These damn CON MEN peddling lists as a miracle. "from zero to $30,000 a month with my list!"

53 replies
A friend gave me a three hour webinar and I went in actually excited.

Then the presenter starts in with:

"the list makes thousands a day! " or..." one of my students made $17,230 last week and another made themselves $200,000 on the down low" whatever that means.

Am I wasting my damn time? I'm in the fitness niche
I have a list. Dunno how to grow it.
These guys are nothing but liars. Right?

I bet the top 0.005% do make $6000 a week, but what a scam I'm starting to feel it all is.
#con #damn #lists #men #miracle #peddling
  • Profile picture of the author Charles Goodnight
    If it walks like duck...

    Trust your gut. Build your list yourself so that it is full of people interested in your niche. These list "deals" usually are scams or full of names that wouldn't think twice about reporting you as spam.

    -CG
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  • Profile picture of the author onSubie
    No, you are not wasting your time. A list can dramatically increase your income and customers.

    I cannot comment on the webinar because you gave zero information. But it was probably a sales pitch for a product so obviously will be aimed at promoting that product.
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    • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
      Originally Posted by onSubie View Post

      No, you are not wasting your time. A list can dramatically increase your income and customers.

      I cannot comment on the webinar because you gave zero information. But it was probably a sales pitch for a product so obviously will be aimed at promoting that product.
      Here it is

      Marketing With You - Marketing with Alex Jeffreys

      1. I have a list on getresponse but am having one hell of a time building it. Under 100 people.

      2. He's already gotten to the part on the audio (am listening not watching it) where he paid someone $5000 for a mentor so guess that's what we're looking at hahaha.

      I just need traffic to my site I guess.
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      • Profile picture of the author Richard Tunnah
        Originally Posted by stevenjcampbell View Post

        Here it is

        Marketing With You - Marketing with Alex Jeffreys

        1. I have a list on getresponse but am having one hell of a time building it. Under 100 people.

        2. He's already gotten to the part on the audio (am listening not watching it) where he paid someone $5000 for a mentor so guess that's what we're looking at hahaha.

        I just need traffic to my site I guess.
        Alex Jeffrey's is a well known successful marketer that makes 7 figures and has helped others make significant money. HOWEVER that doesn't mean that his system or him are a good fit for you. There is no one shoe fits all as there's thousands of people from all over the world with different skill sets, assets and that learn in different ways.
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      • Profile picture of the author Richard Tunnah
        Originally Posted by stevenjcampbell View Post

        Here it is

        Marketing With You - Marketing with Alex Jeffreys

        1. I have a list on getresponse but am having one hell of a time building it. Under 100 people.

        2. He's already gotten to the part on the audio (am listening not watching it) where he paid someone $5000 for a mentor so guess that's what we're looking at hahaha.

        I just need traffic to my site I guess.

        Steven,
        By the way naming anyone on here is against the rules plus associating someone with con man isn't a good idea without a significant bank balance and a very good lawyer!
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  • Profile picture of the author sonny williams
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    • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
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      • Profile picture of the author Simon Anthony
        (Moderated)

        Steve,

        Please please don't take this the wrong way, but I would change your website theme ASAP if it's Wordpress. I don't think it's visually appealing at all. That puts off more people than you would imagine. If you want to appear professional, get a professional looking site, because I can tell you right now that the competition already has, and I haven't even seen them. This is 2014 and you need a modern website.

        As for your popup. I wouldn't be surprised if not many people opt-in to be honest. There's no sales copy on the popup that grabs attention and makes people want your report. It doesn't state any benefits or reason why they should download it. You need to state what they will get out of it. Give them a big reason to download it.

        Please do not be offended by what I say. I am genuinely trying to help, but my words may sound a little harsh. I don't mean it that way, so please don't take it badly. I am trying to help you.

        But I would definitely update your sites look ASAP and remove the popup to a sidebar optin box and one below each post, and maybe an exit pop too. It's been proved that people HATE popups, especially immediate ones like yours. The reason why is that when someone lands on your site they don't know you. They don't trust you or know a thing about you or what you do. They need to see your content and decide that they like what you have to say before they'll give you their precious email address. For this reason, a popup that appears with a second of them landing on your site will always have a terrible conversion unless you make an incredibly irresistible free offer. At least move your popup to appear on exit and not entry, and change the popup text to show strong benefits to the user of your report.

        Hope I helped somewhat. Feel free to PM me if you would like to ask any questions.
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        • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
          Originally Posted by Simon Anthony View Post

          Steve,

          Please please don't take this the wrong way, but I would change your website theme ASAP if it's Wordpress. I don't think it's visually appealing at all. That puts off more people than you would imagine. If you want to appear professional, get a professional looking site, because I can tell you right now that the competition already has, and I haven't even seen them. This is 2014 and you need a modern website.

          As for your popup. I wouldn't be surprised if not many people opt-in to be honest. There's no sales copy on the popup that grabs attention and makes people want your report. It doesn't state any benefits or reason why they should download it. You need to state what they will get out of it. Give them a big reason to download it.

          Please do not be offended by what I say. I am genuinely trying to help, but my words may sound a little harsh. I don't mean it that way, so please don't take it badly. I am trying to help you.

          But I would definitely update your sites look ASAP and remove the popup to a sidebar optin box and one below each post, and maybe an exit pop too. It's been proved that people HATE popups, especially immediate ones like yours. The reason why is that when someone lands on your site they don't know you. They don't trust you or know a thing about you or what you do. They need to see your content and decide that they like what you have to say before they'll give you their precious email address. For this reason, a popup that appears with a second of them landing on your site will always have a terrible conversion unless you make an incredibly irresistible free offer. At least move your popup to appear on exit and not entry, and change the popup text to show strong benefits to the user of your report.

          Hope I helped somewhat. Feel free to PM me if you would like to ask any questions.
          Loads of great advice. Thanks a ton.
          If you can show me a site that is in my niche of youtuber that looks better or fitness in general that would. Be go... Otherwise I'll just start looking at theme forrest I guess.
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          • Profile picture of the author drewfioravanti
            Originally Posted by stevenjcampbell View Post

            Loads of great advice. Thanks a ton.
            If you can show me a site that is in my niche of youtuber that looks better or fitness in general that would. Be go... Otherwise I'll just start looking at theme forrest I guess.
            Be careful taking advice from someone who is not your target market.

            Alex is good but it seems like all of his products are the same...a little nugget of content with a load of how he got rich, how he borrowed money to see rich schefren, how much his students are making, and apply for his inner circle training.
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            • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
              Originally Posted by drewfioravanti View Post

              Be careful taking advice from someone who is not your target market.

              Alex is good but it seems like all of his products are the same...a little nugget of content with a load of how he got rich, how he borrowed money to see rich schefren, how much his students are making, and apply for his inner circle training.
              Well the advice was broad. Of the sites design looks antiquated thej it will appear unprofessional I suppose. That seems as though it would apply to any website.

              I learned my lesson with anik singal who I've finally unsubscribed from. They tell you enough to sell you a product.
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            • Profile picture of the author Simon Anthony
              Originally Posted by drewfioravanti View Post

              Be careful taking advice from someone who is not your target market.
              Niche has nothing to do with constructive advice on how a blog looks or general marketing principles like how to use pops and copy.

              Anyway, here's what I would do ... (also sent to you by email).

              Go to Google and search for "fitness blog" and "health blog" and even "bodybuilding blog" or "athlete blog" (preferably all of them) and go through the first 2-3 pages of each of results and see what they look like. I can't help you with that because YOU must like your blog, not me. I can't work with a blog that I don't like the look of, and it's the same for everyone. Just go and search and get a feel for how most of them are laid-out style wise and see what catches your eye.
              Get a feel for how they work and what their optin boxes look like and what they give away to subscribers. How do they "sell" their freebie. Download a few of their freebies and see how their freebie stacks up with yours. You can always unsubscibe from their list after you get it. It's just market research, looking at what your competition are doing and judging for yourself how your blog content stacks-up against the best blogs out there.

              Also Google "fitness wordpress themes" or "fitness wordpress theme free" if you don't want to pay, and see what you can find.

              If you find a fitness Wordpress blog that you like the look of, go to What WordPress Theme Is That? and enter the URL and find out what theme it is they're using.

              Also go to pixabay.com and get some free quality images to use on your blog.

              After you get it looking nice, start driving traffic to a squeeze page on your site to collect emails. Get a Facebook Fan Page going that also drives traffic back to your blog. You can also easily collect emails directly in Facebook.

              Hope that helps for now.
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              • Profile picture of the author drewfioravanti
                Originally Posted by Simon Anthony View Post

                Niche has nothing to do with constructive advice on how a blog looks or general marketing principles like how to use pops and copy.
                Appearance is subjective and only his target market can determine how effective the design is. Additionally, pops have proven to be increase optins.

                There are a number of bigger issues with the website. Most notably the lack of any sales copy. Design is the least of his worries. Mike Geary's site looks like it hasn't been updated since 2007. And he still does OK.
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                • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
                  Originally Posted by drewfioravanti View Post

                  Appearance is subjective and only his target market can determine how effective the design is. Additionally, pops have proven to be increase optins.

                  There are a number of bigger issues with the website. Most notably the lack of any sales copy. Design is the least of his worries. Mike Geary's site looks like it hasn't been updated since 2007. And he still does OK.
                  Since I'm trying to be a content driven blog I have no idea where to even put sales copy. Oh boy, I'm having a doom and gloom anxious feeling over all this.
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  • Profile picture of the author Simon Anthony
    Well, the top marketers would consider $6k a month to be a disaster. The top guys are making 50k - 100k or more each month. I even heard of one guy who was a newbie just 2-3 years ago who just had his first 100k month.

    I know another guy who makes $10k every month without fail, just by sending promo emails with affiliate links and releasing products every 2 months to keep up his buyers list. And he only started online 2 years ago.

    Fact is, email marketing works but you have to beware. I never came across an industry like IM in my whole life for complete and utter BS, smoke and mirrors, and plain old cr@p. It's tricky to know who to believe because everyone wants a slice of the pie and there's thousands of people out there telling you how to make money online without ever having made one single cent themselves.

    If you're unsure, don't do it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Joseph Villanueva
    Sup Steve,

    You are on a right track to do things organically. Keep making optimized blog posts and youtube vids. Create a fan page and start promoting your posts at youtube and blog when you make one. When you create optimized posts with right seo techniques and ignite it with the facebook ppc ads, it can go viral quickly.

    I have shown you this before in our private group steve you just need to keep implementing it. It does cost money to make that money back and more unfortunately.

    Joe
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  • Profile picture of the author Brent Stangel
    Your site requires sign up and membership right? Yeah
    It is also an affiliate link which is not allowed and has been reported. Please remove it from your post or deleting the spamer's post will do no good.
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    Get Off The Warrior Forum Now & Don't Come Back If You Want To Succeed!
    All The Real Marketers Are Gone. There's Nothing Left But Weak, Sniveling Wanna-Bees!
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  • Profile picture of the author drewfioravanti
    Well, also, fitness is not a niche. It is a market. What part of the fitness market are you in? Are you an actual business? Do you sell products? Do you have any experience or are you just trying to build a website to make money because you were told there is a lot of money in fitness websites?
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    • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
      Originally Posted by drewfioravanti View Post

      Well, also, fitness is not a niche. It is a market. What part of the fitness market are you in? Are you an actual business? Do you sell products? Do you have any experience or are you just trying to build a website to make money because you were told there is a lot of money in fitness websites?
      Okay.
      In 2011 I was 55 lbs overweight and thought I was going to die of a non existent terminal illness.

      I lost the weight, kept it off for three years and 5 months and have a YouTube channel with Around 3700 subs, and a Facebook presense

      I want to offer coaching, and I have two diet books. That I've written that are 100% science and work if they apply them.

      I have two clickbank products I back that I've read. One of which I get better than the 75% normal cut of.

      I do daily youtube videos on health, self improvement, mental physical overall fitness.

      I'm currently studying Filipino martial arts and hope to be able to document that journey and apply it to my story.

      "there's a lot of money in fitness"

      Is there? Because I launched a teespring after having people that I ran a design by swear they'd buy and the cheap idiots don't buy.

      I can't promote just anything because most bull crap in fitness is a scam and doesn't work... So I have to pick a few things and figure out how this can actually come together.

      My big money is offering 1 on 1 coaching. It's up front $200/ 8 weeks for a custom plan and daily emails if they need it.

      However this isn't list related. Is it?
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      • Profile picture of the author onSubie
        Originally Posted by stevenjcampbell View Post

        In 2011 I was 55 lbs overweight and thought I was going to die of a non existent terminal illness.
        I'm currently studying Filipino martial arts and hope to be able to document that journey and apply it to my story.
        "there's a lot of money in fitness"

        Is there? Because I launched a teespring after having people that I ran a design by swear they'd buy and the cheap idiots don't buy.
        I think you need to do a better job of matching products to your audience.

        You changed your mindset from being overweight and thinking you were going to die, to a healthy mindset and lost over 50 lbs.

        This is inspiring and a great start to being an example to others who struggle with finding the mindset and motivation alone.

        And you want to sell them a t-shirt?


        However this isn't list related. Is it?
        The idea of a list is you have repeated contact with your market.

        You may have many people on your list who didn't buy and don't want the coaching or Clickbank product or Paleo Diet Book.

        But after a few "coaching updates" where you tell your list how well the current students are doing many who said "No" at first will now be interested in your coaching.

        If you have a product (Clickbank) that works and you want to promote it, presell for an email or two with your personal story. Get them eager for what you used for your success then offer the product as recommended from first hand experience.

        You want to engage your list. They want to hear about your success.

        Use first person experience to motivate and overcome objections before you push a product.

        Everyone says "provide value" to your list. Your value is first hand experience. Use your personal journey to inspire them and point them in the direction of resources (paid or not) to help them.

        Mahlon
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        • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
          Originally Posted by onSubie View Post

          I think you need to do a better job of matching products to your audience.

          You changed your mindset from being overweight and thinking you were going to die, to a healthy mindset and lost over 50 lbs.

          This is inspiring and a great start to being an example to others who struggle with finding the mindset and motivation alone.

          And you want to sell them a t-shirt?
          Actually no. I didn't even aim that any followers of specifically. I did not use my branding. The teespring was based on an inside joke that gym goers use regarding guys that never workout their legs. It was a broad sort of audience that should. Have had a reaction. Maybe though I'm wrong to offer anything for sale? Again were back to the "how dare you" mentality that the silly youtube audience holds, but I doubt thst was your intentions...

          The idea of a list is you have repeated contact with your market.

          You may have many people on your list who didn't buy and don't want the coaching or Clickbank product or Paleo Diet Book.

          But after a few "coaching updates" where you tell your list how well the current students are doing many who said "No" at first will now be interested in your coaching.
          nice and I never looked at it this way that's why I'm here, to learn.
          I'd be smart to break my story up and put it out in a series of emails. Heck, I can tell people to subscribe and part of that is they learn my story! Awesome.
          If you have a product (Clickbank) that works and you want to promote it, presell for an email or two with your personal story. Get them eager for what you used for your success then offer the product as recommended from first hand experience.

          You want to engage your list. They want to hear about your success.
          AWESOME and again thanks.
          Use first person experience to motivate and overcome objections before you push a product.

          Everyone says "provide value" to your list. Your value is first hand experience. Use your personal journey to inspire them and point them in the direction of resources (paid or not) to help them.

          Mahlon
          You are the man. Thanks for everything here.
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  • Profile picture of the author drewfioravanti
    OK. That's weight loss. Still not a niche; more of a submarket.

    How bog is your list? How often do you email?

    What does a t-shirt have to do with a weight loss business? I've read that Mike Geary does about $20M per year.

    You mention you have your own products but I didn't see them listed on your website. You mention that you sell Clickbank products. But I don't see where you promote them, either.

    You need to add more ways for your audience to get on your email list. Add your website to your YouTube and Facebook pages and posts.

    Learn about copywriting so when someone see's one of your videos or your Facebook page, there is copy there that says You Can Lose 55 Pounds In 6 Months. Go Here To See How: Website

    Or something like that...
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    • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
      Originally Posted by drewfioravanti View Post

      OK. That's weight loss. Still not a niche; more of a submarket.

      How bog is your list? How often do you email?
      Right now in have lucked myself into 91 subscribers. A few that bounce so maybe 85...ibdojtnemail enough. I need to set that up in my mailer. Don't know what to even email them. I've heard offer products every day. What could I even offer...

      What does a t-shirt have to do with a weight loss business? I've read that Mike Geary does about $20M per year.



      You mention you have your own products but I didn't see them listed on your website. You mention that you sell Clickbank products. But I don't see where you promote them, either.
      The 3 weekndiet 250x on the right side is one I endorse. It goes to a review site I made for the product perhaps it should go right to the sales page.

      The other clickbank item isn't online unfortunately the sales page is horrendous (7800 words?! Completerapidfatloss.com is the site it's a mess no that's not my affiliate link). I tried to help him but he refused to listen and it won't convert well.

      Right now my biggest audience isn't my site it's youtube. So I gauge it from how they react to products etc. Not. Good. The big thing on youtube is calling anyone tryibg to earn a living from their work a sellout.

      You need to add more ways for your audience to get on your email list. Add your website to your YouTube and Facebook pages and posts.
      Okay consider adding that to yt and fb done. Actually I can use the page banners and drawn an arrow for them to click to get the free offer and drive them to the offer site.

      All of my yt videos has both annotations and link description to get the free guide and get them on the list

      Learn about copywriting so when someone see's one of your videos or your Facebook page, there is copy there that says You Can Lose 55 Pounds In 6 Months. Go Here To See How: Website

      Or something like that...
      Epic.
      Also I am strange because I actually listen to people like yourself so thank you!!
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      • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
        Originally Posted by stevenjcampbell View Post

        Don't know what to even email them.
        You can always email each time you publish a new video on youtube.

        But even better, embed that youtube video in a blog post with a written description of what's in the video, then email your subscribers to that blog post.

        Get some social sharing buttons using a plugin so they display on each post - make sure you have facebook share, pinterest, and whatever else u please.

        That should help you a bit.
        Signature

        "Human thoughts have the tendency to transform themselves into their physical equivalent." Earl Nightingale

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      • Profile picture of the author MisterY
        Originally Posted by stevenjcampbell View Post

        Right now in have lucked myself into 91 subscribers. A few that bounce so maybe 85...ibdojtnemail enough. I need to set that up in my mailer. Don't know what to even email them. I've heard offer products every day. What could I even offer...
        If you want to know what to email them, start off by telling them something of your story. It should come across as inspirational.

        Don't offer 'products every day'. Take them to one of your YT videos every day. Even better let them view those videos on your blog. And write blog posts that are inspirational and give snippets of useful diet information, or fitness or whatever.

        Above all make sure they realize that you are the real deal. You've done it, gone through the worst and are now (presumably) where they want to be. So help them get there.

        And if the books that you've found on CB are not the real deal, sell them your own product.

        Coming back on track, the thing about Alex is that he talks the talk. You may not like how he opens his videos but they work simply because he shows people that it is possible to earn six figures. Of course what he doesn't point out, succinctly, is that his income comes from showing people that they can do what he is doing - selling the dream to everyone who wants to make money online.

        It's not your dream, exactly, or the dream of your subscribers. But link into their wants and desires instead. Then show them how they can achieve it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Victor Edson
    That's very list related.

    I'd say stop worrying about 'internet marketing' and start thinking about how you can build a business.

    You're off to a great start already... you just need the refinement of putting it all together into a funnel (fancy word for a list) Then testing it out and scaling from there.

    Do you have a squeeze page? An upsell page? An email series promoting your 2 ebooks or the affiliate reports you recommend?

    That's the first step.

    Then point your traffic there. Not everyone buys. And just because someone says they will, they haven't until the money is in the bank, the checks are cleared and you're spending it. Know what I mean?

    People are just iffy and many will say one thing to your face but then either honestly forget about or never have intentions of following through... just part of life. /rant over

    But about the list... set it up and test it out.

    Those people aren't kidding about lists that make that much money. it's doable if you put yourself into action (looks like you've got a head start too!)
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  • Profile picture of the author drewfioravanti
    91 subscribers is a good start!

    You can't look at your subscribers as an ATM. The point of building a list is not to get the biggest list possible. It's about getting an audience of people you can connect with. People rarely buy the first time the visit a site. But if you help them to take steps towards their goal BEFORE you ask them to buy either your product or a product you recommend, you'll have a much better chance at them buying your products or products you recommend.

    Think of them as your friends. Would you say "Hey man, buy this, it's awesome!" to someone you just met? Or would you say "You know what worked for me...the biggest thing...it was cutting down on sugar. I was hard at first but I was able to see improvements quickly just by being aware of all of the sugars I was eating...drinks especially. So I cut down as much as I could on sugar. I didnt cut ALL of it, but I cut as much as I could. And, then I kept looking for more and more places where I could cut sugar.".

    That person is more likely to have a positive view of you if you did the second upon meeting them and learning of their struggles than the first.

    As you've learned, it is very difficult to get someone to your website. That's why you build the list...so you can reconnect with that person. Otherwise, you're constantly trying to get people to your website to buy on that first visit.

    I dont do any Youtube marketing, so I can't help there. But I do a lot of Facebook marketing. Check out Amy Porterfield. She is really good at Facebook marketing. And I think she is doing a Facebook list building course as her "lead magnet" right now. I'm sure that would help you a lot.
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  • Profile picture of the author writeaway
    Never underestimate the power of a well-written AR series. It's all about connecting with the reader based on where they are in the BUYING CYCLE.
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  • Some are liars and some are not. There are some selling info in fitness niche making that kind of money but most are not. It's hard to know, but don't say all are not that is simply not true.
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  • Profile picture of the author DubDubDubDot
    Originally Posted by stevenjcampbell View Post

    These guys are nothing but liars. Right?
    Yes and no.

    List building is a potentially viable source of traffic and income, but it's also highly unethical to position it (or any other single marketing method) as being the ticket to financial freedom.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dasilva Marketing
    You cannot say for sure if its a scam or not. I have a list with 20,000 subscribers and I've built a pretty solid sales funnel.

    I easily process $15,000-$30,000 depending on traffic source and how much revenue I actually use to pay for advertising on sources such as solo ads and Facebook.

    2 goldmines. So you cannot say for sure if they are telling the truth or not UNLESS they actually log into their accounts right infront of you which they most likely won't thus leading you to believe its a scam.
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    • Profile picture of the author heavysm
      Disregarding whether or not Alex is a liar or how questionable his methods are I would likely get onto his list and analyze his presentation because i like studying what these marketers are doing rather than what they're saying.

      In that way it gets to be interesting to see who actually practices what they preach and how congruent their sales pitch is to what they're teaching their students to do.

      How long was the webinar, how did he start it, how did he end it, how did he present what when and why???

      Just think about how he's pitching his stuff and do a better job at it. It doesn't matter what you're market is. Grab some coffee, take a walk and think about how you can apply his marketing methods to your market (pick and choose which you liked the best) and run with it.

      You have to become an internet marketing sleuth to really get into the methods these guys are using which might not always be what they're selling.
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      • Profile picture of the author Dasilva Marketing
        Originally Posted by heavysm View Post

        Disregarding whether or not Alex is a liar or how questionable his methods are I would likely get onto his list and analyze his presentation because i like studying what these marketers are doing rather than what they're saying.

        In that way it gets to be interesting to see who actually practices what they preach and how congruent their sales pitch is to what they're teaching their students to do.

        How long was the webinar, how did he start it, how did he end it, how did he present what when and why???

        Just think about how he's pitching his stuff and do a better job at it. It doesn't matter what you're market is. Grab some coffee, take a walk and think about how you can apply his marketing methods to your market (pick and choose which you liked the best) and run with it.

        You have to become an internet marketing sleuth to really get into the methods these guys are using which might not always be what they're selling.

        You sir have hit the nail on the head:

        Disregarding whether or not Alex is a liar or how questionable his methods are I would likely get onto his list and analyze his presentation because i like studying what these marketers are doing rather than what they're saying.



        TAKE NOTE FROM THAT STATEMENT
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      • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
        Originally Posted by heavysm View Post


        In that way it gets to be interesting to see who actually practices what they preach and how congruent their sales pitch is to what they're teaching their students to do.

        How long was the webinar, how did he start it, how did he end it, how did he present what when and why???
        Three hours and at the half way point he makes. His pitch that he wants a small class of people to have him as their mentor.

        I accidentally deleted the other part you said but I agree. It's an idea I've been kicking ideas around that could use the webinar template.
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        • Profile picture of the author heavysm
          Originally Posted by stevenjcampbell View Post

          Three hours and at the half way point he makes. His pitch that he wants a small class of people to have him as their mentor.

          I accidentally deleted the other part you said but I agree. It's an idea I've been kicking ideas around that could use the webinar template.
          Another thing to understand about his level of marketing, and more upon his goals in his marketing as well, is that one-on-one coaching with him would have been around the same fee as his group coaching fee now several years ago.

          Once marketers realize how finite their time is they see that they need to get their students clustered into groups to get more $$$ per head. If they can say the same thing and have it reach more people...why not put 5 - 10 people in a group so those same words reach more people?

          The problem here is that some students tend to see this as less effective and personal as one-on-one, even though years ago the coach charged far less for personal one-on-one coaching.

          I personally stay away from the up and coming "expert marketers" and try to mingle in the groups of the underground coaches who coach the gurus. These are the people that you only hear about if you need to take your business to an entirely new level (5 - 6 figures a month - or even just $10k to 30k).

          Hype more or less sells well in the MMO and BIZ OP markets, and Alex knows his market well so i can't blame him for using outrageous claims since that's what the market feeds on.

          Many of the marketing tactics he's using are universal though; from his sales pages, to his videos, to how he structures his emails (he's paid a lot for others to coach him as well). So analyzing how he structures his business would be like a free glance at some of the high end coaching he's gotten.

          All of this stuff can be an amazing lesson or BS scam crap depending on how you view it. Can you guess how i see this stuff?
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          • Profile picture of the author DubDubDubDot
            Originally Posted by heavysm View Post

            So analyzing how he structures his business would be like a free glance at some of the high end coaching he's gotten.
            Why would anyone want to study these guys? If they are so great at marketing then why are they selling snake oil? Why have they been reduced to tricking newbies into thinking they can make a gazillion dollars a year? Why aren't any of these "kings of marketing" taking multi-million dollar per year positions at high end marketing firms? And don't try to say they make that much anyway, because they don't.
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            • Profile picture of the author heavysm
              Originally Posted by DubDubDubDot View Post

              Why would anyone want to study these guys? If they are so great at marketing then why are they selling snake oil? Why have they been reduced to tricking newbies into thinking they can make a gazillion dollars a year? Why aren't any of these "kings of marketing" taking multi-million dollar per year positions at high end marketing firms? And don't try to say they make that much anyway, because they don't.
              Lol sounds like you have a lot against these guys.

              If you're attentive to their tactics you'll notice evergreen techniques for copywriting, sales...i mean you list it they probably use it.

              Why would i care how they market? Because those are subtle tactics they use that were taught to them by coaches (some are just marketing and business coaches - don't confuse the high end coaches for the MMO/IM crowd) at the highest levels of marketing. You go into any market with their way of market analysis and you'll be in the mind of your audience in a snap.

              I'm trying to disregard the MMO/BIZ OP aspect of his or his coaching, which you're having a hard time doing. If you pay enough attention to what he's really doing you can pick up on those golden nuggets of marketing that work in any market. Why not take that make it better, make it YOURS, and deliver genuine value to your markets.

              Orr you can just be angry and mad about the whole thing and not think past your box...the choice is yours.
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              • Profile picture of the author DubDubDubDot
                Originally Posted by heavysm View Post

                I'm trying to disregard the MMO/BIZ OP aspect of his or his coaching, which you're having a hard time doing.
                You cannot separate the two. "Internet marketing" coaching and MMO info products are married to one another. It's a process blueprint designed for expanding the MMO industry pyramid and is thus not optimal for anything else.
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                • Profile picture of the author James Campbell
                  Originally Posted by DubDubDubDot View Post

                  You cannot separate the two. "Internet marketing" coaching and MMO info products are married to one another. It's a process blueprint designed for expanding the MMO industry pyramid and is thus not optimal for anything else.
                  Wrong. He can, but apparently you just don't have the ability to with being as jaded as you are.
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                  • Profile picture of the author DubDubDubDot
                    Originally Posted by James Campbell View Post

                    Wrong. He can, but apparently you just don't have the ability to with being as jaded as you are.
                    Very, very, very, very few people are launching new businesses here in 2014 that are essencially operated out of email. Yet these fake gurus preach all day long that it's still a realistic venture to start up and they always attach crazy income claims to it. It is absolutely rediculous.

                    Don't get me wrong, new email lists still have their place, but as a source of supplemental income to a primary income stream.
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                    • Profile picture of the author James Campbell
                      Originally Posted by DubDubDubDot View Post

                      Very, very, very, very few people are launching new businesses here in 2014 that are essencially operated out of email.
                      Your assumptions are based on what exactly?

                      This isn't the first thread where you're obviously completely jaded at the major success of some marketers and I suspect it won't be your last.

                      To put it more bluntly, you've got no idea what you're talking about.
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  • Profile picture of the author drewfioravanti
    Oh, and no, I do not believe Alex is a liar. You have to understand that what you were watching was a sales presentation. I didn't watch the video, but I assume he gave a quality training about things that he actually does or has done. Then he went into showing the success himself and other people. That gets you to believe that it can work for you, too. Then you buy. See how that works? Give away valuable information. Show it works. Show it works for regular people, too. Then, regular people will want the same success, and believe they can achieve it with the right coaching/mentor. Then, they buy.
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    • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
      Originally Posted by drewfioravanti View Post

      Oh, and no, I do not believe Alex is a liar. You have to understand that what you were watching was a sales presentation. I didn't watch the video, but I assume he gave a quality training about things that he actually does or has done. Then he went into showing the success himself and other people. That gets you to believe that it can work for you, too. Then you buy. See how that works? Give away valuable information. Show it works. Show it works for regular people, too. Then, regular people will want the same success, and believe they can achieve it with the right coaching/mentor. Then, they buy.
      I stopped around half way. I walk to work so listen to these things. Unfortunately there were no new "secrets" shared. But at least half way through he made his pitch and not 90% in.

      So then there is hope for six figures a year.
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  • Profile picture of the author cyberzolo
    Success in internet marketing is very slim, so most of the people who are making these huge claims are in fact scams.
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    • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
      Originally Posted by cyberzolo View Post

      Success in internet marketing is very slim, so most of the people who are making these huge claims are in fact scams.
      We are all doomed.
      Then why are you here? Why do you have a post count of over 600? If it's so hard to succeed... Why waste your time?
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  • Profile picture of the author gluckspilz
    Some of these comments are evidence that some people are so ignorant and never accept other people's success.

    It started from from the initial post and those backing it up.

    Am I a big fan of Alex? Probably not because I've been in the game long enough to not learn from him.

    But the fact is, he has made millions...

    Instead of focusing on his claims and stupid stuff like that.

    Use your time to learn what he is doing. Model him. Learn from him. Stop looking for excuses to judge people or products..

    From the post above "people who are making these huge claims are in fact scams."

    Give me a break.

    Earning potential within our industry can range anywhere from tens of thousands to millions per month.

    The only scam part is your belief.

    Look at my signature for example. Bold Big Claim right there.. Is it scam?

    Most people will just look at it and shout "SCAM" those who want to learn will realize it is very possible.

    Rant over.
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    • Profile picture of the author stevenjcampbell
      Originally Posted by gluckspilz View Post

      Some of these comments are evidence that some people are so ignorant and never accept other people's success.

      It started from from the initial post and those backing it up.

      Am I a big fan of Alex? Probably not because I've been in the game long enough to not learn from him.

      But the fact is, he has made millions...

      Instead of focusing on his claims and stupid stuff like that.

      Use your time to learn what he is doing. Model him. Learn from him. Stop looking for excuses to judge people or products..

      From the post above "people who are making these huge claims are in fact scams."

      Give me a break.

      Earning potential within our industry can range anywhere from tens of thousands to millions per month.

      The only scam part is your belief.

      Look at my signature for example. Bold Big Claim right there.. Is it scam?

      Most people will just look at it and shout "SCAM" those who want to learn will realize it is very possible.

      Rant over.
      I'd be back flipping over $5000 a month
      I make practically nothing and that's why I tend to be tricked into thinking that $10k a month is possible. That's why I almost fall for it i guess.

      We all want hope. Me as much as anyone else.
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    • Originally Posted by gluckspilz View Post

      Some of these comments are evidence that some people are so ignorant and never accept other people's success.

      It started from from the initial post and those backing it up.

      Am I a big fan of Alex? Probably not because I've been in the game long enough to not learn from him.

      But the fact is, he has made millions...

      Instead of focusing on his claims and stupid stuff like that.

      Use your time to learn what he is doing. Model him. Learn from him. Stop looking for excuses to judge people or products..

      From the post above "people who are making these huge claims are in fact scams."

      Give me a break.

      Earning potential within our industry can range anywhere from tens of thousands to millions per month.

      The only scam part is your belief.

      Look at my signature for example. Bold Big Claim right there.. Is it scam?

      Most people will just look at it and shout "SCAM" those who want to learn will realize it is very possible.

      Rant over.
      What do you mean "some" people are so ignorant, MOST ARE! I start with me, I'm so dam ignorant I ate poison almost died but that's not the worst while I was poisoning myself i thought it was good for me and healthy. just one out of 1000 examples. Butt he worst is I'm not as ignorant as millions of others. So get use to it, humans are a bunch of ignorant people if not why would they be exploited so much, if we would not ignorant we would all be free, happy and wealthily and we are not 99% die broke. In any case most are (I think, but maybe i'm more ignorant about this and dont see it).
      Signature

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      • Profile picture of the author gluckspilz
        Originally Posted by HelpingYouBeAnExpert View Post

        What do you mean "some" people are so ignorant, MOST ARE! I start with me, I'm so dam ignorant I ate poison almost died but that's not the worst while I was poisoning myself i thought it was good for me and healthy. just one out of 1000 examples. Butt he worst is I'm not as ignorant as millions of others. So get use to it, humans are a bunch of ignorant people if not why would they be exploited so much, if we would not ignorant we would all be free, happy and wealthily and we are not 99% die broke. In any case most are (I think, but maybe i'm more ignorant about this and dont see it).
        Dear Sir,

        I would like to suggest reading some Personal Development Books.

        Maybe start with Tony Robbins.

        I really hope you can change your mindset.
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  • Profile picture of the author eugenedm
    Well I would say that you should just try it, don't listen to your voice that it doesn't work.
    Think that it might work. And then when you try and it doesn't work then you can say at least a tried.

    I would say that lists work.

    But... it requires a lot of work to make them work.
    Signature

    WARNING: A 50 Million Dollar Man Taught Me His Secret... Which Resulted 6,000 Sign-ups on My Email List.

    "It's easier than you think..."

    => Watch this video here...
    Build Your List to 6,000 Subscribers

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  • Profile picture of the author seobro
    E-mail marketing worked great for me in the early 90's, but now, most people get a flood of spam. They do not even open their email any more. Sadly, a lot of advice you are getting would have worked great many years ago. For example, before panda and penguin.

    "Mos Eisley Spaceport - you will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious." - Ben
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  • Profile picture of the author Robert Puddy
    I cant comment on Alex's course I haven't seen it.

    I can tell you 8 years ago alex was riddled with doubt, he bought a ticket for one of our UK events, and called me 3 or 4 times wanting reassurance it would be worth the price he paid ( just $97)

    He came to the event still sceptical, he went away still not convinced.

    He eventually took the bull by the horns as it were and bought that first coaching package and look where he is now.

    Its ok to be sceptical, but at some point you have to take your courage in your hand and make the leap
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      I can't comment on Alex's course either, but I did download one of his Kindle books after seeing multiple 5-star reviews. To say I was underwhelmed would be an understatement. If you took out the plugs for the course and the chest-beating about his own success, the book would have been about four pages long. Those four pages did have information that might be useful for someone brand new to list building, so it wasn't a total waste. And some people need the chest-beating and find it inspirational. To each their own...

      Back to the main topic.

      Lists, in and of themselves, are just stacks of data. What you do with those lists is where the money is.

      I've been acquainted with a couple of confessed con artists over the years, and one thing they both told me was that there was no need to tell big lies. Telling big truths, and omitting the parts that make it hard to sell the con, was usually enough.

      The truth is, there are people making $30K per month from lists. Some of them did start from zero. The omission is that it took them several years, and several failed experiments, and often a bit of luck, to reach that point.

      Want your own demo?

      Go to Facebook. Look at the most successful companies and businesses operating fan pages. Look at the percentage of them that work hard to move you off of the fan page and onto an email list.
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  • Profile picture of the author gmarklin
    Don't believe all this $20,000 a day garbage. If you are in good niche, and your list is growing, stick with it. Internet Marketing is a numbers game. The higher the numbers, the more money you are likely to make, assuming you are promoting the correct products
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    • Profile picture of the author Richard Tunnah
      Originally Posted by gmarklin View Post

      Don't believe all this $20,000 a day garbage. If you are in good niche, and your list is growing, stick with it. Internet Marketing is a numbers game. The higher the numbers, the more money you are likely to make, assuming you are promoting the correct products
      Sorry but this is not always the case - a switched on list of 1,000 that has a great relationship with the host can beat a 30,000 list of unengaged subscribers any day.
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