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What's the future of the Empower Network???

by aceshigh888
81 replies
When I'm talking to some of my friends we've ended up chatting about the Empower Network. So I thought I'd see what people in here think about it? To me it looks like sort of a flash in the pan concept. Like the Double D's are all star-ee-eyed with delusions of grandeur. It's like a full blown Icarus syndrome going on there as far as i can see. Anything to do with a conservative approach seems like not a chance in hell. Which typically is what happens when people hit stardom and also get greedy. Why do I say that? Well, for a lot of reasons, but 20 dollar per month visa fee's, extremely overpriced training, and hiding out in costa rica ring just a few alarm bells in my mind. But that's just me. I don't have any real ill will about them. I've never tried it, as it looks like they could be on thin ice.

but I sort of wanted to see what others in here thought. I'm open minded so maybe there some areas I'm not taking into consideration? Who knows maybe I'm a little jealous as far as that goes. lol Your thoughts???
#empower #future #network
  • Profile picture of the author Ron Killian
    I personally am so tired of hearing about it. Seems like every one and their brother is pushing it. Gotta be a point of saturation at some time.

    I've never looked at join because I am not a fan of MLM. Tried it years back and it's SO hard to build a downline that will actually do something.

    Guessing there will be some fans posting.
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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    Yep, I think many are tired of hearing about it.

    Bubbles burst eventually.

    When your domain is no longer allowed to be posted on Facebook you know you have some spam problems.
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    • Profile picture of the author CyberAlien
      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

      When your domain is no longer allowed to be posted on Facebook you know you have some spam problems.
      Especially when you consider how many spammers there are on FaceBook lol
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    • Profile picture of the author Willie Crawford
      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

      Yep, I think many are tired of hearing about it.

      Bubbles burst eventually.

      When your domain is no longer allowed to be posted on Facebook you know you have some spam problems.

      When Facebook follows your cloaked link, and identifies the domain that
      you are linking to in a PM, and block it (which I have seen) then you do
      have a problem caused by over-zealous promoters :-)

      That's not a comment on the product itself though.

      Willie
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  • Profile picture of the author online only
    I don't know what to say, seriously.

    I really hoped that people who live in 2013 do have some common sense, have heard about MLM's etc, but guess I'm wrong. Seems like this "business" model still works for the creators.

    And yeah, I'm sick of it as well. Especially when rookies register to this forum, start making threads about empower and when someone says them something like "empower is just a hype, u were scammed, get yourself a personal domain & site and start doing real business" then they go angry and start saying that we are all wrong, we all suck and we are n00bs.

    Ridiculous and funny at the same time.
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  • Profile picture of the author Social App Zone
    never made it down here, then either did Bird Flu..
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  • Profile picture of the author Ron Killian
    People don't seem to understand that, about the only people making good off any MLM are the ones at the top, or the power hitters that bring in their own downlines. Unknown guy has little chance.

    How many MLM's can any one even name that have survived for long? Maybe on one hand.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Ron Killian View Post

      How many MLM's can any one even name that have survived for long?
      I can name a lot, to be honest. There are actually many very successful ones that are decades old. Including some with nearly 10 Million distributors, worldwide, these days.

      But those are companies whose distributors make genuine retail sales to genuine retail customers. Nothing like "Empower Network" at all, needless to say!

      It's not ok to be selling "the right to promote the business opportunity" and no more. But there the waters get murky, because of all the arguments about "products/services for your own use". Courts increasingly look, these days, at whether or not there are also retail customers (who are not distributors/affiliates) to determine whether or not that's so.

      I'm no lawyer at all, but have actually discussed this with a couple. Empower, in my personal opinion only, is understandably very high-risk to run into eventual legal problems. If there aren't enough (usually defined by courts as 70%) genuine retail customers using the blog service and/or any other products/services without being involved in the business opportunity, it will eventually qualify for adverse regulatory attention, for sure - just as so many other similar "opportunities" have done. These things often have a limited lifespan of typically a couple of years or so - sometimes less, sometimes more. Eventually they run on to the rocks. US courts apply what they call "the 70% rule" (precedent law/case law, but just as binding on a state court as a statute is, I think), and at some point the owners will presumably need to show that 70%+ of users of the service are genuine retail customers and not affiliates/distributors (and I don't, myself, see how they can ever hope to do that successfully?).

      Originally Posted by aceshigh888 View Post

      What's the future of the Empower Network???
      Either an eventual voluntary liquidation, or dissolution by an eventual court order, in my (not-legally-qualified) opinion. Let me put it this way: if it thrives over the long term and has a happy ending for all concerned, I'll eat my shoes.
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      • Profile picture of the author SunilTanna
        Here is a recent quote from David Wood of Empower network: "Most people assume Empower Network has no customers, when actually, 37% of all of our sales are customer only (non affiliate) sales volume."

        Even if we take his numbers at face value, and assume no clever accounting tricks to make the numbers look better, it means that less than half their sales are to people outside the scheme.... now re-read Alexa's comment.
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        • Profile picture of the author Victor Edson
          Originally Posted by SunilTanna View Post

          Here is a recent quote from David Wood of Empower network: "Most people assume Empower Network has no customers, when actually, 37% of all of our sales are customer only (non affiliate) sales volume."

          Even if we take his numbers at face value, and assume no clever accounting tricks to make the numbers look better, it means that less than half their sales are to people outside the scheme.... now re-read Alexa's comment.
          By law, they're required to sell a minimum 30% of their products to end consumers.

          But if you've taken a look at their marketing plan, it's easy to see they aren't targeting consumers, but affiliates. Their sales process is get you at $25 then fear you into spending more so you don't lose out.

          Just like any REAL business, the only ones making any money are the ones doing all the work. EN isn't any easier or harder to be successful with than selling anything else online. The only difference is their business model is unethical and technically illegal because of the way they prey on affiliates and fear them into buying high end products.

          Most illegal ponzi schemes go on for years before being taken down. It's not really a question of if, but when EN will fall too.

          I like MLMs when done correctly, unfortunately EN wasn't.
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      • Profile picture of the author WillR
        Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

        I'm no lawyer at all, but have actually discussed this with a couple. Empower, in my personal opinion only, is understandably very high-risk to run into eventual legal problems. If there aren't enough (usually defined by courts as 70%) genuine retail customers using the blog service and/or any other products/services without being involved in the business opportunity, it will eventually qualify for adverse regulatory attention, for sure - just as so many other similar "opportunities" have done. These things often have a limited lifespan of typically a couple of years or so - sometimes less, sometimes more. Eventually they run on to the rocks. US courts apply what they call "the 70% rule" (precedent law/case law, but just as binding on a state court as a statute is, I think), and at some point the owners will presumably need to show that 70%+ of users of the service are genuine retail customers and not affiliates/distributors (and I don't, myself, see how they can ever hope to do that successfully?).
        Well said.

        One of the other things that will not work in their favor is all of the publicity around their events and people standing up on stage with big fat sized commission checks. It makes it quite obvious to anyone watching what the real intention of the Empower Network is. It's not to help people get a blog started up. It's to try and get people recruiting more members so the network grows and makes those at the top of the 'pyramid' even wealthier.

        With all those screenshots floating around the place I think they would find it very hard to argue their main concentration is on the product/service being offered and not the opportunity for resale.
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      • Profile picture of the author calumson
        This is a great answer very well done Alexa Smith;8285165!
        For the answer to the question just read this....

        Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

        I can name a lot, to be honest. There are actually many very successful ones that are decades old. Including some with nearly 10 Million distributors, worldwide, these days.

        But those are companies whose distributors make genuine retail sales to genuine retail customers. Nothing like "Empower Network" at all, needless to say!

        It's not ok to be selling "the right to promote the business opportunity" and no more. But there the waters get murky, because of all the arguments about "products/services for your own use". Courts increasingly look, these days, at whether or not there are also retail customers (who are not distributors/affiliates) to determine whether or not that's so.

        I'm no lawyer at all, but have actually discussed this with a couple. Empower, in my personal opinion only, is understandably very high-risk to run into eventual legal problems. If there aren't enough (usually defined by courts as 70%) genuine retail customers using the blog service and/or any other products/services without being involved in the business opportunity, it will eventually qualify for adverse regulatory attention, for sure - just as so many other similar "opportunities" have done. These things often have a limited lifespan of typically a couple of years or so - sometimes less, sometimes more. Eventually they run on to the rocks. US courts apply what they call "the 70% rule" (precedent law/case law, but just as binding on a state court as a statute is, I think), and at some point the owners will presumably need to show that 70%+ of users of the service are genuine retail customers and not affiliates/distributors (and I don't, myself, see how they can ever hope to do that successfully?).



        Either an eventual voluntary liquidation, or dissolution by an eventual court order, in my (not-legally-qualified) opinion. Let me put it this way: if it thrives over the long term and has a happy ending for all concerned, I'll eat my shoes.
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        • Profile picture of the author Richard Van
          Originally Posted by calumson View Post

          This is a great answer very well done Alexa Smith; 8285165!
          Oh no, I'm sure she's younger than that.
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      • Profile picture of the author alashim
        Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

        It's not ok to be selling "the right to promote the business opportunity" and no more. But there the waters get murky, because of all the arguments about "products/services for your own use". Courts increasingly look, these days, at whether or not there are also retail customers (who are not distributors/affiliates) to determine whether or not that's so.
        And therein lies the 'problem' - as far as I can see all the 'products' you buy you sell to those who opt-in. That's ok if they're tools to help develop sales, mindset, etc and you have something to sell to someone who doesn't want to join the network.

        I signed up recently and done nothing with it because of this. Sure they'll get $25 a month from me until I quit but that's not where the money is. Don't know how long I'll stick with it, but I'm hoping that the owners have a master plan for sustainable growth and dealing with saturation.

        PS Thanks Alexa for your post you always manage to connect the hammer to the nail.
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  • Profile picture of the author johnben1444
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  • Profile picture of the author vishwa
    I am also not try Empower Ad Network So far. The concept is Usual equal to every MLM Business. There is $25 joining Fees and Cannot be afford By everyone. For me Just waste of Time and Money as Well. There is no Such Strong Future of it.
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  • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
    Originally Posted by aceshigh888 View Post

    hiding out in costa rica ring just a few alarm bells in my mind.

    but I sort of wanted to see what others in here thought. I'm open minded so maybe there some areas I'm not taking into consideration? Who knows maybe I'm a little jealous as far as that goes. lol Your thoughts???
    Since everyone is shitting on them, I'll offer a different perspective based on what I know about the company.

    David Wood lives in Costa Rica because he wanted to, can if he wants, and has since 2009. Maybe he doesn't like the bullshit that goes on in the US, so he decided to unplug from the matrix - so to speak.

    Empower Network, the company, is a US based company with its headquarters in Florida.

    You probably are a little jealous at all the success that is happening within that group.

    I believe the future is bright for them.

    Someone else said they thought it was dead. It's getting more members per day today than any other time in its short existence.

    They pay about $1 million per WEEK in affiliate commissions every week now.

    In other words, they pay a perfectly executed product launch worth of money in commissions to their members - without having to do any product launches and giving massages with happy endings to their affiliates to get them to promote said launch.

    The products are overpriced to people who think they're overpriced, and pure gold and well worth the money to those who get value out of them.

    Price of anything is simply what people are willing to pay to get what they want.

    They have a huge database of subscribers and customers and all they promote to them is Empower Network and nothing else.

    Can you say that about any other list owners?

    Having been around since 2005 and rubbed shoulders with extremely successful and respected marketers, I'd say in my humble opinion that David Wood and David Sharpe are on a totally different level than most of them - especially David Wood.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

      David Wood lives in Costa Rica because he wanted to, can if he wants, and has since 2009. Maybe he doesn't like the bullshit that goes on in the US, so he decided to unplug from the matrix - so to speak.

      Empower Network, the company, is a US based company with its headquarters in Florida.
      You seem to know quite a bit about it, Jason: what's your own opinion, or even guess, of what percentage of the company's collective sales income comes from selling its products or services to people who are not distributors/affiliates but retail customers buying those products or services purely for their own value with no additional business-promotional incentive to pay for them?

      Do you think they'll be able to prove in court, in accordance with the "70% rule" upheld and enforced by all US courts considering this matter at various regulators' requests, that it's 70% or more?

      It strikes me from the certainty and confidence of your post above that you may have information that I don't have, which is why I'm asking; but personally, from what I've seen I'd be astonished if it's 7%, let alone 70%.

      If it isn't 70%, then at some as-yet-unspecified, future point it's all going to end in tears (just as it did for all its predecessors who had the exact same legal problem), isn't it?

      My guess is that it will fold up "voluntarily", blaming "this and that and the other", soon after the legal proceedings commence, knowing that it wouldn't have a leg to stand on, in court. That's my guess not because I have any "inside information" at all but simply because that's what normally happens in these circumstances and because that's what a couple of lawyers who know about these things have told me is the foreseeable and expected outcome, here.
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      • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
        Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

        You seem to know quite a bit about it, Jason: what's your own opinion, or even guess, of what percentage of the company's collective sales income comes from selling its products or services to people who are not distributors/affiliates but retail customers buying those products or services purely for their own value with no additional business-promotional incentive to pay for them?

        Do you think they'll be able to prove in court, in accordance with the "70% rule" upheld and enforced by all US courts considering this matter at various regulators' requests, that it's 70% or more?

        It strikes me from the certainty and confidence of your post above that you may have information that I don't have, which is why I'm asking; but personally, from what I've seen I'd be astonished if it's 7%, let alone 70%.

        If it isn't 70%, then at some as-yet-unspecified, future point it's all going to end in tears (just as it did for all its predecessors who had the exact same legal problem), isn't it?

        My guess is that it will fold up "voluntarily", blaming "this and that and the other", soon after the legal proceedings commence, knowing that it wouldn't have a leg to stand on, in court. That's my guess not because I have any "inside information" at all but simply because that's what normally happens in these circumstances and because that's what a couple of lawyers who know about these things have told me is the foreseeable and expected outcome, here.
        I don't really care all that much. I like what they're doing and have no problem with what they have going on. I think it's great.

        I was simply presenting some facts I know about the company.

        Will they be around forever? No one knows really.

        Regarding your question about being able to prove in court - I'm not a lawyer nor do I claim to be one, but I know they pay a hefty amount of money on a legal team to remain compliant.

        You're making assumptions, but you're entitled to them.
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    • Profile picture of the author PayForWords
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      Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

      Since everyone is shitting on them, I'll offer a different perspective based on what I know about the company.

      David Wood lives in Costa Rica because he wanted to, can if he wants, and has since 2009. Maybe he doesn't like the bullshit that goes on in the US, so he decided to unplug from the matrix - so to speak.

      Empower Network, the company, is a US based company with its headquarters in Florida.

      You probably are a little jealous at all the success that is happening within that group.

      I believe the future is bright for them.

      Someone else said they thought it was dead. It's getting more members per day today than any other time in its short existence.

      They pay about $1 million per WEEK in affiliate commissions every week now.

      In other words, they pay a perfectly executed product launch worth of money in commissions to their members - without having to do any product launches and giving massages with happy endings to their affiliates to get them to promote said launch.

      The products are overpriced to people who think they're overpriced, and pure gold and well worth the money to those who get value out of them.

      Price of anything is simply what people are willing to pay to get what they want.

      They have a huge database of subscribers and customers and all they promote to them is Empower Network and nothing else.

      Can you say that about any other list owners?

      Having been around since 2005 and rubbed shoulders with extremely successful and respected marketers, I'd say in my humble opinion that David Wood and David Sharpe are on a totally different level than most of them - especially David Wood.

      1. They do promote other products so you're wrong there.
      I won't mention any names but here's one example: High Traffic Academy

      2. I'm sure they do have a TON of signups but I was in there...
      I know for a fact that they also have a HUGE turnover rate.

      3. 1 million per week among how many people exactly? 50,000+?
      Well...I know around a dozen people who are making 6 figures a year in EN..
      While that may seem impressive...where does that leave the other 49K+?

      4. David hasn't lived in Costa Rica since 2009....

      5. No one is jealous of 49,000+ people losing money and less than 1,000 earning a living


      But at the end of the day, if you like it, you like it.


      Either way, we should all state facts here and not assumptions.
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      • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
        Originally Posted by PayForWords View Post

        1. They do promote other products so you're wrong there.
        I won't mention any names but here's one example: High Traffic Academy

        2. I'm sure they do have a TON of signups but I was in there...
        I know for a fact that they also have a HUGE turnover rate.

        3. 1 million per week among how many people exactly? 50,000+?
        Well...I know around a dozen people who are making 6 figures a year in EN..
        While that may seem impressive...where does that leave the other 49K+?

        4. David hasn't lived in Costa Rica since 2009....

        5. No one is jealous of 49,000+ people losing money and less than 1,000 earning a living

        But at the end of the day, if you like it, you like it.

        Either way, we should all state facts here and not assumptions.
        1. They didn't promote high traffic academy. The owner of that site, Vick Strizheus, got in Empower and used High Traffic Academy to build his Empower business as part of his backend.

        2. Most businesses, especially of the MLM grade, have a high turnover rate. I don't know what theirs is, but it doesn't matter. And lots of industries outside of making money online have a high turnover rate. The restaurant business comes to mind.

        3. I don't know how many members get paid weekly, but I'm glad I'm one of them.

        4. Really? How do you know? I guess he's lying when he says hes at his home in Costa Rica when he's on calls and stuff. Pretty sure it's Puntarenas, Costa Rica

        5. The OP said he was jealous. I was just restating his statement. You sound bitter though.

        I was stating the facts as I know them.
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        • Profile picture of the author PayForWords
          Banned
          Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

          1. They didn't promote high traffic academy. The owner of that site, Vick Strizheus, got in Empower and used High Traffic Academy to build his Empower business as part of his backend.

          2. Most businesses, especially of the MLM grade, have a high turnover rate. I don't know what theirs is, but it doesn't matter. And lots of industries outside of making money online have a high turnover rate. The restaurant business comes to mind.

          3. I don't know how many members get paid weekly, but I'm glad I'm one of them.

          4. Really? How do you know? I guess he's lying when he says hes at his home in Costa Rica when he's on calls and stuff. Pretty sure it's Puntarenas, Costa Rica

          5. The OP said he was jealous. I was just restating his statement. You sound bitter though.

          I was stating the facts as I know them.

          1. How convenient? He comes in, climbs to the very top of the leader board almost instantly, and I got emails from "Dave Wood" promoting his new courses that just so happened to be launching in one day...every time I got the email to various email accounts that I signed up at different times. Very strange, huh?

          2. There's a huge difference in the low paying restaurant industry than the wealth promising Empower Network.

          3. Congratulations!!! You should be proud of yourself.

          4. You have the Internet, you know his name, he's been on forums before (and after 2009), go see for yourself. And sure, he lives there now but there's a big difference in 2009 and 2011.

          5. No, not bitter. I just don't like taking advantage of people with a BS product just so the people above me can make more money but hey, if you're happy, more power to ya!

          6. I was in when they FIRST launched and again later on. I used to be all for it but now that I know what they are really doing (and what their plans are), no thanks. I'll pass but again, more power to ya.
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          • Profile picture of the author Steve B
            I know very little about Empower Network although it has been pitched to my over and over again, in person, online, and even through standard mail.

            Here's the thing:

            I know I personally wouldn't enjoy, or be good at, recruiting others (including family, friends, neighbors, etc) into the program. From what I know about the business model, that is the way big money is made at EN - through recruitment.

            Knowing that, why would I want to spend my working life doing something I don't like (and don't really believe in)?

            Regardless of whether EN is eventually found "illegal" or a ponzi scheme or whatever . . .

            Why would I want to devote years, months, weeks, or any time at all to a business that I didn't enjoy, didn't believe in, and didn't want to alienate my acquaintenances with when there are so many other business niches and models to choose from?

            Every hour I spent in EN would mean one less hour I had to work on my own chosen business.

            Good luck to you all,

            Steve
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            • Profile picture of the author kindsvater
              The long-term future of a MLM program like this is what you make of it. If you, like most, are just using Empower to make money by soliciting new members, then you know that mostly likely has an end date and a bad ending. If you are picking up knowledge to enhance your skills, and maybe picking up some downline members along the way, you'll probably be fine.
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          • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
            Originally Posted by PayForWords View Post

            1. How convenient? He comes in, climbs to the very top of the leader board almost instantly, and I got emails from "Dave Wood" promoting his new courses that just so happened to be launching in one day...every time I got the email to various email accounts that I signed up at different times. Very strange, huh?
            The man, Vick, is a paid traffic powerhouse.

            I'm on the real David Wood's lists too and I never got anything about High Traffic Academy.

            You do know that people will use other marketer's names fraudulently to get a higher response to emails.

            Happened to a marketer I used to work for all the time.
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    • Profile picture of the author aceshigh888
      Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

      Since everyone is shitting on them, I'll offer a different perspective based on what I know about the company.

      David Wood lives in Costa Rica because he wanted to, can if he wants, and has since 2009. Maybe he doesn't like the bullshit that goes on in the US, so he decided to unplug from the matrix - so to speak.

      Empower Network, the company, is a US based company with its headquarters in Florida.

      You probably are a little jealous at all the success that is happening within that group.

      I believe the future is bright for them.

      Someone else said they thought it was dead. It's getting more members per day today than any other time in its short existence.

      They pay about $1 million per WEEK in affiliate commissions every week now.

      In other words, they pay a perfectly executed product launch worth of money in commissions to their members - without having to do any product launches and giving massages with happy endings to their affiliates to get them to promote said launch.

      The products are overpriced to people who think they're overpriced, and pure gold and well worth the money to those who get value out of them.

      Price of anything is simply what people are willing to pay to get what they want.

      They have a huge database of subscribers and customers and all they promote to them is Empower Network and nothing else.

      Can you say that about any other list owners?

      Having been around since 2005 and rubbed shoulders with extremely successful and respected marketers, I'd say in my humble opinion that David Wood and David Sharpe are on a totally different level than most of them - especially David Wood.
      No doubt they've had some success. But at what cost. They burned two of my friends from my business group who told me not to try this. They were the one's who told me about the hidden fee. I think there best bet is really to move the whole operation down to costa rica. If I was them I'd be making so many changes. I'd immediately get rid of the 20 dollar fee. I'd restructure the company. You'd have to if you'd want to avoid future problems. But when you run into a lot of money like they have I know it's near impossible to want to turn that off to try and insultate yourself. That's like icarus syndrom. It's a real phychological issue that many people run into. Like alexander the great, you think you're invincible and that you can do whatever you want and abuse whoever you want and there would be no repercussions. But life usually always balances the equation at some point. There business model kinda got me thinking of "what not to do" with one I'm working on.
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      • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
        Originally Posted by aceshigh888 View Post

        No doubt they've had some success. But at what cost. They burned two of my friends from my business group who told me not to try this. They were the one's who told me about the hidden fee. I think there best bet is really to move the whole operation down to costa rica. If I was them I'd be making so many changes. I'd immediately get rid of the 20 dollar fee. I'd restructure the company. You'd have to if you'd want to avoid future problems. But when you run into a lot of money like they have I know it's near impossible to want to turn that off to try and insultate yourself. That's like icarus syndrom. It's a real phychological issue that many people run into. Like alexander the great, you think you're invincible and that you can do whatever you want and abuse whoever you want and there would be no repercussions. But life usually always balances the equation at some point. There business model kinda got me thinking of "what not to do" with one I'm working on.
        You should contact both Dave's on Facebook and offer them consulting.
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  • Profile picture of the author Adie
    A friend asked me why I did not join EN.. Simple answer I gave to her - I don't want to run a business that I don't have 100% control... She joined and still not making what she expected to make...
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  • Profile picture of the author Jeff Lenney
    David sharpe lives In Florida. David wood is actually moving to Los Angeles soon
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    • Profile picture of the author aceshigh888
      Originally Posted by eljeffe77 View Post

      David sharpe lives In Florida. David wood is actually moving to Los Angeles soon
      There so freakin dumb. I would never do that. But they've never been charged so they have no clue, they don't know a damn thing about the FTC or the justice department. If they were smart they'd both leave the US and really not make it known where they live. Because when the shtf and it will, they'll be easy pickings living in the US. If I were them I'd just buy a nice yatch and sail around from port to port and not have any home base. meanwhile work on repairing or dismantaling this thing that's a bit out of control. They probably have an investigation going on on them as we speak. My guess is they don't know the rules of the game. The bigger picture is the person with the biggest stick wins every time, and if the ftc or DOJ gets on there azz they'll be toast. Like in the videos all they talk about is "we're working on new strategies to make more money..bla bla bla." that's so dumb. Insultate what you got, and insultate yourself. That's what they should be working on so they'll have a future.
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  • Profile picture of the author AnythingMarketing
    My own 2 cents:

    Those that go in for the income, don't get it...

    Those that go in to learn from the products AND THEN APPLY WHAT THEY LEARNED...

    They make the income...
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  • Profile picture of the author showole
    Well....
    1. Wood is moving to Cali and Sharp lives in FL
    2. just any online program, YOU HAVE TO DRIVE TRAFFIC to make money
    3. their products especially the inner circle members is an Mindset development Goldmine
    4. big and legit companies do close down everyday, so if EN closes down today, it will not be the first or last...so NO BIG DEAL...but the company is continually adding other product lines wit not affiliate connection. they even have merchandise section now.
    5. I dont necessarily think EN is MLM, even if it's MLM, what would u say about companies like ACN, herbalife etc...they've been around forever.

    in conclusion, i think if Sharp and Woods continue be creative and hire more experienced business and legal team at their corporate office in FL, they should be good.
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  • Profile picture of the author AnythingMarketing
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    • Profile picture of the author AnythingMarketing
      'Nuff said...
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    • Profile picture of the author DubDubDubDot
      Don't rest your livelihood on this program. It's going to be taken away in one fell swoop one day from out of nowhere. Whether participants want to admit it or not, it's a pyramid scheme and those never ever last. If the FTC gets involved it could in theory survive, but it will likely be the SEC coming down on it due to the funds involved. IMO they are standing back waiting for the company to get bigger so they have more to confiscate.

      Originally Posted by AnythingMarketing View Post

      The needle broke right off my BS meter after reading this. $60,000 consulting job for an EN newbie without a verifiable work history? Sure. That isn't the way the world works, kiddo.
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  • Profile picture of the author aceshigh888
    What I'd like to do is find all this training they talk about somewhere online and watch it for free. I want to see if the hype is real, and if you could actually learn something. My guess is it's just overpriced crap though. But if anyone has a copy of the training let me know I want to review it. Thanks.
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    • Profile picture of the author samrand
      Originally Posted by aceshigh888 View Post

      What I'd like to do is find all this training they talk about somewhere online and watch it for free. I want to see if the hype is real, and if you could actually learn something. My guess is it's just overpriced crap though. But if anyone has a copy of the training let me know I want to review it. Thanks.
      Another freebie seeker eh? Want someone to give you a copyright product
      for free so you can confirm it's crap? lol

      Regarding that EN get rid of their $20 per moth affiliate fee (that applies to affiliates
      not customers that are not reselling EN) with their 100% commission structure
      to affiliates how would the company produce revenue to sustain infrastructure?
      Pay for events? Pay for their offices in Florida with staff with a 9-5 phone
      line live support? Lawyers etc.

      The two owners of EN also have affiliate accounts and produce a lot of sales naturally but its the same pay structure as everyone else. They tried to do that for awhile paying all business expenses out of their own affiliate accounts but the reality they found out is that total business costs were exceeding six figures a month. What
      biz owner wants to eat that every month.

      If I was in EN I would rather much pay a $20 a month reseller fee than split
      commissions down the middle off of EVERY sale I make with your other typical
      companies.

      Of course you have to give some sales up in the beginning because there are
      pass up sales like an mlm to create leverage. Only bad marketers and poor
      sales people hate that. When that leverage kicks in and sales start flying in
      from here and there that were not your "personals" that can be pretty exciting.
      It's not so bad then lol.

      Just like being a product owner and watching affiliates drive in sales AND emails
      to your account.

      Everybody loves leverage. The mlm concept is brilliant. Problem is for most
      it just doesn't work long term. People drop out faster than you can
      bring them in. That's the kicker. And before EN came out I don't know how
      people made money in traditional mlm because the commission structure for
      most companies was really bad. 5% on sales and whatnot. You would have
      to recruit a whole army just to hit 5 figures monthly.

      If only I could get 3, then you three, then their three gets three.... in a perfect
      world but unfortunately people don't see it through.

      Not sure if EN will last but I do applaud them for coming out with that comp plan
      that made other companies adjust pay plans too.

      These mlm companies treat their distributors as employees which is a mistake
      because most of the products in these silly companies are not the assest. The
      distributor is.

      Sam
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  • Profile picture of the author TTGSteve
    EN is a joke. I clearly see that another "traffic powerhouse" is now at the top of the leaderboards. Conveniently, he runs his own traffic program, powered clicks or something. Aka EN has partnered with another traffic company to make it look like if you buy traffic from powered clicks that you will make tons of momey, as well.
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  • Profile picture of the author BJ Min
    I think it really depends on the individual on whether if EN is useful for them or not.

    Personally, I've been a warrior since 2007 and the warriorforum has been very useful for me for the "discussion component" to it.

    Just like that EN has been very useful for my development as a person and as a marketer (especially in the team I joined which is Big Idea Mastermind) because of the "mastermind component" to it because you get to learn and meet from like minded people in real life as well as online (there is more synergy and investment in this compared to other training programs I have bought online...most likely because we are all in the same team).

    I have learned a lot from warriorforum and other course but in terms of actually putting the lessons into practice, I have stretched myself more AFTER joining EN (especially from the team I joined which is called Big Idea Mastermind which is led by the #1 income earner in EN).

    I have applied a lot MORE from what I learned regarding traffic generation, PERSONAL development, and most importantly have applied those more than I did from my 5+ years of being a full time internet marketer.

    I just joined 4 months ago and it really doesn't matter when you join because it's about how much you produce. That's what I have learned because I'm already ranking #32 out of all affiliates. I think if you are a serious marketer (with a clickbank or warriorforum background like I had), you have a great advantage (such as creating your own landing page, autoresponders, etc) over most people who join EN because you already know ALL the basics to stand out from all the other EN marketers who do the same thing.
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  • Profile picture of the author Edwin Torres
    I've always wanted to join it but I've read a bunch of people throw the word ponzi scheme at Empower so I've always been cautious.

    It seems like they have a really big following off people and if they do make that much money for their affiliates like they claim then I think it could last for a bit.
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  • Profile picture of the author BJ Min
    Edwin, that's what I felt too...i used to say I'm an internet marketer...not a network marketer...

    but what got me in was the potential to make the big ticket commissions online...and learn traffic from my mentor Vick Strizheus who is the #1 income earner in EN...that alone made me curious to jump all in...and to be honest, that was the best decision I made this year in 2013...

    I've had success online before but joining this mastermind has catapulted me to the next level...does that guarantee it will work for you? Unfortunately the answer I found is NO because for some reason, some people don't DO what they are taught...while others take life/business by the horns and just do it.

    If you do what they teach like I did, I believe you will get a lot out of it...that's it bottomline...

    Plus, the skillsket you learn from EN (learning how to get traffic, personal development, working on yourself which is the key, etc) can be used to multiply your impact in ANY business you have now or any business you create in the future.

    I don't know if you know T Harv Eker (the author of Secrets of the Millionaire Mind which was a New York Times bestselling book). Even inside that book, Eker mentions that network marketing is a great way to build your skills as an entrepreneur and marketer. By the way, even T Harv Eker's son Jesse Eker has recently joined EN after searching years for biz opps. So it's definitely a great place (in my opinion) to build your skillset as a marketer and business owner.

    The people who talk badly about it are people who were never in it or people who were in it and never made any money (most likely because they never put in the energy/time/dedication into it).

    Plus, Robert Kiyosaki (author of Rich Dad Poor Dad), Jim Rohn (Success philosopher) all have had roots in network marketing.

    It's about what you make out of it that defines what this company is for you. You can look at it as half full or half empty but it's really up to YOU to determine what it means for you. And that's based on you doing the work bottomline.

    BJ
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  • Profile picture of the author HelpingYouBeAnExpert
    here is something i noticed over time if everyone thinks it's good and jumps on it, usually it's not
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  • Profile picture of the author TTGSteve
    Their "training" is common sense and complete garbage.

    "Make sure you update your blog regularly!"

    Every EN training video is like 30 minutes long and 27 minutes of that is a sales pitch as to why you should go all-in. At the end of the video, they tell you something lame, like the above.

    I was in EN and actually did an outstanding job in comparison to other people I knew in it and brought into it. Trust me, it's not worth it. If you have any ethics and value your relationships with others, such as friends and family, not the brainwashed sheep in EN, you'll stay very far away.
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  • Profile picture of the author amazing103
    Unfortunately, I was one of the idiots pulled in by a Guru, I thought was trustworthy.
    However, after fighting for 3 weeks, I finally got my $25.00 back.

    You're correct, they make all their money from affiliates who are not making any money.

    I should have know , when they tried to pawn all the extra charges fro Costa Rica, where the law won't get them.

    Every dog has it's day.
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    • Profile picture of the author Chris Silvey
      "What's the future of the Empower Network???"

      Ok I will address this question. Rumor from a friend of mine that works for Google is that it is highly likely to get de indexed. The fact is that EN runs not a blog network, but a network of Iframe sites that mimic true blog sites that are set up to manimulate search engine results. EN uses many domains such as linksprosperity, prosperity group, etc. Sub domain sites look like pages, such as linksprosperity.com/long tail keyword. You click the home key it will stay on the same page. Clicking source you will see the blog roll is not a blog roll , but content originating from EN.

      It is very deceptive to visitors.

      Now as far as ethics, I have hammered EM left and right on several points with their fleecing system and total inside selling. From their 25 month + CC processing system (Paypal won't even touch them with a ten foot pole) to their Inner Circle fee's.

      They pray on Newbies, will vamp that the system works till they drop dead, yet provide no proof.

      Besides here I have my own IM group of over 3,800 members and often enough I have to ban organized posting ambushes when they do a webinar to snare new members.

      In one night I banned over 43 EN members.
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      • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
        Originally Posted by Chris Silvey View Post

        EN uses many domains such as linksprosperity, prosperity group, etc. Sub domain sites look like pages, such as linksprosperity.com/long tail keyword. You click the home key it will stay on the same page. Clicking source you will see the blog roll is not a blog roll , but content originating from EN.
        LinkProsperity is not pushed by Empower. It's the other way around. An EM member/affiliate made the link cloaker for their team to use to promote their empower links and blog posts.

        You get a blog on their domain which runs on wordpress. It's real. lol
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        • Profile picture of the author Chris Silvey
          Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

          LinkProsperity is not pushed by Empower. It's the other way around. An EM member/affiliate made the link cloaker for their team to use to promote their empower links and blog posts.

          You get a blog on their domain which runs on wordpress. It's real. lol
          Have a look - Check Out The Most Popular Prosperity Team Members Blog Posts and as I said these are NOT blog posts. By viewing source you will see that each is an Iframe site, along with menu item like recent posts.

          I could care less about the link cloaker - What, put every url as a linkprosperity slug....

          The point I am making besides all this is that I have yet to see a real EN Member Blog that is provided by EN. The EN network gets credit for the SEO on the content, not the members.

          So basically, with the 25 buck membership, members pay to promote EN. They have to Pay for CC processing on what , 5 products that they sell internally?

          Lets compare this to real affiliate marketing.

          A person signs up for Paypal for CC processing - Free
          They sign up with Jvzoo, Clickbank, Maxbounty, etc - Free
          They either get a free blog or paid hosting with option for unlimited hosting way under 25 a month. IE Multiple sites.
          Training - Info is free for the most part.
          Commissions - 50%-100% WITHOUT OUT OF POCKET EXPENSES Possible.

          "We also host one of the Internet’s largest publishing platforms and content networks for bloggers and content marketers, currently hosting over 70,000 customer blogs."

          I have asked tons of EN members to show me their EN hosted blog. None have come through. Nothing but Iframes like the examples above. No Content authored by the EN member, nor credited to them.

          Now you show me real - Lol
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          • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
            Originally Posted by Chris Silvey View Post

            Have a look - Check Out The Most Popular Prosperity Team Members Blog Posts and as I said these are NOT blog posts. By viewing source you will see that each is an Iframe site, along with menu item like recent posts.

            I could care less about the link cloaker - What, put every url as a linkprosperity slug....

            The point I am making besides all this is that I have yet to see a real EN Member Blog that is provided by EN. The EN network gets credit for the SEO on the content, not the members.

            I have asked tons of EN members to show me their EN hosted blog. None have come through. Nothing but Iframes like the examples above. No Content authored by the EN member, nor credited to them.

            Now you show me real - Lol
            Here's a quick Jing screen capture video I made checking out that link prosperity cloaker tool you had mentioned:

            2013-07-17_2134 - jasondinner's library

            PM me if you want to see my EN blog. I don't want to share it here as it could be considered self promoting affiliate links by a mod.

            Just watch the video though if anything.
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      • Profile picture of the author deebee23
        Originally Posted by Chris Silvey View Post

        "What's the future of the Empower Network???"

        Ok I will address this question. Rumor from a friend of mine that works for Google is that it is highly likely to get de indexed. The fact is that EN runs not a blog network, but a network of Iframe sites that mimic true blog sites that are set up to manimulate search engine results. EN uses many domains such as linksprosperity, prosperity group, etc. Sub domain sites look like pages, such as linksprosperity.com/long tail keyword. You click the home key it will stay on the same page. Clicking source you will see the blog roll is not a blog roll , but content originating from EN.

        It is very deceptive to visitors.

        Now as far as ethics, I have hammered EM left and right on several points with their fleecing system and total inside selling. From their 25 month + CC processing system (Paypal won't even touch them with a ten foot pole) to their Inner Circle fee's.

        They pray on Newbies, will vamp that the system works till they drop dead, yet provide no proof.

        Besides here I have my own IM group of over 3,800 members and often enough I have to ban organized posting ambushes when they do a webinar to snare new members.

        In one night I banned over 43 EN members.
        I was one of those 3800 members you ban on google plus.I bashed the company and you still ban me. Why?
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        • Profile picture of the author Chris Silvey
          Originally Posted by deebee23 View Post

          I was one of those 3800 members you ban on google plus.I bashed the company and you still ban me. Why?
          PM me your G+ name and I can reinstate you. It could of been me or Amanda. G+ has its drawbacks and isn't quite organized as forums. We get hit by hundreds of posts each day that we have to mod before they go live. For the most part Amanda and I have been conditioned to delete/ban anything with the word Empower Network.
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      • Profile picture of the author webgenco
        This is my biggest problem with EN - you are not building your own business or blog, you are building an iframe site which in addition to being banned on Facebook, is not your property, it is EN and can be removed or dlisted at any time. EN is quickly becoming a must-delete from many sites. They may have some OK training though.

        From Chris Silvey "Ok I will address this question. Rumor from a friend of mine that works for Google is that it is highly likely to get de indexed. The fact is that EN runs not a blog network, but a network of Iframe sites that mimic true blog sites that are set up to manimulate search engine results. EN uses many domains such as linksprosperity, prosperity group, etc. Sub domain sites look like pages, such as linksprosperity.com/long tail keyword. You click the home key it will stay on the same page. Clicking source you will see the blog roll is not a blog roll , but content originating from EN."
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  • Profile picture of the author Theduke2011
    Haven't really looked into it too much, but honestly I hear enough about it. Eventually it will get saturated.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rob Maggs
    I really don't like the empower,network marketing type thing. I was recently told that they encourage launch jacking, I'm not sure if that is true, but I have seen empower people promoting reviews of people's products on YouTube, where most of their video is spent promoting empower, followed by a crappy review of products which is just copied verbatim from the marketers jv page. All the keywords on the video mention the product developers name, product name etc.
    But the link in the video description goes to their recruiting page.
    If they are really teaching this...then that is really low.
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  • Profile picture of the author Curtis2011
    It will eventually run out of new suckers to leech money out of, and then the whole thing will implode.

    Pyramid schemes like Empower Network can't go on forever, by their very nature.
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    • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
      Originally Posted by Curtis2011 View Post

      It will eventually run out of new suckers to leech money out of, and then the whole thing will implode.

      Pyramid schemes like Empower Network can't go on forever, by their very nature.
      Tell that to the people who created Amway. It's one of the original pyramid schemes and they're doing pretty good these days
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      • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
        Banned
        Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

        Tell that to the people who created Amway. It's one of the original pyramid schemes
        Not so, Jason. Even if you meant it semi-facetiously, with lots of inverted commas around the words "pyramid schemes", trying to imply that they're not, really.

        AmWay's business has been extensively tested in litigation (on both sides of the Atlantic) and courts have specified - while acknowledging problems with distributor behavior and some of the company's former compensation-plan - that it isn't a pyramid scheme, partly because, unlike EN, it's all based on genuine retail sales to genuine retail customers.

        However, you picked an inconvenient example for yourself, there: if you actually read what courts have concluded, in judgements about AmWay, it would certainly not make you feel happy and confident about Empower Network, because the features of AmWay's business that saved it from being dissolved are features that don't apply to Empower. And even AmWay had to go to court (a few times!).

        Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

        they're doing pretty good these days
        Well, they've been dragged into court often enough by regulators and governments, haven't they? They've certainly weathered a lot of storms and survived (sometimes by the skin of their teeth, it seems) though they've certainly had to make some major changes to their business, over the decades, as a result of court rulings.
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        • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
          Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

          Not so, Jason. Even if you meant it semi-facetiously, with lots of inverted commas around the words "pyramid schemes", trying to imply that they're not, really.

          Well, they've been dragged into court often enough by regulators and governments, haven't they? They've certainly weathered a lot of storms and survived (sometimes by the skin of their teeth, it seems) though they've certainly had to make some major changes to their business, over the decades, as a result of court rulings.
          The only true pyramid schemes I know of were run my Ponzi, Madoff, and still the Federal Reserve

          They've been dragged in and out of court so many times, yet they still do billions of dollars yearly world wide. So far so good.

          You're hair looks "bangin" by the way. Get it? lol
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      • Profile picture of the author Curtis2011
        Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

        Tell that to the people who created Amway. It's one of the original pyramid schemes and they're doing pretty good these days
        Amway sells real physical products, albeit overpriced ones and via an MLM channel that is of questionable ethics.

        Empower Network sells you the ability to sell the network to other people, who then gain the ability to sell the network to other people, who then gain the ability to sell the network to other people... This cannot go on forever.

        Mark my words, Empower Network will implode when it runs out of new customers. The owners will be filthy rich whilst 95% or more of the customers never make their money back. Then, maybe a year later, the owners will introduce a "new and improved" product with a unique spin on it that is just another pyramid scheme, and the show will continue.
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        • Profile picture of the author Chris Silvey
          Originally Posted by Curtis2011 View Post

          A
          Empower Network sells you the ability to sell the network to other people, who then gain the ability to sell the network to other people, who then gain the ability to sell the network to other people... This cannot go on forever.
          I am going to have to borrow this if you dont mind. I might put it up on my twitter background
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        • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
          Originally Posted by Curtis2011 View Post

          Amway sells real physical products, albeit overpriced ones and via an MLM channel that is of questionable ethics.

          Empower Network sells you the ability to sell the network to other people, who then gain the ability to sell the network to other people, who then gain the ability to sell the network to other people... This cannot go on forever.

          Mark my words, Empower Network will implode when it runs out of new customers. The owners will be filthy rich whilst 95% or more of the customers never make their money back. Then, maybe a year later, the owners will introduce a "new and improved" product with a unique spin on it that is just another pyramid scheme, and the show will continue.
          Having been in Amway, they led with the opportunity to make money first, then talked about the products second.

          And while they were great products, they were overpriced a shit ton.

          I miss taking those Double XX multis though
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  • Profile picture of the author Victor Edson
    I know a guy who sells drugs and HE hasn't been arrested, that doesn't mean it's legal or he's not going to get arrested one day if he keeps doing what he's doing.

    EN doesn't sell to end consumers and it pressures their affiliates into purchasing products for fear of losing out on commissions. Saying shit like "Go ALL In" or "Do Whatever You Have to Do to Buy These Products" is a dead simple way to tell if it's legit or not.. Does EN say those types of things?

    If you know it's using those tactics to pressure people into buying their products, then you should also be smart enough to realize that it isn't legal to run a business that way. If it were a legal MLM.. that's what a large majority of people would be saying. But who's making that claim? No one.

    And no one is doubting their ability to sell illegally and profit. Lots of people create 6 & 7 figure businesses illegally. So the argument of "it works" isn't really something that should even be considered. Selling crack works too. That doesn't make it legal.

    The question is only, how long until it's shut down.

    Not if.

    When.

    Remember this... Just because Marketing works, and EN funnels convert... that doesn't make it legal. EN is no different than a weed man who hasn't been busted, yet.

    A big thanks to the mods for not closing this thread.. a lot of new people learn about EN every day and don't understand the difference between a legitimate MLM company and one that uses unethical & illegal business practices.
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    • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
      Originally Posted by Victor Edson View Post

      I know a guy who sells drugs and HE hasn't been arrested, that doesn't mean it's legal or he's not going to get arrested one day if he keeps doing what he's doing.

      EN doesn't sell to end consumers and it pressures their affiliates into purchasing products for fear of losing out on commissions. Saying shit like "Go ALL In" or "Do Whatever You Have to Do to Buy These Products" is a dead simple way to tell if it's legit or not.. Does EN say those types of things?

      If you know it's using those tactics to pressure people into buying their products, then you should also be smart enough to realize that it isn't legal to run a business that way. If it were a legal MLM.. that's what a large majority of people would be saying. But who's making that claim? No one.

      And no one is doubting their ability to sell illegally and profit. Lots of people create 6 & 7 figure businesses illegally. So the argument of "it works" isn't really something that should even be considered. Selling crack works too. That doesn't make it legal.

      The question is only, how long until it's shut down.

      Not if.

      When.

      Remember this... Just because Marketing works, and EN funnels convert... that doesn't make it legal. EN is no different than a weed man who hasn't been busted, yet.

      A big thanks to the mods for not closing this thread.. a lot of new people learn about EN every day and don't understand the difference between a legitimate MLM company and one that uses unethical & illegal business practices.
      Are you a lawyer? You seem to know an awful lot about what is considered legal and illegal.
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      • Profile picture of the author Victor Edson
        Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

        Are you a lawyer? You seem to know an awful lot about what is considered legal and illegal.
        Are you confused about drugs being illegal or what's illegal by law in a MLM company?

        Let me help you..

        I already did the 'hard work' of typing it in Google, and finding a government reference with exactly what you need to know. All you have to read is one paragraph. Here's what the FTC says about Pyramid Schemes:

        "PYRAMID SCHEMES"

        Scroll down to the section: What is a Pyramid Scheme and What is Legitimate Marketing?

        In the first paragraph you'll learn everything they need to know about what makes it legal and illegal. You don't have to read the whole page, I did already.. it's just more information about the struggles of MLM companies like Amway over the years & some more info.

        If the drugs part confused you, here's some interesting info about how well it works
        Illegal drug trade - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

        Estimated 1% of Global Trade... still doesn't make it legal though does it?

        Answer this..

        Do you also have some type of physical evidence that proves your side of the argument or is the only leg you're standing on the fact that you can make money with it?
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        • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
          Originally Posted by Victor Edson View Post

          Answer this..

          Do you also have some type of physical evidence that proves your side of the argument or is the only leg you're standing on the fact that you can make money with it?
          What is my side of the argument? I don't remember. I'm just enjoying watching how riled up some people are getting over something that they shouldn't be getting all riled up over.
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  • Profile picture of the author EPoltrack77
    Dave and Dave will be around for a while, hopefully their authority blog will be as well. I am sure it will be. Two very successful guys so I'm sure they will keep things going. Part of business is change so change might come and probably will but hopefully their fundamentals stay the same. Let me ask you something, Are You All In Or What? lol - Have a great day and thanks for letting me share my input
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  • Profile picture of the author ormabe
    My friend knows someone that is in Empower and has been pressing me to sign up since my unemployment insurance was cut by 11% because of the sequester. I was turned off because of the $60/ month commitment to ensure that I received commissions. It just didn't sit well with me and I felt very uncomfortable going forward. So I followed my first mind and left it alone. That's just my 2 cents as someone that really looked at empower over a few months.
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  • Profile picture of the author excessivemarketing
    I just wanted to put my 2 cents in. I am in empower but I mainly am using it for learning. I have actually made some money from the things I learned in empower. I'm not actively promoting it but do use the products. I do think there are some expensive products but I really like the community and the step by step instructions on what you should do. As I go through these forums I'm learning a lot from other seasoned internet marketers that I can add to it's arsenal.

    As far as people saying it preys on newbies that may be the case but those people are looking for something. Many don't know about the warrior forums or other ways to start learning on how to marketing online. Some will catch on and find other venues to get that information in time but I think it is a good starting block for anyone new to this industry.
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    • Profile picture of the author BobTheBostonian
      Originally Posted by excessivemarketing View Post

      I just wanted to put my 2 cents in. I am in empower but I mainly am using it for learning. I have actually made some money from the things I learned in empower. I'm not actively promoting it but do use the products. I do think there are some expensive products but I really like the community and the step by step instructions on what you should do. As I go through these forums I'm learning a lot from other seasoned internet marketers that I can add to it's arsenal.

      As far as people saying it preys on newbies that may be the case but those people are looking for something. Many don't know about the warrior forums or other ways to start learning on how to marketing online. Some will catch on and find other venues to get that information in time but I think it is a good starting block for anyone new to this industry.
      I'm going to give you a little cheat code: you could take the $25/$50/$60/whatever that you're paying every month, spend that money one time on any $7 rehashed WSO that you want (and just spend that some of money once), and get the same education at the same quality. Without every lesson being a majority pitch for Empower too.

      Or just keep paying a fool's tax. I'm not going to bitch about it: gym memberships are the same deal (fat tax).
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      • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
        Originally Posted by BobTheBostonian View Post

        I'm going to give you a little cheat code: you could take the $25/$50/$60/whatever that you're paying every month, spend that money one time on any $7 rehashed WSO that you want (and just spend that some of money once), and get the same education at the same quality. Without every lesson being a majority pitch for Empower too.

        Or just keep paying a fool's tax. I'm not going to bitch about it: gym memberships are the same deal (fat tax).
        I wouldn't hold much of any $7 WSO in here in the same regard as some of the high level stuff Dave Wood teaches.

        Just the video sales letter in the members area alone he did to sell a $1 trial for their video hosting was mind blowing.

        I gladly paid for all of the products. However, with my experience and mindset, I will turn that investment you call fool's tax into a very healthy return on investment by applying it to all of my income streams.

        Comparing most $7 WSOs to some of the stuff taught in those products is like comparing a KIA Sportage to a Mercedes GL450.

        I can tell the difference and I opted for the GL metaphorically and literally too

        Disclaimer: That's just my humble opinion by the way of course as I'm sure there are some really good $7 WSOs
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      • Profile picture of the author webgenco
        I have to agree with Bob from Boston - spend a few $ on some WSO's on how to create products and start building your own high value network. Recently I bought and recommend this one by Trevor Dumbleton: http://www.warriorforum.com/warrior-...ter-class.html

        and also maybe the best report on how to create info products, it helped me create my first products, many warriors have recommended and used it:

        http://www.warriorforum.com/warrior-...d-version.html

        And how to blog effectively -- there are many great threads here, but I have learned the most from ProBlogger and Copyblogger. All free - Google them. You don't need EN to teach you how to blog.
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  • Profile picture of the author BobTheBostonian
    Comparing most $7 WSOs to some of the stuff taught in those products is like comparing a KIA Sportage to a Mercedes GL450.

    Holy crap, you're totally right: both will get you from point A to point B but the foolish and insecure will blow way more to think that they found the "better" way to get there!

    You don't need EN to teach you how to blog.

    That about covers it.
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    • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
      Originally Posted by BobTheBostonian View Post

      Comparing most $7 WSOs to some of the stuff taught in those products is like comparing a KIA Sportage to a Mercedes GL450.

      Holy crap, you're totally right: both will get you from point A to point B but the foolish and insecure will blow way more to think that they found the "better" way to get there!

      You don't need EN to teach you how to blog.

      That about covers it.
      I don't know man. I really like my GL450. And it was only $30 more per month than the Armada I had before it with $2200 less down. Not bad for a $70K truck I (well my wife mostly) get to drive around in for 2 years. Lease is up in a few months though. Maybe I'll downgrade to a KIA

      Plus the salesmen in higher end dealers don't try to rape you while smiling in your face and telling you what a great deal you're getting lol

      Just sayin...
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  • Profile picture of the author BobTheBostonian
    Plus the salesmen in higher end dealers don't try to rape you while smiling in your face and telling you what a great deal you're getting lol

    It's not as easy to notice the rape when they're distracting you with a smile and a reacharound .

    Just sayin'
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  • Profile picture of the author gmsl
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    • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
      You see what happens when these kind of threads pop up? You have guys like this showing up to promote whatever it is they're in lol

      Bob - I'm more into the Cleveland Steamer personally - so any salesman who does that is getting my money no matter how much

      Originally Posted by gmsl View Post

      To be honest with you I have struggled with Empower as has 90% of the other people that I have spoken with so I have left as well. That's not to say making money with Empower is impossible but not as easy as they make it out to be. If you do not have the knowledge to rank your blog or articles on your blog like the top network marketers are able to do because they got in the beginning you have a extremely difficult task ahead of you. Traffic= Success without traffic to your blog you can blog all day and until your fingers are bony but you won't make a dime because nobody will see your blog. I am promoting another program currently and I have my website and blog ranked on the first page of google for several keywords and get 30-75 people a day to visit it. Those people are targeted and are searching for that keyword and when I do receive a lead it usually is pretty solid and has an excellent chance to convert. This program isn't saturated like Empower and that is the reason I am able to do this.The nice thing about this is this program hasn't gone viral yet so there aren't a lot of people searching yet and I am still getting some nice free traffic. I am doing very well with this program and I have enrolled about 12 people and I am only in the early stages and those 12 people are enrolling people that become part of my downline so I am not only earning commissions from the people I bring in but also from the people my signups bring in and that is only 1 of 7 ways that I can earn income.

      check our video which gives you the basic facts and no selling 3rd party rubbish.

      http://www.mylanderpages.com/bonofac...-bonofa-page_5

      I Hope i give hope to Everyone

      I do have access to the Cube 7 platform. The partners received access on Sunday July 7th to beta test it before it is released to the world on September 22nd. It is amazing. I was able to video chat like Skype with members of my downline. I can send video emails with cool templates in the background. You can do everything that you can do on Facebook plus lots more. Its incredible. Plus they are still going to add Shopping,Gaming, Entertainment and Apps to the platform in the very near future and you will get to invite your friends and they can invite their friends until you build a massive network and the best part they can all join the Cube 7 platform for FREE and you will give them a $80 discount voucher to spend as well. Now anytime one of those friends buy a new pair or jeans or gym shoes, download the latest song, purchases the most popular video game or downloads an app for their mobile device. YOU GET PAID. and that is only 1 of 7 ways you can earn income with Bonofa.

      Ricky
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