OBAMA TELLS SAN FRANCISCO HE WILL BANKRUPT THE COAL INDUSTRY

64 replies
  • OFF TOPIC
  • |
I thought this was important enough to break my self-imposed temporary silence (just this once):

  • Profile picture of the author KimW
    Well now, McCain is now saying in his speeches that he will build 45 nuclear reactors, but I'm not sure if that's before or after all his off shore drilling.
    Signature

    Read A Post.
    Subscribe to a Newsletter
    KimWinfrey.Com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[221816].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author gareth
    "What's next? Are we going to begin firing them into deep space to get rid of them?"

    Firing them into space is in fact the logical thing to do except that a definite percentage of launches self destruct in the atmosphere.

    This is why it is not done.

    France seems to be successfully recycling much of their nuclear waste.
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[221842].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author KimW
    Oh, I agree with you that neclear is not the answer,I was just pointing out that that is the policy mccain is resorting to trying to pass off as his energy policy. He also said that he would have off shore drilling NOW,not later,but NOW. and had the crowd chanting "drill baby drill".
    I'm almost feeling sorry for him, he is resorting to so many things trying to get people to buy any of them. ( Don't worry, I know and understand the fact that a llot of people DO and ARE buying into his lines).
    Signature

    Read A Post.
    Subscribe to a Newsletter
    KimWinfrey.Com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[221857].message }}
  • {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[221869].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author espacecadet
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[221910].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Barry Davis
      Originally Posted by espacecadet View Post

      Yeah, Barry, the second link is coming up 404 error.
      It got linked on Drudge Report so it probably overloaded their server. It is an article about a WV Coal Mining official who is incredulous over Obama's statement.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[221944].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author rondo
    Most major western countries are currently adopting cap and trade systems so new technologies can become competitive on a more level playing field with subsidised coal.

    Barry both candidates want to reduce the number of new dirty powerstations so why pick on Obama?


    Andrew
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[221984].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Barry Davis
      Originally Posted by rondo View Post

      Barry both candidates want to reduce the number of new dirty powerstations so why pick on Obama?
      Did you listen to the interview? He said he will raise the fees so high that it will bankrupt the coal industry. Don't you think that is just a little bit irresponsible?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222024].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author rondo
    Barry he won't raise fees. He didn't say that at all. Instead the market will place a cost on carbon emission.

    I watched the video and never heard him say he will bankrupt the industry. He said they will become bankrupt if they keep building dirty powerstations, because once subsidies are removed and renewables have a chance to compete those new dirty powerstations will not be financially viable.


    Andrew
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222051].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Barry Davis
      Originally Posted by rondo View Post

      Barry he won't raise fees. He didn't say that at all. Instead the market will place a cost on carbon emission.

      I watched the video and never heard him say he will bankrupt the industry. He said they will become bankrupt if they keep building dirty powerstations, because once subsidies are removed and renewables have a chance to compete those new dirty powerstations will not be financially viable.


      Andrew
      I guess you listened to a different audio than I did then.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222072].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by rondo View Post

      Barry he won't raise fees. He didn't say that at all. Instead the market will place a cost on carbon emission.

      I watched the video and never heard him say he will bankrupt the industry. He said they will become bankrupt if they keep building dirty powerstations, because once subsidies are removed and renewables have a chance to compete those new dirty powerstations will not be financially viable.


      Andrew
      That's pretty much what I got out of it also.
      Reminds me of when the EPA told GE that had to clean up the Hudson at their expense. GE cried it would bankrupt them and all the jobs that would be lost, blah, blah.
      Now the cleanup starts next year, GE is doing better then ever, and more jobs where created.

      Big concern over coal miners losing their jobs cause BO wants to clean up some factories and power plants.
      No concern over oil rig workers losing their jobs if we come up with alternative fuels?
      Signature

      Life: Nature's way of keeping meat fresh
      Getting old ain't for sissy's
      As you are I was, as I am you will be
      You can't fix stupid, but you can always out smart it.

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222103].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author rondo
    Oh and those jobs will be safe for a long time yet. The exisitng levels of coal power use won't decline any time soon.
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222059].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author rondo
    No I listened to the same video, the one with the misleading title "OBAMA TELLS SAN FRANCISCO HE WILL BANKRUPT THE COAL INDUSTRY"

    He won't bankrupt it, in fact if they stop building dirty powerstations and adapt to clean coal (which is the whole objective) they will become more profitable than ever.
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222089].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author rondo
    I'll tell you what's funny Barry. You keep posting alarmist videos which aren't based on fact over and over again.


    Andrew
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222330].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Barry Davis
      Originally Posted by rondo View Post

      I'll tell you what's funny Barry. You keep posting alarmist videos which aren't based on fact over and over again.


      Andrew
      Andrew,
      It is a fact. Obama said that if someone builds a coal plant he will bankrupt it. I didn't make that up, that is exactly what he said. I just wish this had come out a month ago, because it could have cost him the election.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222340].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author rondo
    Barry wording is important. He didn't say "I will bankrupt them", he said if they build more dirty powerstations "it will bankrupt them" for the reasons stated earlier.

    The point is that he wants them to become clean, not put them out of business.

    He's wants to give them (the coal industry) "a $150 billion investment in clean coal and other technologies to create jobs and build a new energy economy'' according to the Ohio State Governor.


    McCain on the other hand has said he wants to "transition away from coal entirely".
    Which on the surface sounds like the chances of bankruptcy are far higher under McCain doesn't it. I don't know much about what he wants do, only that he wants more nuclear power.

    Maybe you can fill us in on McCain's plan.


    Andrew
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222369].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Barry Davis
      Originally Posted by rondo View Post

      Barry wording is important. He didn't say "I will bankrupt them", he said if they build more dirty powerstations "it will bankrupt them" for the reasons stated earlier.
      He said that the fines/fees he will impose will bankrupt them.

      Barry


      BTW, if McCain or Palin smoked, we'd never hear the end of it. I've never heard ONE story about Obama's habit from the MSM. Wonder why?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222386].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author KimW
        Originally Posted by Barry Davis View Post

        He said that the fines/fees he will impose will bankrupt them.

        Barry


        BTW, if McCain or Palin smoked, we'd never hear the end of it. I've never heard ONE story about Obama's habit from the MSM. Wonder why?
        lol, now your really grasping at straws.
        Signature

        Read A Post.
        Subscribe to a Newsletter
        KimWinfrey.Com

        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222929].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      France seems to be successfully recycling much of their nuclear waste.
      Yes, they do - about 90% of it from what I've read. They also don't rely on imported fuels because they've built nuclear power plants (the technology is much better now for both building and handling waste).

      I don't think the US will stop the dependence on oil until the oil isn't there. We don't seem willing to look ahead and as soon as the prices go down again we forget about the problem. We've done it again and again. Meanwhile, some potentially powerful alternative fuels have been in development by independent researchers - and the oil companies buy them out and shut them down.

      The talk now is "drill drill" but I read today there is a five year wait for drilling equipment (platforms, etc) and the price has skyrocketed. It was reported that something like 68 million acres of land are already approved for drilling - but the oil companies haven't drilled on it.

      Sooner or later we have to move to new technology - and phase out both oil and coal as much as possible. Every candidate talks about it - no one does anything. In time, we will have an oil crisis as bad as the credit crisis is now - but it seems we won't get serious until that happens.

      kay
      Signature
      Saving one dog will not change the world - but the world will change forever for that one dog.

      I wish offended people would react like fainting goats and quietly tip over.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222389].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

        Sooner or later we have to move to new technology - and phase out both oil and coal as much as possible. Every candidate talks about it - no one does anything. In time, we will have an oil crisis as bad as the credit crisis is now - but it seems we won't get serious until that happens.

        kay
        Kay, Obama has said that his number one priority will be to deal with the oil/energy issue. He just said that yesterday in fact. He actually listed his priorities from one to five. Has anyone heard McCain's priorities about anything besides which smear to throw at Obama the hardest? :-)

        Barry, what's with posting a photo of Obama smoking? You are getting ridiculous now. Plus, Obama stopped smoking. McCain drinks and gambles and we never hear about that. So there goes your theory. Keep trying.
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222422].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Barry Davis
          Originally Posted by TimPhelan View Post

          Barry, what's with posting a photo of Obama smoking?
          It was a free bonus!
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223051].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author HeySal
            So Bama smokes? Kewl - maybe he'll get rid of some of those ridiculously controlling smoking laws. You can't smoke outdoors? LOL - You can drive a car outdoors and that carbon monoxide is poisonous, too, eh?

            The two headed dragon needs to be slain, period. Third Party Voters is what this country needs now.
            Signature

            Sal
            When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
            Beyond the Path

            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223059].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Kurt
    What was left out in this discussion is that Obama will support CLEAN coal technology, as he mentioned in the video. Go back and listen that Obama brings up "clean coal" in the video.

    And isn't charging a company for their pollution a true free market system. Why shouldn't big industry pay to clean the air they pollute? I have to pay to have my trash taken away, why do they get to just dump their trash in our air for free?

    To let big companies not pay their fair share is facist.

    So, we move to CLEAN coal, which has a good future, but is 12-15 years away. In the meantime, we switch to natural gas. We have enough natural gas to take the place of oil for 100 years. It is 2/3s cleaner, and will cost 1/2 the cost of producing gas from oil. And we (The US) owns the 100 year supply within our own borders.

    "Drill baby drill" is dumb as hell. Why spend the money on outdated energy? Use that money to develope natural gas. Drilling for oil is like telling someone they should buy a 8-track instead of an iPod.

    Cars can easily be adapted to natural gas, as an ex cab driver, I drove natural gas cabs 20 years ago. Let me repeat: I drove them 20 years ago, and no one drives harder than cab drivers.

    This is what we can do RIGHT NOW, while we move to solar and wind, expand clean coal, bio fuels, better milage and energy efficiency, etc in the near future.

    Again, listen for Obama to mention CLEAN COAL in this video, which was ignored by the biased. And yes, clean coal has been a part of the Obama energy plan from the start. All those dirty coal workers will have plenty of jobs waiting for them in the CLEAN COAL industry.

    And yes, Obama has said he feels that the energy issue should be treated with the same urgency as the "Manhattan Project".

    For more info on natural gas:
    PickensPlan

    Clean coal:
    Clean coal technology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Signature
    Discover the fastest and easiest ways to create your own valuable products.
    Tons of FREE Public Domain content you can use to make your own content, PLR, digital and POD products.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222484].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author pcalvert
      Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

      "Drill baby drill" is dumb as hell. Why spend the money on outdated energy? Use that money to develope natural gas. Drilling for oil is like telling someone they should buy a 8-track instead of an iPod.
      It's not as stupid as it may sound. There will be a need for petroleum for a long time to come, even when we have better sources of energy. Actually, that is one of the reasons I want to see superior (and not just alternative) energy sources developed sooner rather than later. Petroleum is valuable as feedstock for the production of many different chemicals. So it's actually quite wasteful and short-sighted to be burning it for energy.

      Phil
      Signature

      "If a cat sits on a hot stove, that cat won't sit on a hot stove again.
      That cat won't sit on a cold stove either." - Mark Twain

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[222977].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author espacecadet
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223055].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
      ....... :-)
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223354].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
      I am voting for Obama of course.

      I do get a bit defensive sometimes, but wasn't in this thread.

      But when someone repeatedly calls Obama a "whore", refers to him as "skinny assed mixed race", gleefully predicts he will be shot and assassinated, talks about "damn jew bankers" and the "brown plague", complains about blacks being lazy etc... and then says I am stupid for my first post in this thread... Well, I think the name moron fits.
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223455].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Barry Davis
    Guess some of the guys who actually work in the coal industry know more about this than some of you "experts" on this thread:
    http://www.marketwatch.com/news/stor...-40D8EBD7D93D}
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223339].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author espacecadet
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223385].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
      ... the thread OP is bogus anyways. So it doesn't matter.
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223389].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author TE2
        Originally Posted by TimPhelan View Post

        Moroncadet, the thread OP is bogus anyways. So it doesn't matter.
        The problem with liberals is...

        Bear with me, it's a long list. Here goes:
        • Paranoia
        • Inability to understand the concept of right and wrong
        • Misunderstanding basic concept
        • Delusions
        • Halucinations
        • Disordered thinking
        • Emotional unresponsiveness
        • Socialist tende@###%!!^^$
        Error 25202 - Insufficient Disk Space

        You do not have enough disk space available for
        the large amount of text you entered.

        Error 25203 - Text Overflow

        Cannot post portions of the required Text. You
        can try re-entering less text or contact your
        technical support group, administrator, or
        Microsoft Product Support for more assistance.


        And there you have it.

        Sorry for the extremely long read.

        Regards,

        John
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223437].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author espacecadet
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223405].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Kurt
    Let's set the record straright:

    John McCain has not voted for a single alternative energy bill in his entire career in the senate.

    Now, just to get votes, he's flip-flopped again and is all of a sudden Mr. Greenjeans. Geez...Maybe if he would have supported some of these alternatives earlier, we might not be in this mess. We'd at least be closer to the solutions.

    But McCain is just Lil' Bush, and has constantly voted to protect big oil.

    Talk is cheap. We have 25+ years of McCain's voting record to go on. He is the reason we are in this mess.
    Signature
    Discover the fastest and easiest ways to create your own valuable products.
    Tons of FREE Public Domain content you can use to make your own content, PLR, digital and POD products.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223453].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author espacecadet
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223516].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author TE2
      Originally Posted by espacecadet View Post

      Again, that's just your opinion, which isn't worth much...

      You've gotta be crazy to go through my previous posts just to get fodder for your cannon..
      That's what they do when they can't argue by applying fact or logic. They attack!

      Regards,

      John

      ps - I got yer back
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223525].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
        Just exactly when do you present facts or logic?
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223596].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author espacecadet
          Banned
          [DELETED]
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223605].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author TE2
          Originally Posted by TimPhelan View Post

          Just exactly when do you present facts or logic? I haven't seen any indication of either from you yet. You even still think McCain has a "very good" chance of winning. lol.
          Fact - Sarah Palin has more Executive experience than Barack Obama and Joe Biden combined.

          Your turn...
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223694].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
            Originally Posted by TE2 View Post

            Fact - Sarah Palin has more Executive experience than Barack Obama and Joe Biden combined.

            Your turn...
            Fact, she hasn't had any experience in national foreign policy or national economic policy where Obama and Biden have. Plus she also has more executive experience than McCain. Big deal. Plus, she was found guilty already of abuse of power in less than two years as Governor and is being investigated on a couple more abuse of power issues also.

            Opinion: ( that 59% of Americans agree with with) she isn't qualified to be VP.
            Signature
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223719].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author TE2
              Originally Posted by TimPhelan View Post

              Fact, she hasn't had any experience in national foreign policy or national economic policy where Obama and Biden have. Plus she also has more executive experience than McCain. Big deal.
              Actually it is a big deal. The fact was about "Executive" experience. Point for me. But I am benevolent and will give you another chance.

              I'll bite on your attempt to change the topic.

              Please list Obama's and Bidens experience in foreign policy and national economic policy as well as their records. This is going to be fun.

              Plus, she was found guilty already of abuse of power in less than two years as Governor and is being investigated on a couple more abuse of power issues also.
              To use your words - "Big deal" - an ethics violation was all they could manufacture... and they had to do their best to create it. Puh-leeze. How about offering up something substantial and meaningful.

              Opinion: ( that 59% of Americans agree with with) she isn't qualified to be VP.
              Let's stick to Facts since you were previously alleging the alleged lack thereof.

              TE2 - 1 Tim - 0
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223764].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author TE2
                Fact - Our current economic woes began about 2 years ago when the Democrats became the majority in the House and Senate.
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223770].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author KimW
                  Originally Posted by TE2 View Post

                  Fact - Our current economic woes began about 2 years ago when the Democrats became the majority in the House and Senate.
                  Ding ding, wrong again.
                  Signature

                  Read A Post.
                  Subscribe to a Newsletter
                  KimWinfrey.Com

                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223786].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author TE2
                    Originally Posted by KimW View Post

                    Ding ding, wrong again.
                    Same above - show me the facts that dispute it.

                    John
                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223886].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author TE2
                    Originally Posted by KimW View Post

                    Ding ding, wrong again.
                    Kim,

                    I just realized that I was wrong...

                    Our current economic crisis actually started with Bill Clinton loosening mortgage industry regulations. It kicked into high gear when Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, and other Dems blocked attempts to tighten regulation.

                    And yes, they are not solely to blame. There are Republicans that are culpable as well. But for a party as a whole, the Dems are the predominant cause.

                    John
                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223914].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
                  Originally Posted by TE2 View Post

                  Fact - Our current economic woes began about 2 years ago when the Democrats became the majority in the House and Senate.
                  Wrong. This is illogical. -1 point for Phil.

                  Tim + 5 Phil -2
                  Signature
                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223788].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
                Originally Posted by TE2 View Post

                Actually it is a big deal. The fact was about "Executive" experience. Point for me.
                That isn't any point for you. Just for that I am going to get two points and now you are negative one.

                Tim +2 Phil -1

                See, isn't that silly?

                Obama and Biden are US Senators. They deal with national issues. Not whether or not Wassila should have an ice rink and how many ear marks Alaska can get from the US Tax payers.

                Tim + 5 Phil -1
                Signature
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223784].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author pcalvert
                  You seem to be confused as to whom you are conversing with. The only person I replied to in this thread is Kurt.

                  Phil


                  Originally Posted by TimPhelan View Post

                  That isn't any point for you. Just for that I am going to get two points and now you are negative one.

                  Tim +2 Phil -1

                  See, isn't that silly?

                  Obama and Biden are US Senators. They deal with national issues. Not whether or not Wassila should have an ice rink and how many ear marks Alaska can get from the US Tax payers.

                  Tim + 5 Phil -1
                  Signature

                  "If a cat sits on a hot stove, that cat won't sit on a hot stove again.
                  That cat won't sit on a cold stove either." - Mark Twain

                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[225830].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
                    I know. I thought TE2 was Phil. That happens when people don't use their names. Pardon me Phil.

                    Originally Posted by pcalvert View Post

                    You seem to be confused as to whom you are conversing with. The only person I replied to in this thread is Kurt.

                    Phil
                    Signature
                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[225833].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author KimW
            Originally Posted by TE2 View Post

            Fact - Sarah Palin has more Executive experience than Barack Obama and Joe Biden combined.

            Your turn...
            Actually no.

            You have posted some great posts in the past, don't let desperation reduce you down. ( I'm being sincere).
            Signature

            Read A Post.
            Subscribe to a Newsletter
            KimWinfrey.Com

            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223785].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author TE2
              Originally Posted by KimW View Post

              Actually no.

              You have posted some great posts in the past, don't let desperation reduce you down. ( I'm being sincere).
              Kim I am open to correction. Can you provide factual evidence to the contrary?

              John

              ps - I am being sincere.
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223884].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author KimW
                Originally Posted by TE2 View Post

                Kim I am open to correction. Can you provide factual evidence to the contrary?

                John

                ps - I am being sincere.
                I guess we first need to decide on the definition of executive experience.
                Signature

                Read A Post.
                Subscribe to a Newsletter
                KimWinfrey.Com

                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223916].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author TE2
                  Originally Posted by KimW View Post

                  I guess we first need to decide on the definition of executive experience.
                  The traditional definition - The Top Dog, CEO, Owner, Chief Administrator, etc.. of a business or government entity.

                  My view doesn't include public organizer, president of a club, or such. If that were so, then I have far more experience than all the candidates combined.

                  John for President


                  Edit - I am talking about the lead position as opposed to an individual contributor.
                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223967].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author espacecadet
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223533].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Kurt
      Originally Posted by espacecadet View Post

      Kurt, McCain is PART of the reason we are in this mess. Don't forget, Obama is a Senator as well, and he kicked in his fair share of the votes on various bills, well, except for those where he voted Present to appear neutral on the issue...

      If you're going to say something about one candidate why don't you give the other candidate equal time, or are you just as biased as Tim Phelan?

      See, the problem you guys seem to have with me is you can't pin me down to just one candidate. I don't like either of the frontrunners.

      Don't you just hate that?
      Because Obama voted for alternative fuel...And McCain never has. Facts are your friend.

      And if you're so unbiased, my posts on this thread have been the most factual of anyone's and included unbiased links for others to follow for more info. Neither of my links went to a political party or showed any political bias in any way. You have serious issues with reality.
      Signature
      Discover the fastest and easiest ways to create your own valuable products.
      Tons of FREE Public Domain content you can use to make your own content, PLR, digital and POD products.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223723].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
        Originally Posted by Kurt View Post


        You have serious issues with reality.
        That's what I keep telling him, but he says I am biased on the side of reality. :-)
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223744].message }}
  • It's a shame that we are forced to choose between two fascists....sigh.
    Signature
    "The successful man is the one who finds out what is the matter with his business before his competitors do"
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223551].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author espacecadet
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223632].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author TimPhelan
      Originally Posted by espacecadet View Post

      Exactly what facts and logic are you referring to, if you know?
      There wasn't any. That was my point.
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223643].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author KimW
    My goodness what goes on while I'm at the Drs.
    Signature

    Read A Post.
    Subscribe to a Newsletter
    KimWinfrey.Com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[223787].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author KimW
    Calling being governor of Alaska executive experience is like saying the mayor of Mayberry is presidential material.

    I would probably vote for you John before I'd vote for McCain or Palin.
    Signature

    Read A Post.
    Subscribe to a Newsletter
    KimWinfrey.Com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[224027].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author TE2
      Originally Posted by KimW View Post

      Calling being governor of Alaska executive experience is like saying the mayor of Mayberry is presidential material.

      I would probably vote for you John before I'd vote for McCain or Palin.
      Okay, let's look at some of their accomplishments.

      Palin's Accomplishments:
      • She has been the Governor of Alaska for two years
      • Mayor of Wasilla Alaska for ten years
      • President of Alaska Conference of Mayors
      • City Council member - 1992-1996
      • AGIA License bill signed - Aug 27, 2008
      • Energy Package signed - Aug 25, 2008
      • Administrative Order 242 signed Aug 20, 2008
      These are just a few of her more recent accomplishments.


      Obama's Accomplishments:
      • Junior US Senator (accomplishment or achievement?) - current
      • Voted to end $300 million worth of tax breaks for businesses - 2004
      • Voted for having Illinois endorse embryonic stem cell research.- 2004
      • Voted against restrictions on public funding of abortion - 2000
      • Voted "Present" in nearly all Illinois Senate votes - IL Senate term
      • Co-sponsored prescription drug discount buying club program for seniors and the disabled - 2003
      • Co-sponsored major ethics reform called the Gift Ban Act - 1998
      • Key role in Illinois Death Penalty changes - murder suspect interrogations are to be recorded - 1998

      Remember, he is running for President and she is only running for the VP slot. I believe she is more qualified to be President or even VP compared to his accomplishments.

      Respectfully,

      John
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[224149].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author getsmartt
        Originally Posted by TE2 View Post

        Obama's Accomplishments:
        • Junior US Senator (accomplishment or achievement?) - current

        And lets not forget he has spent the majority of the time since he was elected as senator running for the Presidency and not doing the job he was originally elected for.
        Signature

        Was mich nicht umbringt, macht mich stärker

        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[224195].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author getsmartt
    I can see that I do not make it to th OT forum enough...

    Ok the OT of this OT was OBAMA TELLS SAN FRANCISCO HE WILL BANKRUPT THE COAL INDUSTRY

    his exact words...

    Under my plan of a cap and trade system, electricity rates would necessarily skyrocket.
    Now this seems like something that would be good for our economy....sure

    Regardless of what I say about whether coal is good or bad, because I'm capping greenhouse gases, coal power plants, you know, natural gas, you name it, whatever the plants were, whatever the industry was, they would have to retrofit their operations. That will cost money. They will pass that money on to consumers.
    Hmm looks like even more money out of my pocket...

    Let me sort of describe my overall policy. What I've said is that we would put a cap and trade system in place that is more -- that is as aggressive, if not more aggressive than anybody else's out there. That was the first call for 100%
    a 100% increase over any current cap and trade system in place anywhere, and just how does he expect to keep industry here, or jobs here?

    An auction on the cap and trade system, which means that every unit of carbon or greenhouse gases that was emitted would be charged to the polluter. That will create a market in which whatever technologies are out there that are being presented, whatever power plants that are being built that they would have to meet the rigors of that market and the ratcheted down caps that are placed, imposed every year. So if somebody wants to build a coal powered plant, they can. It's just that it will bankrupt them because they are going to be charged a huge sum.
    Nope no specific mention of dirty plants here, that is pretty much any coal plant that he wants to put out of business.
    Signature

    Was mich nicht umbringt, macht mich stärker

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[224102].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author KimW
    I figured we were going head to head, in which case Palin vs Biden. I think he is far more qualified than she is.

    I have real issues with McCain He scares the hell out of me, though it seems those that dislike Obama have the same feelings about him.
    He has already stated he wants to do the "surge" in Afghanistan next.
    great.
    Signature

    Read A Post.
    Subscribe to a Newsletter
    KimWinfrey.Com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[224240].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author rondo
    So what exactly do you Obama critics think will happen to the coal industry under McCain?

    Seems to me Obama's plan is their only chance of surviving and thriving.

    Andrew
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[224284].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author espacecadet
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[225842].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author pcalvert
      I don't think what Obama said can be equated with a desire to bankrupt the coal industry. It seems to me that he is being quoted out of context in order to twist the meaning of his words. Someone posted what Obama said on a blog. Here it is:

      "I voted against the Clear Skies Bill. In fact, I was the deciding
      vote. Despite the fact that I'm a coal state. And that half my state
      thought that I had thoroughly betrayed them. Because I think clean air
      is critical and global warming is critical. But this notion of no
      coal, I think, is an illusion. Because the fact of the matter is is
      that right now we are getting a lot of our energy from coal. And China
      is building a coal-powered plant once a week. So what we have to do
      then is figure out how can we use coal without emitting greenhouse
      gases and carbon. And how can we sequester that carbon and capture it.
      If we can't, then we're gonna still be working on alternatives.
      But...let me sort of describe my overall policy. What I've said is that
      we would put a cap and trade policy in place that is as aggressive if
      not more aggressive than anyone out there. I was the first call for
      100% auction on the cap and trade system. Which means that every unit
      of carbon or greenhouse gases that was emitted would be charged to the
      polluter. That will create a market in which whatever technologies are
      out there that are being presented, whatever power plants are being
      built, they would have to meet the rigors of that market. And the
      ratcheted down caps that are imposed every year. So if somebody wants
      to build a coal-powered plant, they can. It's just that it will
      bankrupt them because they're going to be charged a huge sum for all
      that greenhouse gas that's being emitted. That will also generate
      billions of dollars that we can invest in solar, wind, biodiesel, and
      other alternative energy approaches. The only thing that I've said
      with respect to coal-I haven't been some coal booster."

      -------------------------

      Joe Biden is another matter. Either he doesn't know what Obama's
      policies are, or he let it slip that Obama is actually anti-coal (for
      us).


      Here is the Joe Biden audio:

      Biden: "We're Not Supporting Clean Coal"

      Questioner: "Wind and solar are flourishing here in Ohio. Why are you
      supporting clean coal?"

      Joe Biden: "We're not supporting clean coal. Guess what? China is
      building two every week. Two dirty coal plants. And it is polluting
      the United States. It is causing people to die.

      Questioner: "So you are supporting wind and solar?"

      Joe Biden: "Absolutely. Before anybody did. The first guy to introduce
      a global warming bill was me -- twenty two years ago. The first guy to
      support solar energy was me -- twenty six years ago. It came out of
      Delaware.

      But guess what China is gonna burn three hundred years of bad coal,
      unless we figure out how to clean their coal up. Because it's gonna
      ruin your lungs, and there's nothing we can do about it.

      No coal plants here in America. Build them, if they're going to build
      them, over there [in China]. Make them clean because they're killing
      us."
      Signature

      "If a cat sits on a hot stove, that cat won't sit on a hot stove again.
      That cat won't sit on a cold stove either." - Mark Twain

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[225919].message }}

Trending Topics