A reminder...

Telekinetic Marketing -
But it's not open to general registration yet...and free registration is over, however, for the 130 or so Warriors already there, we do have a specific group for the chat.

Sorry.....I take blame for the one thread disappearing. Conversation wanders across borders easily these days. I know better. I don't understand what was political about a leaked document that tells exactly how frightening the oil spill might be in reality. It was a politician who said it, but it was about ecology, not politics. Perhaps it was an answer it provoked that I didn't see.

And I have a forum wehre those discussions are allowed.

Paul, I hope you realize my minor statement was in jest, I even added a happy face, and the fox statement was one I was really curious about and it didn't go any farther.

Hapily, I have not even SEEN the comparisons to Hitler, Stalin and Mao. Thanks!

And YEAH, if people want to talk about fox, D vs. R, etc... everyone can go to kims site. Hopfully he'll still let people here get in for free. I'm there, and several others are.

Steve

I have a general forum that you can discuss such things as well. (in my sig)
This account is rather new, I sold a site that had my old accounts email attached to it.
I haven't noticed any political hate threads, but I mainly keep to a few search terms when checking out the forum.

Life is too short to hate......anyone.

I have to agree with that one, Paul. I am not bothered by it, though. To liken something to something else isn't meant to be name calling. It is suggestive merely of the patterns that emerge from a sequence of events and actions. Name calling breaks down the logic of any argument. Unfortunately, most people are not trained to know the difference between emotionally oriented name-calling and pattern association and become totally fuzzed at the personal levels, and a lot of VERY emotional reaction takes over. Hate is engendered and name-calling becomes a very personal weapon.

So yes, it does engender hate. All a very normal part of human sociology and psychology. Somewhat controlled by our mental hardwiring. Name a time in history where the populations did not appropriately demonstrate such tendencies? Maybe within one faction, but not multi-factionally.

Something to think about when writing sales literature. If a marketer doesn't "get" why, tough noogies. One of their competitors will.

I too apologize if I have contributed to bad vibes. In fact some of my posts are deleted and I have no idea what I said - so I figure somebody came up behind me and 'took the bait' (unintentional)

Then again of course I realize 'it is not WHAT you say but HOW you say it'.

I guess I will just stay out of 'those' discussions that are controversial to be on the safer side.

I see this from two ways:

On one hand it is important both psychologically and physiologically to "VENT" - holding stuff in kills (thank God I will never step off this way)

- It seemed important to be able to 'hash it out' with (a) those of a like mind, (b) those opposed, and what seems to happen here (c) those that just play 'devil's advocate' - agent provacateurs -- the purposeful 'baiters' -- as if they enjoy conflict - (believe it or not I hate it).

And from my other side - this is a discussion, not group therapy. We must behave at least in public. We need to be mindful of other's feelings (please do not ever misconstrue this with 'politically correct')...

... and of course play by the rules "don't follow leaders, watch the parking meters"

But Paul, please tell me what is the Godwin thing? (perish the thought).

Again, my apologies if I am on your naughty list.

Best Regards,

Ms. Behavin'

Thanks Steve - ya learn something new everyday.

I don't think that Paul used that to renounce relevant pattern associations found in some topics or the people who find them, though. I think it was just an example of what types of conversation were prohibited while visiting this piece of private property.

Well Paul,

I wish I could disagree with all the comparisons. And some people think some, like me, would like to see fascism and nazism. It isn't sustainable though, requires propaganda, and really hurts EVERYONE. It has everything I hate about a government. I'm surprised ANYONE really went for it, but MOST were threatened a lot, and some things happened gradually. I could say more but...

In looking up something else, related to arnold swartzenegger, I found that he actually commissioned the simon wiesenthal center center to investigate his father. They found that he was innocent of being involved with the nazi garbage.

SO, though I sadly must agree with your ban on its use, its use doesn't invalidate the argument at hand.

Steve

All true. It's also sometimes nothing more than a knee-jerk reaction to a statement that is startlingly totalitarian.

Sorry Paul. I USUALLY make associations with computer things, electronics, and just movies in general but, sometimes... 8-( I might make more associations to movies, but sometimes the truth is odder and, weirdly in this case, better accepted.

Frankly, I just wish the world could be honest and federations or whatever just managed the general federation, and not its parts. Switzerland seems to be the only one that really managed that.

Steve

Well gee, Paul, lol - take your debate point. You're hard core. I'd love to actually debate an issue with you sometime.

I studied political philosophy (and regular) quite heavily in school. There was a point of time I was thinking about going into politics for a living (ur...career politics, gag) and the ideas are pretty well ingrained and automatically associated by this time and date.

The "perception" of the similarities isn't just in these two works. Many politicians have written works which seem to be fashioned at some points from other previous political or philosophical writers - not not necessarily the same philosophies.....but it's not really different from someone in marketing modeling their writing styles and techniques after a great marketer, either.

Now I'd have to have both books in front of me again to go point to point on that argument because I really don't remember much about either of them other than the general drift of each now.

I would also like to say that, yeah - I know I diverge from pure logical argument myself. If I were in a scored debate there are times that I'd take real hits for that, and maybe, with my understanding of fallacies it's harder to excuse when I do it than when someone clueless of quantum logic theorems does...but, hey - I am human, too, and very capable of strong emotions myself sometimes. You would not believe the restraint I have used in here at times.

Another thing - Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini --- were all madmen and murderers, but they were all extremely intelligent as well. Some of their ideas and writings are absolutely brilliant........they just went over the edge (um...WAY over the edge). But to be afraid to study them and agree with some of what they say is an extremely strange idea to me. I studied the works of Crowley, and La Vey, too - and found some very brilliant ideas there - that doesn't make me a Satanist. People freak, though, whenever the names are mentioned, no matter what the reason. You are SO right about that one.

I also hold very close to a few ideas that are actually quite fascist. Overall I couldn't be considered a fascist, but those few principles in which I, myself, could be trounced as "paralleling" are very deeply totalitarian. Shocked? So would most other people be if they realized that a few of their own ideas are pretty nightmarish to many, maybe even most, others.

While I have never been called a fascist in here, and most would be surprised at the last paragraph, I am frequently called a "conspiracy theorist". Did anyone notice that during the hum about HARPP causing the Chinese earthquake a year or two back that I slapped that idea down like a misquito? An actively stressed fault line and a city of people using microwave and other technologies that can affect magnatism, and god knows what minerals in the rock don't need HARPP to cause a beautiful yet eerie glow in the sky. But nobody notices when I don't hold to any and every "conspiracy theory". I am labeled a nutcase across the board by some. Doesn't bother me the least and is to be expected. Probably was some sort of mention about that kind of thought in the "marketing to the herd mentality" thread.

Your problem is to control a forum of people. -- I actually try very hard to respect that and the rules. I have also enlisted your, and Allen's aid in a few very unsettling issues and you two were awesome. I owe you, and have not been 100% cooperative - my human nature steps in, too. Unfortunately it is subjects not allowed on this board, and for very logically placed, reasons that tank me.

My problem is to sell products. Can you put ALL of my comments on this board together and guess the demographics of my target audience and associations? (okay - someone is going to say conspiracy nutcases - and there are a few in the crowd, but that's not the right answer, LMAO).

And that's the reason I have always held that for long-term business success you need to have a niche or niches that you hold very close in your own interests and lifestyles - so that your marketing will always be an honest representation of your own ideals.

OK, I was GOING to agree with tim, and elaborate earlier, but was afraid it would start debate. Ironically one where tim and I would likely be on the same side. I think this is the fourth such time, so maybe the world IS coming to an end. 8-( He earlier thought my thanking another was hypocritical, etc..., so I figured I should just say that the above isn't, and leave it at that. 8-(

PLEASE don't take this as anything to debate, etc... I am just agreeing.

Steve

Sal,

I REALLY wish I could even discuss some areas of your last post. I don't even know if YOU would say anything against my views though, like others here, I don't agree with you, but I am sure it would likely go farther.

I would RATHER state things like how stegosaurus' appearance, if it even has the same name now, has changed so much, or how I learned about brontosaurus, and THAT was different also. WHO KNOWS!?

Steve

OK, five! Do me a favor sal.... PLEASE don't give me another opportunity to thank tim.

Steve

Hey Tim...

I believe Hitler was a marketing and motivational genius, despite his military blunders. He studied public speaking and even had some magician teach him hand movements. He could energize a crowd like few, if any others. I'm not condoning what he did in any way, I just believe he was a great motivator and too bad he couldn't have used those talents for good instead of evil. IMO, he could have been a MLK or Ghandi.

I agree, Stalin was just ruthless. I've never read or seen anything to suggest he had a high IQ and was anything but average, just very violent. Killing your enemies and everyone you think may have talked to your enemies doesn't take a lot of IQ.

So if I mention that Hitler was merely someone that published a book and the NAZI party decided to make him the leader of the party. Eventually, he got to be dictator, and ruled by fear, intimidation, and propaganda, and killed all the major opponents, and others he didn't like, he could find. People were basically FORCED to become members of the NAZI party. HECK, he even tried to intimidate entire nations that were basically harmless. I could say more there but....

Frankly, I LIKE the normal high german language. Hey, here is a little song in german and english:
But I think Hitler made german sound UGLY! If he even wispered it as if it were a sonnet, it would STILL sound bad.

Frankly, hitler was against so many things it was INCREDIBLE! To say I disliked his politics would be like saying I hate the current oil leak because it isn't the right color. It would be imprecise and a massive understatement.

And hitler started at a time when Germany was so relatively dependant and inflation was SKY HIGH. If he did almost ANYTHING it would improve the economy. I don't think ANY nation had it so bad. So his successes in economics were almost a given. Still, there would likely normally be a problem transitioning back to a more open economy. The US policy at that time was to rebuild such nations though, so they had a softer recovery.

In the end, Hitler apparently took the coward's way out through suicide.

OK, it wasn't partisan. Hopefully, most, if not all here, agree with me enough to not get into debate. The only party I spoke against was the NAZI party, which is limited everywhere, including Germany. BTW they are allowed in the US ONLY basically under free speech and a few rules. Most people openly associated with any such group never make it past the most local government.

Steve

I get enough of politics, religion, news, on other places and in my own writings. It would be nice not to hear much of it here. Been gone for awhile and just piping in to a forum I thoroughly think is a great one.

TL,

You ended up bringing it down a new road, and I won't follow. As for what started WWI, I have heard various theories. I don't know if anyone really TRULY knows. The most popular is mentioned in wikipedia:

As for how the NAZIs came to power? It amazes me that that seems to still be a secret to some. AGAIN though, discussing that further would be the wrong road here. Maybe KIM'S forum?

Steve