My Evil Mother...

14 years ago

Well, I am an only child, haven't had the screaming ALL the time, haven't been PHYSICALLY beaten, my mother is about 78, and my father is still alive.

Other than that, WELCOME TO THE CLUB! My mother tried to get me in the place your little sister is. Failing that, she tried tricks, etc....

She is STILL trying it. A month ago, she promised me that she would pay me over $500/month to stay in my home. I told her she couldn't get in because it was locked, and I'm not giving ANYONE the keys. She tried to lay a guilt trip on me, so I found her a NICE apartment for about $500/month. I DOUBT she will go there though she says she will. I don't even know if she can.

This last weekend I was nearby. We made arrangements to meet on saturday. She called at 7PM friday, and 7am saturday, and I only went to sleep at 2AM. I was SO mad I told her she was now the LAST thing on my list. She tried playing mind games, so my list got too long, and I never saw her. So if she wants to see me, it is going to be ANOTHER month!

BTW I was going to sever ties before she moved near me. I DIDN'T, and now regret it! She is perhaps 10miles away from me, has no car, and is locked on the second floor with a locked elevator several nurses, and a locked door between her and the outside. In a way, she was closer to me when she was THOUSANDS of miles away.

Steve

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felmstone

14 years ago

I still believe in the line "mother knows best"
but sometimes, what they think best is the worst of their children.

but what is important "mother will always be a mother and no one could ever replace it", you can only have only one true biological mother on earth and that's the fact.

I really love my mother, also my father.

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seasoned

14 years ago

Originally Posted by felmstone

I still believe in the line "mother knows best"
but sometimes, what they think best is the worst of their children.

but what is important "mother will always be a mother and no one could ever replace it", you can only have only one true biological mother on earth and that's the fact.

I really love my mother, also my father.

OK, I take it YOUR mother currently appears sane. And how old is she anyway?

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athurart09

14 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

Well, I am an only child, haven't had the screaming ALL the time, haven't been PHYSICALLY beaten, my mother is about 78, and my father is still alive.

Other than that, WELCOME TO THE CLUB! My mother tried to get me in the place your little sister is. Failing that, she tried tricks, etc....

She is STILL trying it. A month ago, she promised me that she would pay me over $500/month to stay in my home. I told her she couldn't get in because it was locked, and I'm not giving ANYONE the keys. She tried to lay a guilt trip on me, so I found her a NICE apartment for about $500/month. I DOUBT she will go there though she says she will. I don't even know if she can.

This last weekend I was nearby. We made arrangements to meet on saturday. She called at 7PM friday, and 7am saturday, and I only went to sleep at 2AM. I was SO mad I told her she was now the LAST thing on my list. She tried playing mind games, so my list got too long, and I never saw her. So if she wants to see me, it is going to be ANOTHER month!

BTW I was going to sever ties before she moved near me. I DIDN'T, and now regret it! She is perhaps 10miles away from me, has no car, and is locked on the second floor with a locked elevator several nurses, and a locked door between her and the outside. In a way, she was closer to me when she was THOUSANDS of miles away.

Steve

Thanks for sharing.

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thehobbster

14 years ago

Yeah, I was beat, intimidated, oppressed, and enslaved (tons of yardwork... like insane amounts) by my alcoholic, fundamentalist Christian father. Now you can add crack-head to the list.

I've grown up, moved out, moved on, and piecing it all back together. I'm psychologically more mature than all those around me at my age. That's the gift I got out of the suffering. But it also crippled me in areas such as relationships, self-esteem, self-confidence, anxiety, depression, etc. But I'm pulling through and coming out on top I think.

He still tries to control aspects of mine and my siblings lives. He still hounds us about whether or not we are going to church. He still spits racist, extremist right-wing nonsense at us.

And we still love him.

You have to separate a person's illness and behavior from the true person hiding underneath all that. We all get dealt some cards, and we pass those on. But we all do the best we can under our circumstances. I don't think anyone intentionally means to do wrong. But it happens. I don't blame evil. I blame ignorance.

I'd say just try to reconcile on your own behalf, even if the other person doesn't respond positively. I know my dad is lonely, so I remain his only friend while my siblings left him alone. You have to get on that level where you can get beyond the stupidity of their actions and just love them for the relationship. She is your mother, despite all the other stuff.

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KenThompson

14 years ago

Hey Gareth,

Sounds pretty uncool. You asked us what we think, so I'll offer
something for whatever it's worth.

I'm not of the same opinion as post #3. It is an incredible dilemma
what highly dysfunctional parents can cause for their children. On
the one hand the adult wants to pretty much take a baseball bat
to them. And on the other, most adults still love their parents.

But in my opinion the two-way dynamics of that love are unhealthy.

I would imagine that among other feelings you have some degree of
anger toward your mother. And I'm not asking because I want an
answer. That's your business. I do not see how anyone could not feel
some amount of anger toward someone who treated them like that. And
not only did that, but is largely responsible for all the emotional baggage
that treatment led to as an adult. All the dysfunctions that really don't
fully become manifest until adulthood.

So I'll just offer two things to think about:

If you do feel angry, I heartily recommend you forgive your mother with
no strings attached. It's not necessary to tell her directly unless you
feel you want/need to. Also, depending on where her head is, it may not
be received well; or she may not understand why you're doing it.

But you can still do it privately, and it still can go far toward dissolving
anger, hatred, resentment, etc. It may take time until you really mean it
if you do it. You may find that you can say it but not really mean it. So
be prepared to experience that possibility.

It's more important to forgive her for your own well-being than anything
else.

Secondly, you need to do what's best for you. Not your mother or anyone
else. I am not suggesting anything about any situations other than this one
with you. In your situation, and others that are very similar, I'll say you need
to do that.

It's normal to love or like someone, but for whatever reasons it's unhealthy
to be around them. You can still love your mother because you do, but that
doesn't mean you have to subject yourself to things that are harmful to you.

It may mean that you need to keep a distance from anyone else in your family
as well. Only you know best about that.

I'd recommend you spend your time and energy on healing yourself from what
happened. It may take the rest of your life, but don't let that discourage you
at all. There could very well be certain behaviors and deeply ingrained patterns
of thought that will always stay with you. But you can learn to deal with them
in a positive and healthy way.

No matter what, do not do nothing. Or, take action and work on yourself. The
best place to start is with yourself. Get to know yourself extremely well. Never
BS yourself about anything. If you do, you're on the path to self-deception and
no real progress or healing.

It's not easy, but the more attention you give toward healing, you'll find that
things will get better. But don't waste time and no BS.

Ken

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waterotter

14 years ago

Originally Posted by KenThompson

Hey Gareth,

Sounds pretty uncool. You asked us what we think, so I'll offer
something for whatever it's worth.

I'm not of the same opinion as post #3. It is an incredible dilemma
what highly dysfunctional parents can cause for their children. On
the one hand the adult wants to pretty much take a baseball bat
to them. And on the other, most adults still love their parents.

But in my opinion the two-way dynamics of that love are unhealthy.

I would imagine that among other feelings you have some degree of
anger toward your mother. And I'm not asking because I want an
answer. That's your business. I do not see how anyone could not feel
some amount of anger toward someone who treated them like that. And
not only did that, but is largely responsible for all the emotional baggage
that treatment led to as an adult. All the dysfunctions that really don't
fully become manifest until adulthood.

So I'll just offer two things to think about:

If you do feel angry, I heartily recommend you forgive your mother with
no strings attached. It's not necessary to tell her directly unless you
feel you want/need to. Also, depending on where her head is, it may not
be received well; or she may not understand why you're doing it.

But you can still do it privately, and it still can go far toward dissolving
anger, hatred, resentment, etc. It may take time until you really mean it
if you do it. You may find that you can say it but not really mean it. So
be prepared to experience that possibility.

It's more important to forgive her for your own well-being than anything
else.

Secondly, you need to do what's best for you. Not your mother or anyone
else. I am not suggesting anything about any situations other than this one
with you. In your situation, and others that are very similar, I'll say you need
to do that.

It's normal to love or like someone, but for whatever reasons it's unhealthy
to be around them. You can still love your mother because you do, but that
doesn't mean you have to subject yourself to things that are harmful to you.

It may mean that you need to keep a distance from anyone else in your family
as well. Only you know best about that.

I'd recommend you spend your time and energy on healing yourself from what
happened. It may take the rest of your life, but don't let that discourage you
at all. There could very well be certain behaviors and deeply ingrained patterns
of thought that will always stay with you. But you can learn to deal with them
in a positive and healthy way.

No matter what, do not do nothing. Or, take action and work on yourself. The
best place to start is with yourself. Get to know yourself extremely well. Never
BS yourself about anything. If you do, you're on the path to self-deception and
no real progress or healing.

It's not easy, but the more attention you give toward healing, you'll find that
things will get better. But don't waste time and no BS.

Ken

Hey Gareth,

I don't know if Ken is a registered/practicing psychiatrist/psychotherapist and, or social worker, but the advice he has given you is invaluable. Take his advice and run with it.

I worked in Social Services for many years.....Ken's advice is worth it's weight in gold. I have seen the long-term affects that this kind of abuse has on children/adults. It's not fair, my heart breaks for you and everyone that suffers this abuse as a child. As an adult now, that's where you need to take control. Let go of any anger...this will take time, but it can be done.

If you continue to harbor any anger/hatred/resentment, it will be you that suffers in the long run...not your mother or anyone one else...just you. The rebound effects of your traumatic childhood etc. may come back to haunt you in the form of a heart attack or stroke, or a variety of other ailments. Why suffer premature paralysis or death at such a young age? It's not worth it.

Like Ken said "you have to heal yourself". It's worth it in the long run.

All the best to you,
waterotter

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derekwong28

14 years ago

Gareth, it had been 3 years since I made that post. I did suffer a major breakdown then, having to take a major tranquiliizer and to see a professor in psychology. It was almost certain that my mother had an extreme form of histrionic personality disorder which made it virtually impossible for her to get along with anybody close to her.

The psychologist whom I saw at that time did advised me to keep contact to a minimum, because it is almost impossible to avoid sparking off a major conflict. She told me to try to ignore whatever my mother says or do because my mother could not control herself because of her condition. Anyway, I started seeing my mother again, usually weekly with both my daughters. Right now, we are going through a difficult patch again and I had just taken some minor tranqualizers for a few days. I have lost count how many time she threatened to break off all contact.

I don't blame my mother fully for all that had happened. My father was an extremely selfish and uncaring person. There was infidelity as well and he was extremely mean. All he cared about was money and he gambled heavily and lost a lot in the stockmarket. In fact, he was almost convicted of manslaughter being involved in the death of 4 patients to whom he prescribed dangerous sedative (similar to Dr. Murray with Michael Jackson). Needless to say, they went through a bitter divorce and this is the main reason why my mother is so bitter. In the divorce settlement, my father only offerred to pay a minimal amount of child support and did not even ask for visitation rights. When my mother asked for an increase in child support, my father promptly refused. The trial judge stated that he will order my father to sell his Roll Royce that he had at that time if he continued to refuse paying child support. I have got a much worse relationship with my father than my mother.

I would actually advise you to keep the status quo. You may well hurt yourself much more by cutting yourself off from her entirely. Besides your younger sister could feel more isolated because of this. As the others have said earlier, it seems that you are still quite bothered about what happened 20 to 30 years ago. It is really best just to move on. I think writing a screenplay about what had happened would be by far the worse thing you can do.

Although there is no point in comparing misery, you must remember that I am in a much worse situation than you. For a start, this psychological mind games and emotional blackmail is still ongoing for me. In fact, I am getting worried that my daughters are being affected. The other day, my mother told my 6 year old daughter that she doesn't need a "rotten" granddaughter like her. Moroever, besides my mother, I have my equally insane father to contend with, plus that I have an autistic daughter to bring up. It is all thanks to my wife that I am still sane. This is why I would advise you to live in the present and take things as they come along.

Derek

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thunderbird

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

<snip> I think writing a screenplay about what had happened would be by far the worse thing you can do.

<snip>

Derek

Why do you think so? I have to also ask: If writing about one's life is such a bad idea, why're you doing so here?

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derekwong28

14 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

Why do you think so? I have to also ask: If writing about one's life is such a bad idea, why're you doing so here?

What I wrote here mainly concerns things that were happening to me right now or at that time, not what had happened years ago. In fact, it is the first time I ever wrote about my father and that was mainly to help Gareth.

In Gareth's case, you are talking about things that happened many years ago. If you keep on living in the past and relive all the bad moments, you will be consumed by it and have a very bad future. This is what has happened to my mother, she keeps on being consumed about her failed marriage.

I somehow doubt people who lost loved ones in 911 would want to write a screenplay or novel about it. Would they really want to relive every moment of that day, and would it be really be therapeutic for them?

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waterotter

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

I somehow doubt people who lost loved ones in 911 would want to write a screenplay or novel about it. Would they really want to relive every moment of that day, and would it be really be therapeutic for them?

Actually, it is VERY therapeutic.

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derekwong28

14 years ago

Originally Posted by waterotter

Actually, it is VERY therapeutic.

I doubt it, if my family got killed suddenly, I certainly won't want to relive those terrible moments everyday. This is certainly what I gathered when I read stories about people who lost loved ones in 911 and other major disasters. Maybe, it may work for some many years afterwards but not in the first few years following the event.

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waterotter

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

I doubt it, if my family got killed suddenly, I certainly won't want to relive those terrible moments everyday. This is certainly what I gathered when I read stories about people who lost loved ones in 911 and other major disasters. Maybe, it may work for some many years afterwards but not in the first few years following the event.

It's another way of expressing the pain/suffering that a person is enduring, just like Gareth and yourself have done so here. It's like talking, when you discuss these issues, more often than not, you feel better after doing so. When people "hide" their pain/suffering, there is a greater chance they will suffer ill/long term effects in the long run, be it a heart attack/stroke, or a variety of ailments brought on by stress etc. Dealing with traumatic issues early on benefits everyone. How you choose to deal with these issues is entirely a personal choice. Some methods of dealing with such issues are more effective than others.

p.s. Neuro-linguistic programming is an alternative source of treatment, though it is considered a controversial approach to psychotherapy. Point being, if it works for you, that's all that matters.

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thunderbird

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

<snip>
I somehow doubt people who lost loved ones in 911 would want to write a screenplay or novel about it. Would they really want to relive every moment of that day, and would it be really be therapeutic for them?

Maybe for some, it would be.

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derekwong28

14 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

Maybe for some, it would be.

Even it it is true for some people, just how much time do you think it will take to write a novel or screenplay, especially if the motive is not for profit. People have jobs and family to look after.

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thunderbird

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

Even it it is true for some people, just how much time do you think it will take to write a novel or screenplay, especially if the motive is not for profit. People have jobs and family to look after.

How long is a piece of string? I've written feature-lenghth screenplays within ten days. Others are years in the making.

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waterotter

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

Even it it is true for some people, just how much time do you think it will take to write a novel or screenplay, especially if the motive is not for profit. People have jobs and family to look after.

Money isn't everything. The motive here is to heal, not to make money. Health is far more important.

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waterotter

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

Although there is no point in comparing misery, you must remember that I am in a much worse situation than you. For a start, this psychological mind games and emotional blackmail is still ongoing for me. In fact, I am getting worried that my daughters are being affected. The other day, my mother told my 6 year old daughter that she doesn't need a "rotten" granddaughter like her. Moroever, besides my mother, I have my equally insane father to contend with, plus that I have an autistic daughter to bring up. It is all thanks to my wife that I am still sane. This is why I would advise you to live in the present and take things as they come along.

Derek

Derek, I don't mean to be rude, but who are you to make this kind of a judgement call? Only Gareth knows all the facts and truths in his case. He has chosen to share some of his story with us. Furthermore, I have to question your parenting abilities if you are subjecting your disabled daughter to that kind of environment.

Did your psychologist actually help you? :confused:

waterotter

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derekwong28

14 years ago

Originally Posted by waterotter

Derek, I don't mean to be rude, but who are you to make this kind of a judgement call? Only Gareth knows all the facts and truths in his case. He has chosen to share some of his story with us. Furthermore, I have to question your parenting abilities if you are subjecting your disabled daughter to that kind of environment.

Did your psychologist actually help you? :confused:

waterotter

I can't but I am trying to help Gareth. I am trying to make him feel better by suggesting that I am in a worse situation. Gareth was referring to me in the OP post, therefore I feel that I have to answer. Again, who are you to judge about my parenting ability since you do not my whole story either? It was my normal younger daughter who I was referring to. The pschologist did help, mainly in coming to terms with what may or may not happen.

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waterotter

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

I can't but I am trying to help Gareth. I am trying to make him feel better by suggesting that I am in a worse situation. Gareth was referring to me in the OP post, therefore I feel that I have to answer. Again, who are you to judge about my parenting ability since you do not my whole story either? It was my normal younger daughter who I was referring to. The pschologist did help, mainly in coming to terms with what may or may not happen.

Maybe supervised visitations with your mother would be more beneficial. From what you have wrote about your mother, it certainly not a healthy environment for any child.

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derekwong28

14 years ago

Originally Posted by waterotter

Maybe supervised visitations with your mother would be more beneficial. From what you have wrote about your mother, it certainly not a healthy environment for any child.

I am with my daughters when they visit, but it probably doesn't help much anyway. My mother just got much more extreme: she did not say this sort of horrible stuff when I was that age.

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gareth

14 years ago

Its strange.

I don't hate my mother but I don't love her either. By not hating her I no longer need to forgive her.

She actually doesn't deserve to be. Is she crazy or just nasty ?

I think she is just plain nasty & cruel. But she is an old woman and poses no threat to me.

She has however totally screwed the life of my younger sister and one of her daughters.

What can I do ?

As for the affect on me personally - I never suffer from depression. But I do have difficulty forming intimate relationships.

I think women sense my wariness & they misinterpret it.

I would never hurt a woman.

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seasoned

14 years ago

Originally Posted by gareth

Its strange.

I don't hate my mother but I don't love her either. By not hating her I no longer need to forgive her.

She actually doesn't deserve to be. Is she crazy or just nasty ?

I think she is just plain nasty & cruel. But she is an old woman and poses no threat to me.

She has however totally screwed the life of my younger sister and one of her daughters.

What can I do ?

As for the affect on me personally - I never suffer from depression. But I do have difficulty forming intimate relationships.

I think women sense my wariness & they misinterpret it.

I would never hurt a woman.

AGAIN, JOIN THE CLUB! You kind of echoed my feelings. As I said, my depression is more chemical. It isn't related to anything anyone did, or what I am currently going through.

And YEAH, I don't want to marry a ms jeckyl, and find a ms hyde, etc... I always talk about clam bake. I feel like presley did in the beginning. I guess I always hoped that, in the end, I would end up like HE did there.

Steve

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thunderbird

14 years ago

Originally Posted by gareth

<snip>
I ain't gunna rescue them - I'm not a shrink.

What do you guys think about it ? - I'm at the point where I'm gunna sever ties again.

You're writing here, so it seems to me that it is somehow therapeutic for you to do so. I would suggest, why not write a novel or screenplay based on your experiences. If it is a screenplay, remember that action and visuals are the primary components of a film. Check out the film Ordinary People.

Also, I hope it is ok to say this. I think that if you have the power and resources to rescue your sister and her daughter, you should. That's two human lives, two generations.

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thehobbster

14 years ago

Start a micro-niche site!!!!

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thunderbird

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

What I wrote here mainly concerns things that were happening to me right now or at that time, not what had happened years ago. In fact, it is the first time I ever wrote about my father and that was mainly to help Gareth.

In Gareth's case, you are talking about things that happened many years ago. If you keep on living in the past and relive all the bad moments, you will be consumed by it and have a very bad future. This is what has happened to my mother, she keeps on being consumed about her failed marriage.

I somehow doubt people who lost loved ones in 911 would want to write a screenplay or novel about it. Would they really want to relive every moment of that day, and would it be really be therapeutic for them?

It is hard to say what someone should do about their problems. For one person, maybe writing about things would consume them in scary ways and knock them over into a fiery abyss. For another, it can be highly therapeutic. The same applies to peanut butter -- for me, it is nourishing but my nephew is highly allergic to peanuts and eating just one peanut could kill him.

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thunderbird

14 years ago

Jerry, Jerry, Jerry!

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derekwong28 14 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

Jerry, Jerry, Jerry!

This is a very serious thread. Gareth, I and others here have gone through a lot. I respectfully request you to refrain from making fun out of this.
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thunderbird

14 years ago

I apologize if I offended you. For me, humor has helped in the challenges in my life.

But, I'll be serious. For perspective, imagine people in a worse situation than yours and how they feel:

Toxic legacy of US assault on Fallujah 'worse than Hiroshima' - Middle East, World - The Independent

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derekwong28

14 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

I apologize if I offended you. For me, humor has helped in the challenges in my life.

But, I'll be serious. For perspective, imagine people in a worse situation than yours and how they feel:

Toxic legacy of US assault on Fallujah 'worse than Hiroshima' - Middle East, World - The Independent

Don't worry about it. Gareth did participate in my thread a few years when I was in a horrible mental state and therefore I felt that it was time for me to reciprocate. As a qualified doctor, I do have some experience of persons with psychiartric and psychological problems other than myself.

I really have to say that psychiatric illnesses are by far the worse illnesses I have encountered, either personally or professionally. They are extremely depressing and unsettling to watch and many psychiatrists end up having problems themselves.

Derek

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SDenham

14 years ago

Reading this thread makes me think things weren't nearly as bad for me as I made them out to be.

I willl, however, share this with you. I severed ties with my family for five years. Not sure what prompted the split, but I was feeling rejected every time I spoke with my Mother, and when I saw her again, I had grown past the need for her approval.

Now, we have a healthy, distant relationship, and I can see her for the flawed, but perfect person that she is, and I don't need her approval for anything. Makes life much easier for me, and being away from her for five years didn't kill her or me.

Go for it, cut and carterize. Then go live a life you can be proud of.

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phsims

14 years ago

I grew up in a VERY similar situation, after my parents devoiced all my mother anger was directed at me (I was 7 at the time). I haven't spoken to the woman in years (I quick bothering with her after she went around telling people that she would take my son away from me if she didn't like how I raised him) and she hasn't seen my son since he was about 2.

My sister is very close to my mother (probably cause my sis is an alcoholic and my mother keeps her in drink). I have had my sister, my grandparents and even my uncle say what an awful person I am for refusing to have anything to do with my mother, but at the end of the day it wasn't any of them that tool the beatings or put up with the constant mental abuse (I was anorexic by 14 as she had me convinced i was fat).

U need to do what you think is best for yourself and your family, as for what anyone else things F$%K them, they didnt put up with the crap, why should they get a say?

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thunderbird

14 years ago

Originally Posted by phsims

<snip>
U need to do what you think is best for yourself and your family, as for what anyone else things F$%K them, they didnt put up with the crap, why should they get a say?

Absolutely!

(and that includes me.)

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NasalSpray

14 years ago

Sigh...

show them the care and concern...and its a happy family.

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soependi 14 years ago

really hard to comment, i never felt your experience...
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unbrokenspirit

14 years ago

I have no idea to share my family life especially my mother. I have too much problem too indeed

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Intrepreneur

14 years ago

Mothers like that have their own problems and is why they turn on their kids.

It shouldn't happen but unfortunately they're only human beings and ways of dealing with your problems can be very strange.

It's a cruel world as I say but the best part is getting on your feet and getting on with it. You can't change the past but you can the future.

Originally Posted by thunderbird

I apologize if I offended you. For me, humor has helped in the challenges in my life.

But, I'll be serious. For perspective, imagine people in a worse situation than yours and how they feel:

EXAMPLE:

YouTube- Face ripped off by a Bristolian...

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derekwong28

14 years ago

One must remember that our mothers are getting old. If something happens to them, feeling of anger and hurt could easily turn grief and remorse very quickly. That is why I prefer to take a pragmatic approach where possible. The problem about taking things much furhter could have unintended consequences that could come back and make things worse. For example, other close relatives and friends could be hurt if they know you are writing a book or screenplay.

For the record, my mother does love her grandchildren dearly. I am much more concerned about her spoiling them rather than suffering verbal abuse at the moment. These are still quite rare at the moment. What I am very dissapointed is that I got the feeling that I have been kicked here when I am down here. I found the remarks by waterotter especially cruel and insensitive.

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thunderbird

14 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

<snip> For example, other close relatives and friends could be hurt if they know you are writing a book or screenplay.<snip>

That would be true if...

1. The novel or screenplay was meant for publication rather than as a personal exercise...like writing a diary.
2. The screenplay or novel was not fiction, but a reanactment of actual events using real names. I gather that the fictional screenplay Taxi Driver was initially written primarily for therapeutic reasons.

Your whole reaction to the screenplay/novel thing is starting to make me wonder if cultural differences are coming into play here. At this point, I kind of wish I didn't bring it up.

Like it or hate it, the fact of the matter is, some people write because they find it has therapeutic value. I do regret saying anything hurtful to you. I actually kind of feel like I'm walking on eggshells writing this, since you're obviously very sensitive.

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KenThompson

14 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

Your whole reaction to the screenplay/novel thing is starting to make me wonder if cultural differences are coming into play here. At this point, I kind of wish I didn't bring it up.

Like it or hate it, the fact of the matter is, some people write because they find it has therapeutic value. I do regret saying anything hurtful to you. I actually kind of feel like I'm walking on eggshells writing this, since you're obviously very sensitive.

I was wondering the same thing about differences with cultural attitudes. On the
other hand, I don't think you did anything wrong with suggesting it. And I don't
feel there is anything wrong with writing about it.

In Asia, there is the cultural belief and concept of saving face, and it is considered
extremely rude to cause someone to lose face.

Anyone from Asia reading this, feel free to add or clarify what I just said.

Mr. Wong, there are obvious differences going on in this thread, and I don't feel
that anyone has kicked you when you are down. But, the only thing that matters,
to you, is what you choose to feel.

What you choose to feel. Never mind about a person's intentions, good or ill -
accurately perceived or mistaken; what you choose to feel.

I think it would serve you well to understand and bear in mind that you're talking
to (mainly) people in North America. Pardon for anyone else living elsewhere. I
didn't check locations of everyone who posted.

Generally... people in the West approach matters differently, and they will offer
you their opinions. You're discussing highly personal matters in an open forum;
much moreso (referencing quantitative and not qualitative) than the OP who
only made a passing reference to you.

So perhaps you could serve yourself well by realizing and understanding that
you are opening yourself to comments, opinions, and/or suggestions that you
may not like or want to hear. I do not believe anyone, in this thread at least,
would purposely make comments designed or intended to be malicious or
without appropriate feelings.

If you are extremely sensitive to remarks you do not like or want to hear, then
perhaps a little more discretion on your part may be in order. But - that is just
a suggestion.

If you feel my comments are negative or otherwise insensitive toward you, then
that is your perception which you are free to hold. My comments are intended
to be as objective as possible and are neutral in feelings.

Ken

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derekwong28

14 years ago

Ken, Thunderbird, it was not the idea of Novel of Screenplay that was upsetted me. It was the way I was challenged, especially the tone of the posts that were often patronizing and judgemental. The main intention of my post was to help Gareth, I really just didn't expect to be attacked in return. I was particularly unhappy about #15 that had nothing to do with a screenplay / novel, but which questioned my parenting ability. In fact, in that post it was clear the author knew it was rude. Just how you feel if you hear "not meaning to insult you, but you are a truely ugly piece of work!"

I am having pretty bad problems myself right now at the moment. Anybody involves in counselling knows that you do not do things to upset the patient whether he is right or not, because you can push him over the edge. Moeover, it is best to lead the patient to reach the decision himself. Each person is very different there is no one approach that is completely right or wrong. Sometimes, it is completely possible for a treatment to make things worse as it happened with my autistic daughter recently. I am certainly not an expert in psychiarty but I have done enough in my medical traning to know that each case is different and there is no one fit all approach.

I don't think there are actually cultural differences involved, because kiss and tell, washing all your dirty linen in public and Jerry Springer stuff are very common in Hong Kong now as well. Our media here are much less restraint than those in the US and UK. What I don't like when I see this kind of stuff is that a lot of other people are hurt. But again, I emphasize that it is not the novel / screenplay idea that upsetted me.

Ken, what you wrote in post #6 was completely right and this is what I am trying to do. I can't find that thread a few years ago but essentially, I suffered a pretty bad nervous breakdown after my mother threatened to break off all relations over a very trivial matter. She wanted a maid whom she had hired to work a our place for a few months but my wife refused fearing that the maid would be used as a spy.

Derek

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seasoned

14 years ago

derekwong28,

She usually seems nice, but ANYONE can make a mistake.

And maybe she doesn't realize that you can't just cut your mother out of the picture. HECK, it is often WORSE and HARDER in asian cultures! And I have been pretty open about MY problems with my mother.

And ****PLEASE**** don't think "Jerry springer" is normal for americans. He is some jerk that basically decided to have a FREAK SHOW on TV.

As for me, I SERIOUSLY am one of the ones that is like the indians are said to have once spoken about. An old saying attributed to "american indians" is that you can't TRULY understand one until you "Walk a Mile in his Moccasins"! My life has had MANY ups and downs and I can tell you that most are VERY uncommon.

Steve

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Kay King

14 years ago

Cultural differences exist - and everyone in the thread should respect that. However, I don't see anyone being insulted here intentionally.

Personally, I can't imagine an adult allowing themselves to be controlled by their parent. You set the limits for involvement with your mother and your siblings. If they can't respect your right to your lifestyle and threaten to cut off contact - that is their choice to make. Such a threat is usually a last effort to regain control of you. If it works, they'll do it again next time.

Cultures are changing and it's likely your mothers are rooted in their own past. You make allowances for that. You can show respect and love and also keep some distance if you have the courage to set and enforce your boundaries. The alternative leads to resentment, emotional problems and guilt.

Grandparents are made to spoil grandchildren - but they don't have the same effect on your children they had on you as a child. They don't have that level of control because you are now the parent and your children look to you for guidance.

We don't get do-overs for childhood - or for life. Writing things down (whether the writing is ever seen by others or not) is therapeutic for some people - but for others it bonds them to the past. Mistreatment in childhood can cause emotional problems for adults - but it is a choice to allow the angst to continue or put it behind you and live your own life.

My own mother once hired a "cleaning lady" to come to my house twice a week - I fired the lady when she first appeared. My mother was angry - but that was her problem, not mine. She tried the guilt trip - didn't work. She threatened to cut off contact and I told her that was her choice. If she remained in my life she would respect my family and my choices. It was hard because our mothers make us feel like a child even when we are all grown up. They can only do that if we buy into the drama they create.

Though culture plays a role, relinquishing control of your adult life to a parent is a choice you make....or perhaps a choice you avoid making. At the same time, you can't control the parent, either, and your siblings have to make their own choices.

kay

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seasoned

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

Cultural differences exist - and everyone in the thread should respect that. However, I don't see anyone being insulted here intentionally.

Personally, I can't imagine an adult allowing themselves to be controlled by their parent. You set the limits for involvement with your mother and your siblings. If they can't respect your right to your lifestyle and threaten to cut off contact - that is their choice to make. Such a threat is usually a last effort to regain control of you. If it works, they'll do it again next time.

Easier said than done. My mother came to help out when I had my dissected aorta, and got my key. She ended up trespassing in the worst way. If she didn't have a key, I could just call the cops and have her thrown in jail. Ironic that she ended up getting locked up because of calls SHE made. ALSO, many asian cultures are supposed to care for and respect the elderly members of the family.

My own mother once hired a "cleaning lady" to come to my house twice a week - I fired the lady when she first appeared. My mother was angry - but that was her problem, not mine. She tried the guilt trip - didn't work. She threatened to cut off contact and I told her that was her choice. If she remained in my life she would respect my family and my choices. It was hard because our mothers make us feel like a child even when we are all grown up. They can only do that if we buy into the drama they create.

Tell me about it! MY mother hired a person that was basically supposed to help me out with basic things, take me out for things, get things, etc... I had STITCHES, just had a major operation, etc... She came in ****SICK**** and I got sick. That was enough to make me tell her I never wanted to see her again.

My mother EVEN wanted to be on my hipaa release form. NO THANKS! BESIDES, it has to be updated every month where I live.

Steve

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Kay King 14 years ago

If she didn't have a key

OK, she came to help - but why didn't you change the locks after the helpfulness was over?:p

Easier said than done.

Isn't that true of everything? We make choices to make changes, solve problems or tolerate what is happening around us and to us.

kay
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- seasoned 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Kay King
  
  OK, she came to help - but why didn't you change the locks after the helpfulness was over?:p
  
  I shouldn't have had to! ALSO, that WAS problematic. I am typically there for like a day and a half. I actually bought a KIT to do it MYSELF! Sadly, it was not 100% clear. I even took the lock to a locksmith, and he struggled with it a LONG time before he got it done.
  
  Oh well, NOW it is DONE, I rekeyed almost every other lock, etc...! I even built up a kit such that I could rekey practically the whole neighborhood if I wanted!
  
  BTW the Titan series now has locks that can EASILY be rekeyed. Unfortunately, there is a **************MAJOR*************** flaw! There is NO reason to rekey the lock unless someone has the old key. ANYONE that has an old key can EASILY rekey the lock!
  SO, I couldn't even go THAT route.
  
  She TRIED to get back in, but I told her NO WAY! I changed the locks, and I am not giving ANYONE the key!
  
  Isn't that true of everything? We make choices to make changes, solve problems or tolerate what is happening around us and to us.
  
  Yep, but it is still not easy. And it doesn't matter WHO the person is. My mother obviously has a lot of problems, but she can charm the neighboors, and may even call the police, EVEN 911, and twist facts to get something done. Sometimes she amazes me. THAT is why I NEVER formalized anything, NEVER actually accepted money, recorded phone calls, researched renter whatever, researched homestead rights, etc... If we were still in California, what she did could have meant real trouble. Luckily, in Indiana, it didn't get her to first base.
  
  BTW ironically, she has been locked up since about a week before I changed the locks. But there are plenty of people there that know what she is like, and that she is supposed to stay there, so they aren't letting her out.
  
  Steve
  
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  Kay King 14 years ago
  
  Of course, it's not easy. Often the person who causes the most problems in any family is the one who can also be the most charming when it suits them.
  
  It can be unpleasant, it can be hurtful, you may feel guilt. However, there is also a sense of relief. The relief can occur even when you've made a small change. If you've limited the visits, or the shouting and insults, that can be enough to ease the stress.
  
  We can't control family members but we can remove ourselves from their influence and we can control how we react to their antics. No one said it would be easy but sometimes it's necessary to protect our own emotional welfare.
  
  kay
  
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soulravager

14 years ago

Originally Posted by gareth

I remember a couple of years ago there was a thread from a guy in Hong Kong with a cruel domineering Mother who was deliberately destroying his marriage.

We discussed our shared experience about abuse as children etc.

My mother had seven kids, some were raised in Rhodesia in the 60's but my folks moved to New Zealand before I was born.

Mother was a Kiwi and father a pom.

Anyway our mother always beat the hell out of us. We all would get 2-3 beatings a week.
But worse than that was constant incessant screaming, nagging and verbal abuse.

I mean screaming at full volume like a drill sergeant.

If you can imagine getting up each morning to an hour of abusive brow beating, then returning later to another 2-3 hours of screaming and nagging with the possibility of a physical beating at any moment.

It was pure hell living with that woman.

Anyway now she is 74 or there abouts. None of my elder brothers and sisters have anything to do with her.

Our dad is dead by the way and my parents divorced many years ago.

I am second youngest & my younger sister stayed with my mother - she ain't too bright.

My evil mother has manipulated and twisted my sister and her daughter to the point where she now has them both on medication and diagnosed with psych problems.

This is because she wants somebody to care for her in her old age.

I know this sounds weird - but that is what she has done. If they were to stay away from the abuse from this old crow there would be nothing wrong with them.

I ain't gunna rescue them - I'm not a shrink.

What do you guys think about it ? - I'm at the point where I'm gunna sever ties again.

I don't mean to sound like an asshole but your mother was one crazy b*tch and you should be glad you are far away from her. Only thing you can do is get her into a retired people home so your sister can have a chance to get better(mentaly)... Well not everyone can be normal.
There are just some plain EVIL people. Now stop thinking about this and continue making cash online

And be sure you don't turn out to be like her instead you should try to be a great father take your kids out for ice-cream, visit theme parks etc make sure you make up with their childhood for yours(Have fun WITH them)

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sloanjim

14 years ago

It's a shame there isn't a means test before some people become parents..shows how some people lack basic emotional intelligence and should not have been allwoed to have children. If I had a poision parent like that they would jhave been history as soon as i turned 16..luckily I never had to deal with anything like tnat.

BUT you must take 100% responsibilty now and move on.

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seasoned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by sloanjim

BUT you must take 100% responsibilty now and move on.

Sounds easy, but the only way I could be unaffected would be to write her off. I have all but done that at this point. I ACTUALLY had verizon BAN her number, after my phone beeped after she left a message at 5am. I ALREADY had disabled direct calling. It is free for 90 days but after they want $5 a month extra if you want to continue.

Normally I would have sympathy for her, but she keeps trying to work herself into my life, and involves me as a player, main contact number, etc...

Steve
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gareth

14 years ago

OK I didn't come back here for a while.

First I must say if you have not been in this situation there is no way you will really understand.

Second I already said I don't hate the woman - when I was a teen and was dependent upon her (had to live with her) I hated her.

Now I can simply choose to avoid her - which is what I will do.

Funny I remember when she was my age and her own mother wanted to be close to her she was very cruel and unkind to my grandmother.

Anyway I have done nothing unkind to her so my conscience is clear.

But she is very cunning and devious - thats why I must avoid her & why my siblings do also.

Truly if I hated this woman I would smack her with a baseball bat.

But I am mentally healthy & know that I must avoid people and circumstances that are unhealthy.

As for why would I post about such a personal thing ? Well I guess its because the situation for my sister & her child is so weird.

My sister has always been dumb. But she has been in many bad relationships, got raped by her ex, boyfriend recently committed suicide, and all along she clings to our abusive mother.

Her daughter is worse, she phoned the cops & told them she had molested a toddler, she was already on medication when this happened, then she was placed on ebail - with guess who as custodian - grandma.

So the whole thing is totally crazy & I just want to steer well clear.