by barryc
23 replies
I have tried to buy 2 products through JVZoo but it get this...

"Your Purchase is not allowed.
We're sorry, but your buying privileges to this vendor's products have been removed by the vendor. Please contact the vendor for further information if you feel this is incorrect"

I have been unable to contact vendors so far, have tried to join a Facebook page for one & still waiting for approval.
It appears that I`ve done something to cause JVZoo to block all or any purchases as I can still buy via Paypal but not in JVZoo.
Any ideas?
#jvzoo #refusals
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  • Profile picture of the author Benjamin T
    I agree with Andrew... Chances are you have a history with the seller of purchasing, then asking for a refund. It appears you've been blacklisted.

    On another note, you still have full Paypal "privileges" if you can call it that. It's just that the JVZoo platform is barring you from purchasing from this certain seller.
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    • Profile picture of the author Chris Silvey
      [DELETED]
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      • Profile picture of the author 4DayWeekend
        If it isn't happening with every JVZoo product, just selected ones, then yes it'll be a case of the product creators selecting to 'blacklisting' you...

        There's a few reasons why a buyer could be blacklisted...
        • Multiple refund requests.
        • Fast refund requests (For example, before it seems feasible that you could've gone through the whole product.
        • Because you require a lot of support.

        Ask yourself, if you've bought products from these guys before and haven't been satisfied, why are you buying from them again?

        The best bet is to contact them, explain why you refunded last time and why you're interested in this product and that you're not a serial refunder. If your contact seems genuine (and you really aren't a serial refunder) i'm sure they'll give you the privileges back.

        Alternatively, if this is happening with every JVZoo product, contact the JVZoo help desk rather than the vendors.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark Hess
    To expand on this blacklist thing a little... vendors have the option of going to their
    My account ---> Buyer's Blacklist and choosing a number between 0 - 5 (how it works is explaned on this page): 2014-01-16_0622 - MarkHess's library


    So it all depends on whether the vendor has this function turned on or how aggressive they have their settings (1-5).
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  • Profile picture of the author barryc
    Thanks folks I did ask for 3 refunds last year & checked which ones they were & one was from the vendor whose product I want ,have facebook messaged him, explaining why I did it, waiting for response. However I just tried to buy another very useful new product through JVZoo & it is allowing me to buy so maybe JVZoo itself has not completely blocked me,hooray for small mercies.
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    • Profile picture of the author Danny McConnell
      I find it interesting (but believable) that someone would blacklist you for one refund.

      I have a hard time understanding why people put "60 day No Questions Asked" guarantees on products and then get all bent out of shape when someone asks for a refund.

      I have bought, and immediately returned, at least one product purchased on blind copy. Without the guarantee I never would have bought in the first place.

      Isn't that the point?
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      • Profile picture of the author Greg guitar
        Originally Posted by Danny McConnell View Post

        I find it interesting (but believable) that someone would blacklist you for one refund.

        I have a hard time understanding why people put "60 day No Questions Asked" guarantees on products and then get all bent out of shape when someone asks for a refund.

        I have bought, and immediately returned, at least one product purchased on blind copy. Without the guarantee I never would have bought in the first place.

        Isn't that the point?
        That is exactly the point. But the phenomenon is understandable given the very low barrier to entry; anyone can whip up a product and sales page saying anything they like to get some sales, and then act like drama queens when anyone takes them up on the "no questions asked" refund.

        I've seen people claim that in the IM space, a 30-40% refund rate is acceptable, so maybe some of the people who blackball every person who refunds are the ones that put out crap, sell it with lies, burn through their audience, and keep the refund rate from climbing even higher by never allowing the "kind of person who asks for refunds" (of garbage products), to do it a second time. Most people who are unhappy probably never bother with the refund, or their refund rate might be 90%.

        The good news is they probably do the would-be buyer a favor by refusing their purchase (although a bigger favor would be to take their crap off the market). I seriously doubt anyone who would act in such a childish, unprofessional manner, is capable of producing a great product anyway.

        To the OP: if this is what happened, be glad you didn't give the jerk your money. Screw them; move on and find something better.
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  • Profile picture of the author Zeus66
    Eh, I can see both sides of this discussion of quick blacklisting. Just because someone is selling a product doesn't mean they're desperate for any and all sales. Heresy? Maybe.

    I know there are all kinds of reasons to refund - some totally legit and some nefarious - but a seller isn't required to sell to anyone who comes calling any more than a buyer is required to buy from anyone offering.

    For what it's worth.
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    • Profile picture of the author Greg guitar
      Originally Posted by Zeus66 View Post

      Eh, I can see both sides of this discussion of quick blacklisting. Just because someone is selling a product doesn't mean they're desperate for any and all sales. Heresy? Maybe.

      I know there are all kinds of reasons to refund - some totally legit and some nefarious - but a seller isn't required to sell to anyone who comes calling any more than a buyer is required to buy from anyone offering.

      For what it's worth.
      I think you are correct about the legal right of the seller to ban previous buyers for any or no reason, but I didn't take this thread to be about legal rights.

      Taking the adversarial action of blacklisting, against customers who make one refund for unknown reasons, is just a bad business practice, and makes "unconditional" a term that ought to be qualified with "except in terms of future purchases from me, which will be forbidden."

      It's legal for waiters to be rude too, but not advisable if the restaurant wants a good rep.

      The IM marketplace has a bad rep due in part to sellers like this who have a bad attitude toward their customers. While you are right that there are good and bad reasons for refunding, the seller apparently didn't know the reason, since the OP only gave one after being blacklisted. Which means the guarantee was unconditional, but the real policy is to blacklist each person who has the audacity to exercise it. That to me, is ridiculous, but like I said before, the OP is lucky to be blacklisted by the jerk.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mikaedi
    Interesting topic, as far as requesting a refund is concerned..some sellers over-hype their products and when the buyer gets it they see this is not, or diffirent from what they had read in the sales page..but for one refund, highly unlikely as I'v requested one refund as well.

    Perhaps the seller has a high refund rate and the problem is actually with JVzoo, if that be the case then move on..as someone has already suggested, maybe they're selling crap product anyway.

    Mikaedi
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  • Profile picture of the author Zeus66
    Let's say you sold shoes. One day, a customer buys a pair. The next day, he comes into your store wearing the shoes and wants his money back. The shoes cannot be returned and sold again. They're used. They've got some scuff marks and the soles are worn a little. But he wants to keep the shoes and get his money back. You've offered a guarantee to refund the cost of the shoes if he asks. So you honor his request, as you should.

    Would you want him to buy more shoes from you?

    Nobody was defrauded or broke any rules. He paid based on your guarantee and then asked for him money back as you promised. He got a free pair of shoes. It's the risk you took to win a new customer.

    Did you win a new customer? Nope. You gave away a pair of shoes. I don't think it's unreasonable or somehow wrong to refuse to sell another pair of shoes to that person.

    That's the logic here. I don't ban one-time refunders, but I also don't look down my nose at anyone who does. Not only do they have the legal right to do so, they have every moral right as the business owner to choose with whom they wish to do business.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      they have every moral right as the business owner to choose with whom they wish to do business.
      This.

      Beyond that simple statement of principle, virtually everything else in the thread that expresses an opinion is uninformed. We don't know why the seller chose to block this person, and it is none of our business. Even if it were, no-one in this thread has enough information to form an opinion, much less express one as Gospel.

      The product didn't work for this customer. It appears he received a refund.

      If you think that's a reason to judge the seller, or the industry, harshly, you need to step back and examine your motivations.


      Paul
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      Stop by Paul's Pub - my little hangout on Facebook.

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  • Profile picture of the author hbhanot
    Seller just blocked your IP. Because you may be buying his products and then refund them. May be you have done it many times.
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  • Profile picture of the author absolutelee
    In jvzoo you can set various levels of blacklists. Nothing personal, I'm sure. Just vendors trying to keep from having too many refunds in PayPal, or chargebacks from credit card companies. It's easier to lose a few sales than to have PayPal keep part of your money in a rolling balance.
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  • Profile picture of the author Alex Blades
    I did ask for 3 refunds last year
    I think that qualifies as a serial refunder. I can't remember the last time I asked for a refund, but I usually buy things I need, not shiny objects.

    You really can't force someone to sell you something, I'm sure he had his reasons. There is always two sides to a story, so I doubt he blocks everyone that ask's for a refund

    We don't know why the seller chose to block this person, and it is none of our business.
    I feel the same way, there is always two sides to a story.

    I don't ban one-time refunders
    Most vendors don't, there had to be more to it.
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    " I knew that if I failed, I wouldn't regret that.
    But I knew the one thing I might regret is not ever having tried. "

    ~ Jeff Bezos

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  • Profile picture of the author barryc
    Ok ,I really like all the comments here,I only refunded from the seller once.He has the right to ban me I think but after one? He had a 30 day guarantee no questions asked. I`ve given up trying to contact as he would have seen my messages on Facebook so I`ll let it go.
    There are points for & against refunding but I think we are entitled to ask for one if product is not as advertised, & frankly some products are very flimsy. Just an overall look at method or system with no real instructions to follow.
    Any way I have a bit to think about with all the views expressed & I thank you all for them.
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    • Profile picture of the author Dennis Gaskill
      Originally Posted by barryc View Post

      Ok ,I really like all the comments here,I only refunded from the seller once.He has the right to ban me I think but after one? He had a 30 day guarantee no questions asked. I`ve given up trying to contact as he would have seen my messages on Facebook so I`ll let it go.
      There are points for & against refunding but I think we are entitled to ask for one if product is not as advertised, & frankly some products are very flimsy. Just an overall look at method or system with no real instructions to follow.
      Any way I have a bit to think about with all the views expressed & I thank you all for them.
      Yes indeed, if there's a guarantee you have every right to ask for and receive a refund. The vendor has rights too, and one of them is to not sell to people that refund his products. That's one of the risks you take when you ask for a refund.

      What I wonder is why you'd want to buy from the vendor again after buying one product that wasn't, as you say, as advertised?
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      Just when you think you've got it all figured out, someone changes the rules.

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      • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
        Most vendors don't, there had to be more to it.
        Most don't, but some do, and for no reason other than it's their preferred way of handling the issue.

        It would surprise me if there aren't groups of sellers trading lists of refunders, for that matter. I don 't think most people recognize just how angry some sellers get over the small, but persistent, serial freebie-by-refund crowd. Especially given that the same crowd is responsible for nearly all pirating of their products.

        It's easy for people with a bad attitude about the industry to get sanctimonious about how horrible sellers are for trying to defend themselves against thieves. Makes 'em feel good to bash, it seems. That really only proves they've never seen the problem from the other side.

        The fact is that the majority of sellers and the majority of buyers are operating in good faith. It only takes a very small percentage of problems on either side to create a bad impression. Especially since we have so many people who have adopted the "bash first, look at the facts never" approach.


        Paul
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        Stop by Paul's Pub - my little hangout on Facebook.

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  • Profile picture of the author Alex Blades
    It would surprise me if there aren't groups of sellers trading lists of refunders
    Another thing could be finding your product shared on a blackhat forum, and some venders will go straight to a refunder and block him.

    I remember one time, I had a product shared and only had one guy who did a refund, I blocked him right away.
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    " I knew that if I failed, I wouldn't regret that.
    But I knew the one thing I might regret is not ever having tried. "

    ~ Jeff Bezos

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  • Profile picture of the author ronrule
    To the OP: It sounds like one or more sellers have blacklisted you in the past, and the current seller is using the global setting to auto blacklist people who have been blacklisted by other sellers.

    To those who say this feature shouldn't be used, I disagree - there are lots of perfectly valid reasons to pre-blacklist a customer:

    Serial Refunders
    Those who "collect" info products and always request a refund.

    Liars
    Those who are caught using/discussing a product after they've said it wouldn't work for them and requested a refund. You'd be surprised how many people request refunds and then are noticed discussing their use of the product/strategy right here on WF a few days/weeks later. Recently I received a refund request from a customer who claimed my course was over her head and wasn't something she'd be able to use... which is perfectly understandable, we're all at different levels here. But then - in the same email - she said she couldn't open the zip file. I replied with "If you couldn't open the ZIP file, how would you know it was too complicated?" No response, and two hours later I got a PayPal dispute notice. :rolleyes:

    Rude Refunders
    Those who simply send an email saying "Refund". No reason or explanation offered. When you ask for one, they respond with "Your return policy says no questions". Sure, it does say that, which means you'll get your refund. But if you can't give me the courtesy of telling me what it was you didn't like about the product, I have no choice but to assume you're just a serial refunder/collector and as such I'm not interested in giving away my other products in the future.

    Leakers
    Those who "share" products by leaking them to sharing sites. Did you really think using the same name or sig on WarriorForum as you use on [insert blackhat forum name here] wouldn't be noticed?

    Unsuccessful Freebie Seekers
    Those who request products on blackhat sites that haven't yet been leaked. If they can't find it, they often buy and refund.

    Problem Customers
    Those who seem to have no idea why they purchased the product or how to use it, even when everything is clearly explained in the sales letter. Example: Your product is clearly a Wordpress plugin, Adsense Strategy, Facebook Strategy, etc. They request a refund because (allegedly) they don't know how to use Wordpress or got banned from Adsense or Facebook. Um, so why did you buy it?

    Late Refunders
    Those who miss the deadline for a refund, then file a PayPal dispute indicating they "requested a refund several times and received no response".

    Skimmers
    Those who "skim" over detailed instructions, then rush into execution missing important steps or details along the way. After not getting the advertised results, instead of contacting the seller asking for help figuring out where they went wrong, they publicly bash the product claiming it's a scam or doesn't work, usually also claiming they followed the instructions to the letter.

    Sneaky "Affiliates"
    Those who sign up as an affiliate only to refer themselves so they can buy at a discount. Sorry dude, but if you sign up as an affiliate and your only sale is the most expensive OTO, not only are you not getting the commission, you're getting blacklisted as a buyer and reported as an affiliate.

    Anyway, like I said, lots of valid reasons for a seller to make the decision not to sell their product to certain people. Frankly I think the global blacklist does a pretty good job of saving headache and keeping refund rates down. Sure, I want to sell as many products as I can, but I also want to keep a low sales-to-refund ratio and anything that filters out those that are most likely to refund, whatever the reason, is pretty useful.

    As a seller, you're better off having 500 sales and 10 legitimate refunds (a 2% refund rate) than 750 sales and 100 refunds (a 13% refund rate). Affiliates pay attention to those stats, and if your refund rates are high the top affiliates won't promote your products.
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  • Profile picture of the author Istvan Horvath
    To those who say this feature shouldn't be used, I disagree - there are lots of perfectly valid reasons to pre-blacklist a customer:
    Maybe... although I had a recent experience that makes me question your arguments.

    I rarely buy products and as fas as I can remember, didn't ask for a refund even when I found some products to be quite of questionable quality... (or simply lying in the salespage).

    Now, one or two months ago I was looking for some PLR stuff and came across a product that seemed to be something I could use, skimmed the sales page (my fault, I know!) and bought it. There was nothing to download, the products were accessible inside of a membership setup and they were only for personal use = "consume" them inside the membership.
    Oops, I went to their support and explained my mistake - thinking I was buying PLR - and asked for a refund. I got it.

    Later I found their similar and indeed PLR product but when I tried to buy it I figured I was banned to purchase anything from them via JVZoo.

    Oh, well.
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    • Profile picture of the author ronrule
      Originally Posted by Istvan Horvath View Post

      Maybe... although I had a recent experience that makes me question your arguments.

      I rarely buy products and as fas as I can remember, didn't ask for a refund even when I found some products to be quite of questionable quality... (or simply lying in the salespage).

      Now, one or two months ago I was looking for some PLR stuff and came across a product that seemed to be something I could use, skimmed the sales page (my fault, I know!) and bought it. There was nothing to download, the products were accessible inside of a membership setup and they were only for personal use = "consume" them inside the membership.
      Oops, I went to their support and explained my mistake - thinking I was buying PLR - and asked for a refund. I got it.

      Later I found their similar and indeed PLR product but when I tried to buy it I figured I was banned to purchase anything from them via JVZoo.

      Oh, well.
      If this happened exactly as you describe, it sounds like the seller is just a dick.
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  • Profile picture of the author barryc
    I won`t call the seller a `dick` as I have no desire to flame him, just respect his right to do as he wishes & move on.
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