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What A Waste Of A Good Brain

by positivenegative
15 replies
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. . . shame he'll get a long stretch instead.

Prosecutor Ian Paton said: "A lot of criminal ingenuity harbours in the mind of Mr Moore. The case is one of extraordinary criminal inventiveness, deviousness and creativity, all apparently the developed expertise of this defendant".
The judge, Recorder David Hunt QC, described the behaviour as "ingenious" criminality.
Wandsworth Prison escapee Neil Moore faked bail email
  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    YEAH, imagine what he could have done for HONEST business, using only the talents he used to get out!

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author positivenegative
      Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

      YEAH, imagine what he could have done for HONEST business, using only the talents he used to get out!
      That aside, I just find it kind of strange that after all that time spent planning and creating, he then hands himself in a few days later. I guess only he knows the reason(s) why.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    I saw the thread title and was instantly angry that you would talk about me like that right to my face. Whew.

    Moore should have come to the US. He could have had a good job in politics.
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  • Profile picture of the author alistair
    It may seem like an interesting story at first glance but when I think about it, it's really not. So this chap came up with an idea to escape from prison and the article seems to try to make him out to be some kind of criminal mastermind. How many prisoners seriously plan an escape anyway? Not many I would think.

    History tells us that there's plenty of people in this country that could have came up with an idea like that if they had to but most of us stay on the right side of the law and use our brains to make a living legitimately which in most cases doesn't really make for a good quirky story.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by alistair View Post

      It may seem like an interesting story at first glance but when I think about it, it's really not. So this chap came up with an idea to escape from prison and the article seems to try to make him out to be some kind of criminal mastermind. How many prisoners seriously plan an escape anyway? Not many I would think.

      History tells us that there's plenty of people in this country that could have came up with an idea like that if they had to but most of us stay on the right side of the law and use our brains to make a living legitimately which in most cases doesn't really make for a good quirky story.
      I've noticed that whenever a criminal shows any intelligence at all, the media calls him a mastermind, or a devious genius. I've wondered why the story is written like that, for several years.

      My tentative conclusion is that;
      1) It just makes a more dramatic story.
      2) Intelligence is commonly seen as evil. It's subtle...but I see it in movies and stories.

      It's like when you see movies about Con Men. They are generally shown as brilliant, and articulate. The few that I've known in real life, were broken people, who plied their craft in a clumsy way...and would have made much more money, if they just built a real life.
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      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        I've noticed that whenever a criminal shows any intelligence at all, the media calls him a mastermind, or a devious genius. I've wondered why the story is written like that, for several years.

        My tentative conclusion is that;
        1) It just makes a more dramatic story.
        2) Intelligence is commonly seen as evil. It's subtle...but I see it in movies and stories.

        It's like when you see movies about Con Men. They are generally shown as brilliant, and articulate. The few that I've known in real life, were broken people, who plied their craft in a clumsy way...and would have made much more money, if they just built a real life.
        You're right of course. If one has somewhat realistic voices, they could easily do the calls, and may have. STILL, as I said, it is a usable talent. If they are BRAZEN, they could EASILY use a close variant of the domain, and email. AGAIN, nothing special, but the skills are salable. So YEAH, he wasn't that smart, but he COULD have make good legal money.

        HECK, they made the same comments about K.M., and even HE said a lot of what he did was social maneuvering. In THAT way, it WAS a lot like the movie wargames. He tricked OTHERS into giving him the password, or access, or info, and used their failings, etc...

        Steve
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        • Profile picture of the author Kay King
          I've heard - and read - similar comments about crooks. If they had only applied themselves to something worth while....it was a brilliant strategy...etc.

          They got caught - how smart is that?
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

            I've heard - and read - similar comments about crooks. If they had only applied themselves to something worth while....it was a brilliant strategy...etc.

            They got caught - how smart is that?
            If many of us used our imaginations, we could think up complex plans like this. I'm pretty sure, I could. And I can think of a few others here, that could. It just takes nerve.

            And truly, most people in jail don't have the organizational and planning skills to pull off complex plans like this. That's how they got caught in the first place.

            I've read stories about these Master Criminals. How they could fool everybody. But then I see interviews with them, and wonder how anyone could believe them in the first place.

            Maybe it's that we expect people to behave in certain ways, and it's just hard to believe they would act contrary to human nature. It's why psychopaths get away with crimes for so long. Their actions just seem so impossible. The normal mind just rejects the possibility that they are being fooled....especially if they are invested in the perception they have of the scammer.
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            • Profile picture of the author seasoned
              Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

              If many of us used our imaginations, we could think up complex plans like this. I'm pretty sure, I could. And I can think of a few others here, that could. It just takes nerve.

              And truly, most people in jail don't have the organizational and planning skills to pull off complex plans like this. That's how they got caught in the first place.

              I've read stories about these Master Criminals. How they could fool everybody. But then I see interviews with them, and wonder how anyone could believe them in the first place.

              Maybe it's that we expect people to behave in certain ways, and it's just hard to believe they would act contrary to human nature. It's why psychopaths get away with crimes for so long. Their actions just seem so impossible. The normal mind just rejects the possibility that they are being fooled....especially if they are invested in the perception they have of the scammer.
              Well, I never said it was inventive, or genius. I spoke of it being brazen. Lets say the prision domain was prison.il.com, he COULD have registered i1.com, and made prison.i1.com. If someone noticed, he could be in severe trouble. As I said, BRAZEN. It is possible that it was like prison.il.gov, and he couldn't get a .gov. Still, he could make money from it. Maybe not MILLIONS, but who knows.

              Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by alistair View Post

      It may seem like an interesting story at first glance but when I think about it, it's really not. So this chap came up with an idea to escape from prison and the article seems to try to make him out to be some kind of criminal mastermind. How many prisoners seriously plan an escape anyway? Not many I would think.

      History tells us that there's plenty of people in this country that could have came up with an idea like that if they had to but most of us stay on the right side of the law and use our brains to make a living legitimately which in most cases doesn't really make for a good quirky story.
      Well, he didn't just get the prison guards to free him, which is pretty inventive, he also conned companies into handing him vast amounts of money.

      Moore had previously used four different aliases to commit fraud worth £1,819,000 in total.

      Posing as staff from Barclays Bank, Lloyds Bank, and Santander he managed to persuade large organisations to give him vast sums of money.

      Sometimes he answered calls from victims using a man's voice and then pretended to transfer the call to a colleague before resuming the conversation in a woman's voice, the court heard earlier.
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
      Banned
      Originally Posted by alistair View Post

      It may seem like an interesting story at first glance but when I think about it, it's really not. So this chap came up with an idea to escape from prison and the article seems to try to make him out to be some kind of criminal mastermind. How many prisoners seriously plan an escape anyway? Not many I would think.

      History tells us that there's plenty of people in this country that could have came up with an idea like that if they had to but most of us stay on the right side of the law and use our brains to make a living legitimately which in most cases doesn't really make for a good quirky story.
      Actually it's an old trick.

      Paypai phishing scam (not Paypal).

      The part I kinda doubt is the guy building a cloned website with a cell phone. My bet is he had someone else build the clone site & setup the domain, etc...
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  • Profile picture of the author alistair
    I'm not sure he set up a website, just got the domain for the email address.
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by alistair View Post

      I'm not sure he set up a website, just got the domain for the email address.
      I guess you may have a point.
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  • Profile picture of the author thunderbird
    It could be that the illicit nature of his activities is what sparked his interest and creativity. Conceivably, he wouldn't perform so well in something legitimate might not interest him and spark his intelligence.

    Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

    I saw the thread title and was instantly angry that you would talk about me like that right to my face. Whew.

    Moore should have come to the US. He could have had a good job in politics.
    Lobbying politicians can be extremely lucrative in the United States. Once legalized, "corruption" is transformed into "law," often bit by bit so as not to spark alarm.
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    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      Originally Posted by thunderbird View Post

      It could be that the illicit nature of his activities is what sparked his interest and creativity. Conceivably, he wouldn't perform so well in something legitimate might not interest him and spark his intelligence.



      Lobbying politicians can be extremely lucrative in the United States. Once legalized, "corruption" is transformed into "law," often bit by bit so as not to spark alarm.
      Not sure if criminal minds are bored or just self interested enough to lack empathy.

      As far as politicians, it's unbelievable the petty criminality in politics. DUI, tax fraud, domestic violence -- we really have a grimey, slimey bunch "representing" us. Go sit by a table of them in a bar or at a country club and listen to those people bad mouth and laugh at the general public. They not only use the "bit by bit" method - they wait for something explosive going on then slide stuff through on the sly when we're not looking. Did you know it's legal for them to do the same inside trading that they slammed Martha Stewart in jail for now? Hmmmmmm. When did that happen?
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      Sal
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