by Mr. Thiago Banned
153 replies
???????????
#debt #guarantee #make #making #mechanics #modern #money #reading
  • Profile picture of the author Shariyf Clark
    Will do. Thanks for the tip.
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  • Profile picture of the author khir
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    • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
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      • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
        Originally Posted by Mr. Thiago View Post


        You can watch the video at Zeitgeist - The Movie

        To get modern money mechanics (47 pages) you must search 'free modern money mechanics download' on Google.
        That was a heads up movie, dude.

        Too bad its going to fall on deaf ears for most.

        Most will only see or care AFTER its much too late.

        The 13 th Warrior
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        • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
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          Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post

          That was a heads up movie, dude.

          Too bad its going to fall on deaf ears for most.

          Most will only see or care AFTER its much too late.

          The 13 th Warrior
          People are too worried about what coloured knickers Paris Hilton will wear next, or who Lindsey Lohan is going to lay backstage.
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      • Profile picture of the author sahbussman
        Thanks for sharing just now i started downloading.
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        • Profile picture of the author LibertyUnc
          Definitely good stuff. I stumbled across these things a couple of years back while researching law.

          Some of this is what prompted me to recognize that money is simply stored time, which let me quickly and easily change my behavior patterns. I used to make about 5k a month at a day job and end every month with a zero balance. Today I make a lot less, but spend only about $6-700 per month...which includes rent. And as a result I have so much more free time to do the things I want. As I increase what I make via the knowledge gained from this forum and elsewhere, my free time actually increases.

          Modern money mechanics ( and a couple of the sister books put out by the federal reserve ) is an excellent book and holds the keys that so many are seeking in relation to debt. The only bad part is that so many people are unable to comprehend the truth of their plight at this stage. Take the information within it, distill it down so that more people can comprehend it without running into the wall of cognitive dissonance, and you have a powerful ebook indeed

          And the matrix is definitely one of my all time favorite movies...every time I see it I pick up on little things that I had not previously noticed. Just follow DeJure and you will eventually see that you are not Mr. Anderson. You are you...and once you stop allowing others to define you it becomes possible to do things which most consider impossible.
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    • Profile picture of the author shadow2203
      You can either google them
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    • Profile picture of the author oboi2121
      Hello Omari Taylor Here,

      Great to hear about you success. I'll check it out. Best wishes.
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      Omari Taylor

      Learn How To Realistically Make $15,000 Per Month (or more) In Your Business, In Your First 90 Days With No Experience, Without Picking Up The Phone, Or Making A List Of Your Friends And Family...EVER Again**FREE** ==> http://www.InstantRoad2Riches.com

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      • Profile picture of the author JamesEcho1
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        • Profile picture of the author axileon
          thanks mr thiago... very valuable information..
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        • Profile picture of the author vifechi
          Thanks for the info, i like the statement you made "Today I realize that money is just an illusion like everything else, and it is so easy to make just by thinking right and speaking right".I will watch the video and read the book.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
          Banned
          Originally Posted by JamesEcho1 View Post

          Thanks for the help. You wouldn't mind sending me a link for the ebook would you?
          I have some excellent news.

          www.barronscrediteducators.com - Credit Card Debt? This is the website that I used to download modern money mechanics.

          Also download 'two faces of debt' and 'banking basics' off this website 100% free and watch the video 'money masters' on youtube.

          Also watch this video on youtube -
          All The Best!
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  • Profile picture of the author Shariyf Clark
    Thiago what did you do after you watched the movie and read the book? That shits mind blowing
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    • Profile picture of the author NaiksTips
      Thanks for sharing the information Mr. Thiago.
      Just the same question, what did u do after that to have such bank balance?
      is that from IM ? if so, can you tell a little bit about that too?
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      • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
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        • Profile picture of the author affjourney
          This is so true- the focusing on the work and not the money!
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        • Profile picture of the author jane pope
          Thank you. I will follow your advice. To learn so young is great. From bankrupt to more debts, at 49, I feel you are never to old to learn and never to old to know younger people can and DO know more.

          To a positive journey.

          Jane
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  • Profile picture of the author BigSexy
    Thanx for the share, I definitely will take a look at it.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mr. Cross Brown
      [DELETED]
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      • Profile picture of the author Christian Chan
        Obama got it wrong. Hitler is being remembered.

        Originally Posted by Mr. Cross Brown View Post

        Let us build success because, according to President Obama, people will remember us for what we built not for what we destroyed.
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        • Profile picture of the author dlwebb610
          Originally Posted by Christian Chan View Post

          Obama got it wrong. Hitler is being remembered.
          What makes you think Obama (aka the banks new lacky) is any different than Hitler? You folks truly have no idea what is coming do you?

          For those interested, here is another vid to watch. This one is about the illegal income tax that you are told you MUSt pay. I tried to find the full length version in youtube to imbed it here but no luck.

          freedom to fascism - Google Videos
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          • Profile picture of the author Eben
            Mr. Thiago -

            Thanks for sharing your success story.
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  • Profile picture of the author Shariyf Clark
    Thiago,
    Thank you so much for sharing this with us. I watched both Zeitgeist movies last night back to back and have begun reading the Modern Money Mechanics book. My life has also changed for good.

    I've already begun taking steps to repair my credit and eliminate my short term debt. I'm making slow, steady progress. Knowing that you did the same and eventually came out on top is encouraging.

    Thanks again.
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  • Profile picture of the author rlnorthcutt
    Thiago,

    I see! You are leveraging credit in the RIGHT way... fantastic. I think the fact that you have a good plan is key, but often we can supercharge our business with a WISE infusion of capital.

    You are correct - money is an illusion and those who know it are the ones who can bring it in easily.

    I have read that if you took all the money in the world and divided it up evenly amongst all the humans on the planet, within a year it would be back to those it came from. They get it!

    So many people are programmed by modern culture to be blind consumers - they buy any old crap that comes along. The wise save/invest their money creating assets and building their cash flow generating power.

    Thanks for the info!

    Ron
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    • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
      Banned
      Originally Posted by rlnorthcutt View Post

      Thiago,

      I see! You are leveraging credit in the RIGHT way... fantastic. I think the fact that you have a good plan is key, but often we can supercharge our business with a WISE infusion of capital.

      You are correct - money is an illusion and those who know it are the ones who can bring it in easily.

      I have read that if you took all the money in the world and divided it up evenly amongst all the humans on the planet, within a year it would be back to those it came from. They get it!

      So many people are programmed by modern culture to be blind consumers - they buy any old crap that comes along. The wise save/invest their money creating assets and building their cash flow generating power.

      Thanks for the info!

      Ron
      Yes, you are totally right Ron. Most people seem to be under a trance.
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  • Profile picture of the author Shariyf Clark
    Thiago,
    I was on the Barron's credit site earlier today and now the site seems to be taken down. And the youtube vid you posted isn't working...strange
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    • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Shariyf Clark View Post

      Thiago,
      I was on the Barron's credit site earlier today and now the site seems to be taken down. And the youtube vid you posted isn't working...strange

      Wow you're right. I don't know what happened because it was working this morning. That is freaky.

      Maybe people were downloading too much because of this post.

      To be honest with you not much people have read this booklet. It's quite difficult to find and no one talks about it.
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  • Profile picture of the author angelgabe
    great recommendations Thiago. I heard of both before but never got around to reading or watching either. As for the history of banking - very interesting...people should really learn more about what money "is".
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  • Profile picture of the author MelodyInFlorida
    Cool, I will check this out! Thanks for the tip!
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    I look forward to working with you soon!
    Melody@EloquenceOfWriting.com
    And remember to visit: www.EloquenceOfWriting.com
    For all of your content & marketing needs!

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  • Profile picture of the author indocg
    thanks. it help a lot
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  • On some level, everything is illusion but try telling yourself that when you step on a drawing pin.

    Making money is always going to start and end with attitude.
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  • Profile picture of the author egaeb
    WOW.... I just watched Zeitgeist Addendum....all I can say is "wow"

    ...

    I'm about to watch Zeitgeist The Movie now which was released (as the name would imply), before the addendum. Hopefully it will equally as "wow" lol - wow if I get a full 4 hours of "wow" today I won't know what to do with myself. :p

    Seriously though - thank you for the great recommendation!
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  • Profile picture of the author egaeb
    Oh, if you guys are looking for where you can watch it - The Zeitgeist Movement streams it free. www . zeitgeistmovie . com (sorry about the spaces - post count restriction)
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  • Profile picture of the author Livefire
    You can find the Modern Money Mechanics pdf file at truthsetusfree dot com website......
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    • Profile picture of the author TiAndrine
      Originally Posted by Livefire View Post

      You can find the Modern Money Mechanics pdf file at truthsetusfree dot com website......
      Didn't find it at the above, I did find it here...

      Modern Money Mechanics
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  • Profile picture of the author leesr
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    -- LeeSr

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  • Profile picture of the author Deeno Zee
    Thanks will definitely check this out, much appreciated.
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  • Profile picture of the author amine
    great tip thanks
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    • Profile picture of the author coachmike
      You "guarantee" I will? How do you make the guarantee? Or, is this just a nice-sounding phrase.

      Maybe it's just the skeptic in me, but I certainly wondered about the way you said this.
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      • Profile picture of the author egaeb
        Originally Posted by coachmike View Post

        You "guarantee" I will? How do you make the guarantee? Or, is this just a nice-sounding phrase.

        Maybe it's just the skeptic in me, but I certainly wondered about the way you said this.
        yeah, although i loved the movie, I'm not really sure how this can be applied to making more money - unless he meant it in the sense of putting you in the right "mind-set" ABOUT money which then can facilitate making more of it..... the movie is basically talking about the negative effects of our monetary system, how the fractional system works in relation to the federal reserve and banks creating money from thin air, adding to inflation etc... global politics, economic hit men, religion, slavery, illusion of freedom....

        I'm pretty sure it was meant in a mind-set sense....
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  • Profile picture of the author Traffic101
    Sounds interesting. It's a different path, worth checking out. Thanks for the movie link and for sharing. And congrats to your success, it's nice to hear that other people are successful online.
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    • Profile picture of the author nolachief
      Thanks! I've seen the first movie in the series, didn't kow there was a second one.... looking forward to seeing the second and reading the book....bob
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  • Profile picture of the author RedPhoenix
    Hmmm ... Yes the movies were interesting. As are some of the ideas advocated by "The Venus Project" but what is rather puzzling is they both call for the end of the monetary system while Mr.Thiago's post heading claims this info guarantees that you will make money.

    Also Mr.Thiago you took out a loan for £10,000 which you repay at £97 pm - this means that without any interest applied you will be indebted to the bank for over 8 1/2 years. What you have got to ask yourself is am I earning a greater return on this loan than the interest I am paying on it? Plus why would you even want the loan as you have £12,500 in your bank & earn £1,600 a month. Why not just pay the £10,000 back & have a balance of £2,500? "This video will help you stop spending money and wasting time on garbage" - Why waste money on bank interest?

    As for the scrapping of the monetary system - both Zeitgeist & Venus seem to have equated the aberrant money printing/supply & credit practices of the central/federal reserve banks with the entire monetary system. The monetary system preceeded the existence of both banks & central/federal reserve banks. The monetary system replaced the barter system which serverely restricted tade and commerce. They also fail to elaborate on just how their proposed resource based economy would operate on a practical level. I shall comment on this tomorrow after applying a little critical thinking overnite.

    Whilst what you posted is interesting & thought provoking you have not shown how this leads to the creativity, insight, persistence & skill necessary to earn money online. However I do admire your passion & intention to be helpful.

    All the best

    Mike
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    • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
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      • Profile picture of the author Shariyf Clark
        what's RICO?

        Sounds like you are managing your cash and credit in ways most beneficial to you. Why don't you create an info product about it ;-) I'm sure a few warriors and non-warriors would find some value in it. Hell, My entire perception of money changed in 4 hours thanks to your suggestion. I wonder how many more people you could steer in the right direction.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
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          • Profile picture of the author wizozz
            Originally Posted by Mr. Thiago View Post

            Hi Shariyf,

            I don't want people to get carried away with this information and movie. Money is just another illusion.

            Money doesn't make everybody happy.

            Ask yourself this:

            What do I need money for?

            What will I do with this money?

            Can I have or do this without money anyway?

            Everything must have a balance.

            My grandmother spent 20 years of her life chasing after money and she still hasn't made anything. She hasn't slept properly for a few years and is under stress. She has also lost her health and fitness.

            Was it worth it?

            The answer is No. She will never get those 20 years back in this life.

            YouTube - Holographic Universe (Part 1 of 2 ) its all illusion.
            Hi,

            I think money is not "just an illusion". It is a means of exchange of value.

            Not all value can be exchanged into money, but are related with money.

            Health & Fitness definitely has value, so you can talk about "Wealth of Health and Fitness". So can we talk about "social value (or wealth)", like having loving friends and family, a trusted support network. We can even talk about "Wisdom Value (or wealth)", where someone can clearly see what is the right thing to do, to solve a problem, and accordingly, etc. You can think about being happy and positive as a wealth or value, so you can talk about "Emotional Value (or wealth as stored value)". You can talk about knowledge and skills as a value, say "Mental Value"...

            So, I think in general it is unwise to "chase money", and neglect everything else to lose all the other values, but gain money. I guess it is better to have an overall "balanced wealth" of money, health, friends, skills etc...

            So focus on "value creation and delivery" (read: helping other people get what they want), not only for short term but also long term, and money (and friends, and health, and knowledge, and wisdom) will follow.
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    • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
      Originally Posted by RedPhoenix View Post


      The monetary system preceeded the existence of both banks & central/federal reserve banks. The monetary system replaced the barter system which serverely restricted tade and commerce. They also fail to elaborate on just how their proposed resource based economy would operate on a practical level. I shall comment on this tomorrow after applying a little critical thinking overnite.
      This is where the rubber is going to meet the road.

      The monetary system , worldwide, is going to implode on itself.

      The distress brought on by natural and universal forces concurant with system self-erosion will have things re-evaluated and re-defined what truely is of value and valuable.

      And a constant intensifying of that distress to boundaries unbelieved will narrow that definition of value to even a smaller, shrinking variable.

      Where evolutionist/scientific and religious ideologies will be physically seen and felt as to what is truth and what is illusion, what was a lie and what is reality. In both camps, there will be far less than 1% that will be all about real truth, regardless of whether its flavorful or appease the palate, or conforms to accepted concepts and definitions of what is.

      Also, this is taking as true that civilizations all started and functioned with some sort of monetary system , like barter, which is patently untrue.

      One fact to support this is when a tribe, people or culture has first been discovered, most of the them( tribe, culture) welcomed these strange new explorers, and offered them what they would give their own brother or son.

      No "payment" , whether barter or other was necessary or expected, an act of brotherhood to a complete stranger or strange people.

      Do you have a "monetary" system that your child has to access for you to feed, clothe and shelter him/her?? Of course not.

      The microcosom of the family unit represents the Macrocosom of the family of man which will be established, naturally.

      Despite errant scientist and historians, this type of civilzation existed a long time, into the hundreds of thousands of years ago, and it is going to established again, this time, for good.

      A few thousand years is only a drop in time, yet ,we evaluate history within very limited time modules.

      They simply keep finding older and older human remains that break the previous record of so-called timelines of "when history " started.

      There will be no "I" or "You" or "Mine".

      There are some ancient languages where there is no equivalent practice or word such as "MINE" or "OWN".

      Like some cultures have a main plate with food, and a person takes only what they need to put on a smaller plate. The smaller plate only is a place to rest the food before it is ingested, not a "stake" that declares ownership.

      No more holding resources as "hostage" to impose one's will on others.

      The Earth is 75% water, yet we pay for it. To charge for it should be capital punishment.

      Believe it, if there was a way scientist could dispense Oxygen for pay, a lot of folks would be dying of oxygen deprivation.....a ridiculous but small example of monetary lunacy and how far this system can devolve to and devolve humans.

      Most of us, despite education , have a future of failing to become human beings, much less growing into manhood and womanhood.

      Skills does not make us any more of a HUMAN, ask Ted Bundy and other psycopaths that have good upbringing, high incomes and high education, examples to the wise few.

      The future trade, hobby, science and skills of future man will be self-improvement, planet improvement, universe improvement, brother improvement, sister improvement, only glimpses of such a world , at best, is possible for us at this present time.

      When there is a shrinking and evitable "end" to all forms of monetary system, that is only going to be one ingredient to "The Shock Of The Hour".

      The 13 th Warrior
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      • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
        Banned
        Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post

        This is where the rubber is going to meet the road.

        The monetary system , worldwide, is going to implode on itself.

        The distress brought on by natural and universal forces concurant with system self-erosion will have things re-evaluated and re-defined what truely is of value and valuable.

        And a constant intensifying of that distress to boundaries unbelieved will narrow that definition of value to even a smaller, shrinking variable.

        Where evolutionist/scientific and religious ideologies will be physically seen and felt as to what is truth and what is illusion, what was a lie and what is reality. In both camps, there will be far less than 1% that will be all about real truth, regardless of whether its flavorful or appease the palate, or conforms to accepted concepts and definitions of what is.

        Also, this is taking as true that civilizations all started and functioned with some sort of monetary system , like barter, which is patently untrue.

        One fact to support this is when a tribe, people or culture has first been discovered, most of the them( tribe, culture) welcomed these strange new explorers, and offered them what they would give their own brother or son.

        No "payment" , whether barter or other was necessary or expected, an act of brotherhood to a complete stranger or strange people.

        Do you have a "monetary" system that your child has to access for you to feed, clothe and shelter him/her?? Of course not.

        The microcosom of the family unit represents the Macrocosom of the family of man which will be established, naturally.

        Despite errant scientist and historians, this type of civilzation existed a long time, into the hundreds of thousands of years ago, and it is going to established again, this time, for good.

        A few thousand years is only a drop in time, yet ,we evaluate history within very limited time modules.

        They simply keep finding older and older human remains that break the previous record of so-called timelines of "when history " started.

        There will be no "I" or "You" or "Mine".

        There are some ancient languages where there is no equivalent practice or word such as "MINE" or "OWN".

        Like some cultures have a main plate with food, and a person takes only what they need to put on a smaller plate. The smaller plate only is a place to rest the food before it is ingested, not a "stake" that declares ownership.

        No more holding resources as "hostage" to impose one's will on others.

        The Earth is 75% water, yet we pay for it. To charge for it should be capital punishment.

        Believe it, if there was a way scientist could dispense Oxygen for pay, a lot of folks would be dying of oxygen deprivation.....a ridiculous but small example of monetary lunacy and how far this system can devolve to and devolve humans.

        Most of us, despite education , have a future of failing to become human beings, much less growing into manhood and womanhood.

        Skills does not make us any more of a HUMAN, ask Ted Bundy and other psycopaths that have good upbringing, high incomes and high education, examples to the wise few.

        The future trade, hobby, science and skills of future man will be self-improvement, planet improvement, universe improvement, brother improvement, sister improvement, only glimpses of such a world , at best, is possible for us at this present time.

        When there is a shrinking and evitable "end" to all forms of monetary system, that is only going to be one ingredient to "The Shock Of The Hour".

        The 13 th Warrior
        Thankyou for the information. You are absolutely right.
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  • Profile picture of the author stbernardcom
    Interesting, thanks for the lead, and for posting the link to the video here. I would have to do some more research into banking, but definitely something to consider researching.

    To your continued success.
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  • Profile picture of the author Palo Coyote
    Thanks for the link.
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    No sig today.

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  • Profile picture of the author RedPhoenix
    Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post


    Also, this is taking as true that civilizations all started and functioned with some sort of monetary system , like barter, which is patently untrue.

    The 13 th Warrior
    All people living in social groups have a need for goods and services regardless of their "state of development". An effort is required by all adults to sustain & entertain their families & themselves. As people tend to have different likes, needs & wants a means of exchanging any surplus goods & services that you may have had for others that you wanted or needed became necessary. Initially this was done through barter - goods & services for other goods & services. As this was a cumbersome system the need for a neutral medium of exchange arose. This has taken various forms including coins, salt, semi-precious gems etc. All civilizations use a medium of exchanging effort (goods & or services) within the community. Money is just 1 medium of exchanging effort for effort. Even hunter-gatherer societies exchange effort for effort.

    Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post


    One fact to support this is when a tribe, people or culture has first been discovered, most of the them( tribe, culture) welcomed these strange new explorers, and offered them what they would give their own brother or son.

    No "payment" , whether barter or other was necessary or expected, an act of brotherhood to a complete stranger or strange people.

    The 13 th Warrior
    Hospitality or gifts offered to strangers/visitors/guests show kindness & emphathy but are certainly not proof that the "tribe/culture" in question does not function on at least an exchange of effort for effort basis.

    Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post


    Do you have a "monetary" system that your child has to access for you to feed, clothe and shelter him/her?? Of course not.

    The microcosom of the family unit represents the Macrocosom of the family of man which will be established, naturally.

    The 13 th Warrior
    Are you suggesting that some adults are like children whilst others are like parents and that the latter are completely responsible for the former? That the child-adult has a right to expect the parent-adult to completely provide for them! That the parent-adult has the right to discipline & control the child-adult! Superior & inferior.

    Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post


    Despite errant scientist and historians, this type of civilzation existed a long time, into the hundreds of thousands of years ago, and it is going to established again, this time, for good.

    A few thousand years is only a drop in time, yet ,we evaluate history within very limited time modules.

    They simply keep finding older and older human remains that break the previous record of so-called timelines of "when history " started.

    The 13 th Warrior
    Whilst I agree that we are given a rather slanted partial view of history and that it is constantly being revised in the light of new discoveries. What civilizations are you talking & where does your information on them come from? Plus more importantly what caused their demise & virtual obliteration? Please elaborate on this.

    Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post


    There will be no "I" or "You" or "Mine".

    There are some ancient languages where there is no equivalent practice or word such as "MINE" or "OWN".

    Like some cultures have a main plate with food, and a person takes only what they need to put on a smaller plate. The smaller plate only is a place to rest the food before it is ingested, not a "stake" that declares ownership.

    No more holding resources as "hostage" to impose one's will on others.

    The 13 th Warrior
    As long as the ego(personal awareness) exists which distinguishes 1 person from another, "I" , "You" etc will continue to be part of life. Whether a language has or had the equilavent words for Mine" or "Own" exclusive possession, use & consumption will have played at least some part in the lives of the people in question. Unless you are suggesting they had a "Borg-like" collective awareness and completely lacked individuality. Your meal sharing example is not all that different from a family in any western country sitting down to enjoy a meal together with members taking a portion from the main plates in the center of the table. A better example would be people helping themselves from a communal pot and eating with their hands. The control of resources is a natural extention of the "Them" and "Us" mentality of the ego state. It is neither fair or equitable and seeks to serve a group's self interest. Unless the ego awareness is transcended by the vast majority of people things will continue on much the same basis even under a "new" system.

    Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post


    The Earth is 75% water, yet we pay for it. To charge for it should be capital punishment.

    Believe it, if there was a way scientist could dispense Oxygen for pay, a lot of folks would be dying of oxygen deprivation.....a ridiculous but small example of monetary lunacy and how far this system can devolve to and devolve humans.

    Most of us, despite education , have a future of failing to become human beings, much less growing into manhood and womanhood.

    Skills does not make us any more of a HUMAN, ask Ted Bundy and other psycopaths that have good upbringing, high incomes and high education, examples to the wise few.

    The future trade, hobby, science and skills of future man will be self-improvement, planet improvement, universe improvement, brother improvement, sister improvement, only glimpses of such a world , at best, is possible for us at this present time.

    When there is a shrinking and evitable "end" to all forms of monetary system, that is only going to be one ingredient to "The Shock Of The Hour".

    The 13 th Warrior
    Do you have a well in your back garden that you draw water from? How does water get to your house/flat etc? Who filters, cleans & purifies it? Ever noticed how some people in less developed countries have to make their own arrangements for getting water. Yes they get it free if you ignore the effort that they had to make to obtain it. Anything that requires you to make an effort is not free. One way or another everthing has a "price-tag" of sorts. The simple fact is that when something is provided for you whether it be goods or a service; like having clean running water piped to your house; someone else has expended an effort to make that happen. The people that have expended this effort have given you value, enhanced the quality of your lifestyle, it is only fair & equitable that this be reciprocated and they receive a form of value from us.

    As for skills without developing these we would have no high technology and most likely we would be an extinct species. Monetary is just a word - there will always be a medium of exchanging value for value, of making a contribution. Yes change, improvements and even a complete overall may be called for. Zeitgeist & The Venus Project do have some great ideas but great ideas are not enough, practical solutions are called for that recognise the diversity & complexity of the actual situation. The real cause of inequality & unfairness is not the monetary system its our egocentric consciousness. Untill each person takes steps to transform themselves not much will change except the appearance of the playing field. The core character traits of humankind the primary drives & emotions have remained largely unchanged for thousands of years. Without higher awareness the game remains much the same. The good news is all change should begin with you, there is nothing to prevent you from working on yourself.


    Siochan leat

    Mike
    Signature
    http://www.23rdwave.com/

    "Excellence is not an event it's a habit" - Aristotle 384 BC
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    • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
      Banned
      Originally Posted by RedPhoenix View Post

      All people living in social groups have a need for goods and services regardless of their "state of development". An effort is required by all adults to sustain & entertain their families & themselves. As people tend to have different likes, needs & wants a means of exchanging any surplus goods & services that you may have had for others that you wanted or needed became necessary. Initially this was done through barter - goods & services for other goods & services. As this was a cumbersome system the need for a neutral medium of exchange arose. This has taken various forms including coins, salt, semi-precious gems etc. All civilizations use a medium of exchanging effort (goods & or services) within the community. Money is just 1 medium of exchanging effort for effort. Even hunter-gatherer societies exchange effort for effort.



      Hospitality or gifts offered to strangers/visitors/guests show kindness & emphathy but are certainly not proof that the "tribe/culture" in question does not function on at least an exchange of effort for effort basis.



      Are you suggesting that some adults are like children whilst others are like parents and that the latter are completely responsible for the former? That the child-adult has a right to expect the parent-adult to completely provide for them! That the parent-adult has the right to discipline & control the child-adult! Superior & inferior.



      Whilst I agree that we are given a rather slanted partial view of history and that it is constantly being revised in the light of new discoveries. What civilizations are you talking & where does your information on them come from? Plus more importantly what caused their demise & virtual obliteration? Please elaborate on this.



      As long as the ego(personal awareness) exists which distinguishes 1 person from another, "I" , "You" etc will continue to be part of life. Whether a language has or had the equilavent words for Mine" or "Own" exclusive possession, use & consumption will have played at least some part in the lives of the people in question. Unless you are suggesting they had a "Borg-like" collective awareness and completely lacked individuality. Your meal sharing example is not all that different from a family in any western country sitting down to enjoy a meal together with members taking a portion from the main plates in the center of the table. A better example would be people helping themselves from a communal pot and eating with their hands. The control of resources is a natural extention of the "Them" and "Us" mentality of the ego state. It is neither fair or equitable and seeks to serve a group's self interest. Unless the ego awareness is transcended by the vast majority of people things will continue on much the same basis even under a "new" system.



      Do you have a well in your back garden that you draw water from? How does water get to your house/flat etc? Who filters, cleans & purifies it? Ever noticed how some people in less developed countries have to make their own arrangements for getting water. Yes they get it free if you ignore the effort that they had to make to obtain it. Anything that requires you to make an effort is not free. One way or another everthing has a "price-tag" of sorts. The simple fact is that when something is provided for you whether it be goods or a service; like having clean running water piped to your house; someone else has expended an effort to make that happen. The people that have expended this effort have given you value, enhanced the quality of your lifestyle, it is only fair & equitable that this be reciprocated and they receive a form of value from us.

      As for skills without developing these we would have no high technology and most likely we would be an extinct species. Monetary is just a word - there will always be a medium of exchanging value for value, of making a contribution. Yes change, improvements and even a complete overall may be called for. Zeitgeist & The Venus Project do have some great ideas but great ideas are not enough, practical solutions are called for that recognise the diversity & complexity of the actual situation. The real cause of inequality & unfairness is not the monetary system its our egocentric consciousness. Untill each person takes steps to transform themselves not much will change except the appearance of the playing field. The core character traits of humankind the primary drives & emotions have remained largely unchanged for thousands of years. Without higher awareness the game remains much the same. The good news is all change should begin with you, there is nothing to prevent you from working on yourself.


      Siochan leat

      Mike

      Hi Mike,

      I totally agree with you on this one. Even if they were to scrap the money system, the same people who are in power now would still be in power.

      They know that money is just an illusion like everything else.

      There is a secret much deeper. This is why Zeitgeist has to be taken with a pinch of salt.

      This secret took me 2 years and 4 months to discover.

      The secret cannot be explained, people have to see it for themselves.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[493035].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Rachel Zaouche
        Hi Mr Thiago

        I loved your story and fair play to you to get up off your backside and do something about your life and your debts. I love your attitude and your spirit of sharing.

        BUT I do think you may have been given the wrong steer in going to your bank. I think you quite possibly would have been able to fund your business, given your age etc, by a grant from The Princes Trust or a similar organisation.

        Business support, information and advice | Business Link will give you some excellent free advice as it may not be too late to get assistance. I appreciate your comments about the bank, but being a financial planner, I have to say I would argue that you should look very closely at your finance options.

        Also, I assume you have registered as self employed/set up Ltd Company/Partnership so dont forget that you can deduct the cost of this finance and some depreciation on your computers etc against profits as a tax deductible expense.

        Whilst the value of money is perhaps an illusion, the wealthy (and powerful) people around us know two things - keep an eye on your costs (not the same as being a penny pincher!) and always pay yourself first. It is funny how you can always find the money to pay bills afterwards yet most people (poor people!) pay everyone else first and then realise that they have more month than money.

        Best of luck to you.

        Rach
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      • Profile picture of the author kozmotm
        Thanks for sharing this.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mr. Thiago
      Banned
      Originally Posted by RedPhoenix View Post

      All people living in social groups have a need for goods and services regardless of their "state of development". An effort is required by all adults to sustain & entertain their families & themselves. As people tend to have different likes, needs & wants a means of exchanging any surplus goods & services that you may have had for others that you wanted or needed became necessary. Initially this was done through barter - goods & services for other goods & services. As this was a cumbersome system the need for a neutral medium of exchange arose. This has taken various forms including coins, salt, semi-precious gems etc. All civilizations use a medium of exchanging effort (goods & or services) within the community. Money is just 1 medium of exchanging effort for effort. Even hunter-gatherer societies exchange effort for effort.



      Hospitality or gifts offered to strangers/visitors/guests show kindness & emphathy but are certainly not proof that the "tribe/culture" in question does not function on at least an exchange of effort for effort basis.



      Are you suggesting that some adults are like children whilst others are like parents and that the latter are completely responsible for the former? That the child-adult has a right to expect the parent-adult to completely provide for them! That the parent-adult has the right to discipline & control the child-adult! Superior & inferior.



      Whilst I agree that we are given a rather slanted partial view of history and that it is constantly being revised in the light of new discoveries. What civilizations are you talking & where does your information on them come from? Plus more importantly what caused their demise & virtual obliteration? Please elaborate on this.



      As long as the ego(personal awareness) exists which distinguishes 1 person from another, "I" , "You" etc will continue to be part of life. Whether a language has or had the equilavent words for Mine" or "Own" exclusive possession, use & consumption will have played at least some part in the lives of the people in question. Unless you are suggesting they had a "Borg-like" collective awareness and completely lacked individuality. Your meal sharing example is not all that different from a family in any western country sitting down to enjoy a meal together with members taking a portion from the main plates in the center of the table. A better example would be people helping themselves from a communal pot and eating with their hands. The control of resources is a natural extention of the "Them" and "Us" mentality of the ego state. It is neither fair or equitable and seeks to serve a group's self interest. Unless the ego awareness is transcended by the vast majority of people things will continue on much the same basis even under a "new" system.



      Do you have a well in your back garden that you draw water from? How does water get to your house/flat etc? Who filters, cleans & purifies it? Ever noticed how some people in less developed countries have to make their own arrangements for getting water. Yes they get it free if you ignore the effort that they had to make to obtain it. Anything that requires you to make an effort is not free. One way or another everthing has a "price-tag" of sorts. The simple fact is that when something is provided for you whether it be goods or a service; like having clean running water piped to your house; someone else has expended an effort to make that happen. The people that have expended this effort have given you value, enhanced the quality of your lifestyle, it is only fair & equitable that this be reciprocated and they receive a form of value from us.

      As for skills without developing these we would have no high technology and most likely we would be an extinct species. Monetary is just a word - there will always be a medium of exchanging value for value, of making a contribution. Yes change, improvements and even a complete overall may be called for. Zeitgeist & The Venus Project do have some great ideas but great ideas are not enough, practical solutions are called for that recognise the diversity & complexity of the actual situation. The real cause of inequality & unfairness is not the monetary system its our egocentric consciousness. Untill each person takes steps to transform themselves not much will change except the appearance of the playing field. The core character traits of humankind the primary drives & emotions have remained largely unchanged for thousands of years. Without higher awareness the game remains much the same. The good news is all change should begin with you, there is nothing to prevent you from working on yourself.


      Siochan leat

      Mike
      You couldn't be more right.
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    • Profile picture of the author rdbranson
      Money is a tool that has worked very well in helping to create prosperity.

      At the same time, like all tools, money can be abused.

      One-at-the-time personal transformation is nice, but doesn't work well. Organized action that changes culture is the main way people change their consciousness.

      RDB
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    • Profile picture of the author yosis
      "Zeitgeist & The Venus Project do have some great ideas but great ideas are not enough, practical solutions are called for that recognise the diversity & complexity of the actual situation. The real cause of inequality & unfairness is not the monetary system its our egocentric consciousness." --RedPhoenix

      I agree. I also found that the Venus Project placed too much emphasis on Technology as a means to solve the world's problems. As if our technological advancements will change some of the fundamental problems that have little to do with technology. For example, we've had the technology to have electric cars for decades but greed, selfishness, and big business means our environment and our economics suffer.

      Now my criticisms of the film doesn't take away from the fact that you've managed to change your life from whatever inspiration you were able to gather from it. That's wonderful and I applaud you. You're making moves to improve your life and that in of itself is an inspiration (our different tastes in movies notwithstanding).
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  • Profile picture of the author george43
    Hi guys, I also recommed you watch The Secret if haven't done it yet!!
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  • Profile picture of the author yaz8888
    sounds interesting...I'll check it out
    Signature

    Latest alternatives to Leather Gym Gloves

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  • Profile picture of the author Simon74
    Very interesting info, I will check it out. I really admire people like you so determinate.

    All the best.
    P.S. I am sure you will be a success
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    • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
      Originally Posted by RedPhoenix View Post


      All civilizations use a medium of exchanging effort (goods & or services) within the community. Money is just 1 medium of exchanging effort for effort. Even hunter-gatherer societies exchange effort for effort.
      "Civilizations" that you know of. "Civilizations" within the past several thousand years until the present. That is only a drop compared to civilizations in the past that go into the hundred thousands of years ago. One can believe it or not.

      The frame of reference referring to as "each" family as a self-sustaining unit with only allegence to themselves is untrue in what the root definition of what civilization or civil is, regardless of what webster says.

      If the laws of nature and the universe operated in such a manner, there would be no existence.

      How would one feel if your organs or oxygen in the atmosphere operated in the " give me something first" in exchange for their services....and maybe it would think that it "deserves" MORE than it is naturally designed to use or need, there would be problems.

      Good thing that Man is the only one with this power of "choice" for if other entities operated as we do, then there is the end of time and existence.

      Technologies in the past thousand years, that, TODAY, with computers and modern science, STILL can't figure out how they back then either made it work or how it worked.

      How arrogant and mentally imprisoned are we, if, an engineer,TODAY, that can build and design a car from the ground up could'nt figure out how a wagon or cart could work a thousand years ago, to illustrate a simple example, there is lacking in the present worlds knowledge and definitions.


      Originally Posted by RedPhoenix View Post


      Hospitality or gifts offered to strangers/visitors/guests show kindness & emphathy but are certainly not proof that the "tribe/culture" in question does not function on at least an exchange of effort for effort basis.
      "Yes", it is part of the proof. Most explorers that decided to live among even the most so-called uncivilized peoples continued to get that treatment.

      Goods and services are for everyone to share, freely, though I don't expect most who reflect the opposite sentiment to comprehend.

      If one is born with the gift and ability to heal, then that is what one does, period. Not " I'll heal you if you give me something", and that goes with all trades and disciplines.

      Most equate "Life" , its meaning, purpose and reason in the vision of the life styles of the rich and famous. Live to ski, party, surf,lay in the sun all day, entertain ones self, play poker and gamble all day, etc.,...so when people cannot fathom something else, then its simply not for them to see.

      That is why the Earth HAS to have a cleansing of sorts, because the majority of folks cannot comprehend this, which is why no matter who the leader is or what politics or theology, or design of the system, it is bound to fail, and fail miserably because of the lack of this ORIGINAL order of nature and people.


      Originally Posted by RedPhoenix View Post


      Are you suggesting that some adults are like children whilst others are like parents and that the latter are completely responsible for the former? That the child-adult has a right to expect the parent-adult to completely provide for them! That the parent-adult has the right to discipline & control the child-adult! Superior & inferior.
      If somebody does not understand my {family/child/family of man} metaphor, it is useless for me to explain further.

      Not to pick on the above quote, but most of the world would have problems comprehending this , simply for the 1st fact that we have yet to be HUMAN, let alone grow into manhood and womanhood.

      The above quote is great, if we are talking in the philosophy of literal math numbers with no human soul/cohesive as a balance, or literal monetary or physical value given a tag or number to be assessed or monetary derivative thereof, with some unnatural/artificial system exploited to "each" family units unlimited capacity for monopolization, or using computer binary code as a guide into what it is to be human or have humanity.

      Superior and Inferior are words incompatable with Humans and anyone using that is likely lost forever. These words are impossible to use and apply to people without some tinge, ingredient of blatant evil or would eventually erode to such, I don't care what scientist use them. These words are applicable only to physical objects in relation to specific purposes.

      Its like trying to explain to a Robot what it is to "be" human or what the act of humanity "is", or what does it really mean, the term, "human soul".


      Originally Posted by RedPhoenix View Post


      Whilst I agree that we are given a rather slanted partial view of history and that it is constantly being revised in the light of new discoveries. What civilizations are you talking & where does your information on them come from? Plus more importantly what caused their demise & virtual obliteration? Please elaborate on this.
      NOTHING said here or demonstrated will change what people percieve or want to believe.

      The fact is, the choice , for everyone, has already been made and even the wrath of god cannot change what people want in their hearts desire.

      Any information one needs will either have been found or is in the process of finding , way before this forum was created.

      Any NEW information would only solidify the path that one is ALREADY on , not disuade a person to something that redefines what one percieves and believes, no matter what the science or facts say, because the die has been cast on what people want, even if they are allowed to die and re-incarnate a few times, their path has been chosen deep in their heart, by them, by choice, and very little will be altered. Like I said before, if Hitler was re-incarnated a few times, he would most likely be a more craftier person than before, or Pharoah would do things a tad different to "extend" his time before the wrath, not much more.

      For someone to ask means one was never "there" as far as a mind set.... like a person on a train and watching the scenary as they go by in thier direction, not being curious enough to see something that makes them stop the train or get off and go to a new direction.

      At best, new information for people is like a cruise ship that docks at a port, look at the gift shops, take a few photos, then continue on in THE direction of the ships original destination, nothing more than an exercise or a "break" for the satisfaction of a curiosisty.


      Originally Posted by RedPhoenix View Post


      As long as the ego(personal awareness) exists which distinguishes 1 person from another, "I" , "You" etc will continue to be part of life. Whether a language has or had the equilavent words for Mine" or "Own" exclusive possession, use & consumption will have played at least some part in the lives of the people in question. Unless you are suggesting they had a "Borg-like" collective awareness and completely lacked individuality. Your meal sharing example is not all that different from a family in any western country sitting down to enjoy a meal together with members taking a portion from the main plates in the center of the table. A better example would be people helping themselves from a communal pot and eating with their hands. The control of resources is a natural extention of the "Them" and "Us" mentality of the ego state. It is neither fair or equitable and seeks to serve a group's self interest. Unless the ego awareness is transcended by the vast majority of people things will continue on much the same basis even under a "new" system.
      "Unless the ego awareness is transcended by the vast majority of people ......",...yes, this will happen, and it can happen, once the people who will not choose to change are no longer here by natural forces.

      Love..., most people say it, see it in dictionary but really lack its comprehension and purpose in the universe. There is a scientific and atomic law that operates this principle as we currently live.

      Again, trying to explain what being human is and that a family unit is a microcosm of the macrocosm. "Your" baby daughter, means as much to me, not greater or lesser , than my baby daughter, even if I have never met you or your daughter.

      Words like, in their literal sense, "I", 'Me", "Mine", "ego", "control of resources", "group self-interest", are words that are mechanical in nature and exemplifies the mis-use of possibly something of good. They are given life and definition by the operators soul.

      Fair and Equitable is the path, purpose and direction of the human soul. To "Them" , "Us" or some entities or tools within themselves or definitions that cannot be changed or truely defined is simply another justification for "reasonable deniability" so people can continue doing what they do. Fair and Equitable is entrenched in natural law and direction, and we humans have the capacity to be even more perfect than universal forces are now.

      A Gun is only a tool, and neither seeks Fairness and Equity, so what?

      The only problem is, the invention and existence of this tool has its roots in evil, so even if this "tool" and word "Gun" is eliminated, if the root of the mind that envisioned this cannot be quantified, found, understood, then destroyed, then any philosophy that cannot address this soundly is futile and/or lacking, only has "pieces" of truth.

      For someone to say that "collective awareness" and "individuality" cannot co-exist , there is no explantion that can make people to see.

      Too quick to want to compartmentize things in some box so one can move on and justify ones path so as to "no need to work on and get into that" , " that " being, the root of evil in us all.

      We are living in an age where only "Whole, organic, pure, unprocessed, unrefined, chemical free, hybrid-free" truth is the only thing that is going to work....time will show the philosophies and science that have reached their zenith are un-recyclable, and will erode as we speak, never to be used with efficency or effectiveness again, even if they worked for thousands of years, until on one way is left standing.

      THE TRUTH, cares not whether you find it pallatable or of inconcievable taste standards.

      A New way has come.



      Originally Posted by RedPhoenix View Post


      As for skills without developing these we would have no high technology and most likely we would be an extinct species. Monetary is just a word - there will always be a medium of exchanging value for value, of making a contribution. Yes change, improvements and even a complete overall may be called for. Zeitgeist & The Venus Project do have some great ideas but great ideas are not enough, practical solutions are called for that recognise the diversity & complexity of the actual situation. The real cause of inequality & unfairness is not the monetary system its our egocentric consciousness. Untill each person takes steps to transform themselves not much will change except the appearance of the playing field. The core character traits of humankind the primary drives & emotions have remained largely unchanged for thousands of years. Without higher awareness the game remains much the same. The good news is all change should begin with you, there is nothing to prevent you from working on yourself.
      Evaluating Techological achievements as to the definition of what being human is is one of the primary mistakes and people must choose and desire on their own to take a self help on this one, no religion or philosophy can change the desire of the will.

      Words are given meaning by their practice and spirit. The word , ideology, meaning and practice of the word {monetary} is coming to and end very soon, forever.

      The Earth has a specific gravity density it operates under, what is that worth?

      What numerical value does one put on the oxygen we injest, what formula do we need?

      On an insurance form, it says if you lose your arm, the value of it has been mathematically worked out to a dollar figure. Yes, logical, in the logic and mathematics of witches, demons, devils, and other soul-less entities that have two arms, two legs, and can calculate interest rates. Please don't bother to ask what this means because if you do, it is beyond the scope of comprehension. All it really takes , is the soul to be truely human to understand any of it.

      Venus project may only have 1% of vision of the kind of world is going to evolve. I see things in the Venus project that will "infect" and retro-act the plague of our present world, so the change they propose would barely be temporary.

      Anything and everything that leads toward the birth of the root of evil will not continue in the near future. One cannot invision or form anything or evolve anything until the root of evil is understood of how it came into existence, its purpose and its end, forever. If your religious, theosophy, ideology, philosophy,mathematics, cannot point out its orgin, cannot quantify the why it exist, cannot fathom its permanent solution , don't worry about it too much, we are continuing on a path we are unwilling to alter, no matter what we read or what we hear.

      How can one understand, define, evolve and master Life if one does not know the root of evil , which is the enemy of existence and peace?

      To say there will never be an end to evil, it will always exist in some form, is to say one is lost without recovery, will never see, which is why the best on the planet we have today, is under 20% brain capacity, the "other" 80% + will be actived in the new world when the root of anti-existence is removed from the planet , conscious, soul and future progentors forever.

      This technology can easily manifest in physical achievements beyond this worlds comprehension but that will be the least and afterthought...most of this technologys root , focus, direction and power occupys brotherhood, sisterhood, peace, equity, love, empathy, unselfishness, selflessness, tranquility,harmony, reciprosity....these have molecular equivalents.

      Any place you go on planet Earth, you would be "HOME" and treated as such, ALL peoples.

      This "technology" DEFINATELY exist and will evolve beyond this worlds capacity to "see" in the future.

      The 13 th Warrior
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      • Profile picture of the author stbernardcom
        Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post

        Goods and services are for everyone to share, freely, though I don't expect most who reflect the opposite sentiment to comprehend.

        If one is born with the gift and ability to heal, then that is what one does, period. Not " I'll heal you if you give me something", and that goes with all trades and disciplines.
        This is where people have their own opinions. A person born with an ability to help others has the choice of how much they want to help others, because they have free will. If providing their service for free results in them not having a place to live or enough food to eat, it is wise for them to start charging or find creative ways to create income or trade for shelter, etc.
        Signature
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      • Profile picture of the author wizozz
        Hi,

        Originally Posted by The 13th Warrior View Post

        "Civilizations" that you know of.
        Fair and Equitable is the path, purpose and direction of the human soul. To "Them" , "Us" or some entities or tools within themselves or definitions that cannot be changed or truely defined is simply another justification for "reasonable deniability" so people can continue doing what they do. Fair and Equitable is entrenched in natural law and direction, and we humans have the capacity to be even more perfect than universal forces are now.

        A Gun is only a tool, and neither seeks Fairness and Equity, so what?

        The only problem is, the invention and existence of this tool has its roots in evil, so even if this "tool" and word "Gun" is eliminated, if the root of the mind that envisioned this cannot be quantified, found, understood, then destroyed, then any philosophy that cannot address this soundly is futile and/or lacking, only has "pieces" of truth.

        For someone to say that "collective awareness" and "individuality" cannot co-exist , there is no explantion that can make people to see.

        Too quick to want to compartmentize things in some box so one can move on and justify ones path so as to "no need to work on and get into that" , " that " being, the root of evil in us all.

        We are living in an age where only "Whole, organic, pure, unprocessed, unrefined, chemical free, hybrid-free" truth is the only thing that is going to work....time will show the philosophies and science that have reached their zenith are un-recyclable, and will erode as we speak, never to be used with efficency or effectiveness again, even if they worked for thousands of years, until on one way is left standing.

        ...

        How can one understand, define, evolve and master Life if one does not know the root of evil , which is the enemy of existence and peace?

        To say there will never be an end to evil, it will always exist in some form, is to say one is lost without recovery, will never see, which is why the best on the planet we have today, is under 20% brain capacity, the "other" 80% + will be actived in the new world when the root of anti-existence is removed from the planet , conscious, soul and future progentors forever.

        This "technology" DEFINATELY exist and will evolve beyond this worlds capacity to "see" in the future.

        The 13 th Warrior
        I share some of your views, some I do not.

        I do not think "money" or "owning" or "trading" is "evil" or anything like that.

        How do you define "fair and equitable"? Is it "fair and equitable" to steal all the wealth of a billionaire by force, and then, distribute it to everyone on earth equally (which would make, like $0.15 per person)? (I personally think it is theft, not "fair", nor "equitable".) Is a rich man "evil" because he has "more than others"? (I think most probably, he created and delivered more value than others. Kudos for him!)

        However, I do think that there is "evil" on this world, and it is based on not money, or free trade, but collectivism, which basically means, "collecting all the money/power/resources within a hierarchical central system by force". It is what Governmet+Banking(and industry) Elite do, as is described by Zeitgeist, Freedom to Fascism etc. If anyone wants to learn about documented FACTS about conspiracies of POWER ELITE, you can go to For those who want to know: Reliable information on health, energy, media, war, elections, 9/11, more to learn more.

        In primitive societies, there is a lot of sharing and gifting, it is true. Human beings are generous if there is an ABUNDANCE of resources available. If everything everyone wants and needs is ABUNDANT and freely available, there is no need for MONEY, TRADE, and OWNERSHIP.

        I doubt that, if all 7 BILLION people lived like primitive cultures, they would be so friendly and sharing. Soon, we would be out of food, wood, and shelter, because those methods are highly inefficient to provide all the basic necessities (or the luxuries and comforts) of life. And we would kill each other for the scarce resources. And then there would be probably less than 500 million people on earth. (primitive lifestyle can only support so many people).

        All primitive cultures were not "always" peaceful under all circumstances. In fact, there were many wars between tribes, and most, %60 of male adults died from inter-tribal wars.


        "Civilization" means "less violence". Inter-tribal wars left their place to inter-government wars. If we lived as tribes, all the death of past century would be 2,000,000,000 (TWO BILLION) instead of 100,000,000 (ONE HUNDRED MILLION).

        However, even this "violence" is unnecessary, in my opinion. I think there will be a BIG change (this is where I agree with you), it will be dissolving of this force-based-hierarchies called Governments (and collectivist large corporations feeding them), and a "market anarchy" which I call "agora" will take place. Even all the government functions (like safety, justice) will be provided by voluntary organizations in the free market.

        See how it has started in Alaska and Montana:

        See also:
        BuildFreedom.com -- Free World Order
        (ignore the MPL, HYIP etc., but go for the freedom philosophy)

        But there will still be "ownership", "money", and "trade".

        But there will be much more "freedom" and much less "violence/force".

        Therefore, I define making money by creating/delivering value (read: helping other people get what they want) as GOOD, LIFE and FREEDOM Increasing and Love-based, and gaining money by FORCE (read: taxation, gov-backed up subsidies, referential treatments, legal monopolies etc) as EVIL, LIFE and FREEDOM Decreasing and FEAR-based.

        Otherwise I would not be here trying to hone my "Internet marketing" skills and earn more money. If I thought like you, I'd probably go join a primitive society in the Amazon forest, and give away all my money and possessions etc...

        Isn't it a self-contradiction for you to be in the most wealthy %3 of the whole world (based on your access to Internet), trying to make more money here (based on your participation to Warrior Forum), and cursing money, trade and ownership?

        I suggest you get clear about what you what you want, and what you stand for: Do you want to get rich learning Internet Marketing, making millions of dollars? Or do you want to go join a primitive tribe and live without "owning" "money" and "trade" but in a gifting culture?

        Or do you want everyone else to be millionaires, and just "give you" that millions, like the primitives share their food, so that you can buy yourself that Ferrari? Sorry, I read about "the monk who sold his Ferrari" but never heard one who gave it away... I guess that's not gonna happen...

        I'd be surprised if you were (or will ever be) a rich and successful marketer, with this mindset basically saying "money is evil".

        I think money (or owning something or trading) is not good or evil in itself. But based on what people do to earn it, people might be good or evil, to varying degrees.
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  • Profile picture of the author Charan Saini
    Well done on your achievement ! and thanks for sharing
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  • Profile picture of the author jaijav29
    Your story is very inspiring! This is what you get when you patience and hope. Don't ever give up.
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  • Profile picture of the author theinfomaven
    Thiago,

    In your experience, what do banks look or ask you when applying for such a small loan or line of credit?
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  • Profile picture of the author parrott
    SO much of making and having money is in our mindset......Can you picture swimming in a pool of money? PIcturing things like that will help yo uattract money to you
    LP
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  • Profile picture of the author Andrew Lewin
    Yes I watched this when it came out too. Very good material and good for you for sharing it here.
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  • Profile picture of the author highrider21
    I only watched about 30min of the video but it is very interesting. Now that America is in an economic crisis I think more people are realizing how insane our financial system works. I wonder if it is going to get worse or better after this crisis since the government keeps bailing out these huge corporations and banks with hundreds of billions of dollars. The one thing he didn't mention in the video was how we used to be on the gold standard and all of americas wealth was in fort knox.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark Brian
    I've always hated money but I am forced to be part of this monetary system. I'm glad the people have started thinking for the true meaning being absolutely one - not globalization - but just being absolutely one, in a resourced based system, without the need for money. I am enraged by just watching this movie, we have indeed truly become a disgusting profit oriented society. I remember Sbarro's "mission statement" that they display in their restaurants: "We are committed to profit"... it's just downright disgusting in a resource based system. I also remember Steve Balmer saying that the end-users of MS DOS/Windows have been deprived of the real (more advanced) state of technology that MS DOS/Windows can bring if they have not been under the hands of IBM in the 80s...

    I can only hope that I'm still alive when this revolution, The Project Venus actually begins. Every single man on earth must watch Zeitgeist Addendum. We are the true CHANGE, not Obama or anything, only us. Damn, I hope the world burns all the money in the world and just start a clean slate.
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  • Profile picture of the author sarasayshi
    Yea this is interesting. I saw the first one about 911 and was wowed. This is all too interesting. I have downloaded modern mechanics and will watch the movie.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kim Thomas
    thanks so much for the tips! i have been really looking for ways to make money and i reall appreicate you sharing your wisdom!!!!! i will take a deeper look into this and see what happens!! thanks again.
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  • Profile picture of the author FrontLineMentor
    Nice real story from you.
    Thanks for sharing.
    But it is about implementation
    and discipline. If we just watch
    the movie and no single step taken
    nothing will improve...
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  • Profile picture of the author Cmizer
    Alright man! Congratulations! Thanks for the heads up I'm definitely going to check it out.
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  • Profile picture of the author markfoo76
    Hi Mr. Thiago,

    Thanks for sharing your story! It's very inspiring!

    Cheers~

    Mark
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  • Profile picture of the author here4yoursuccess
    Thanks for the info. I will check it out.
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  • Profile picture of the author metafever
    Looks nice . . . I will check it out for sure!
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  • Profile picture of the author tssen
    gonna have a read now!
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  • Profile picture of the author thurana
    Thank you for the information. I'll definitely check them out.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tristan Lee
    Man, all these video's are very trippy...

    I have have to wake up at 6 AM today and get to class at 8 AM.

    I have never missed a class since the first day.

    But after watching these, I have become depressed in an enlightening way.

    It is both a good and bad feeling right now.

    Thank you Mr. Thiago for showing me, and the rest of the people here, a new and different perspective of how the individual and the world works.

    In addition, due to these events, I have decided not to go to class today.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stevecyr
    I think i would comment after watching this movie only...I have put that movie on torrent....lets see what it conveys and will tell u guys that whether it is worth or not!!
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  • Profile picture of the author Kneb Knebaih
    Killer post here...


    Nice to see people discussing this stuff (at last) here on WF : )


    This is the core of everything... the real meat.


    Next step is Kaizen - Learn + Act = Improve.


    Life´s an illusion. Attitude is everything.

    So just get the life you want... JUST TAKE IT.


    Thanks for showing up this stuff to discuss.

    : )
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  • Profile picture of the author doomain
    thanks for the link, I'll check it
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  • Profile picture of the author goalpower
    Thanks for the tip and thanks to all the other warriors responding - I've both watched Zeitgeist and read the money .pdf and they were eyeopening to say the least...

    Here's another great read to open your mind - "The Master Key" by I think Charles Haanel - it is now free online - just google "The Master Key" - I believe it's more powerful than "The Secret"
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  • Profile picture of the author elitesystem
    i have bookmarked the thread, i am definitely going to check this out. thanks alot mate! rep added
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    • Profile picture of the author Manticore
      I'll have to check these out later, they sound like their pretty informative. Also if your interested int he subject of that holographic universe video, i recommend you check out a book by the same name written by Micheal Talbot.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tony Vercetti
    I will check out the video you mentionned, seems interesting and inspirational.
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  • Profile picture of the author Adaptive
    Now I have 2 contracts from a couple of companies paying me around £300 each Monday - Friday for doing their SEO, Marketing, Articles, Business Cards, Flyers etc.
    Thanks for the interesting thread. I have a few questions about the mechanics of what you did.

    1. That seems like an assortment of online/IM and print graphics services. What is the theme you used to present them all as a package to your clients? Or did you start with one of these services and expand out to do others as well?

    2. How did you get the clients?

    3. Did you have some clients before you got the loan? If so were they the same clients you have now? If not, how did you convince the banker that you would be able to get clients and repay the loan?

    Regards,
    Allen
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  • Profile picture of the author digidoodles
    Thanks for the info... now if I could just find 4 hours...
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  • Profile picture of the author DrAl
    Awesome. It is not often I come across new information. Having read a lot about the banking system, I thought there wouldn't be much new, but really enjoyed the movie and ebook. Definitely has some other ways to explain the concepts and definitely cleared a few things up for me. Thanks
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  • Profile picture of the author John Henderson
    If anyone wants to see a video about fractional lending that genuinely educates (i.e. without the explosions and 9/11 footage), then spend 47 minutes watching the excellent animation "Money As Debt"...

    money as debt - Google Video Search
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    • Profile picture of the author 1 Marketing
      Originally Posted by John Henderson View Post

      If anyone wants to see a video about fractional lending that genuinely educates (i.e. without the explosions and 9/11 footage), then spend 47 minutes watching the excellent animation "Money As Debt"...

      money as debt - Google Video Search

      I was confused on the way how the saving rose to the huge bank balance instead of the debt... But if it is a loan financing etc. I don't think it is an achievement.

      now watching money as debt...
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  • Profile picture of the author oic800
    Thanks much for the post, I will definitely check it out. I could use a checkup from the neckup.
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  • Profile picture of the author femkeshe
    x for sharing, Mr. Thiago.

    f.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kezz
    Great recommendation. I really feel that Zeitgeist Addendum is required viewing for everybody. I was shocked to realize how much I didn't understand about what is essentially the most fundamental systematic element of our society. Once you get a grasp on how the monetary system works, you understand the political and military movements around the entire planet.

    The most important thing to realize out of all this, and it took me a while to come to understand it, is it is still not money that is the problem. The issue is threefold:

    1. Currency issuance is controlled by a private business with private motivations, when it should be controlled by government.
    2. Currency issuance has interest placed on it, thereby giving the aforementioned private businesses a cut on every transaction in the world, and creating inescapable debt.
    3. Present day currency represents nothing, when it should represent something real, such as silver or gold.

    I love the Venus Project, and I hope to see it as our future one day. But the truth is we are not ready for it. The bridge to a resource based economy free of money, is to first rid ourselves of the corruption of the present monetary system, so it accurately represents our resources, allows for fair trade, and allows prosperity to flourish. How do we do this?

    1. Put currency issuance back in the hands of the government, where it is supposed to be.
    2. Issue currency without interest, which has no place being added to it, as it is supposed to be a token for trade only.
    3. Ensure that currency always represents some real resource, such as silver or gold, so its value doesn't become distorted.

    Here's the tricky part. You have some extremely clever, extremely ruthless bankers who are the richest most powerful people on the planet because of the way they have gained control over currency, and corrupted its use to their own ends. These people are, and have always been, very hard to deal with. Every single person in history who has tried to go up against them, has met an untimely demise.

    For example, did you know that JFK tried to introduce currency backed by silver? Before the year was out, somebody shot him in the head.

    Take this opportunity to read up on the history of US Presidents trying to deal with the bankers, and trying to keep control of currency in government hands. You'll realize this has been going on for some time - since the beginning of the USA as a start. This struggle against bankers goes back even before that. At least to the Napoleonic wars. Shafting the people has been the family business for these folks for generations.

    There is plenty of information around if you do a little web searching. Here's a good summary to get you started: THE FEDERAL RESERVE FRAUD
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  • Profile picture of the author forest60
    It is very great info. Thank you so much.
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  • Profile picture of the author reliance
    This is the one of the best posting I came across. Thanks a lot for very good inspiring info.
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    • Profile picture of the author 1 Marketing
      Yeah, off course with the videos of Matrix and very detailed discussion on the holographic imagination. Realization of Mind power, I must admit this is a great thread indeed.
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  • Profile picture of the author WCA
    Great resources, although I am not sure they are as much about making money as they are about the underlying current in the banking system.

    Resources anyone should invest their time and energy into though.
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  • Profile picture of the author danmorton
    Mr. Thiago -

    It's great to hear a success story like this.

    You must have given your bank a great presentation to get the loan. That's what it takes to be successful.

    Thanks,
    Dan
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  • Profile picture of the author Sean S
    What are some easy ways to make money with none down ?
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    • Profile picture of the author thriftgirl62
      Originally Posted by Sean S View Post

      What are some easy ways to make money with none down ?
      That's easy, go here: INSTANT 100% Commissions Paid Direct to your Paypal Account
      Signature

      I retired in 2005 at 43 and now I give away websites like these for FREE [hosting excluded]

      When you make at least $100+ per month, we split the profit 80/20 and YOU get the 80% Until then, you keep 100% and I'll help you drive traffic, get backlinks and put the domain in your name too!
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Newman
      Hello Sean,

      I will suggest that you try affiliate marketing and article marketing.Search for oneweekmarketing by Potpie girl and info. on bum marketing by Travis Sago.Both are Warriors.I wish you the best.
      Alaba
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  • Profile picture of the author mrjasonser
    HELLO MR. Thiago!
    Thank You Sooooooo Much! There are things that had been in my heart and mind for like years, but I just could not figure a way out of this "stone" within my heart, I felt unhappy, angry about the way my life had become but could not figure a clear way to get out of all this. I had watched the movie which had helped put everything into perspective.

    Wil be getting the MMM now.

    Once again thanks for telling us this info.

    Cheers
    Jason Ser
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    I Don't Speak The Queen's English, But I Say What I Mean and Mean What I Say.

    Here is where I work now: www.LohasDigital.com

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  • Profile picture of the author Mark 2
    I am making money already but need more and more. That's why I am here on the warrior forum.
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    Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you have imagined.
    Home Funny Videos
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  • Profile picture of the author jgand
    Sounds interesting. I'll check it out. Thanks everyone for the info.
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  • Profile picture of the author yourlif2
    Very interesting, I'll definitely check this out
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  • Profile picture of the author MrIMVO
    Good for you! Keep up the good work. It seems to me that having any debt is like having a partner and it's better to be without either. Just my .02
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  • Profile picture of the author conners88
    thanks for the share
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    www.connersroad2success.com Follow my 20 micro niche sites per month challenge
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  • Profile picture of the author l23bc
    Originally Posted by Mr. Thiago View Post

    Hi Warriors,

    Today I want to share with you some information that changed my life for good.

    I was lucky to have got my hands on this information last year, when I was just 21.

    So, if you are not making money now, listen up so that you can start.

    September 28th last year I started my first job as a labourer and I was earning a measly £4.76 per hour after tax. After completing my seventh day of work I came back home to find an email message with a link to a video called 'zeitgeist addendum'.

    I watched this video which was two hours long. Because I pay a lot of attention to detail I remembered the guy in the video mention a book called 'modern money mechanics'.

    What I did was download this book free off the internet and read it til I understood everything.

    Because I read this book I now have £12,500 in my bank account and I'm only paying back the bank £97 each month + I quit my job and I'm working from home and making £400 per week after tax.

    When I started working on September 28th I had around £60 in my bank account and I was £800 in debt.

    Today I realise that money is just an illusion like everything else, and it is so easy to make just by thinking right and speaking right.

    If you are not making money and you are struggling to pay off debts at the moment watch 'zeitgeist addendum' and read 'modern money mechanics' and study a little about the history of banking.

    All The Best and I wish all you warriors a prosperous, healthy and happy 2009.
    thanks for the info but were can i get my hands on the video and infomation you mentioned, what did you spend the 97 dollars on? the book

    anyway thanks for the infomation
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  • Profile picture of the author Good News Now
    Thanks for the post! It does help to be more optimistic.
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  • Profile picture of the author syedtaha
    Will watch the video and read the book. I definitely need some motivation. I am making less than a dollar/day online.
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  • Profile picture of the author msdobe
    Thanks for the tip! I'm definitely going to check it out.
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  • Profile picture of the author gengiscon
    Wow, excellent link. What do you think of the Zeitgeist Movement the movie spawned?

    link
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  • Profile picture of the author priyatham
    Sounds interesting...I'll check it out.
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  • Profile picture of the author Gavin Stephenson
    WOW. I am only 20mins in to zeitgeist addendum and its completely blowing my mind. Now i am thinking of ways to use this as my advantage. cant wait to watch the rest. This is nuts. Thanks for the share
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  • Profile picture of the author mikey21
    Awesome Bro Thanks!

    I believe money is an 'illusion just like everything else', or as it were something that comes and goes, has a finite existence, and is valued in our minds.

    We are the immortal souls that never die, therefore only WE are real. We are the creators who manifest life!

    This is why I have found affirmations, waking meditation, deep introspecion and goal focusing in alignment with our highest visions to have really taken me from $0 income with no desire for a job to $200/week doing exactly what I love doing (with growing potential), while pursuing my Uni. studies, in a few short months. What a turn-around for me! All answers lie within!!!

    Modern Money Mechanics looks like a great read thanks for this post and thankyou for sharing.

    Wishing you blessings and abundance
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  • Profile picture of the author Profit-smart
    Zeitgeist is a load of bollocks.

    Some of the information is solid, but if you run a snopes.com search on alot of the material you'll find out they simply made it up.

    The first Zeitgeist especially; The whole sungod bit was complete phooey.
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    • Profile picture of the author thriftgirl62
      This thing started a whole year ago? Where is everyone now, a year later?
      I guess the truth really is whatever you believe. The mind is a powerful
      thing. Underused and abused.
      No wonder everyone is crazy....hey
      check this out!

      Nothing for sale, No ads either. If anyone has information on
      brain damage, suggestions would help...you'll see. It happens.

      Chemist Defies Natural Law. Inhales Solvent Reactive Chemicals daily since 1968.
      Signature

      I retired in 2005 at 43 and now I give away websites like these for FREE [hosting excluded]

      When you make at least $100+ per month, we split the profit 80/20 and YOU get the 80% Until then, you keep 100% and I'll help you drive traffic, get backlinks and put the domain in your name too!
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  • Profile picture of the author anwar001
    Modern day mechanics seems to be totally focused on banking systems. How is this going to help us IM marketers?
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  • Profile picture of the author Victor Chor
    It's always amazing to hear success stories. That would be a great experience to put into a sales page to provoke your readers to opt into whatever you are interested in marketing! I'm going to take a look at the Zeitgeist movie right now. God bless!
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  • Profile picture of the author Nigel Howell
    Yes thanks for the information. I've checked out the video, it's 2 hours but worth the watches. Understanding the creation of money is extremely useful in these times of 'quantative easing' by central banks around the world.
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  • Profile picture of the author moneyblogger1
    Leverage is the key. I built my entire first business on this principal. I used the banks money and private lenders to build a very large vending company in Canada.

    There are only two things you can leverage:

    1. Time
    2. Money

    If you want to get on the fast track you need to learn how to leverage both

    Brandon
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  • Profile picture of the author Dviau17
    That is a very interesting way of doing things thiago. THanks for the info and have a happy 2010! haha (one year later)
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    Winning isn't everything. Yet you should do everything to win.

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  • Profile picture of the author Dviau17
    Is income tax a law in Canada? is it using the same system as the IRS because the IRS doesnt exist in Canada? can someone PM the answer to me if they know?

    I always wondered how internet marketers have to pay their tax at the end of the year. All the money we make is really crappy
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    Winning isn't everything. Yet you should do everything to win.

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  • Profile picture of the author Dviau17
    This information may very well change your life if implemented the right way, especially at a young age.
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    Winning isn't everything. Yet you should do everything to win.

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  • Profile picture of the author wemakeiteasy
    Thanks for the tip. Will definitely check it out
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  • Profile picture of the author joedwi1
    thanks for your motivation im now is same as u before i want to quit my job but i still afraid thanks bro you give me a proof that internet marketing is best way to make money
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Newman
      Hello Captain Joe,

      This may seem simplistic-but dont quit your day job until you start making regular income online.Running your WSOs will help make this whole online money real.Bryan Kumar's reports will help.Try his report:10k-2k and bum marketing by Travis Sago.I wish you the best.

      Alaba
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  • Profile picture of the author Alex Lin
    Buddha explained these 2500 years ago in Abhidhamma. Much more than these.
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  • Profile picture of the author perry911
    great info hope i still can use this for my business
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  • Profile picture of the author appie
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author Gino Robin
      Hi,everyone seek the secret to make more money.You can read,watch or buy any dvd or book... Like a donkey..just watching the carrot someone providing..you just follow it ..till you fall deeep in the hole..
      many people are in that hole right now ..and still believe they can make money...

      The secret is to make money work for you.Money are just a physical thing that humans beings create,to trade.And today they still trade in the Warrior Forum............

      Thanks
      Gino
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      Frustrated? Free Guide to Make Money Here..Thanks

      Download
      Free E-Book Make Money with Free Products Here


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  • Profile picture of the author Gary Pettit
    Wow, this is what I love about Warrior Forum.
    The original post generated so much discussion.
    A lot of valuable information and links in this thread.
    Thanks to all who took part in it!
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  • Profile picture of the author PeterDunin
    many thanks for sharing this quality advice!
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  • Profile picture of the author tailrunner
    Life is what YOU make of it - plain 'n' simple.
    "If you think you can't - you're right, If you think you can - you're right"
    DON'T OVER COMPLICATE
    Signature

    Modified Twin Engine Cessna 310D ----- very fast :)

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  • Profile picture of the author mikrei75
    "The key to keep growing your wealth is to focus 100% on your work and not spend the money on garbage.

    What I say to people is use the money you have left over to invest in your business and studies.

    Just keep at it and believe in yourself."

    That is so true.. Learn the secret of money, you will know it not real, just an idea!
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  • Profile picture of the author ColdFire123
    Well I got interested on it. I'll check this out.
    Signature
    Affiliate Marketing Season Special: Earn Commissions as much as 70%. More Stuff Get Sold and Still More Stuff To Sell.
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  • Profile picture of the author fengshui1988
    Thanks for sharing the information Mr. Thiago. I will check out the material you share. Thank you
    Signature

    Maximize your Success with Feng Shui and the Feng Shui Calendar by Nicholas Teo

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  • Profile picture of the author RegalWeb
    This is what I love in Warrior Forum. I get to know feel-good success stories from people from different walks of life. Some succeeded, some failed. It's really true that life is a gamble and so does the life of Internet marketers.
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  • Profile picture of the author RyanLow
    Thanks for sharing, Thiago
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    "Chance favors the prepared mind." --- Louis Pasteur

    Some people dream of success, while others wake up and work hard for it.
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  • Profile picture of the author springning
    Thank you for sharing this information
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  • Profile picture of the author jas_warrior
    Sounds interesting. It's a different path, worth checking out. Thanks for the movie link and for sharing. And congrats to your success, it's nice to hear that other people are successful online.
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  • Does the book you read is free? We would like to read it as well.
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  • Profile picture of the author pandda
    Banned
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author play2win727
      This is really interesting. This is what I love about forums they tend to have lots or interesting ideas outside of just IM. Got about halfway through the movie, so far pretty mind blowing stuff.
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  • Profile picture of the author muddywaters
    Will check this out, thanks for the post
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  • Profile picture of the author ih8themall
    Thanks for sharing this!
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  • Profile picture of the author godspeed7
    Ha hah! I have also a success story...........
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