      When was the last time you tried something new? (New to you.) Did you try something new today?

      If you didn't why, didn't you? Do something new to you before you go to bed tonight.

      As Jarrett said: "you don't have to do 100% commission". You don't have to do ANYTHING that others do. In fact, if many others are doing something, it might be a clue that you should do something completely different.

      Do stuff. Do ONE new thing -- that's new to you -- before you go to bed tonight.

      If you keep doing that, things will happen.

      And some of those things, will be good things. :-)

      Cheers

      Angela
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    • Profile picture of the author DennisNBrown
      Originally Posted by Jarrett View Post

      Here's what I can tell you.

      I've helped about 50 people recently all create 6 figure+ businesses in the WSO section alone.

      Several of those recently hit the 7 figure mark from WSO's + list building alone..

      so yes. WSO section is alive and well and there's tons of money to be made for everyone.

      no. you don't have to do 100% commission.

      I never have. never will. if your product converts and gives a high epc, that's good enough to get alot of big affiliates on board. So there's still plenty of money to be kept for yourself on the front end and oto.

      Even if you did give away 100% commission.. who cares?

      find someone else who has an awesome high quality WSO related to your niche that is doing 100% commission, promote his the very next day.. and CRUSH IT! BOOM!

      you just made 100% commission for yourself.

      where's the problem?
      Hear Hear

      Or like you hinted on.. find some one with a webinar.. let him set up everything. you sit back and get paid.

      I co-hosted a webinar.. I did nothing. literally. lol. I showed up and did a 3 minute introduciton. he took care of the rest.

      I made $85k from it... and this was from a tiny list of 700, and sold his product..

      So that list of 500 customers/buyers that you get from selling your WSO that you just talked about.. just got BAD ASS!

      Affiliates. Schmilliates.
      If you got a hot offer that converts... it's not hard to get affiliates to promote it at all.
      I help newbies who do their first product line up tons of affilaites.. all the time.

      but even if you don't have affiliates promoting for you.. doesn't matter. you can still crush it. There is so much more traffic out there..

      facebook ppc, solo ads, banner traffic, ppv, signature traffic, youtube, etc..

      so yes. I agree with you. if people think they're going to get rich by quickly slapping together a half-ass report and just listing it in the WSO section..

      and then believing that money will magically fall out of the sky.. they're crazy.

      But don't be such a negative nancy, Shawn, when it comes to WSO's..

      There is TONS of money to be made. The sky is not falling.

      Just be smart. think outside the box. do the opposite of what everyone else is doing.. and you'll do fine
      HERE HERE Jarrett
      I'm glad someone has stood up and shown the positive side of WSO launches. Of course if you are going to put out a crappy product just thrown together from 3rd rate PLR. then you can expect (even if you get away with it the first time) To find it hard to get JV partners to support you in your future ventures.
      Life is like that people are not stupid in any arena of their daily lives & internet marketing is no exception to the rule.
      I have always found if you do your best and endeavour to treat your fellow man with the due respect in all things. Rewards will come your way.
      Keep on truckin Dennis N Brown
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    • Profile picture of the author KateD
      Originally Posted by Jarrett View Post

      But don't be such a negative nancy, Shawn, when it comes to WSO's..

      There is TONS of money to be made. The sky is not falling.

      Just be smart. think outside the box. do the opposite of what everyone else is doing.. and you'll do fine
      Well said!

      Sure, the WSO section isn't IDEAL, but it still holds an incredible amount of potential for those that put in the creativity and hard work.

      KateD
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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
    I saw some stats compiled by one of the WSO JV Groups on Facebook and apparently over 96% of WSO's fail. Not sure what they classify as 'failure' but it's true that most hardly sell any volume. Just look at the numbers on W+ and you'll see most people can't sell much more than 10-20 copies and hardly anyone is doing 1,000+ sales these days unless they already have a huge list, lots of JV connections and a good reputation.

    The best thing to do is to use them as a lead generation tool then funnel your subscribers into higher paying offers like coaching, membership sites, webinars or high ticket products. Selling $7 WSO's isn't getting anyone rich these days.
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    • Profile picture of the author 4DayWeekend
      Most people selling make money online products usually do the method(s) they're teaching to make money too (or should at least).

      In those cases they aren't relying on the WSO success, it is just supplementary income.

      And as Jarrett has explained, for every problem comes an opportunity. As affiliates get paid higher commissions, you sometimes just use a product to build a buyers list that trusts you and your recommendations
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    • Profile picture of the author Not So New
      My point exactly

      What's important is you have the right expectation for them, then you will find them to be a powerful tool

      Shawn

      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      I saw some stats compiled by one of the WSO JV Groups on Facebook and apparently over 96% of WSO's fail. Not sure what they classify as 'failure' but it's true that most hardly sell any volume. Just look at the numbers on W+ and you'll see most people can't sell much more than 10-20 copies and hardly anyone is doing 1,000+ sales these days unless they already have a huge list, lots of JV connections and a good reputation.

      The best thing to do is to use them as a lead generation tool then funnel your subscribers into higher paying offers like coaching, membership sites, webinars or high ticket products. Selling $7 WSO's isn't getting anyone rich these days.
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  • Profile picture of the author jsmiley
    Shawn - I love this post. I have set up a handful of WSO's over the years. All did ok, though none were even close to stupid money successful. The last one I did was a bomb here on the forum. I relied too heavily on the Warrior Forum to do all the work for me.

    My number one mistake - I didn't find any/enough JV partners. I was afraid to reach out and ask for partnerships. And the ones I did, I didn't push to promote it.

    My second mistake - I had a single product package - no Upsells or downsells. I know it's important to have an upsell and a downsell, but I was in too big of a rush to try and make some money.

    My third mistake - This is directly related to the first two. Because I didn't recruit a group of JV partners and because I only had the one product in the sales funnel, I believe I priced the item a little higher than I should have to start. And, with only one product in the sales funnel, I only offered 50% commissions to affiliates.

    I am realizing, if I had recruited JV partners and offered 100% commission, but priced the product at 1/3 the original sales price, added an upsell priced at original target price with a 50% commission and a downsell at mid-price point, I more than likely would have doubled or tripled my net.

    You post has helped open my eyes. Lesson learned.

    Thanks for posting.

    -- John
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  • Profile picture of the author doctor973
    Thank you Shawn for this post. I created a product and was going to do a WSO, but discovered what you already wrote in your post, so I decided not to do it, although I am thinking of giving my product as a free WSO for collecting leads. The problem is that in this case also I don´t know if its really worth it. I mean that even if you get 300 or 500 leads, the quality of those freebies seeking leads is much lower than that of 20 buyers. So, in my case, I don´t really know if it´s worth doing a WSO (In a cost effective balance a solo ad could be more profitable). I would much appreciate if anybody could assist me in this dilema.
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    • Profile picture of the author rmolina88
      Originally Posted by doctor973 View Post

      Thank you Shawn for this post. I created a product and was going to do a WSO, but discovered what you already wrote in your post, so I decided not to do it, although I am thinking of giving my product as a free WSO for collecting leads. The problem is that in this case also I don´t know if its really worth it. I mean that even if you get 300 or 500 leads, the quality of those freebies seeking leads is much lower than that of 20 buyers. So, in my case, I don´t really know if it´s worth doing a WSO (In a cost effective balance a solo ad could be more profitable). I would much appreciate if anybody could assist me in this dilema.
      No, it's not worth it. I put up a free WSO in the past and it didn't generate as many buyers as I wanted.

      You get buyer leads when people buy.
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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    I love threads like this because it scares others away from selling WSO's.

    They are far from dead. But do you have to work hard to have a successful WSO? Yes.

    Do 99% of the people who release WSO's expect to just stick their product up and make hundreds of sales? Yes.

    Is that the reality? No.

    Have a look at the Warrior Plus stats alone. They have now sold over $55 million worth of WSO's through their system only the last couple of years. Add in JVZoo, Product Pay, and others and that figure would be even bigger. Someone is getting all that money. If you say it's all too hard and play the victim then you won't be one of the people getting a share of that money.
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  • Profile picture of the author EliteAffiliate
    Originally Posted by Not So New View Post


    The truth is (and I'm sure a lot of WSO creators will agree with me) the whole WSO section has changed over the past year or so. Gone are the days where you could put up your product and 100's of sales would come in almost instantly just from the people searching the WSO section of the forum.
    So sad that I missed out on those years!


    500 WSO Sales X $10 = $5000 - You Keep $0 (100% goes to affiliates)
    150(30%) OTO Sales X $27 = $4050 - You Keep $2025 (50% to affiliates)

    So when it's all said and done you now have 500 customers (buyers) & $2025. Don't forget to take away all of your expenses for developing the product from that $2025.
    On my last WSO we messed up the $27+ 50% OTO and at the very last minute had to pull it cause of it's issues just before launching! So mad! So only had a 100% FE and low price $12 75% BE. Though if I had not had to pull the high price OTO it would of been worth it since it sold about 1,400 copies (that mostly all went to affiliates).

    It's sad that it's not what it used to be. Though on the other hand, it's still way better to build a list that way as opposed to paying for solo ads! Solo ad buyers give away a product for 100% free to get 'freebie seekers' on their list, AND they pay for them at about $40 per 50 leads or so (same for FREE WSO's listed per bump).

    They might have an OTO in place after the opt in, though since they were mailing to freebie seekers the conversions aren't great and they usually only make back their $40 investment, then have to find the next one to buy.

    The stats you mentioned above sound much better! Instead of getting about 50 new 'freebie seeker' leads every couple days for free, you get 500+ buyer leads in only a few days and get paid at least $2k to get those higher quality leads!

    I'd take option 2!

    Only thing is it is a lot more work and more time consuming and you don't have endless products you can create that would make a good selling WSO. Though the return is still better than solo ads for list building.


    Not The Life Altering Money That You Were Promised ... Is It???
    Most people selling WSO's about how they made $x,xxxxx dollars from their WSO's are misleading! As they pretty much all only mention the Gross amount the WSO's received, not their personal net amount they walked away with.


    So now what? Well you do have 500 new buyers. What most people do is just start promoting other offers as an affiliate to this list. Sure you will make a few bucks, but it won't be long before these buyers show up on everyone else's list, get burnt out and unsubscribe...
    That's true for all list building Unfortunetely. Still makes people decent money if they can build large enough lists. It's a numbers game etc.


    I actually think that WSO's are a useful marketing tool to generate leads, but if you are going in with the expectation that you are going to make a lot of money from selling them ... you need to rethink your business.
    I agree. You could get lucky with one, though for the majority of them, don't expect too much, especially without doing the entire launch process, and the net is going to be small without a great high ticket funnel in place. It takes a lot more pre launch work and often experience and reputation built up first to get one of those 4,000+ selling huge five to six figure launches!

    My first WSO was listed with no OTO or JVs so I got to see how much traffic would come in from the forum alone. Not much! It may say (6k viewing) though they're mostly all viewing a specific page they got to from a link, not browsing.

    Only relying on forum traffic you're lucky to make back your $40. I got some affiliates and sold over 100 copies though that was a huge failure and disappointment, after putting weeks into writing and perfecting it, giving away secrets that were making me money, paying $150 to a designer for the sales page, etc. The conversion rate was almost 10% without a single refund, so that wasn't a failure. It was the traffic that was the failure.

    It also changes what you're willing to put into and give away for your WSO's. With such low returns it's no longer worth it to give away some of your best kept secrets and tips that are earning you money elsewhere, and invite competition on those in exchange for almost nothing. So the quailty of WSO's goes down!

    Now days since there's so little buying traffic directly from WF, I see more and more sellers launching with JVZoo and using their own self hosted sales pages instead. More control and better for getting traffic from a wider range of sources. Though they still use the JV connections and pricing model from WF. 100% low ticket FE and 50% middle ticket BE.

    I would only rethink what it actually takes to make good money from a high selling WSO. They're still worth it IF you put into them what is required now days to make it a hit.
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  • Profile picture of the author timpears
    If I made that $2,000 I would be a happy camper. But when he said those figures are a bit high, he was right. The advertising costs and the cots of creating was more then the revenue for me. Not sure I will go there again.

    Hey OP, you are going to piss Alan off with this thread. But it probably needed to be said.
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    Tim Pears

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    • Profile picture of the author WillR
      Originally Posted by timpears View Post

      Hey OP, you are going to piss Alan off with this thread. But it probably needed to be said.
      I don't think it will piss Alan off because Alan (as well as myself and many others) know that the WSO forum is still very alive and kicking. This thread is just one persons opinion. Someone who may not have even tried to release a WSO themselves and are just talking numbers. Has the OP even released a WSO or is this just here say? I've released 10+ WSO's so my experience is based on real world.

      Don't listen to what people say, listen to figures and stats because they are the only thing that cannot be faked and cannot lie. $55+ million worth of sales the last two years should speak for itself. The sad thing is most people think it's just a matter of coming along and throwing shit at the wall and hoping it sticks. They will never have a successful WSO but nor would they have a successful product selling it anywhere else either.

      It's not the place you are selling your product that determines how successful it is. It's how you sell it that really matters.

      What I find equally funny is that the OP thinks WSO's are so dead yet at the same time runs a membership site that gives people bonuses for WSO's they are already buying. Contradiction much? You went and created a whole membership site around a business model you think does not work? That makes sense...
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      • Profile picture of the author timpears
        Originally Posted by WillR View Post

        I don't think it will piss Alan off because Alan (as well as myself and many others) know that the WSO forum is still very alive and kicking. This thread is just one persons opinion. Someone who may not have even tried to release a WSO themselves and are just talking numbers. Has the OP even released a WSO or is this just here say? I've released 10+ WSO's so my experience is based on real world.

        Don't listen to what people say, listen to figures and stats because they are the only thing that cannot be faked and cannot lie. $55+ million worth of sales the last two years should speak for itself. The sad thing is most people think it's just a matter of coming along and throwing shit at the wall and hoping it sticks. They will never have a successful WSO but nor would they have a successful product selling it anywhere else either.

        It's not the place you are selling your product that determines how successful it is. It's how you sell it that really matters.

        What I find equally funny is that the OP thinks WSO's are so dead yet at the same time runs a membership site that gives people bonuses for WSO's they are already buying. Contradiction much? You went and created a whole membership site around a business model you think does not work? That makes sense...
        Yes, but you are a super star when it comes to WSO promotions. Many, like me, fell flat on their face. Never made any money on any of them as something always seems to get in the way. Until I can figure out what I am doing wrong, I shall continue to be a flat broke SOB. :p I got a coach now, I am hoping that will work, but still having problems. Strange problems that I can't figure out.

        There must be a reason the OP did what he did, I know it doesn't seem to make sense. Who knows?
        Signature

        Tim Pears

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        • Profile picture of the author WillR
          Originally Posted by timpears View Post

          Yes, but you are a super star when it comes to WSO promotions.
          Where do you think every single person who successfully sells WSO's started? In your exact same position. So what is the difference between me and you? I kept going and MADE it work.

          Originally Posted by timpears View Post

          Many, like me, fell flat on their face. Never made any money on any of them as something always seems to get in the way.
          You can only do one of two things. You can use that attitude as an excuse (which is what 99% of people in this industry do and that's why only a very small percentage of people are making all the money) or you can use your failure as a launch pad to your success.

          Every single person who is successful went through the process of not being successful. It depends how much you want it. If you just give up after a few failed attempts then the reality is you don't want it enough and so you will not get it -- regardless of whether you have a coach or not. A coach can not give you persistence and determination and they are the two skills you need to make this work. Without those two things all the knowledge in the world will be lost with you.

          I don't mean to sound harsh, it's just the reality of the situation.
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          • Profile picture of the author George Wright
            Originally Posted by WillR View Post

            ...Every single person who is successful went through the process of not being successful.
            Will,

            I agree with all you are saying. One thing however, back in the "day" one really could put up a WSO and EXPECT to make a nice piece of change.

            I've never depended on WSOs for my living, however, they have been a very nice supplement to my income every time I created one.

            I realize, "success" is defined differently by people. I always considered it a success when I could spend a day creating a product, invest nothing, later $20 and now $40 and earn between $1,000 and $5,000 each time.

            Honestly, it's been a few years since I've done a WSO. I'm going to create one and see what all this "change" talk is about.

            Thanks for your insights Will. (I know you noticed the admin thanks above, cool )

            George Wright
            Signature
            "The first chapter sells the book; the last chapter sells the next book." Mickey Spillane
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            • Profile picture of the author Plugin Profits
              Originally Posted by George Wright View Post


              I realize, "success" is defined differently by people. I always considered it a success when I could spend a day creating a product, invest nothing, later $20 and now $40 and earn between $1,000 and $5,000 each time.
              Stop making us newbies jealous and regretting our wasted years!
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            • Profile picture of the author WillR
              Originally Posted by George Wright View Post

              I agree with all you are saying. One thing however, back in the "day" one really could put up a WSO and EXPECT to make a nice piece of change.
              George,

              I do definitely agree with you on that point. Back when I released my first WSO (that was just under 2 years ago now) it was easier and that's because there was less 'noise' in the marketplace. Back then there was maybe one product being released every few days. If you go and look at the jv boards now you will see most days have multiple launches listed. It's gone crazy! It has quickly become a very crowded marketplace. But that can be an advantage or disadvantage depending on how you choose to use it.

              Although it is harder nowadays to rise above the white noise, if you are prepared to put in the work and persist with it, the numbers possible these days are much bigger than the numbers these forum based launches were making back then. So yes, things are harder these days but there are still a lot of people who are making big bank with these launches.

              I think the most important thing I would tell those who are just starting out and trying to get into the WSO space is to realize it's a process. You can't just expect to put up your first offer and have it go gangbusters. Some people will strike it lucky and do very well with their first offer but most will not... and that's cool. Be ok with that.

              But then you do a second offer... and a third... and a fourth. Each time you launch a new product your assets compound. You get some more customers. You build your list a little bit more. You attract a couple more affiliates. So each new product you release can progressively get out to more and more people and that's how you begin to raise your profile and become a well known and well trusted seller. It just takes time but the rewards are definitely there for those who want them.
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              • Profile picture of the author Plugin Profits
                Originally Posted by WillR View Post

                Although it is harder nowadays to rise above the white noise, if you are prepared to put in the work and persist with it, the numbers possible these days are much bigger than the numbers these forum based launches were making back then. So yes, things are harder these days but there are still a lot of people who are making big bank with these launches.
                What is it about the current saturation and different commission set ups makes you say the numbers could be greater now days?
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            • Profile picture of the author RapidImpact
              Well ya its how things are in this day and age.

              1. person finds way to make money and exploits it non stop
              2. More people discover the same tactic and also exploit causing proft to drop
              3. Person creates info product explaining how to make money using this nearly exauster tactic
              4. Rubes jump on board like crazy trying to hump the leg of the american dream of making millions without working for it.
              5. Market gets completly saturated making it only possible for the well established to profit.
              6. See step one
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              • Profile picture of the author cooler1
                Originally Posted by jambon View Post

                Well ya its how things are in this day and age.

                1. person finds way to make money and exploits it non stop
                2. More people discover the same tactic and also exploit causing proft to drop
                3. Person creates info product explaining how to make money using this nearly exauster tactic
                4. Rubes jump on board like crazy trying to hump the leg of the american dream of making millions without working for it.
                5. Market gets completly saturated making it only possible for the well established to profit.
                6. See step one
                Also, on many WSO threads this typical pattern occurs.

                1. The sales page delivers a story about how the person was flat out broke living rough, struggling in the rat race, slave to their boss, etc.. and then through their incredible "lightbulb moment" of creativity managed to devise a system that makes them a great living online earning $xxxx per month and "how you can to" if you buy this WSO, but best hurry soon because there's "limited copies" available at this price before it goes up.

                2. Numerous members, often friends of the WSO seller or people who recieved a review copy then come in and say what a great actionable method it is with loads of "killer content" and highly recommend it even though they've earned nothing with the method themselves.

                3. Most people who buy the WSO either don't implement the method after reading it or they do implement it and come across a stumbling block which prevent them getting results because the method is either horseshit, no longer is effective, has become saturated or isn't backed up with good support.

                4. The thread eventually dies and withers out as people realise the hype on the sales page doesn't match up to reality.

                Rinse and repeat. See this way too many times.
                Signature

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                • Profile picture of the author RapidImpact
                  Originally Posted by cooler1 View Post

                  Also, on many WSO threads this typical pattern occurs.

                  1. The sales page delivers a story about how the person was flat out broke living rough, struggling in the rat race, slave to their boss, etc.. and then through their incredible "lightbulb moment" of creativity managed to devise a system that makes them a great living online earning per month and "how you can to" if you buy this WSO, but best hurry soon because there's "limited copies" available at this price before it goes up.

                  2. Numerous members, often friends of the WSO seller or people who recieved a review copy then come in and say what a great actionable method it is with loads of "killer content" and highly recommend it even though they've earned nothing with the method themselves.

                  3. Most people who buy the WSO either don't implement the method after reading it or they do implement it and come across a stumbling block which prevent them getting results because the method is either horseshit, no longer is effective, has become saturated or isn't backed up with good support.

                  4. The thread eventually dies and withers out as people realise the hype on the sales page doesn't match up to reality.

                  Rinse and repeat. See this way too many times.
                  yup the only thing you forgot to mention is how these people are usually selling the secret of how they earned $XXXXX for the rock bottom price of $10 and no one thinks twice to question why if someone was making that kind of money in the first place why would they waste their time telling everyone about it for practically nothing lol
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                  • Profile picture of the author WillR
                    Originally Posted by jambon View Post

                    yup the only thing you forgot to mention is how these people are usually selling the secret of how they earned for the rock bottom price of $10 and no one thinks twice to question why if someone was making that kind of money in the first place why would they waste their time telling everyone about it for practically nothing lol
                    If someone said you could spend just a few days putting together a simple course and potentially make anywhere from $1,000 to $100,000 would you do it? There's the answer to your question above.

                    Do you honestly think just because people are earning money with one method that they will never want to try and make money doing any other method? True entrepreneurs are those that want to try everything and are never truly happy with what they have -- they always want more.

                    Having said that I agree that there are a lot of people out there selling THEORY. Things they have not put into practice themselves but are trying to teach others. But it's not the case with everyone.
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                    • Profile picture of the author ronrule
                      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

                      If someone said you could spend just a few days putting together a simple course and potentially make anywhere from $1,000 to $100,000 would you do it? There's the answer to your question above.

                      Do you honestly think just because people are earning money with one method that they will never want to try and make money doing any other method? True entrepreneurs are those that want to try everything and are never truly happy with what they have -- they always want more.
                      That is my exact mentality when it comes to this site. There are only so many hours in a day... the few strategies I've offered are ones that I use on my own clients and have had success with, but since I don't have the time to take on any new clients, creating a WSO allows me to continue to monetize a good strategy.
                      Signature
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                    • Profile picture of the author Paul Barber
                      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

                      Having said that I agree that there are a lot of people out there selling THEORY. Things they have not put into practice themselves but are trying to teach others. But it's not the case with everyone.
                      Well said and that can be the trouble with WSO's people with no experience of making money/running a genuine business are trying to 'teach' it by re writing other peoples WSO's and then selling as their own (a method 'taught' in some WSO's)

                      The WSO platform is not helped by the very low prices being charged for bothy good products (being sold for list building, effectively loss leaders) and rubbish. In the normal world we are used to judging quality by the price. Not so with WSO's.

                      Shame it would be great if people could charge more for the genuinely new and good products and make decent money that way without OTO etc.

                      Cheers

                      Paul
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                  • Profile picture of the author MarketBuddy
                    Right on!
                    Question everything

                    Originally Posted by jambon View Post

                    yup the only thing you forgot to mention is how these people are usually selling the secret of how they earned for the rock bottom price of $10 and no one thinks twice to question why if someone was making that kind of money in the first place why would they waste their time telling everyone about it for practically nothing lol
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          • Profile picture of the author timpears
            Originally Posted by WillR View Post

            Where do you think every single person who successfully sells WSO's started? In your exact same position. So what is the difference between me and you? I kept going and MADE it work.



            You can only do one of two things. You can use that attitude as an excuse (which is what 99% of people in this industry do and that's why only a very small percentage of people are making all the money) or you can use your failure as a launch pad to your success.

            Every single person who is successful went through the process of not being successful. It depends how much you want it. If you just give up after a few failed attempts then the reality is you don't want it enough and so you will not get it -- regardless of whether you have a coach or not. A coach can not give you persistence and determination and they are the two skills you need to make this work. Without those two things all the knowledge in the world will be lost with you.

            I don't mean to sound harsh, it's just the reality of the situation.
            Yes, I know that reality very well. And I have not given up, just focused my attention in other places where I think i can succeed. When I do succeed, I may return to the WSO forum to show others like myself how I did it.

            I am pretty much of a stubborn SOB, and when I got together with my first mentor to put his teachings on a PDF, as i thought others would get some benifit from it, I was proven wrong. Therefore I think that was probably not a good idea.

            I will find my own way, in my own time, that suits me. What I am doing now frustrates me some, but I do enjoy it. I am learning how to deal with very odd problems. And I will make it. Because I will not stop till I find my way. I have narrowed my focus to things I enjoy doing more. The way I was doing the WSO was not working for me as it wasn't my success I was selling, it wasn't believable I think. Maybe, maybe not. Either way, it cost more than it earned. Not a good business model.
            Signature

            Tim Pears

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            • Profile picture of the author Kay King
              Back in the day, it was ok to offer 50% across the board to affiliates, but with the low cost front end WSO's ($7-$10) the new standard seems to be 100% commissions on the front end and 50%-100% on the OTO.
              Go back a day more - there was NO affiliate programs for WSOs. You put up your offer and people who came to this forum bought it or didn't.

              There was no bumping and WSO's ran for 3 weeks (I think that was the term) and then were gone unless you re-posted them.

              Truth is, you are unlikely to get rich from any method where you are utilizing someone else's platform to run your business. That said, you can make money with WSOs and many here do that every day.

              kay
              Signature
              Every child needs a pet because every family needs an optimist

              Saving one dog will not save the world....but will forever change the world for one dog.
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          • Profile picture of the author Gene Pimentel
            Originally Posted by WillR View Post

            Where do you think every single person who successfully sells WSO's started? In your exact same position. So what is the difference between me and you? I kept going and MADE it work.
            Gold nugget.
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      • Profile picture of the author Not So New
        Hey Will,

        Don't think WSO's are dead ... Just think they should be looked at as a lead generation vehicle and not for front end profits.

        Just my opinion ... and yes I have launched several WSO's on here

        Shawn

        Originally Posted by WillR View Post

        I don't think it will piss Alan off because Alan (as well as myself and many others) know that the WSO forum is still very alive and kicking. This thread is just one persons opinion. Someone who may not have even tried to release a WSO themselves and are just talking numbers. Has the OP even released a WSO or is this just here say? I've released 10+ WSO's so my experience is based on real world.

        Don't listen to what people say, listen to figures and stats because they are the only thing that cannot be faked and cannot lie. $55+ million worth of sales the last two years should speak for itself. The sad thing is most people think it's just a matter of coming along and throwing shit at the wall and hoping it sticks. They will never have a successful WSO but nor would they have a successful product selling it anywhere else either.

        It's not the place you are selling your product that determines how successful it is. It's how you sell it that really matters.

        What I find equally funny is that the OP thinks WSO's are so dead yet at the same time runs a membership site that gives people bonuses for WSO's they are already buying. Contradiction much? You went and created a whole membership site around a business model you think does not work? That makes sense...
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  • Profile picture of the author Corey Geer
    This doesn't just go for the WSO section but for life in general.

    If something was mind-numbingly easy, wielded positive success every time it was done and required little effort, everyone would be doing it.

    The problem is: A lot of people today want everything for nothing and don't want to put any kind of spin or action into anything. Just take a look at some of the scraping sites where people give away people's WSOs and how many people lurk there requesting things.

    You might be thinking: We should shut those places down!

    But why? Those people aren't ever going to put in sufficient effort to ever create their own business, they're going to sift through forums looking for freebies that'll make money for them without effort.

    The people on top of the WSO+ lists aren't wizards, they're just putting in more effort than your typical WSO salesman who puts up a WSO and calls it a night. It's not the reality behind WSO sales, it's the reality behind selling a product period.

    For people who think releasing a product is as easy as launching a website, here are some of the real facts:

    1) No one's going to just buy your product to make you money. That's a common problem with a lot of people is that they just expect people to throw money at them. No one is logging on to make you money, they want to solve a problem or they want information.
    2) You're going to have to work on your social skills. People will ask you questions, they'll probably even ask questions that have been answered before and all it takes is one lost temper or poorly answered question to cost you a few sales from the visitors or lurkers there.
    3) Refunds will always be a part of selling. Some people will genuinely disagree with your product and some will just be serial refund-ers who go through product pages, get it then request a refund immediately after.
    4) Traffic is another issue that people seem to forget about. Just because you have some amazing product, doesn't mean everyone's going to come running to it, you have to get it out in front of them. Yes, a JV with a list helps or perhaps even some PPC but there are multiple ways to promote a product or WSO after it launches to keep getting traffic.

    The problem isn't that WSO selling or infoproduct marketing sucks, it's that people are misguided on what it is and expect people to just hand them money because they've designed a product.

    As far as affiliates go, as someone stated earlier, I'm pretty sure an affiliate would be happy promoting something high converting for 25% of the sale rather than a random crap product for 100% of the sale.

    The reality of making money online period is, it's not easy (contrary to what people who don't understand the internet says) and if it was as easy as some info products would have you believe, everyone would be doing it, making the value of money hit rock bottom.

    Regards,
    Corey
    Signature

    Skype: Coreygeer319

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  • Profile picture of the author rmolina88
    As someone who launched his first WSO 2 months ago and will be launching a 2nd one next week, I've made more money in the past 2 months in comparison to my 2 highest months as a regular affiliate marketer with a list. Not too bad for a first WSO and I've never made one prior to that.

    I did learn quite a lot of important lessons from my first WSO and I know my 2nd will probably sell much better.
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  • Profile picture of the author TimothyTorrents
    It also depends on how you launch your WSO...

    Writing a WSO and posting it in the WSO section without marketing it at all obviously won't bring in a lot of sells.
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  • Profile picture of the author markmcknight
    Originally Posted by Not So New View Post


    Let's say you were going to sell a WSO at $10 with an OTO of $27. Let's also assume you were going to stick with the new standard of 100% on front end and 50% on OTO to affiliates. Finally, let's also assume you did pretty well and sold 500 copies on the front end and your OTO converted at 30%. These numbers are a bit high nowadays, but let's just assume you were able to secure a bunch of good partners to promote you.

    Here's what this would look like:

    500 WSO Sales X $10 = $5000 - You Keep $0 (100% goes to affiliates)
    150(30%) OTO Sales X $27 = $4050 - You Keep $2025 (50% to affiliates)

    So when it's all said and done you now have 500 customers (buyers) & $2025. Don't forget to take away all of your expenses for developing the product from that $2025.
    You would keep 50% of the FE as well would you not? Not all your FE goes to affiliates. You will have your own sales I'm sure.

    Am I right to think this?
    Signature

    Regards,
    Mark McKnight
    http://www.markmcknightblog.com

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    • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
      Originally Posted by timpears View Post

      The advertising costs and the cots of creating was more then the revenue for me. Not sure I will go there again.
      Just because it didn't work once doesn't mean you can't learn from what went wrong and then make it work next time. Analyse where the problem was. Was it a poor product? Lack of traffic? No affiliates? Poor market research when releasing the WSO? All of the above?

      One of the best things you can do is recruit a lot of JVs to promote your product because this is where most of the sales come from. Despite the staggering amount of visitors in the WSO section at any one time 'organic' sales are almost always low.


      Originally Posted by rmolina88 View Post

      No, it's not worth it. I put up a free WSO in the past and it didn't generate as many buyers as I wanted.

      You get buyer leads when people buy.

      My experience with free WSO's is that they generate a decent amount of subscribers but many of them are literally just downloading any freebie they can see in the hope they can use it later and then it gathers virtual dust on their hard drive. They never look at it and never open your emails.

      I found releasing a $1 WSO could get a similar amount of subscribers as a freebie and everyone is a proven buyer. Would rather have that any day.

      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

      What I find equally funny is that the OP thinks WSO's are so dead yet at the same time runs a membership site that gives people bonuses for WSO's they are already buying. Contradiction much? You went and created a whole membership site around a business model you think does not work? That makes sense...
      LOL never noticed that.

      Originally Posted by rmolina88 View Post

      As someone who launched his first WSO 2 months ago and will be launching a 2nd one next week, I've made more money in the past 2 months in comparison to my 2 highest months as a regular affiliate marketer with a list. Not too bad for a first WSO and I've never made one prior to that.

      I did learn quite a lot of important lessons from my first WSO and I know my 2nd will probably sell much better.
      Are you saying you made more money in last 2 months solely from your WSO sales or are we talking about through WSO sales, OTOs, back end offers etc?

      Originally Posted by timpears View Post

      Yes, but you are a super star when it comes to WSO promotions. Many, like me, fell flat on their face. Never made any money on any of them as something always seems to get in the way. Until I can figure out what I am doing wrong, I shall continue to be a flat broke SOB. :p I got a coach now, I am hoping that will work, but still having problems. Strange problems that I can't figure out.

      There must be a reason the OP did what he did, I know it doesn't seem to make sense. Who knows?
      If you're 'flat broke' then you're obviously not making any money online so one has to wonder why you'd be at the warrior forum selling guides on how to make money online?

      Assuming that is what you are doing I have no idea what your WSO's are about.

      Originally Posted by George Wright View Post

      Will,

      I agree with all you are saying. One thing however, back in the "day" one really could put up a WSO and EXPECT to make a nice piece of change.

      I've never depended on WSOs for my living, however, they have been a very nice supplement to my income every time I created one.

      I realize, "success" is defined differently by people. I always considered it a success when I could spend a day creating a product, invest nothing, later $20 and now $40 and earn between $1,000 and $5,000 each time.

      Honestly, it's been a few years since I've done a WSO. I'm going to create one and see what all this "change" talk is about.

      Thanks for your insights Will. (I know you noticed the admin thanks above, cool )

      George Wright
      Would be interesting to see the result of what you can achieve now and what you did back in the day. Let us know.

      Originally Posted by timpears View Post

      Yes, I know that reality very well. And I have not given up, just focused my attention in other places where I think i can succeed. When I do succeed, I may return to the WSO forum to show others like myself how I did it.

      I am pretty much of a stubborn SOB, and when I got together with my first mentor to put his teachings on a PDF, as i thought others would get some benifit from it, I was proven wrong. Therefore I think that was probably not a good idea.

      I will find my own way, in my own time, that suits me. What I am doing now frustrates me some, but I do enjoy it. I am learning how to deal with very odd problems. And I will make it. Because I will not stop till I find my way. I have narrowed my focus to things I enjoy doing more. The way I was doing the WSO was not working for me as it wasn't my success I was selling, it wasn't believable I think. Maybe, maybe not. Either way, it cost more than it earned. Not a good business model.
      Releasing WSO's is NOT a business model anyway. That should never be your sole business, it should be part of it and a way to generate leads, test products before they go onto bigger and better things and so on but selling WSO's isn't really a viable business model at the present time.

      Originally Posted by markmcknight View Post

      You would keep 50% of the FE as well would you not? Not all your FE goes to affiliates. You will have your own sales I'm sure.

      Am I right to think this?
      Depends what you set your commission as. If you set it to 100% commission then affiliate takes the lot. If it's set at 50% comms then you split it with them.

      It's standard these days to offer 100% on the front end with many affiliates not promoting anything unless they receive 100% FE and at least 50% on the backend / OTO.

      Seems harsh to people not familiar with the process but that's how it is and if it gets affiliates promoting and people on your list then it's all good.
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  • Profile picture of the author eugenedm
    Don't be fooled into WSO. But instead have WSO as one of the ways to make your business grow! You gotta do 5-7 things to make it work!
    Signature

    WARNING: A 50 Million Dollar Man Taught Me His Secret... Which Resulted 6,000 Sign-ups on My Email List.

    "It's easier than you think..."

    => Watch this video here...
    Build Your List to 6,000 Subscribers

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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
    Your product may start it's life as a WSO but that should rarely be the end of it's life span. Use the WSO section to cheaply test products and get feedback, conversion and sales figures then move it elsewhere and start selling at a higher price.

    Don't look at releasing WSO's as a business, it's just part of a business. A source of traffic and testing if you like.
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    • Profile picture of the author Plugin Profits
      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      Your product may start it's life as a WSO but that should rarely be the end of it's life span. Use the WSO section to cheaply test products and get feedback, conversion and sales figures then move it elsewhere and start selling at a higher price.

      Don't look at releasing WSO's as a business, it's just part of a business. A source of traffic and testing if you like.
      That's something I keep wondering about. How do people market their product after the end of their WSO or in addition to their WSO?

      I've heard people say the forum is best to test a product for a greater launch, though a launch where and how?

      How do you continue the lifespan of your product after the WSO? There's plenty of guides on how to launch a WSO, though I've seen nothing on how to market and get lots of traffic and sales AFTER the WSO.

      (Hint Hint) There should be a good WSO on this! Maybe WillR will write it!
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      • Profile picture of the author Plugin Profits
        Originally Posted by Art of Marketing View Post

        I feel funny saying Hi PlugIn!

        But you ask good questions.

        A WSO never really dies unless you ask the thread to be closed.

        People can find WSOs with great testimonials and still click the buy button a year later.

        Remember you can still advertise all over the web but they just come to the WSO thread to click buy.

        Later you can decide to add more content...go from ebook to video with added content on some new social network that was not around when you first published.

        There is also AppSumo where you can promote to their huge list of customers. You of course would add content or training program, service etc and offer them a discount...from your new value price that was actually increased.

        And your next WSO may be a breeze because you generated a list of buyers...you kept in touch and surveyed them to see what they would like.

        Then you prelaunch them in your email messages and get them ready for the big day once its live.

        That surge in initial sales will get affiliates attention and its just a fun ride.

        Art
        Hi Art of Marketing

        I know you could keep it open, though then you can't use scarcity to drive up the most sales when you actually have good affiliates promoting for you during the launch phase. And if you want to release it elsewhere at a higher price it's best to close the offer. They really are meant to be special limited offers for the forum of higher priced higher value products. So seems more worth it to extend lifespan elsewhere, or simply relaunch a new updated version than keep it open.

        Though as a buyer I hate it when I search for specific guides I want and find the one's I want are closed!

        Simply wonder if these sellers are continuing to promote their product through affiliates somewhere at a higher price, or simply through sales funnel squeeze pages and getting traffic to the squeeze from solo ads or fb ads?
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        • Profile picture of the author CandyxLand
          Well, one particular audience may become saturated, but the industry of selling people quick methods to make money will never die, so long as we live in a capitalist society. It's a part of human nature to want to get something for nothing. Just look at any list of the current bestselling books. It's all about how to quickly do something. How to memorize facts quickly, how to lose weight quickly, how to turn your life around in 30 days. The industry is alive and well.
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  • Profile picture of the author TLH Media Mktg
    I have found that the key ingredients to WSO product launch success are:

    (1) Getting coaching on how to launch products upfront, especially if you are a newbie
    (2) Launching quality products and offering lifetime service after the sale
    (3) Forming relationships with other affiliates both for your product launch and for offering quality products to your list (offering 100% commissions on product launches seems to be falling by the wayside and for good reason)

    One small product launch (300-600 sales) can afford some with enough income to support themselves just fine with email marketing alone. Recommending highly targeted, relevant offers to one's list is important. One also needs to ensure that they are writing corporate quality emails to their subscribers rather than the one or two-liners that are commonly seen that offer no real value.

    There is success to be had doing WSOs has been my experience. And, some people's definition of being "rich" is different than others. Having meaningful relationships, being financially independent, and being in good health is considered being "rich" by some.
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  • Profile picture of the author Bill Hugall
    For the newbie reading this thread:

    The key is not to look at the numbers that people are calling awful. The OP was right on the mark stating that you should have a strong back end in place if you would like to make a good consistent monthly income.

    Where IMO he falls short is that he paints a very one sided picture. One that involves massive amounts of work for very little return. I just did a WSO and did over 135 sales with no real JV. It also converted really well for an MMO product. Strong 7% My OTO did a 19% conversion and a 0% refund rate.
    Decent numbers for a couple hours of my time and $200

    As for whoever stated that 1000 sales is rare..... Really?
    It happens all the time. Yes JV's are booked, but there are a ton of sleepers out there that will come up and make a big day for you out of the blue. How can someone attract those sleepers? Well...And this is just a thought. Make some friends around here. Stop looking for the money and start learning that the big boys and girls around here have friends. Not I will scratch your back if you scratch mine friends, but real I can't wait to see you at the next event friends. Networking usually leads to friendships. Marketing becomes a few conversations not some spam attack.

    The key to doing a WSO.... Do one and find out. Fall down and feel the pain of failing when you tell yourself this one will be the key to setting you free. Then make a choice as to how committed you are to your success. You can dust yourself off and kick ass on the next one. OR
    You can quit and walk away knowing that at least you tried. If that's your deal. Those who do succeed in the WSO section. Don't do the latter.

    Not really that tough. It all takes work and trial and error. The one thing I do know for sure.

    Put your heart into it and think about your customers and how to best help them, and you will improve everytime. Go after the money and watch the bad reviews come pouring in.
    I personally would rather do 100 sales and have 100 happy customers than do 1000+ and have 500 buyers who don't care about what I have to say next.

    There will always be people giving you reasons not to do something. This post one of them. Ignore it and go for it.
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    • Profile picture of the author Plugin Profits
      Originally Posted by Bill Hugall View Post

      For the newbie reading this thread:

      Where IMO he falls short is that he paints a very one sided picture. One that involves massive amounts of work for very little return. I just did a WSO and did over 135 sales with no real JV. It also converted really well for an MMO product. Strong 7% My OTO did a 19% conversion and a 0% refund rate.
      Decent numbers for a couple hours of my time and $200
      Is there a reason why you choose to not use affiliates and a prelaunch?

      I hear so many people say things like "knocked this WSO out in under an hour" etc. Though that makes me question how much they really put into it to make it their best quality and knowledge. The Ebooks I've written have taken me weeks to write with hours and hours of reediting and adding more content to them. Though maybe I'm just a perfectionist.

      You can quit and walk away knowing that at least you tried. If that's your deal. Those who do succeed in the WSO section. Don't do the latter.
      If you release a WSO and it doesn't do the numbers for you that you were hoping, do you always need to come up with a brand new method and product to try next time doing better on what you did wrong? Or is it ok and profitable to learn what you did wrong and then correct those things to relaunch the same product the correct way?

      I just hear about that so many of these JVs, not only would they only promote WSO's with 100% commission, though only brand new unknown WSO's that have never been released before (even if they had great conversion rates). I guess it's cause they're banking off the buzz and excitement of a 'new' product to their lists?
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      • Profile picture of the author Bill Hugall
        Originally Posted by Plugin Profits View Post

        Is there a reason why you choose to not use affiliates and a prelaunch?

        I hear so many people say things like "knocked this WSO out in under an hour" etc. Though that makes me question how much they really put into it to make it their best quality and knowledge. The Ebooks I've written have taken me weeks to write with hours and hours of reediting and adding more content to them. Though maybe I'm just a perfectionist.
        I was testing some things out actually. I did use some affiliates, but my main goal was not volume. I mean chrushing it would have been nice, but I need to make sure that what I have set-up is going to work before I go out and tell affiliates they should promote for me.
        Nothing worse for relationships then something that won't convert. No point putting a product up if it won't sell. Try getting a car salesmen to work for straight commission selling cars that no one will buy.

        A lot of failures come from this exact step being left out. If you want people to view you as someone to promote for..... Make damn sure your product sells and that people are going to keep it. IMO
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        • Profile picture of the author Plugin Profits
          Originally Posted by Bill Hugall View Post

          I was testing some things out actually. I did use some affiliates, but my main goal was not volume. I mean chrushing it would have been nice, but I need to make sure that what I have set-up is going to work before I go out and tell affiliates they should promote for me.
          Nothing worse for relationships then something that won't convert. No point putting a product up if it won't sell. Try getting a car salesmen to work for straight commission selling cars that no one will buy.

          A lot of failures come from this exact step being left out. If you want people to view you as someone to promote for..... Make damn sure your product sells and that people are going to keep it. IMO
          Makes sense. Some do great doing it that way if the EPCs are really high. I guess it's more those who already have a reputation and history of past high EPCs that have a better time getting JVs prelaunch with a jv page and contests, cause JVs go by their past stats.
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  • Profile picture of the author zenxseo
    i am agree with Will :- advantage or disadvantage depending on how you choose to use it,

    yes a new be can be Rich in just one or 2 or 3 wso ,
    like Rome wasn't built in a day every things takes time and hear work,
    The Big issue is now a days more and more people are jumping in to WSo with a dream they will be Rich with in few month in internet marketing, without knowing the Facts .
    if you want to be true Rich want a good income from Im then have to work lot more than just 2 or 4 hours...
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  • Profile picture of the author aizaku
    nice read, and I agree %100.

    never the less, you didn't spell out "what can't be done" but more like "how not to do it."
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    • Profile picture of the author Not So New
      Hey Aizaku ...

      My main point was to make sure that you have a funnel on the backend in place as that is truly where you will be successful

      Shawn

      Originally Posted by aizaku View Post

      nice read, and I agree %100.

      never the less, you didn't spell out "what can't be done" but more like "how not to do it."
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  • Profile picture of the author JensSteyaert
    Hi Shawn,

    I think you hit the nail with your post here. Surely there will be Wso's that generate lots of money, enough to take a break for a few months or even a year, but over 90% of the Wso's don't reach the income one expects when launching it i think.

    But then again, you can still make a nice income when you have a good quality product, and you only need a few good affiliates to promote your offer.

    You simply need everything in place to make good money in the Wso section, because you won't make decent money in the front end if you have an average product.

    Jens
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    • Profile picture of the author Not So New
      Yep .. Exactly

      Originally Posted by JensSteyaert View Post

      Hi Shawn,

      I think you hit the nail with your post here. Surely there will be Wso's that generate lots of money, enough to take a break for a few months or even a year, but over 90% of the Wso's don't reach the income one expects when launching it i think.

      But then again, you can still make a nice income when you have a good quality product, and you only need a few good affiliates to promote your offer.

      You simply need everything in place to make good money in the Wso section, because you won't make decent money in the front end if you have an average product.

      Jens
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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
    That's something I keep wondering about. How do people market their product after the end of their WSO or in addition to their WSO?

    I've heard people say the forum is best to test a product for a greater launch, though a launch where and how?

    How do you continue the lifespan of your product after the WSO? There's plenty of guides on how to launch a WSO, though I've seen nothing on how to market and get lots of traffic and sales AFTER the WSO.

    (Hint Hint) There should be a good WSO on this! Maybe WillR will write it!
    A lot of WSO's end up moving over to Clickbank or other market places. Or like someone else mentioned you could take it to AppSumo, Udemy, Lynda or various other market places depending on what it is or sell it exclusively on your own website. Once you've created a buzz through the WSO, got some sales figures, seen how well it converts / sells you can then use that data to your advantage.

    Selling something for $7 forever isn't a great strategy IMO.
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    • Profile picture of the author WillR
      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      Selling something for $7 forever isn't a great strategy IMO.
      It depends what it is. If it's something that's only truly worth about $20 then selling it for $7 to get leads is not a bad thing. If it's a product that is worth $100+ and you are selling it for $7, again, it's not necessarily a bad thing if it's a lead in to your funnel. It depends what you are then doing with those leads. That's what really matters.

      Besides, who says you can only have it in one place? The smart marketer would keep their product selling on the Warrior Forum AND go and list it in other marketplaces also. There's absolutely no need to only have it in one marketplace at a time.
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      • Profile picture of the author Steve Fleming
        Originally Posted by WillR View Post

        It depends what it is. If it's something that's only truly worth about $20 then selling it for $7 to get leads is not a bad thing. If it's a product that is worth $100+ and you are selling it for $7, again, it's not necessarily a bad thing if it's a lead in to your funnel. It depends what you are then doing with those leads. That's what really matters.

        Besides, who says you can only have it in one place? The smart marketer would keep their product selling on the Warrior Forum AND go and list it in other marketplaces also. There's absolutely no need to only have it in one marketplace at a time.
        Well said Will... would totally agree with that 100% as I'm sure would most other vendors.

        Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author Plugin Profits
      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      A lot of WSO's end up moving over to Clickbank or other market places. Or like someone else mentioned you could take it to AppSumo, Udemy, Lynda or various other market places depending on what it is or sell it exclusively on your own website. Once you've created a buzz through the WSO, got some sales figures, seen how well it converts / sells you can then use that data to your advantage.

      Selling something for $7 forever isn't a great strategy IMO.
      Never heard of those other marketplaces, interesting. There should still be a good WSO on how to market and launch succesfully in those other marketplaces.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
    True, the more places it's sell for the better but in the spirit of the WSO section they are 'supposed' to be special offers and special offers don't usually last forever.

    I think that most products have a limited life span in the WSO section. People seem obsessed with NEW launches. I've recommended products to my lists before that have been around for a while and are proven good sellers, work well, no complaints about the product and many members of my list have emailed me (some quite angrily) asking me why I'm promoting an old product. I promoted something a short while ago that had been released just a week earlier in the previous month and had an angry email from a guy saying I must be desperate to be promoting products from last month. :confused:
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    • Profile picture of the author Plugin Profits
      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      True, the more places it's sell for the better but in the spirit of the WSO section they are 'supposed' to be special offers and special offers don't usually last forever.

      I think that most products have a limited life span in the WSO section. People seem obsessed with NEW launches. I've recommended products to my lists before that have been around for a while and are proven good sellers, work well, no complaints about the product and many members of my list have emailed me (some quite angrily) asking me why I'm promoting an old product. I promoted something a short while ago that had been released just a week earlier in the previous month and had an angry email from a guy saying I must be desperate to be promoting products from last month. :confused:
      Lol! WSO's have become simply the latest fashion trends. HAVE to have the new shiny object!
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  • Profile picture of the author David Moore
    Thank you for saying all of that, not so new. I purchased a five star WSO that cost me less that ten dollars some months ago, the budget is tight at that week. It turns out that the seller is friendly and I am willing to opt in his list. Just some days ago I purchase his high ticket webinar session.
    Had the WSO cost me more than 10 dollars, I would never seen one of the best webinar I've ever seen.
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    • Profile picture of the author Not So New
      Thanks for Sharing David ...

      Good to see that marketer had a funnel in the back and you are finding value

      Shawn

      Originally Posted by David Moore View Post

      Thank you for saying all of that, not so new. I purchased a five star WSO that cost me less that ten dollars some months ago, the budget is tight at that week. It turns out that the seller is friendly and I am willing to opt in his list. Just some days ago I purchase his high ticket webinar session.
      Had the WSO cost me more than 10 dollars, I would never seen one of the best webinar I've ever seen.
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  • Profile picture of the author CBusiness
    I made a profit on the WSO I'm tied into but agreed, it's definitely flat-lining.
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    • Profile picture of the author Not So New
      Not sure if it's flat lining , just need to be a little more creative.

      Shawn

      Originally Posted by CBusiness View Post

      I made a profit on the WSO I'm tied into but agreed, it's definitely flat-lining.
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  • Profile picture of the author Herrick Sun
    I think the reason why WSO is still so important for IM - it is about traffic, targeted traffic. It is #1 site having so many MMO niche audience here. As someone highlighted, it is about value, it is the value that make the products can sell for years. With such a tremendous traffic source, we cannot neglect the opportunities in WSO. It is a matter of the value you bring to the table and the strategy you used in selling.
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  • Profile picture of the author Bruce NewMedia
    Every marketing venue I've participated in has changed over the years. The WSO forum is no different. I started in it over 2 years ago. It seemed competitive then, but what did I know? !

    There was a lot more organic traffic searching for products than there appears today. But, as Will mentioned, if you keep at it, and have something of true value, you can carve out your own success niche. Most warriors simply do not give it enough time and enough tries at bat.

    ...and there isn't just one marketing model that works - there are many, and ones that haven't even been tried yet. You definitely do NOT have to give up 100% commission to do good sales.
    My last one, a few weeks ago, did almost 13K in sales with a healthy profit.
    ...and I have an entire offline business that takes most of my time and attention.
    _____
    Bruce
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  • Profile picture of the author paul nicholls
    offering 100% on the front end is absolutely fine, i love doing it because it's good for affiliates and if you have a good product then you can pick more affiliates and get sent a boat load of buyers for free

    my latest wso has done 1000 sales and i gave 100% commission on the fe

    i still made made a nice chunk of money from the upsells and also i funnelled tonnes more people into my membership site too

    oh and not too mention i now have an extra 1000 buyers

    did i manage this on my first wso?

    no

    did it take work?

    yes

    can anyone do this if they bother to learn?

    yes

    you can make some fantastic money but at the same time it does take work, the ones who just think by chucking together a quick wso to make lots of money are the ones who will never make a bean

    paul
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  • Profile picture of the author ronrule
    I've made about $8,200 selling WSO's on Warrior since joining in February. I'd hardly consider that rich, or even a good income, but hobby spending money my wife never sees is always a bonus.
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    • Profile picture of the author Not So New
      I hear that Ron

      Originally Posted by ronrule View Post

      I've made about $8,200 selling WSO's on Warrior since joining in February. I'd hardly consider that rich, or even a good income, but hobby spending money my wife never sees is always a bonus.
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  • This thread is spot on. I have created a few WSO's in the past but after its all said and done, you really don't make that much unless you know a way to get that buyer to buy something of greater value.
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    • Profile picture of the author WillR
      Originally Posted by realaffiliatereviews View Post

      This thread is spot on. I have created a few WSO's in the past but after its all said and done, you really don't make that much unless you know a way to get that buyer to buy something of greater value.
      YOU don't make that much. But it doesn't mean others are not making that much. Launching WSO's is a process and your momentum generally builds up over many launches as you get more and more customers and more and more affiliates on board. If you give up after a few failed launches then you can never expect to grow things to the level some Warriors are operating in the WSO market.
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  • Profile picture of the author rohit36
    Its not just about WSO, if your business is built and rely on just one platform platform, then your definitely not secure enough and not running on full potential... the same case with WSOs

    might be true that one WSO can not make you rich but series of WSO's can.

    The Idea here is not just to launch a WSO and hope for sales, but to build and grow customers list as well as affiliates.

    there is nothing wrong with wrong with 100% commission when you know you can give less on your next launch when you will have additional 500 customers on your list already
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  • Profile picture of the author A S M
    I don't think there's a place online or offline you can't become rich from.

    If you love your product , believe in it , have mastered the knowledge base of IM etc . You can be successful at almost anything .

    Best thing to do anyway , is to have multiple streams of income instead of relying on just one.
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  • Profile picture of the author Humbee360
    Very interesting thread, one thing I was curious about reading the OP post, there must be a point in the sales process where affiliates (that are needed) hurt the customer.

    By that I mean if you are using the upfront and back end model as mentioned, does that not reduce the quality of the product and the future of a product.

    Most successful products have to be updated, maintained, supported.

    If the only way to develop a sales process is to (give away) most of the revenue from the sales process to an affiliate, then where does the customer come in?

    It would seem to me that sellers owe customers a product that will be a viable long term product that is both useful and valuable.

    When I see a WSO where most of the revenue is in affiliate sales then I wonder to myself, do I want to buy that because I have to think that the seller is not thinking the product offering through.

    Just an idle thought, but perhaps the value of the product and the amount of effort it takes to maintain and support a product should come first.
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    • Profile picture of the author Not So New
      Very good point ...

      But normally the front end will be how to do something with an OTO software upgrade that will speed up the process.

      So it shouldn't take away from the actual lesson

      Shawn


      Originally Posted by Humbee360 View Post

      Very interesting thread, one thing I was curious about reading the OP post, there must be a point in the sales process where affiliates (that are needed) hurt the customer.

      By that I mean if you are using the upfront and back end model as mentioned, does that not reduce the quality of the product and the future of a product.

      Most successful products have to be updated, maintained, supported.

      If the only way to develop a sales process is to (give away) most of the revenue from the sales process to an affiliate, then where does the customer come in?

      It would seem to me that sellers owe customers a product that will be a viable long term product that is both useful and valuable.

      When I see a WSO where most of the revenue is in affiliate sales then I wonder to myself, do I want to buy that because I have to think that the seller is not thinking the product offering through.

      Just an idle thought, but perhaps the value of the product and the amount of effort it takes to maintain and support a product should come first.
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  • Profile picture of the author juicedmarketing
    Very sound advice from this thread. Another learning experience on WF
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  • Profile picture of the author Rishy
    Interesting post, I just launched my first WSO last month, got WSOTD and got over 500 sales. But I am not leaving my customers deserted, doing some good after sales service for them. The great thing about having a digital product is that you can continue to relaunch it in many platforms!So going to relaunch it in Jvzoo as well!
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  • Profile picture of the author Dee Syed
    Wow, great post - liked it a lot. With so many claims about make $X in Y minutes etc., it's good to see an honest and business-focused take on WSOs. Haven't launched any of my own, but it's interesting to see how things are changing.
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  • Profile picture of the author ddev
    Interesting Thread. I'm a wso seller too and here's what i can share:

    - The WSO Section Changed. It's not the same that it was some time ago where you published something and sales started rolling in like crazy (considering your product was good).

    - Today a Good product may be ignored and jump to page 2 without being noticed (things go too fast).

    - Extremely Low priced products had sense in the past because of the volume, today if you don't have good JV's, forget it.

    Don't trust people who say that it's easy and that you can make fortunes by publishing a WSO as is. It's not real. You need affiliates, otherwise it's a matter of Luck.

    Some warriors may talk about the millions made through W+ etc. I'd monitor those numbers month after month to compare them with the past to see the progression as i'm not sure.

    My opinion: There's WSO Blindness.

    The wso section is growing like crazy and think that subcategories would be great to help customers make a better decision if things are grouped.

    Today, all the offers are mixed together:

    - How to make money selling your hair.
    - Pinterest Software.
    - [Free WSO] Discover How I Make Money Publishing Free WSO's.
    - Weight Loss PLR Articles.
    - Hot Membership Plugin.
    - Backlinking Software That Will Catapult Your Site To The Top of Google.
    - PLR Images about my dog.




    Frankly, it's a mess and a waste of time/efforts/opportunities for both vendors / customers.

    Maybe something better organized in subsections (truly moderated where each wso would belong to a category - today for example you see SEO services in the WSO section when you have other sections for that like "Warrios For Hire" etc), would be more convenient and a win win situation for everybody.

    Example:

    - Software WSOs
    - Themes & Plugins WSOs
    - Money Making Systems WSO (You'd say no but this section should exist as these WSO's exist).

    And so on. It's just an idea, someone could organize it seriously.

    You would know where to find what you're looking for. Something like what Google has accustomed to.

    It would be great to see the power of WSO's again in terms of exposure, even if you don't opt to launch with affiliates (i'm not saying if it's convenient or not).

    Things change (i'm still trying to open my messenger to chat with my friends),
    so why not a change for WSO's?

    That's what i think. What i believe...nothing will change

    Just my 2 or 10 cents.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
    People give up way too easy... They launch a WSO... it bombs and they immediately turn to create something else.

    Wait a minute... Why not rework the WSO, change the offer and make it work instead of giving up on the product. If it's valuable information you want to share with the world then look for a way to make it work.

    Too many people slap up a WSO and expect the money to come rolling in instantly. They don't have an upsell, they don't have a marketing strategy at all, unless you consider winging it a strategy.

    Like others have said, think outside the box... We all started in the WSO section with our first one and made it work.

    Here's a simple plan to get you thinking a little:

    1. Launch 3 Free WSO's all related to each other, about a week a part each with a unique and interesting offer. Build your list...

    2. Followup with your list routinely... reiterating the most important parts of your free information in the days and weeks to come.

    3. Launch a paid WSO with a pre-announcement to your own list of the launch so they can take advantage of the low price first. That's about treating them right.

    4. Keep going ... with or without affiliates.

    5. Just because you launch a free (or paid) WSO doesn't mean it's dead when it drops off page 3. It's your job as a marketer to keep promoting it in different ways. Think outside the box here folks...
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  • Profile picture of the author Vector Graphics
    lol do we seem to forget not too long ago when Chris Munch made over 100,000 selling his $9 course?

    If you get a few buyers from a wso then stop making any more products then yeah it's not going to work out. You need to continue to make relevant products that get more buyers, and more important REPEAT BUYERS. If you continue to do this (and the sky is the limit) and build a big enough buyers list then you will get a ton of sales just by promoting your new wso to your list.
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  • Profile picture of the author timpears
    If your WSO breaks even and you get 500 added to your list, I would still do this as often as I could. As soon as I had 10,000 on my list, I would be in hog heaven. They say your list shojlf be worth $1 per member per month. so I don't think the WSO is a means to get rich. I think of it more in terms of building my list. If I can have it as a self liquidating, or better yet, profit makin operation, so much the better.
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    Tim Pears

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  • Profile picture of the author Sarevok
    I think of WSOs as a lead acquisition tool only.

    You won't get rich selling WSOs, that's true.

    But you can very well get rich if you have an elite backend funnel.



    Just my $.02
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  • People who think wso's will make them rich, will be poor for a long time.
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    “The ultimate reason for setting goals is to entice you to become the person it takes to achieve them”― Jim Rohn
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    • Profile picture of the author lotsofsnow
      Nice discussion...

      By the way there is a nice sticky post in the WSO section:

      Originally Posted by admin View Post

      3. People have used this section of the forum to launch $20,000 a month businesses. Believe it or not, it's a fact. Treat it like Gold because that is exactly what it can be for you.
      Guess what, it's true.
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  • Profile picture of the author troy23
    I don't think anyone expects to get rich with $7 WSO's.
    It's just another source of income and in this business you have to diversify a little.
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  • Profile picture of the author zelmazfpz
    It also depends on how you launch your WSO.
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  • Profile picture of the author hustlinsmoke
    I see quite a few not agreeing with you but I do. I have pretty much moved away from wso's though and launch outside to get a better price.

    I will say in six months last year I built a list of over 5,000 throwing wso's up.

    I made really no money on wso's. I would pay the affilaites as much as possible and run contests and the graphics copy ect would eat it. I did get buyers emails though and returned my money ten fold.

    If I did wso's again. I would
    1. Do low cost trials, say 2 bucks then the rest 14 days later.
    2. It would be a quailty wso. With good bonuses and only one great oto.

    I would concentrate on the numbers since I want that email address.

    This has worked but it offers for more serial refunders coming in. I love to block those guys don't you. Anyways I do agree to a point but if you have a great product and the right oto's there is still alot of money to be made here. I just like to make more so outside is best for me for the most part. Plus alot of my stuff borders grey hat so keeps me out of trouble.
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