My IM Journey....Three Years of Disappointments

128 replies
Hello fellow warriors,

I have joined this forum over six years ago in 2007. And for the last six years I have been on a quest to make a full-time income online. I was so excited about this goal of mine that I even quit my job three years ago in order to finally make this dream of mine a reality!

I thought by working full-time on my goal I will certainly make it in the IM world and make a full-time income!

The sad part is I didn't....:-( I'm at a point now where I have eaten enough into my savings that if I don't find a job soon I will be in dire financial straits.

I was so confident that with three years of savings I would certainly make it online!

I would like to share with you my IM journey the last three years and I would love any suggestions and support as my confidence is now at an all-time low and I have considered throwing in the towel on IM several times now:

-I purchased a number of WSOs making claims of "easy money", "easily make six figures a month", "this one-hidden trick will make you $5,000 a month". And the list goes on and on. None of them delivered on their promise.

-I entered the world of CPA marketing and for a while made some money. But thousands of CPA affiliates were promoting the EXACT same programs I was promoting and before I knew it profits started to dwindle and before I knew it I was facing losses.

-I entered the world of media-buying promoting clickbank products. For a while I did OK and made a profit. Before I knew it thousands of affiliates were promoting the EXACT SAME product I was promoting and using the EXACT SAME banners like me in fact they were using the same banners I was using and my profits started to dwindle.

-I used Facebook Ads to promote affiliate products including WSOs and there were times when I made a bit of money and times I broke even but more often then not I would make a loss. I noticed a lot of people where doing the SAME THING like me.

-I paid for a very expensive solo ad coaching program that promised me the world. I joined an "inner circle" that would make be the best solo-ad seller. I was expecting to make thousands each month. I noticed there are many people selling solo ads and the market is getting saturated. In fact it seems to be selling recycled clicks. Again like with the other projects I was involved this is full of people doing the EXACT SAME THING and selling the EXACT SAME THING.

-I was trained by an IM product development coach and he also promised me the world and said all I had to do was make my own IM product. I did that. I noticed thousands of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING.

-I entered the world of Kindle. And was coached by a Kindle "expert". I was also promised thousands each month. For a while a made a bit of money then a lot of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING I was doing. Soon enough Amazon started cracking down on Kindle as it was flooded with IMers using similar tactics and selling similar stories.

-At one point I was told article marketing was the golden nugget. I did that for a while and invested in a lot of articles. However, my income with article marketing took a significant hit and now is almost non-existent.

-I also tried list-building in a number of niches (IM and others). I noticed the open-rates and click rates are getting lower and lower. I didn't have much success with list-building either.

I'm losing hope as after three years of doing this full time I haven't been able to achieve my objectives. I spent a lot of my savings trying to achieve my dream lifestyle of gaining a full-time income online.

I spent so much time (not 4 hours a week, more like 60 hours a week) trying to build an online business. But nothing was every sustainable or long-term.

This was supposed to be easy. I wasn't suppose to work so hard and make so little. If I knew this was the outcome I might as well have stayed at a paid job.

I beginning to feel this is a game of musical chairs and it is goes round and round. Every now and then you get a seat if you know how to play the game.

I did meet some good folks here though who are extremely helpful and genuinely wanted to help. And it is those people who pointed me in the right direction and I am thankful for that.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

I really want to be able to make a full-time income online and it is not that I want an easy way to get there. I worked very hard the last three years. It is also not because I am cheap and want a free way to get there. I spent over $30,000 in the last three years trying to get there. Just nothing seems to pan out the way I expected it to .

Looking forward to your feedback

Thanks,
Mark
#case study #coaching #disappointments #internet marketing #journeythree #years
  • Profile picture of the author ksummers
    Hi Mark, I'm really sorry to hear you didn't make it in IM. All hope is not lost, however.
    My thoughts on your situation: I make a point never to spend money I haven't earned. A lot of people say "you have to spend money to make money" but that's only true up until a point.
    I'm no expert but it seems like you had a bit of shiny object syndrome. If you had stuck with one way of making money maybe you could have seen it through to success?
    It looks like you have made the right decision for you for now. Maybe when you are settled in your job you can IM on the side using the tools and knowledge you have already purchased. I did it that way around: worked until I was making enough to work be a full time AMer.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      There is one thing consistent in all your experiences and its something I see in IM a lot and is its achille's heel

      Never did you control your own unique product or service.

      I had a job awhile back when I was in college. I did deliveries. It was the worse paying job I have ever had but I got it because it was easy to get. If you had an insured car with a drivers license then you were hired. you were then paid a commission on the delivery

      Problem is the low obstacle to get in was the death of the whole thing. If I could get in with just those requirements then anyone could and soon I realized there were more drivers than jobs.

      IM is the same thing for a lot of people. The product launches give you some technique that tens of thousands have used and will use but with no unique selling proposition you have nothing that stands out. Furthermore a lot of the time that technique really only worked for a few people and for a short time.

      For $30,000 you could have come up with something unique to sell or even hired a programmer to build a very lucrative site that solves a need and makes cash. Buying WSOs will never give you that.
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      • Profile picture of the author jfranchino
        Mark:
        I'd like to capy Oprah Winfrey
        “If you’re constantly pushing yourself higher, higher, the law of averages — not to mention the myth of Icarus — predicts that you will at some point fall. And when you do, I want you to know this, remember this: There is no such thing as failure. Failure is just life trying to move us in another direction.
        All your bad experience is material for an excelent WSO.
        For me your error was believing in recipes
        I recomend you:

        Internet Business Manifesto you can get for free. (this is not an affiliate link)

        You have to have your own products.
        When I finish my next WSO I'd like to receive your review if you like.
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      • Profile picture of the author seonutshell
        Yeh mking your own product is the best way forward. EBook, real life product, service etc is better than getting a percentage, and making someone else rich promoting theres. I mean commisions are feasable if your selling phones etc but if you create a nice ebook that soves problems or makes money, and only sell it for $17, thats 17 dollars every time someone buys it you get me?
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      • Profile picture of the author KenJ
        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        Never did you control your own unique product or service.
        Hi Mark

        Thank you for your honesty. I agree with Mike. You need to find your own way in IM. After 6 years of doing what others say, find your own corner and your own unique selling point. Create an online presence in this corner and stay with it.

        I followed a similar path to you, although I was lucky enough to find a good mentor for my first year, and made money immediately. All my success has been with my own products and that is where you will find your success. I no longer follow the crowd and I do things my own way, even if the clever people say that is wrong.

        The other point to make is about earnings. You need to earn much more with IM for it to be worth you making the jump from employment to running your own business. This is because you will not have a steady income. You will have a bad month in January 2014 like most other marketers online will. So if you are making £20,000 in your job then you need to plan for £40,000 from your online business. This will enable you to control your finances in times of feast or times of famine.

        Good luck in the future

        KenJ
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  • Profile picture of the author Andy Fletcher
    I'm sorry it's taken you 3 years and $30,000 to realise the truth but better than still not getting it.

    You said, "This was supposed to be easy. I wasn't suppose to work so hard and make so little. If I knew this was the outcome I might as well have stayed at a paid job."

    Hopefully you've got over that now because there's no such thing as a free lunch.

    Business. Is. Hard.

    All the things you described doing above sounds like you dabbled in it. Picked up the low hanging fruit while it was easy and never took the time to get really good at one thing. Then when lots of people came for the low hanging fruit there was nothing for you to pick.

    If something is easy it will quickly become saturated.

    Your job is to get good at something that others can't/won't do.

    To illustrate with an example from my own business. I've spent the last 4 years getting really good at launching products. I started before it became the thing everyone was doing but I work hard every day to stay ahead of the curve and keep an advantage.

    Solve other people's problems. Get good at it. Charge for it.

    Don't just jump around from one thing to another looking for the easy way out. It's not there and you'll go mad/broke/both if you try and find it.
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    • Profile picture of the author Tenzho
      I love doing graphic stuff and playing with Photoshop. Hence I started a gig on Fiverr designing ebook covers. Yes, this market is saturated... However, I did make it!

      I'm making consistent income every month... approx $200 a month.

      This is nothing to brag about, but if I get good enough I can change the platform to either Warriorforum or Odesk and charge for more. I could even build a team of graphic designer and outsource all the works, the possibilities are endless!

      I still like to jump on one shiny object to another. But my Fiverr business is already part of my life... They say it took 30 days to form a habit, It is TRUE!! Everyday I just login to my Fiverr account and just deliver my orders automatically without me thinking!! Everything is like automated for me!!

      When something goes wrong, don't blame it on the WSO vendor, Google updates, or the Internet! you are destroying yourself by blaming others or give excuses.

      Find what do you love to do, and it can benefit a certain group of people.

      -Article Writing
      -Graphic Design
      -Banner Design
      -SEO
      -Copywriting
      -Video creating
      -Voice over
      -Web design

      You are NOT a genius, you can't be an expert at Solo-ads, CPA marketing, Kindle Marketing, and Article Marketing at the same time.

      Be the guy who made $10,000 a month writing articles.
      Be the guy who writes a million dollar sales copy
      Be the guy who creates product that sells over a 1,000 copies
      Be the guy who rank #1 on Google for every target keyword

      Treat IM like a business, not a hobby.

      Yes, most field in the IM is very saturated... So do every other jobs and businesses in this world. That is why you need to create a unique selling point for yourself. Why choose you? Why not choose others? My "Unique Selling Point" of my Fiverr ebook cover Gig that stands out from the rest is that I offer UNLIMITED revisions. And my "Unique Selling Point" of my Fiverr Virtual Assistant Gig is that I will record myself doing the work for an hour. There's no other gig I see provides UNLIMITED revisions or a RECORDING of VA job.

      You have to keep innovate yourself if you want to stay at the top of the game. If something goes wrong, don't keep trying the same thing thinking it will work. You need to get feedback and change your strategies.

      Keep INNOVATING to stay at the TOP of your game
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      Code for a Free $5 EXTRA: WSOSPECIAL
      Click Here
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    • Profile picture of the author Kindleismylife
      Originally Posted by Andy Fletcher View Post

      I'm sorry it's taken you 3 years and $30,000 to realise the truth but better than still not getting it.

      You said, "This was supposed to be easy. I wasn't suppose to work so hard and make so little. If I knew this was the outcome I might as well have stayed at a paid job."

      Hopefully you've got over that now because there's no such thing as a free lunch.

      Business. Is. Hard.

      All the things you described doing above sounds like you dabbled in it. Picked up the low hanging fruit while it was easy and never took the time to get really good at one thing. Then when lots of people came for the low hanging fruit there was nothing for you to pick.

      If something is easy it will quickly become saturated.

      Your job is to get good at something that others can't/won't do.

      To illustrate with an example from my own business. I've spent the last 4 years getting really good at launching products. I started before it became the thing everyone was doing but I work hard every day to stay ahead of the curve and keep an advantage.

      Solve other people's problems. Get good at it. Charge for it.

      Don't just jump around from one thing to another looking for the easy way out. It's not there and you'll go mad/broke/both if you try and find it.
      This is spot on.

      As someone who makes his full-time living from Kindle (one of the businesses you have tried) here are my thoughts:

      I read your OP and counted a lot of different new businesses being started within a 3 year time frame.

      I would guesstimate that you spent less than 6 months trying to make each business work. I know that feeling - jumping from one thing to the next.

      But here is the deal - trying a brand new business for 6 months just simply isn't enough time to see results - despite what overhyped sales pages might promise.

      Learning curves are FIERCE in business. Even those product creators who claim X amount of profits in X amount days forget to factor in the fact they ALREADY ARE EXPERTS. If you are doing something for the first time, you are already at a disadvantage for making "fast profits".

      It took me almost a year of writing, rewriting, writing again and then writing once more before I could write something worthy of being sold on Kindle.

      PPC? I have been playing with FB ads for almost 4 years and only NOW am I starting to make them work with my Fiction business.

      One of my most favorite people in the whole world is Floyd "Money" Mayweather. I don't care for his cockiness at times - but he is the #1 highest paid ATHLETE in the world.

      He obviously knows what he is doing.

      He says two things that I have adopted as my mantra.

      1 - "Hard Work. Dedication."

      When I don't want to write, I echo those words.

      2 - "I dedicated myself to the craft."

      A lot of people criticize him because he makes so much and he flaunts it. His response?

      "I didn't steal it. I just dedicated myself to the craft of boxing. I earned it the hard way."

      If you REALLY want to make money online or off, you have to dedicate yourself to your craft.

      What do you want to master?

      SEO?
      PPC?
      Kindle?

      What would you be happy focusing on for the next 5 years straight? What could hold your attention so that you don't get distracted?

      When I realized I wanted to dedicate myself to writing fiction - that is when my entire life changed.

      It wasn't/isn't easy. I can't think of a more challenging thing to do with your life than to be self employed.

      But it is worth it.

      Focus. Dedicate yourself. And the results will follow.
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    • Profile picture of the author wayneh
      Originally Posted by Andy Fletcher View Post

      I'm sorry it's taken you 3 years and $30,000 to realise the truth but better than still not getting it.

      You said, "This was supposed to be easy. I wasn't suppose to work so hard and make so little. If I knew this was the outcome I might as well have stayed at a paid job."

      Hopefully you've got over that now because there's no such thing as a free lunch.

      Business. Is. Hard.

      All the things you described doing above sounds like you dabbled in it. Picked up the low hanging fruit while it was easy and never took the time to get really good at one thing. Then when lots of people came for the low hanging fruit there was nothing for you to pick.

      If something is easy it will quickly become saturated.

      Your job is to get good at something that others can't/won't do.

      To illustrate with an example from my own business. I've spent the last 4 years getting really good at launching products. I started before it became the thing everyone was doing but I work hard every day to stay ahead of the curve and keep an advantage.

      Solve other people's problems. Get good at it. Charge for it.

      Don't just jump around from one thing to another looking for the easy way out. It's not there and you'll go mad/broke/both if you try and find it.
      It seems to me that getting good at one thing is the way to go, work very hard at it. Look at whats working and what isn't and test again and again until you have mastered it. Once that becomes easy you can then add more things to your set of skills (as you don't want to rely on just one thing).
      Hard work and focus are the most important things. Good luck.
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  • Profile picture of the author Devin X
    Banned
    It sounds like you spent too much time consuming and not enough time producing. You also seemed to jump from one thing to another, and jumped ship anytime you noticed that other people were doing what you were doing...rather than adapting and improving. Sounds like you're out, and you're right, it's probably for the best. Farewell and goodbye.
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  • Profile picture of the author efrizzz
    Create some WSO. some WSO creator is the same as broke as you, they are profitting by selling stuff. that is the EXACT way they create some money. and dont forget to put some fancy sales page with the "TITLE: HOW TO MAKE $50000000 a day" I'm sure a lot of newbie will fall for these, I mean try it out. (RINSE and REPEAT) my favorite Quote.
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    • Profile picture of the author Wade Watson
      Well, your tendency to fall into the various "easy money" schemes suggest a need to to follow and followers do not make good entrepreneurs. You will always find those arenas crowded. To succeed on one's own you have to break away from the mindset that probably made you a good employee-- being a follower. A successful entrepreneur isn't a good follower. While you can learn tricks here and there from others most of what will make your business succeed is what you learn from hard experience-- which usually means a good many failures.

      Here's how to get out of those crowded situations. Start with a potential customer and learn what he/she needs, then work back from there. Find ways to creatively apply your IM knowledge to filling a need. No course is going to give you this information. You have to get out there and get it yourself. You have to take the initiative.

      One way to get away from the IM crowd is to concentrate on local ("offline") IM marketing. Every city has new businesses that can benefit from IM marketing work and most of the will pay plenty it. This is what I do and, while it has it's problems, too, it's very lucrative. Anyway, if you think you can't get past the follower mentality, give up and go back to a job. If you're the kind of person who never turns back, rethink your direction and keep going. There's an old saying: "Those who succeed never quit, but those who quit never succeed".
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      • Profile picture of the author Steve B
        Hello Mark,

        Believe it or not, your story is not unlike that of many others who have had dreams of Internet business success. May I make a few observations that seemed to me to be evident as I read your story?

        First, you have tried a lot of different money-making methods over the past three years. I think sometimes we mistakenly feel we need to try multiple methods until we find one that works for us. Occasionally that works, but I think more often than not it leads to "sampling" and "dabbling" on the surface of those methods rather than immersing onself fully into method in order to really give it a chance to work. It's difficult to become an expert at anything when you barely scratch the surface. I've seen Internet businesses that haven't paid off for years as the owner works to gain some traction . . . then all of a sudden it begins to produce.

        Second, it seems to me that you are drawn to promotions that claim to be easy money makers and promises that guarantee 6-figure incomes. My experience has been that such promotions are typically advertising fodder by marketers that are only interested in their own advancement. Stop and think for a moment . . . if IM were easy, why do such a large percentage of entrepreneurs coming online fail? If a 6-figure income could actually be guaranteed, why aren't those coaches or product creators able to show how 100% of their students/users are 6-figure earners?

        Third, it seems that you haven't made an attempt to develop a following and nurture or develop a relationship with your subscribers in the different niches you've been in. At least you didn't talk about that. But how many of the Internet marketing experts talk about the importance of "building a list" to their success?

        Fourth, you never mentioned what niche you're in but I'm guessing you have jumped from one to the next, to the next. I believe most successful people online begin their money making story in one niche. Some never leave that niche their whole career. Others begin and become successful in one thing, then later branch out to others. Rarely do successful people jump to a second niche until they have mastered the first.

        As I have watched the whole Internet small business development world unfold over the past 17 years (that's when I first came online) there have been some common threads running through the history of successful business creators.

        • Typically, they become an expert or an authority in one particular field. They get very good at doing one thing and then they branch out into replicating their success in other things or multiple products in the same niche.
        • Their success is usually not credited to (and the result of) one particular program, one piece of software, one WSO, or one singular event. They become successful as people who have learned how to make offers and sell things.
        • Usually those who become the authority in a niche do so because they work harder, stay longer, sacrifice more, and are consistent in how they treat their customers. They provide quality products or services that others want and are asking for.
        • Most take full responsibility for their own success or failure. It's not the courses or products they bought that are the reason they succeeded or failed. They admit that they are the sole responsible party in their own business career.

        I hope you find success in the future, whether in Internet Marketing or some other profession.

        Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author Devid Farah
      Hey mark,

      well, you listed a LOT of different ways to make money online. Seems that you tried em all.

      My question is, how much time you dedicated for each and every method?

      Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

      I was trained by an IM product development coach and he also promised me the world and said all I had to do was make my own IM product. I did that. I noticed thousands of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING.
      And so what? Sorry but this is absolute nonsense to me. Every product is "original". Dont get intimidated by the fact that there are thousands of people out there doing the same thing.

      They dont sell the EXACT SAME THING. Your ebook, software, video product wont be EXACTLY like the many others out there. And am not talking about PLR, MRR or RR stuff but your own product that you create by yourself or hiring a ghostwriter.

      Plus, I dont know what you did but product creation is a HUUUGE process and if you have been involved with it it takes time, dedication, and its HARD WORK. Pretty much everything you listed requires TIME and DEDICATION. The problem is that if you don't stick with ONE thing at a time(lets say kindle) and wait the right time to get results (or become really "expert" at it) you get super attracted by so many things in a way that you get totally distracted from the bigger picture and go off in tangents instead of remaining focused on the goal.(making money with kindle).

      You get so attracted by "the new thing" in a way that you end up spending countless hours and money on it(like in your case $30,000) and you probably dont even know if its the right thing for your business.

      What i perceived from your post is that you didnt stay focused on one method but jumped from one thing to another. This is one of the reasons most people fail miserably.

      Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

      I also tried list-building in a number of niches (IM and others). I noticed the open-rates and click rates are getting lower and lower. I didn't have much success with list-building either.
      Again, how much time you dedicated on this? You said you tried a number of niches and this is probably the reason you failed. There are plenty of markets; internet marketing/make money online, health, finance, dating, fitness, weight loss... You should pickup ONE market and become an expert at it.

      Again, dont get intimidated by the latest gmail update; email marketing will always work. You need to focus on creating a reputation for yourself and providing content, stuff that engages people and make em interested in reading your stuff and wanting more.

      Plus, how many subscribers did you get? Did you dedicate the right time to drive enough traffic to build a list of 3k/5k subscribers? Probably not.

      Its funny because you picked up 2 of the best methods to earn a living online; product creation and list building. They are linked together btw.

      Look the game is simple; you need to sell dude. Become a vendor, a product creation expert or offer services, freelance work, consulting...sell on Fiverr...

      You need to understand what you really want now. Mindset plays a huge role.
      And don't worry if you fail sometimes. You MUST experience failure in order to be successful. Just learn by your mistakes and always take action.

      Best of luck
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    • Profile picture of the author propanther
      Originally Posted by efrizzz View Post

      Create some WSO. some WSO creator is the same as broke as you, they are profitting by selling stuff. that is the EXACT way they create some money. and dont forget to put some fancy sales page with the "TITLE: HOW TO MAKE $50000000 a day" I'm sure a lot of newbie will fall for these, I mean try it out. (RINSE and REPEAT) my favorite Quote.
      This sounds like taking advantage of the newbie's. That's not the way to build a business encouraging unethical practice. If you can't give good advice please don't post anything.
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  • Profile picture of the author DTGeorge
    Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

    Hello fellow warriors,

    I have joined this forum over six years ago in 2007. And for the last six years I have been on a quest to make a full-time income online. I was so excited about this goal of mine that I even quit my job three years ago in order to finally make this dream of mine a reality!

    I thought by working full-time on my goal I will certainly make it in the IM world and make a full-time income!

    The sad part is I didn't....:-( I'm at a point now where I have eaten enough into my savings that if I don't find a job soon I will be in dire financial straits.

    I was so confident that with three years of savings I would certainly make it online!

    I would like to share with you my IM journey the last three years and I would love any suggestions and support as my confidence is now at an all-time low and I have considered throwing in the towel on IM several times now:

    -I purchased a number of WSOs making claims of "easy money", "easily make six figures a month", "this one-hidden trick will make you $5,000 a month". And the list goes on and on. None of them delivered on their promise.

    -I entered the world of CPA marketing and for a while made some money. But thousands of CPA affiliates were promoting the EXACT same programs I was promoting and before I knew it profits started to dwindle and before I knew it I was facing losses.

    -I entered the world of media-buying promoting clickbank products. For a while I did OK and made a profit. Before I knew it thousands of affiliates were promoting the EXACT SAME product I was promoting and using the EXACT SAME banners like me in fact they were using the same banners I was using and my profits started to dwindle.

    -I used Facebook Ads to promote affiliate products including WSOs and there were times when I made a bit of money and times I broke even but more often then not I would make a loss. I noticed a lot of people where doing the SAME THING like me.

    -I paid for a very expensive solo ad coaching program that promised me the world. I joined an "inner circle" that would make be the best solo-ad seller. I was expecting to make thousands each month. I noticed there are many people selling solo ads and the market is getting saturated. In fact it seems to be selling recycled clicks. Again like with the other projects I was involved this is full of people doing the EXACT SAME THING and selling the EXACT SAME THING.

    -I was trained by an IM product development coach and he also promised me the world and said all I had to do was make my own IM product. I did that. I noticed thousands of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING.

    -I entered the world of Kindle. And was coached by a Kindle "expert". I was also promised thousands each month. For a while a made a bit of money then a lot of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING I was doing. Soon enough Amazon started cracking down on Kindle as it was flooded with IMers using similar tactics and selling similar stories.

    -At one point I was told article marketing was the golden nugget. I did that for a while and invested in a lot of articles. However, my income with article marketing took a significant hit and now is almost non-existent.

    -I also tried list-building in a number of niches (IM and others). I noticed the open-rates and click rates are getting lower and lower. I didn't have much success with list-building either.

    I'm losing hope as after three years of doing this full time I haven't been able to achieve my objectives. I spent a lot of my savings trying to achieve my dream lifestyle of gaining a full-time income online.

    I spent so much time (not 4 hours a week, more like 60 hours a week) trying to build an online business. But nothing was every sustainable or long-term.

    This was supposed to be easy. I wasn't suppose to work so hard and make so little. If I knew this was the outcome I might as well have stayed at a paid job.

    I beginning to feel this is a game of musical chairs and it is goes round and round. Every now and then you get a seat if you know how to play the game.

    I did meet some good folks here though who are extremely helpful and genuinely wanted to help. And it is those people who pointed me in the right direction and I am thankful for that.

    Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

    I really want to be able to make a full-time income online and it is not that I want an easy way to get there. I worked very hard the last three years. It is also not because I am cheap and want a free way to get there. I spent over $30,000 in the last three years trying to get there. Just nothing seems to pan out the way I expected it to .

    Looking forward to your feedback

    Thanks,
    Mark
    There is one thing that stands out to me here in what you're saying:

    Lack of focus and understanding what you're good at.

    It's like me, who's all of 5'7, going to a basketball coach and expecting him to make me an NBA star.

    I'm not saying that it's impossible but my effort would almost certainly be better spent doing something I'm good at as opposed to something I can make money on.

    You tried a number of niches - why? Because they were allegedly profitable and successful?

    What other people make money doing will have little bearing on what you should be doing to make money.

    Figure out what you do well and then build on your knowledge and skills. Figure out how to get your product/service to the highest possible amount of people. Differentiate your offerings so that you have a unique selling point.

    Personally I like offering services because they cost little to nothing to produce yet can make money when priced and marketed correctly.

    Try your hand at freelance writing (I'm not talking about the 1 cent per word crap either)

    Learn wordpress and set up simple sites for people.

    These two methods can make you money within 24 hours - although if you do it right then you'll take a bit longer to learn and set up a business that will generate greater profits.
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  • Profile picture of the author Will Edwards
    Hi Mark

    I started my project back in 2003 but was not at all serious about it in the first year. I made exactly $29 in commission through 1 sale. But that sale made me see the potential so I began seriously in 2004. It took me seven years of solid effort after that to build up my income to a level where I was prepared to quit the day job - that was about 2 years ago.

    So, yes ... there is no question that you can do it. But, you need to stop chasing those 'get rich quick' schemes. Believe me (and I don't wish to be unkind here) the only reason they exist is because there are people looking for them.

    Making money is indeed easy but it is NOT easy at the start. In order for it to become easy, you need systems and processes in place that will generate targeted traffic and then send it to related offers. But you need to build those systems and processes and that's where all the hard work is. As some wise person once said,

    "It took me 10 years to become an overnight success."

    Or, as Samuel Goldwyn put it,

    "The harder I work, the luckier I get."

    Yes - it IS hard work - a lot of really hard work before you get to go to the beach and let the money come rolling in of its own accord. That's not what you have been reading on those 'get rich quick' sales pages. But it is the truth.

    My advice to you is to read everything you can about how to generate targeted traffic. Actually, that is really step 2. Step 1 is to decide upon the niche you are best equipped to serve. But when you have those 2 things in place:

    1. A tightly defined niche you can serve that is already buying online
    2. The ability to get leads (targeted traffic)

    ... you will be off to the races.

    Just one more thing: as I mentioned here ...

    http://www.warriorforum.com/mind-war...n-succeed.html

    ... the decision you make right now is what is going to make the difference.

    Good luck,

    Will
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    • Profile picture of the author fmolina2010
      Originally Posted by Will Edwards View Post

      Hi Mark

      I started my project back in 2003 but was not at all serious about it in the first year. I made exactly $29 in commission through 1 sale. But that sale made me see the potential so I began seriously in 2004. It took me seven years of solid effort after that to build up my income to a level where I was prepared to quit the day job - that was about 2 years ago.

      So, yes ... there is no question that you can do it. But, you need to stop chasing those 'get rich quick' schemes. Believe me (and I don't wish to be unkind here) the only reason they exist is because there are people looking for them.

      Making money is indeed easy but it is NOT easy at the start. In order for it to become easy, you need systems and processes in place that will generate targeted traffic and then send it to related offers. But you need to build those systems and processes and that's where all the hard work is. As some wise person once said,

      "It took me 10 years to become an overnight success."

      Or, as Samuel Goldwyn put it,

      "The harder I work, the luckier I get."

      Yes - it IS hard work - a lot of really hard work before you get to go to the beach and let the money come rolling in of its own accord. That's not what you have been reading on those 'get rich quick' sales pages. But it is the truth.

      My advice to you is to read everything you can about how to generate targeted traffic. Actually, that is really step 2. Step 1 is to decide upon the niche you are best equipped to serve. But when you have those 2 things in place:

      1. A tightly defined niche you can serve that is already buying online
      2. The ability to get leads (targeted traffic)

      ... you will be off to the races.

      Just one more thing: as I mentioned here ...

      http://www.warriorforum.com/mind-war...n-succeed.html

      ... the decision you make right now is what is going to make the difference.

      Good luck,

      Will
      Great advice Will. I myself can learn from this. Thank you.


      Hi Mark. I hope you don't mind me sharing my perspective of this situation of yours.

      I'm not sure if you've heard of the "scarcity mindset". When you believe that there is not enough resources for everyone, that's the scarcity mindset. Now I understand since you've spent the past 3 years and $30,000 with, according to you, no success.

      However, try to think about it, having tried what you've tried these past 3 years surely enough you have learned a lot of things about IM, is that right?

      The flood of advice and "you can still do it" posts on here are amazing and majority of them point to a common theme - find a part of IM that you are good at, establish yourself there and build your own product.

      Just take a break for a few days, let your thoughts settle in and decide if you'd like to give this another, more laser-like focus the second time around. Good luck, may success come to you.
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  • Profile picture of the author yonks
    Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

    Looking forward to your feedback
    Hi Mark,

    This is actually my first post here on the Warrior Forum.

    Instead of providing feedback, I'll do something slightly different. I'll ask a question ...

    Over the last 3-6 years what value have you provided to the internet?

    I'm a firm believer that in order to get decently compensated within life, value must be provided (normally more value than what you are being compensated for ... especially on the front end).

    Cheers,
    ~~Yonks
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  • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
    Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

    Hello fellow warriors,

    I have joined this forum over six years ago in 2007. And for the last six years I have been on a quest to make a full-time income online. I was so excited about this goal of mine that I even quit my job three years ago in order to finally make this dream of mine a reality!
    Well, at least you're learning some very important lessons. As a former financial planner, if you were my client I would have advised you not to quit your job, even with the amount of savings that you had. Starting a new business is risky, no matter what some people say.

    I thought by working full-time on my goal I will certainly make it in the IM world and make a full-time income!

    The sad part is I didn't....:-( I'm at a point now where I have eaten enough into my savings that if I don't find a job soon I will be in dire financial straits.
    Finding a job should be your number 1 priority right now.

    I was so confident that with three years of savings I would certainly make it online!

    I would like to share with you my IM journey the last three years and I would love any suggestions and support as my confidence is now at an all-time low and I have considered throwing in the towel on IM several times now:

    -I purchased a number of WSOs making claims of "easy money", "easily make six figures a month", "this one-hidden trick will make you $5,000 a month". And the list goes on and on. None of them delivered on their promise.
    I would like to take this offline with you as there's no way we could cover this one topic in this thread. I would like to see how much time and effort was put into one of these WSOs and what they were.

    -I entered the world of CPA marketing and for a while made some money. But thousands of CPA affiliates were promoting the EXACT same programs I was promoting and before I knew it profits started to dwindle and before I knew it I was facing losses.
    If you were making some money, why did you stop? Did you test other offers? What kind of traffic were you getting and where from?

    -I entered the world of media-buying promoting clickbank products. For a while I did OK and made a profit. Before I knew it thousands of affiliates were promoting the EXACT SAME product I was promoting and using the EXACT SAME banners like me in fact they were using the same banners I was using and my profits started to dwindle.
    You're learning some very valuable lessons and you are very close to getting what you want. It looks like to me when your profits start to dwindle you get discouraged, quit, and jump onto something else.

    -I used Facebook Ads to promote affiliate products including WSOs and there were times when I made a bit of money and times I broke even but more often then not I would make a loss. I noticed a lot of people where doing the SAME THING like me.
    Show me your marketing funnels. Without seeing this and how you were promoting them it's difficult to make any kind of assessment.

    -I paid for a very expensive solo ad coaching program that promised me the world. I joined an "inner circle" that would make be the best solo-ad seller. I was expecting to make thousands each month. I noticed there are many people selling solo ads and the market is getting saturated. In fact it seems to be selling recycled clicks. Again like with the other projects I was involved this is full of people doing the EXACT SAME THING and selling the EXACT SAME THING.
    Hard to comment on this without knowing what the offer was and what specific actions you took.

    -I was trained by an IM product development coach and he also promised me the world and said all I had to do was make my own IM product. I did that. I noticed thousands of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING.
    And thousands more are doing it and yet are succeeding at it. There's one red flag that I'm noticing here and that is you keep on repeating that someone "promised me the world".

    Did any of these programs have any kind of guarantee?

    -I entered the world of Kindle. And was coached by a Kindle "expert". I was also promised thousands each month. For a while a made a bit of money then a lot of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING I was doing. Soon enough Amazon started cracking down on Kindle as it was flooded with IMers using similar tactics and selling similar stories.
    No, Amazon only cracks down on people who use PLR or violate any of their rules. Granted, you might have been doing something they didn't like because you were following someone else's advice. But plenty of people are making money with Kindle.

    -At one point I was told article marketing was the golden nugget. I did that for a while and invested in a lot of articles. However, my income with article marketing took a significant hit and now is almost non-existent.
    Article marketing stills works, but if you're referring to submitting articles to directories, that stopped working a long time ago.

    -I also tried list-building in a number of niches (IM and others). I noticed the open-rates and click rates are getting lower and lower. I didn't have much success with list-building either.
    You're doing something wrong, list building still works...in a lot of niches.

    I'm losing hope as after three years of doing this full time I haven't been able to achieve my objectives. I spent a lot of my savings trying to achieve my dream lifestyle of gaining a full-time income online.

    I spent so much time (not 4 hours a week, more like 60 hours a week) trying to build an online business. But nothing was every sustainable or long-term.

    This was supposed to be easy. I wasn't suppose to work so hard and make so little. If I knew this was the outcome I might as well have stayed at a paid job.
    It's easy for people to come into this thread and put 100% of the blame on you; I'm NOT one of them. There are a lot of empty promises in this industry and after reading a bunch of hyperbole, testimonials, and having people tell you how "easy" or "simple" it is, then you have unrealistic expectations when you first come in.

    Unfortunately you have paid a pretty high price in terms of money and time to learn a very valuable lesson:

    Starting a business is not easy.

    Every successful marketer that I know worked their asses off, in some cases, for many years. So you don't want to quit now. You've got to learn from what you've done already.

    I beginning to feel this is a game of musical chairs and it is goes round and round. Every now and then you get a seat if you know how to play the game.

    I did meet some good folks here though who are extremely helpful and genuinely wanted to help. And it is those people who pointed me in the right direction and I am thankful for that.

    Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

    I really want to be able to make a full-time income online and it is not that I want an easy way to get there. I worked very hard the last three years. It is also not because I am cheap and want a free way to get there. I spent over $30,000 in the last three years trying to get there. Just nothing seems to pan out the way I expected it to .

    Looking forward to your feedback

    Thanks,
    Mark
    Mark, I know you and have talked to you before. I'm going to do something that I rarely do. I just sent you a PM with my Skype ID. Let's get together for about an hour. I have nothing to sell you.

    If you're serious about this then what we need to do is take a look at what you're currently doing and see what's missing in your business plan.

    RoD
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  • Profile picture of the author Joe Lumbergh
    well the experience you got will last forever. keep on it
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Kohler
    Hi Mark,

    I am sorry to hear about your experience. I have heard many people state that after trying something the "new strategy" becomes oversaturated or things change on the Internet and problems occur.

    My only piece of advice that might be helpful is creating your own product. I know this might seem like old advice, but here is my take on it.

    An example would be the exercise industry. People come out with "new" techniques and machines every year. But people still buy them, especially in the very competitive markets. The key is to be on top of the pyramid, so to speak. When you have your own product or products, then everyone else is worrying about how to market it, the changes on Google, Facebook, etc.

    You just have to create the product one time and you are able to avoid these changes. Plus, you are using the "same thing" strategy to your advantage by taking advantage of "herd mentality". I think it is the only strategy that keeps any of us from all that you discussed above.

    Anyway, hope that helps. Don't give up. You have learned far too much to quit now.
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  • Profile picture of the author preets
    I noticed that you have used word " EXACT SAME" 9 times in your post . This is the main reason of your failure because you dont want to do EXACT SAME things as others doing to make money.

    Famous quote " Winners don't do different things , they do things differently"

    Cheers
    Preeti
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  • Profile picture of the author royalgalaxy
    hey bro listen... Internet Marketing is not like one man show business, first you need is a mentor who can guide you... and Most important is you should never ever quit job and then try IM...thats not possible.... IF you dont like to do paid job... then you can create your own site and make your own ebooks and sell...within 4 months you can earn in millions..if you do SEO properly. apart from that you can create your own blog keep adsense in it and attract people...making site and have a personal blog will give you good amount of $ after some years as a backup income ...
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  • Profile picture of the author mariof
    Mark,

    I saw you have many successes under your belt. The fact that you were able to navigate PPC and facebook and profit is great. Now just expand on what you learned.

    That's the only mistake I see you make "Giving Up Too Early".

    Your actually ahead of 70% of marketers.

    Cheers,
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    • Profile picture of the author hometutor
      The first thing I noticed was no sig file

      Do you have a website?

      Now onto the serious questions.

      What makes you Mark?

      What do you love?

      What do people ask you about all the time because of your expertise?

      What do you absolutely wish you could do for a full time living?

      That's your unique niche! I'm not saying other people won't be in it, but you're an expert. There not competition!

      Go with that and go with God.

      Rick
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      • Profile picture of the author discrat
        Originally Posted by hometutor View Post

        Go with that and go with God.
        Rick
        Hey Rick,
        Thank you as it is very refreshing to see 'God' mentioned by people these days
        Personally, I wish people used it more in everyday conversation !
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        • Profile picture of the author TanM
          Hi Mark,

          As most people said here, "don't give up", but always look for new ideas or opportunities. All the best.

          Cheers,
          Tan
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  • Profile picture of the author Fazal Mayar
    I have been in IM for 3 years too and I have learn from my mistakes and I have up'd my game this time. You need to have a solid strategy. Online marketing is about having a strategy. For an example, most of the time you need to do keyword researching and that's how you can develop a strategy.

    Don't put all eggs in one basket, yes you have tried different strategies but there is a reason why it doesn't work. It's like bodybuidling, you can lift for 10 years but have no results.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ripster
    @OP, it sucks to hear you story but becoming successful online is a lot harder than the gurus make it seem.

    I would suggest that you start looking for part-time job and continue working online on the side. Or just find a full time one.
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  • Profile picture of the author Lewis T
    Personally, it seems like you switched between one thing and another too quickly. Whatever worked for you in the past, keep at that and you'll get out what you put in. That of course will only happen if you don't keep chasing the "Make a $$$Million$$$ in a month". Aim for a realistic goal and build it up, you can still earn more than the average national statistic for the average salary in the U.S and UK.
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  • Profile picture of the author benzwm02
    None of those attempts really solved a problem or 'found the pain' that would allow someone to give you his/her money for a solution. These attempts you have more or less were just ways someone else found a problem first and then taught you some of the marketing tactics he/she was doing.

    If you want to make a real online business you are going to have to sell or deliver something that someone really needs. The internet doesn't need another Clickbank ab product or 'How to get your ex back" ebook unless there is truly something unique no one else is doing in it.
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      Originally Posted by Rod Cortez View Post

      And thousands more are doing it and yet are succeeding at it. There's one red flag that I'm noticing here and that is you keep on repeating that someone "promised me the world".

      RoD
      Rod, what makes you think that the thousands doing the "EXACT SAME" things as Mark are having any more success with them than he had? It may be that (actually, it's highly likely that) there are thousands more 'Marks' out there all busily copying each other and wondering where the easy money is.

      Beyond that, you've made a generous offer and I hope Mark takes you up on it.
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      • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
        Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

        Rod, what makes you think that the thousands doing the "EXACT SAME" things as Mark are having any more success with them than he had? It may be that (actually, it's highly likely that) there are thousands more 'Marks' out there all busily copying each other and wondering where the easy money is.

        Beyond that, you've made a generous offer and I hope Mark takes you up on it.
        Nothing. That wasn't the point I was making. I wasn't clear though; I meant that there are thousands of others who are doing the same thing in terms of creating their own products and marketing them and are having success with it. That's the specific point I was addressing from his own bullet point.

        I didn't mean that they were doing the "exact same thing". And I doubt that very much as I've yet to meet two marketers who do the "exact same thing"...way too many variables in this business which is why I'm asking Mark to go offline with me so I can find out more specifics.

        Yes, there are thousands just like Mark who are hitting the wall and the majority of them quit. And the reasons for that are way too many to really flesh out there. But many other Warriors have already touched upon some of them.

        My counterpoint to Mark's was that there are people who are succeeding at all of the things that he's tried, there's something missing in his approach and suspect part of it stems from:

        1. He bought into the hype and he really expected this to be "easy".

        2. He jumped around, possibly not giving any one method (or business) enough time to really build any momentum.

        RoD
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    • Profile picture of the author pickeringmt
      Hey,
      One of my only big goals in life is to succeed as an internet entrepreneur. I am just getting started, and even though I feel like I have learned a lot over the last few months I realize that I still don't have a clue.

      But I am working on it- every day.

      I just wanted to thank every single person that posted on this thread. This was a real eye-opener, and I really appreciate having the chance to read this.

      Thanks
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  • Profile picture of the author DeanJames
    Mark, I sympathise to an extent but your mindset is wrong my friend. All this "They promised me the world" stuff defers the responsibility for success (in your eyes) to those that promise you something which never became your reality (yet). YOU are responsible for your success - nobody else. Nobody. No system, no guru, no buddy marketer, course, program or ebook.

    You are going into things subconsciously expecting to fail. Sure, I know your conscious mind wants to be a great success online and to make it all work, but your subconscious mind is annihilating you my friend.

    Reset your mindset and THEN take action... consistent applied action and focus... and you will SUCCEED. But you have to want it and I mean REALLY want it! In your mind nothing can stop you - that's the level you have to be at.

    For one second do not fall for the notion of any of it being 'easy'. Sure it's easier at the top, just like it is standing at the top of a castle when it has been built. But when you're at the bottom you have to build it one brick at a time even when it looks nothing like a castle! Even when everyone around you thinks your chances of building that castle are slim to none... But you know better. That fire deep inside of you carried the vision through.

    Without it you're dust man. Seriously.

    Don't give up - even if you go back to work carry on with it in your spare time, but PLEASE... please.. don't keep 'TRYING' the latest and greatest fad/system/loophole.

    You need to make a decision and STICK with it like glue on a windshield.
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  • Profile picture of the author wolfe655
    I really don't know what to tell you here except that I was into this about 4 years ago. I did it for about 2 years so I started about 6 years ago. I quit about 4 years ago to start a trucking business with my Dad. I started back into IM to get out of that truck. I have been back at it for a couple of months and have not really done a lot yet but I have learned a lot. I bought a few select WSO's from a few select marketers and I have everything I need right there to get up and running.

    In the past I bought a lot of crap that just rehashed the basics and promised millions. It doesn't work that way. You will not get rich overnight but you can make fairly good money in a fairly short time if you do it right. I like to come here and read posts but I get hung up on it and a lot of times don't get anything done. You can get overloaded on information and strategies. You have to get good at one or 2 things and go with it for a while.

    I am thinking of a membership site in a non IM niche. I am going to concentrate on great content and great tutorials and building an e-mail list and driving traffic to that list. on the website I am just going to provide great content. I am not going to worry to much about SEO now or even getting a high ranking in Google. I just want to drive traffic to that list and get them to join my site for 10 or 15 bucks a month.

    I think you need to get a little plan like that and go for it a little at a time. This will not happen overnight for me or you but if it works out who knows where it will be in a year or 2.

    My little membership site think about it. I still need to get the site running. Could be a month before I open it to my list. Say during that time I have built my list to 1000 which can be done. Now I open the site to my list at $10 a month and get 100 to join right away that is $1000 a month right away Just keep working to build it. If in 2 or 3 years if I have 1000 members that's 10 grand a month. Not bad. Now I have quit my job and have time to work on other things besides this site. I am not counting on it but I know it is defiantly possible. Thing is you have to stick with something that is working and improve on it. I think if it is not working after a week or 2 it is not time to jump ship it is time to figure out why. I just read on this forum I think a guy said he was a low signup rate to his list. He changed from a squeeze page with a sign up box to a squeeze page that had a pop in sign up box. It pops in after the page being up for so long. His sign up rate went way up from what he said.

    Well just my .02!
    Scott
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  • Profile picture of the author TeamBringIt
    Get a job now! You can still do IM, but need to start making some money, before you go broke. IM is never easy and it takes lots of hard work and a system to make money. You have the experience, choose one thing and work at it. All those elements that you mentioned are making money for people.

    What separates them from you, is that they keep testing things, till they work and become profitable. Some people have failed, for a lot longer and have become successful. Don't give up, stop buying everything that promises wealth.

    My fav quote "Become a producer and not a consumer". Thing can turn around for you, you just gotta focus and not chase every new product/system that comes out.

    You mentioned, that you were mentored. Get the materials and trainings, for that specific mentoring and give it one more try. Create our own product and start selling it. If you do anything else from now, till end of the year...create your products and start selling em.

    Honestly, that's how majority of the big earners do it, there is no secret...Selling makes money and not buying...

    Whatever you do, never quit!
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  • Profile picture of the author wolfe655
    One thing I forgot to put in my post. You don't need to be buying any more stuff but if you follow Bill Hugall and Alex Jeffries at least IMHO they have some great stuff out there right now. Good informative solid stuff and it definitely will not break the bank.
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  • Profile picture of the author dgiles63
    Frankly most every system leaves out important steps. Check into Marlon Sanders dashboards. They are the only systems I have found that go over every step. IM me if you need a link.

    Little steps are like little hinges and can change the results substantially. Most people don't measure the results so they can't make the little changes that make the big differences. Then they jump to other things before the magic happens.

    I did all of the things that you listed, and was only mildly successful. Then I learned to build on the successes. The biggest changes were little things in the covers of my ebooks, a few words in my sales pages, but the biggest was just finding a lot of affiliates that would sell my products and that had great products that I could sell to my list.
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  • Profile picture of the author doggerel
    I can tell you exactly where you messed up.

    When other marketers see that their system is being over exploited and run over, they switch from being do-ers to teachers. That's when they release the WSO and the coaching and teaching program. That's when they share all of their secrets.

    Next time you see the money dwindling and the market being saturated, pull out and start coaching and teaching right quick.
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  • Profile picture of the author misshang
    Hi, Mark

    Have you found any specific field of IM that you love? Stick to you love to do will lessen your frustration.

    Can you leverage your online experience to help offline business that needs them? There are lots of mom and dad shops need online exposure.

    I believe you can save people 3 years from your experience and it's quite valuable, what do you think?
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  • Profile picture of the author clever7
    You have to find a job and work online part time. You are not the only one who didn't manage to have a regular income. Many people are in such position because they go from one money-making method to another.

    You have to find something you know well and you like, and is also in demand.

    Stop spending money online and do everything you can to make some money without spending anything. Offer your services, use free platforms like Blogger and also platforms that pay you to create pages like Squidoo, Hub pages and Zujava to make some money, but you cannot depend on them. Use them to drive traffic to your pages and have this income stream.

    Write ebooks about your personal experiences for Kindle.

    Stick with one method until you will learn everything about it. Then, find something else that may help you, and is related to your main niche.

    Make combinations. Promote your CPA offers at your blog, along with affiliate products.

    Try to be original and have your personal style.





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  • Profile picture of the author BurtL
    You've made money in quite a bit of ventures you've tried, so what you've learned definitely works. The problem lies in the fact that you give up too soon.

    Once you notice your numbers drop, you quit and move on to something else.

    Find out why profits fall, then try to fix it first before giving up.

    No business in the world has growth every day/month/year. There's always going to be ups and downs.
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  • Profile picture of the author John F Kennedy
    Mark,

    You write with great intellect and yet your answer to what you seek, you refer to many times: "EXACT SAME THING"

    When something is proven to work, it is the "EXACT SAME THING" that you need to be doing, only add your own spin and you're in the money.

    If you haven't been able to make a sustainable income for yourself list building then quite simply, you're doing it wrong.

    First and foremost, it's people's personalities that we buy then the product. You're clearly a smart guy and yet you have missed it even though it's staring right at you.

    I suggest going back to basics:

    1) Build a capture page around a product
    2) Capture emails
    3) Become an attractive character (you have this already, you got me interested!)
    4) Nurture your list, connect with them on their level, not yours
    5) Be yourself even if that means offending and losing half your subscribers (you don't want them anyway)
    6) Provide them with more value than you make from them
    7) Give your list stuff for free even if it costs you money
    8) Promote products of value not crap!
    9) Rinse and repeat...
    10) The biggest one of all, believe in yourself (without that, you're dead already)

    When done correctly, this will not fail

    Also.... submerse yourself in this book everyday:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VadExa-5PWc

    Good luck Mark!

    Remember......you have only failed if you give up
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  • Profile picture of the author DeanJames
    Mark, I was thinking about what you wrote earlier. I want to offer you these words of encouragement, "The Past Is Not Your Future".

    Just because you have failed prior to now, doesn't mean you can't have massive success, but you've taken more than a few knocks - battle scars, if you will. Don't let them hold you back, just dust yourself off and instead of following courses, wso's etc just do this one thing...

    START looking at what successful people are doing. NOT what they are saying.

    Model those people. Do what they are doing because it's working for them. Sure, you won't know what's going on at the backend so you may have to even go through their funnels but you can reverse engineer pretty much any business model online that isn't high barrier to entry.

    By doing this you are nailing the target much more securely than following the next great thing that is being recommended to you.

    Up until now you have been an internet marketers dream. You've spent thousands of dollars and you've got trapped in the buying cycle. When results haven't appeared as you expected, you've jumped ship and bought the next product. It's important to recognise you are following this pattern of behavior because you are very likely to repeat it unless it truly dawns on you what folly it is.

    There are people out there that can put their fingers in many pies and do very well, but most people that achieve success develop laser focus and stick to one thing until it hits paydirt. I will give you one caveat here and say don't follow ONE thing if it's a loophole or something relying on a 3rd party platform that can wipe you out overnight. Build contingency into what you are doing where possible.

    Really work on your mindset though it definitely needs fine tuning. Instead of spending all that money on courses buy books like "Think and Grow Rich" and spend your time in the company of successful people (in books). In real life bottom line what people are doing, not what they are saying.

    Not many people will tell you this because, well quite frankly they want you to keep buying products and earning them commissions/sales. But after several years it's your turn to break out.

    Go back to work for a while if you have to and then come back stronger than ever. Good luck man!
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    • Profile picture of the author John F Kennedy
      Originally Posted by DeanJames View Post

      Mark, I was thinking about what you wrote earlier. I want to offer you these words of encouragement, "The Past Is Not Your Future".

      Just because you have failed prior to now, doesn't mean you can't have massive success, but you've taken more than a few knocks - battle scars, if you will. Don't let them hold you back, just dust yourself off and instead of following courses, wso's etc just do this one thing...

      START looking at what successful people are doing. NOT what they are saying.

      Model those people. Do what they are doing because it's working for them. Sure, you won't know what's going on at the backend so you may have to even go through their funnels but you can reverse engineer pretty much any business model online that isn't high barrier to entry.

      By doing this you are nailing the target much more securely than following the next great thing that is being recommended to you.

      Up until now you have been an internet marketers dream. You've spent thousands of dollars and you've got trapped in the buying cycle. When results haven't appeared as you expected, you've jumped ship and bought the next product. It's important to recognise you are following this pattern of behavior because you are very likely to repeat it unless it truly dawns on you what folly it is.

      There are people out there that can put their fingers in many pies and do very well, but most people that achieve success develop laser focus and stick to one thing until it hits paydirt. I will give you one caveat here and say don't follow ONE thing if it's a loophole or something relying on a 3rd party platform that can wipe you out overnight. Build contingency into what you are doing where possible.

      Really work on your mindset though it definitely needs fine tuning. Instead of spending all that money on courses buy books like "Think and Grow Rich" and spend your time in the company of successful people (in books). In real life bottom line what people are doing, not what they are saying.

      Not many people will tell you this because, well quite frankly they want you to keep buying products and earning them commissions/sales. But after several years it's your turn to break out.

      Go back to work for a while if you have to and then come back stronger than ever. Good luck man!
      Great advice Dean, good man!
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  • Profile picture of the author mentoredlife
    I can understand your frustration, and the journey you've been on. I think like many have already pointed out part of the reason you haven't seen the breakthrough you're looking for is you've been hopping from one strategy to another. (I've done it too)

    Perhaps you can use the pressure of having to go back to a job to light the fire under you that you need to focus (Follow One Course Until Successful) on one strategy that inspires you and stick with it until you succeed.

    Find a mentor that you can follow who's actually still doing the thing you want to model. The drop your EGO and be willing to do what he tells you to do.

    That's my 2 cents.

    Best of Success!
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  • Thanks so much for your posts. You have been so helpful. This is a great forum as people take the time to reach out and help one another.

    I will continue my IM journey (although this time with a job!). I will be a producer and not consumer!

    I will be contacting you shortly Rod! Thanks so much for that offer! You have always been helpful to me. Rod is an outstanding guy.

    I shall update you on my IM journey and hope one day to share the good news that I reached my goal!
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  • Profile picture of the author ijohnson
    Mark,

    Your story is more common than you know. IM is no joke ... it takes a lot of hard work and a whole lot of clarity and planning.

    There have been some awesome WSOs offered on the WF. However, I haven't found many that really share (outside their inner circle) the whole enchilada or the "secret sauce" that makes their method work quicker, easier and more effectively.

    Having a coach or mentor who is successful can accelerate your progress. However, we students, must be coachable and must be able to stay focused.
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  • Profile picture of the author carol951
    Pick something that you are passionate about and do it. For example, if you are into eating health you could create a membership site to help others - you could share you tips, recipes, strategies etc. You have to focus and enjoy the the journey...
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  • Profile picture of the author wfjason
    Just keep on going and don't ever give up. You have really tried lots of things and you have accumulated experience along the way. If these systems have work for other people, it will surely work for you if you do not give up.

    For me personally, I feel that growing a IM business requires lots of work and time as it is just like growing any other real business. If I have chosen a mentor that is really successful, I will simply just follow it closely and take whatever action that is needed to make it work.

    Keep going and good luck
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  • Profile picture of the author Nightengale
    Mark,

    Congrats on being willing to take a big leap and take action! That's more than most Warriors ever do. So kudos to you!

    You've already gotten a lot of good advice here. A few things stand out to me about your post:

    1. As others mentioned, you have a lack of focus which seems to stem from a lack of clarity (as evidenced by you jumping from one thing to the next). After 3 years and $30K, you don't sound any closer to knowing what kind of business you REALLY want.

    This is a kiss of death. Just wanting to "make money online" is not enough, as you've found out.

    2. Forgive me, I don't mean this unkindly, but...

    Why on earth would you quit your job with $30K and NOT invest some of it in a real, solid program like Product Launch Formula? A coach? Some other training program?

    I will never understand why Warriors insist on relying solely on $7 WSOs and then actually expect to make real, consistent money or build a real business. WSO's, by their nature, are incomplete at best. They're merely a very small sliver of a very large pie. Yes, they can provide good info. But what they DON'T do is provide a comprehensive overview. They're merely a single blade of grass in a very large field.

    3. It drives me CRAZY when people say "I tried listbuilding. I tried article marketing." as if they were biz opps in and of themselves.

    Arrhggh!

    You can only make money in one of two ways:

    1. Sell a product.
    2. Sell a service.

    That's it! Listbuilding and article marketing are nothing more than MARKETING ACTIVITIES to sell that product or service.

    Even if you don't have your own product or service and choose article marketing to monetize CPA offers, you're essentially providing a service: you're driving qualified traffic to advertising offers. Article marketing is the method, NOT the business.

    I hope that brings some clarity.

    As someone else mentioned, focus all of your energies on getting a job right now. That can take a while. Once you have consistent income, you can get back into IM.

    You might also consider using your IM knowledge to help local businesses get customers. That can bring in some money fairly quickly. Check out OfflineBiz.com.

    Hope that helps!

    Michelle
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    • Profile picture of the author Nightengale
      Originally Posted by Art of Marketing View Post

      Really hope people are paying attention.

      -Art
      Thanks for your kind comments. I doubt it. The OP hasn't been back. :rolleyes: That seems to happen to a lot of threads I've posted in lately. I feel like I'm wasting my time.

      But for the OP, if he comes back (and anyone else who's interested who's had a similar experience to Mark's):

      Jeff Walker is currently in launch for Product Launch Formula 4.0. He's releasing it in Sept. If you've been struggling, lacking clarity and a step-by-step system to make money online, go sign up NOW at ProductLaunchFormula.com to be notified when he releases it.

      I have PLF 3 and it's FANTASTIC. LOVE Jeff's stuff! And PLF provides the COMPLETE picture/process (not just a tiny sliver like WSOs do). Jeff is also very good to his PLF owners. We got lots of bonuses, included periodic open coaching calls for the last 2 years.

      So you not only get the complete how-to foundation in the course, you also get a chance to get your questions answered.

      As I mentioned previously, marketing METHODS are NOT a business! So buying a WSO on the benefits of video marketing, for example, is of absolutely no use unless you already have an existing business (or know what business you want to get into) -- AND know how video marketing fits into all the other pieces of your business. (And realize it's just ONE piece out of several pieces!)

      That's the major downfall of WSOs, I think. Assuming they're any good, they still provide just a sliver of the pie -- and it may not even be a sliver that belongs in YOUR business pie.

      I TOTALLY get the anger and frustration -- and disappointment. We've all been there. *I've* certainly been there. So it's time to change your approach.

      Time to get real and get serious. Want to start a real business online and make real money? Then treat it like a real business! Invest in at least one comprehensive IM course.

      PLF is one of my top recommendations. You can't go wrong with it and I'm very grateful to Jeff for what he's shared with me in PLF. (Thanks Jeff!)

      Hope that helps!

      Michelle
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  • Profile picture of the author Mikaedi88
    A lot of great advice Mark, I urge you to take Rod up on his generous offer, I have seen several threads similar to this one, with most being highly critical..

    Great, that within the WF there are folk willing to help...and be honest.
    Don't give up man, learn from your failures.
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  • Profile picture of the author domainscience
    Hi Mark:
    Here is my take on the internet.
    It is just like any other business.
    Bye that I mean you need to sell a product that to a market that very few people are able to duplicate.
    As you have found out the hard way (3 years and $30,000) later, you cannot believe what you hear or read. (That simple.)
    You have proven what I learned early on (started in 1998) and that is if it is profitable, somewhat accessable, then you will make money in the short run until everyone else gets in the game.
    For over two years, I was selling jewelry cleaners and made good money at it, until all these suppliers caught onto to the internet and started selling the same thing at my cost. (I figured they were making pennies per sale and my time was worth a heck of a lot more.) So I stopped.
    I am slowing making a comeback to start manufacture my own jewelry line (with my brother who is a jeweler).
    I promise you that his is not easy, but that's what it takes.
    Create something that is better then what people can bring from China (our jewelry will be made in the U.S.A.), putting Americans to work, and we hope to mushroom on the internet like there is no tomorrow. (However, I will not quit my job to do this.)
    At any rate, you need to do something unique (the whole idea of the internet was to find unique items and information), make sure not too many people (I can count my competition of actual custom jewelry making on my fingers), deliver a great product and a good price.
    You should be okay.
    Good Luck.
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    • Profile picture of the author KBull
      Mark,
      Thanks so much for sharing your trying journey. I'm also new to IM but learning that this forum is full of great, knowledgeable and generous people. So be sure to reach out before giving up!
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  • Profile picture of the author fallingdown101
    great advice here !!! bookmarked the thread !!
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  • Profile picture of the author hijoy
    Banned
    Well the experience you got, you should insist, victory is at hand.
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      Originally Posted by ijohnson View Post

      There have been some awesome WSOs offered on the WF. However, I haven't found many that really share (outside their inner circle) the whole enchilada or the "secret sauce" that makes their method work quicker, easier and more effectively.
      While there are WSOs (and other offers online) that hold back in order to lure buyers deeper into the funnel, that's not always the case.

      Sometimes the "secret sauce" has to be supplied by the buyer. People are always asking to see examples of what works, what a successful whatever looks like. The problem is that what works (or worked) for me in a certain situation may be a total disaster in different circumstances.

      In my email marketing book, I deliberately make the point that there are very few live examples, templates, swipes, etc. simply because too many people will just copy them without understanding the context behind them. Then, when or if they fail, they'll blame me and/or the method.

      Then again, you do have sellers that lay things out in step-by-step, paint by numbers fashion. The result is folks like the OP following the plan in good faith, only to find thousands of others doing the same thing with the same materials, banners, sales pages and so on.
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  • Profile picture of the author Infopreneurqueen
    You didn't try to perfect anything you were doing. You keep jumping from one business to another. I expected you to stick with something you believe in and something which you feel you're good at. Wish you luck but try to work on these things. Also equip yourself with useful tools like YouTube videos and ecourses

    Minimize the money you spend. I try to use free tools first before investing money on anything. I've earned thousands online without evn spending up to a hundred. Goodluck
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  • Profile picture of the author TheNewGuy2010
    Keeping things in perspective, $30,000 over 3 years isn't bad at all.

    For a brick and mortar business at start up phase, $30k could be easily spent in the first 3-6 months and that's for a small "mom and pop" business.

    I think when "we" get into the IM world where everything is so cheap, i.e., Fiverr and odesk, we can sometimes forget about reality and how much business really costs.

    I'm working with a consultant for a offline project, his retainer fee............$22,500.
    I didn't blink when he gave me the invoice.

    Keep things in perspective.

    As Andy said, get good at one thing and be better than others and charge for it.
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    • Profile picture of the author celente
      Originally Posted by TheNewGuy2010 View Post


      I'm working with a consultant for a offline project, his retainer fee............$22,500.
      I didn't blink when he gave me the invoice.

      I totally love this post, and can see that you are light years ahead of some in here.

      WHY?

      Well.....its pretty simple!!

      People hate forking out money! Ok, I get that!! For sure, its hard to part way with something you work hard for, for sure.

      However I have a client that pays me $4k per month, and since doing so has added about $9,000 to his business every month, and he actually listens to what I have to say! He asked similar to what you did!

      I myself have paid for coaching, and can tell you if you are paying someone big money each month, but it is brining in more profits, and more revenue for your businesses, then there is not need to whine and whinge.

      Do your homework first, and find someone that will get your results that you are after! And study those who are where you want to be in a few years time. Re-verse engineering the gurus, is the easiest way to success I know, is it hard work......eff Yes, but life was not made to be easy, and business also. Work hard and you will get there.
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  • Profile picture of the author adamzanber
    The best way is building authority website in niche which you like to write about without targeting any keyword and doing SEO but social sharing is must. The traffic will come naturally for content and you can monitize by adsense and selling ad space. Although, it will take few months to get there.
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  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Deegan
    The thing that stands out to me is everything you did you did with the intent to make money, not create value. You used various marketing methods/tactics, but you did so without vision, strategy and an actual goal (outside of create a business to make some money)

    The other thing as others have pointed out is that you stopped and changed gears when things started to turn south. You did what others did and had some success, which is a great way to start but NOT the best way to keep moving forward. Once you had that foundation, you had/have a chance to work on how to improve, maximize and optimize and gain an edge over the competition.

    For example...

    -improving conversions (banners, landers, site speed, etc)
    -lowering traffic costs, finding new traffic sources
    -getting better payout on offers, creating your own offer or bonus, etc.

    There are many things you could work on, a small improvement in multiple areas would create an exponential increase on your returns. The more profit you can squeeze out, the more you can pay for traffic/leads which furthers your edge. Its a process/cycle, but you have to stick with it and remember its a number game.

    But back to my first point, value should be your primary focus. Create or promote stuff with a real value. Stop with the gimmicky type bulls*t (PLR, crappy CPA or Clickbank product,etc).

    You already have a lot of the knowledge and skills, to succeed because you have succeed. Also put me in the camp with other folks who feel creating your own products/services is the best way to actually make money online. Though leveraging affiliate products for market testing, cross/upsells, in many cases should be part of your model.

    Much love,
    Daniel.
    ----------------------
    P.S. I've been away from the forums for quite awhile, apologies to those who PM'd me questions, etc. Life changed pretty dramatically and priorities/focus/time completely shifted. (separation, becoming a single parent of 2 young children, etc.)
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  • Profile picture of the author joseph7384
    Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

    I entered the world of CPA marketing and for a while made some money. But thousands of CPA affiliates were promoting the EXACT same programs I was promoting and before I knew it profits started to dwindle and before I knew it I was facing losses.

    Well what have we learned here? Create your own product and thousands of affiliates will still be promoting the same product, but it would be your product that these affiliate would be promoting.
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    • Profile picture of the author Tony Nelson
      One thing i noticed is that you said you were able to turn at least some profit on all the methods you tried. That's where the money is! I assume you had to tweak or or modify the product that taught you in some way. Those tweaks are where the new product could come from. It doesnt matter if there are 100 products that tell how to make money with cpa, all that matters is how yours is a little different and how you market it.

      As far as jumping from one thing to the next. Everyone does that, its nessessary due to changing rules etc. SEO is not taught the same way today as 3 years ago. And when twitter first came out, of course people jumped to try and get better or easier traffic. I do think you should stop buying products as a prospect and start buying as a marketer. Buy them to see what the trend is right now and where it is going.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nightengale
    For Mark (and everyone else who's experienced the same frustrations). This is what I should have posted in this thread first:

    Clarity is a HUGE part of IM success. I hope this post brings some clarity. It's so simple when you know it -- and darn difficult when you don't! I owe my mentors a world of thanks for bringing this clarity.

    IM is actually pretty simple: you can sell only one of two things:

    1. Products
    2. Services

    That's it!

    And selling products or services online happens in the same basic way for everyone, no matter what they're selling:

    Traffic > Opt-in page > Autoresponder series (or e-zine) > Sales page

    That's it! It's just that simple. (We IMers tend to overcomplicate things.)

    But no matter what your niche is, or whether you're selling a product or a service, do you know what your business model is?

    A business model is the framework or skeleton of your business. Essentially there are three types of online business models:

    1. Membership-based model

    A membership-based business model allows you to build a community of people (your members) who are as passionate about your subject as you are. Your membership fees can be monthly or annual, but either way, you're building recurring, passive income.

    There are a lot of resources and information out there to help you build a membership-based business if you're interested in doing this.

    2. Product-based model

    Selling products allows you to maximize your time and effort by selling items over and over again. This can be hard goods or it can be information products. Information marketing is it's own business model under the product-based model. Information marketing allows you to take your brain to the bank by creating a product ONCE based on what you know and selling it over and over again.

    Affiliate marketing falls under both models. You can choose to market either products or services as an affiliate.

    3. Service-based model

    Selling services can be great for 1) generating quick cash (as in the case of article writing or video producing) and 2) establishing your expertise and getting testimonials.

    However, in the long run, your goal should be to offer services at a PREMIUM. The biggest advantage of IM is LEVERAGE. You're able to leverage your time, money and expertise exponentially online. We all have just 24 hours each day. Time to get ruthless about what you expect for those hours you spend in IM each day. Expect more of yourself and more from your business friends, clients, partners, etc.

    What results are you getting for those hours you spend online each day? Ultimately, your services should be at the bottom of your funnel and cost the most since they involve your time and personal attention. (We all have a limited amount of time each day.)

    The fun (and confusion) comes in with all of the endless mix-and-match possibilities of the above models. If you're just starting or still struggling to make money, keep it simple:

    Pick just ONE!

    1. Pick ONE niche. (Something you're interested in and know something about.)

    2. Pick ONE target market for your product or service. (Who will buy what you're offering? The more specific you are, the more you narrow it down, the more successful you'll be.)

    3. Pick ONE business model.

    Now that you're clear about what business you're in, FOCUS! (And stop buying any info not related to your niche and target market, period!)

    F -- Follow
    O -- One
    C -- Course
    U -- Until
    S -- Successful

    And remember: build a list, Build a List, BUILD A LIST!

    In IM, it's easy to put the cart before the horse. Take a deep breath, step back and consider what type of business you REALLY want. Don't worry about getting traffic or buying that expensive traffic product until you know 1) what your business model is, 2) what niche you're in and 3) WHO your target market is!

    Successful business people will tell you that MARKETING is more than half the effort that's needed for success anyway. So pick a niche, target market and business model. Then spend most of your time and effort marketing it.

    If you DON'T have a solid plan or system, THAT'S when it's hard. A good system will shave YEARS (and save you big $$$) off of your learning curve

    That's why I recommend investing in at least one good, comprehensive IM course (or mentor who will give you such a system) instead of jumping from one $37 e-book to the next. A lot of people here complain about not being able to make any money. But neither are they willing to invest in their business. (Buying a random bunch of $37 e-books doesn't count.)

    The best thing I ever did was invest in a comprehensive IM course aimed at REAL business owners, not just other IM wannabes. Yes it was $1500. (It's no longer available.) But it was truly some of the best A-Z IM info I ever bought. Everything else I've learned (from the $37 e-books) since has simply been plugged into this system.

    Get a solid plan or system and then work the plan!

    Hope this helps!

    Michelle
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  • Profile picture of the author hustlinsmoke
    Hey Mark, I did feel bad for you at first when I read your post but I feel more admiration now for you after reading it a second time.

    Internet Marketing is not Rocket Science no matter what anyone tells you.
    What works for me may not work for someone else. We all do pretty much the same thing we just have different roads to take to get us there.

    Maybe you haven't found the right road yet.
    I can coach someone for months but if they can't do everything the same way I can, they won't get the same results as I will, but some actually do even better than me lol.

    I agree with a lot of statements here right now. One your livelihood is your most important task right now. You must find a job even part time and supplement through IM.

    I also agree with them that what most call Information overload and lack of focus has caused your situation.

    You know one thing I have found out in IM never put all your eggs in one basket and I have learned that the hard way three times. Gambling sites, diet pill sites and Adsense. I always though follow through till I met my goal on the project.
    Now I have probably dozens of things making me money.
    I will say some only make me 20 a month but they sit there and make me 20 a month.

    I still make money at cpa even though its over saturated but new cpa offers come out every day. Some of my cpa sites have been up for years earning me nothing but 20 bucks and up a month but they are there and earning me money.

    I still get checks from hostgator and don't think I actively marketed them in over five years. I never was the best file keeper and I get checks I have no idea on earth where they came from.

    I really can not tell you anything you haven't heard or read and I can't guarantee your success if you stay in, but man you know I fail every day, every single day I fail at something, but I have never truly failed because I will continue to try something in a different way each time.

    Good luck to you my friend.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kevin_Hutto
    If you believe Gladwell (and the study behind it), it takes 10,000 hours to master something. That is 10k hours working on one thing. Like Sales Copy. Or paid traffic. Or SEO. Or whatever.

    The point is... if you had spent the last 3 years really learning one thing then I doubt you would have ever written this thread. You could probably write your own ticket.

    The second piece of advice I will give you came from Jim Rohn... "Work harder on yourself than you do on your job." If you acquire the skills, then you will be able to translate them into income.
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  • Profile picture of the author hustlinsmoke
    First I do believe Jim Robin but I have a debatable nature with Gladwell and his study.

    I studied Gladwell"s theory as I did not fully agree with it.
    First lets start by saying Gladwell did not take a number of participants and do a double blind placebo study, what he did was study the habits of very successful people.
    I mean I do not think you can be a great copywriter if you do not have the aptitude for it. You can be trained as a parrot and repeat what you have learned from repetition but repetition is not always real life and things have to change sometimes for a situation.

    I mean honestly if the 10,000 hour rule was the case then everyone could be the star quarterback.

    Lets just say we have 100 men and we train them for 10,000 hours to be Folk Musicians, does this mean we are going to have 100 on the number one charts of Folk music. I would have to say we would be lucky to get one successful musician unless we hand picked them to do the job.

    There is plenty of research on the net to back this up.

    I have seen Internet Marketers walk in the door and make hundreds of thousands of dollars. I have seen tons more walk in and never realize a dollar profit.
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  • Profile picture of the author DR0832
    I got involved in IM without really even realizing what IM actually was. I am a professional stock trader. I have traded for a living since 2002. Around 2010 a relative got very sick and I decided to take a break from full time trading to help take care of them. To help with income during this time I wrote an ebook and created a course which detailed a decade of my experience in the stock market and what I do on a daily basis to extract profits from the stock market. Most people lose money in the stock market just like most people lose money in the IM arena. My course showed people how not to lose money, and in the process extract profits.

    I was successful building an online business because I created a product which couldn't be replicated. Somebody could try to copy my product but the fact is to be successful in the stock market requires gaining an understanding of something which few people have. I am able to answer questions of my customers and share my knowledge and very few other people can do the same because they have never made money in the stock market themselves. The penny stock niche is extremely competitive but my product is completely unique because hundreds of other people are providing useless products or straight up scams, and my product is legitimate.

    I have succeeded because although I had absolutely no clue about internet marketing before I got involved, I learned how the game is played from places like this forum and other online resources. I did not buy WSO's or other courses because frankly most people that sell these are modern day snake oil salesmen, and they do so because uninformed people will buy them. To the original poster if you want a product that sells, become my affiliate and you can start earning 50% commissions but understand you can't make money doing what everyone else does. (I have hundreds of affiliates and only the ones that differentiate themselves make money). I know all about this because in the stock market is exactly the same. You only make money if somebody else loses money. Although the IM industry is not a zero sum game like the stock market, you have to separate yourself from the "herd" as as you do in the stock market or you are bound to fail.

    Building a unique squeeze page and strong sales letter is important. Most people try to use some generic squeeze page that came from software they bought in a WSO. This goes back to doing something different from others. Also building a list is important but you can't really use solo ads because basically everyone in the IM arena has a list composed of the same subscribers.
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  • Profile picture of the author ronrule
    Dude... you have a product right here.

    First, you figured out how to save up for three years, so you could survive the other three without a paycheck and have an extra $30,000 to spend. That makes you an economic genius Dave Ramsey would be proud of, and is probably worthy of its own book without a single mention of what you spent the $30k on. Teach people how to do THAT and you'll be a wealthy man.

    But separate from that... your experience with all of this is one that would be valuable to many people. People who step into this world just like you did, thinking there is some "secret formula I just haven't figured out yet" that will lead to a passive income without any expertise.

    The problem isn't with any of the models you tried, or even market saturation. The problem is that markets change, and you have to know how to adapt to those changes. If all you ever do is follow a step by step guide, no matter how good it is it will always be a short-term gain. You learned this first hand... and your experience here gave you insight that many people just getting started could benefit from, so they don't make those mistakes. So they turn off the "autopilot income" mentality and focus on building a LASTING income.

    Write it all down. Then sell it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Noctilus
    I don't think you should give up. Find a real service oriented path where you provide value to others and people will pay you. The rest of the "methods", just look at them as hobbies to challenge yourself with, like little puzzles you do in your free time with the extra profit you make.

    That's what I do and the minute I used the above information that I am giving you I became a real full time internet marketer with money enough to keep me and my partner comfortable.

    What kind of service can you offer? List it here so we can help you on the forum. After all the money you spent and all the "studying" you did, I am sure there must be something you have gotten good at. What is it?
    Don't give up!
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  • Profile picture of the author derekwong28
    Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post


    -I entered the world of media-buying promoting clickbank products. For a while I did OK and made a profit. Before I knew it thousands of affiliates were promoting the EXACT SAME product I was promoting and using the EXACT SAME banners like me in fact they were using the same banners I was using and my profits started to dwindle.

    -I entered the world of CPA marketing and for a while made some money. But thousands of CPA affiliates were promoting the EXACT same programs I was promoting and before I knew it profits started to dwindle and before I knew it I was facing losses.
    My impression is that you have been most successful with "hit and run" profit generating methods rather than those that create sustainable income.

    I do not see anything wrong with this. Many people using "sustainable" methods were just as badly hit after multiple Google updates. If you could make $200,000 in three months, who cares if you make next to nothing for the rest of the year. However if you use "hit and run" methods, you cannot just sit still and then get disillusioned when the niche doesn't work anymore. You have got to go on finding and trying out new niches.
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  • Profile picture of the author IMDealBox
    I bumped my head against IM walls for 1.5 years before i figured out the "secret"!

    A very simple secret:
    1. Spend time learning (mostly for free - but paid courses can speed up the process)

    2. Spend time implementing what you have learnt!

    3. Do not become a serial buyer or shiny thing chaser! There is NO WAY you become rich in 24 hours, 1 day, 1 week or 1 month - contrary what 75% of the WSO tell you!

    4. WORK HARD - yes...work 18-20 hours a day!

    5. Dont give up! Any effort is sooner or later rewarded!

    Following the above rules i now make $300-$400/day...not EVERYDAY ...but most of the month!

    IM is simple if you start something and stick with it...if it makes you money just scale it up and make more!

    DIXI
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    • Profile picture of the author Daniel Evans
      Originally Posted by IMDealBox View Post

      4. WORK HARD - yes...work 18-20 hours a day!
      Four hours sleep with no additional time to relax?

      I'd suggest putting more into the time rather than burn the candle at both ends. At least that's what works for me.
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      • Profile picture of the author IMDealBox
        Originally Posted by Daniel Evans View Post

        Four hours sleep with no additional time to relax?

        I'd suggest putting more into the time rather than burn the candle at both ends. At least that's what works for me.
        Well..those hours were put on after i realized IM is not as easy as they make it sound... Now i am behind PC for about 8-10 hours with breaks whenever i want them...and days off whenever i decide to...

        So...that hard work ..pays off...!


        Plus...i was 2 years younger back then...
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    • Profile picture of the author TheNewGuy2010
      Suggesting someone 18-20 hours a day is foolish.

      The amount of time you work does not matter as much as how effective you work with the time you have. Working that many hours is unhealthy. When do you have time to eat a healthy meal? Get exercise? Have a social life?

      You're doing all of that for money?

      Your priorities are backwards or at the very least, you're very young in age.


      BTW, there is no secret.

      If the OP just focused in listing building by doing Solo Ads and Adswaps, he would be miles ahead of where he is in 3 months time. He could even sell tools and products related to making money online. He doesn't have to promote garbage that claims you'll make $xxx amount of money.

      Lot's of people want to build lists, he can promo Aweber. Lot's of people want to build blogs. He could sell WP training videos. In addition they'll need hosting, he could sell hosting also. All essential tools for blogging and creating your customer list.

      Don't complicate this process, because it's not that complicated. Once he gets his clashflow coming, he can go offline, where the real money is. When I say offline, I don't mean IM realated services like SEO, web design ,etc.....




      Originally Posted by IMDealBox View Post

      I bumped my head against IM walls for 1.5 years before i figured out the "secret"!

      A very simple secret:
      1. Spend time learning (mostly for free - but paid courses can speed up the process)

      2. Spend time implementing what you have learnt!

      3. Do not become a serial buyer or shiny thing chaser! There is NO WAY you become rich in 24 hours, 1 day, 1 week or 1 month - contrary what 75% of the WSO tell you!

      4. WORK HARD - yes...work 18-20 hours a day!

      5. Dont give up! Any effort is sooner or later rewarded!

      Following the above rules i now make $300-$400/day...not EVERYDAY ...but most of the month!

      IM is simple if you start something and stick with it...if it makes you money just scale it up and make more!

      DIXI
      Signature
      Retired Internet Marketer.
      Gone Fishing....
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      • Profile picture of the author IMDealBox
        Originally Posted by TheNewGuy2010 View Post

        Suggesting someone 18-20 hours a day is foolish.

        The amount of time you work does not matter as much as how effective you work with the time you have. Working that many hours is unhealthy. When do you have time to eat a healthy meal? Get exercise? Have a social life?

        You're doing all of that for money?

        Your priorities are backwards or at the very least, you're very young in age.


        BTW, there is no secret.

        If the OP just focused in listing building by doing Solo Ads and Adswaps, he would be miles ahead of where he is in 3 months time. He could even sell tools and products related to making money online. He doesn't have to promote garbage that claims you'll make amount of money.

        Lot's of people want to build lists, he can promo Aweber. Lot's of people want to build blogs. He could sell WP training videos. In addition they'll need hosting, he could sell hosting also. All essential tools for blogging and creating your customer list.

        Don't complicate this process, because it's not that complicated. Once he gets his clashflow coming, he can go offline, where the real money is. When I say offline, I don't mean IM realated services like SEO, web design ,etc.....
        Let's just agree to disagree!

        I am not suggesting anyone 18 hours work days...though that wont kill you!
        When you future depends on being successful doing IM...i bet you'd put same hours in!

        IM is not a hobby or a side deal for me...it is the main source of income for me and my family...

        I worked hard to get here and i AM PROUD of all i did! If you want to say that i did it for money...go ahead....but i did it for my FAMILY!

        PS. If this doesnt make sense...i live in a 3rd world country in Europe where $500 month is considered a LOT of money, where monthly rent for appartments is about $250 and where people my age dont get hired to offline jobs unless they had lots of previous experience. All my experience was never related to almost anything that is available offline.

        Anyways..bottom line is this!

        HARD WORK, even for shorter periods of time, becomes a rock solid basis for your future endeavors!

        DIXI


        PS. I just saw the young age comment!...Oh my...i wish!!

        I am an old gizzard (32)....ah...where are my 20's??
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  • Profile picture of the author Andyhenry
    Your story reminds me of the guy who sold his field to go in search of riches only to find later that his field was the top of a diamond mine and if he'd just focused on where he was (rather than going in search of riches) he'd have been rich beyond his dreams.

    You seem to have a sensible head on your shoulders and the fact that you're willing to admit you've failed and ask for help is a great sign.

    I think Fletch's comments earlier in this thread made a good point - you said "it was supposed to be easy", well that expectation was probably your undoing.

    Sure, there are a lot of people saying it's easy - but if you look closely they're usually selling something.

    You seem to be serious about wanting to do well, but if you think it's an easy route to succeed and work less hours than a normal job, well you're asking for trouble because for most people succeeding in IM does not mean sitting on the beach with their laptop working 4 hours a week - it means they work at least as hard as a normal job - except that they control their work, their time and their results - and in return get the lions share of the rewards for that work.

    Don't be misled into thinking that all you need to do is choose a Clickbank product and then pay for traffic and you can retire.

    Don't think of IM as the easy alternative to a normal job - think of it as an alternative lifestyle, much more work but for your own reasons, enjoyment and results.

    If you're starting an IM business doing something you wouldn't do if you didn't need the money - you're probably in the wrong business. You need to be completely committed to your plan and your results or the chances are high that you will fail.

    Don't go around looking for other people to tell you what your business should be or what your results should be - only you are responsible for your plan, your action and your results.

    Andy
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    nothing to see here.

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  • Profile picture of the author goindeep
    Sounds like you need a holiday.

    I'd been at this for seven years before I made consistent money.

    I know people that tried hard for ten years and never made it then gave up.

    I also know people that made money and then created a business their first month online.

    Everyone is different.

    Best advice I can give you is to take a holiday or some time off from I.M. clear your mind, dont even think about it. It's the best thing you can do at this point. Come back to it with a fresh perspective and find out what makes you tick, what you like, what your good at... go do that.
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  • Why didn't you look at yourself in the mirror. I'm buying all this crap, but won't make money.

    There must be someone like me.

    I will make crap, and sell it.

    Done!
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    • Profile picture of the author happyifthi
      Originally Posted by Jonathan Emanuels View Post

      Why didn't you look at yourself in the mirror. I'm buying all this crap, but won't make money.

      There must be someone like me.

      I will make crap, and sell it.

      Done!
      Well said...there are hundreds out there to buy crap every single day - I realised that its all in the hype...the more you hype more you get tempted to go for it and of course at the end of the day its sheer crap but thats another story
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  • Profile picture of the author Veo
    Friend,

    First I'm sorry for the situation that you're in right now.

    I don't know your background in business, but I'll tell you this:
    Principles of business (off-line or on-line) never change, strategies rarely change, tactics might change from time to time.
    I believe that famous Dan Kennedy actually said it, and because my background is from a brick and mortar biz, I somehow subconsciously went by that when I decided to enter on-line biz arena.
    And it worked, and will continue to work.
    I hope and believe that stuff that you've learned won't be a waste , just use them as a tools or vehicles in your business. Trust me, you know much more than some of the folks I work with, that are making good money on-line.
    You have to cover the basics ( and I haven't seen that in your post):
    What's your market?
    How thorough is your research?
    What are their circumstances?
    Demographics and psycho-graphics?
    Problems and pain points?
    Competition?
    Marketing channels?
    Your Unique Selling Proposition?
    The list can be (and is) longer, but unless you don't do basic homework, all the knowledge that you accumulated won't help you.
    Don't chase but plan, and stick to it! You might be very close to success.

    I wish you all the best!

    Veo
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  • You have done so much. You could even begin a website. Dontfaillikeme.com or something.
    Slogan: Been there, failed that.

    You could give tips about what doesn't work, you could even ask questions. You could do a lot with your knowledge.
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    • Profile picture of the author 4DayWeekend
      Are you selling your own products and services?

      You say you've hired a product creation coach and created a product - where is it? Show us and we can provide some feedback on why it isn't selling? If it's in the ether somewhere... the question is already answered...

      Your post gives the impression that you're giving up on things because 'thousands of others' are doing it. Well, that's business. It's competitive out there. Sometimes to succeed you need to go that extra mile.

      There are tens of thousands of Indian restaurants here in the UK. Does that mean a new one can't open tomorrow and become the most popular in your city? Absolutely not. It just needs to do something extra.

      I'd say pick one idea (preferably one of those that has made you money) and stick to it. When it starts to get competitive tweak it. Jumping from one idea to another isn't the answer.

      Also, consider getting a job and doing IM part time while you get back on your feet.

      Good luck,

      Nick
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    • Profile picture of the author ErinWalsh
      Originally Posted by Jonathan Emanuels View Post

      You have done so much. You could even begin a website. Dontfaillikeme.com or something.
      Slogan: Been there, failed that.

      You could give tips about what doesn't work, you could even ask questions. You could do a lot with your knowledge.
      Brilliant! What a great way to work with what you know, and offer real advice.
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      • Profile picture of the author heavysm
        I'm seriously surprised you didn't stick with anything you mentioned on your list. If you see something you don't like, why not change it? Stick with it, learn all you can about it, then dominate it as an expert in that field. You really have to saturate yourself with the material, but wouldn't it be worth it if people look to you for your knowledge?

        I sort of get your angle that so many people are doing the same thing you get into. But so what? That's your chance to shine in that particular field. Don't leap frog from market to market in hopes that something else will be better. YOU have to make it work from your unique perspective. Give it your own flavor of experience and people will flock to you if the thing you have to offer is worth it's weight.

        You mentioned solo ads, and that really hit me. So what if everyone is doing it? Do it better, build a better relationship with your list and maybe you'll see selling solos may not be your thing. But at that stage you would have a list that you can build and grow long term, so it almost doesn't matter how you monetize it.

        It just looks like you have to rework your mindset rather than look to the next new thing that comes along. A bullet proof determined mindset is invaluable if you really want your business to succeed.
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        • Profile picture of the author Devilfish168


          what presently hinder my sales..is TRAFFIC...

          I don't care the traffic is "target" or "non target"...

          as long REAL visitor browse my blog....Is a "gamble" ...you never know out of hundred to even 10k or more even better visitors come to your blog...

          surely some will feel interest and bother to click and check it out....

          I wonder any warriors here feel the same like what I think...
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  • Profile picture of the author Slin
    Mark,

    I hate to say this, but don't listen to most of the people on here.

    Well kind of...listen to the ones that are telling you to continue to press on! But don't listen to anyone who tells you to buy more coaching or training.

    What you need to do is create a large authority website. In 3 years time, you could have created an extremely profitable site, without spending nearly as much money. The problem with doing this is the results come a lot slower at first, that's why you won't see most people online advocating it.

    Don't try to sell your own product, not yet, wait until you have a following in a niche. Selling a service is another way to go about making money, I don't have much experience with it but some of my buds do.

    But I can tell you right now, find an interest of yours that involves a product, then create an authority site. Make an "about me" page a page to put reviews on, and whatever else you need, which mainly depends on your niche.

    Than post to that blog on there a few times a day, maybe create some videos, feel free to share it on forums as well. First few months traffic will be next to nothing, but keep going, keep posting, don't build backlinks, just keep posting. After 5 months or so things will start going up and up and up.

    3 years from now you'll tell all of us a different story.

    Trust me Mark, this is the way to success.
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  • Profile picture of the author Walt Serdville
    I'm sorry to say it but you failed because you had no clear business and marketing plan. It's the preparation. Research. Diving into blind never does good. Also not being able to see through the WSO fluff can't be blamed on anyone else other than you.
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  • Profile picture of the author MusicMinCoach
    I'm far from an experienced, successful marketer, man. Let me say that up front. But I realized a few things early on that have helped me gain clarity, get focused and STAY focused. While my journey is moving slowly, it's moving in the right direction and I haven't spent a lot of money. What I have spent I've spent mostly from money earned from the business. And I've done it all around my full time job, which is what I'll continue to do until my marketing efforts are generating at least twice what I make on my job.

    There are so many awesome replies here, but some really stand out. Nightengale's comments, all of them, should really be read and re-read. Because what she says will really help you understand and avoid the trap most of us fall into at the beginning; Shiny Object Syndrome. I learned this term early and "got it" quickly. And it has saved me thousands.

    The point she made about the fact that products like list building courses are NOT businesses in and of themselves, but processes that only work when you already have a business, is absolute gold. That bit of wisdom alone has helped me avoid 95% of the products I see being sold on-line.

    The second point being made here that has really helped me is the fact that you really MUST have your own product. I read this many times when I first started and it really sunk in quickly. So I started looking at my own niche and what wasn't available, and that's where I saw the the most opportunity.

    But even if you don't have a specific niche and you're thinking you can't create a product, you might be surprised to know that in my opinion you just did. I just recently bought a coaching product from Alex Jeffries where he taught the power of just starting a blog and telling your story, and how it can lead you to a very successful business. Then he gave many real-world case studies of people who had done just that. One of them was an older lady who's first blog post was a story just like yours here. Alex actually took us to the blog, showed us her first blog post and a few others she had made chronicling her journey, then he took us up to where she is currently-making a full time living.

    Your original post- your story- IS your product. And like many others have said, it's the one thing nobody else can duplicate. If you started a blog and simply told your story, documenting all of your attempts, successes and failures along the way, you would have hundreds of followers in no time. Do you know how many thousands of people out there identify with your story?

    Soon they would start asking you questions in their replies to your blog posts. As you start to see the same questions over and over you start to move from novice to an expert of sorts. Next thing you know you release a product of your own answering the questions you're getting asked most often. Which you can easily do from the knowledge you've gained from your own experiences so far. Now you have your own business, a clear focus and your own following. A list of people who are following you because they identify with YOU.

    And as you've already proven, telling your story is very natural and something you're very good at. And the fact that people would relate, like and want to follow you is evident by the number of people responding in kindness to your post.

    So, my lack of experience notwithstanding, I say your next move-after getting yourself employed-is to register a domain name-something around your own name- start a blog and then just start telling your story. Honestly, candidly, holding back nothing- just like you did here. Even posting this thread and talking about all the replies you got should be one of your posts. Followed by what you did next. Going back to work. Everything. Start a blog, telll your story, keep participating in forums like you're doing now, with your link in your signature, and I think you'd be surprised at how many people would start following you. You're the product you need to sell, in my opinion. Being you is something nobody else is doing.

    Then when you buy a traffic course or a list building course you'll see it for what it really is supposed to be, as Nightengale said. And I really thought her acronym was profound.
    F -- Follow
    O -- One
    C -- Course
    U -- Until
    S -- Successful

    And Rod?? OMG, even I reached out to him and he wasn't even talking to me, lol!
    I know you're still reading so I just wanted to add my two cents in as someone relatively new and still figuring it out myself. I've made some money, created a couple of products and seen lots of progress-all in a niche most people avoid. But what I've been able to do so far is based on the fact that I'm just me. In my blog posts, on my fan page, in my videos.
    I wish you much success, man. And if you start that blog I'll be one of the first to follow.

    Take care!
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  • Profile picture of the author Matthew Trujillo
    My advice would be stop LEARNING so much and get in the TRENCHES.

    That is the only way you will LEARN.

    There are similar people that jump around from seminar to seminar and never get anywhere.

    At one point in your life you must realize, you have EVERY tool you need to be successful.

    It comes down to YOU, ultimately in the end you are responsible for your life.

    You must take ACTION daily.

    Hope this helps
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    • Profile picture of the author 4q
      Hello Mark, very sorry to learn of your story.

      However........

      Just thinking "outside" the box here for a moment, why don't you create a WSO detailing ALL the things that didn't work for you?

      Who says a WSO needs to be about "making money?"

      As you have explained, and many others will no doubt experience, there is a lot of money to be "lost" in IM.

      SO why not create a comprehensive guide of your experience detailing all the things you spent money on that didn't work out for you?

      Imagine the money this could save other internet marketers in the same position?

      If I could pay for a guide of campaigns and experience that are proven not to be successful, I'd buy it IMMEDIATELY!

      The time and money it would save other IM's would far, far out weight the cost a WSO!

      Go turn that negative into a huge positive!

      In IM, learning what is not successful can be of far MORE VALUE than learning about what is successful!

      Your experience so far has a HUGE value attached to it Mark.

      Good luck!

      Chris Farquah
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  • Profile picture of the author larry50
    Mark,
    I have my own version of your story and I have now found what I believe to be a coach that is sending me in the right direction based on what I have learned over the last 4 years, 2 1/2 of those trying to succeed at internet marketing.

    I know some of the comments by DeanJames may be painful, but in the area of business philosophy he is talking about he is dead on target. If you will swallow the bitter pill, it will help you to become successful, you are not alone.

    But there is another area that some have brushed on, but reading your post brought to mind. Did any of your mentors ever talk about bringing something of value to the market place? Exchanging something of value for money? Did any of the courses you bought, talk about how to find something of value, to take to the market place? Did anyone explain to you how to use your creative mind to bring something unique to the market place?

    I have a growing list of books I could recommend, but perhaps the best place to start is the book by Robert Kiyosaki - The Business Of The 21st Century because it shows the difference in thinking between an employee and a successful business person.

    So as others have said, there is nothing wrong with getting a job to make a living, and working on IM to make your fortune. The more I grow the more I am amazed at how many ways my beliefs and thinking have kept me in poverty, and how it doesn't have to be like that.
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  • Profile picture of the author dewayneboyd
    Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

    Hello fellow warriors,

    I have joined this forum over six years ago in 2007. And for the last six years I have been on a quest to make a full-time income online. I was so excited about this goal of mine that I even quit my job three years ago in order to finally make this dream of mine a reality!

    I thought by working full-time on my goal I will certainly make it in the IM world and make a full-time income!

    The sad part is I didn't....:-( I'm at a point now where I have eaten enough into my savings that if I don't find a job soon I will be in dire financial straits.

    I was so confident that with three years of savings I would certainly make it online!

    I would like to share with you my IM journey the last three years and I would love any suggestions and support as my confidence is now at an all-time low and I have considered throwing in the towel on IM several times now:

    -I purchased a number of WSOs making claims of "easy money", "easily make six figures a month", "this one-hidden trick will make you $5,000 a month". And the list goes on and on. None of them delivered on their promise.

    -I entered the world of CPA marketing and for a while made some money. But thousands of CPA affiliates were promoting the EXACT same programs I was promoting and before I knew it profits started to dwindle and before I knew it I was facing losses.

    -I entered the world of media-buying promoting clickbank products. For a while I did OK and made a profit. Before I knew it thousands of affiliates were promoting the EXACT SAME product I was promoting and using the EXACT SAME banners like me in fact they were using the same banners I was using and my profits started to dwindle.

    -I used Facebook Ads to promote affiliate products including WSOs and there were times when I made a bit of money and times I broke even but more often then not I would make a loss. I noticed a lot of people where doing the SAME THING like me.

    -I paid for a very expensive solo ad coaching program that promised me the world. I joined an "inner circle" that would make be the best solo-ad seller. I was expecting to make thousands each month. I noticed there are many people selling solo ads and the market is getting saturated. In fact it seems to be selling recycled clicks. Again like with the other projects I was involved this is full of people doing the EXACT SAME THING and selling the EXACT SAME THING.

    -I was trained by an IM product development coach and he also promised me the world and said all I had to do was make my own IM product. I did that. I noticed thousands of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING.

    -I entered the world of Kindle. And was coached by a Kindle "expert". I was also promised thousands each month. For a while a made a bit of money then a lot of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING I was doing. Soon enough Amazon started cracking down on Kindle as it was flooded with IMers using similar tactics and selling similar stories.

    -At one point I was told article marketing was the golden nugget. I did that for a while and invested in a lot of articles. However, my income with article marketing took a significant hit and now is almost non-existent.

    -I also tried list-building in a number of niches (IM and others). I noticed the open-rates and click rates are getting lower and lower. I didn't have much success with list-building either.

    I'm losing hope as after three years of doing this full time I haven't been able to achieve my objectives. I spent a lot of my savings trying to achieve my dream lifestyle of gaining a full-time income online.

    I spent so much time (not 4 hours a week, more like 60 hours a week) trying to build an online business. But nothing was every sustainable or long-term.

    This was supposed to be easy. I wasn't suppose to work so hard and make so little. If I knew this was the outcome I might as well have stayed at a paid job.

    I beginning to feel this is a game of musical chairs and it is goes round and round. Every now and then you get a seat if you know how to play the game.

    I did meet some good folks here though who are extremely helpful and genuinely wanted to help. And it is those people who pointed me in the right direction and I am thankful for that.

    Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

    I really want to be able to make a full-time income online and it is not that I want an easy way to get there. I worked very hard the last three years. It is also not because I am cheap and want a free way to get there. I spent over $30,000 in the last three years trying to get there. Just nothing seems to pan out the way I expected it to .

    Looking forward to your feedback

    Thanks,
    Mark
    You are like so many people I see her over and over again. You have a huge list of things you have tried, and AdSense is nowhere on the list. Stop the hard stuff and get to the easy money - AdSense.
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  • Profile picture of the author Joan Altz
    Imo, you should go back to some of those things that worked for you, where you made some profit, and try new ways to beat the snot out the copycats - rise above them. You're quitting too easily, letting others drive you out. You should be the one driving some of them out.

    It also sounds to me like you haven't spent much time testing anything. You just kind of follow along with someone's method and never perform tests so you can see for yourself why something works.

    When you understand why something works, not just that it works, you can apply that understanding to other things, including adjustments and improvements, and then from testing arrive at your own strategy that would be hard to duplicate unless you made it public.
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  • Profile picture of the author rmolina88
    It sounds like you tried to jump from method to method and didn't stick with one thing.

    -I was trained by an IM product development coach and he also promised me the world and said all I had to do was make my own IM product. I did that. I noticed thousands of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING.
    With everyone here telling you to make a product (and it looks like you did), why didn't you make more products? Did you ever learn how to market them?

    You mention "PEOPLE ARE DOING/SELLING THE SAME THING" over and over. If you had stuck to product creation and list building, people would have been selling YOUR product over and over!
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  • Profile picture of the author SeanSupplee
    Rule #1 if someones trying to sell you a product that says your going to earn 5k a month do you really think its going to work that well? 9.9/10 times it does not because why would someone sell you a true honest system for $97 that is suppose to make you 5k a month? It just makes no sense. Yes these products have good information in them for the price but unless you think outside the box and tweak it to your own level I can promise you your not going to make anywhere near that 5k they are saying you are suppose to make. Learn from the products and then build your own idea.

    Don't get pulled in 100 different directs or drop a project because your not seeing results in your first month. Honestly it can some times take a year before you start seeing positive results in some cases.
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  • Profile picture of the author dengkane
    There are many wonderful advices.

    In fact, I have a similar experience with you, and wasted so many time trying different methods, until I begin to think about what the most important asset is.

    It is a targeted and responsive list, yes, this is the most important asset for you as an Internet marketer.

    After I understand it, what I do every day becomes very simple. I improve my sales funnel every day, and find good advertising sources, and buy advertising to drive traffic to my sales funnel. I begain to make money effortless, and I became more and more confident.

    So, I suggest you think about for you what the most important asset is, then find ways to build the asset.
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  • Profile picture of the author xpesos
    I am sorry to hear about your heavy loss
    It was the same point for me when i started heavily studying and buying IM products
    But it somehow became turning point for me, i shut down every thing, stopped reading everything, and starting thinking days and days what i can do ..
    I suddenly realized i had some experience regarding pinterest, i knew how it worked how you can pull traffic, so i decided to make a product and sell it dirt cheap for peanuts just to grab my potential leads, i made sales thread on different IM forums
    And you know what it worked, i started a regular income,
    As my buyers community kept on growing i had always new product for them, and like always it helped solve their problem, so i had a happy community

    This is what you need to do
    . If you are expert in something try to sell it
    . If you are not try to be in one

    For all the years i wasted buying IM products, i had feeling about them that there were there to make sure i never had success online, it was success for the owners not for me
    It was only the point when i stopped hearing from others and started hearing myself, this was the turning point for me
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      You talk a lot about EXACT SAME this, EXACT SAME that.

      Didn't anyone teach you that you have to offer something unique to stand out of the crowd?

      If everyone uses the EXACT SAME banners, then I assume the affiliate company provided them, why not hire a company to design your own unique banners and test with that, or take a complete different angle with things.

      Finding a successful campaign is one thing, maintaining it is another.

      Same with normal business start ups, it can go great in the beginning but keeping up with is the hard part, that's one of the reasons why most companies go broke within the first three years.

      I went from $0/month to $10.000/month within 8 months.

      Why? Cause I offered services that almost no one was offering, and by the time they started to catch up I was already two steps ahead of the game. Some people even started to complain in my sales threads: "Why is your service changing all the time?", cause they simply didn't understand that it can always be done better.

      That's the key to maintaining success, continuosly improving your service to higher levels instead of sitting passively and waiting for it to die out or get swallowed by the masses.

      Even with a large client base you can't say, oh I just stop advertising or stop improving myself cause I have so many repeat business. Nope even that dies out when you don't stay on the edge of the game.

      Nowadays or in other words right now it's getting tough for me as well, simply cause Google is much more strict and my clients and new clients are still building crappy sites that are as good as impossible to rank. Should I start to blame my clients for that?

      Nope it's my responsibility to start educating them about how to build a site that IS able to rank well, so that I can keep them as clients and thus guarantee my income/job.

      Will I leave it at that? Hoping that my clients will follow my advice? No way, I own a business so I can't depend on others. On the side I'm starting my own projects to make money with affiliate marketing. I am closing deals with SEO companies that are also experiencing a drop in clients, they build and maintain the sites, I rank them.

      People should take the fate in their own hands instead of being dependent on others.

      You think I started to sell SEO services cause I read it in some silly WSO? No way, I launched my first affiliate site, had good results pretty fast and wanted to scale up ASAP. However I had no money to invest in content / domains and everything so I said to myself "You know what, you did a good job at a few websites, why not help other people to rank their websites", and that's how it all started.

      I also bought numerous WSO's and it only took me 5-20 minute reading to find out that it was a loser strategy that was being sold. I'm not the smartest on this planet but I do have a lot of common sense to see what might work and what wouldn't.
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      • Profile picture of the author StuartDavidson
        Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

        You talk a lot about EXACT SAME this, EXACT SAME that.

        Didn't anyone teach you that you have to offer something unique to stand out of the crowd?

        If everyone uses the EXACT SAME banners, then I assume the affiliate company provided them, why not hire a company to design your own unique banners and test with that, or take a complete different angle with things.

        Finding a successful campaign is one thing, maintaining it is another.

        Same with normal business start ups, it can go great in the beginning but keeping up with is the hard part, that's one of the reasons why most companies go broke within the first three years.

        I went from $0/month to $10.000/month within 8 months.

        Why? Cause I offered services that almost no one was offering, and by the time they started to catch up I was already two steps ahead of the game. Some people even started to complain in my sales threads: "Why is your service changing all the time?", cause they simply didn't understand that it can always be done better.

        That's the key to maintaining success, continuosly improving your service to higher levels instead of sitting passively and waiting for it to die out or get swallowed by the masses.

        Even with a large client base you can't say, oh I just stop advertising or stop improving myself cause I have so many repeat business. Nope even that dies out when you don't stay on the edge of the game.

        Nowadays or in other words right now it's getting tough for me as well, simply cause Google is much more strict and my clients and new clients are still building crappy sites that are as good as impossible to rank. Should I start to blame my clients for that?

        Nope it's my responsibility to start educating them about how to build a site that IS able to rank well, so that I can keep them as clients and thus guarantee my income/job.

        Will I leave it at that? Hoping that my clients will follow my advice? No way, I own a business so I can't depend on others. On the side I'm starting my own projects to make money with affiliate marketing. I am closing deals with SEO companies that are also experiencing a drop in clients, they build and maintain the sites, I rank them.

        People should take the fate in their own hands instead of being dependent on others.

        You think I started to sell SEO services cause I read it in some silly WSO? No way, I launched my first affiliate site, had good results pretty fast and wanted to scale up ASAP. However I had no money to invest in content / domains and everything so I said to myself "You know what, you did a good job at a few websites, why not help other people to rank their websites", and that's how it all started.

        I also bought numerous WSO's and it only took me 5-20 minute reading to find out that it was a loser strategy that was being sold. I'm not the smartest on this planet but I do have a lot of common sense to see what might work and what wouldn't.
        This is a pretty solid answer!
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  • Profile picture of the author kencalhn
    Super thread, good read for all who are struggling.

    As someone who 'made it' (fulltime online since '99), at least a comfortable living, the thing I see here is what I see in so much of the WF.. you guys are trying to become marketers first, and experts second. Cart before horse.

    It's true that some people can do just affiliate marketing and cpa and reselling stuff; that's an ok way to get one's feet wet I suppose. It's how I'm getting my wife started in a new niche she's interested in, for example.

    But the way I found works best is to gain genuine expertise, specialize in one narrow niche, then become a well known authority/expert in that niche, and develop an info business from there.

    Example: I started by gaining experience in the trading niche by actually trading for years in the late 90s, then in 1999 I started my business by producing a tutorial product, which went viral (in '99, on yahoo message boards), then I created an online course, and went from there, to now I'm a top recogized pro in my niche and publish articles, speak at expos and the rest. But it all started off very humbly, by answering the question "What did I learn that's most valuable, and how can I share that knowledge in a professional (for-pay) way with others?"

    hope that helps - best wishes. and all of you, stop with all the gimmicky how to be a marketer bright-shiny-object consumer vs producer mentality, that's useful AFTER you've become a genuine expert or can produce CONTENT, then (or while producing), learn how to market it. I've produced now 47 dvds, dozens of sites, built out a big continuity and ladder model w/internal product launches etc and have thousands of customers. but it all started off with a small following of 20-30 on yahoo message boards back in 99.

    my biggest epic fail is i don't trust people, so I did far too little w/affs/jvs (built my business with close to zero affs/jvs), which I'm working to expand on next year and beyond
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark Pescetti
    You know more than you think you know Mark.

    Take a step back.

    Press the reset button.

    There's a reason what you've done hasn't worked.

    There's always a way to succeed. Always. No exceptions.

    How can you leverage your story to connect with people, while helping them avoid the predictable pitfalls you've fallen into over the years?

    The answer to that question is the gold at the end of the rainbow.

    Mark
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  • Profile picture of the author K Mec
    Consistancy is the master key to success in any action. If you hit the nail confinuously with the hammer on the wall surely it will go through the wall but if you hit once here and once there nothing will happen.

    Prepare only one blog. Spend time on it. Check what people likes. Spend more on it. Do consistently. Have patience and see the results.
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  • Profile picture of the author yixar
    OP you can't make it in ANY business until you change your perspective. You are looking at things all wrong blaming Facebook Ads, product creation, Amazon. When all this time, the common denominator is YOU.

    Sorry to say but YOU are your probably. Einstein says insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

    Based on what you said you've been doing the same things over and over again in that you are trying everything, anything, going at it, and quitting at the first sign of hardship. Not realizing that this behavior is what has been preventing you from reaching your goals.

    My advice to you is to fix the bad habits you have. You have an opportunist mentality. Where you keep looking for the next great opportunity while not really doing anything. Fix that and I promise that the road to your goals will be easier.
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    • Profile picture of the author scottgzz
      As a newbie I really appreciate all of the valuable comments placed here by the experienced members. I've been on other forums where the experienced, successful members won't take the time to mentor the newer members.
      Thanks!
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  • Profile picture of the author theprofitjam
    Sorry for you! But do not give up! You are an an icon to those who haven't made money online and have spent less time and money than you did.

    For you I have got one idea, now that you have figured out how all things on the web works for making money online may be you can start a blog on revealing things and offers that are fake or not delivering on their promises - a review type of site who offer people to be rich online!

    Hope this helps
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris30K
    PPC, On page and off page SEO, Backlinks, Direct Mail, Split Testing, Email capturing, Writing Copy, building a membership, trying to build customer relations, CPA, Media Buying, Facebook Ads, Kindle Book writing, blogging, article marketing, bum marketing, spinning articles, landing page design, social networking, SMS marketing, Press releases, ebook marketing, video marketing, forum blasting, joint ventures, branding, affiliate marketing, classified ad marketing, offline marketing, ad swapping, telesiminars


    ALL OF THESE ARE ABSOLUTELY USELESS.

    Unless you follow this method:

    -Find the Pain - Talk to people, do research, create a hypothesis.
    -Validate the Pain Talk to people, make sure that this is a serious pain that they would pay money to solve.
    -Build a Solution (Read the Book "Running Lean" By Ash Maurya)

    After this part....

    THEN DO ALL MARKETING CRAP LISTED ABOVE!

    The solution to your problem, Mark, is truly this simple. In fact, the only time I've ever made money in my life was when I validated the pain.
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  • Profile picture of the author aleksbogata
    Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

    I really want to be able to make a full-time income online and it is not that I want an easy way to get there. I worked very hard the last three years. It is also not because I am cheap and want a free way to get there. I spent over $30,000 in the last three years trying to get there. Just nothing seems to pan out the way I expected it to .
    Don't give up Mark, you have put so much into this already. I agree that you should go find a job, it will take the pressure off and you can take this slow. Financial stress or any stress for that matter massively affects your concentration, your motivation and general well-being. When you are under that amount of stress, how the hell are you supposed to focus! Don't be hard on yourself just take a step back. Then rinse and repeat ;-)

    I think with all the things you have tried and dabbled in you could produce some killer WSOs and make your money back in no time. You have been offered some great advice from some very experienced IMers in this thread - take advantage of it all and find yourself a good coach to help you with the whole process of creating WSOs.

    I would also recommend reading a few inspirational books to get your mindset back on track. Check out this thread for recommendations.

    Or this one: Personal Development Books - your favorites!

    YOU CAN DO IT!!!
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  • Profile picture of the author StuartDavidson
    Nothing in life is easy. I don't have an answer for you, but none-the-less wanted to show my appreciation for sharing your thought provoking story.
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  • Profile picture of the author Clayton Collins
    This is some serious good advice from tons of different people. Some great, some good, some just clicks. I'd recommend reading through to find the things that click.

    See where you are and where you want to be and make a map. Seriously, write down your very own step by step guide/map to where you want to be. It'll help you find your way.

    The best exercise for almost anything in life.
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  • Profile picture of the author dbrwn
    The thing that one ahs to remember about online success is that it takes on many forms. What works for one individual may not work for another, so there's no way that you can easily say that one shoe fits all.

    Take solo advertising for example. There are many different ways to create a solo ad campaign, and there are many entrepreneurs whose lists are built on many different niches. So if you're into let's say selling water to people in the desert, then you will want to create solo ads and place them on lists that relate to people living in the desert.

    You wouldn't want to sell water to people who live in a huge city because they already have water. You will want to market to those living in desert communities and such.

    What works for one type of business and its entrepreneur may not work for your business or for you in particular. So to say that one particular formula, technique or strategy will make everybody successful is really an understatement because there's no one strategy or technique that works well for everybody.

    You're going to find that some techniques or strategies work well for certain types of businesses while other types of techniques and stratigies work for different businesses.

    So what makes one individual successful may be a total flop to somebody else. It is all in how you present yourself, your web site and your products that really makes the diffference. Just use what really works best for you and your market.
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    http://www.teachmeinfomarketing.com/truthisout

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  • Profile picture of the author sujanani
    You need to be more focused on working with only some networks learning and implementing the strategies taught there. Before joining any network as an affiliate do your own research before you join in. It takes consistent time and effort before you start systematizing your online business and generate a regular income. And most important thing is to stay positive and never give up on your dream
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    • Profile picture of the author LindyUK
      There have been some great answers in this thread, I'm jus going to add one about thinking differently.

      If your doing the same things in the same ways as others, sooner or later it comes down to a diminishing circle of opportunity - too many goldfish in the same bowl.

      I'm going to be lazy, going to post something I used in another thread, about my first lesson on thinking differently:

      I'v mentioned I started in IM in ebay, trying to sell ebooks. Wasn't very successful, I only made $408 for my whole first year. Like every one else I had big dreams of building my Business, but I had no clue really how to do it, didn't know anyone else involved with IM so I was jus buying an reading ebooks an searching on the web. I don't think WF was even going then, but if it was I didn't know about it.

      I used to like going into the MSN chat rooms, chatting up the Guys lol. One night I met John, we started talking an I found out he was from Australia an had been involved with IM Business's for 5 years. He was making a fulltime income from them, around US$75,000 a year which I viewed as a fortune then. I asked him if he would mentor me, but he said no. He said he didn't mind having a chat every now an then but he didn't have time to mentor me.

      Well, I'm not one to give up, every time we had a chat I would ask him, and he would say no, no, no. But I wore him down to where he eventually said yes.

      He started his mentoring by looking at what I was doing in ebay. I only had about 20 ebooks, most on Internet Marketing, a few recipe books and 3 on relationships, like how to get a girlfriend. I had never sold a copy of any of the relationship books, he decided to use those as my first lesson.

      He choose the how to get a girlfriend book as the first exercise.

      He said ok there are thousands of different books in ebay on thousands of different subjects. An thousands of people looking for books too, but how many might be looking for a book on how to get girlfriends, or even know one exists an listed in ebay?

      Next he said, but what if you stopped every young Guy you saw in the streets in London and asked them if they were looking for a girlfriend, an if they said yes, you then said, well go into that Hall (Building) and I'll come in an tell you how you can get a girlfriend.

      So now he said, well we have hundreds of Guys in there now who we know want to get a girlfriend. (a targeted audience) and you're the only girl in there, up on the stage in front of them, so you know their attention is going to be all on you and what your going to tell them. (a captive audience)

      So then he said, do you now think you could sell your ebook to some of them? My answer was yes, but how could I do that in real life?

      He said you build a Website, that's your Hall. And you attract single Guys to it. He also told me way back then that I needed to find other ebooks or products to sell on my website, to increase my chances of a sale from every visit to my site.

      So how we did it, it was like an Advice website for Guys, where they could ask me, being a girl, advice about other girls. I promoted in MySpace, I could target an attract Guys to my website in there. (Now you can do that much better an easier with FaceBook)

      The idea was successful from the start, the first month I sold 36 of those how to get a girlfriend ebooks plus a few others. That was more than double the profit of my whole first year. As my website grew (with more Guys coming to it) I was soon selling hundreds of ebooks a month from my website, I jus expanded the range of ebooks that would be of interest to my captive market.

      John's lesson was not only bout thinking differently, finding a different way to sell my ebooks, but also bout creating my own circle of influence, so I was not competing in a sea of others. You can do this too by building niche lists, you are then fishing in your own pond so to speak, an not competing in the big sea with all the others.

      Lindy
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      • Profile picture of the author aleksbogata
        Originally Posted by LindyUK View Post

        John's lesson was not only bout thinking differently, finding a different way to sell my ebooks, but also bout creating my own circle of influence, so I was not competing in a sea of others. You can do this too by building niche lists, you are then fishing in your own pond so to speak, an not competing in the big sea with all the others.

        Lindy
        Like it Lindy! Thanks for that story
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  • Profile picture of the author RyanGueterbock
    I counted about 9 pivots in 3 years from you OP. The problem seems to be split focus and expecting instant results. Internet marketing is just like any other business, you will be presented with obstacles, the same obstacles everyone else in a niche can choose to overcome or not.

    If you fall off the wagon at the first 5 obstacles then the guy that climbed the 6th is going to always out perform you.
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    MY EXACT BLUE PRINT TO EARN $12,950 A MONTH SELLING DIGITAL PRODUCTS.
    http://eproductmarketer.com
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    • Profile picture of the author Chris30K
      Originally Posted by RyanGueterbock View Post

      I counted about 9 pivots in 3 years from you OP. The problem seems to be split focus and expecting instant results. Internet marketing is just like any other business, you will be presented with obstacles, the same obstacles everyone else in a niche can choose to overcome or not.

      If you fall off the wagon at the first 5 obstacles then the guy that climbed the 6th is going to always out perform you.
      A pivot is with one foot to the ground. He was making full speed cuts haha..
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      Chic Fil A > McDonald's

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  • Profile picture of the author smodha
    3 years, $30,000 spent and very little reward - that's a great story that needs to be told! James Altucher failed many times in his career. He's happy to fail everyday!

    Remember, IM is a journey. It's taken me two years to get to this point and I would say 90% of that journey ended in failure. What are you good at? What did you learn in 3 years because you have TONS of experience. Identify everything you have learnt and replicate - there's money to be made.
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    I Sell What People Want. The Money Is A Bonus..
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  • Profile picture of the author Daniel J
    Mark,
    My heart goes out to you! I've been there and have fallen for many of these "quick riches" ebooks and courses. The truth (as most here will tell you) is that online income almost never comes "easy." It's a lot of work just like any other business... and sometimes even working hard will not bring the results you want. I'm still astonished how so many people seem to be doing so well with affiliate marketing, mini-site building, facebook ads, Kindle creation etc. I've dabbled in some of this stuff, but the work required for such little pay-off got me burned out quickly. I make a full time income online, but I focus almost entirely on selling REAL physical products to REAL people utilizing Amazon and Ebay (as well as my own websites- but this isn't even necessary to get started). My advice to you is don't spend another penny on courses. There is so much free information available. Ebay and Amazon themselves have tons of information to get you started right on their site! I wrote an ebook explaining my strategy (also FREE) and there are many other great ones out there (free) don't pay me or anyone any money- at least not until you're MAKING money. The best courses I bought were courses that expanded on what was ALREADY WORKING for me.

    E-commerce works for me and lots of people, but that doesn't mean it will work for you. Start small, learn as you go, and preferably start by selling some things you already have in your house (Ebay!) After you make a few $$, you'll get motivated to keep going. At that point, get as much good free information as you can! When things get rolling, that is is the time (in my opinion) to buy some of the proven courses out there. I'm so sorry to hear that you've gotten burned out on this! Good luck on your journey!
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    Click HERE to download my FREE guide and learn step by step how I make a 6 figure (profit) income selling real products online while automating and outsourcing most of the work! (no website necessary!)
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  • Profile picture of the author brutecky
    Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

    -I purchased a number of WSOs making claims of "easy money", "easily make six figures a month", "this one-hidden trick will make you $5,000 a month". And the list goes on and on. None of them delivered on their promise.
    So basically you wasted a bunch of time and money trying to find the "easy money" instead of actually working hard, learning from the forum here and formulating a real business plan. Its no wonder you failed.

    Honestly its like a broken record here. I cant make money .. bla bla .. I bought some WSO that told be Id make $300 a day while I slept and I didnt .. bla bla. so now IM doesnt work . .bla bla ..

    Im going to say this once and for all everything you need to know to make cash online is right here in the WF. Its right here, litterly. Right in front of you right now.
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    • Profile picture of the author da1fitz
      Why so negative?
      Everyone falls for the dodgy wso copy before learning better.
      Its all part of the IM lesson really - "truth is" Honesty pays
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  • Profile picture of the author da1fitz
    Hello u

    Sorry to hear that all of your IM experiments went wrong.

    Truth is - I started when u did in 2007.
    Truth is I did what you did.
    Truth is you need to release all of the stuff that you thought you knew and start anew.
    Truth is you really do need to start with a job again and get your stuff in order.
    Truth is you need to go thru the niche selection process again and relate to what you love todo.
    Truth is you need to focus on this new way of thinking and your success is guaranteed.
    Truth is you get what you believe you're going to get.

    Truth is - I wish you all of the luck in the universe with your business - and more importantly your future choices.

    Go get em
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  • Profile picture of the author Lightlysalted
    Mark Don't give up. Never. I know it feels like rock bottom now but that exactly the point most successful people reach before they turn it around. My advice is to find some part time work and keep trying but Focus is key. Stick to one product or sector. And learn everything you can about it. You will do it. I believe in you. Perhaps you just need a break and to look at things from a fresh perspective. Get free advice here. NEVER pay for coaching. In 5 years you'll be famous.
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  • Profile picture of the author discrat
    Originally Posted by marktheonlinesurfer View Post

    Hello fellow warriors,

    I have joined this forum over six years ago in 2007. And for the last six years I have been on a quest to make a full-time income online. I was so excited about this goal of mine that I even quit my job three years ago in order to finally make this dream of mine a reality!

    I thought by working full-time on my goal I will certainly make it in the IM world and make a full-time income!

    The sad part is I didn't....:-( I'm at a point now where I have eaten enough into my savings that if I don't find a job soon I will be in dire financial straits.

    I was so confident that with three years of savings I would certainly make it online!

    I would like to share with you my IM journey the last three years and I would love any suggestions and support as my confidence is now at an all-time low and I have considered throwing in the towel on IM several times now:

    -I purchased a number of WSOs making claims of "easy money", "easily make six figures a month", "this one-hidden trick will make you $5,000 a month". And the list goes on and on. None of them delivered on their promise.

    -I entered the world of CPA marketing and for a while made some money. But thousands of CPA affiliates were promoting the EXACT same programs I was promoting and before I knew it profits started to dwindle and before I knew it I was facing losses.

    -I entered the world of media-buying promoting clickbank products. For a while I did OK and made a profit. Before I knew it thousands of affiliates were promoting the EXACT SAME product I was promoting and using the EXACT SAME banners like me in fact they were using the same banners I was using and my profits started to dwindle.

    -I used Facebook Ads to promote affiliate products including WSOs and there were times when I made a bit of money and times I broke even but more often then not I would make a loss. I noticed a lot of people where doing the SAME THING like me.

    -I paid for a very expensive solo ad coaching program that promised me the world. I joined an "inner circle" that would make be the best solo-ad seller. I was expecting to make thousands each month. I noticed there are many people selling solo ads and the market is getting saturated. In fact it seems to be selling recycled clicks. Again like with the other projects I was involved this is full of people doing the EXACT SAME THING and selling the EXACT SAME THING.

    -I was trained by an IM product development coach and he also promised me the world and said all I had to do was make my own IM product. I did that. I noticed thousands of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING.

    -I entered the world of Kindle. And was coached by a Kindle "expert". I was also promised thousands each month. For a while a made a bit of money then a lot of people were doing the EXACT SAME THING I was doing. Soon enough Amazon started cracking down on Kindle as it was flooded with IMers using similar tactics and selling similar stories.

    -At one point I was told article marketing was the golden nugget. I did that for a while and invested in a lot of articles. However, my income with article marketing took a significant hit and now is almost non-existent.

    -I also tried list-building in a number of niches (IM and others). I noticed the open-rates and click rates are getting lower and lower. I didn't have much success with list-building either.

    I'm losing hope as after three years of doing this full time I haven't been able to achieve my objectives. I spent a lot of my savings trying to achieve my dream lifestyle of gaining a full-time income online.

    I spent so much time (not 4 hours a week, more like 60 hours a week) trying to build an online business. But nothing was every sustainable or long-term.

    This was supposed to be easy. I wasn't suppose to work so hard and make so little. If I knew this was the outcome I might as well have stayed at a paid job.

    I beginning to feel this is a game of musical chairs and it is goes round and round. Every now and then you get a seat if you know how to play the game.

    I did meet some good folks here though who are extremely helpful and genuinely wanted to help. And it is those people who pointed me in the right direction and I am thankful for that.

    Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

    I really want to be able to make a full-time income online and it is not that I want an easy way to get there. I worked very hard the last three years. It is also not because I am cheap and want a free way to get there. I spent over $30,000 in the last three years trying to get there. Just nothing seems to pan out the way I expected it to .

    Looking forward to your feedback

    Thanks,
    Mark
    Hey Mark,
    I thought this video might be of help to you and maybe others here. Maybe a little cheesy but it rings of so much Truth

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