Paul Closing Threads?

by donhx
28 replies
Moderated: There are several forum-wide moderators who close threads, Paul Myers did not close the thread you are referring to. So please bear that in mind.

This quote is straight from the "New Members" Sticky:

6. Remember that threads get deleted for lots of reasons, most of them having no reflection on the original poster. They can be nuked because they're the umpteenth copy of the same discussion in a short period, because they're on topics which too often degenerate into flame wars, because they have nothing to do with making money, because they're pointless, because they tend to drift into bashing, and lots of other reasons

The owner of the forum allows us to make judgment calls and I realize not everyone is going to agree with them, but we do have to make them.


I recently saw this post from Paul Myers, who we all appreciate. (Remember, Paul is not the only moderator in this forum, he is the most visible though and I reiterate, it was not him who closed that thread).


He closed a thread saying,

"Please use the search function. There have been quite a few threads on this already this year."

Is this a new policy? If it were applied evenly, that would mean maybe 50-60% of the posts would be closed down. I've been here for 4 years now, and I see the WF as a place where all the old questions are asked by newbies on an ongoing basis. Sometimes the answers are the same, sometimes they change as IM techniques evolve.

My view is that closing threads has a chilling effect on the open discussion that makes the WF so useful. Ideally, newbies should do a search before asking a question, but human nature being what it is, many do not.

Since discussion is being locked on some frequent topics, should people replying to a post do a search to make sure it has not been addressed in the past?

This is not negative criticism, only questions by someone who values the WF.
#closing #paul #threads
  • Profile picture of the author ASG1123
    The above post got moderated with appended text.

    Irrespective of whether Paul closed those threads or not, why can't mods reply like regular people instead of editing a post? What is this, Russia? I think this is an overkill. Just sayin..
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    • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
      Originally Posted by ASG1123 View Post

      The above post got moderated with appended text.

      Irrespective of whether Paul closed those threads or not, why can't mods reply like regular people instead of editing a post? What is this, Russia? I think this is an overkill. Just sayin..
      From the moderators that I do interact with it's because not all the moderators want the public to know they are a moderator of this forum, that's why.

      The mod above chose to explain themselves instead of deleting the thread.

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      • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
        Originally Posted by ASG1123 View Post

        The above post got moderated with appended text.

        Irrespective of whether Paul closed those threads or not, why can't mods reply like regular people instead of editing a post? What is this, Russia? I think this is an overkill. Just sayin..
        I see your join date is new.
        They didn't have to reply at all. They could have just nuked this thread.
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    • Profile picture of the author Dennis Gaskill
      Originally Posted by ASG1123 View Post

      The above post got moderated with appended text.

      Irrespective of whether Paul closed those threads or not, why can't mods reply like regular people instead of editing a post?
      Most of threads I've seen with a "moderated" message appended, it's done to explain a rule or policy, like "please post web design topics in the web design forum," for example. Instead of just nuking the thread, they're trying to help without getting tied up in a discussion/debate.
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  • Profile picture of the author onSubie
    Originally Posted by donhx View Post

    He closed a thread saying,

    "Please use the search function. There have been quite a few threads on this already this year."
    Ironically, if you use the search and reply to an old thread, the mods close it pretty quickly.
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
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      Originally Posted by onSubie View Post

      Ironically, if you use the search and reply to an old thread, the mods close it pretty quickly.
      That depends on the motive of the poster who reopens an old thread. Many times, it is all too apparent that a spammer with a sig link on a topic searches for all of the old threads on that topic and posts some inane crap to get his sig link in there. It's often very obvious what is going on, as there will be a bunch of old threads reopened and if you look at the posting dates, you'll see the same person opening them.
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      • Profile picture of the author onSubie
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        Depends on what they add, and how old the thread is.
        Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

        That depends on the motive of the poster who reopens an old thread. Many times, it is all too apparent that a spammer...
        I know. I know. And I have frequently trashed a long written response just before I hit 'post' when I realize it is to a thread dated 2010. LOL

        I mostly try to behave, I really do.
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        • Profile picture of the author BradVert2013
          Originally Posted by onSubie View Post

          I know. I know. And I have frequently trashed a long written response just before I hit 'post' when I realize it is to a thread dated 2010. LOL

          I mostly try to behave, I really do.
          I hate it when that happens. I write out a long thoughtful post, then realize the thread was started 3 years ago. Aaargh!

          IMO if a thread is a month old with no new comments, then it can probably be closed (not deleted). That way they're still searchable, but can't be used by spammers.
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    • Profile picture of the author George Wright
      Originally Posted by onSubie View Post

      Ironically, if you use the search and reply to an old thread, the mods close it pretty quickly.
      Lesson: Don't reply to old threads. :-)

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  • Profile picture of the author salegurus
    Everyone has their own opinion, if you are happy to reply to the same questions day in and day out well that's your choice.
    I for one am happy to see that the mods or mod are taking a more aggressive approach when it comes to threads that are in the wrong forum and some of the more repetitive threads.

    I mean how many different ways can you answer "where to start", "how can i drive traffic", "best auto responder", "best webhost", "I have X to invest" etc.
    It's true that some people can't even do a simple Google search never mind using the forum search function but there are many that do and still post the same exact question that was asked 2 hours ago.

    How do you differentiate between the true newbie innocently asking a question with someone too lazy to do some research. Also how do you keep the main forum clean if you don't close or move a few threads?

    We are all here to learn, interact, participate, there should be a balance to keep the forum interesting for all...
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    • Profile picture of the author Brian Tayler
      Originally Posted by salegurus View Post

      ...I mean how many different ways can you answer "where to start", "how can i drive traffic", "best auto responder", "best webhost", "I have X to invest" etc.
      It's true that some people can't even do a simple Google search never mind using the forum search function but there are many that do and still post the same exact question that was asked 2 hours ago...
      I have to agree with you here. Especially for those of us who have been here for many years. Your question "How can I make money online in 30 days" or "My rent is due tomorrow and I need money what can I do" may seem very specific and thoughtful to you... but man oh man... have you even tried searching yet? That question has been asked THOUSANDS of times here. Even more frustrating (for me) is that these questions or topics are usually started by an account with 1-10 posts, who joined in the last month (or two), and someone who NEVER follows up or contributes to their thread after the original post anyway. It takes away from the quality discussion and FORUM that the Warrior Forum can be.

      Your question or problem may seem specific to you... but odds are its not.
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  • Profile picture of the author talfighel
    Most of the time, people post threads with questions that have already being asked and answered to.

    So there is no need to keep them open. They get deleted or just locked down.
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  • Profile picture of the author BradVert2013
    There are A LOT of threads that should probably be closed. I can't count how many I see threads like "I have x number subscribers, what should I do" or " newbie, where do I start" and my personal favorite, "What would you do with x amount of dollars?" There's a lot of repetition, which can easily be fixed by doing a simple search.

    That said, mods can't close down every thread deals with common questions. There are a lot of new opinions, ideas and methods that members like to share and should have a chance to.

    Maybe having stickies on more common newbie questions will cut down on repetitive threads. I don't know.

    I think the mods walk a fine line here. Will they always make the right decision? Probably not. But they do keep the forum clean, I definitely give them credit for that. It's gotta be a tough job and the decisions can be subjective.
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  • Profile picture of the author David Braybrooke
    They are like the Greek Gods of the old order. They do what they want.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      As a couple of people pointed out, I'm only one of the mods. Not the only one. There are better than a half dozen who can close, move, or delete threads anywhere in the forum. Then there are mods who stick to specific areas of the place. There's a fair number of us, all told.
      Ironically, if you use the search and reply to an old thread, the mods close it pretty quickly.
      Depends on what they add, and how old the thread is.

      Most of the time, a search will give you an answer that doesn't require adding comments. If you do a search and don't find what you were looking for, there's a proper way to start a new thread. For example:

      "I've looked through a lot of threads about what web host is the best, and I've seen all the arguments about Hostgator and EIG and all that. What I couldn't find is a recommendation for a host that is specifically focused on high-traffic Wordpress sites. Anyone got a recommendation based on personal experience?"

      Most of the older threads that get bumped and then locked are bumped by spammers, or people who add something useless. That starts a slew of responses from people who don't realize the OP hasn't logged in for the past 4 years...
      Irrespective of whether Paul closed those threads or not, why can't mods reply like regular people instead of editing a post? What is this, Russia? I think this is an overkill. Just sayin..
      Well, let's see...

      Could it be, in a case like this, that the mod thought it best to make their point at the top of the thread, to avoid a cascade of irrelevant and misinformed responses? Like, for example, a whole bunch of people assuming the OP was right, and going off on a tangent from that?

      Seems to me like a sensible way to handle it.

      As far as the note which I did leave, and which was quoted in the OP... How many freaking threads do we have to have that ask "What's the best web host" before we start giving people time off over it, rather than just closing threads?

      I've seen as many as 5 threads on that topic on the front page at one time. That's not even a function of not using the search option. That's just rude.

      There's a hole in the ground where the stain used to be that was all that was left of the horse that was beaten to death in that discussion.

      Why leave the note? Because the same people jump into every one of those threads, with the same argument about why Hostgator is evil and EIG has borged half the digital galaxy, blah blah blah. If they see a warning or two, maybe they'll start to point people to existing threads, rather than having the same conversation for the umpteenth time this month.
      They are like the Greek Gods of the old order. They do what they want.
      No. We don't. Or there would be a slew of topics that are allowed now which wouldn't be, and a passel of people who'd have been removed from the forum ages past for being pains in the posterior.

      No, I am not referring to you with that comment, David.


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  • Profile picture of the author hustlinsmoke
    Lets get down to basics, its not really a question of searching, its the ones that come in, they have been here before, they make new names they start asking the same questions. Give them six or seven posts and they start spamming us.

    They don't even care about the question most the time they copy and paste it.

    And yes the rules are different for different people and there is a reason for that. If you have someone that actually helps people, they may bend the rules sometimes and the mods may look the other way.

    Do I mind, No this is not a perfect world and we need to bend the rules to benefit those who benefit us and to cripple those that want to cripple us.

    Just saying.
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  • Profile picture of the author hprice
    Half the time a well read newbie thread is duplicated/reposted its some loser trying to make a few bucks with their signature file.

    Im surprised more of them are NOT deleted.
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  • Profile picture of the author Joan Altz
    I'm of the opinion that telling newbies to search the forum is a tad rude. Many newbies aren't stupid and already know they can search - maybe they just want to start out here with some interaction or have their question addressed personally. A forum isn't just about information, it is about community. If some of them are spammers, they'll be found out eventually, but many are not spammers.

    So deleting old threads is overall a good thing imo. Telling people all the time "search the forum" is just as useless as some of the old threads. Plus, many people who would respond now did not respond back then, so why refer to some of those threads as if they hold the final thoughts on the questions posed?

    As changeable and volatile as some aspects of internet marketing is, let's not become a ridiculous historical archive of junk advice.
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    • Profile picture of the author hustlinsmoke
      WE get frustrated opening up threads with the same questions. So we say things like that. I am the one to usually take up for people but now I understand everyone else's frustration.

      We are all here for a purpose and most of us the smart ones are trying to get ahead at what we already do. Some of these people have one purpose and that is to give me a dang blasted head ache.

      Originally Posted by Joan Altz View Post

      I'm of the opinion that telling newbies to search the forum is a tad rude. Many newbies aren't stupid and already know they can search - maybe they just want to start out here with some interaction or have their question addressed personally. A forum isn't just about information, it is about community. If some of them are spammers, they'll be found out eventually, but many are not spammers.

      So deleting old threads is overall a good thing imo. Telling people all the time "search the forum" is just as useless as some of the old threads. Plus, many people who would respond now did not respond back then, so why refer to some of those threads as if they hold the final thoughts on the questions posed?

      As changeable and volatile as some aspects of internet marketing is, let's not become a ridiculous historical archive of junk advice.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      I mostly try to behave, I really do.
      [chuckle] Most people do.

      It's easy for folks to forget that there is a constant flow of new people into and through the forum. They mean well, but haven't yet learned the ins and outs of online communities. That's where mentioning the search function and pointing to useful threads that already exist is helpful. Blasting them for asking the same questions that have been asked for the past 17 years isn't.

      There's an obvious exception, but it's mostly confined to the SEO section. Some dipstick posting a thread titled "What is LSI?," with the body of the post saying, "What is LSI? Please discuss in detail." Said dipstick will invariably have a sig file that links to an SEO firm, usually in India, Pakistan, or Bangladesh.

      I'm betting all those posts come from just 3 or 4 dipsticks.
      Your question or problem may seem specific to you... but odds are its not.
      Yep. We go through a lot of this. Just had yet another conversation today about a topic that gets brought up monthly, and has for years and years. Same frustrations, same response. I keep hoping someone will actually have useful suggestions, but they're always the same.

      One day, I'm gonna get surprised and the conversation will yield something new.
      I'm of the opinion that telling newbies to search the forum is a tad rude.
      Really?

      Which makes more sense to you? Asking the person who needs an answer to do a few minutes worth of work to see if it's already here, or asking the group in general to waste their time repeating the same things they've already answered 17 times before?
      As changeable and volatile as some aspects of internet marketing is, let's not become a ridiculous historical archive of junk advice.
      Wow. Totally missed the context.

      Did you catch the part of the quote that started this where I said "quite a few threads on this already this year?" Considering it's only February, and this wasn't a highly technical topic, I doubt the answers would be all that outdated.

      The concern about old info is valid, certainly. That's another reason we lock really old threads that get necrobumped. But it doesn't apply to most of the times people are asked to do a search.


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      • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        There's an obvious exception, but it's mostly confined to the SEO section. Some dipstick posting a thread titled "What is LSI?," with the body of the post saying, "What is LSI? Please discuss in detail." Said dipstick will invariably have a sig file that links to an SEO firm, usually in India, Pakistan, or Bangladesh.

        I'm betting all those posts come from just 3 or 4 dipsticks.

        Yep. I can vouch for that. If anyone can locate those 3 or 4 dipsticks, please take away their keyboards.
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    • Profile picture of the author salegurus
      Originally Posted by Joan Altz View Post

      I'm of the opinion that telling newbies to search the forum is a tad rude.
      Really, Is asking someone to do a bit of research really that bad? In most cases they would have the answer to their question in minutes instead of maybe waiting an hour or more for a decent reply...


      Originally Posted by Joan Altz View Post

      As changeable and volatile as some aspects of internet marketing is, let's not become a ridiculous historical archive of junk advice.
      And that's exactly what would happen if you had 10 threads on the forum asking "where do i start"...
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  • Profile picture of the author Brent Stangel
    The owner of the forum allows us to make judgment calls and I realize not everyone is going to agree with them, but we do have to make them.


    And they don't have to explain them, but often do.

    How can you complain about that?
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Brent,
      And they don't have to explain them, but often do.

      How can you complain about that?
      "I disagree." That's all the justification some folks need to start flinging accusations around.

      Most folks are reasonable. Some will either get their way or demand a pound of flesh instead. When it becomes apparent that we're dealing with the latter type, the preferred option is lobotomization. Since that would be redundant, we settle for a ban.


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  • Profile picture of the author XponentSYS
    To say I would be BEYOND THRILLED if the MODS would launch a campaign to nuke all those stupid and pointless "If you have $300.00 to spend....." threads, would be an understatement.

    I'm sort of poking fun but on all seriousness.....

    This is a massive forum, the likes of which are a massive undertaking to moderate and run. I have no qualms about how Paul or any one of his peers run the show.
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  • Profile picture of the author Graham Maddison
    I personally think the "Mods" do an excellent job, but I do have one personal gripe and that is on occasion, I have been guilty of inadvertently starting a new thread in the "wrong forum" and it subsequently gets moved.

    On one occasion I specifically remember using the search function to find my thread, but to no avail. This then caused me to doubt myself - had I violated the forum rules? convinced in my own mind I hadn't and being annoyed at the time, I posted another thread asking why my post had been deleted.and a courteous reply from Mr. Paul Myers, explained that it had been moved to the correct forum.

    I fully understand the actions of mods in cases like this, but my gripe is this: why when moving threads such as this, can mods not simply send a pm to the op with a link to the thread in the correct forum? It would certainly stop frustration and a vast amount of the threads "why has my thread been delted?"

    Now before you say anything, I know you guys are busy and sending pm's to all and sundry will add to your workload, this is just a gripe I have and nothing more... I have gotten used to it and do my utmost to post in the correct forum.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dennis Gaskill
    On one occasion I specifically remember using the search function to find my thread, but to no avail.
    Instead of doing that, click your user name and select "Find more posts by Graham Maddison" and you'll get a list of all your posts in chronological order. It's very easy to find where your threads are moved to that way ... unless it's been deleted, of course.

    At the time of this writing, your last post was to ask someone why they didn't use the poll feature for the question they asked. You probably won't get an answer because it was a 4 year old thread, but at least you weren't the one that dredged it up for no useful reason.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Graham,
      why when moving threads such as this, can mods not simply send a pm to the op with a link to the thread in the correct forum?
      Why should the mods waste significant chunks of their days telling people things that anyone old enough to be a member here should be able to figure out if they've read the rules?

      There is an additional problem with "explaining" decisions. It leads to ridiculous arguments.

      I deleted a comment someone left in a WSO thread recently, and informed the poster by PM that they were welcome to repost their comments, but they could not use LARGE RED FONTS or personal attacks to do it. He accused me of all sorts of conspiratorial nonsense, and alleged that I was somehow protecting a seller from negative comments for my own personal gain.

      Wrong, and wrong.

      The BIG RED FONTS trick is one used by people who want to artificially give their comments more weight than the thoughts of the other people around them. It's like screaming over a civilized conversation. Rude, and an improper tactic.

      The cause of his self-righteous ire? He had a download problem, which was almost certainly user error. (Lots of other people posted reviews the same day.) The seller in question wasn't quick enough to answer his messages - on a Sunday morning.

      This is not an uncommon example.


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