Another Big Launch Goes Haywire

15 years ago

Wow, all order canceled! That sounds pretty rough.
This is all odd to me, because I would never even offer to sell something until it was thoroughly tested through a beta group, and then typically I put it on sale without advertising for at least a few hours, and THEN I email everyone, and let the sales process begin.

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Cashman

15 years ago

That's pretty disturbing. I would think with all that is on the line for the merchant there should be some liability against the payment processor. I am sure the payment processor has protected themselves against such an outcome. It's sad a payment processor can screw up and they are not really out much but they have cost the merchant big time. You make a great point that having a backup plan in place for everything possible is really important.

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powerspike

15 years ago

That would seriously hurt everyone involved. I wonder if the payment processor company panicked and pulled out? While it is true to test, test more, and keep testing, there are some things that you just can't test or plan for.

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Ron Douglas

15 years ago

What was the problem with the payment processor if you don't mind sharing?

Was it related to forced continuity?

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John Rogers 15 years ago

Originally Posted by Ron Douglas

What was the problem with the payment processor if you don't mind sharing?

Was it related to forced continuity?

I have no idea. I would only be guessing. The details in the email from the affiliate were sketchy at best.

I did do a quick search to see if the product owner disclosed any details publicly. There's no mention on his blog of anything beyond the launch of the product itself. The sales page states the product is sold out.

If the problem with the payment processor is related to forced continuity, the lesson here would be to spend some phone time with payment processors prior to making the decision on which one to use.

John
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- Ken Strong 15 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by John Rogers
  
  I have no idea. I would only be guessing. The details in the email from the affiliate were sketchy at best.
  
  Can't really learn from their mistakes if you don't know what the mistakes were.
  
  Technical glitches can happen to anybody (if that's what it was), and you can't prevent them 100%.
  
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Korey Carter

15 years ago

Payment processors are notorious for getting nervous about something and running for the hills. I have setup businesses with payment processing on the internet for years and have seen this happen many times. It's usually happens when there is a huge influx of orders that the processor is not expecting.

I have seen it happen alot of times where if you let the processor know up front that you are doing a launch and expecting a bunch of orders they will be ready for it.

I suggest always letting your payment processor know what is going to happen before it happens to protect yourself.

Now if this has something to do with forced continuity it is a whole different ballgame.

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Hackbridge

15 years ago

The creator of this product is a well seaason marketer, so it is very surprising to hear that. I saw the initial emails and ignored the rest. I saw something about deferred launch but I never opened it.

There have been so many, but my point is I'm surprised that this happened to this particular person. Perhaps he changed his payment processor?. What's to say that this is a 'ploy' to come back even better than ever with more bonuses to sweeten the pot???

Brian
Ps No offence to the creator whom I like.

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virginiad

15 years ago

The product was being sold for $1, so there must have been an incredible number of orders.

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John Rogers 15 years ago

Originally Posted by virginiad

The product was being sold for $1, so there must have been an incredible number of orders.

I didn't know the price and frankly didn't look at the offer at all, but plenty of marketers have gone that road before. It's nothing new.

John
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Minisite Nerd 15 years ago

Originally Posted by virginiad

The product was being sold for $1, so there must have been an incredible number of orders.

Well, I have no idea what the product is or who is selling it, this is the first I'd seen of this.

But I can guarantee you that if it was being sold for $1, it was most certainly a forced continuity deal. That's for sure.
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Tracy Yates

15 years ago

I remember seeing a few emails about something being sold for $1, but I don't remember seeing any email about the launch being closed. Wow, that's crazy.

I bet there's a ton of people supremely angry over this one. Just glad it wasn't me

Tracy

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mudmat

15 years ago

Hmm.. The $1 price tag seems very familiar. I think I might know which big launch is it.. It is a forced continuity alright.

Woa.. A payment processing problem for such a reputable marketer is really, really bad.

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MaxReferrals

15 years ago

Originally Posted by John Rogers

Launch deferred... Bonus deferred...

Wow, really?

Yeah, it's all getting so predictable it's funny.

How about someone offer a BONUS or hold a CONTEST open to
any Guru who can pull off a launch without any technical problems.

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Charlie Parker

15 years ago

From what I know everything was very well tested.

At the last minute the merchant account provider decided that they were not comfortable taking orders the way in which they were being processed.

I imagine that to mean they didn't like the one click upsells.

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John Rogers

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Charlie Parker

From what I know everything was very well tested.

At the last minute the merchant account provider decided that they were not comfortable taking orders the way in which they were being processed.

I imagine that to mean they didn't like the one click upsells.

If that's in fact the case, and if both parties were completely above board from the get go, I would suspect there's a good case for legal action against the payment processor.

John

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Simon Ashari

15 years ago

Originally Posted by John Rogers

If that's in fact the case, and if both parties were completely above board from the get go, I would suspect there's a good case for legal action against the payment processor.

John

John.

In a perfect world, you would think that would be the case. But unfortunately the chances are that the payment processor would have their behinds covered from every angle.

I'm not saying this as any legal authority, just think its unlikely. Lets hope he does have some recourse.

Simon

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Simon Ashari

15 years ago

ha.

hope nobody thinks that this marketer created these problems on purpose.

what better way to piss affiliates off and lose sales.

and no... any 'social proof' from the problems caused will not make up for all the money left on the table because of this issue.

normally wouldn't come out so strong, but every time something with a launch goes wrong, there are always those who think this kind of this was of benefit to the marketer and that they did it on purpose.

regards

Simon

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Donna Dueck

15 years ago

It was a 30 day trial for a $1 then a monthly subscription for $97 or $37 not sure which, it had both on the sales page. There was nothing forced about it, you could cancel at anytime.

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Minisite Nerd 15 years ago

Perhaps with the recent publicity and attention paid to some of these forced continuity programs, like the **** and google offers popular with CPA companies, some payment processors are a bit leery of letting vendors use them.

Especially on something that is looked at as a "get rich quick" product by those outside the little IM niche.
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stevenh512

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Donna Dueck

It was a 30 day trial for a $1 then a monthly subscription for $97 or $37 not sure which, it had both on the sales page. There was nothing forced about it, you could cancel at anytime.

Could you buy for $1 without creating a monthly subscription? If not, it's forced continuity, you're "forced" to create a monthly subscription to get the deal even if you can cancel it 5 minutes later. Forced continuity has nothing to do with whether or not you can cancel (a monthly subscription that you can't cancel is something entirely different, I believe there's a term for that, it's called credit card fraud). Forced continuity simply means that in order to get the "deal" (usually a product that's offered "free" or for some ridiculously low price) you have to take a "free trial" of a paid membership where you will be billed weekly/monthly/annually if you don't cancel before the "free trial" period is up.

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crissanteiro

15 years ago

I saw this but it said that it was pushed back until May 24, that he just needed to get everything right. Might have been cancelled after I read this, if he was not able to fix the problem. Who knows...

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Steven Fullman

15 years ago

Lol,

Everyone can remember the price, but no-one can remember either the product or the seller.

Not exactly Mass Control, is it?

Steve

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pub 15 years ago

Most people don't remember because we just receive so many e-mails promoting the latest top notch/wonderful/you can't live without/jaw dropping/magic bullet ebook/course/software/videos... and this every day.

So, to reply to the question it's Micheal Cheney. For $1 you could get a video where he explains how he made 1 million in 7 days. And of course you were signing at the same time to a membership site.

Anyway, what's more important for me is the "free" program everybody was promoting is not free because it costs $1. Sure $1 is not a lot but why say you get something for free when you have to pay something?
If I could find let's say 5000 persons willing to give me nothing every month on my PayPal account, it would make me $5000 per month doing really nothing.

I have received lots of e-mails asking me to buy the free stuff but only one send an e-mail to say the offer was postponed! What happened to the others? Looking in a hurry for another product to promote to replace their loss with this failed launch?
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Simon Ashari 15 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Fullman

Lol,

Everyone can remember the price, but no-one can remember either the product or the seller.

Not exactly Mass Control, is it?

Steve

Hi Steve.

we know the name of the marketer and the product. At least I do. The point was to not name names. Forum policy... even though this may not apply in this instant.

Looks like someone has spilt the beans on who it is anyways :rolleyes:.

regards

Simon
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digidoodles

15 years ago

Ok, as a newbie... would paypal do this to you?

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stevenh512

15 years ago

digidoodles, paypal does this to a lot of people, usually for no apparent reason and with no explanation whatsoever and you have to jump through all kinds of hoops to get your account back (if you can get your account back at all). as far as other payment processors.. some are better than others.. a good merchant account shouldn't do this to you unless they suspect some kind of fraud.

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dave830

15 years ago

On a related note... how many of you have a secondary merchant account, for such situations?

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archivefive

15 years ago

Mike Filsaime's Butterfly Marketing report discusses this type of issue in detail.

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Affiliate.Solutions

15 years ago

question though... how do you test for this type situation?

I can understand why should you have multiple payment possibilities.

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Lillian

15 years ago

Those who thought the payemnt processor was the problem were right. Not mentioning any names since that is not allowed I got an email that said. "The incredible demand we saw yesterday was too much for our merchant processing company to handle and we had to stop taking orders after just a few hours. YOU WILL NOT HAVE TO PAY A MONTHLY CHARGE It went on to say that "Originally, the idea behind Delta Squadron was that on top of the 18-video course "How To Make $1 Million in 7 Days" you would also get access to four live webcam training shows with me(the vendor) per month (with the first 30 days free). However - because we had to stop taking orders there were not sufficient people who made it thru into Delta Squadron for the webcam shows to be effective."

The live webcam shows have been put on HOLD until it reopens - future recurring payments are also on hold and everyone that paid their $1 and got in gets the fast action bonuses originally limited to the first few.

With my experience with this vendor, I expect him to bounce back with bigger and better offers once the problems are solved.

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Mr.Wright

15 years ago

Funny how a "big" marketer does a huge disservice to affiliates (without even making up to them in anyway) and gets away with it.

If it were a small marketer like the average joe, we would be called "scammers" and burned at the stake.

If you haven't noticed, many affiliates sent the vendor in question thousands of leads during pre-launch in the effort of making sales based on cookies at launch. Guess what, I'm sure those emails and leads will benefit only the vendor now as 90% of those cookies will expire or the affiliate tracking system will be changed and the affiliates' hardwork is all lost.

Recently too... There have been launches which I believe were purposely delayed by 1 or 2 hours because these vendors knew that many affiliates would pre-schedule emails to be sent during the exact time of the launch. By doing this, they can squeeze some more extra leads out of the affiliates.

Funny that the "big" affiliates get away with it, but anyone else does it, and they are immediately not "reputable" anymore or a "scumbag" (not my words, the words I see from some members in this forum itself). I guess it shows how "influence" plays a big role in the way this market operates and the herd mentality it fosters.

-JW

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WPQ 15 years ago

If anyone here is doing software/etc. Plimus.com while being a little pricey is wonderful. I've been using them for a half dozen products at this point.
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- Alfred Shelver 15 years ago
  
  I Love Plimus as a payment processor but some of the products that they sell and allow affiliate options to are dodgy to put it mildly i had a great product that i was making $3600 a month on until 3 months after it was found to be an illegal product purchased with stolen credit cards it destroyed a very small reputation that i had.
  
  Originally Posted by WPQ
  
  If anyone here is doing software/etc. Plimus.com while being a little pricey is wonderful. I've been using them for a half dozen products at this point.
  
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Affiliate.Solutions

15 years ago

I can understand your point and agree to some extent but you are saying that big marketers are turning to blackhat methods are a bit extreme. I can't see someone like this doing as you described to burn some bridges to make a couple extra $

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Alan Petersen 15 years ago

I usually ignore these type of big launches myself but a marketer I really admire offered an incredible bonus so I got Delta Squadron for his bonus (yep it worked on me). Not sure where I'm at with the bonus now that this whole delta squadron has been shot down in mid-air and has gone down in flames. :p

On my end it's no big loss. I paid the buck and supposedly the forced continuity aspect has been canceled by Michael Cheney. I'll still double check to make sure. But I will be bummed if the marketer cancels his bonus.

What an awful position this marketer and the other affiliates that offered bonuses have been put in. What is the right thing to do? If you offered a bonus and through no fault of your own they pull the plug. Do you honor the bonus or cancel it as well? I'm glad I don't have to deal with that quandry but I hope I get my bonus.
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Star Riley

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Affiliate.Solutions

I can understand your point and agree to some extent but you are saying that big marketers are turning to blackhat methods are a bit extreme. I can't see someone like this doing as you described to burn some bridges to make a couple extra $

I'm not sure we should degrade the term Blackhat by affiliating it with some of these online marketing huksters. You would be amazed at how many marketers use BH at least when they started to get a boost their online income.

As an SEO student I'm also a member of a highly classified BH forum and from the people who help some really Big name marketers promote their stuff at the end of the day they get paid from results.

Not sure it applies to MC launch as wolverine says Snikt happens.

When you think Black Hat anything *god does not agree with is not necessarily Black hat.

*Google

As for the forced continuity statements it is not really you have to click to add things and you can cancel in 29 days within system.

Not like another "Beloved Guru's System" who accidentally charged me 2 times whether it was my fault or not, I went through Hell trying to cancel one subscription so I just went ahead and destroyed that Credit Card I still see emails about attempts to charge and this is quite some time later.

In the long run one incident matters not it is the long term business practices of MC that will shine forward I'll stick by him he has not been one of the GURU's that had no heart.

My vote is it was unfortunate in this case and should be forgiven, if your really interested get it if not don't.

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Mr.Wright

15 years ago

The question isn't about MC's reputation or lack there of. The question is hypocrisy.

I was an affiliate of this launch and did send a few hundred leads or so (which took me months to build) towards MC's site. I deserve to be credited for it instead of him running away with my hardwork.

If I would have done the same or anyone else other than the "big" marketers would have done the same, I guarantee you that many here would destroy the marketer in question.

During the Virtual Smart Agent launch, the vendor's affiliate tracking had a small issue for the first few hours because it had a "hard-coded cookie" of the first affiliate not last. Funnily enough, many affiliates were calling the vendor a "scammer" and so on which was ridiculous but still the vendor ended up making up for it by paying out of his pocket. Why? because he wasn't as big of a marketer as MC and the other gang. Guess what, MC won't do any of that and guess what again -- All affiliates will be screwed now not 'some'.

While I sympathise MC's position, I do question the fact that on the other side of the coin, affiliates got screwed... BIG TIME. If it were a CPA Network or a business outside the "IM niche" you would have bet MC would have been in much deeper trouble.

- JW

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Simon Ashari

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Mr.Wright

[*cut*]

While I sympathise MC's position, I do question the fact that on the other side of the coin, affiliates got screwed... BIG TIME. If it were a CPA Network or a business outside the "IM niche" you would have bet MC would have been in much deeper trouble.

- JW

What do you suggest he do to rectify the situation?

I can't see any way he could make things right in this situation. His hands seem to be tied.

Simon

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Star Riley

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Simon Ashari

What do you suggest he do to rectify the situation?

I can't see any way he could make things right in this situation. His hands seem to be tied.

Simon

I personally feel He did the most stand up thing possible:

All Webcam Shows are on HOLD until we re-open later in the year.

Let me explain what happened here..

Originally, the idea behind Delta Squadron was that on top of the 18-video course "How To Make $1 Million in 7 Days" you would also get access to four live webcam training shows with me per month (with the first 30 days free).

However - because we had to stop taking orders there were not sufficient people who made it thru into Delta Squadron for the webcam shows to be effective.

The live webcam shows have been put on HOLD until we re-open.

So here's the..GOOD NEWS

Because of this I have stopped all the future recurring charges and you will NOT be billed any monthly fees to remain an active Delta Squadron member.

(all you have paid is the one-off, one-time $1 to get access and then any additional one-off payments if you bought any of the upgrades)

And here's more good news..

YOUR SPECIAL BONUS

Because I have to put a hold on the live webcam shows until the product re-opens I am giving you ALL the Fast Action Bonuses worth $2091 (even though these were originally limited to the first few buyers through the door).

PLUS..

The $1 you paid gives you full and permanent access to the 18-video training program "How To Make $1 Million in 7 Days" worth a value of $1997.

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David-JP 15 years ago

This is a let down, I was expecting someone to accuse the marketer of doing this as a tactic.
Surely someone can come up with a good conspiracy theory to this! Social proof conspiracy?

David
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Simon Ashari

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Star Riley

I personally feel He did the most stand up thing possible:

---%<---

YOUR SPECIAL BONUS

Because I have to put a hold on the live webcam shows until the product re-opens I am giving you ALL the Fast Action Bonuses worth $2091 (even though these were originally limited to the first few buyers through the door).

PLUS..

The $1 you paid gives you full and permanent access to the 18-video training program "How To Make $1 Million in 7 Days" worth a value of $1997.

Yah. If I'm not mistaken, you are defending this marketer. Hope I'm right.

I was also defending him, just incase there was any confusion

.

There really seems to be nothing he could do and no real recourse (merchant companies always make sure its their behind that's covered at all times.

unfortunate circumstance.

regards

Simon

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Willie Crawford

15 years ago

I noticed that email too but don't know the full story
behind what happened.

It did remind me of one fact though, some payment
processors are VERY uncomfortable if your products
title or promotion promises results that are too big.
I've seen several people have to scramble for new
payment processors because the third party processor
looked closely at the sales page at the last minute
and declined to allow order for the product to
processed.

In fact, I once wrote a report on How To Make $1000
In 24 Hours that Paypal asked ME to to NOT use Paypal
to process orders for. They FROZE my account until I
filled out a form agreeing to remove all mention of them
from the site.

Paypal did unfreeze my account in a matter of hours
after I confirmed acceptance of their terms of service.
So they were reasonable in that case.

You're right though, it does pay to brainstorm thing
that can go wrong with people who have done huge
launches before.

Willie

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DonDavis

15 years ago

Gee, I wonder why a payment processor would shy away from a product that references making a million dollars in 7 days...

This quote from the email is humorous;

"The incredible demand we saw yesterday was too much for our merchant processing company to handle and we had to stop taking orders after just a few hours."

To much for them to handle? Of course he can't come out and tell all of his prospective customers/affiliates that his offer was shut down because the processor was afraid of it, but can't he see how transparent his explanation was.

-Yeah okay Michael, this offer is so hot you melted down a payment processor. Wow.

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usualcliche

15 years ago

Yeah, I was half expecting this to be yet another ploy to get eyeballs on the launch. After reading further I almost feel for the guy because that could be a lot of faith lost over this incident. Live and learn and make sure all things are sorted out....least he was man enough to put a halt instead of the other way around.

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tommygadget

15 years ago

The payment processor is a link NO guru can control. Once they bounce you, it's all over.

TomG.

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Star Riley

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Simon Ashari

Yah. If I'm not mistaken, you are defending this marketer. Hope I'm right.

I was also defending him, just incase there was any confusion

.

There really seems to be nothing he could do and no real recourse (merchant companies always make sure its their behind that's covered at all times.

unfortunate circumstance.

regards

Simon

Yep I'm definitely supporting or rather calling it like I see it, for what it is worth I do wear glasses...

Originally Posted by tommygadget

The payment processor is a link NO guru can control. Once they bounce you, it's all over.

TomG.

Lets hope we become become successful enough that only 1 in a million launches catch a snag like this. I agree 100% with you both the only thing we can control sometimes is our reaction to the uncontrollable.

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Daniel E Taylor

15 years ago

How to make $1 million in 7 days. LMAO

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Cass Tyson

15 years ago

All I can say is, I wish I had problems like these!

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Eric Lorence 15 years ago

I think the title claim says it all...

More processors than Paypal would have a problem with a claim like that.
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