Buyer asking for a refund after sharing my product on black hat forums. What would you do?

I think Alexa is spot on here.

I found myself getting angry just reading about what this guy did, but in situations like this you must elevate your level and not meet people at theirs.

Best of luck!
-Pedro

Don't look now, but (just like Gerald Ratner, before him) he did his business quite a lot of harm with those, and has now extensively and repeatedly apologised in public, and withdrawn his rude remarks, and done a series of interviews to try to get the message across that "he's a nice guy really, and unreservedly sorry for what he said", in an attempt to mitigate some of the damage he did. They've spent a fortune trying to undo the negative publicity they got.

A myth!

Negative publicity can be very damaging. Businesses shave gone under because of it. It depends on the circumstances.

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Which he probably thanked you profusely for, laughed behind your back, and then shared all over Black Hat forums. Pirates are pirates. They aren't customers and they aren't "normal people."

I share and approve of and endorse the sentiment entirely, but I'd never actually do this because I'd expect it to make such situations worse, overall, rather than better.

You can't approach such people with logic and reason: they have a totally different moral compass from the one you and I share; they genuinely believe that they're right and we're wrong. There's no point in trying to educate them, in that context. They're too stupid. That's just going to come across to them as a "challenge" and increase the chances of them uploading our products to torrent/file-sharing/subfusc-headwear sites.

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That's exactly what I just did. Placed a refund and continued working on my next product.

@Alexa - You're right, there's no education or nice talk here. They just live for to "REP" stats on their forums and are lurking daily for new stuff to snatch. Most of them are hiding behind - "freedom to information" statement which they don't even understand..

I hope this topic will help other marketers in similar situations. Try not to get agitated but just push that refund button, take a long walk and focus back on your goals

No refund.

Assume you have a refund policy - still no refund.

IMHO, and I won't mince words here - anyone giving this thief a refund is an idiot and either shouldn't be in business or their business isn't worth much.

(Yes that's harsh and everyone is entitled to their own opinion and every situation is different. I said "this thief." This is someone stealing from you and to say as a blanket rule sure, no problem, have a nice day, have my product, give it to others, would you like something else to steal? - doesn't make sense to me.)

The next thing you do is submit DMCA take down notices to the BH forum and its web host for contributory infringement. I am not sure how your direct link is working, or if you can change it. Perhaps with some php or htaccess you capture the referrer and block anyone coming from the BH forum.

The next thing you do is add his email to the blacklist on JVZoo.

If the buyer is identifiable and in the US (rare), consider registering the copyright with the US Copyright Office and send him a demand letter for $5000 or you'll file suit.

If you have that info you forward it to the appropriate district attorney's office and hope they are not too busy chasing drug dealers to take action.


As for why there is no refund even if there is a refund policy, why would you? This person stole from you. He is taking money out of your bank account no different than if he stole your wallet. Taking money you could be using to feed your family.

You're not in breach of any agreement to refund because the buyer is already in breach of the purchase transaction by giving your product to others.

I can't think of any place other than this forum, and certainly not any physical store, that when catching someone stealing from them they would reward and send the thief money.

LOL. No, he won't. (From a lawyer)

Have some pride in yourself and your product. And grow a spine.

Otherwise, there is nothing to stop someone who didn't even buy your product from simply demanding monthly payments so they won't create bad publicity for you. Has anyone suggesting this even thought this out?

This I agree with. You don't want to waste time corresponding with the idiot and you never want to get in a debate where someone has the opportunity to make threats, etc. You will find the JVZoo block and submitting a DMCA complaint can be done in a minute.

Learning how to block improper downloads of your product is time well spent.

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Wow, guys thanks for your engagement and additional suggestions.

I've written it in one of my posts but the guy didn't receive a refund in the end!

One thing I didn't mention before - he actually send me an email asking why I'm such a prick?

Because, some other product vendors willingly upload their products on black hat forums and encourage sharing... By doing so, I can only have benefits because more people will use my product!

After that, I just thanked him for helping me reach broader audience

Lessons learned for future launches:
- better download protection
- updating refund policy
- stop wasting any time on those "freedom fighters"
- ....continue the list...

Hi guys,

Bit late, but I was just wondering how the actual blackhat sites survive? How can a forum that's sole purpose is to distribute paid content not be taken down by the hosting company and the owner taken to court as the hosting company would know their name, address etc.

Moreover, why do Google index these sites?

Thanks for this, surely the problem lies with the forum as well? It is providing a convenient method to be able to search for links to file host sites that have the product to download.

While they are not directly hosting the product, the forum is what should I say a 'hub' of illegal activity and its primary motive is to promote sharing of links to where the product is hosted? So how come the blackhat sites/forum get shut down?

Thanks