Single-optin or Double-optin

31 replies
Hi Warrios,

I have to apologize at the beginning of this thread if this thread is in wrong place and I would like to ask moderators to move it to appropriate place if this is the wrong one.

But back to topic of our thread. Very simple question:

What would you prefer single-optin or double-optin? Why?

Brief explanation about both optin methods:

- Single-optin -> User is added to your list without confirmation message
- Double-optin -> User is required to confirm their subscription by clicking confirmation link that is sent to user's email.
#doubleoptin #singleoptin
  • Profile picture of the author jamescanz
    Single.

    Ever since I realized how many optins I was missing with double...

    I changed and never went back.

    And if you feel like you are getting 'random emails' signing up...

    You can always 'clear the clutter' of people who have never opened an email
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    • Profile picture of the author Lokki08
      Originally Posted by jamescanz View Post

      Single.

      Ever since I realized how many optins I was missing with double...

      I changed and never went back.

      And if you feel like you are getting 'random emails' signing up...

      You can always 'clear the clutter' of people who have never opened an email
      Hi James,

      Thank you for your reply. Today I made my first solo ad and I noticed that I only got 7 confirmed subscribers and 21 lost subscribers from 112 clicks, which is huge loss, since 75% of subscribers were lost .

      I got very good advice from the solo ad seller and turned off double-optin and now I need to test the results. I tested it also with one of my PPC campaign and received 5 subscriptions, where 1 is confirmed and 4 was lost due to double-optin :/. It really sucks.

      I hope single-optin is making better results and I probably put some of them here once I have done the test to help other marketers in this
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      • Profile picture of the author jamescanz
        Originally Posted by Lokki08 View Post

        Hi James,

        Thank you for your reply. Today I made my first solo ad and I noticed that I only got 7 confirmed subscribers and 21 lost subscribers from 112 clicks, which is huge loss, since 75% of subscribers were lost .
        Yea, that's exactly why I never looked back after changing to single

        Still even if you had single optin on, it seems like your squeeze page needs some work...

        28 subs out of 112 clicks is only a 25% conversion

        Originally Posted by Lokki08 View Post

        It really sucks.
        It's a learning experience
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  • Profile picture of the author blueclcl
    I go for single opt in all the time now in the IM niche.

    I also place a message at the top of each email informing them that they signed up to my list and that is why they are receiving the email. I also inform them that they can unsubscribe if they wish.
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    • Profile picture of the author Lokki08
      Originally Posted by blueclcl View Post

      I go for single opt in all the time now in the IM niche.

      I also place a message at the top of each email informing them that they signed up to my list and that is why they are receiving the email. I also inform them that they can unsubscribe if they wish.
      Thanks blueclcl, that's good advice. Speaking about unsubscribe I think they will notice unsubscribe link in each message you send, since it's compulsory.
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    • Profile picture of the author Robert Puddy
      double optin... because all that clutter mentioned above causes your sender score to be vastly devalued, and most of your emails become undeliverable.

      its no good having 5 times as many people on your list with single than you get with double if 80% of your emails are going to the spam folder or more importantly never even getting to the recipients inbox with email providers just sending all your emails into the server bin.

      Deliverability is the king here not list size
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      • Profile picture of the author Lokki08
        Originally Posted by Robert Puddy View Post

        double optin... because all that clutter mentioned above causes your sender score to be vastly devalued, and most of your emails become undeliverable.

        its no good having 5 times as many people on your list with single than you get with double if 80% of your emails are going to the spam folder or more importantly never even getting to the recipients inbox with email providers just sending all your emails into the server bin.

        Deliverability is the king here not list size
        That's good point Robert, thank you for your reply
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      • Profile picture of the author Super Affiliate
        Originally Posted by Robert Puddy View Post

        double optin... because all that clutter mentioned above causes your sender score to be vastly devalued, and most of your emails become undeliverable.

        its no good having 5 times as many people on your list with single than you get with double if 80% of your emails are going to the spam folder or more importantly never even getting to the recipients inbox with email providers just sending all your emails into the server bin.

        Deliverability is the king here not list size
        I totally agree. Though I use quite frequently single optin and it's a way to build your list faster, the quality of your list significantly decreases and you'll have to pay a lot more for all those subs that never even open your emails. It is quite costly to pay for over 10k list when all you got is 200-300 people who open your emails.
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      • Profile picture of the author thetacrm
        Originally Posted by Robert Puddy View Post

        double optin... because all that clutter mentioned above causes your sender score to be vastly devalued, and most of your emails become undeliverable.
        Double or single, it is not the confirmation that increases the sender score.

        The reason for double optin is only to avoid the abuse, like someone entering third party emails, and I guess this rarely happens. But abuse nevertheless can happen with double optin as well, at least for the first email. In general, if marketer has a good landing page and clear product that does not attract abusers, single optin is fine.

        There is interesting approach that instead of confirmations one simply ask for action, and each click on such link would represent confirmation in itself.
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        • Profile picture of the author John Pagulayan
          There are many ways to go about this. And many marketers have different views. You know why?

          Because each of them have their own experiences with both!

          Bottomline here is, do what works for you and always track and test your conversions. I mean, the end goal is always the ROI.

          If double opt in/confirmed opt in bought you less subscribers but more ROI then why use single opt in? If single opt in bought you better ROI then so be it.

          Sometimes as marketers we need to be reminded that our goal is to maximize how much we earn and not to just have a huge list.
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  • Profile picture of the author lotsofsnow
    Single optin is usually fine.

    Most autoresponder companies clean out bounced emails anyhow. That meansthe small percentage of bogus emails will be filtered out.
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  • Profile picture of the author pensfan6636
    I primarily use single opt in. But honestly it really just comes down to what your goal is. You will have a more responsive list if you use double optin, but many people will not cofirm. If you are building a list via solo ads then its best to use single opt in. This is what I have found to work best. If you have an opt in form on a blog then I have found double opt in to work pretty well. Just a different kind of traffic.
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    • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
      I think you mean confirmed opt-in, rather than double opt-in.

      Deliverability would be an issue only if your original offer/pitch were unclear or too widely targeted. Otherwise - and certainly in any niche outside of IM - single opt-in is far preferable. There's no need to force
      potential subscribers to go through any more stages than necessary.


      Frank
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  • Profile picture of the author nicheblogger75
    Definitely single. If you use double opt-in you will lose many subscribers. Many things can happen. Confirmation emails can end up in the "spam" or "promotions" folder and never be opened, ARs can have glitches that cause the confirm emails not to go out, etc.

    The important thing if using single opt-in IMO is to do what others have suggested in this thread, and that's to put a reminder in each email telling the subscriber when they signed up, etc.

    Also, never make it so there is tons of space between the end of your email body and your unsubscribe link. I see a lot of marketers doing this in hopes of concealing the unsubscribe link and not only is this an unethical thing to do, it's a big no-no with several ARs as well. Make sure your unsubscribe link is highly visible. My rule is never put more than 2 blank lines of space between the end of your email and your unsub link.

    One of the problems that you can run into with single opt-in, however, is when you buy solo ads. If the seller is not honest and ethical and is using bots or some other underhanded method to make it look like you are getting tons of opt-ins, this cannot be caught if you are using single opt-in. If you are using double opt-in you will easily see this because you will get lots of opt-ins but none of them will confirm.

    There are some red flags that should go up if this is happening. For one if you get conversions higher than 60%, you should always double check and see if they are real. You can do this by simply sending out an email to just those new subscribers and see what kind of response you get. If you do not even get a single subscriber to open your email, then you know you have probably been scammed. Another sure-fire sign is a low number of IPs. For instance if you got 100 visitors to your offer but only 15-20 different IPs, it could mean you have been scammed.

    Overall though, for those who are building lists in the MMO/BizOpp niche, single opt-in is the way to go.
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    • Profile picture of the author criniit
      I have several lists of over 100,000 subscribers and I run a very successful Solo Ad Business. Here is the deal.

      If someone dosen't take the time to actually confirm their email then they don't actually have any interest in hearing what you have to say and just want the "freebie".

      I have done an insane amount of testing, and sent over 1.5 million emails in the last 5 years. I can tell you without a doubt, a double confirmed opt-in list is VASTLY more responsive and will have a MUCH larger percentage of people who want to hear from you and buy from you.

      When building a list it is all about the responsiveness of the list, not the size.

      However if your lead magnet (the free giveaway) is crap then you won't have many people confirming their email. It needs to be a really valuable giveaway to be able to get a high confirmed opt-in rate. On my own lead magnets I only lose around 2% of people who enter their email and don't confirm.

      What is the best and most attractive lead magnet I have found?

      Case Studies by far! People love reading them and they are much more valuable than some free ebook you probably bought as PLR.
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      • Profile picture of the author Lokki08
        Originally Posted by criniit View Post

        I have several lists of over 100,000 subscribers and I run a very successful Solo Ad Business. Here is the deal.

        If someone dosen't take the time to actually confirm their email then they don't actually have any interest in hearing what you have to say and just want the "freebie".

        I have done an insane amount of testing, and sent over 1.5 million emails in the last 5 years. I can tell you without a doubt, a double confirmed opt-in list is VASTLY more responsive and will have a MUCH larger percentage of people who want to hear from you and buy from you.

        When building a list it is all about the responsiveness of the list, not the size.

        However if your lead magnet (the free giveaway) is crap then you won't have many people confirming their email. It needs to be a really valuable giveaway to be able to get a high confirmed opt-in rate. On my own lead magnets I only lose around 2% of people who enter their email and don't confirm.

        What is the best and most attractive lead magnet I have found?

        Case Studies by far! People love reading them and they are much more valuable than some free ebook you probably bought as PLR.
        Hi criniit, I'm currently learning and making lots of test about list building, but when I read your reply, I just thought one thing. Why people would even subscribe to my list, when after clicking subscribe button they will be directed to a dynamic page where is shown that they must confirm their subscription?

        Would it be because they might have thought that they would get immediate an access to my provided stuff once they click subscribe button?
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    • Profile picture of the author Lokki08
      Originally Posted by nicheblogger75 View Post

      Definitely single. If you use double opt-in you will lose many subscribers. Many things can happen. Confirmation emails can end up in the "spam" or "promotions" folder and never be opened, ARs can have glitches that cause the confirm emails not to go out, etc.

      The important thing if using single opt-in IMO is to do what others have suggested in this thread, and that's to put a reminder in each email telling the subscriber when they signed up, etc.

      Also, never make it so there is tons of space between the end of your email body and your unsubscribe link. I see a lot of marketers doing this in hopes of concealing the unsubscribe link and not only is this an unethical thing to do, it's a big no-no with several ARs as well. Make sure your unsubscribe link is highly visible. My rule is never put more than 2 blank lines of space between the end of your email and your unsub link.

      One of the problems that you can run into with single opt-in, however, is when you buy solo ads. If the seller is not honest and ethical and is using bots or some other underhanded method to make it look like you are getting tons of opt-ins, this cannot be caught if you are using single opt-in. If you are using double opt-in you will easily see this because you will get lots of opt-ins but none of them will confirm.

      There are some red flags that should go up if this is happening. For one if you get conversions higher than 60%, you should always double check and see if they are real. You can do this by simply sending out an email to just those new subscribers and see what kind of response you get. If you do not even get a single subscriber to open your email, then you know you have probably been scammed. Another sure-fire sign is a low number of IPs. For instance if you got 100 visitors to your offer but only 15-20 different IPs, it could mean you have been scammed.

      Overall though, for those who are building lists in the MMO/BizOpp niche, single opt-in is the way to go.
      Hi nichblogger and thanks for your advice. I really appreciate it. One of my goals in building list is to be ethical. I don't want to be a spammer, or somebody who doesn't care about his subscribers. I want to help my subscribers with things that I have promised them with.

      Today I got first bogus subscriber with single-optin type, since it's address was obvious I simply removed it from my list.

      But I will not forget your test methods about checking whether I got scammed or not. I choose my solo ads people very carefully and I make some research about them before I start doing it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Randall Magwood
    Single for me. Double didnt really bring in higher conversions for me.
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  • Profile picture of the author l0gic
    When I launched my first info product I started with a double-optin on the thank-you page for my buyers to receive the download link and future updates. Even those buyers, who literally JUST bought my product and want to download it, sometimes wouldn't confirm.

    It sucks because I can't even legally email them directly to tell them that they haven't finished the process because they haven't confirmed.

    Just something to keep in mind, many people will receive the confirmation in their spam folder or simply won't confirm, even when they've BOUGHT your product.
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  • Profile picture of the author JensSteyaert
    Single optins are always best, no matter what some may claim.

    Most people are lazy and won't confirm, or get distracted...

    It's a simple fact that you'll make more money with single optins, without a doubt, so that should answer your question i think
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  • Profile picture of the author wentzco
    If you buy solo ads - use double opt-in. It will catch scammers as well as identify quality of subscriber list. You should have 70-80%+ of subscribers that initially opt-in confirm their subscription IMO... unless the clicks you bought from solo ad seller aren't as high quality as they should be (people using bogus or non-used email addresses). Quality of your opt-in page & offer also will make a difference... do they really want to receive your info? Think about what you do when you subscribe to an offer/e-zine with double opt-in... do you confirm the subscription?


    Here are some exact examples for me


    Solo ad scammer #1 - I had 111 clicks from him with 50 "pending" subscribers that never conformed their subscription (I have double opt-in). Yep - 0% opt-in rate is what I got.


    Solo Ad Scammer #2 - 105 clicks with 42 "pending" subscribers that never conformed their subscription - 0% opt-in


    Here's an example of a legit solo ad seller who I buy 100 clicks from & they send 109 clicks in a fast time - I get 23 confirmed with double opt-in shortly with another 23 pending. In a few hours about 12 of those 23 that were pending confirm so I have 35% opt-in. (30-45% is typical depending on seller). A couple more confirmations usually trickle in the next day.


    You will have a higher quality & more accurate subscriber list though you will miss some legitimate people who fail to confirm their subscription. It will be cleaner, more responsive & have less spam complaints.


    Let's talk about "open rates" as well. I have a double opt-in campaign & the first automated letter sent to people gets a 66.55% open rate.


    I don't use MailChimp but they have a good post here talking about double opt-in & single opt-in with actual stats. Double Opt-in vs. Single Opt-in Stats | MailChimp Email Marketing Blog (dramatically higher open & click rates with double opt-in)

    Heck - even if you don't buy solo ads - use a double opt-in. What sense is it to have subscribers that don't open your emails?
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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    Single.

    Nothing to be gained by using double optin.

    Name personalization is old and outdated.
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  • Profile picture of the author Vincent Denali
    I've always used double opt-in. My overall list might be a little smaller because of this extra step but I'm more about quality over quantity so I'm OK with it. I have about 10-20% that I loose because of the extra (confirmation) step. If it were the other way around say if I lost 80-90%, I would consider single opt-in. At this point, double opt-in.
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  • Profile picture of the author Edlund88
    I would say it depends on what you use your list for. If you want to build a relationship with your list and get a good responsive list, then go for double optin.

    However if you will build your list by doing lots of ad-swaps, then you would probably want to go with the single optin, because you will probably not be build a relationship with them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Lokki08
    I made few tests and here are some points that I have found:

    With my new elements tested I turned my 27% converting Squeeze page into 56% converting squeeze page. Here are some tips that I highly suggest doing:

    1. User Power Words in your headline, like FREE, skyrocket your chances of success, simple but power method, revealed and so on.

    2. Have strong bullet points that really lure people to subscribe to your list.

    3. Use double optin at the beginning and remember to add notification somewhere near your submit button that a subscriber must confirm his/her email in order to get the stuff.

    4. If you use double optin also add custom thank you page where you point out again that subscriber must confirm, this is because that you make sure that he/she get the message that they must confirm so that you don't waste one opportunity to get your subscriber.

    5. If double optin doesn't convert for you, try single optin.

    6. This is very important point which is obvious is to do very much split testing!!!
    * Test different squeeze pages, headlines, bullet points, graphics, call-to-actions.
    * In your autoresponder test different follow-up messages and subject headlines.
    * Make one test at a time/squeeze page, analyse it after you have sent a new round of clicks and write down your results

    7. If you are using solo ads, remember to test different solo ad sellers. It really matters!

    8. Learn from mistakes!
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  • Profile picture of the author NK
    I would go for single optin, simply because a LOT of people won't click that confirmation link because they decided they don't want to be in, they forgot about it or they don't know how to do it.

    But as a few others have said above - test them both and check your results. If everything is equal and you're not getting spam reports, stick with single.
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