How We Can Put A Stop to High Gas Prices

by TC3000
81 replies
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Please read this entire idea PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE


Dropping Gas Prices:

This is not the "Don't Buy Gas for a Day", but it will show you how we can get gas prices back down to $2.00 per gallon.

If you are tired of the gas prices going up AND they will continue to rise this summer, take time to read this please.

Phillip Hollsworth offered this good idea.

This makes MUCH MORE SENSE than the "don't buy gas on a certain day" campaign that was going around a couple of years ago.

It's worth the consideration. Join the resistance!!!

I hear we are going to hit close to $5.00 a gallon by Memorial Day, and it might go higher!! Want gas prices to come down?

We need to make some intelligent, united action. The oil companies just laughed at that because they know we wouldn't continue to hurt ourselves by refusing to buy gas.

It was more of an inconvenience to us than it was a problem for them, BUT, whoever thought of this idea has come up with a plan that can really work. Please read on and join with us!

By now you've probably thinking gasoline priced at $2.00 is super cheap. Me too!

It is currently $3.59 for regular unleaded in my town.

Now that the oil companies and the OPEC nations has conditioned us to think that the cost of a gallon of gas is CHEAP at $1.50-$1.75, we need to take aggressive action to teach them that BUYERS control the marketplace not the sellers.

With the prices of gasoline going up more each day, we consumers need to take action. The only way we are going to see the prices of gas come down is if we hit someone in the pocketbook by not purchasing their gas! And, we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves.

How? Since we all rely on our cars, we can't just stop buying gas, But we CAN have an impact on gas prices if we all act together to force a price war.

Here's the idea! For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY gasoline from the two biggest (Which now are one), EXXON and MOBIL.

If they are not selling any gas, they will be inclined to reduce their prices. If they reduce their prices, the other companies will have to follow suit.

But to have an impact, we need to reach literally millions of Exxon and Mobil gas buyers. It's really simple to do! Now don't wimp out on me at this point.....Keep reading on and I'll explain how simple it is to reach millions of people!!

This note was sent to 30 people. If each of us send it to at least 10 more (30x10=300) and those 300 send it to at least 10 more (300x10=3000) and so on, by the time the message reaches the sixth group of people, we will have reached over THREE MILLION consumers. If those three million get excited and pass this on to 10 friends each then 30 million people will have been contacted.

If it goes one more level further, you guessed it - THREE HUNDRED MILLION PEOPLE!!!

Again, all you have to do is send this to 10 people, that's all!

If you don't understand how we can reach 300 million and all you have to do is send this to 10 people ... Well, let's face it, you just aren't a mathematician. But I am. So trust me on this one.

How long will this take? If each of us send this to 10 more people within one day of receipt, all 300 Million people could conceivably be contacted within the next 8 days!!!

I'll bet you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you!

Acting together we can make a difference.

If this makes sense to you, PLEASE pass this message on, I suggest that we not buy from EXXON/MOBIL UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE $2-00 RANGE AND KEEP THEM DOWN. THIS CAN REALLY WORK.

Keep it going!!!

P.S. Please keep this concept in mind, to keep gas prices from going up in the future.


Conclusion: Oil companies have cross the line, understand this; We' er not saying don't buy gas period, you need gas to back and forth to work or to take of your daily routine - what we' er saying don't buy "EXXON and MOBIL". Lets make the Oil Companies feel the pain for a change! There's no website to go to - just pass this information on to your family members, co-workers, neighbors and friends. Let Us All Band Together!
#gas prices #high gas prices #oil companies
  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    You seem to forget SEVEN little things!

    1. MANY stations are associated with, or buy gas from, those two processors. HECK, I can't even remember when I bought gas directly from EITHER of those guys, though they are now Exon/MOBIL symbol XOM ! My PARENTS did in the 70s!

    2. MANY processors use imports, or processed items, from those big guys.
    3. There is a LIMITED supply! Many probably use the other 2 as a backup.
    4. There is the commodities market where they can sell, and others can buy. If you keep industry supply the same, prices will remain the same.
    5. They have other businesses, like natural gas that some CAN'T boycott! To do so means NO heat and/or no stove/oven.
    6. They merge and buyout.
    7. DON'T FORGET BP!

    This will just hurt franchisees and maybe close stations. That could drive their profits up and make you drive farther for gas!

    IRONIC, HUH?

    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Adam Roy
    We should band together, take over the oil fields, and sell the stuff as cheap as we can.

    Or, we could develop a marketing campaign and drive traffic to the biggest petition known to man. We could all go on strike, and not pay for oil until the price goes down. If we put our marketing noggins together, we can drive traffic to the petition and strike proposal from all reaches of the internet.

    When everyone goes on strike, we'll just teach them how to make money online so they don't need to use gas to get to work.

    We'll drive traffic to it from weight loss niches, MMO niches, sports niches, news aggregators and more! Somebody put up a website and everybody put a link to it in the footers of your website now!
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by Adam Roy View Post

      We should band together, take over the oil fields, and sell the stuff as cheap as we can.

      Or, we could develop a marketing campaign and drive traffic to the biggest petition known to man. We could all go on strike, and not pay for oil until the price goes down. If we put our marketing noggins together, we can drive traffic to the petition and strike proposal from all reaches of the internet.

      When everyone goes on strike, we'll just teach them how to make money online so they don't need to use gas to get to work.

      We'll drive traffic to it from weight loss niches, MMO niches, sports niches, news aggregators and more! Somebody put up a website and everybody put a link to it in the footers of your website now!
      Sell cheap? WHY? And THEN the company has US pay them ROYALLY as thanks?

      Petition? To have WHO do WHAT!?!?!?

      Make money on line? DOING WHAT? AND, what is ON LINE? I thought you had to have computers and a phone system, but I guess THAT can't be! THEY DRIVE! And what do you do for clothing or gas? OH, and say good bye to ALL physical goods, because THAT requires gas! In fact, I can make ONE trip to sears and eat on the way using LESS gas than if I ordered delivery and ordered the sears stuff online.

      You obviously haven't thought this out.

      Steve
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      • Profile picture of the author Adam Roy
        Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

        Sell cheap? WHY? And THEN the company has US pay them ROYALLY as thanks?

        Petition? To have WHO do WHAT!?!?!?

        Make money on line? DOING WHAT? AND, what is ON LINE? I thought you had to have computers and a phone system, but I guess THAT can't be! THEY DRIVE! And what do you do for clothing or gas? OH, and say good bye to ALL physical goods, because THAT requires gas! In fact, I can make ONE trip to sears and eat on the way using LESS gas than if I ordered delivery and ordered the sears stuff online.

        You obviously haven't thought this out.

        Steve
        Oh yea, you're right, forgot about all that other important stuff.

        Well, there goes my idea!

        Gas is so overrated...
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  • Profile picture of the author entrepreneurjay
    Drive a moped to work or a bike that'll teach them lol.... Yeah I know it does suck hopefully they stable out I feel bad for over the road truck drivers they are probably losing their asses.
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  • Profile picture of the author waterotter
    Here's the latest news and gas prices from Libya....









    نور اگر رفت سایه پیدا نیست نقش دیوار و چشم خیره ما نقش سایه دگر نمی دان نور اگر رفت سایه. ر رفت سایه پیدا نیست نقش دیوار و چشم خیره ما نقش سایه دگر نمی دان نور اگر رفت سایه پیدا نیست نقش دیوار و چشم خیره ما





    If I hear anything else, I'll let you know.....:p
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Convert your car to run on natural gas, it will cost you about a dollar a gallon.
      Pressure the president and congress to pass a law where all govt. vehicles most run on natural gas. Then faze out all trucks, buses, etc. that run on diesel and either convert them to natural gas and make all new trucks that would run on diesel run on natural gas.
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      • Profile picture of the author Kurt
        Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

        Convert your car to run on natural gas, it will cost you about a dollar a gallon.
        Pressure the president and congress to pass a law where all govt. vehicles most run on natural gas. Then faze out all trucks, buses, etc. that run on diesel and either convert them to natural gas and make all new trucks that would run on diesel run on natural gas.
        In the SW US (where there is plenty of sun), give incentives for fleet/delivery vehicles to convert to solar powered electricity, using swappable battery systems similar to those used in Israel.

        In the mid-US, use wind turbines.

        I also have a site that shows some cheap DIY green energy projects for homes.
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        • Profile picture of the author ThomM
          Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

          In the SW US (where there is plenty of sun), give incentives for fleet/delivery vehicles to convert to solar powered electricity, using swappable battery systems similar to those used in Israel.

          In the mid-US, use wind turbines.

          I also have a site that shows some cheap DIY green energy projects for homes.
          Bookmarked.
          Between Kurt and I (and T. Boone) we've given solid ways to end our dependencies on foreign oil.
          Myself I plan on this year canning my oil boiler and going with natural gas and maybe a wood stove for supplemental heat.
          I also have the plans for building solar panels and will start with my garage (thanks Dave).
          We can come up with ways to get off oil all day, but if no one does them what's the use?
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          • Profile picture of the author Roaddog
            Natural gas may burn cleaner, but the way they drill for it and the consequences are "fracking" unreal.

            This link is to PBS, to a review of Gasland. A documentary about this drilling technique. Not sure at the moment where you can get Gasland for free.

            Somehow I saw this a while back (Gasland).

            It was "fracking" eye opening.

            Jim
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            • Profile picture of the author ThomM
              Originally Posted by Roaddog View Post

              Natural gas may burn cleaner, but the way they drill for it and the consequences are "fracking" unreal.

              This link is to PBS, to a review of Gasland. A documentary about this drilling technique. Not sure at the moment where you can get Gasland for free.

              Somehow I saw this a while back (Gasland).

              It was "fracking" eye opening.

              Jim
              Fox's film--inspired when the gas company came to his hometown--alleges chronic illness, animal-killing toxic waste, disastrous explosions, and regulatory missteps.
              If there weren't safe ways to drill for natural gas, we wouldn't have any natural gas to use
              Articles (and movies) like that allege that all drilling for natural gas isn't safe. That's like watching a drunk driver have an accident and saying that all drivers are drunk:rolleyes:
              Truth is you can safely drill for natural gas and companies have been doing it for years.
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              • Profile picture of the author Roaddog
                Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

                If there weren't safe ways to drill for natural gas, we wouldn't have any natural gas to use
                Articles (and movies) like that allege that all drilling for natural gas isn't safe. That's like watching a drunk driver have an accident and saying that all drivers are drunk:rolleyes:
                Truth is you can safely drill for natural gas and companies have been doing it for years.

                With all due respect Thom. You sound like someone who hasn't seen the documentary. That's what I thought till I saw this. It's in depth and well worth the watch.

                There is nothing alleged about that toxic cloud in the middle of Wyoming, or the water and people with health problems. I do realize that there are other ways to drill.

                But the fracking is cheaper, so...well, I'd be willing to bet you already know where I'm going with that.


                Jim
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                • Profile picture of the author ThomM
                  Originally Posted by Roaddog View Post

                  With all due respect Thom. You sound like someone who hasn't seen the documentary. That's what I thought till I saw this. It's in depth and well worth the watch.

                  There is nothing alleged about that toxic cloud in the middle of Wyoming, or the water and people with health problems. I do realize that there are other ways to drill.

                  But the fracking is cheaper, so...well, I'd be willing to bet you already know where I'm going with that.


                  Jim
                  No Jim I didn't watch the film and I do know there are problems with fracking. I also know it can be done safely just not as cheaply as the bad way. But not to utilize natural gas to replace oil (if done safely) is simply foolish.
                  It seems that the people who are against fracking are against natural gas use, true or not, that's the perception I get.
                  50 years ago we used natural gas for heat and cooking where I lived. I believed the gas came from drilled wells.
                  Also you can safely frack for natural gas. At least T. Boone Pickens says you can and I tend to listen to someone who has fracked over 3,000 times without incident.
                  The natural gas reserves we had under our soil is larger then the oil reserves that all of opec has under theirs. That we haven't utilized it sooner and gave opec the finger shows who really runs things around here.
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              • Profile picture of the author seasoned
                Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

                If there weren't safe ways to drill for natural gas, we wouldn't have any natural gas to use
                Articles (and movies) like that allege that all drilling for natural gas isn't safe. That's like watching a drunk driver have an accident and saying that all drivers are drunk:rolleyes:
                Truth is you can safely drill for natural gas and companies have been doing it for years.
                Well, I'm certainly no expert on drilling for gas, but saying "It MUST be safe, or we wouldn't have any" is a statement that is silly. I guess crude oil, coal, gold, diamonds, are ALSO safe to mine/drill for. And nuclear radiation is safe. They aren't, but we have them. Granted, there are a FEW safe ways to get the items, but they are considered exhausted.

                And I don't think anyone is really AGAINST natural gas. There ARE a number of government vehicles that use natural gas. Even some public buses.

                Steve
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                • Profile picture of the author ThomM
                  Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

                  Well, I'm certainly no expert on drilling for gas, but saying "It MUST be safe, or we wouldn't have any" is a statement that is silly. I guess crude oil, coal, gold, diamonds, are ALSO safe to mine/drill for. And nuclear radiation is safe. They aren't, but we have them. Granted, there are a FEW safe ways to get the items, but they are considered exhausted.

                  And I don't think anyone is really AGAINST natural gas. There ARE a number of government vehicles that use natural gas. Even some public buses.

                  Steve
                  Steve what I should of said is there must be safe ways to get it or we wouldn't have any. My bad.
                  Also I said my presecption is those against fracking are against natural gas.
                  If whenever you mentioned utilizing natural gas people started talking about how dangerous fraking is (like that's the only method to extract it) what would you think.
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          • Profile picture of the author Kurt
            Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

            Bookmarked.
            Between Kurt and I (and T. Boone) we've given solid ways to end our dependencies on foreign oil.
            Myself I plan on this year canning my oil boiler and going with natural gas and maybe a wood stove for supplemental heat.
            I also have the plans for building solar panels and will start with my garage (thanks Dave).
            We can come up with ways to get off oil all day, but if no one does them what's the use?
            Hey Thom,

            You're right, we don't have to wait for others or the Gov to get things rolling...And my site focuses on what the average diy-er can do, and how to do it cheap.

            Here's an example: Let's say you build 4 solar panels, just to get a feel on how to do it. They will generate about 10% of the electricity needed for the average US home.

            So after you figured out how to make 4, you build 8 more for a total of 12 solar panels. That will produce about 1/3 of the electricity needed for the average US home.

            People tend to over-think solar panels...You don't need your entire home to run off solar and you don't need to sell electricity back to the power company (which can be tricky and expensive).

            It can also be really cheap...Find some salvagable usable glass (that won't break if it hails), and see if you can't come up with a source for "dead" deep-cycle batteries. I have resources for "scalvaging" materials as well as details on how to recondition batteries others just throw away.

            Also check out how to make solar air heaters and water heaters. Both are very easy and inexpensive and can help create free heat and hot water.

            For some reason I have a feeling you're knowledgeable with mylar. It's great for solar projects, and although it won't last but a few months outside, it's very cheap and perfect for testing. You can also use it to reflect more sunlight onto your panels to get higher production from them.

            Using a black anodized pipe with a parabolic reflector made with mylar can easily produce 180 degree water, which is much hotter than any hot water heater makes, and is a pretty simple weekend project. The only "hard" part is getting it connected to your present hot water heater.

            Just getting one or two rooms "off the grid" will do a lot and is pretty easy to do. Plus, being 1/3 independent of the grid is great security if anything does happen to the local power grid.
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            • Profile picture of the author ThomM
              Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

              Hey Thom,

              You're right, we don't have to wait for others or the Gov to get things rolling...And my site focuses on what the average diy-er can do, and how to do it cheap.

              Here's an example: Let's say you build 4 solar panels, just to get a feel on how to do it. They will generate about 10% of the electricity needed for the average US home.

              So after you figured out how to make 4, you build 8 more for a total of 12 solar panels. That will produce about 1/3 of the electricity needed for the average US home.

              People tend to over-think solar panels...You don't need your entire home to run off solar and you don't need to sell electricity back to the power company (which can be tricky and expensive).

              It can also be really cheap...Find some salvagable usable glass (that won't break if it hails), and see if you can't come up with a source for "dead" deep-cycle batteries. I have resources for "scalvaging" materials as well as details on how to recondition batteries others just throw away.

              Also check out how to make solar air heaters and water heaters. Both are very easy and inexpensive and can help create free heat and hot water.

              For some reason I have a feeling you're knowledgeable with mylar. It's great for solar projects, and although it won't last but a few months outside, it's very cheap and perfect for testing. You can also use it to reflect more sunlight onto your panels to get higher production from them.

              Using a black anodized pipe with a parabolic reflector made with mylar can easily produce 180 degree water, which is much hotter than any hot water heater makes, and is a pretty simple weekend project. The only "hard" part is getting it connected to your present hot water heater.

              Just getting one or two rooms "off the grid" will do a lot and is pretty easy to do. Plus, being 1/3 independent of the grid is great security if anything does happen to the local power grid.
              Well Kurt my father always said, "if you want something done, do it yourself".
              As for the solar, the reason I'm doing the garage first is to give me the understanding I'll need to do the house
              As for the Mylar. On Ebay you can buy a dozen 'survival blankets' for about $21 delivered. What they are are 4ft.x8ft. sheets of thin Mylar

              As far as trades go, I'm not a good finish carpenter. But I'm pretty damn good at plumbing, electric, framing,etc. I can also read and understand most blueprints and schematics so I figure once I get started and understand the whole solar concept it will just be a matter of time before I'm off the grid with electric.
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              • Profile picture of the author Kurt
                Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

                Well Kurt my father always said, "if you want something done, do it yourself".
                As for the solar, the reason I'm doing the garage first is to give me the understanding I'll need to do the house
                As for the Mylar. On Ebay you can buy a dozen 'survival blankets' for about $21 delivered. What they are are 4ft.x8ft. sheets of thin Mylar

                As far as trades go, I'm not a good finish carpenter. But I'm pretty damn good at plumbing, electric, framing,etc. I can also read and understand most blueprints and schematics so I figure once I get started and understand the whole solar concept it will just be a matter of time before I'm off the grid with electric.
                Hey Thom,

                Don't get the survival blankets as they diffuse light and don't reflect it, which is what you need for solar purposes.

                The best deal I found on ebay was actually for a shop in Denver so I drive on down to check it out. They mail order:
                Reflective Mylar

                I actually bought a 50 ft by 50 in roll and keep in the back of my pickup (with a shell) for emergencies. With a little mylar and some duct tape and cardboard you can make a lot of stuff, like solar ovens, reflect or deflect light (heat), make solar stills, etc.


                Also, with your skills do checkout solar air and water heaters...Thinking about it for hot water, really all you need is a temperature control valve. If the water in the solar heater system is hotter than the water tank input, switch to solar. If the water in the solar heater system is cooler, switch valve to the "regular" intake. And that's the "hard" part.

                The rest is a piece of cake and can be as simple as a black garden hose encased/sealed in glass and pointed to the sun to take advantage of the greenhouse effect.
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      • Profile picture of the author shabbirbhimani
        Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

        Then faze out all trucks, buses, etc. that run on diesel and either convert them to natural gas and make all new trucks that would run on diesel run on natural gas.
        Cost of that would too huge and soon we would see natural gas vehicle price shoot up.
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        • Profile picture of the author ThomM
          Originally Posted by shabbirbhimani View Post

          Cost of that would too huge and soon we would see natural gas vehicle price shoot up.
          Not if the new trucks, etc. bought to replace older trucks where natural gas.
          It can't happen over night, but over about 10 years most if not all diesel burning vehicles could be replaced.
          Actually as the demand increases the supply would increase lowering the prices. Look at computer prices today as compared to 10 years ago.
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    • Profile picture of the author Sunfyre7896
      Originally Posted by waterotter View Post

      Here's the latest news and gas prices from Libya....









      نور اگر رفت سایه پیدا نیست نقش دیوار و چشم خیره ما نقش سایه دگر نمی دان نور اگر رفت سایه. ر رفت سایه پیدا نیست نقش دیوار و چشم خیره ما نقش سایه دگر نمی دان نور اگر رفت سایه پیدا نیست نقش دیوار و چشم خیره ما





      If I hear anything else, I'll let you know.....:p
      Oh I heard that too. They said that charging us $10 a gallon is a real steal. Man they are geniuses. What would we do without OPEC (Oil Production with Extreme Corruption) and the dirty, greedy oil companies? I really don't know......
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    Stop the politicians who are putting large 5 and 6 figure kickbacks in their pockets and you'll find the price dropping.

    We could always just turn the Middle East into glass and take over. Why don't we just do that? Then we can bury all the sheik powder in one place and pressurize it to ensure future oil supplies. :rolleyes:
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    • Profile picture of the author lcombs
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      Stop the politicians who are putting large 5 and 6 figure kickbacks in their pockets and you'll find the price dropping.

      We could always just turn the Middle East into glass and take over. Why don't we just do that? Then we can bury all the sheik powder in one place and pressurize it to ensure future oil supplies. :rolleyes:
      That hits closer to the target than most of the other posts.
      At least 50% of the price of gas is tax.

      And, what really pis*es me off is they openly manipulate the market.
      When prices get too low they cut production and raise the price.

      But, when it comes to taking action to lower the price I defer to Mark Twain.
      "Everybody complains about the weather, but nobody does anything about it".
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      • Profile picture of the author ThomM
        Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

        That hits closer to the target than most of the other posts.
        At least 50% of the price of gas is tax.

        And, what really pis*es me off is they openly manipulate the market.
        When prices get too low they cut production and raise the price.

        But, when it comes to taking action to lower the price I defer to Mark Twain.
        "Everybody complains about the weather, but nobody does anything about it".
        This is from the article I linked to.
        "net income grew 53 percent in the fourth quarter as it produced more oil to take advantage of higher prices "
        That tells me it's not just the oil companies, but also Wall st. and Washington.
        All working together to suck up as much money as they can, and when they get it all? They just print more money:rolleyes:
        The thing is, all of this could be prevented or stopped if we went back to having our dollar backed by gold and silver. Currently our dollar is backed by "The Full Faith and Credit of the United States Government" which means they can print as much as they want.
        When the dollar is back on the gold standard you are limited in the amount you can print and it is better to keep the money in circulation then to suck it all up in profits for the corporations. Seriously does an oil company really need to make 9 billion in net profits in 3 months?
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      • Profile picture of the author Kurt
        Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

        That hits closer to the target than most of the other posts.
        At least 50% of the price of gas is tax.

        And, what really pis*es me off is they openly manipulate the market.
        When prices get too low they cut production and raise the price.

        But, when it comes to taking action to lower the price I defer to Mark Twain.
        "Everybody complains about the weather, but nobody does anything about it".

        I really diasgree. Our politicians are keeping the price of oil artificially LOW, not high. If we include our costs of keeping a military presence in the Middle East, which is about half a trillion a year, the REAL FREE MARKET cost of gas would be about $6.50 a gallon. And this estimate was before the recent gas price increases. This figure is probably closer to $7.50 a gallon now.

        Most of our military costs are spent on Navy sailing in/around the Persian Gulf, using antiquated Cold War style ships and tactics.

        These facts are from a non-partisan group of 4 retired U.S. Senators 2 D and 2 R. Since they are retired they don't have political aspirations, they didn't have those biases, and joined together to see if they could come up with a plan for our debt problem.

        The reality is, we subsidize our oil companies by paying for their over-seas security, which is about half of our military budget (and at a cost of about $1 Billion a day), keeping the price of gas artificially low.

        We are at a point now were if the price of oil goes up too much, other technologies are ready to take over. To combat this, Big Oil will play "cat and mouse" with prices, raising them when they can, then when people are ready to make the switch to alternatives, cut the gas prices so it makes oil a "better" purchase.

        Instead of giving Big Oil a special tax rate of 9% when every other US corp pays 25% (I think I have my numbers correct) as well as giving them half of our military budget in the form of free over-seas security, let's let oil compete in a truly free market and let's see how well it does on a level playing field.

        And I haven't even brought up the costs of life and limb that goes with the military...Nor the effects of the trade imbalance of sending US dollars to the Middle East...Nor the effects of oil on our environment.
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  • Profile picture of the author David Maschke
    I'd put an end to Quantitative Easing, the real cause of inflation, but that's just me.
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  • Profile picture of the author ebbomb
    Sadly, gas prices won't fall until Americans decide to stop buying gasoline-required cars. There are natural gas vehicles and electric vehicles, but sadly, people don't want to invest in either of those. Simple economics states that competition brings down prices, so until Americans switch gas prices will rise.
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    • Profile picture of the author Diane S
      Originally Posted by ebbomb View Post

      Sadly, gas prices won't fall until Americans decide to stop buying gasoline-required cars. There are natural gas vehicles and electric vehicles, but sadly, people don't want to invest in either of those. Simple economics states that competition brings down prices, so until Americans switch gas prices will rise.
      Hey, have you checked the price tags on these alternative vehicles? Out of reach for many folks.
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      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by Diane S View Post

        Hey, have you checked the price tags on these alternative vehicles? Out of reach for many folks.
        Yeah, and are they REALLY better for the environment? Those batterioes are really not that great. And I hope they NEVER have the problem that SONY(IIRC) had! THEIR computers, DELLS, APPLES, etc... were actually catching on fire!

        As I understand it, it was a SIMPLE manufacturing defect! Iron filings somehow ended up in the electrolyte.

        Gizmodo, the Gadget Guide

        HowStuffWorks "What is causing lithium-ion laptop batteries to catch fire?"

        Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author rondo
    Unleaded costs $6 per gallon here in Australia, and $8 in the UK.

    Why do you expect to pay only $2 in the US?


    Andrew
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    • Profile picture of the author Roaddog
      Originally Posted by rondo View Post

      Unleaded costs $6 per gallon here in Australia, and $8 in the UK.

      Why do you expect to pay only $2 in the US?


      Andrew

      We're special...
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by rondo View Post

      Unleaded costs $6 per gallon here in Australia, and $8 in the UK.

      Why do you expect to pay only $2 in the US?


      Andrew
      One thing people fail to mention about in the US, is that the average American has to travel dozens of miles or more to get to work or the stores, and there isn't a great public infrastructure in some areas. HEY, in washington DC they have a pretty good infrastructure, and SUBWAYS! STILL, it doesn't go THAT far, etc... Towards the end, I had to walk half a mile to get to the bus, take the bus to the train station, walk maybe a half mile to the train, take the train to the right station, walk maybe a half mile to a shuttle which took me to work. And I was on the outskirts of one of like 4 or 5 lines, IIRC. HECK, one person I know paid OVER asking price for a home that he was ECSTATIC about and MANY bid for because it was close to a train station.

      Where I live I would have to walk like 2 miles just to get to the street and I don't think there are ANY buses there. The ONLY buss I saw was a school bus. luckily, if I had kids, that is only about 1/2 a block from my home. It is about 3 miles to the nearest gas station, maybe 10-15 miles to the nearest store.

      And I don't know what "petrol" REALLY is, but "gasoline" is less than about 90% gasoline(less than 90% of what petrol at least USED to be). And do you know what gas REALLY costs you anyway? I mean in the US "gas" costs about 86% of the price they list, and want you to pay. The other 14% is TAXES!!(which means the REAL tax on gasoline is 26%! Don't forget, OUR gas is DILUTED at least 10%) It would be unfair to tell us to pay more because you are paying your government more in taxes.

      For all WE know YOUR "petrol" is what we call E85! E85, as the name implies, is diluted 85%! It is only 15% gasoline(meaning the REAL gasoline). When we buy "gasoline" today, it only CONTAINS gasoline. In the US they started making cars cheaper a bit over a decade ago and they started making them more like they used to only a few years ago. Cars within that area where they were built cheaper can't even use E85 because apparently it will hurt gaskets, etc... BTW in case people are curious, the cars that were built for E85 and can handle it are often marked flexfuel.

      http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/flextech.shtml

      Want to see something SAD?

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flexible-fuel_vehicle

      The ford Model-T was the FIRST flex fuel vehicle. Because they decided to save a few bucks, many engines older than a few years may NOT be able to use E85. And we usually use E10-15(aka "gasoline"). It makes you wonder. One side effect of e85 on an engine that can't use it is INCREASED polution. Because a leasky hose or gasket will do just that. You have to wonder if the E10-15 does the same thing to a lesser degree.

      Steve
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      • Profile picture of the author Kurt
        Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

        One thing people fail to mention about in the US, is that the average American has to travel dozens of miles or more to get to work or the stores, and there isn't a great public infrastructure in some areas. HEY, in washington DC they have a pretty good infrastructure, and SUBWAYS! STILL, it doesn't go THAT far, etc... Towards the end, I had to walk half a mile to get to the bus, take the bus to the train station, walk maybe a half mile to the train, take the train to the right station, walk maybe a half mile to a shuttle which took me to work. And I was on the outskirts of one of like 4 or 5 lines, IIRC. HECK, one person I know paid OVER asking price for a home that he was ECSTATIC about and MANY bid for because it was close to a train station.

        And I don't know what petrol REALLY is, but gasoline is less than about 90% gasoline(less than 90% of what petrol at least USED to be). And do you know what gas REALLY costs you anyway? I mean in the US "gas" costs about 86% of the price they list, and want you to pay. The other 14% is TAXES!!(which means the REAL tax on gasoline is 26%! Don't forget, OUR gas is DILUTED at least 10%) It would be unfair to tell us to pay more because you are paying your government more in taxes.

        For all WE know YOUR "petrol" is what we call E85! E85, as the name implies, is diluted 85%! It is only 15% gasoline(meaning the REAL gasoline). When we buy "gasoline" today, it only CONTAINS gasoline.

        Steve
        This is inaccurate as it doesn't factor in that oil companies pay less taxes than other industries. And it doesn't factor in the REAL cost of oil.

        A recent bipartisian group of ex senators (2 R, 2 D) show that about 1/2 of our military is spent on protecting oil interests over-seas, mostly on navy ships in the Persian Gulf. This costs US tax payers about $350 billion a year, or roughly a billion a day.

        The price of gas in the US is artificially low. If we were paying the true free market price for oil/gas, we'd have switched to other energy sources long ago. And this price is just in dollar figures and doesn't include the loss of life and limb by our military personel.
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    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      Originally Posted by rondo View Post

      Unleaded costs $6 per gallon here in Australia, and $8 in the UK.

      Why do you expect to pay only $2 in the US?


      Andrew
      Same reason everyone thinks that we have to stop using gas to make the price go down. We're not the only country on the globe that buys oil from OPEC are we? You don't like the price of gas in your country - tell your freaking leaders. About all we can do over here, too. We have cheap gas because the freaking size of our country is the size of all Europe. How would your countries respond to trucking food all the damned way across the continent on the price you have on your tanks now? We can tell ya from the last time it went up this high - it's not a good thing. We're hoping that the people in office would want to see it come back down. We might even have to start kicking them to the curb again to get them around to seeing to it that the price does come down.
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      • Profile picture of the author ThomM
        Don't get the survival blankets as they diffuse light and don't reflect it, which is what you need for solar purposes.

        The best deal I found on ebay was actually for a shop in Denver so I drive on down to check it out. They mail order:
        Reflective Mylar
        I already have a bunch of the blankets. I use them indoors and they seem to work ok if you have a backing for them. But I don't have a light meter so I don't have a way to really test that. A big issue with the blankets is how thin they are. Real pain to work with and light will get through them.
        The prices there at HTG are way better then anywhere else that I've seen for Mylar. Speaking of HTG, I've ordered lights and ferts from them before and they are a great company to do business with, in fact they are now my main source for gardening supplies.
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      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

        Same reason everyone thinks that we have to stop using gas to make the price go down. We're not the only country on the globe that buys oil from OPEC are we? You don't like the price of gas in your country - tell your freaking leaders. About all we can do over here, too. We have cheap gas because the freaking size of our country is the size of all Europe. How would your countries respond to trucking food all the damned way across the continent on the price you have on your tanks now? We can tell ya from the last time it went up this high - it's not a good thing. We're hoping that the people in office would want to see it come back down. We might even have to start kicking them to the curb again to get them around to seeing to it that the price does come down.
        That IS another point. The arabs DON'T like the US! And NOW, they accept some foreign currency. So if the US lowered their costs, ALL would benefit. Some maybe more than the US. Americans drive more than europeans for LOTS of reasons. AND EVERYONE is affected. A small change in the US will affect everone MORE than it would in Europe. In USA today, yesterday or the day before, they spoke of how the gas prices are hurting the US economy.

        Europeans see it and figure it is a LUXURY! HECK, you guys have VAT, but some things there are STILL cheaper than they are here. I even saw some radios, etc... that were cheap there. I think I spoke earlier about how I talked about getting a car in switzerland. It was CHEAP, from a BMW dealership! Rolexes were CHEAP! I mean from a REAL jeweler, so they were NOT knockoffs. A $14K watch here cost like $9K in Denmark. A gold presidente around 1989. Rolex Watches Day-Date President Yellow Gold - Fluted Bezel - Oyster From SwissLuxury.Com And YEAH, that is european stuff, but not all was. The US actually has an agreement with rolex. They don't allow like more than 2-3 watches per person into the country! And Rolex has an agreement with US jewelers, they don't provide support to watches that don't follow in proper channels. So I guess the US and Rolex know about the disparities in price!

        Gee I'll have to look at tag heuer watches again. HERE, they are sky high! In 1989 I apparently could have bought a steel rolex for about what some simple tag heuers here cost. And YEP, rolex DOES make stainless steel watches! MENS NEW-STYLE FLUTED BEZEL ROLEX OYSTER PERPETUAL DATEJUST WATCHES

        And the US used to have many that acted like europeans lived in luxury! Perception can be a damning thing, and VERY wrong.

        Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author ebbomb
      Originally Posted by rondo View Post

      Unleaded costs $6 per gallon here in Australia, and $8 in the UK.

      Why do you expect to pay only $2 in the US?


      Andrew
      Cheap oil is an American thing. But it won't get better for us until gas prices rise further. America isn't build to withstand high oil prices, so if they continue to rise, Americans will find other ways to move around.

      But gosh, $8 in the UK? Wow.
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      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by ebbomb View Post

        America isn't build to withstand high oil prices, so if they continue to rise, Americans will find other ways to move around.
        GREAT! PLEASE tell me how I can get somewhere traveling over 300mph with no gas!

        BTW 300 mph = 482.8032 kph!

        I mean if I can't do that, I have to change jobs, which may be difficult, or stay home. That's just me, some work HAS to get done. Some SOMEONE needs gas.

        If I could walk, I WOULD! BTW did you know that gas USED to be a WASTE product! Oil was used for oil, tar, and KEROSENE! Gas was just a byproduct. It's TRUE!

        http://inventors.about.com/od/gstart...a/gasoline.htm

        AND, for a time, Standard oil was the biggest oil company, started by J.D. rockefeller:

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Oil

        In fact, it was forced to breakup into a lot of little guys. EXXONmobil, and chevron might be the only ones still around, with their names pretty much intact anyway. chevron DOES own texaco , one other. Others have merged with foreign interests, like dutch shell, or bp amoco(IIRC).

        Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author VOnline
    Hybrid and electric cars?
    Or ride a bike or get a motorcycle M1 license.
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    • Profile picture of the author Bill Farnham
      Yea, I can see it now...

      A whole bunch of 120 pound humans driving 6,000 pound SUVs boycotting gas stations for their right to fill their tanks at $2.00 a gallon.

      Maybe the problem is deeper than you imagined...
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    Kurt,

    I wasn't including ANY taxes the gas companies actually pay. I was talking only about money paid at the pumps, almost like a salestax.

    As for the military, I know that in a perfect world, we would just keep to ourselves. The US, unfortunately, has NOT done that for at least 66 years. If the US HAD kept out, american society would be quite different. There would almost certainly be fewer people. The arabs would probably still be nomads. HECK, islam would probably be a MUCH smaller religion.

    Even if we just fought WWII, and pulled out, things would be so much better. Unfortunately, we wouldn't want europe to be taken over by the n*. If we had let them, they would spread like ants and come HERE. Technically, whether known ahead of time or not, someone else gave US a sucker punch, so that action COULD justly be considered a valid reaction to an act of war, but it was a valid preemptive act and support of our allies.

    Alas, it wasn't like that. Some areas the US has fought in have little if any oil. In other areas there at least is another legitimate reason, even if the US helped cause it.

    So I wouldn't say ALL that money was for GAS. Still, to determine how such payments figured into today's gas prices is WAY too involved.

    And I am certainly not saying anything against people in the military. HECK, most of my uncles have been in various branches of the military. My best friend was in the military. Luckily, THEY all made it back alive and in one piece.

    And I thought in the 70s that we should have switched to solar THEN! I am certainly NOT against that. Heck, a freind once took me, around 1970, to a company that made electric cars. I never even drove one, so I don't really know what they were like. Today batteries and motors are FAR better. Those cars were still an interesting start. It's a shame nobody got all similar companies to work together. I read an article once in like the early 70s in popular mechanics, IIRC, that talked about lithium batteries for such things. As I recall, there was a concern about operating temperature, etc... It is just interesting that they knew about it SO long ago. Since then they have gone through nicad, Nimh, and now litium ion. Who knows WHAT they will come up with in another 10 years.

    BTW Thom,

    Are you using photovoltaic solar cells? If so, did they work well? If so, what brand, etc... are they? A few months ago I did look at amazon and the quality control seemed to not be that great. I DO need to get a backup system for my office. I thought at one point that I might charge it with a solar inverter. If that worked I, like you, could expand it to get off the power grid. BTW my heat is already natural gas.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      BTW Thom,

      Are you using photovoltaic solar cells? If so, did they work well? If so, what brand, etc... are they? A few months ago I did look at amazon and the quality control seemed to not be that great. I DO need to get a backup system for my office. I thought at one point that I might charge it with a solar inverter. If that worked I, like you, could expand it to get off the power grid. BTW my heat is already natural gas.

      Steve
      That's a project for sometime this summer Steve, so I can't really answer any of that.
      As for the gas, I have the pipe already up to the house so I don't have to deal with that expense. I'll either convert my current furnace or install a new one.
      If I already had a meter I'd do it myself, but I have to have a licensed heating contractor do it and have National Grid inspect it before they will install the meter. I happen to have a friend that fits that bill and will do it for material cost and then an exchange of services for the labor.
      I want it as much for the heat (I have hot water radiators) as I do for cooking. I hate electric stoves with a passion
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  • Profile picture of the author Ozwald01
    I drive around Pattaya all week for A$3 on my Yamaha Mio scooter.
    Can't complain about the price of gas....
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  • Profile picture of the author hireava
    Gas here in our place.. increases their price so fast!. that's why some of us wants to take the bus to work. Instead of using our cars.
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    • Profile picture of the author jimbo13
      $8 a gallon for petrol in the UK? WOW indeed. Where can I get that?

      It is infact £6 a gallon which I believe is around $10 .

      Both the AA and RAC (motoring organisations) predict £8 by the summer.

      Our papers don't call it RIP OFF Britain for nothing.

      Dan
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  • Profile picture of the author Adam1981
    Unfortunately, many of these ideas fail to account for 2 very important factors.

    1. Easy oil is almost gone, we're now extracting shale and tar sands which not only is a harder to get but has a much, much lower EROI. This means it's more expensive to extract and we have to use A LOT more energy to get a barrel out of the ground.

    2. The developing world is demanding more and more oil on a daily basis, if the USA won't pay the going rates then there are plenty of other countries who will. China and India in particular.

    So basically, Rapidly growing demand + limited resources = price is only going one way and it ain't down.

    The human race needs to ween off the black stuff fast or in the not so far away future we're going to up sh*t creek without a paddle.
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by Adam1981 View Post

      The developing world is demanding more and more oil on a daily basis, if the USA won't pay the going rates then there are plenty of other countries who will. China and India in particular.
      So YOU think the owners of the fields, who are primarily ARAB, are cutting us a DEAL!?!? That's a HOT one! Don't say that around the oil fields, then NOBODY will get it! Get it? Fire, oil!

      And you think china and india will pay more. WOW! BTW did it ever occur to you that many of the refiners are AMERICAN!?

      Steve
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      • Profile picture of the author Adam1981
        Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

        So YOU think the owners of the fields, who are primarily ARAB, are cutting us a DEAL!?!? That's a HOT one! Don't say that around the oil fields, then NOBODY will get it! Get it? Fire, oil!

        And you think china and india will pay more. WOW! BTW did it ever occur to you that many of the refiners are AMERICAN!?

        Steve
        My how aggressive.

        It's not a case of cutting anyone a deal, it's simple supply and demand. If demand is high then prices are high.

        Who the refiners are is totally irrelevant, their bottom line comes first. If you refuse to pay the current rates then other places will, they care only about their profit margin. With the cost of extracting the oil that the world is now using, processing it, shipping it, a small profit for the places that sell it etc anything close to $2 would be making a big loss.

        You think the Chinese can't afford to pay more than you? As in the Chinese with a full swing industrial revolution and huge surplus of cash? Have a look at the numbers. As it stands at the moment, they could comfortably afford $10 a gallon without too much fuss. Perhaps even more.
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        • Profile picture of the author Kurt
          Originally Posted by Adam1981 View Post

          My how aggressive.

          It's not a case of cutting anyone a deal, it's simple supply and demand. If demand is high then prices are high.

          Who the refiners are is totally irrelevant, their bottom line comes first. If you refuse to pay the current rates then other places will, they care only about their profit margin. With the cost of extracting the oil that the world is now using, processing it, shipping it, a small profit for the places that sell it etc anything close to $2 would be making a big loss.

          You think the Chinese can't afford to pay more than you? As in the Chinese with a full swing industrial revolution and huge surplus of cash? Have a look at the numbers. As it stands at the moment, they could comfortably afford $10 a gallon without too much fuss. Perhaps even more.
          Actually, the price of oil/gas can only get so high, then alternative fuels will very quickly become the better deal.

          Plus, who do you think is leading the world in green energy tech, like solar and wind? I won't mention the country's name, but its initials are c-h-i-n-a.
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          • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
            Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

            Actually, the price of oil/gas can only get so high, then alternative fuels will very quickly become the better deal.

            Plus, who do you think is leading the world in green energy tech, like solar and wind? I won't mention the country's name, but its initials are c-h-i-n-a.
            AHA! I'm onto you Jurt. While you may have attempeted to cleverly disguise which country it is, I have seen through your little game.

            It's so obvious now.

            c-h-i-n-a stands for Comoros Happily Integrates Natural Alternatives. Go Comoros!

            All the best,
            Michael
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          • Profile picture of the author Adam1981
            Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

            Actually, the price of oil/gas can only get so high, then alternative fuels will very quickly become the better deal.

            Plus, who do you think is leading the world in green energy tech, like solar and wind? I won't mention the country's name, but its initials are c-h-i-n-a.
            I'm fully aware of that, but to develop this tech, what exactly do you think they are using for power? Three letter word, begins with O.

            Alternative oils are great in theory, the problem is making them. Most biofuels would require a truly massive land mass to meet the USA's current demands. The problem being that the land is already used for food. With an ever growing world population that's not exactly something we can cut down production of.
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            • Profile picture of the author Bill Farnham
              Originally Posted by Adam1981 View Post

              Alternative oils are great in theory, the problem is making them. Most biofuels would require a truly massive land mass to meet the USA's current demands. The problem being that the land is already used for food. With an ever growing world population that's not exactly something we can cut down production of.
              Currently 14% or so of the corn crop in the States is devoted to Ethanal.

              That's a lot of corn being grown as a substitute for fuel, yet it doesn't have a net energy gain. It takes a lot of petro energy to make it.
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              • Profile picture of the author Kurt
                Originally Posted by Adam1981 View Post

                I'm fully aware of that, but to develop this tech, what exactly do you think they are using for power? Three letter word, begins with O.

                Alternative oils are great in theory, the problem is making them. Most biofuels would require a truly massive land mass to meet the USA's current demands. The problem being that the land is already used for food. With an ever growing world population that's not exactly something we can cut down production of.
                Originally Posted by Bill Farnham View Post

                Currently 14% or so of the corn crop in the States is devoted to Ethanal.

                That's a lot of corn being grown as a substitute for fuel, yet it doesn't have a net energy gain. It takes a lot of petro energy to make it.
                Biofuels are only one source of alternative energy, and corn is only one source for producing biodiesel, and probably the most inefficient.

                Sawgrass is far more efficient for biodiesel than corn and takes no "farming" and is draught resistant. And, it's actually the natural grass of the US plains. Once the Ogalala aquifor dries up (which will be soon), we won't be growing much corn on the southern plains anyway, and we'll be back to sawgrass.

                Plus, the midwest is the "Saudi Arabia" of wind power...And the desert SW has as much sunshine as any country. A couple of scientists have said that one 10 mile by 10 mile (100 sq miles) area in Nevada covered by solar collectors could power the entire US.

                The energy isn't the problem. The biggest problem (other than motivation) is that the places where there's wind and sun don't connect to the grid. It's really just a matter of getting the grid to the places that have the energy.
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                • Profile picture of the author HeySal
                  Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

                  Biofuels are only one source of alternative energy, and corn is only one source for producing biodiesel, and probably the most inefficient.

                  Sawgrass is far more efficient for biodiesel than corn and takes no "farming" and is draught resistant. And, it's actually the natural grass of the US plains. Once the Ogalala aquifor dries up (which will be soon), we won't be growing much corn on the southern plains anyway, and we'll be back to sawgrass.

                  Plus, the midwest is the "Saudi Arabia" of wind power...And the desert SW has as much sunshine as any country. A couple of scientists have said that one 10 mile by 10 mile (100 sq miles) area in Nevada covered by solar collectors could power the entire US.

                  The energy isn't the problem. The biggest problem (other than motivation) is that the places where there's wind and sun don't connect to the grid. It's really just a matter of getting the grid to the places that have the energy.

                  There's a strong move right now to preserve prairie lands - and that means planting grasses - with the benefit of using them instead of corn for ethanol. There's less than 1% of tall grass prairie land left, most has been used for corn for ethanol, etc. Corn takes pesticides, degrades soil nutrients, allows for erosion and planting all the grasslands in corn has put many species on the endangered list.

                  By replanting the grasses, which are BETTER for ethanol creation, biodiversity is encouraged. The grasses prevent erosion and water pollution, build rich soil. They take no pesticide to maintain (something that MONSANTO is fighting tooth and nail against). Also cattle can be grazed on non-toxin containing grasses and thrive. They gain weight naturally, do not destroy grasslands, and are eating food that is naturally meant for them. They produce healthier meat.

                  Using MONSANTO crap plants that are ruining the environment makes not one drop of sense when grass converts the environment and takes so little energy to produce a better quality of ethanol. We really have to stop letting our land be destroyed by a company who produces toxic waste for profit.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Kurt
                    Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

                    There's a strong move right now to preserve prairie lands - and that means planting grasses - with the benefit of using them instead of corn for ethanol. There's less than 1% of tall grass prairie land left, most has been used for corn for ethanol, etc. Corn takes pesticides, degrades soil nutrients, allows for erosion and planting all the grasslands in corn has put many species on the endangered list.

                    By replanting the grasses, which are BETTER for ethanol creation, biodiversity is encouraged. The grasses prevent erosion and water pollution, build rich soil. They take no pesticide to maintain (something that MONSANTO is fighting tooth and nail against). Also cattle can be grazed on non-toxin containing grasses and thrive. They gain weight naturally, do not destroy grasslands, and are eating food that is naturally meant for them. They produce healthier meat.

                    Using MONSANTO crap plants that are ruining the environment makes not one drop of sense when grass converts the environment and takes so little energy to produce a better quality of ethanol. We really have to stop letting our land be destroyed by a company who produces toxic waste for profit.
                    Saw grass is the native grass of the praries and I think it's something like 7-8 times more efficient for making bio-fuel than corn. The "problem" is, there's not much profit.

                    And I was reading about the benefits of yaks over cattle...It was pretty interesting actually. Cattle are really tough on the land, and yaks have much less environmental impact and are healthier to eat. I wish I could find the article.
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                    • Profile picture of the author Antonios
                      There are much promoted "savings club" on gas and groceries.

                      I read of "fillerup club" by joseph dutton, Texas, that gives half price rebates on gasoline purchases.

                      I had inquired about how he does it, to give 50% rebates if we are not buying the gas from him, gas is bought at the nearby gas station.

                      But he answered that he wasn't going to giveout his accounting info.

                      Since they don't require members to recruit other members to participate in the program, it doesn't seem to be a ponzi scheme.

                      I opened a thread in the reviews section of WF, to see what other members have experienced with this "fillerup club".

                      A $10 a month membership is required.

                      And a minimum of $200 rebate certificate investment is required to get the rebates. It takes six (6) months to earn the complete rebate. But another $195 is deposited into one's fillerupclub account (fuel tank), so it turns out to be free and even with a profit after the six month time.

                      They refund $65 a month with the $200 rebate certificate.

                      The question is "from where are they earning the funds to refund gas purchases made at the local gas stations"?.

                      Sincerely,

                      Antonios
                      :confused::confused::confused::confused:
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            • Profile picture of the author Kurt
              Originally Posted by Adam1981 View Post

              I'm fully aware of that, but to develop this tech, what exactly do you think they are using for power? Three letter word, begins with O.
              Actually "or" is only a two letter word...Or, we can use many other resources, such as electricity generated by natural gas, solar, wind, hydro-electric, geo-thermal, etc.

              And even if we do use oil, it's a much smarter investment to use it to create tools that use the other resources, so we're only burning oil once to produce things that produce more energy, instead of buring oil over and over and over and over. There's a lot more sun than there is oil.

              BTW, even Iran is converting to electric cars...So they can sell more oil.
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              • Profile picture of the author Bill Farnham
                Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

                And even if we do use oil, it's a much smarter investment to use it to create tools that use the other resources, so we're only burning oil once to produce things that produce more energy, instead of buring oil over and over and over and over.
                This is such common sense it's almost uncommon...
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              • Profile picture of the author Adam1981
                Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

                Actually "or" is only a two letter word...Or, we can use many other resources, such as electricity generated by natural gas, solar, wind, hydro-electric, geo-thermal, etc.

                And even if we do use oil, it's a much smarter investment to use it to create tools that use the other resources, so we're only burning oil once to produce things that produce more energy, instead of buring oil over and over and over and over. There's a lot more sun than there is oil.

                BTW, even Iran is converting to electric cars...So they can sell more oil.
                The kicker is, the technology used to harness many of those is made with rare earth metals that aren't exactly easy to come by. China owns most of the worlds stock and as domestic demand is set to meet supply in the next 1-2 years they are most likely going to either severely restrict or totally stop exporting them.

                In order for these things to be a viable option for global energy supply we need to work out how to harness them using more readily available resources.
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                • Profile picture of the author Kurt
                  Originally Posted by Adam1981 View Post

                  The kicker is, the technology used to harness many of those is made with rare earth metals that aren't exactly easy to come by. China owns most of the worlds stock and as domestic demand is set to meet supply in the next 1-2 years they are most likely going to either severely restrict or totally stop exporting them.

                  In order for these things to be a viable option for global energy supply we need to work out how to harness them using more readily available resources.


                  We don't need no stinking rare metals...

                  Wind turbines can easily be made with very common materials and are actually fairly low tech. Biggest problem is holding up to the elements.

                  Change to Nickel Iron Batteries - From my site:

                  These were perfected by Thomas Edison about 100 years ago. While they cost about 3x the amount of acid batteries, they can last just about forever, there's one in the Smithsonian that's been working for 99 years, and don't reach the maximum power output for about 4 years. Because of the longevity, big industry got them taken off the market in the 1970s.
                  NI-FE batteries are making a comeback due to increased interest in green energy, and the tech for them is GPL.

                  And solar cells can use a variety of common material...But solar cells aren't the most efficient. But they are the easiest for the home user.

                  Solar concentrators used as a heat source for Stirilng engines are the most efficient, and none of these components require rare metals.

                  Here's a very simple example...And the Stirling engine is the most simple engine there is.



                  The combo of a parabolic mirror solar concentrator, stirling engines and
                  Nickel Iron (NI-FE) batteries are how we should/can be headed, IMO.

                  The funny thing is, this is all technology that's 100 years old or older. The NI-FE batteries were invented 100 years ago. The stirling engine almost 200 years ago and the parabolic mirror may have been used by the Ancient Greeks as the Archimedes heat ray more than 2000 years ago. At the very least, they invented the math for it. And wind mills were also invented thousands of years ago.

                  Is there anything really new under the Sun?
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              • Profile picture of the author bob steel
                It's very, very simple and no sacrifice on our part!!

                We boycott Exxon Mobil for the month of May. If we could drop their business by as little as 20 or 30% they would be forced to lower prices. The more we tank their business the faster it will happen. Then all the other gas dealers would be forced to follow and suddenly we'd have a gas price war! A race to the bottom - caused by we the consumers.
                Pass it on!!!
                Lets do it

                copy and paste this and pass it around
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                • Profile picture of the author seasoned
                  Originally Posted by bob steel View Post

                  It's very, very simple and no sacrifice on our part!!

                  We boycott Exxon Mobil for the month of May. If we could drop their business by as little as 20 or 30% they would be forced to lower prices. The more we tank their business the faster it will happen. Then all the other gas dealers would be forced to follow and suddenly we'd have a gas price war! A race to the bottom - caused by we the consumers.
                  Pass it on!!!
                  Lets do it

                  copy and paste this and pass it around
                  Don't you realize that this happens *****ALL THE TIME*****!?!?!? Recently, it happened at a Borders here! It took years, but they FINALLY lowered their prices up to 40%! 40%!!!!!!!! IMAGINE IT! 40 PERCENT! You pay 60 cents on the dollar! HOW do they DO it!?!?!? Oh yeah, I didn't tell you the WHOLE story!

                  Profit=price-cost of business LOSS =loss-recovery price=cost+profit MARGIN

                  If the profit margin can't sustain the cost of business, you LOSE money! Eventually, it is cheaper to sell the inventory for pennies on the dollar than to ship it elsewhere, and it is certainly better than throwing it away.

                  YEP, they closed stores! The best deals are taken quickly.

                  Steve
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                • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
                  Originally Posted by bob steel View Post

                  It's very, very simple and no sacrifice on our part!!

                  We boycott Exxon Mobil for the month of May. If we could drop their business by as little as 20 or 30% they would be forced to lower prices. The more we tank their business the faster it will happen. Then all the other gas dealers would be forced to follow and suddenly we'd have a gas price war! A race to the bottom - caused by we the consumers.
                  Pass it on!!!
                  Lets do it

                  copy and paste this and pass it around
                  I got an even better idea.

                  How about we boycott every idiot who actually thinks this is a good strategy?

                  To be fair, we can also boycott every idiot who forwards messages like these.

                  The only thing this shows is a lack of understanding of how the whole process works. Everybody's entitled to be ignorant though, that's their choice.

                  All the best,
                  Michael
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        • Profile picture of the author Kay King
          Steve -

          What we need to remember is that a few years ago the US was THE market for most of the oil produced. Now we compete with other countries like China and India as those countries develop. If you don't own the resources - you pay the rates of those who do.

          Our problem is our expectation that what we demand we should have - and that gas prices should stay low because we want them to. The lower they are, the more we waste. We have proven that many times.

          We have developed a nation where driving is a pastime and a necessity - and we built in that way because gas was cheap and plentiful. We need to adjust our expectations or we'll be slammed with a big problem in the future.

          When the economy was booming, corporations transferred employees madly from one area of the country to another. The company paid for the move, paid for several months accommodation in the new location, etc. I loved it because I was selling real estate and I sold to a lot of transferred executives in Atlanta. Their corporate bosses paid the closing fees and sometimes the realtor fees as well. At the same time, I wondered why a company would spend so much money shuffling people around.

          You don't see so many transfers today - because companies have cut back and aren't going to waste that money. The question remains - why were corporations practicing such a wasteful tactic in years past? Because the money was flowing freely and they could write it off as well.

          The moment we return to cheaper gas prices, we forget about any potential crisis. It's our nature and not one of our best features.
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  • The problem isn't with the oil companies or the President. Gas went up here because the Saudi's tripled the price of oil per barrel (like they need more money, right?) so, obviously, that gets passed on to the customer. The only way to couter-act that would be if the U.S. started getting our oil somewhere else, or actually started using our reserves. Demand goes down, Saudi's have to lower their price. Simple economics.
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by Bradley J Anderson View Post

      The problem isn't with the oil companies or the President. Gas went up here because the Saudi's tripled the price of oil per barrel (like they need more money, right?) so, obviously, that gets passed on to the customer. The only way to couter-act that would be if the U.S. started getting our oil somewhere else, or actually started using our reserves. Demand goes down, Saudi's have to lower their price. Simple economics.
      They did NOT triple the price of oil. I haven't been watching TOO closely but last I heard it was like $113/barrel. I don't even remember it being $38/barrel! BESIDES, 113 ******WHAT******? DOLLARS! So it is NOT currency, but effectively a zero coupon bond. And how has THAT been affected YEAR TO DATE? The historical reference has a bug, so I couldn't check against gold. I had to check against ANOTHER currency that is hurting, the EURO. It lost about 10% against that! And a crude oil history chart says oil cost $71.21 last year! So OUR cost of oil increased LESS than 49%, from 1/1/2011. And THIS is assuming that their price is END of year. If it is the BEGINNING price, the price increased even LESS! The fact is that NOBODY wants to reduce their lifestyle. People HERE talk about it all the time! So if the dollar drops 50%, they will STILL keep the REAL cost level and we would need to pay twice as much.

      One more thing. A $1 increase on a barrel translates to about $.18 at the pump? NO WAY! That would mean less than 6 gallons of gas per barrel, assuming gas were ALL they get out of it. I don't know about the yield per barrel. Maybe it is kind of low. I doubt it. But gas is not NEARLY the only thing they get from the barrel. The fact is it is 55 gallons. So assuming 80% is usable, they net 44 gallons. If they raised the price on EVERYTHING less than $.03, they would break even. So why did the price of gas increase by 6 times as much?

      BTW if $1-.18, then the price of gas now should be about $20.34/gallon! ($113(cost per barrel)*.18(dollars per barrel effect of increase at the pump))

      Besides, OPEC is saying there is NO shortage.

      Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author Sunfyre7896
      Originally Posted by Bradley J Anderson View Post

      The problem isn't with the oil companies or the President. Gas went up here because the Saudi's tripled the price of oil per barrel (like they need more money, right?) so, obviously, that gets passed on to the customer. The only way to couter-act that would be if the U.S. started getting our oil somewhere else, or actually started using our reserves. Demand goes down, Saudi's have to lower their price. Simple economics.
      Funny you say that. In all actuality, the U.S. gets most of it's oil from sources outside of the Middle East. About 84-85% in actuality comes from other sources. Canada is the largest source as well as South America, the oceans, and Alaska/48 lower states. With only about 15% coming from the Middle East, we could surely just give them the finger, but when you're making millions and millions as well as millions in campaign funds that influence policy, why cut them off?
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    Bradley,

    I don't know who you were responding to. If it was to me, well....

    $50 isn't triple, it is double, and that is SINCE 2008. Since 50 then is like $70+ NOW, it is even LESS than double! And that is WHAT, like $135 in the middle of 2008? So if that were linear, and the dollars were constant, gas would be 4.98 THEN. Of course, the dollar ISN'T constant, so it would have been less. But if currency, and tax, accounts for the difference, it supports my "theory". If it DOESN'T account for the difference it kind of destroys the idea about this being due to the price of oil. That also means that the end of 2008 had gas around 1.48. BTW Gasbuddy says the prices were around 3.87 and 1.62 then! SO, let's see... 19% HIGHER About 8% lower. So there seems to be a correlation, but not a precise one. And this IS a narrow timeframe that straddles that event. Interestingly, that IS about the time things went crazy. BTW, the price of gold went crazy in 2009, and went from 850-1500 a 76% increase! So gas NOW is really about $2.37 in 2008 dollars!

    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author lcombs
    Nobody start their car for one day.
    Don't go to work.
    Don't go to the store.
    Stay home.

    Shut down the entire business world for one day.
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
      Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

      Nobody start their car for one day.
      Don't go to work.
      Don't go to the store.
      Stay home.

      Shut down the entire business world for one day.
      That wouldn't work anyway, the logic is faulty.

      If everybody didn't go to the store on the same day, they would still consume food and other products...then they would simply buy MORE the next time they went shopping.

      However, if everybody would go into full stasis for a day, THAT could work.

      ~M~
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      • Profile picture of the author ThomM
        Just an interesting read Exxon profit up 53 percent; best quarter since 2008's 3Q - Washington Times
        Exxon Mobil earned $9.25 billion in the last three months of 2010, its most profitable quarter since the record third quarter of 2008.The largest publicly traded oil company said Monday that net income grew 53 percent in the fourth quarter as it produced more oil to take advantage of higher prices.
        Global consumption of petroleum products increased during the quarter and oil prices rose 12 percent to an average of $85.14 per barrel. Higher prices made production operations more profitable. Increased demand boosted margins at refineries.
        Exxon joined fellow U.S. oil companies Chevron and ConocoPhillips in reporting vastly improved results.
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

      Nobody start their car for one day.
      Don't go to work.
      Don't go to the store.
      Stay home.

      Shut down the entire business world for one day.
      WOW! If everyone like you, and the YNW, did that for a year, it could save TRILLIONS of dollars, and the world could get back on it's feet! GREAT IDEA! DO IT!

      It is ASTOUNDING that so many believe gas prices are SO high because gas STATION owners want to make a HUGE profit. INCREDIBLE! They even forget that over 50% is tax in some form or another. ONE plan now is to charge refiners MORE! OK, let me get this straight! You INCREASE their costs so they will DECREASE their price? WOW! ANYONE that believes that, send me $100,000! With YOUR logic, you will make maybe a million dollars by paying me a mere $100,000! WHAT A DEAL! HEY, I won't mind! I have ANOTHER theory as to what will happen!

      BTW to all those with those crazy theories. Why are GOLD, MILK, EGGS, TVS, etc.... going up in price? Ever hear of OCCAM'S RAZOR!?!?!? LOOK IT UP! Which reason makes more sense?

      1. That THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of people are conspiring in many industries for some nefarious purpose.

      OR

      2. That the value of currency is dropping and people are reacting to it.

      occam's razor says PICK #2!

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author whateverpedia
    Geez,

    Two pages on this thread and not one mention of Peak Oil.

    The way some people are going on about it, you'd think oil was an infinite resource.

    By the time some of you get your head around what it means, the prices you're paying now will seem like the good old days.

    Learn what it means, and prepare yourself for it.

    If you think you can carry on regardless, or that there's something governments or markets can do about the rising price, you're in for one hell of a shock sometime in the very near future.
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by whateverpedia View Post

      Geez,

      Two pages on this thread and not one mention of Peak Oil.

      The way some people are going on about it, you'd think oil was an infinite resource.

      By the time some of you get your head around what it means, the prices you're paying now will seem like the good old days.

      Learn what it means, and prepare yourself for it.

      If you think you can carry on regardless, or that there's something governments or markets can do about the rising price, you're in for one hell of a shock sometime in the very near future.
      We ALL know it is limited. At least I HOPE we all do. But that is NOT what is currently making the price so high. MANY say the refiners and gas stations DON'T make that much. Before you talk about record profits, etc... Realize that there are licensing, franchise fees, store income, Oil, Other petroleum products(Tar and Asphalt for example), Related chemicals, auto service and payments for MANY other things. ALSO, a PENNY on a gallon of gas can add up QUICK! I don't drive very much, and am only ONE person! If they made $.01/gallon, then that is as much as $.14/week for me! If everyone used gas, only drove locally, etc... that means the industry would make $42,000,000 a WEEK on ONE penny! That means $2,184,000,000 a YEAR! GRANTED, we don't ALL use gas! GRANTED some may use less than I do. But SOME use a LOT more. And what about planes, trains, tractors, etc....? 2BILLION from ONE part of ONE industry for one PENNY is nothing to sneeze at. BTW I was only counting ONE country.

      Oh, and I ALREADY have seen the good old days. This isn't them!

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    Kurt,

    They may be keeping it artificially low in REAL terms, but the dollar is declininng so people THINK it is more expensive. Of course, it doesn't REALLY make any difference because MOST people don't get raises to keep up with inflation so a 50% inflation rate amounts to a 50% pay CUT EVEN though it looks like you have the SAME amount of money.

    REMEMBER, currency varies related to a set value and to currency. For set value, most use GOLD! You can see how gold has SKYROCKETED! But HAS it? Well, look how the dollar relates to other currencies. In most cases, it is going DOWN! Imagine if those people sold something for $9.00, and the dollar dropped 10%. They will SEE the drop, and want to raise the price. After all, the drop is like a pay cut.

    BTW inflation eventually affects EVERYTHING, so if this causes gas to increase, it will also raise alternative methods, and basically automate the cat mouse thing you spoke about. Of course, with solar and wind, the high cost may be spent on the basis that continuing costs are as prevalent. STILL, the INITIAL cost WILL go up.

    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author garyv
    I don't know who keeps coming up w/ these gas station boycott days (probably the oil companies) but they never work, and never will. Because even though you're not buying gas on that particular day, you're still driving just as much. So you'll just have to refill that much more the next day.

    The only way to hurt them is to start carpooling more, and using less gas. Someone should start a huge carpooling website. I'd bet it would go over good in some of the large grid-locked cities, like Chicago, Nashville, or LA. We'd save over $100 a week in our household if we did more carpooling.


    Edit - after writing that, I found this: http://www.erideshare.com/
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by garyv View Post

      I don't know who keeps coming up w/ these gas station boycott days (probably the oil companies) but they never work, and never will. Because even though you're not buying gas on that particular day, you're still driving just as much. So you'll just have to refill that much more the next day.

      The only way to hurt them is to start carpooling more, and using less gas. Someone should start a huge carpooling website. I'd bet it would go over good in some of the large grid-locked cities, like Chicago, Nashville, or LA. We'd save over $100 a week in our household if we did more carpooling.


      Edit - after writing that, I found this: eRideShare.com Carpool / Rideshare Community
      Well, maybe opec would then lower their prices. Let's see, it is about $2.30 NOW. If they cut it in half(UNLIKELY) the refiner price would be $1.15. The pump price would then be about $2.10. DON'T FORGET though! This means the states and US would LOSE MONEY IN TAXES! They would RAISE taxes! The resulting price, if added to the gas, would likely make it about $3.15!

      OH WELL!

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author caseycase
    Personally, I am working on my flux capacitor.
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  • Profile picture of the author Alex Da Kid
    Get a bike.
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  • Profile picture of the author simplybeastz
    Originally Posted by TC3000 View Post

    Please read this entire idea PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE


    Dropping Gas Prices:

    This is not the "Don't Buy Gas for a Day", but it will show you how we can get gas prices back down to $2.00 per gallon.

    If you are tired of the gas prices going up AND they will continue to rise this summer, take time to read this please.

    Phillip Hollsworth offered this good idea.

    This makes MUCH MORE SENSE than the "don't buy gas on a certain day" campaign that was going around a couple of years ago.

    It's worth the consideration. Join the resistance!!!

    I hear we are going to hit close to $5.00 a gallon by Memorial Day, and it might go higher!! Want gas prices to come down?

    We need to make some intelligent, united action. The oil companies just laughed at that because they know we wouldn't continue to hurt ourselves by refusing to buy gas.

    It was more of an inconvenience to us than it was a problem for them, BUT, whoever thought of this idea has come up with a plan that can really work. Please read on and join with us!

    By now you've probably thinking gasoline priced at $2.00 is super cheap. Me too!

    It is currently $3.59 for regular unleaded in my town.

    Now that the oil companies and the OPEC nations has conditioned us to think that the cost of a gallon of gas is CHEAP at $1.50-$1.75, we need to take aggressive action to teach them that BUYERS control the marketplace not the sellers.

    With the prices of gasoline going up more each day, we consumers need to take action. The only way we are going to see the prices of gas come down is if we hit someone in the pocketbook by not purchasing their gas! And, we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves.

    How? Since we all rely on our cars, we can't just stop buying gas, But we CAN have an impact on gas prices if we all act together to force a price war.

    Here's the idea! For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY gasoline from the two biggest (Which now are one), EXXON and MOBIL.

    If they are not selling any gas, they will be inclined to reduce their prices. If they reduce their prices, the other companies will have to follow suit.

    But to have an impact, we need to reach literally millions of Exxon and Mobil gas buyers. It's really simple to do! Now don't wimp out on me at this point.....Keep reading on and I'll explain how simple it is to reach millions of people!!

    This note was sent to 30 people. If each of us send it to at least 10 more (30x10=300) and those 300 send it to at least 10 more (300x10=3000) and so on, by the time the message reaches the sixth group of people, we will have reached over THREE MILLION consumers. If those three million get excited and pass this on to 10 friends each then 30 million people will have been contacted.

    If it goes one more level further, you guessed it - THREE HUNDRED MILLION PEOPLE!!!

    Again, all you have to do is send this to 10 people, that's all!

    If you don't understand how we can reach 300 million and all you have to do is send this to 10 people ... Well, let's face it, you just aren't a mathematician. But I am. So trust me on this one.

    How long will this take? If each of us send this to 10 more people within one day of receipt, all 300 Million people could conceivably be contacted within the next 8 days!!!

    I'll bet you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you!

    Acting together we can make a difference.

    If this makes sense to you, PLEASE pass this message on, I suggest that we not buy from EXXON/MOBIL UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE $2-00 RANGE AND KEEP THEM DOWN. THIS CAN REALLY WORK.

    Keep it going!!!

    P.S. Please keep this concept in mind, to keep gas prices from going up in the future.


    Conclusion: Oil companies have cross the line, understand this; We' er not saying don't buy gas period, you need gas to back and forth to work or to take of your daily routine - what we' er saying don't buy "EXXON and MOBIL". Lets make the Oil Companies feel the pain for a change! There's no website to go to - just pass this information on to your family members, co-workers, neighbors and friends. Let Us All Band Together!
    Take a Visit to the Uk , £1.45 for a Litre! That's Like $1.80 a Litre! That's $8.50 a Gallon. When I went to LA I was amazed at how cheap it was!
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