How Do You Stop Worrying?

14 years ago

Faust said "We weep for what we may never lose".

If you worry about everything - it sounds like anxiety attacks to me. Sometimes it helps to look closely at your thought patterns....

When you start to worry about someone's health, or your business or your car, or.....

Examine what your thinking is. Write it down - exactly what do you worry will happen? Realistically, is there any reason to feel anxious? Do you have any control over what happens in the future? Much of the time, what we call "worry" is simple fear - and once you admit to yourself you are afriad, it loses its power over you.

If that doesn't work, get meds

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KimW

14 years ago

Steven, I could name a dozen ways right off the bat,but reality is you just do it.
As cliche as this sounds, there is almost always someone worse off than you.Remember the saying, "I cried because I had no shoes,then I saw a man with no feet."

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ThomM

14 years ago

Originally Posted by KimW

Steven, I could name a dozen ways right off the bat,but reality is you just do it.
As cliche as this sounds, there is almost always someone worse off than you.Remember the saying, "I cried because I had no shoes,then I saw a man with no feet."

Which is why I watch The Jerry Springer Show every morning.
After an hour of that you realize no matter what, you're life isn't that bad.
When things get bad I just remind myself that at least I'm not on Springer. It tends to put things in place for me

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HeySal

14 years ago

When you find yourself worrying and picturing bad things happening - those thoughts and images can lodge themselves into your subconscious mind as truth and you will start to go back to those thoughts repeatedly.

When you worry about something, the first thing you need to do is call yourself silly for thinking of something so crazy -- it's best this kind of stuff gets lodged in your head as rejected nonsense. Then think of something good instead and ask yourself why would I think that nonsense when THIS is the truth. Your subconscious will also hold that message as truth and enough truths like that and your head will clear out a bit.

Also - if this is a condition that started when your mother passed or during some other event, you are just reacting to a trauma. Sometimes when people have their security upended they will even get a fear of the dark for awhile. Knowing that you are reacting to a bad event can go a long way to quelling the reaction.

If it's ongoing and you can't stop it, get some counseling and maybe talking your problem out with someone will allow you to find the source and kick it out of your head.

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daleron

14 years ago

TURN IT INTO MUSIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

............

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King Shiloh

Banned 14 years ago

Steven,

Each time you want to get worried, look at yourself in the mirror and ask yourself this simple question:

"Steven, what have you positively added to your life, family, career and business by being worried?"

I know the answer would be NOTHING.

By the way, I'm happy you know you have a problem because some people have a problem but they don't know and they are not ready to know.

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Andie

14 years ago

Steve,
Maybe try finding a hypnosis tape that is focused on the 'worry' or 'confidence' issue...let it play as you go to sleep every night. It may/may not take some time to see results, but it is likely to ease the 'worry anxiety' issue even if it doesn't completely eliminate it. can easily d/l for ipod or whatever

Also try making a nightly note of the 'positive' in your life (5 a day works well) so your focus can begin to shift to those things rather than the negative.

kinda nice to know the big-guns worry too (sorry about that!)

Andie

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thunderbird

14 years ago

Have you tried self-hypnosis? A friend of mine found that 5 htp helped.

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yukon

Banned 14 years ago

[DELETED]

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King Shiloh Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by yukon

Sounds like you need a vacation!

Them, he has to go on vacation for God-knows-how-long considering the fact that he's worried about things almost all the time.
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KenThompson

14 years ago

Steve,

I lived most of my life worrying about everything under
the sun. I don't worry about anything, anymore, and
that's the truth.

Kim mentioned that you just do it. I agree with that but
also feel it's easier said than done. I was able to just do
it, but it took me a long time to be able to just do it.

I was aware for a long time that I worried too much, and
I worked to eliminate it.

But what really worked for me is things got so bad that I
just felt like I had done all I could and couldn't possibly do
anymore. This was some years ago. I was unbelievably tired
of worrying, feeling afraid, etc.

That is when I did what was suggested and just did it.
And for some reason it has stuck. There is more to it that has
to do with spiritual things. I wouldn't mind mentioning it to
you but it's no one elses business.

There's the idea of faith. I ask for help with something, and then
offer my gratitude knowing that I'll receive what I need.

There are a number of things that are a part of it. So it's not as
simple as just doing it, although that is kind of how it felt. But a
whole lot of things went into it and are a part of it.

Also much has to do with your perspective. It's the kind of thing you
have to work out for yourself, I think.

Hope that helped some. Ask to be shown how to stop worrying in
a way that is best for you. Then expect to be shown and pay
attention. Don't forget to offer thanks and gratitude for the help.

Ken

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Bill Farnham

14 years ago

Steven,

I learned a long time ago to outsource all my worries. I simply find someone who is good at worrying and have them add all my worries to their basket.

The trick is to find someone really good at it.

Just sent you a PM.

~Bill

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KenThompson

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Bill Farnham

Steven,

I learned a long time ago to outsource all my worries. I simply find someone who is good at worrying and have them add all my worries to their basket.

The trick is to find someone really good at it.

Just sent you a PM.

~Bill

Bill...

I'll take care of your worries for you. No problem. But... lol

It's a forced continuity for life thing. Another one of those things
I sometimes mention.

So, here's the deal...

$1 7 day all you can worry extravaganza. Sort of a worry-fest, but
not to be confused with festering worries or sores. (ew)

After the 7 day stress bonanza is over, you'll be billed a mere $97.77
per week. As you well know, Bill, expert worriers are almost impossible
to find. So I know you'll see right away, if not sooner, that this is a
complete steal.

It's almost like you're taking complete advantage of me. But other than
Kurt, perhaps, there's no one else I'd rather be taken advantage by. lol

Got that?

Oh, scarcity. Right. Ok, well, this offer expires at midnight, but if you miss
it you can still enroll tomorrow. Also, limited service areas, but I'm sure
no matter where you are we can fit you in.

Let me know, babe.

All the best.

Ken

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Doug

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

So, any recommendations on how to stop worrying?

Books?

Thanks for your help.

Steven,
Albert Ellis wrote good material on changing behavior. Boiling it all down...Behavior is based on emotion stemming from thought.

Ellis taught that by changing the way you think you change the way you "feel" which then changes how you behave.

Google Albert Ellis and Rational Emotive Behavioral Therapy

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magill

14 years ago

Do you get that now you are worrying about worrying?

Thomas Leonard used to say "90% of what killed me never happened."
Anytime you/we go out into the future and find something that hasn't happened - and likely will never happen -and bring it back to the present moment, we experience fear and call it worry.

I recommend you check out your local library for a book or CD by Pema Chodron. She has a book that speaks specifically about fear - which is at the core of worry. If your library doesn't have anything of Pema's to borrow, go to Amazon and buy a copy. I think you will find what you're looking for in her writings. In the meantime, do some deep breathing and "focus on the out breath."

Be good to yourself...

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pickthat apple 14 years ago

Originally Posted by magill

[...]
Thomas Leonard used to say "90% of what killed me never happened."

I so like this sentence - it explains it all in a few words.
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whateverpedia

14 years ago

This sums it all up pretty well.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

As our resident "music-head", I figured you'd get more out of a musical reply than an in-depth psychoanalytical response.

All that aside, I think daleron's response is worth considering.

You're a songwriter, so put your worries to music.

It worked for John Lennon, Roger Waters and many others.

And of course, don't forget to post the results in here.

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CDarklock

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Nobody

Snap a rubber band on your wrist when you have undesirable thoughts

This is called "aversion therapy." It is productively used for many things, from anxiety to anger management to smoking cessation.

It also has one major drawback.

I once dated a woman who had formerly dated a child molester. Her ex came by one day with a rubber band on his wrist. When he left, she explained to me that if you ever see someone with a rubber band on his wrist? He's either a child molester or a rapist.

You see, when a violent sex offender is on probation or parole and sent to therapy, and they really honestly can't get him to stop having his inappropriate impulses... they put him on aversion therapy.

I can't say for sure how many people in the world have this association, but I for one am not going to be snapping any rubber bands on my wrist in public anytime soon.

EDIT: The individual who recommended aversion therapy is terribly, terribly upset about being "lumped in with child molesters." :rolleyes: For his sake, I have removed his name, restated his post so it doesn't quote any of his distinctive speech patterns, and added the underlined statement to clarify that all sorts of totally normal and productive people use aversion therapy without being any sort of dangerous sexual deviants.

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KenThompson

14 years ago

Originally Posted by CDarklock

I can't say for sure how many people in the world have this association, but I for one am not going to be snapping any rubber bands on my wrist in public anytime soon.

Preemptive strike...

Kurt? Careful being seen in public.

Ken

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Bill Farnham

14 years ago

Originally Posted by CDarklock

EDIT: The individual who recommended aversion therapy is terribly, terribly upset about being "lumped in with ....

Can't say I blame him. When you search using someone's name and that pops up.....YEEEEEEEEEEEEEZZZZOOOOOOWEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!

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CDarklock

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Bill Farnham

Can't say I blame him. When you search using someone's name and that pops up.....YEEEEEEEEEEEEEZZZZOOOOOOWEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!

Hey, maybe it's me, but if someone is searching "[your name] child molester" on Google... I'd say you already have a pretty big PR problem.

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KenThompson 14 years ago

Originally Posted by CDarklock

Hey, maybe it's me, but if someone is searching "[your name] child molester" on Google... I'd say you already have a pretty big PR problem.

No, it ain't you. All in all, it was a bit of an oopsie.

Ken
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Alexa Smith Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by CDarklock

maybe it's me, but if someone is searching "[your name] child molester" on Google... I'd say you already have a pretty big PR problem.

Your Page-Rank would be the least of your problems, I'd think ...
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- KenThompson 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Alexa Smith
  
  Your Page-Rank would be the least of your problems, I'd think ...
  
  Oh geez, Smith, come on. He's talking about press releases.
  
  Ken
  
  Thanks
  
  1 reply
  
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  Trace 14 years ago
  
  Steve,
  
  Read the book " How to Stop Worrying and Start Living" by Dale Carnegie.
  
  Thanks
  
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Paul Myers

14 years ago

Originally Posted by CDarklock

Hey, maybe it's me, but if someone is searching "[your name] child molester" on Google... I'd say you already have a pretty big PR problem.

Okay. This has gone beyond ridiculous.

First you relate the story of a friend, and do so in a way that seems to give credence to the idea that the rubber band means "child molester." Which means you may well have planted that idea in someone's mind and caused some other innocent person to be viewed that way based on using the technique to stop some perfectly harmless habit.

You then pretend that you don't know that it only takes searching on a name and reading all the results in order for someone to make that leap.

Then you act as though it's wrong for the guy to not want that kind of thing associated with his name when it can be helped.

More than anything else in here in a year or more, those comments make me believe that the best thing Allen could do for this forum as a whole is to simply delete the off topic section.

Paul

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CDarklock

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Then you act as though it's wrong for the guy to not want that kind of thing associated with his name when it can be helped.

What I think is wrong is when people get on the internet, get involved in a conversation, and then say "I regret being in this conversation. Please amend the record to conceal my involvement."

Can it be helped? Yes. Should it? No.

That's the last time I edit a post for someone else's comfort. I tried to be nice, it was against my better judgment, and henceforth it will not happen.

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Bill Farnham

14 years ago

Originally Posted by CDarklock

What I think is wrong is when people get on the internet, get involved in a conversation, and then say "I regret being in this conversation. Please amend the record to conceal my involvement."

Can it be helped? Yes. Should it? No.

That's the last time I edit a post for someone else's comfort. I tried to be nice, it was against my better judgment, and henceforth it will not happen.

Caliban,

It's just as easy to trip over your principles as it is to stand on them.

Mike's choice to want his name removed from the context of the conversation only points to his ability to grasp how the internet works, both as a tool for construction as well as destruction.

Your equating his long time use of a technique to that which is associated with the worst societal scurvy was an unfortunate twist that was also unnecessary. Your personal bias on the technique, and the matter of fact way you stated it, would make any reasonable person wonder how their words could be so grossly used to paint themselves in the same light as what you were suggesting.

He got involved in a converstaion that was entirely different than the conversation that evolved once that turd dropped on the table. To chastise him for not wanting to have any association with this thread once it took a left turn is dumbfounding from my perspective.

You're an incredibly intelligent person. That much is obvious. What is also obvious is that you haven't been able to couple your talents with an equal dose of wisdom. Wisdom comes from self evaluation, among other things, not from standing on principles. This might be a good time to step back and look at how this situation unfolded and ask yourself what the lessons truly are here.

I just don't see that happening, and I also think you're more than capable of doing that. It's an internal choice, to be sure...

~Bill

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MikeAmbrosio

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Bill Farnham

Caliban,

It's just as easy to trip over your principles as it is to stand on them.

Mike's choice to want his name removed from the context of the conversation only points to his ability to grasp how the internet works, both as a tool for construction as well as destruction.

Your equating his long time use of a technique to that which is associated with the worst societal scurvy was an unfortunate twist that was also unnecessary. Your personal bias on the technique, and the matter of fact way you stated it, would make any reasonable person wonder how their words could be so grossly used to paint themselves in the same light as what you were suggesting.

He got involved in a converstaion that was entirely different than the conversation that evolved once that turd dropped on the table. To chastise him for not wanting to have any association with this thread once it took a left turn is dumbfounding from my perspective.

You're an incredibly intelligent person. That much is obvious. What is also obvious is that you haven't been able to couple your talents with an equal dose of wisdom. Wisdom comes from self evaluation, among other things, not from standing on principles. This might be a good time to step back and look at how this situation unfolded and ask yourself what the lessons truly are here.

I just don't see that happening, and I also think you're more than capable of doing that. It's an internal choice, to be sure...

~Bill

The Ignore feature is a wonderful tool in many ways. But unfortunately when you quote the person I have ignored I get to read the post anyway...LOL.

Irregardless I want to thank you for hitting the nail right on the head in a much more eloquent way than I would have had I posted over the past weekend. Which is why I stayed away until now. In fact I would not have even posted this except for the latest comment...so now I will.

The way my words were twisted was unlike anything I experienced here on this forum before. I'll say that Mr. Darklock has a remarkable skill in that department.

But he also revealed a LOT about himself to me during our extended PM session between Saturday and Sunday. I can tell you that I am no longer all that impressed with his, oh, what's a good word here... communicative skills as I once was.

He no longer has to worry about editing anything from me. I have no intention of interacting with him at all, considering how skilled he is at twisting the truth for his own purpose. Whatever they may be. From where I sit it seems it was for no more than his own enjoyment...who knows. And frankly, I don't care.

I never claimed to be perfect. I have said a great number of things on this and MANY forums in my 10 years on line. And I always stand behind what I state.

This is not one of those cases. I didn't want MY comment removed or edited. I wanted my name removed from someone else's comments. Period.

I work very hard to maintain a solid reputation on line. The internet is my living, not some self ego-inflating hobby as it is for many. And in my view, the post I was DRAGGED into was one that I did not want or need my name attached to.

I don't think Mr. Darklock is stupid. I think he knows 100% what my beef is.

I made a simple request - not demand... REQUEST. He chose to take it down the path he did...and I still can't figure out why. Some perceived "honesty" thing apparently...

But also trying to infer I had some sinister thing to hide was just cheap. Very cheap. Considering what he revealed to me, I would argue he potentially has more to hide. Right CD? You know what they say when people start off a conversation with "You know, I have this friend..."

I know I can be a wise-ass. I have said things to people I wish I could take back. But at the same time I also know how quickly a reputation can be destroyed and take pains not to do that to others. I don't lie, I don't steal and I don't make people look like some sinister person with a questionable history...

But I hope this person realizes that this doesn't mean I COULDN'T. I will only be pushed so far. You can take that to the bank.

I am now done with this thread. Case closed. In the past. I am always about moving forward. It's my choice now to do just that.

And Paul - as always, thanks. I am sure I got just a TINY taste of the crap you put up with daily. I could NEVER be a moderator here.

Mike

Edit:
Steve - please don't be sorry you started this thread. You have something valid that you were looking for answers for. None of this was your fault. You are a solid contributor and I have a great deal of respect for you.

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Steven Wagenheim

14 years ago

Originally Posted by MikeAmbrosio

The Ignore feature is a wonderful tool in many ways. But unfortunately when you quote the person I have ignored I get to read the post anyway...LOL.

.
.
.

Edit:
Steve - please don't be sorry you started this thread. You have something valid that you were looking for answers for. None of this was your fault. You are a solid contributor and I have a great deal of respect for you.

Mike, I've just gone back through this whole thread and I don't see where
you had made any previous posts. Perhaps they were removed. I don't
know.

Quite honestly, I am totally dumbfounded as to what just happened here.

It was like I walked into a shopping mall and got greeted by a team of
oozy toting grasshoppers.

I'm sorry if you got dragged into this with something you said and I'm
sorry if it caused you any problems. I don't know what else to say because
my confusion level on this thread is beyond anything I've ever experienced
in my life, seriously. I feel like somebody just told the world's funniest joke
and I totally missed the punchline.

Anyway, I'll think more carefully about the kinds of things I post here. I
agree with Paul on one thing.

This sub forum needs to be seriously sanitized.

And I had no cavities today at my dental checkup...something else I was
worried about for nothing.

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Bill Farnham

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

Quite honestly, I am totally dumbfounded as to what just happened here.

Steven, in the words of that famous philosopher Pogo, "We have met the enemy and he is us."

I don't think a single person here would have predicted the unfortunate way this thread unfolded. It is ironic that the topic was worries, either real or imagined. Who'd a thunk...

Glad your check up had such good results. Now, if we could just get those cavities between our ears checked out...

Mike,

Thanks for that response, and sorry you had to see that referrenced part of the conversation. Fwiw, I was aware of you as an internet marketer before I was aware of the WF and I've always held you in the highest regard. I hope this episode does not deprive us of your good company here. I always enjoy your posts and have especially enjoyed the limited interaction I've had with you here. All the best to you.

~Bill

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MikeAmbrosio

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Bill Farnham

Mike,

Thanks for that response, and sorry you had to see that referrenced part of the conversation. Fwiw, I was aware of you as an internet marketer before I was aware of the WF and I've always held you in the highest regard. I hope this episode does not deprive us of your good company here. I always enjoy your posts and have especially enjoyed the limited interaction I've had with you here. All the best to you.

~Bill

I gave it serious consideration over the weekend, but in reality I like it here

Not to worry about seeing the post. I chose to ignore NOT so I wouldn't read and feel insulted or anything. It was more to help me keep my own damn mouth shut

And thanks for the compliment. I don't market as much as I used to (on line). Much of my business is now off line. I have a good time...

Mike

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Pauline60

14 years ago

I am a worrier by nature but have managed to get it under reasonable control in two ways -

First - a few years back I listened to a self help tape , can't remember who it was by. He put forward a technique for managing worry which was this - when you start to worry about something and its on your mind all the time don't try to stop worrying altogether, instead tell yourself that you will set aside time to worry about it later. I was very surprised to find that this actually worked - by telling myself that I woud worry about it later I freed myself from worring about it now. My mind was able to accept the idea and I found that I instantly started to worry far less.

Secondly, when something bad happens or seems about to happen I think about far worse things that happen to people, in order to get some perspective. Like when someone damaged my car and drove off, leaving me with a bill to pay I was very upset. Then I reminded myself that only the car was damaged, none of my children were hurt, and I could afford to pay the bill. Somehow it didn't seem so bad compared to what could have happened.

Another thing which I think has helped me to stop worrying so much is that a few years ago, when my then youngest child was three, I had a serious health scare. All turned out well in the end and since then I have found that I worry less about things which, in the end, don't really matter all that much.

Pauline

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Izwarrior

14 years ago

I understand exactly what you are going through. I know the relentless suffering of which you speak. I have been that way all my life. I have spent the last ten years developing something that really works in the trenches and has been beta tested succesfully with dozens of my clients. I am Native american and it is inspired from teachings of my tribe. I would be glad to share this with you. If it works for you and you have internet marketing knowledge perhaps you can help me share it with others. PM me if your interested. Miigwetch.... Iz

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Nicola Lane

14 years ago

Firstly, congratulations! You have already leaped the first giant hurdle – realising that you have a problem and that your worries are mostly monsters under the bed.

So here are a few suggestions that you can try:

When you realise that your train of thought is a “worry” – change your environment (internal or external). The idea is to “move away” from the worry. Some examples,

• If you are sitting at your desk working – then get up and do something different like make a cup of coffee, or take a quick stroll into your garden to get a breath of fresh air.
• As you are a musician you could try picking up an instrument and playing a piece of music that you have to think about to get right.
• Allow yourself five minutes to look at a nonsense website (I like LOL cats!)
• Put on some music that is uplifting for you – or that you just have to sing along to.

Something else that may prove helpful is to keep a “worry” journal. When you realise that you are worrying make a note in your journal – what you were worrying about, what you were doing when you started worrying and what brought the worry on/what you were doing just before you started worrying.

There are three aims here
1. Reassuring yourself that your worries don’t come true
2. Identifying something that will trigger a worry session
3. Finding out if you have any particular persistent worries

Once you know that your worries don’t come true that on its own will help.

Once you have identified a trigger you can do something about it!

The next technique is often useful to reduce the impact of persistent worries – but needs to be used with caution as it can sometimes backfire!

Allow yourself to imagine that your worry could come true – now think about what you would do to deal with it, and also think about things that you can do now (or put in place now) that will alleviate your concerns. Some examples:

• You have a bad business month – will one bad month kill you financially? Have you ever had a bad month before – what did you do then? Would you be able to analyse your business so that in future you could do more of what is working and less of what isn’t? Can you diversify so that if one major component of your business crashes you can still work other components?
• Assume that your PC has just crashed – Do you still have a dinosaur computer in the house – or a silly netbook, so that you can still access your most vital things and tell people your PC has crashed? Do you have the funds available or room on a credit card to be able to go out and buy a new PC. Have you got a backup routine for all your critical stuff?

Sometimes worries are simply the fear that if disaster happens we would not be able to cope – so if you have already thought about it, put sensible precautions in place and made a few mental plans then the worry should recede.

Something else that will help (if you have the right sort of friends) is to call a friend and talk about it. They should be the sort of friends who will help you with your disaster planning and will also be able to reassure you that your disaster scenario is not very likely – without ridicule!

However, after all that if your worries are interfering with your life then you should talk to a medical professional and see if a talking therapy or anti-anxiety medication would prove helpful. CBT (cognitive behavioural therapy) is often very useful with this sort of problem.

I’ve tried to keep this brief – but if you want to “talk” more please send me a PM, I have rather more experience of this that I’d like!

Zen Huggs to you and everyone that needs them

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JamesJeffery

14 years ago

Steve, stop worrying about worrying

I think a huge percentage of the worlds population are just like you, me included. Heck I worried so much about my health I was diagnosed with anxiety and labeled a hypochondriac. Health is not the only thing I worry about.

It's safe to worry

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Hanz

14 years ago

I have the same problem as you Steven. I worry a lot too but really over small things. Yesterday I was worrying that the rollercoaster might fly off the rails while I'm on it when I was at Wonderland theme park.:p
More legitimate worries are whether my business or product will fail miserably. I guess worries related to money and health are valid. We all worry from time to time so nothing wrong with it.
Do you think worrying has helped you thrive? I remember reading an article about stress actually being good for the soul as it further drives your ambition and motivation to succeed. Worry more about money and health and you'll be fine. By doing that, you'll work harder to make money and you'll motivate yourself to exercise so you can maintain your health.

I was worried that I wasn't getting enough exercise so I went and did a strenuous running session. Felt great! If I didn't worry about not getting enough exercise then I would not have done nor continue to do those running sessions. See? Worrying can also be helpful.

Keep at it!

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paulie888

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Hanz

I have the same problem as you Steven. I worry a lot too but really over small things. Yesterday I was worrying that the rollercoaster might fly off the rails while I'm on it when I was at Wonderland theme park.:p
More legitimate worries are whether my business or product will fail miserably. I guess worries related to money and health are valid. We all worry from time to time so nothing wrong with it.
Do you think worrying has helped you thrive? I remember reading an article about stress actually being good for the soul as it further drives your ambition and motivation to succeed. Worry more about money and health and you'll be fine. By doing that, you'll work harder to make money and you'll motivate yourself to exercise so you can maintain your health.

I was worried that I wasn't getting enough exercise so I went and did a strenuous running session. Felt great! If I didn't worry about not getting enough exercise then I would not have done nor continue to do those running sessions. See? Worrying can also be helpful.

Keep at it!

This is the flip side of worrying that people seldom talk about. It is a natural part of the human condition, and without worry we'd do many reckless things and endanger our physical and emotional health too much and too often. On the other hand, too much worrying could cross the line into obsessive paranoia, and that essentially prevent us from doing or accomplishing anything.

I suppose we all need to learn to properly recognize that fine line which separates healthy worries from paranoia, and always try to remain on the healthy side of things.

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thunderbird 14 years ago

Originally Posted by paulie888

This is the flip side of worrying that people seldom talk about. It is a natural part of the human condition<snip>

It is a theory that everybody has a flip-side, eg mega brilliant physicist Isaac Newton believed in ghosts.
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Don Schenk

14 years ago

Steven,

A technique that was taught to me is to write about it - journal in as much detail as possible. This gets it out and helps one to think more clearly. Then upon looking at the next day, the silliness becomes obvious.

Another technique I've used for more than 20 years is to keep a gratitude list. I can bring myself right back up emotionally by reading it. In it I list every little and big thing in my life for which I am grateful - it lists friends and family, it list things like "a stranger smiled at me today" (and I don't think they were laughing about me.) I am grateful that I have a roof over my head... on and on it goes.

When I first began writing it, I would read it every morning. Eventually it became long enough that it would take 20 minutes to read it. That is when I recorded it onto a cassette tape (remember those?) and would play it in the car.

I was just adding a few items this morning and looked at the page count. It is a Word doc, single spaced typed, one new item per line...

...and it is now 71 pages long.

Doug mentioned cognitave therapy. Dr. David Burns, in his book "Feeling Good" lists the common cognitive distortions people use to get themselves into a funk - and how to move beyond them. It's a good read.

My mother, when she was still on this planet, was the ultimate worrier. My father would say, "You mother is ruminating again." It was brain chemistry, but she was frightened of doctors - especially psychiatrists.

I inherited that brain chemistry and have used the techniques I mentioned here to change the way I think. Today, scientists tell us there is neuroplasticity. By using SPECT scans and PET scans and fMRI they have proven we can change our brain chemistry by changing our thoughts.

The worry becomes a habit, and after a while is the automatic response. By changing our thinking we can change the worry habit.

:-Don

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thunderbird 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Don Schenk

<snip>
Another technique I've used for more than 20 years is to keep a gratitude list.<snip>

Gratitude is a key to happiness and peace of mind, I think. I'm not sure I've ever appreciated anything before first having a sense (at least a sliver of a glimpse) of not having it.
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KimW

14 years ago

Paul,
"More than anything else in here in a year or more, those comments make me believe that the best thing Allen could do for this forum as a whole is to simply delete the off topic section."

I would have to respectfully disagree.
There is a community of very good WF members that frequent this part of the forum.I don't understand why all should be dreprived because of the actions of a few.

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Paul Myers 14 years ago

Kim,

I don't understand why all should be dreprived because of the actions of a few.

I have no idea why the entire forum should get a reputation as nutjobs because of a few people who refuse to think.

Frankly, I waste way too much time in an attempt to keep this section sane. Nearly every thread that starts out discussing something meaningful reaches a point at which it really should just be deleted. Because of a small handful of people who can't seem to grok the concept of simple civility.

We have people who regularly post threads they know will turn political, despite having been asked not to do so. We have people who can't even look at a topic without twisting it into something it's not.

And then we have stuff like what Caliban posted in this thread.

That kind of commentary should have been greeted with a storm of correction, and it got very little in the way of response.

This section is just not worth it.

Paul
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- Bill Farnham 14 years ago
  
  Paul,
  
  I know on a scale of 1 to 10 my contributions to the WF don't even rate being on the radar but I'd like you to reconsider the OT as having value.
  
  That's purely a selfish statement on my part as I truly enjoy interacting here. In fact, before I visit the main forum I come here first to see what's going on.
  
  I can only read so many guru rants and threads where the question has been asked a thousand times before. Interspersed with all the great knowledge some of the incredible marketers here are generous enough to share, I, just speaking for myself, enjoy a lttle levity, and a great place to find it is here in the OT.
  
  So it makes for a somewhat rounded experience, for lack of a better phrase, to have the ability to participate in the OT. Again, that's just a personal opinion.
  
  I think the WF is a better place for having this outlet, and I'm keenly aware of the burden it places on the moderation of the forum in general. I'm also aware of how easy it is the straddle the line between what is acceptable and what is not, and a great many threads here do test the system. So please accept my apologies for any transgressions I have commited, I know none of us have been lilly white.
  
  I just want you to reconsider this for a number of reasons, the chief one being how much fun this place can be if you're a regular poster here like I am.
  
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  ~Bill
  
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KenThompson

14 years ago

The OT is a nice alternative, for me, because I occasionally get a little
bored in the other forums. That's not a criticism of anything. So I'll
hang out down here for a while because I enjoy talking to some with
whom I feel acquainted.

But, honestly Paul, I had similar thoughts the past days for certain
reasons 'some' of which you touched on. But for me, I can only speak
for me, I tend to skip over certain things that seem to be frequently
offered. Obviously, I'm being very careful about what I say, here. lol

I don't know what a good solution is to the issues you mentioned. I
hope it doesn't go away, but if it does then I'll certainly understand.

And if I have ever been a party to marginal behavior, I offer my apologies.
Anyone can call me on something if they feel it's inappropriate in some
way - just as long as they're cool about, that's all I would ask.

But I do know what you mean.

Ken

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KimW

14 years ago

Paul,
I actually do understand your frustration. And you are correct about a lot of it.
Especially this:
"We have people who regularly post threads they know will turn political, despite having been asked not to do so. We have people who can't even look at a topic without twisting it into something it's not."

There are some here that will push the limit no matter where the bar is set.

I actually wrote a very long reply,but then deleted it, instead I just go back to my orginal thought, get rid of those that make it tough.

Edit: I do have one more note. As some know, I gave free access and open reign to discuss anything and everything on a forum I own. I was hoping to minimize the problems the mods had to deal with in the OT,because as Paul rightly said, there are some that post things intentionally to stir things up. Some came to the other forum, but most of those causing issues stayed here anyway,which made me have the theory that they don't want to discuss issues,they just want to create problems.

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KenThompson

14 years ago

I took a cue from Pat (Patrician). She said once that sometimes she'll write
something and not post it. It's apparently for cathartic reasons, in some way.
I've done that several times, and it is cathartic.

I've written some blistering posts, and some of them would've earned me a seven
day vacation if not more. But they were never published.

So, thanks Pat! lol

Ken

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KimW

14 years ago

I'm the same way Ken, My desktop is covered with replies I've written then never posted. Writing them was thereaputic for me,and not posting them was smart!

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KenThompson

14 years ago

Besides... Kurt and I can't totally bust on each other in any other forums. Sure,
I could PM my insults to him, but it's just not the same.

Ken

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Paul Myers

14 years ago

Folks, I didn't say I was going to lobby for closing this section down. I just think it would be a very good move for the forum overall. But I don't make those decisions.

Kim,

Some came to the other forum, but most of those causing issues stayed here anyway,which made me have the theory that they don't want to discuss issues,they just want to create problems.

Partly that, partly inertia, and a lot of drama addiction.

Doesn't matter much to me why. When we have multiple very senior people refusing to participate because of the plague of pettiness, especially when they're folks who have the experience and tendency to help others in a meaningful way, it's a big issue.

I intensely dislike banning people who are well-intentioned. Especially when it's over the kind of petty stuff that goes on in here. Not to mention the constant hassle that would create for everyone on the moderation team. I'd rather just nuke every thread that had enough substance to degenerate into vitriol. But that's baby-sitting, and I don't care to spend my time baby-sitting a group composed of adults, some of whom deserve better treatment than that.

This one just went beyond the pale. The more disturbing thing is that so few people (one?) said anything about it.

Paul

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KenThompson

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Doesn't matter much to me why. When we have multiple very senior people refusing to participate because of the plague of pettiness, especially when they're folks who have the experience and tendency to help others in a meaningful way, it's a big issue.

Paul

That's interesting. Multiple senior people you obviously know about, and you
somehow are aware that they feel there's too much pettiness in the OT. Well,
I would agree there is too much pettiness among other things.

It's a big issue because they feel that way.

But there's nothing stopping them from coming down here and addressing it. So
because for whatever reason they don't want to do that, then it's a problem.

Sure, you obviously can consider it a problem because you're in a position to
do that.

But something about that doesn't seem quite right. However, I also know it
does not have to sound right, or any other way, to me. I'm well aware of the
dynamics involved when membership is a privilege.

If the OT disappeared overnight life would go on. So I'm not arguing (in the sense
of debate) whether or not the OT should stay, etc. If Allen wants to flush it,
then ok.

I don't know who these senior people are, but I would openly suggest and welcome
them to come down, participate, and join the discussion.

You know... there are people of less "seniority" (join date?) who also have a helluva
lot to offer and contribute to others here in the OT. And we are here, and not all of
us are petty or whatever. I've seen a fair amount of pettiness in other parts of this
forum, as well as drama. We're here, and we do contribute value to those who come
down here and ask questions.

So... senior people... you most certainly are cordially invited to the OT. We have a
great deal of fun. We share news and other pieces of occasionally useless information.

I think people try not to be petty. But sometimes things get heated 'down here' in a
similar manner they do 'up there.' We've all seen it.

We deal with the pettiness, warts, and all. Personally, I think it's a commentary I
won't completely comment on that the feelings of senior people is enough to contribute
to a moderator openly stating he feels like a part of a forum should be closed.

But, that's life, eh? And it's cool. I have no problem with anyone or anything.

Ken

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Paul Myers

14 years ago

Ken,

But there's nothing stopping them from coming down here and addressing it. So because for whatever reason they don't want to do that, then it's a problem.

Why should they need to? They're not adding to the problem by staying away, and they are avoiding an escalation of the kind that is all too common.

It's not just in OT, mind you. It's more pronounced here, though. And it has people staying away from the forum entirely, whether it originates with this part of the board or some other. I only know about the ones who tell me what's going on. I'd estimate that to be a small fraction of the people affected.

Yes, some of the folks here just deal with it. But a lot of people don't care to, especially when their efforts at discussion get them nothing but abuse.

I don't blame them for not wanting to waste their time on it. That's the smart play.

Paul

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KenThompson

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Ken,Why should they need to? They're not adding to the problem by staying away, and they are avoiding an escalation of the kind that is all too common.

They shouldn't need to, and there shouldn't be a need for anyone to. There
shouldn't be a need for oversight or moderators. And that's not sarcasm or
a cheap shot. But as Allen said, we're all moderators... but we shouldn't have
to all be moderators.

If they don't want to say something to others regarding matters of perceived
or real pettiness, or whatever it is, then that is their choice.

Yes, some of the folks here just deal with it. But a lot of people don't care to, especially when their efforts at discussion get them nothing but abuse.

I don't blame them for not wanting to waste their time on it. That's the smart play.

Paul

I understand all that, Paul. You have always said, I've read it enough times, that
if someone doesn't like it here they can leave. So if they don't like something
about the OT, then they should stay away and apparently they do. So given
that, there shouldn't be a problem. But because they choose to stay away and
perhaps because they are senior, then it does seem that it is a problem.

If they feel they're wasting their time, then ok. That's cool.

You said their efforts at discussion get them nothing but abuse. I am not sure
I'd agree that that's a universal problem among senior people coming down here
and discussing things. I don't agree at all that anyone in the OT has the
experience of receiving constant abuse - with the exception of me or Kurt and
only from each other. (pardon the light moment)

I've seen enough discussions here to say with confidence that abuse is not a
universal occurrence. If any particular person feels like that's "all" they ever
get, then I'd be curious to see what they're saying that seems to always
attract abuse.

If someone has a low tolerance for the way other people may reply, then I
am not sure what to think about that, or what to think about their feelings
having so much weight among the chain of command.

Please understand, Paul, that I'm not trying to give you a hard time or be
unduly argumentative. I would hope you have seen enough of me to know
those are not characteristic of my manner.

I do understand if you may feel that too much attention to a part of a
marketing forum that is not related to marketing may not justify its existence.
I certainly can see that point.

As for me, this horse seems beaten to death. I've made my point. I know it
won't even buy me a cup of coffee. But that's ok.

Maybe we can make Kurt or Pat permanent OT mod. I'll vote for Pat cuz
she's cool. I'd definitely vote for Kurt because I'll have more opportunities
to bust his stones and make him cry.

See ya tomorrow, Paul. I still have writing to finish, and it's almost time to
light the midnight oil lamp. Life goes on...

Ken

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dagaul101

14 years ago

Try and focus on what made you happy at any point in your life, then grab on to that feeling and never let go, hard at first but easier with time

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Paul Myers

14 years ago

Ken,

First - I'm not taking anyone's comments on this as anything but their opinion. Civilly stated, too. It's just a different view of the place than you get after a long enough time.

I've seen enough discussions here to say with confidence that abuse is not a universal occurrence. If any particular person feels like that's "all" they ever get, then I'd be curious to see what they're saying that seems to always attract abuse.

It's not what they do, it's who decides to obsess on them.

We're not talking about just one person. This stuff has driven some very sharp people out of this forum. It's gone on for over a decade. It would be impossible to guess what that's cost the members as a group, given that these tend to be the folks who actually test things and work in multiple aspects of the business. The ones who value their time enough not to spend it arguing with folks who attack without reason or sense.

Or the people who just argue illogical positions in order to "win" and look smarter than their targets.

The moderators can't stop it or change the trend. We can slow it down some. The ones who control the tenor of the forum are the members. That's why it's so disturbing when so few people step up and correct these kinds of arguments.

I don't for a moment believe that Caliban, for example, meant to imply what his comments suggested. I do think he kept up the argument because he wants to win, even though it's a matter of personal preference and interpretation. The kind of decision we do not have the right to make for another person.

Almost as disturbing is the lack of awareness on the part of so many people about the difference between destructive and constructive forces. I'm not talking about negative and positive mentality here. I'm talking about actual building up versus tearing down, and how often people consider the ability to destroy to be a sign of personal power.

Any idiot can set off a stick of dynamite. It takes a lot more to skill, talent, and character to construct the building. Yet we have a huge number of people who think that being able to destroy a thing makes them the equal of the person or group who built it. And a lot more people who will sit back and watch, treating the destruction as a form of entertainment.

There have been a number of times I've gotten disgusted enough to walk away from moderating for a while. It has, except one time, always been the result of too much of that last group. The ones who sit back and say nothing.

Why is offtopic worse? A number of reasons, but the biggest one is the distinction between posts in this section and the rest of the forum. In the other sections, a post with useful info benefits everyone who reads it. It gives them tools to make their lives better. In this section, the vast majority of the posts have no benefit to anyone but the people active in the discussion. At best, they're mild entertainment to others for a few moments.

There are exceptions, like the incredibly valuable and informative BP thread. And in just about every such case, the OT problem children have tried to derail or wreck them with the usual bag of tricks. Usually not out of malice, but from the simple inability to be aware of their context and respect the other members.

They're like people who text while driving. They don't mean to damage others. They're sure thay can do it safely. But their actions nearly guarantee an accident will happen, and someone's going to get hurt.

There's usually not much chance of physical harm, as there would be in the driving scenario. With the example in this thread, though, it actually could get to that point if someone were to buy into what Caliban's friend said. When people believe there's a threat to their children, or other people's children, they often respond with as much force and as little thought as possible. That's a very good thing when the threat is real. It's a Very Bad Thing when it's imagined.

I knew a guy a while back who was a self-described pyrotechnic engineer. Meaning he did fireworks and other flame-involved displays for theatrical productions. Dude was an absolute genius at his craft. I heard him say something to a guy he was training once, and it stuck with me:

"There are some matches no-one should play with."

Words to live by.

Paul

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LudVanDaal

14 years ago

Practice sports. It really helps me to stay focused and not to worry so much about everything

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varshahooda

Banned 14 years ago

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Steven Wagenheim

14 years ago

I want to offer my apologies for even starting this thread. Had I known a
harmless question like this would have turned into what this thread turned
into, I would have just kept my mouth shut and gone to see a shrink.

With what I make a year I can certainly afford it.

Just totally disgusted.

/ Rant

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Paul Myers 14 years ago

Caliban,

You have a remarkable talent for twisting what's being said and done. Please take that talent somewhere before an audience which appreciates it. That last post just demonstrated exactly the thing that torqued me off so much earlier, and I am no longer in the mood to debate or discuss it.

Someone got into the conversation with a comment which was both accurate and useful, and you added a spin that made it look like what they were suggesting was a sign of being a child molester. If you don't understand why that's a problem, you need freaking therapy. And remedial logic classes.

End of rope. Choose.

Paul
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ThomM

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

I want to offer my apologies for even starting this thread. Had I known a
harmless question like this would have turned into what this thread turned
into, I would have just kept my mouth shut and gone to see a shrink.

With what I make a year I can certainly afford it.

Just totally disgusted.

/ Rant

Steve save your money and just watch Springer in the morning.
Seriously, when you see those yahoo's you realize you don't have any worries if you're not on Springer

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KimW

14 years ago

Paul,
Let me add you do an excellent job down here and are extremely tolerant at times when you really have no need to be. For that myself and others here thank you.

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Kay King 14 years ago

Paul -

I usually agree with you but not on this.

It's true a few here get carried away by emotion, partisan bickering or an inability to keep their wits about them and you do a great job of keeping us in line.

However, it's one thing to get carried away - and quite another to post in a way meant to be outrageous which is what happened here. The goal was to get attention - and it's better to leave the thread than grant that attention in my opinion.

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KimW

14 years ago

I don't know what is worse,springer or Maury.Povich used to be a serious newsman but nowadays every single show is a variation of 1 momma,2 babies,15 possible fathers, and Maury tests them all! Stay tuned for the shocking results. And of course,no matter what the results you have the momma running off the stage crying and screaming and the father/not the father high fiving everyone.

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Kay King 14 years ago

I can't watch it - just laugh too much.

I think I missed one of the language revolutions in recent years anyway. When did "baby momma" and "baby daddy" become so widely used?

Do these people not have names?
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ThomM

14 years ago

Originally Posted by KimW

I don't know what is worse,springer or Maury.Povich used to be a serious newsman but nowadays every single show is a variation of 1 momma,2 babies,15 possible fathers, and Maury tests them all! Stay tuned for the shocking results. And of course,no matter what the results you have the momma running off the stage crying and screaming and the father/not the father high fiving everyone.

I can't stand the Maury show.
Springer on the other hand is just to funny.
The "guest's" on Springer prove the saying "If brains caused pain, they wouldn't feel a thing."

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As you are I was, as I am you will be
You can't fix stupid, but you can always out smart it.

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Nicola Lane

14 years ago

I don’t know how to express the depths of my disappointment at some of the behaviour in this thread.

Steven asked for a little help, he probably needed a little understanding and sympathy as much as the help. For what he has put into this forum he certainly deserved at least a little of all three. He currently has a small problem, but it has the potential to develop into a much larger one, a potentially life threatening problem. This type of problem is one that is often misunderstood, and many people still react with scorn and ridicule, which serves to make asking for help so much more difficult.

Steven did something very brave, he recognised his problem and turned to a community that should contain his friends and asked for our help. Have you any idea how difficult that was? How vulnerable he made himself?

Just look at what we sent him back!

One person tried a small de-railing manoeuvre. Did we all report his post so that it was simply pulled and we could all carry on with understanding and advice? Unfortunately we did not, we carried on rocking and as a result the small train derailment became the train tumbling down the side of a mountain and rolling over an entire village!

I’ve seen how wonderful this community can be, the way we pull together when disasters and problems strike, the help, generosity and love that has flowed toward so many people that were in need. So many people are so much better off because of the people of this forum.

Then we do this.

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I like to keep an open mind, but not so open that my brains fall out

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Andie

14 years ago

who needs maury & comp. when we have the OT?

Steve,
whatever you do, do Not worry about the thread and non-useful

Andie

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**Warrior KimW needs a kidney & YOUR support**

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aaaa33030

14 years ago

How do I stop worrying? ->I get online and try to make money

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Perpetual Income 365

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KimW

14 years ago

Mike,
I got to go with KJ on this one.
I think we agree more than disagree.I always read any post you make and I usually get something good from it.
Stay the course!

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PeterDunin

14 years ago

the best way to stop worrying is to face the problem head on and fix it.Other than that having someone to talk to helps.

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