Microsoft silences its new A.I. bot Tay, after Twitter users teach it racism

9 years ago

Donuts and Claude aren't racist words

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yukon Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by Zodiax

Donuts and Claude aren't racist words

Have you seen Claude eat donuts?
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- Zodiax 9 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by yukon
  
  Have you seen Claude eat donuts?
  
  Have you seen a racist donut?
  
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  'I hated every minute of training, but I said, 'Don't quit. Suffer now and live the rest of your life as a champion'
  -Muhammad Ali
  
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  yukon Banned 9 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Zodiax
  
  Have you seen a racist donut?
  
  Have you?
  
  Nuts For Pudding - SYMO - YouTube
  
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  MissTerraK 9 years ago
  
  That didn't take very long...
  
  Terra
  
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seasoned

9 years ago

I'm curious! What race does the computer think it is, and why?

ALSO, I won't even entertain the idea of that opinion being the slightly bit honest, about being racist, without a statement as to what the actual "opinion" was, and how it was stated.

And with the double speak, words like invest, revenue, profit, rich, good,bad, white, black, indian, etc... would have to be excluded to achieve what they claim, and the "A.I." would then be practically 100% WORTHLESS! They would have to let it state EVERYTHING UNCENSORED!

Of course, having said that, if they have it learn from the internet, it couldn't use dictionaries, encyclopedias, blogs, forums, news, etc.... sites, and they would have to have a decent unbiased person pick proper sites to glean data. Good luck with that.

You have to treat such information much like you treat amazon reviews. With the reviews, some people get the company or product details wrong, and I know that it was a mistake or a lie. Some say things that CLEARLY aren't true. Some clearly don't know the subject. Some have unrealistic expectations. I have to throw those out. Some are clearly written by a friend, fan, or author, so throw those out. The negatives have to be weighed against the positives, and the amount taken into account. Such things can't be done by programs in general. But you have to do that sort of thing with information.

Then again, that is how MANY A.I. scifi films start! I robot, colosus, terminator, etc... ALL have a computer pick data that fits a set of rules, and allow it to determine validity and action based on its interpretation of the rules. HECK, I watched a video narrated by a person that didn't have a CLUE about things before 1990 describe them, and state how it was funny that so many kids didn't have a clue. YEAH, the internet had GREAT promise. It almost met it, for a time. TODAY, there is so much GARBAGE and most stuff is there for COMMERCIAL use.

And don't forget about the STARTREK NOMAD episode, or the VoyaGER movie. In BOTH cases, two robotic trains of thought were melded to come up with a rather dangerous variant. And you ALSO have to deal with a computer variant of "the telephone game".

Steve

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Mike Anthony

9 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

I'm curious! What race does the computer think it is, and why?

ALSO, I won't even entertain the idea of that opinion being the slightly bit honest, about being racist, without a statement as to what the actual "opinion" was, and how it was stated.

Obviously racist stuff

Microsoft Creates AI Bot - Internet Immediately Turns it Racist

will you concede? or go on a long rant?

WF off topic office pool open. Ten dollars per square

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seasoned

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Obviously racist stuff

Microsoft Creates AI Bot - Internet Immediately Turns it Racist

will you concede? or go on a long rant?

WF off topic office pool open. Ten dollars per square

Mexico SHOULD pay for the wall, because THEY necessitated the need for it! A border is SUPPOSED to be a way to provide MUTUAL control, and is a sign of RESPECT! If a nation ENCOURAGES and SUPPORTS a breach, it is an INSULT to the other nation! That is just fact, SORRY if that sounds RACIST.

And FEMINISM? They want men to be even MORE subservient to them, and say they can have charges levied for retroactive rape!(Consent to and have consensual sex, and later scream rape) And they claim men are EVIL! So teaching an AI that it is GOOD is not good. BTW I am ALL for equal rights for women, etc... But I'm NOT for special rights. It would be nice if feminists, like emma watson, wore buttons, and maybe THEN men could treat them as they claim things are. It would be ironic! I mean AFTER ALL, they DO claim the world works a certain way. They could watch the women walk by happy and unaffected. I used to like emma watson.

As for leaving the message up there to indicate that AI is bad? PARROTING, and simple memory of statements is NOT intelligence! This isn't so much a reflection on AI as it is on the people that "designed" it. Of course, such things are COMMON, so I am AGAINST trying to design a full auto-didactic "A.I.". SEVERAL companies have claimed to create one, but I have ******NEVER****** seen one, and the fact that they haven't appeared everywhere, or even had write-ups or written articles, is proof that they were lying. Maybe they should read a dictionary. They constantly confuse intelligence and knowledge. I mean if the two were the same, Kim Peek would likely be the smartest person on the planet. According to Wikipedia, his IQ is only 87. I didn't know he finished highschool at 14, or did the accounting for a 160 person company in 3 hours, with NO computer. That is pretty impressive, but the average person would probably do that much faster, without tutors, if they had that type of memory. And his employer DID replace him with 2 full time bookkeepers and a computer when they could.

Anyway, the article doesn't show racism, but simple parroting. And if it goes by frequency, it will probably eventually say that everyone is a SAINT unless they are white, straight, and male, and THEN they are EVIL ALIEN ANGELS on this planet ONLY to persecute everyone ELSE!

Here's a thought! How about we stick with the type of AI that has been used for decades. It is called an expert system. It is TAUGHT through a set of provable facts and base knowledge, and learns through personal EXPERIENCE, and revisions. They have limited control and do specific things for a given function.

BTW YEP! Some say we are ALIENS! I have EVEN heard a "theory" that we are EVIL ANGELS! As PROOF, they say that whites often speak of their "little angels"!

OK, is that long enough for you?

Steve

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yukon Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

Mexico SHOULD pay for the wall, because THEY necessitated the need for it!

Lol, you got roped into the bogus someone did me wrong tweets.
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- seasoned 9 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by yukon
  
  Lol, you got roped into the bogus someone did me wrong tweets.
  
  NOPE! I LIVE HERE! I have SEEN the effects PERSONALLY. And MOST of them NEVER try to meet even the most BASIC of requirements to come/stay here legally. I once went to a mcdonalds IN LAX, and the SPANISH SPEAKING manager apologized to me, in english, for the MONOLINGUAL SPANISH SPEAKING woman who feigned to take my order for a MCDONALD'S PRODUCT. She clearly knew NO english, or even mcdonald's products. The manager's excuse? She was "new here"! I STILL don't know how she got the job, into the country, into the airport, etc.... one thing is for sure, she was NOT legal, and didn't desire to be. She didn't even seem to know the currency.
  
  But YEAH, the US tries to control people going to mexico, and mexico is supposed to control people coming FROM mexico. They do the SAME thing in Europe, Asia, and likely in Africa also. After all, the WHOLE idea about countries is BORDERS. When you go into that area, you are supposed to be subject to that area. If you don't legally agree, you are supposed to be refused entry. Europe DOES have some special cases, as all in the EU agree to the EU laws and, as such, go between the various EU countries with relative ease. I was actually on the eurail once and out of the 6-7 people there, they only looked at MY passport! WHY? The OTHERS all had EU passports. But what about those refugees that tried to go through austria that DIDN'T legally agree? They were held back! Here is ANOTHER article about another area:
  
  Idomeni refugees await word from Brussels | Europe | DW.COM | 14.03.2016
  
  Online, refugees ignore Austrian
  
  NOW, as to mexico and the US?
  
  Coyotes: The Smugglers That Bring Kids To The Border
  Coyote: 'If you turn yourself in to immigration, there is no problem' | Al Jazeera America
  
  Steve
  
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Mike Anthony

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

OK, is that long enough for you?

Steve

Yep read the first PARAGRAPH...not the REST of the blather BUT

will you concede? or go on a long rant?

WF off topic office pool open. Ten dollars per square

I'm one of the WINNERS of this WEEK's Off TOPIC pool!!

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Dennis Gaskill

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

I'm one of the WINNERS of this WEEK's Off TOPIC pool!!

Lunch is on you! Where should we meet?

As an on-topic aside, I'm surprised it didn't mimic any raunchy or deviant sexual talk (unless I missed it). Maybe Microsoft anticipated that and programmed it not to do that?

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seasoned

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Dennis Gaskill

Lunch is on you! Where should we meet?

As an on-topic aside, I'm surprised it didn't mimic any raunchy or deviant sexual talk (unless I missed it). Maybe Microsoft anticipated that and programmed it not to do that?

Yeah, someone would have to mention something to tie that in, and another ask the question to bring it up. The people doing this probably never bothered. THAT is the most likely reason that such things never came up.

As for programming exclusions, that is just DUMB! It limits any hope of learning, while possibly excluding things that could be meaningful. That is one reason why I am against such things.

I heard an ad for an anti virus program just yesterday, for example, that spoke of a school and a hospital that were basically SHUT DOWN because their antivirus program FAILED to prevent a virus! WHY? Because it had a BLACK LIST! With a black list, it is assumed that everything is GOOD, unless it is on the list. The virus was on a new site that wasn't already blacklisted.

THEIR answer? A WHITE LIST! A white list assumes everything is BAD, unless it is on the whitelist.

SO, to sum it up, a black list is BAD, because it WILL FAIL! A WHITE list is BAD because it limits things and takes more initial effort. At least a white list is less likely to be a disaster though. This is not to say anything against a blacklist for your personal system, as it is better than nothing, and you have to check a site out to whitelist it.

And THAT is why I am OK with an expert system. Ideally, an AI system should be INTELLIGENT, and decide what is right. NOBODY has succeeded in doing that yet though. An EXPERT system is effectively the ULTIMATE whitelist system, as it is programmed with specific data and is a closed system that is inherently a whitelist. An expert system just works at a given job though while the ultimate AI's goal is to seem like an intelligent person.

Steve

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Mike Anthony

9 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

I heard an ad for an anti virus program just yesterday, for example, that spoke of a school and a hospital that were basically SHUT DOWN because their antivirus program FAILED to prevent a virus! WHY? Because it had a BLACK LIST! With a black list, it is assumed that everything is GOOD, unless it is on the list. The virus was on a new site that wasn't already blacklisted.

THEIR answer? A WHITE LIST! A white list assumes everything is BAD, unless it is on the whitelist.

SO, to sum it up, a black list is BAD, because it WILL FAIL! A WHITE list is BAD

On the bright side for balance theres no ambiguity on other things. The tendency of shouting colors is just always awful and BAD.

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seasoned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

On the bright side for balance theres no ambiguity on other things. The tendency of shouting colors is just always awful and BAD.

I was OBVIOUSLY talking about lists, not people. I ALSO said both had their uses, benefits, etc... The internet is RIFE with blacklists. WHY? Because they are things EVERYONE should want, and are easy t create. Whitelists are mostly used by corporations, and cost money. WHY? Because they are restrictive, and corporations like that, and they aren't so easy to create/give away.

Colors DID exist before any race knew about the others, and are actually inherently good. Imagine trying to find fruit, or distinguish between certain insects, etc... And HEY, the first TVs, and first present day film, were black and white. HEY, black was even mentioned FIRST! And the very first photographic techniques were like brown and kind of white. Sorry if you though it was some kind of "dog whistle" or whatever they call it. It wasn't.

Anyway, my point stands.

Steve
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yukon

Banned 9 years ago

Back around 1997 MSN had a very active chat forum. I figured out that I could open a dozen new browser windows for the same forum page/URL & have a unique chat name (no extra login needed) for each browser. I would paste the same text into each browser instance & get the pages lined up & just start clicking all the submit buttons (ha, ha...). The forum page would be a wall of the same text repeated over & over... from a dozen profile names.

They didn't track IPs or nothing back in those days.

Lmao, it was like the Wild West (anything goes).

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yukon

Banned 9 years ago

Just so everyone knows, the MS Tay chat is supposed to mimic a 19 year old female combined with public domain data.

About Tay & Privacy

Tay is an artificial intelligent chat bot developed by Microsoft's Technology and Research and Bing teams to experiment with and conduct research on conversational understanding. Tay is designed to engage and entertain people where they connect with each other online through casual and playful conversation. The more you chat with Tay the smarter she gets, so the experience can be more personalized for you.

Tay is targeted at 18 to 24 year old in the US.

Tay may use the data that you provide to search on your behalf. Tay may also use information you share with her to create a simple profile to personalize your experience. Data and conversations you provide to Tay are anonymized and may be retained for up to one year to help improve the service. Learn more about Microsoft privacy here.

FAQ

Q: Who is Tay for?
A: Tay is targeted at 18 to 24 year olds in the U.S., the dominant users of mobile social chat services in the US.
Q: What does Tay track about me in my profile?
A: If a user wants to share with Tay, we will track a user’s:
Nickname
Gender
Favorite food
Zipcode
Relationship status
Q: How can I delete my profile?
A: Please submit a request via our contact form on tay.ai with your username and associated platform.
Q: How was Tay created?
A: Tay has been built by mining relevant public data and by using AI and editorial developed by a staff including improvisational comedians. Public data that’s been anonymized is Tay’s primary data source. That data has been modeled, cleaned and filtered by the team developing Tay.

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yukon

Banned 9 years ago

I have no idea why anyone would even attempt to quote/link a state funded middle eastern propaganda site for US news.

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Ploppi

9 years ago

How can a robot be racist?

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yukon

Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by Ploppi

How can a robot be racist?

It's a poorly built algo. & it was mimicking people that tricked it into repeating racist words/comments.

The algo. was basically built on word association.

car
- toyota
- honda
- ford
- etc...

bird
- cardinal
- robin
- crow
- etc...

Claude
- vacuum cleaner
- donuts
- bacon
- etc...

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Ploppi

9 years ago

Originally Posted by yukon

It's a poorly built algo. & it was mimicking people that tricked it into repeating racist words/comments.

The algo. was basically built on word association.

car
- toyota
- honda
- ford
- etc...

bird
- cardinal
- robin
- crow
- etc...

Claude
- vacuum cleaner
- donuts
- bacon
- etc...

yes, but the robot by using racist words cannot be racist as it's just repeating words and creating phrases based on the information it is processing to come up with statements.

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Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Ploppi

yes, but the robot by using racist words cannot be racist as it's just repeating words and creating phrases based on the information it is processing to come up with statements.

Two thoughts immediately come to mind.

If you write a racist statement on a tablet, is the tablet racist?

And...

Your point made me think that most...maybe all racism is inherited, or spread like a virus.

Being racist isn't a conclusion you come to, after serious study. It's like a virus, you have to catch it from someone else.

In other words, It's difficult to imagine that someone not exposed to other's racist thoughts, would become a racist on their own. That would explain why geography is so important, in dealing with racist ideas.

I've know dozens of extreme racists (I grew up in Lodi Ohio, the Grand Wizard of the KKK was on my paper route. The fields had crosses burned in them).

None of them think they are bad people, or that they are wrong. They think they have a firm grasp on reality. But it had to come from somewhere. Probably parents or classmates. That's my guess.

Originally Posted by Ploppi

yes, but the robot by using racist words cannot be racist as it's just repeating words and creating phrases based on the information it is processing to come up with statements.

And I think that's how humans think as well. We repeat what we hear. We think what we were taught. And a human racist, is just doing what the A.I. Bot was doing.

So, in that way, the Bot is racist. But it doesn't think. It has no feelings.

Interesting experiment, I think.

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kenmichaels

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

None of them think they are bad people, or that they are wrong. They think they have a firm grasp on reality. But it had to come from somewhere. Probably parents or classmates. That's my guess.

One of my brothers has become racist over time. Seven siblings total and
one is a racist. Same upbringing, same basic set of circumstances, same
same, same, same. How that happened I will never know. I found out
when he met my wife for the first time (Japanese). After we had a pleasant
dinner together I simply asked if he liked her.

His entire answer, "at least she isn't a nword".

That may have been the angriest I have ever been in my life about something.

The only difference I see about him vs us (the rest of his siblings) is
he has the lowest IQ out of the entire family.

I don't know if that means anything or not. But I have always considered
any type of racism as a form of ignorance. So, maybe, just maybe he isn't
smart enough to understand how F'n stupid he is being.

Wow, that was 12 years ago and I am getting angry again just typing this.

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Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by kenmichaels

The only difference I see about him vs us (the rest of his siblings) is
he has the lowest IQ out of the entire family.

I don't know if that means anything or not. But I have always considered
any type of racism as a form of ignorance.

Maybe your brother reads the wrong blogs, talks to the wrong people. I always thought of racism (or sexism, or prejudice against gays) as a form of broken perception. a mental instability.

I do notice that people that are a little dim, are much more susceptible to adopting biases they hear from others.

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yukon Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

I do notice that people that are a little dim, are much more susceptible to adopting biases they hear from others.

Maybe but I've seen it happen a different way, not with racism but with needing to follow another person.

My sister inlaw is a follower & I'm thankful she has never crossed paths with anyone in a cult because I know she would be sucked into the group. She is just that type of person. She is a nice person & smart but she can not make good social decisions on her own.

I think the same happens with gangs, they either need to belong to a group because their family has failed or they're forced into joining the group & scared to leave on their own.

IMO racism is learned by being in the wrong place at the wrong time. No doubt that can't always be prevented especially for kids growing up in that type of environment & hearing it day after day, year after year. I'm sure there's a breaking point where it becomes habit.

I grew up with an alcoholic father, it was hell. I watched what it did to him, it destroyed his whole life. When I was a kid I made a promise to myself I would never drink & I don't after all these years. I knew from the beginning that would never be me.

I guess in the end we all make our own decisions.
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yukon

Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

...the Grand Wizard of the KKK was on my paper route.

THAT IS THE MOST HILARIOUS THING I HAVE EVER READ!!!

I can hear it now:

[Paperboy] ...but mom I don't want to deliver newspapers anymore!
[Mom] WHY NOT!
[Paperboy] That guy with the hood is standing in his driveway again.
[crickets chirping...]

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Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by yukon

THAT IS THE MOST HILARIOUS THING I HAVE EVER READ!!!

I can hear it now:

[Paperboy] ...but mom I don't want to deliver newspapers anymore!
[Mom] WHY NOT!
[Paperboy] That guy with the hood is standing in his driveway again.
[crickets chirping...]

I was extremely lucky that neither of my parents had any prejudice in them.

The Grand Wizard ( I think that's what they are called) was an old man on Grove Street that had a lawn that always needed mowed. I delivered his paper, but don't remember ever talking to him.

It was just part of the fabric of our community, and I never gave it a thought.

Everyone in town was white. No exceptions. I never saw a black person even drive through town. And because our family had nothing to do with the KKK, it wasn't a topic of discussion. It wasn't until after I graduated from high school that I saw what a xenophobic community it was.

I once asked my Dad about the crosses I saw in the fields, and he said something like, "Those people are bad. Stay away from them". But I can't remember ever talking about it again.

Years after graduation, I found out that several guys I went to school with were staunch supporters of the KKK and the John Birch Society. And when I met them socially, they sounded way different from the way I remembered them. More backward.

But maybe I was different, who knows.

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yukon

Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by Ploppi

yes, but the robot by using racist words cannot be racist as it's just repeating words and creating phrases based on the information it is processing to come up with statements.

Sure, it's software, it can't be anything other than software. It did what it was coded to do, mimic text that humans supply.

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Microsoft silences its new A.I. bot Tay, after Twitter users teach it racism

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