The $10,000.00 a month mindset.

33 replies
Here at the WF, we see a lot of people aiming for 100k a year, or better yet, the 10k a month income from their IM.

Just recently, a Warrior posted it took him 5 years to reach that and stay consistent. It would be nice to see a year from now how he is doing and if that was maintained. There was a Warrior in the past, who took even longer, 7 or 8 years to hit his 100K a YEAR goal, which he did.

Then he started selling his HOW TO info in the WSO. In less than a year, he went from 100k to under 10 k for THE YEAR. He recently came back to the WF, out of sheer boredom, to see what was going on. Anyhow...

It is not uncommon for an Entrepreneur in the real world to spend 5 years or more getting those results, mostly through trial and error and finding their own path. Once they reach it, they have either systems or their tactics can keep them at that level.

Online, we have seen a lot of people hit the 100k a year mark, only to be swatted down because they built their money making machine on someone's beach (like the Article Marketer) and got washed away by the tides of changing algorithms.

So, struggle, trial and error seem to be part and parcel of the journey, BUT, there is the flip side to that coin.

My old friend Jim Straw came online, and within 2 years built a 6 figure a MONTH affiliate marketing business, he was so successful, he closed down his paper and ink publishing business which he had operated for decades.

How long it takes any given person to reach the 10k a month mark has as much to do with the MINDSET along with the knowledge, skills and experience they bring with them as it does with just grinding it out.

See, there are those Warriors who have spent a decade without success, some going 8, 11 years without making any money, after having spent thousands on various courses.

Sure, chasing shiny objects, rainbows and unicorns have a lot to do with it, and wanting unrealistic rapid results, but I want to argue the lack of preparation and bad choices have as much to do with failure as anything.

The one way to get rapid results is through preparation, not just learning software, or social media...but basics like accounting and budgeting.

There have been many people get to a high level and then spend their money, without saving or reinvesting and when something happens, they are unprepared. A month of basic business how to, which includes accounting, budgeting, marketing and general business management would bode many well before they dive into IM.

There is a tendency when someone hits their goal, to see things through their personal journey glasses, so if it takes someone 5 years to hit 100K a year, that is what HE will say, teach, believe or have experienced.

If they took 8 years, they will tell YOU it takes 8 years.

How long does it take to get to 100k a year? As long as you THINK it does. It takes as long as it takes based on what you do and how you do it.

And that depends what you bring with you to the game. Matt Furey teaches the PSYCHO-CYBERNETICS self-image approach. Which basically says your self image acts as a governor on your behavior.

We tend to do what we believe we can.

I have long advocated an approach which begins with self analysis, and knowing what one wants, the goal in as much detail as possible along with a reason WHY one would want to achieve it. Old school (and tons of success from it) would be Earl Nightingale who said: "We tend to live up to our expectations."

So, if it takes you 10 years, I would ask why?

If it takes you two years, I would ask HOW?

There are no rules, no IM regulations, no Online cops giving tickets for jaywalking.

But getting there and STAYING there, are two very different things, which is also, governed by mindset, as opposed to blaming Google or Facebook for pulling the rug out from under you.

How long does it take? As long as you make it take.

GordonJ
#$10 #mindset #month
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  • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
    A monthly income target is a relic of a salary mindset. I've never heard any true entrepreneur talk in those terms. For an entrepreneur, it's about building a business asset, the value of which could take years to realize - or might make an almost instant return. An experienced entrepreneur soon learns to judge which is more likely and either sticks with it or cuts his losses.

    Without real world business experience, it's easy to see how prospective marketers fixate on a monthly income figure or buy into the mantra that with enough time and persistence, success is inevitable. Their thinking is still in career mode.
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    • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
      Originally Posted by Frank Donovan View Post

      A monthly income target is a relic of a salary mindset. I've never heard any true entrepreneur talk in those terms. For an entrepreneur, it's about building a business asset, the value of which could take years to realize - or might make an almost instant return. An experienced entrepreneur soon learns to judge which is more likely and either sticks with it or cuts his losses.

      Without real world business experience, it's easy to see how prospective marketers fixate on a monthly income figure or buy into the mantra that with enough time and persistence, success is inevitable. Their thinking is still in career mode.
      There is a difference between "true Entrepreneur" and IM Prospects, and that may be mostly in how they THINK. If more began from the ...

      I want to build a business ASSET, as opposed to...

      I want to make money online, and reach 10k a month as a measurement of my success...they might reach their goal more quickly, and have something of value that lasts.

      We've seen many a Warrior climb to the 100K a year peak, only to be Jacked and Jilled down the hill by Google, Facebook, or some other thing which they blame.

      It would be nice, albeit, somewhat of a stretch, to see more Entrepreneurs here than the make money quick and easy crowd, but that is the WF target market, is it not?

      GordonJ
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

        There is a difference between "true Entrepreneur" and IM Prospects, and that may be mostly in how they THINK. If more began from the ...

        I want to build a business ASSET, as opposed to...

        I want to make money online, and reach 10k a month as a measurement of my success...they might reach their goal more quickly, and have something of value that lasts.

        We've seen many a Warrior climb to the 100K a year peak, only to be Jacked and Jilled down the hill by Google, Facebook, or some other thing which they blame.
        I think once someone is clearing a low six figures a year, their problems change.

        Like you just said, they get shut down. But that takes many forms.

        They have one credit card processor and they get cancelled. One financing source, one supplier. They also often rely on one method of lead acquisition. It could have been FAX, infomercials, robo calls, articles online....and the algorithm changes, the law changes.

        And now you are left with nothing other than expenses.

        So, have alternates. At least two sources of everything.......it took me too many years to learn that. And it cost me money.



        Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

        It would be nice, albeit, somewhat of a stretch, to see more Entrepreneurs here than the make money quick and easy crowd, but that is the WF target market, is it not?

        GordonJ
        It's that there are so many more "opportunity seekers" than real business people.
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        • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          I think once someone is clearing a low six figures a year, their problems change.

          Like you just said, they get shut down. But that takes many forms.

          They have one credit card processor and they get cancelled. One financing source, one supplier. They also often rely on one method of lead acquisition. It could have been FAX, infomercials, robo calls, articles online....and the algorithm changes, the law changes.

          And now you are left with nothing other than expenses.

          So, have alternates. At least two sources of everything.......it took me too many years to learn that. And it cost me money.





          It's that there are so many more "opportunity seekers" than real business people.
          Great points. Had that happen to a cc processor, it was a tough lesson to learn. But once burned, twice prepared.

          My conflict is with:


          It's that there are so many more "opportunity seekers" than real business people.


          Having made mini fortunes from both, the low hanging fruit is definitely BIZ 0P, but the real business people are more sustainable and have a much higher lifetime value.

          My conflict happens when lust enters the pic, my WANTING something NOW, tends to throw me toward the Biz-Op crowd, it is evergreen, a pig in the python, and pretty easy to tap into.

          Good think I've tempered my lusts with unwavering decrepitness.

          GordonJ
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

            My conflict happens when lust enters the pic, my WANTING something NOW, tends to throw me toward the Biz-Op crowd, it is evergreen, a pig in the python, and pretty easy to tap into.
            And every year, there is a new crop of them....with hopes and dreams...and credit cards.

            Like you, I have changed a little. My new sales training course (probably out early next year) is going to be marketed to salespeople with at least a year of real sales experience, and business owners in applicable fields.

            I don't need to sell everyone. I don't want everyone. Most salespeople are new. It's that new people drain the life out of me.

            If I were selling maps to a gold mine, my preference is to be in the map selling business. I'd sell to prospectors.

            Yes, most of the money would be made in the "I'll get the donkey, the supplies, go with you to the gold mine, help you dig, hold your hand while you pan for gold, and tell you how great you are when it takes a while to find gold" business. But I'm not in he babysitting business. I used to be (hiring and training new reps), but now I just want to talk to people who already have done something.

            Here? I can stop posting if the person shows they are hopeless.
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            • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
              Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

              And every year, there is a new crop of them....with hopes and dreams...and credit cards.

              Like you, I have changed a little. My new sales training course (probably out early next year) is going to be marketed to salespeople with at least a year of real sales experience, and business owners in applicable fields.

              I don't need to sell everyone. I don't want everyone. Most salespeople are new. It's that new people drain the life out of me.

              If I were selling maps to a gold mine, my preference is to be in the map selling business. I'd sell to prospectors.

              Yes, most of the money would be made in the "I'll get the donkey, the supplies, go with you to the gold mine, help you dig, hold your hand while you pan for gold, and tell you how great you are when it takes a while to find gold" business. But I'm not in he babysitting business. I used to be (hiring and training new reps), but now I just want to talk to people who already have done something.

              Here? I can stop posting if the person shows they are hopeless.

              but now I just want to talk to people who already have done something.

              Here? I can stop posting if the person shows they are hopeless.


              I took one or two steps further than you have, by NOT WANTING to talk to people at all.

              In 2004, with a list of over 10k buyers, that was all I was doing. Found I could make just as much moolah from a tenth of that, with a lot less Q and A and HANDHOLDING.

              Then, that got to be a lot to deal with, and I conferred with Harvey Brody, one of my Mentors, who closed down a very lucrative publishing business because he was sick of his employees. Today, he talks to very few people, and that usually, just to refill orders.

              I'm currently working with an Entrepreneur who is bringing a Home Study course out next year and we're trying to figure out how to do it without the slop and mess of talking to people,

              Much harder today than two decades ago. But we'll figure it out.

              I very much like the Bill Myers concept of a Vending Machine, like buying a candy bar, where they buy the product, and leave me alone.

              As for the WF TIME WASTERS (TW), we learn pretty quick, after a slew of good answers, suggestions and advice that is ignored, followed by another question (and he sees crickets)...who these guys are.

              Being a helpful bunch, we tend to bend over backwards, until the realization the poster is just wasting his time, so we don't waste ours.

              NO people contact, for some of us (ME), that is the ideal MMO concept.

              GordonJ
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              • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
                Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

                just as much moolah from a tenth of that, with a lot less Q and A and HANDHOLDING.

                Then, that got to be a lot to deal with, and I conferred with Harvey Brody, one of my Mentors, who closed down a very lucrative publishing business because he was sick of his employees. Today, he talks to very few people, and that usually, just to refill orders.

                I very much like the Bill Myers concept of a Vending Machine, like buying a candy bar, where they buy the product, and leave me alone.
                Wait! You knew Jim Straw? You know Harvey Brody? Bill Myers?

                I have to admit. I'm jealous. I saw Jim Straw stand up at a Dan Kennedy event, and wave to the crowd. My guess is that besides me...five people knew who he was.

                I walked by Glenn Turner ( recognized him) at a Kennedy event, and stopped him for a few minutes. Two old salesman, talking shop.

                To me, these guys are legends. We stand on the shoulders of giants.
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    • Profile picture of the author Odahh
      Originally Posted by Frank Donovan View Post

      A monthly income target is a relic of a salary mindset. I've never heard any true entrepreneur talk in those terms. For an entrepreneur, it's about building a business asset, the value of which could take years to realize - or might make an almost instant return. An experienced entrepreneur soon learns to judge which is more likely and either sticks with it or cuts his losses.

      Without real world business experience, it's easy to see how prospective marketers fixate on a monthly income figure or buy into the mantra that with enough time and persistence, success is inevitable. Their thinking is still in career mode.
      i personally think the more poisonous mindset involves anything that has a retirement date ..true entrepreneurs are usually workaholics from the start . and build their businesses around the way they work .. and never really stop ..adjust as they get older .. but never really stop .

      many in this space are struggling because their success .. is building a business so they do not have to work .. what isn't in their mindset is that they can have work they enjoy ..
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      • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        i personally think the more poisonous mindset involves anything that has a retirement date ..true entrepreneurs are usually workaholics from the start . and build their businesses around the way they work .. and never really stop ..adjust as they get older .. but never really stop .

        many in this space are struggling because their success .. is building a business so they do not have to work .. what isn't in their mindset is that they can have work they enjoy ..
        Great insight. The mindset you hold about the whole concept of "work" is probably the key difference.
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        many in this space are struggling because their success .. is building a business so they do not have to work .. what isn't in their mindset is that they can have work they enjoy ..
        That's a key point, I think.

        Most people work so that they can retire. They want the work to end.

        And when pitching a business opportunity, the goal that is shown, is the luxury you'll live in...after you retire from work. And that's what people buy...the reward. But these people rarely get anywhere.

        The people that really succeed are the ones that love the grind. It's the journey itself that they love, not the promise of some far off reward.

        Most employees are thinking of the eventual escape from their work. The ones that do really well are embracing their work.

        Apparently, I can't let anyone else have the last word.
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        • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          That's a key point, I think.

          Most people work so that they can retire. They want the work to end.

          And when pitching a business opportunity, the goal that is shown, is the luxury you'll live in...after you retire from work. And that's what people buy...the reward. But these people rarely get anywhere.

          The people that really succeed are the ones that love the grind. It's the journey itself that they love, not the promise of some far off reward.

          Most employees are thinking of the eventual escape from their work. The ones that do really well are embracing their work.

          Apparently, I can't let anyone else have the last word.
          We're glad you don't. Any added wisdom from the Elders, those branded by the fires of trial and error, and like yourself, those who DO, and know the truths of life (and gladly share them) are always welcome to have the last word. I anticipate yours.

          GordonJ

          PS If only a few more Warriors actually used all the Wisdom we old dogs share, there might be a little less barking up the wrong tree by some of these pups, eh?
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        • Profile picture of the author Odahh
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          That's a key point, I think.

          Most people work so that they can retire. They want the work to end.

          The people that really succeed are the ones that love the grind. It's the journey itself that they love, not the promise of some far off reward.

          Most employees are thinking of the eventual escape from their work. The ones that do really well are embracing their work.

          Apparently, I can't let anyone else have the last word.
          one of the thing i have learned studying the most successful people in many areas is the effort or work they put in is in constantly improving productivity
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  • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
    I think one problem with the people that take years to make any real headway (other than just not doing enough to matter)...is this...

    They take a course, try an idea or two out of the course....while doing everything else wrong...and the idea doesn't generate huge wealth. Then they think "Well, that doesn't work", and they go to the next course/training/guru/idea. They never find the 500 things they are doing wrong, while trying every new idea. So nothing works hardly at all.

    Another thing I see is believing that the first sale is the big money maker. They buy $10 in ads, make $7 in sales, and say "I lost money. That doesn't work". But many fortunes are made by losing a little money on the front end, to get the customer. Once you have someone who has given you money, and likes what they got in return, that person may be worth thousands of "names" you may be trying to sell for the first time.

    And beginners (until you've made money, you're still a beginner) hear something like "You need to build a list" or "Market to your list"...and they get subscribers by buying them from someone else, or giving something away to get the name and E-mail address.

    The e-mail list they have is pretty worthless. What's a good list? a list of people who have bought from you before. Or a list of people who have bought what you sell before.

    An analogy is in selling. I've had reps that tell me "I can't sell anything, and I'm doing exactly what you are doing". But they are not. They are doing what they imagine I'm doing. They are doing a small part of what I am doing, and the rest is counterproductive stuff they believe should work. But if I can't see everything they are doing, I can't tell what part is killing the sale.

    Like making a cake. A recipe tells you exactly what to add, in what order, in what amounts. But if you decide "Instead of flour, this powdered concrete dust is cheaper. I'll use it."...your cake isn't a cake.

    And that's a reason many internet marketers (or salespeople/marketers of any kind) are failing. They are mixing concrete dust in with the rest of what they are doing...and it's killing the results.

    Heck, we have people here ask "Why isn't my website selling?" and then we go to the website and see why....everything on the website is screaming "I have no idea what I'm doing. Don't buy from me!".

    Anyway, I wanted to vent.
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  • Can I get real Sweetsypoppet here?

    bcs kinda what mattahs here is VALYOO.

    I would wish for evrywan here to be pulsin' that baby out to max effect for the benefit of their Whomsoevahness.

    So ... what happens when alla the success is done?

    Or ... midways in the transition slot between dreamin'/plannin' an' gettin' sumplace / bein' shot in the ass for a heretic ... how is evrythin' playin' out in yr body & brain?

    Tellya, biggest dreamo illusion we got is how we can mebbe make out like the Gods -- or the Goddesses ( bcs they got way more seductively compellin' slinkywear).

    We figure pools fulla milk, hunney & chardonnay.

    Easeful sunsets cruisin' all beautysum till we gotta snooze on our coolest ideahs of the day.

    Languish beyond all sufferin'.

    Prahblem with reachin' any plateau is how it plays out real soon into endless plains invitin' mountains.

    Which mean gettin' yr boots on all ovah again.

    Huh, was so easy sippin' cocktails by the pool, but now I gotta go make with the crampons anew.

    Hey, but ain't anew sumthin'?

    Self-refreshment of zeal in a Cosmos undooly bummed by fear, genrl stiflestuffs, plus also kinda stoopids?

    Point is, opportoonity seekers abound.

    Ain't no intrinsic prahblem with opportoonity seekin' less'n you can't get what you wanna.

    Or ... you land the Big One but kinda happen to be way corrupt.

    I PROFFER THIS WISE COUNSEL

    FROM THE CURIOUS COMFORT OF A WAY SQUISHY PIZZA
    DRIBBLIN' MOLTEN CHEESE OVAH MAH CHOPS

    Hey, yeah -- so make of this what you will.

    Anewsome is the new ungruesome.
    Signature

    Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
    So, if it takes you 10 years, I would ask why?

    If it takes you two years, I would ask HOW?

    There are no rules, no IM regulations, no Online cops giving tickets for jaywalking.

    But getting there and STAYING there, are two very different things, which is also, governed by mindset, as opposed to blaming Google or Facebook for pulling the rug out from under you.

    How long does it take? As long as you make it take.

    GordonJ
    Going by the last few months, l expect to get over 100k within the next two years, (l may achieve that sooner, but it depends on consistency of investments).

    And it is online trading!

    How, sorry that is $1,500 WSO territory or a trade secret, but Claude gave a hint to that, or l had to make this work.

    So regardless of how many years l couldn't make this work, l had to make this work, and ended up making this work.

    Or most try fail, and give up. I also tried for years had a big failure, but kept going, and figured something out.

    The rich are not super smart they are just stubborn as hell!

    But 10k a month is subjective, or nice when it happens, but it is not a goal for me more of a stepping stone. For me the system is the main focus and the end result is conformation. Or once you have a way of making money then reinvesting that, to make more, that is obviously risky.

    And as Claude said, l could blame the T-3 ruling, (l can currently trade up to three times on one day, but cannot trade 4 times, not without having to spring trade it). Or getting my account locked for some time, (my account gives a warning).

    Some borrow 10k and make a fortune with it on the Stock market, but most don't. And the most do not making a furtune, because their IQ is too low, more because the Stock Market doesn't give a toss, about you. It can and will tear your heart out if you let it, or it is a bit like getting a gold tooth from a shark.

    Most cannot and some will lose a limb or their life, but a small number will figure it out.

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  • Toil is hands 'pon tools
    they don't wanna --
    for zero point,
    zero reward.

    Passion --
    howevah it swellsya --
    tellsya
    where is
    forward.

    Inhabit yr flesh,
    Be moreward:
    Juicylicuoisness
    ungnawed.

    Put nuthin'
    to sword
    as might live
    forevah
    as heart
    inscribed as
    word.
    Signature

    Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • Profile picture of the author Jeffery
    Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

    That's a key point, I think.

    Most people work so that they can retire. They want the work to end.

    And when pitching a business opportunity, the goal that is shown, is the luxury you'll live in...after you retire from work. And that's what people buy...the reward. But these people rarely get anywhere.

    The people that really succeed are the ones that love the grind. It's the journey itself that they love, not the promise of some far off reward.

    Most employees are thinking of the eventual escape from their work. The ones that do really well are embracing their work.

    Apparently, I can't let anyone else have the last word.
    Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

    one of the thing i have learned studying the most successful people in many areas is the effort or work they put in is in constantly improving productivity
    I get what "it" is that you mean and for me "it" is improving sales. Improving self-productivity is one thing and typically improves sales, however too many people think that is all there is to it because they lack business experience and focus on working harder whereas an entrepreneur focuses more on improving sales via thinking smarter.
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    In the minute it took me to write this post.. someone died of Covid 19. RIP.
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    • Profile picture of the author Odahh
      Originally Posted by Jeffery View Post

      I get what "it" is that you mean and for me "it" is improving sales. Improving self-productivity is one thing and typically improves sales, however too many people think that is all there is to it because they lack business experience and focus on working harder whereas an entrepreneur focuses more on improving sales via thinking smarter.
      Jeffery your way of thinking and doing business was probably outside the box before outside the box was a term people used ..and many of you old school entrepreneurs had some kind of hustle or way to make money when you where in your teens that wasn't working a job ..

      now as for self improvement .or personal productivity ..tech is outpacing human productivity in so many areas ..95 percent of self improvement is really better use of tech or acurieing better tech .. the same way entraprenurs use debt to brow their businesses or investment .. to make more money ..and and an huge percent of people get in debt and need a safe stable job to make money ..

      entrepreneurs will naturally figure out how to use tech to mech money and build businesses .. and replace the ned for human employees who can stay off their f#$%^ cellphone ..when they should be working

      i am going to change the tone a little ..because of the low start up cost and the main risk running an online business is the algorithm changing or your credit card processor screwing things up.. the majority of people starting businesses .. that don't require outside capital , signing leases or employing people .. should not really be considered entrepreneurs .. at all ..
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      • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        Jeffery your way of thinking and doing business was probably outside the box before outside the box was a term people used ..and many of you old school entrepreneurs had some kind of hustle or way to make money when you where in your teens that wasn't working a job ..

        i am going to change the tone a little ..because of the low start up cost and the main risk running an online business is the algorithm changing or your credit card processor screwing things up.. the majority of people starting businesses .. that don't require outside capital , signing leases or employing people .. should not really be considered entrepreneurs .. at all ..
        That is a bit rough, Musk came up with PayPal and sold it off for $132,000,000, and l don't think he had a team helping him apart from living near his Laptop for years on end, and his Mother making his dinners.

        Actually two teenagers locked themselves in an apartment living off pizza for about 6 weeks, developing Doom, (mainly to crack 3D rendering) and word of mouth made their fortunes.

        An Entrepreneur takes risks, creates wealth and makes it grow, a brick and morter business is helpful but isn't a kudo.

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        • Profile picture of the author Odahh
          Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

          That is a bit rough, Musk came up with PayPal and sold it off for $132,000,000, and l don't think he had a team helping him apart from living near his Laptop for years on end, and his Mother making his dinners.

          Actually two teenagers locked themselves in an apartment living off pizza for about 6 weeks, developing Doom, (mainly to crack 3D rendering) and word of mouth made their fortunes.

          An Entrepreneur takes risks, creates wealth and makes it grow, a brick and morter business is helpful but isn't a kudo.

          only a small fraction of business people or people who start business ..end up being entraprenurs ..
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          • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
            Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

            only a small fraction of business people or people who start business ..end up being entraprenurs ..
            Businesses. Would it surprise anyone to find out most businesses are started as a JOB ALTERNATIVE?

            I do agree, a small fraction of people who start a business are Entrepreneurs. Here, at the WF, which I have to keep reminding myself (and others) is where we are at...one will find very few risk takers, which categorize an Entrepreneur.

            We have tens of thousands who want a JOB, where they are the boss, and work from home, and make enough to survive off of.

            Many momma and poppa operations are a JOB, they pay a workman's wages to the owners, and for the most part, the businesses are happy with that.

            As has been pointed out, any dollar amounts pursued, are not the sign of Entrepreneurship, but it is a yardstick HERE at the WF, which is why I posted it up.

            I think the VAST majority of Warriors who reach the 10k a month earnings level, feel that they have achieved their IM success, albeit, it may be a harder JOB than what they could do, but they only have themselves to answer to.

            120K a year, in about the Pareto (80/20) %, would be a JOB. An Entrepreneur could make half of that, or 10x that amount.

            But here, at the WF, most want a JOB income, and are willing to work much harder (or so they claim) than they would for someone who would be their boss.

            GordonJ
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            • Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

              Many momma and poppa operations are a JOB, they pay a workman's wages to the owners, and for the most part, the businesses are happy with that.


              I think that's right, for the vast majority of small business owners. They are concentrating on the "doing" of whatever they do...and not the marketing and growth of their business.

              For example, the retailers in my core business are almost universally repair guys that decided to open their own shop. But the act, work, and market...as though they are doing a job. Often they even tell me how much they make per hour.

              And most people are perfectly happy with that.

              And truth be told, in my soul, I'm a salesman. The entrepreneur in me is secondary.
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              • Profile picture of the author Odahh
                Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

                I think that's right, for the vast majority of small business owners. They are concentrating on the "doing" of whatever they do...and not the marketing and growth of their business.

                For example, the retailers in my core business are almost universally repair guys that decided to open their own shop. But the act, work, and market...as though they are doing a job. Often they even tell me how much they make per hour.

                And most people are perfectly happy with that.

                And truth be told, in my soul, I'm a salesman. The entrepreneur in me is secondary.
                it is interesting to see the patterns over the last 250 years of entrepreneurship and the industrial age ..American have this real ridgid model for business and entrepreneurship..

                where much of the world even poor people run businesses and build out over years working 12 hours or more a day ..and living with in walking distance of their business ..

                because of zoning and other laws .. around the country .. there are a lot of people who are capped on how big their home businesses can get .. and work within that "mostly "

                because of how poorly wages have grown over the last 30 years .. the jim rohn quote that 1,000- 2,000 extra a month is life changing to most people ..is still accurate . when 50 percent of wage earners earn less than 40,000 a year ..

                the 10k a month put people in the top ten percent .. but if they are starting out at 2k a month or less ..many will be happy when they replace the income from their job and get to 3-4 k a month . ambition may already start to fade .. as the main goal was achieved .. unless they are in a real high cost of living part of the US ..
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                • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
                  Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

                  it is interesting to see the patterns over the last 250 years of entrepreneurship and the industrial age ..American have this real ridgid model for business and entrepreneurship..

                  where much of the world even poor people run businesses and build out over years working 12 hours or more a day ..and living with in walking distance of their business ..

                  because of zoning and other laws .. around the country .. there are a lot of people who are capped on how big their home businesses can get .. and work within that "mostly "

                  because of how poorly wages have grown over the last 30 years .. the jim rohn quote that 1,000- 2,000 extra a month is life changing to most people ..is still accurate . when 50 percent of wage earners earn less than 40,000 a year ..

                  the 10k a month put people in the top ten percent .. but if they are starting out at 2k a month or less ..many will be happy when they replace the income from their job and get to 3-4 k a month . ambition may already start to fade .. as the main goal was achieved .. unless they are in a real high cost of living part of the US ..
                  I highlighted the part of your post about ZONING, which mostly caps traffic, or numbers of people, but NOT income. And to bring this full circle back to my original point, there is no CAP put on anyone here when it comes to income, or the SPEED of getting it.

                  I appreciate you calling attention to a more Macro view, the world has different modes of operation depending where you are, but for all intents and purposes, IM, Internet Marketing tears down barriers, eliminates borders (for the most part) and allows anyone with access to the Internet to engage in money making activity.

                  I like money goals for MOST IMers, although the risk takers, the Entrepreneurs fall into a different arena, as do inventors and product developers.

                  Money is measurable, and when there are goals in place, fairly easy to track progress, or lack of it.

                  The 10k a month is an arbitrary number, used a lot here at WF, as a yardstick of IM success. But, if it is costing you 11k to earn it, not so great unless you're building the next Amazon.

                  Now, I just read a post from a guy who has hit the 10k a month figure and has had a REVELATION. He had his AH HA moment when someone told him (for the billionith time) ...

                  The money is in the list. And you must build a relationship with the list.

                  And this is sort of my windmill I choose to joust with. Some Warriors who have spent the 5, 7 or 11 years getting NOTHING chose to ignore those common ideas which have come from the experienced.

                  I have had many a "discussion" here over the decades when someone who has reached her/his goal says it takes X number of years, or it takes a lot of FAILURE or trial and error.

                  NO it doesn't. It takes doing what is known to work.

                  Is there money in a list? Maybe. If you cultivate it, know who to get on it in the first place.

                  I have to wonder if the guy who spent 5 years could have cut off a couple of them had he taken the advice he had heard billions of times, and actually applied it? Common sense tells us his achievement would have been expedited, does it not?

                  Here in the MINDSET sub-forum we see countless discussions about the thinking, the positive images, the "right" kind of thinking, and much of it comes from guys who have been here 5 years or longer, and still have not reached their goals...but man, do they have the RIGHT mindset, eh?

                  DOING what it takes. Doing what has been tested and proven to work. Doing the WORK, instead of thinking about it, instead of hearing it a billion times, the DOING of it, whatever the it is...

                  is the right mindset to be in. One of movement toward a goal, even if you choose not to have a monetary one, you should have some evidence you are getting closer to what you want (even if that is to enjoy your status quo, and appreciate your journey).

                  Does it really take 5 or 7 years of struggle, trial and error to find yourself and to get aligned with your desires? I reckon that is opinion...and mine is simply, that is an EXCUSE.

                  Doing is the answer.
                  Doing is the clue.
                  Doing what is known to work,
                  Could it work for you?

                  Feel free to refute, respond or ignore. Or add to the discussion.

                  GordonJ
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                  • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
                    Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

                    DOING what it takes. Doing what has been tested and proven to work. Doing the WORK, instead of thinking about it, instead of hearing it a billion times, the DOING of it, whatever the it is...
                    is the right mindset to be in.
                    The Mind section of the forum promotes the notion that mindset leads to action. If that were always (or even often) the case, this sub forum would be filled with success stories rather than "motivational" clichés. In real life, it's far more common for action to precede mindset.

                    Faced with a seemingly large and daunting project, it's all too easy to contemplate yourself into inertia, or put things off until the inspiration kicks in. But just doing something, no matter how small, can often provide the spark that gets you moving forward. Ideas and insights suddenly appear as if from nowhere, and before you know it, you've got momentum. And you've tricked your mind into thinking it was its idea all along.
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                    • Originally Posted by Frank Donovan View Post

                      The Mind section of the forum promotes the notion that mindset leads to action. If that were always (or even often) the case, this sub forum would be filled with success stories rather than "motivational" clichés. In real life, it's far more common for action to precede mindset.
                      I know that's true.

                      But often, I wonder Why these things are true....

                      Why do people talk about mindset, motivation, and talk in quotes? Because the actual work is a different skill.

                      Mindset is all "Feel good" material. It's motivational...it gives a feeling that you are doing something.

                      But it's the How that gets it done. And the way you learn the How is by actually doing the project.

                      And you know who is mostly interested in the How? The people who are actually going to do the work. The dreamers? They don't need to know How...because they are happy living in the world of "What if' and Won't it be great when?


                      I just wanted everyone to know that I'm smart too.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Odahh
                    Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

                    I highlighted the part of your post about ZONING, which mostly caps traffic, or numbers of people, but NOT income. And to bring this full circle back to my original point, there is no CAP put on anyone here when it comes to income, or the SPEED of getting it.

                    I appreciate you calling attention to a more Macro view, the world has different modes of operation depending where you are, but for all intents and purposes, IM, Internet Marketing tears down barriers, eliminates borders (for the most part) and allows anyone with access to the Internet to engage in money making activity.

                    I like money goals for MOST IMers, although the risk takers, the Entrepreneurs fall into a different arena, as do inventors and product developers.


                    Feel free to refute, respond or ignore. Or add to the discussion.

                    GordonJ
                    curve ball question..what if there is a limit ..need ..so they turn to the internet and earn the money they feel they need to earn to have the lifestyle they want ..freed up from the need to save for retirement..or to earn well beyond that to invest ..because they really do not need to invest .because they will always need to make enough money to meet their needs ..
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                    • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
                      Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

                      curve ball question..what if there is a limit ..need ..so they turn to the internet and earn the money they feel they need to earn to have the lifestyle they want ..freed up from the need to save for retirement..or to earn well beyond that to invest ..because they really do not need to invest .because they will always need to make enough money to meet their needs ..
                      Like MEATLOAF, I never see the sudden curve until it's way too late...

                      But, if I am wrong, please correct me, OK? I think you are saying someone needs to make a certain amount of money on a regular and routine basis to maintain a given lifestyle, is this right?

                      So, say you want to move to Tagaytay City, a couple of hours from Manilla, and it will take you 1500 a month to have a place to live, set up a shop, and cover your monthly expenses.

                      And you need 900 GUARANTEED income on a monthly basis, OK? That covers your living expenses and anything above that you earn from your IM is "gravy".

                      So, one answer, would be to set up ONGOING or recurring income from providing an ongoing service, such as maintaining a web site, or a social media platform for someone, or having a retainer for your services.

                      At 900, you would need 3 people paying you 300 a month for such services or 6 at half that, and you would need a long term contract or agreement with them.

                      The other way might be to BANK $10,800.00 and draw out the 900 a month, if you can bank the 10 k in a single month, as some Warriors do, then you don't have to work for the rest of the year, and can focus on growing some micro greens for local restaurants.

                      Am I close to an answer to your question(??) ?

                      GordonJ
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                      • Profile picture of the author Odahh
                        Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

                        Like MEATLOAF, I never see the sudden curve until it's way too late...

                        But, if I am wrong, please correct me, OK? I think you are saying someone needs to make a certain amount of money on a regular and routine basis to maintain a given lifestyle, is this right?



                        The other way might be to BANK $10,800.00 and draw out the 900 a month, if you can bank the 10 k in a single month, as some Warriors do, then you don't have to work for the rest of the year, and can focus on growing some micro greens for local restaurants.

                        Am I close to an answer to your question(??) ?

                        GordonJ
                        that is way to tight of a budget ..i know people do manage that ..but i tried that for a few months in the philippines and i think the feel rich zone is 3000-4000 a month and that would pretty much give a comfortable lifestyle in much of the world .. and having something productive to do with an online business several hours a day ..is a good thing anyway .. which requires having good internet ..


                        now Claude ..when people se work as this miserable thing .. and you can see it when the feel good people talk about it .. it make it easier to see why it get avoided
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      • Profile picture of the author Jeffery
        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        Jeffery your way of thinking and doing business was probably outside the box before outside the box was a term people used
        I wouldn't say that because I only know what I learned from the the school of hard knocks, business college, the military and more importantly from my first mentor who was a true entrepreneur.

        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        ..and many of you old school entrepreneurs had some kind of hustle or way to make money when you where in your teens that wasn't working a job ..
        In my teens my first job was a shoe shine boy. Then one day I co-opted all of the shoe shine boys in the city and turned it into a real business. So, started with a job, learned how to do the baics of business (banking, accounting, payroll) - then had the idea to create a co-op and with my basic business experience - finally, more cities, more high-ticket customers which led to more growth, i.e. loss leaders and conversions.

        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        now as for self improvement .or personal productivity ..tech is outpacing human productivity in so many areas ..95 percent of self improvement is really better use of tech or acurieing better tech .. the same way entraprenurs use debt to brow their businesses or investment .. to make more money ..and and an huge percent of people get in debt and need
        a safe stable job to make money ..
        There are many roads to success. One example: Claude. On the road he walked from house to house selling vacuum cleaners. Along the road he became a master salesman serving home and corporate sales, a respected sought after mentor and speaker. Finally, his own business, secure future and a lovely wife.

        BTW, I don't speak "for" Claude. I like to think I speak "with" Claude. In my opinion, Claude would make an excellent Mentor. If he only knew how to make an excellent cheese cake he would own the world.

        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        entrepreneurs will naturally figure out how to use tech to mech money and build businesses .. and replace the ned for human employees who can stay off their f#$%^ cellphone ..when they should be working
        Some do and some do not. Example: A true entrepreneur knows the difference between technology and new technology in that technology is always changing which means - risk. A true entrepreneur does not like - risk. The true entrepreneur may do both to an extent. A true entrepreneur holds his cards close, i.e. profitable businesses that will always stand the test of time "without technology".

        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        i am going to change the tone a little ..because of the low start up cost and the main risk running an online business is the algorithm changing or your credit card processor screwing things up.. the majority of people starting businesses .. that don't require outside capital , signing leases or employing people .. should not really be considered entrepreneurs .. at all ..
        There is a lot of truth to that statement Odahh.
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  • Profile picture of the author JPs copy
    Psycho-Cybernetics for the win
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  • Profile picture of the author Kay King
    entrepreneurs will naturally figure out how to use tech to mech money and build businesses .. and replace the ned for human employees who can stay off their f#$%^ cellphone ..when they should be working

    i am going to change the tone a little ..because of the low start up cost and the main risk running an online business is the algorithm changing or your credit card processor screwing things up.. the majority of people starting businesses .. that don't require outside capital , signing leases or employing people .. should not really be considered entrepreneurs .. at all ..
    I disagree with much, if not all, of that.

    Entrepreneurs do not have some magical way to 'naturally figure out' - they have the desire to learn and the willingness to do so. If your employees waste time on the clock - that's your fault as a manager. The micro managers who feel they must control their workers - whether employees in an office/shop or virtual workers online - have problems with productivity. Those managers who set expectations for results and consequences for lack of results, have it easier.

    The idea that offline businesses where people sign leases and employ others is not 'entrepreneurial' is just plain wrong. Do you think that word was coined AFTER the internet?

    Starting an offline business is riskier in many cases...signing a lease means committing funds long term and often required a hefty deposit as well. Getting credit will depend on your willingness to risk your possessions to back the new business - and then there's the money needed to stock your stores. As an entrepreneur, it can take more commitment to start an offline business than it does to start a low-cost startup online. "Entrepreneur' describes the mindset - not the business model.

    An Entrepreneur takes risks, creates wealth and makes it grow, a brick and morter business is helpful but isn't a kudo
    In my forum experience here, those who like to talk about the risks, anticipate the rewards, and analyze the 'mindset' of entrepreneurs....are usually not financially successful themselves. I'm not convinced you can 'create' an entrepreneur - you either have the vision, the drive, the ability....or you don't.

    That said - someone with determination, willingness to do what it takes and stick with it for the long haul....can be hugely successful without the 'mindset of an entrepreneur'.
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