NWO - 90% population reduction goal

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Is it true or is it crap?

Please provide reasons/evidence/logic....speculation will do if you don't have anything else.

How will they achieve it? (if THEY exist).
  • Profile picture of the author myob
    This idea originated from Michael C. Ruppert, author of Crossing the Rubicon, creator of From The Wilderness (From The Wilderness Publications Home Page), and avowed defender of human freedom. In Ruppert, we have another excellent example of how even the best of intentions can be seduced into the Illuminati plot.

    There is no NWO and there is no chance of one in your life time, the world is too chaotic. Since 2006, "plague drills" have been conducted throughout US and other countries and especially Israel. The danger is expected from terrorists obtaining lethal weapons of mass destruction, which at first was believed to be developed heavily in Iraq. The US, Russia, and other countries have high doses of allergens enough to destroy large population in addition to nuclear weapons. With the chaotic conditions of the world increasing the danger of these weapons falling into the wrong hands is also increasing. These terrorists are becoming increasingly adept at propoganda, cyber warfare, and convincing a conspiracy-theory populace that the goverment is responsible for terrorist activities.

    For example, in 1998, the US government ordered 25 million body bags from DOW Chemical. This huge order was justified by "Within the next 5 to 10 years it would probably be possible to make a new infective microorganism which could differ in certain important aspects from any disease-causing organisms. Most important of these is that it might be refractory to the immunological and therapeutic processes upon which we depend to maintain our relative freedom from infectious disease." To put this in perspective, that quantity, 25 million body bags, is ten times more than all those men and women killed in all US wars COMBINED! (Civil War, World War I, World War II, Korea, Viet Nam, Desert Storm, 1812, Revolution, Spanish American War).

    There are religious extemists who absolutely hate our Industrial Civilization! Further, this hatred is so intense that they want to see it destroyed, to be replaced by a civilization based upon primitive agricultural techniques, like that which existed over 1300 years ago! Only, then, they believe, can mankind truly live peaceful lives that will fulfill our needs and desires. These extremist really do want our entire way of life be destroyed and replaced with the most primitive existence. The danger of depopulation is a real threat indeed, but not from the NWO as the religious terrorists are depending upon the stupidity of the overfed population to believe in the conspiracy theory.
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    • Profile picture of the author Phnx
      Oh yes, it's true. What do you think all that 'overpopulation' and 'sustainability' is all about. Food shortages and water rationing will be their next trick.

      informationliberation - Eugenics and Environmentalism
      American Bioethics Advisory Commission
      World Evolutionary Humanism, Eugenics and UNESCO
      The Greening - The Lawful Path

      Scientifically proving the Malthusian model of sustainability is bollocks, and the solution (which everbody ignores):

      Who is Buckminster Fuller? | The Buckminster Fuller Institute

      Sustainable Development And The Vulnerable

      This will not happen of course, they've been conditioning us for 50 years. Don't believe it? Okay, ponder this:

      Your home is absolutely well stocked with food. One day you notice your neighbour seems to be losing weight. She's pregnant and already has 3 kids to feed. We'll assume her husband is dead or otherwise absent. There is no welfare. What little food she has is given to the kids, and food is being priced out of her reach. When you find out about this you are utterly shocked. Is your instinct:

      a) to seize her and have her sterilized so she doesn't bring more children into the world to "suffer" and cause you distress at having to witness them slowly starving to death. This will of course ensure her genetic line finishes, but you are still distressed and are totally on board with the idea that the humane thing to do is to euthanase her. Problem solved.

      b) share your food with her and her kids. You will still have more than enough for you and yours, but even if you only had enough to get by after sharing you'd still choose that option.

      The vast majority of people would instinctively share their food with their neighbour, without even thinking twice. Yet unbelievably, incredibly, that instinct has been overidden so that the choice in the wider world is essentially a) and not b). A bunch of Nazi's (for that is what they are) have managed to overide that human compassion. They've also overidden the survival instinct and people are willing to cull their own species and even themselves "for the greater good". Jim Jones couldn't have done a better job.

      "Overpopulation" isn't something known by the few, it's mainstream. Those who argue against it are often arguing much like those who don't want to believe tobacco is bad for them (hey I'm a smoker and I know it is). Eventually they'll be worn down. Others "know" it is true, but they don't want to believe it is now that something has to be done. They'll come along eventually. The few like me who used to believe it and started to say "hang on, something isn't right here", well we are growing in number, but we'll never win. Not this one.

      Ask people what comes to mind when they think of "overpopulation". Bet you anything they'll say 'famine' or 'hunger'. And who do they see suffering? 9 times out of 10 the image in their mind will be a Third World nation. And yet removing them will not leave more for us - they barely take anything in the first place. It should logically be the wealthy West that bites the bullet en masse if there really was scarcity. We do after all, take far more than our share.

      You can get people to do anything you want when you control just 2 emotions: fear and hope. Condition them over the years that they are doomed if they don't decrease the population, and continually show the famines in the media (carefully avoiding discussion of the true means they ended up like that. We will also not show too much evidence that shows populations drop when living standards rise). Once that conditioning has 'taken' it acts like an anchor point. Then you offer Hope. The Solution. Depopulation will solve our problems, and the masses leap on it with relief! It will never occur to them that it is the globalist SYSTEM that needs changing. No, they offer themselves -or more accurately OTHER PEOPLE - for the cause. The "cause" of Nazi's.

      If you wonder how a bunch of Nazi's can fool everyone and be in control of the whole environmental movement, well think of the pedophile. He worms his way into teaching jobs, the Church, social services etc. Everyone thinks he is wonderful, so kind and caring and so good with the kids. Yet his Agenda is far different from his public face.

      Dr. Gary North calls it "the most stupendous, unified, worldwide propaganda campaign I've seen in my lifetime."

      They are so much smarter than us, it is frightening.
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      In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane. ~ Oscar Wilde (1854 - 1900)

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      • Profile picture of the author greymatrixx
        What Phnx said..+ Largest terrorist org on this planet the CIA...Criminal Intelligence Agency...Indy
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        • Profile picture of the author Floyd Fisher
          Dig up a copy of 'Global 2000: Report to the President' in your local library. It will tell you everything.
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          • Profile picture of the author myob
            Originally Posted by Floyd Fisher View Post

            Dig up a copy of 'Global 2000: Report to the President' in your local library. It will tell you everything.
            Except for any mention of NWO population control. Pick up a copy of the annual report: Patterns of Global Terrorism. You will find actual achievements of population reduction by extremists.
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            • Profile picture of the author Floyd Fisher
              Originally Posted by myob View Post

              Except for any mention of NWO population control. Pick up a copy of the annual report: Patterns of Global Terrorism. You will find actual achievements of population reduction by extremists.
              Have you ever actually read it? It outlines 4 methods. A cookie to anyone who can list 'em.
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              • Profile picture of the author myob
                Originally Posted by Floyd Fisher View Post

                Have you ever actually read it? It outlines 4 methods. A cookie to anyone who can list 'em.
                Yes, I read this annual report every year it was available to the public from 1999 to 2005 because
                that is part of my business.

                Our policy has four main elements:
                · First, make no concessions to terrorists and strike no deals.
                · Second, bring terrorists to justice for their crimes.
                · Third, isolate and apply pressure on states that sponsor terrorism to force them to change
                their behavior.
                · Fourth, bolster the counterterrorist capabilities of those countries that work with the United
                States and require assistance.


                So where's my cookie?
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                • Profile picture of the author KNG
                  Banned
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                  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
                    Don't believe someone would want to hurt us?

                    Global push for fluoridated water. This is DEADLY - we are led to believe it is good for your teeth when the research ALL says otherwise...once you get flourosis, your teeth will crumble. Not to mention the other damages it does - brain, liver, nervous system, bones, cancer, obesity, kidney failure - the list goes on and includes environmental damage. Yet there is a push going on now to globalize the use of fluoridated water against all the research and evidence. One network - Fluoride Action Network is taking a large stand against it and educating the professionals, politicians, and people about the REAL research...yet still the money is in the corner of the corporations who have no other way to dump this poison other than to make us drink it.

                    Bill C-51 in the house in Canada at this very moment will make it illegal to grow garlic or herbs and also allows for unrestrained search, seizure, and prosecution of anyone in the possession of or growing these healthful items!

                    As evidence piles up for the harm that GM foods do to livestock, we are now fed these without our knowledge - the law to label these foods is gone.

                    America is now letting farmers and distributers to irradiate lettuce, spinach, etc and does not make them label the foods as irradiated - irradiation can kill the enzymes and cause problems with the blood/brain barrier.

                    Pharmaceuticals are so prevelant that they are being leeched into our water supplies - the AP found that 41 million Americans are drinkiing water daily with pharmaceuticals in it.
                    They also found a few places where there was another unamed chemical that officials admitted was added to the water as post 9/11 protection. WTF? They have not disclosed who is getting that chemical or the nature of it.

                    Many diseases have simple cures that are not recognized by the Medical Associations - cures are not allowed by pharmaceutical companies who have worked dillegently to cover up all cures for cancer......they are trying to find a way to make it chronic so you will be forced to eat their drugs to control it for the rest of your life.....bleed your wallet as you die.

                    Chemtrails containing barium. 'nuff said.

                    How about possible pandemic killer flus? Are you getting the info that massive doses of Ascorbic acid can save your life from deadly flus? Many countries are limiting access to Vitamin C - even though it is that important. If you are hospitalized with the flu, you literally have to ask for ascorbic acid infusions, they are not given freely even though they can save you. You could die and never receive this treatment unless you demand it. The information kept from you can KILL you.

                    Iraq - one million dead, and the number grows.
                    Afganistan, Africa --
                    Iran is next - Russia? Claims that WWIII has already started are starting to surface.


                    Mass starvation.
                    Okay - here is where we get into critical mass populations again. People freaked about global warming. Last year we had a global cold snap. Rice crops were destroyed. We also had a shortage due to ethanol of one (maybe 2?) crops - corn. While the ehthanol crop shortage was purposeful, or at negligent, the rice shortage is a natural disaster, not a manmade problem. Many countries stopped or curtailed rice exports to feed their own populations. Rice reserves are very low in some places, gone in others. If this year's crops are again frosted out, we have a massive and very REAL problem on our hands. People will be starving by the millions - and this will not be alliviated by those in control of food distribution. When you put the real crisis on top of the politics of distribution we will see a crisis of unprecidented proportions as temperatures drop. Those in countries that survive on mainly rice already do not have extra to put back for a shortage - they are already in one.

                    Police Militia? 205 dead in America by the beginning of 2008 from police tasers. These were not people who were a threat to police safety. One woman in a wheelchair -most already in cuffs or custody. ALL unarmed.

                    Now I have heard the 90% death plan, but this number has risen with subsequent years. It started out years ago with a world goal of sustained 4 bil, and that is the population that the entire world was doing best at - now the reports have crept down to less than one billion. I see culling going on everyday - but not that massive of an objective as 90% of the population. It seems there is much truth as well as much fiction going on and it would be good if we could find the barrier between the two.
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                    When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
                    Beyond the Path

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                    • Profile picture of the author myob
                      Based on what I have seen, we should focus on getting rid of the ones whose only avowed and published purpose in life is for maximum population reduction by blowing up innocent people. Go after the shadowy ones later if they even exist at all.
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                      • Profile picture of the author HeySal
                        But Paul.....if we don't overpopulate so the elite have their soldiers, who is going to fight the wars for them so they can take over the whole planet while getting rid of the excesses they bred? We've been livestock for a lot of years now. If science hadn't been hushed and the population was kept to 4 bil in the first place, these guys wouldn't have gotten the foothold they needed to take over.

                        I just wonder how many people would be any too upset if someone bombed Bohemian Grove during one of the big league events. A couple of innocent little boys might get killed in the blast though - better a few that probably wouldn't make it out okay anyway than a whole world.

                        I just saw that it is being surmised that we are already in the midst of WWIII. I just can't believe that the troops don't just say "f*** these *******s" and go get the real bad guys instead of continuing to blast innocents off the planet.
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                        Sal
                        When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
                        Beyond the Path

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                        • Profile picture of the author greymatrixx
                          IN ITS SADISTIC BRUTALITY AND IN ITS FLAGRANT VIOLATIONS OF INTERNATIONAL LAW THE CRIMINAL ZIONIST APARTHEID REGIME OF ISRAEL DOES SURPASS THE CRIMES OF THE HITLER REGIME IN FORMER FASCIST GERMANY

                          Benjamin Merhav

                          August 27, 2008

                          The Israeli Bar Association is a zionist organisation to which are affiliated all the Israeli lawyers. It has been a very conservative organisation ,and very loyal to the zionist apartheid regime of Israel. The news item below does reflect therefore the severity of the zionist crimes and the sadistic brutality of this racist and fascist regime. Never before did the Israeli Bar Association dare to expose the regime's war crimes, nor condemn the systematic torture of thousands of Palestinian political prisoners by the zionist Gestapo. So shocking have become those crimes that even this conservative zionist body can no longer maintain its silence.

                          Surely, the news item below is sufficient alert for the international community to put the top zionist war criminals on trial for war crimes and for crimes against humanity this regime has perpetrated for over 60 years now !

                          The Israeli Bar Association: ?Many Palestinian detainees are in solitary confinement since 5 years" - International Middle East Media Center - IMEMC
                          The Israeli Bar Association: “Many Palestinian detainees are in solitary confinement since 5 years"
                          Monday August 25, 2008 22:34

                          by Saed Bannoura - IMEMC & Agencies

                          The Israeli Bar Association issued a report on the Palestinian detainees in Israeli prisons and revealed that there are several detainees who spent many years in solitary confinement without any legal status or charges.



                          The report revealed that those detainees are not defined as administrative detainees, and are imprisoned for extended periods, as high as five years, without charges or trial.

                          The Bar Association added that there are seven detainees in Ayalon and Kitziot detention camps who were placed in solitary confinement five years ago and now they are still in solitary confinement while no charges were filed against them.

                          The Association said that these incidents violate the international law. One of the cases is the case of detainee Mahmoud Az’an, who was kidnapped by the (zionist) army 10 years ago and he is still imprisoned without any charges or trial.

                          The Association also said that the prisons lack the basic components and the basic medical services which increased the number of deaths among the detainees in recent years. The detainees are also repeatedly attacked and abused by the Nahshon Division which is a military branch in charge of transferring the detainees to court or from one prison to another.

                          The report also focused on medical negligence and the insufficient number of physicians and nurses comparing to the high number of detainees. A significant number of detainees who died in recent years died due to medical negligence practiced by the prison administration.

                          AGAINST ZIONIST APARTHEID, PART EIGHT


                          Indy..
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                • Profile picture of the author Floyd Fisher
                  Originally Posted by myob View Post

                  Yes, I read this annual report every year it was available to the public from 1999 to 2005 because
                  that is part of my business.

                  Our policy has four main elements:
                  · First, make no concessions to terrorists and strike no deals.
                  · Second, bring terrorists to justice for their crimes.
                  · Third, isolate and apply pressure on states that sponsor terrorism to force them to change
                  their behavior.
                  · Fourth, bolster the counterterrorist capabilities of those countries that work with the United
                  States and require assistance.


                  So where's my cookie?
                  Nope, not even close. You don't even have the right report.

                  Go down to your local library, and dust off Global 2000: Report to the President and read it. I guarantee it will open your eyes.

                  Here's the wiki on it:

                  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Glo..._the_President
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                  • Profile picture of the author Phnx
                    Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

                    If science hadn't been hushed and the population was kept to 4 bil in the first place, these guys wouldn't have gotten the foothold they needed to take over.
                    No you've got that backward. They lost control of us when we started breeding too fast for them. That's why they are desperate to whittle us down again like we were in their idealistic 'feudalist' system of the Middle Ages. The fewer we are, the easier to control resources (ie they get them cheap or free), the easier to control us.

                    David Rockefellers recent speech where he said "we" (ie the Third World) had to 'slow economic growth' is because they are terrified they'll lose control. Chavez has already made his move and Venezuela is gonna see some major growth now he's kicking the corporatists out. The wealthy Americanised 'middle classes' there aren't happy because they like the way the cake is sliced - the tiny percent at the top get the bulk, the middle classes get a decent chunk and the vast majority don't get enough to live on. Those 'serfs' provide for the 'Masters and they are desperate to keep it that way. Chavez is a damn hero to the peasants. According to Nick Rockfeller 'they' are gonna get him at some point. They've already tried to oust him and the fake 'coup' was caught live as John Pilger was filming there.

                    It's only amongst the affluent West that this brainwashing about 'sustainability' has taken hold. We simply don't want to change the economic model. Our economic model. Or rather theirs. There never has been a 'free market', that's just what they tell the masses so that we don't notice they've rigged the deck. Curious how people who understand how badly they lie, can suddenly imagine they'd tell the truth on this. It's all a front for a COLONIAL LAND GRAB. It's a grubby little CLASS WAR at heart. Always has been. Take a good hard look at the WWF. Thanks to Western 'liberals' they control 40% of Tanzania which just so happens to be loaded with profitable resources...diamonds..cobalt and other precious metals etc. They also control over 10% of the Earths resources and it's growing. Throw in the other 'environmental' groups and it's not a pretty picture.

                    The 1001 Club are in the driving seat of the WWF and they get people like you and me to carry out their agenda. They can't count on me to help them any longer.

                    "1001 Club members Sidney Spiro, Harry Oppenheimer, Sir Val Duncan, Maurice Strong and Sir Eric Drake. They represented corporations and banks as Anglo-American, De Beers, Charter, Rio Tinto, the Anglo-Iranian Oil Company and BP, the British Newfoundland Corporation, Société Générale pour l'Energie et les Ressources, the International Energy Development Corporation, P&O shipping, the Bank of England, Barclays and Hambro. Duncan and Strong were close associates of Edmund de Rothschild. Strong, also a close associate of the Rockefellers, used to be a key player in the elitist-version of the UN sustainable development movement, in which it seemingly is the idea to hand over ownership of all national resources to the UN Security Council."

                    And guess who pulls the strings of the Security Council?

                    1001 Club - Institute for the Study of Globalization and Covert Politics

                    That's what The Wildlands Project is all about where the UN is slicing America into 'wilderness zones' and planning to herd the rest of you into cities. Too many of you of course, so most of you will have to go. They'll 'preserve' those areas just like they are 'preserving' others around the world by helping themselves to the resources while preventing anyone else from using them. Those who campaigned for 'biofuels' played straight into their hands, and they now have control of that industry too.

                    I just wonder how many people would be any too upset if someone bombed Bohemian Grove during one of the big league events. A couple of innocent little boys might get killed in the blast though - better a few that probably wouldn't make it out okay anyway than a whole world.
                    I've wondered that myself, you could pack plenty of explosives in that Owl. Any terrorist organization worth their salt should have made an attempt by now. However, as was pointed out to me, most 'terrorists' around the world are often funded by many of these people. Guess they don't want to destroy their paymaster. Wouldn't be surprised if some patriot group in the future attempted something though. At the moment it seems protesters just hold banners up as the nobs enter the compound.

                    I just saw that it is being surmised that we are already in the midst of WWIII. I just can't believe that the troops don't just say "f*** these *******s" and go get the real bad guys instead of continuing to blast innocents off the planet.
                    Why on earth would they? The majority over there believe the lie. Should Martial Law ever be declared the majority of police will believe the lie that it is for the greater good and protection of America. Their perception will be altered to ensure it. No amount of evidence will persuade the majority that it's all a lie. Especially the sheer SCALE of it. How can they conceive such a thing? You've seen how many people react when you show reputable, creditable people questioning 9/11. Still they refuse to consider the evidence. Just like you continue to believe the lie of sustainability and overpopulation and no amount of evidence will sway you. You are really not in a position to condemn them.

                    Sure there may be protests, but it's the usual Left/Right paradigm. Bushco are evil so get someone else in and all is right with the world. Good Cop/Bad Cop. Nothing changes because they control our perceptions. Until we regain control of our own minds - if we ever had that - then they can shape the world in whatever way they wish and we'll help them do it, even to our detriment.

                    Here's an interesting analysis of the MSM using NLP on us. This is Hannity & Colmes interviewing a Professor talking about 9/11, but while Fox is often blatant, it really applies to most Western Media to a greater or lesser degree. And that includes the environmental movements, eductation, medical science etc. They ALL lie, and they get well meaning people to give 'Truth' to the lies.


                    Here's an amusing 'subliminal' one with George Bush on election day: every time he says "who do you trust?" there is a faint ringing phone in the background. Every time people heard a ringing phone during that day they subconsciously associated it with the word 'trust'. Trust=George Bush. Unless they actively distrusted him before, he'd now be perceived to be trustworthy at the time of vote casting in his home town. It really is that easy! All you have to do is make sure your subliminals take hold before the 'other side' get in there. They do all this shit because it works!


                    It's a common belief that you can't do something you wouldn't normally do under 'hynosis' - say, murder your Mother. How can I put this....yes you can. You merely change the perception so the perceiver sees someone other than the Mother. The intelligence agencies have been working on this since the end of WW2. Subliminals and NLP in advertising, politics, education etc also changes our perceptions to get us do what the 'button pushers' want. They are merely more subtle about it, and must use repetition. When they 'anchor' it with a powerful emotional 'punch' (especially fear) then they are effectively shaping our beliefs in the direction they wish, and hence controlling our minds.

                    Their greatest feat so far has been to do what is effectively a mass 'Jim Jones' on us, and persuade us that in order to 'save the Earth' we must drink that Kool Aid for the greater good.

                    Now do you see why I compare us to trusting children? These dudes are FORMIDABLE.

                    An excellent metaphor for what's going on and how our attention is misdirected to place blame elsewhere so they can work unimpeded, is John Carpenters film "They Live". Crap special effects though.
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                    In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane. ~ Oscar Wilde (1854 - 1900)

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                    • Profile picture of the author Phnx
                      And here's their plans weaving their magic. Why do I say "magic"? Because by 'sleight of hand' they've had a seemingly mesmerising effect on people to displace blame as usual. This crystalizes more than anything, how we are manipulated.

                      In spite of the frost and failure of rice crops there was still a bumper crop yield - including rice - in the 2007-2008 season according to the charities Food Aid and Grain. They should know. Those organizations are not just fighting against the corporate monsters, but the liberals who are doing their dirty work for them. FFS what people should be doing is demanding that Cargill Corp - who control 85% of the worlds grain, release that rice they are currently sitting on, at cost price. Threaten them with corporate manslaughter, or mass murder. Threaten to nationalize the *******s! Threaten to jail the speculators and remove their profits.

                      Cargill bought dirt cheap and they are sitting on it while prices spiral upwards. Farmers are selling on the open market rather than to the governments or usual sources. I normally sympathise with farmers, but not this time. You betcha ass rice stocks are low - governments will only top up their reserves when prices are low. They are sky high at the moment so few can afford to buy much. The shortages are NOT because the grains aren't there physically. If people bother to read this article from GRAIN they won't be able to continue deluding themselves by misplacing the blame on "Mother Nature" or "too many people to feed". People are dying because of the manipulated beliefs of Westerners, which enables them to continue doing this.

                      Don't be surprised if they offer genetically modified grains as the solution to this 'crisis'. Problem. Reaction. Solution.

                      DON'T DO THEIR DAMN WORK FOR THEM!

                      As people don't click links I'll just paste it in. (Bolding certain sentences is mine.) Read it and weep for us poor malleable pawns:


                      Making a killing from hunger

                      We need to overturn food policy, now!

                      GRAIN

                      [See also this page with more documents and links]

                      For some time now the rising cost of food all over the world has taken households, governments and the media by storm. The price of wheat has gone up by 130% over the last year.[1] Rice has doubled in price in Asia in the first three months of 2008 alone,[2] and just last week it hit record highs on the Chicago futures market.[3] For most of 2007 the spiralling cost of cooking oil, fruit and vegetables, as well as of dairy and meat, led to a fall in the consumption of these items.

                      From Haiti to Cameroon to Bangladesh, people have been taking to the streets in anger at being unable to afford the food they need. In fear of political turmoil, world leaders have been calling for more food aid, as well as for more funds and technology to boost agricultural production. Cereal exporting countries, meanwhile, are closing their borders to protect their domestic markets, while other countries have been forced into panic buying.

                      Is this a price blip? No. A food shortage? Not that either. We are in a structural meltdown, the direct result of three decades of neoliberal globalisation.

                      Farmers across the world produced a record 2.3 billion tons of grain in 2007, up 4% on the previous year. Since 1961 the world's cereal output has tripled, while the population has doubled. Stocks are at their lowest level in 30 years, it's true,[4] but the bottom line is that there is enough food produced in the world to feed the population. The problem is that it doesn't get to all of those who need it. Less than half of the world's grain production is directly eaten by people. Most goes into animal feed and, increasingly, biofuels - massive inflexible industrial chains.

                      In fact, once you look behind the cold curtain of statistics, you realise that something is fundamentally wrong with our food system. We have allowed food to be transformed from something that nourishes people and provides them with secure livelihoods into a commodity for speculation and bargaining. The perverse logic of this system has come to a head. Today it is staring us in the face that this system puts the profits of investors before the food needs of people.

                      Market realities
                      The policy makers who have shaped today's world food system - and who are supposed to be responsible for averting such catastrophes - have come out with a number of explanations for the current crisis that everyone has heard over and over again: drought and other problems affecting harvests; rising demand in China and India where people are supposedly eating more and better than in the past; crops and lands being massively diverted into biofuel production; and so on. All of these issues, of course, are contributing to the current food crisis. But they do not account for the full depth of what is happening. There is something more fundamental at work, something that brings all these issues together, and which the world's finance and development chiefs are keeping out of public discussion.

                      Nothing that the policy makers say should obscure the fact that today's food crisis is the outcome of both an incessant push towards a "Green Revolution" agricultural model since the 1950s and the trade liberalisation and structural adjustment policies imposed on poor countries by the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund since the 1970s. These policy prescriptions were reinforced with the establishment of the World Trade Organisation in the mid-1990s and, more recently, through a barrage of bilateral free trade and investment agreements. Together with a series of other measures, they have led to the ruthless dismantling of tariffs and other tools that developing countries had created to protect local agricultural production.

                      These countries have been forced to open their markets and lands to global agribusiness, speculators and subsidised food exports from rich countries. In that process, fertile lands have been diverted away from serving local food markets to the production of global commodities or off-season and high-value crops for Western supermarkets. Today, roughly 70% of all so-called developing countries are net importers of food.[5] And of the estimated 845 million hungry people in the world, 80% are small farmers.[6] Add to this the re-engineering of credit and financial markets to create a massive debt industry, with no control on investors, and the depth of the problem becomes clear.

                      Agricultural policy has completely lost touch with its most basic goal of feeding people. Hunger hurts and people are desperate. The UN World Food Programme estimates that recent price hikes have meant that an additional 100 million people can no longer afford to eat adequately.[7] Governments are frantically seeking shelter from the system. The fortunate ones, with export stocks, are pulling out of the global market to cut their domestic prices off from the skyrocketing world prices. With wheat, export bans or restrictions in Kazakhstan, Russia, Ukraine and Argentina mean that a third of the global market has now been closed off.

                      The situation with rice is even worse: China, Indonesia, Vietnam, Egypt, India and Cambodia have banned or severely restricted exports, leaving just a few sources of export supply, mainly Thailand and the US. Countries like Bangladesh can't buy the rice they need now because the prices are so high. For years the World Bank and the IMF have told countries that a liberalised market would provide the most efficient system for producing and distributing food, yet today the world's poorest countries are forced into an intense bidding war against speculators and traders, who are having a field day.

                      Hedge funds and other sources of hot money are pouring billions of dollars into commodities to escape sliding stock markets and the credit crunch, putting food stocks further out of poor people's reach.[8] According to some estimates, investment funds now control 50-60% of the wheat traded on the world's biggest commodity markets.[9] One firm calculates that the amount of speculative money in commodities futures - markets where investors do not buy or sell a physical commodity, like rice or wheat, but merely bet on price movements - has ballooned from US$5 billion in 2000 to US$175 billion to 2007.[10]

                      The situation today is untenable. Look at Haiti. A few decades ago it was self-sufficient in rice. But conditions on foreign loans, particularly a 1994 package from the IMF, forced it to liberalise its market. Cheap rice flooded in from the US, backed by subsidies and corruption, and local production was wiped out.[11] Now prices for rice have risen 50% since last year and the average Haitian can't afford to eat. So people are taking to the streets or risking their lives to journey by boat to the US.

                      Food protests have also erupted in West Africa, from Mauritania to Burkina Faso. There, too, structural adjustment programmes and food-aid dumping have destroyed the region's own rice production, leaving people at the mercy of the international market. In Asia, the World Bank constantly assured the Philippines, even as recently as last year, that self-sufficiency in rice was unnecessary and that the world market would take care of its needs.[12] Now the government is in a desperate plight: its domestic supply of subsidised rice is nearly exhausted and it cannot import all it needs because traders' asking prices are too high.

                      Making a killing from hunger
                      The truth about who profits and who loses from our global food system has never been more obvious. Take the most basic element of food production: soil. The industrial food system is a chemical-fertiliser junkie. It needs more and more of the stuff just to keep alive, eroding soils and their potential to support crop yields in the process. In the current context of tight food supplies, the small clique of corporations that control the world's fertiliser market can charge what they want - and that's exactly what they are doing. Profits at Cargill's Mosaic Corporation, which controls much of the world's potash and phosphate supply, more than doubled last year.[13] The world's largest potash producer, Canada's Potash Corp, made more than US$1 billion in profit, up more than 70% from 2006.[14] Panicking now about future supplies, governments are becoming desperate to boost their harvests, giving these corporations additional leverage. In April 2008, the joint offshore trading arm for Mosaic and Potash hiked the price of its potash by 40% for buyers from Southeast Asia and by 85% for those from Latin American. India had to pay 130% more than last year, and China 227% more.[15]

                      Table 1. Profit increase for some of the world's largest fertiliser corporations

                      Company Profits 2007 (US$ million)
                      Increase from 2006
                      (%)
                      Potash Corp (Canada)
                      1,100
                      72%
                      Yara (Norway)
                      1,116
                      44%
                      Sinochem (China)
                      1,100
                      95%
                      Mosaic (US)
                      708
                      141%
                      ICL (Israel)
                      535
                      43%
                      K + S (Germany)
                      420
                      2.8%

                      Source: Compiled from corporate reports

                      While big money is being made from fertilisers, it is just a sideline for Cargill. Its biggest profits come from global trading in agricultural commodities, which, together with a few other big traders, it pretty much monopolises. On 14 April 2008, Cargill announced that its profits from commodity trading for the first quarter of 2008 were 86% higher than the same period in 2007. "Demand for food in developing economies and for energy worldwide is boosting demand for agricultural goods, at the same time that investment monies have streamed into commodity markets," said Greg Page, Cargill's chairman and chief executive officer. "Prices are setting new highs and markets are extraordinarily volatile. In this environment, Cargill's team has done an exceptional job measuring and assessing price risk, and managing the large volume of grains, oilseeds and other commodities moving through our supply chains for customers globally."[16]

                      Table 2. Profit increase for some of the world's largest grain traders

                      Company Profits 2007 (US$ million)
                      Increase from 2006 (%)
                      Cargill (US)
                      2,340
                      36%
                      ADM (US)
                      2,200
                      67%
                      ConAgra (US)
                      764
                      30%
                      Bunge (US)
                      738
                      49%
                      Noble Group (Singapore)
                      258
                      92%
                      Marubeni (Japan)
                      90*
                      43%*

                      Source: Compiled from corporate reports
                      *Data is for Marubeni's Agri-Marine division only.
                      Absent from this list is Louis Dreyfus (France), a private agricultural commodities trader with annual sales in excess of US$22 billion, which does not report its profits.

                      Managing and assessing are not so difficult for a company like Cargill, with its near monopoly position and a global team of analysts the size of a UN agency. Indeed, all of the big grain traders are making record profits. Bunge, another big food trader, saw its profits of the last fiscal quarter of 2007 increase by US$245 million, or 77%, compared with the same period of the previous year. The 2007 profits registered by ADM, the second largest grain trader in the world, rose by 65% to a record US$2.2 billion. Thailand's Charoen Pokphand Foods, a major player in Asia, is forecasting revenue growth of 237% this year.

                      The world's big food processors, some of which are commodity traders themselves, are also cashing in. Nestlé's global sales grew 7% last year. "We saw this coming, so we hedged by forward-buying raw materials", says François-Xavier Perroud, Nestlé's spokesman.[17] Margins are up at Unilever, too. "Commodity pressures have increased sharply, but we have successfully offset these through timely pricing action and continued delivery from our savings programmes", says Patrick Cescau, Group CEO of Unilever. "We will not sacrifice our margins and market share."[18] The food corporations don't seem to be making these profits off the back of the retailers. UK supermarket Tesco reports profits up 12.3% from last year, a record rise. Other major retailers, such as France's Carrefour and the US's Wal-Mart, say that food sales are the main factor sustaining their profit increases.[19] Wal-Mart's Mexican division, Wal-Mex, which handles a third of overall food sales in Mexico, reported an 11% increase in profits for the first quarter of 2008. (At the same time Mexicans are demonstrating in the streets because they can no longer afford to make tortillas.[20])

                      It seems that nearly every corporate player in the global food chain is making a killing from the food crisis. The seed and agrochemical companies are doing well too. Monsanto, the world's largest seed company, reported a 44% increase in overall profits in 2007.[21] DuPont, the second-largest, said that its 2007 profits from seeds increased by 19%, while Syngenta, the top pesticide manufacturer and third-largest company for seeds, saw profits rise 28% in the first quarter of 2008.[22]

                      Such record profits have nothing to do with any new value that these corporations are producing and they are not one-off windfalls from a sudden shift in supply and demand. Instead, they are a reflection of the extreme power that these middlemen have accrued through the globalisation of the food system. Intimately involved with the shaping of the trade rules that govern today's food system and tightly in control of markets and the ever more complex financial systems through which global trade operates, these companies are in perfect position to turn food scarcity into immense profits. People have to eat, whatever the cost.

                      The urgent need for a policy rethink
                      The larger backdrop to this perverse food market situation is the global financial system, which is now teetering on its flimsy axis. What began as a localised housing loan collapse in the US in 2007 has unravelled into something far more serious, as people realise that the emperors of the global financial system have no clothes. The world economy is living on debt that no one can pay. While central bankers and Lear jet executives try to patch the holes and restore confidence, the underlying truth is that the system is close to bankruptcy and no one in power wants to take the necessary tough measures: not the IMF, nor the World Bank, nor the leaders of the world's most powerful nations. Not much more than public relations glitter can be expected from the G8 meeting in June.

                      Similar problems lie at the heart of the food crisis: an ideologically driven elite has forced countries to wrench open markets and let the free market run, so that a few megacorporations, investors and speculators can take huge payoffs. Many countries have lost that most basic power: the ability to feed themselves. This loss, coupled with the corruption that plagues our countries and trading systems, shows that neoliberalism has lost any legitimacy that it might once have had. It is a measure of how out of touch these ideologues are that many now openly call for more trade liberalisation as a solution to the food crisis, with some even proposing that the rules of the WTO be changed to prevent countries from imposing export restrictions on food.[23]

                      The World Bank president, Robert Zoellick, has tried to win the world over with his call for a "New Deal" to solve the hunger crisis, but there is nothing new about it: he calls for more trade liberalisation, more technology and more aid. Today's food crisis is the direct result of decades of these policies, which must now be rejected. While immediate action is necessary to lower food prices and to get food to those who need it, we also need radical changes in agricultural policy so that small farmers around the world gain access to land and can make a living from it.

                      We need policies that support and protect farmers, fishers and others to produce food for their families, for the local markets and for people in cities, rather than money for an abstract international commodity market and a tiny clan of corporate boardroom executives. And we need to strengthen and promote the use of technologies based on the knowledge and in the control of those who know how to grow food. To put it another way, we need food sovereignty, now - the kind that is defined and driven by small farmers and fisherfolk themselves.

                      Social movements around the globe have been struggling to promote such a reversal of strategy, only to be dismissed as unrealistic and backward by those in power, and often violently repressed. The glimmer of hope in this crisis is that the situation can be reversed. Peasant organisations have concrete proposals about what needs to be done to resolve the crisis in their countries, and governments should listen to what they are saying. Already some governments are talking of a policy change towards food self-reliance.[24] Others are starting to question the fundamental rationale of pushing for more free trade. Neoliberal hawks at the top of the global food policy pyramid have lost whatever credibility they may think they once had. It is time for them to move out of the way so that the visions of food sovereignty and agrarian reform that come from the grassroots can take their place and get us out of this hellish mess.


                      Going further:Further References: GRAIN | "Against the grain" | 2008 | Making a killing from hunger
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                  • Profile picture of the author myob
                    Originally Posted by Floyd Fisher View Post

                    Nope, not even close. You don't even have the right report.

                    Go down to your local library, and dust off Global 2000: Report to the President and read it. I guarantee it will open your eyes.

                    Here's the wiki on it:

                    The Global 2000 Report to the President - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
                    That report was published once. I was referring to the annual report published from 1999-2005: Patterns of Global Terrorism. You will find actual achievements of population reduction by extremists.
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                    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
                      Such pessimism and angst.

                      Outside today I teased a ladybug found on the leaf of a rosebush. I watched 2 ants carrying their huge crumbs diligently through the grass and cut some flowers to bring inside. I refilled bird feeders emptied by greedy Cardinals and on the oak trees it seems the Spanish Moss blown away by Katrina may be finally making a comeback.

                      Driving across the bridge I saw 3 brown pelicans gliding along beside my car and the Least Terns are hatching on the beach.

                      Would my life have been better today if I had worried about conspiracies and looked for evidence of population reduction? Would theorizing about plots and secret societies have added value to my life today?

                      Don't think so.

                      kay
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                      • Profile picture of the author Tiger
                        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

                        Such pessimism and angst.


                        Its good to be neither too negative or too positive.

                        Balanced is good.

                        Having an easy life is great. But the 40,000 children
                        who died needlessly of starvation yesterday deserve a
                        voice.

                        /Steve
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                      • Profile picture of the author Barry Walls
                        With the greatest respect Kay, this is the mindset that is necessary for any take over to happen. History seldom repeats...but it often rhymes. Movements like these need to be nipped in the bud when they arise in the social consciousness before they get out of control. All that needs to happen for them to gain critical mass is apathy...its all they've ever needed.

                        When the Nazis came for the communists,
                        I remained silent;
                        I was not a communist.
                        When they locked up the social democrats,
                        I remained silent;
                        I was not a social democrat.

                        When they came for the trade unionists,
                        I did not speak out;
                        I was not a trade unionist.

                        When they came for the Jews,
                        I remained silent;
                        I wasn't a Jew.

                        When they came for me,
                        there was no one left to speak out.

                        Sure, it may not affect you...but do you have children? These people seem to be playing a VERY long game. Their goal isn't personal power, but eternal power of their descendants...and the enslavement/eradication of yours.

                        What were you doing when this happened mommy? Well sweetie...I was enjoying the lady bugs!

                        Whats a lady bug mommy? Do they have them in Central Human Zone 5?

                        Barry
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                        • Profile picture of the author myob
                          I watched a firefly dance across the sky, darting from rose to rose. Reminds me of a poem from many years ago when fireflies would form like waves of living sparks across the starlit sky:

                          Like waves of living sparks
                          the brilliant kind
                          light a way
                          tangling the little love-lights
                          fireflies
                          twilight is coming
                          and for this occasion
                          rival the very stars.
                          tiny miracles
                          luminescence without incandescence.
                          stars in their courses
                          think only of illumination
                          firefly light
                          the visible part
                          the spectrum
                          illuminational
                          luminous firefly.
                          cooler than the air
                          of the summer night
                          fingers capture their yellow beams
                          between flashes of the air
                          flash little beacons

                          Alas, they are not as plentiful as in years gone by. Could it be part of the conspiracy?
                          Lights out for fireflies
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                        • Profile picture of the author Jeremy123
                          Hi Barry,

                          I'd like to sign-up to get your affiliate materials,
                          but the box goes to low so I can't click ok.
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                          • Profile picture of the author myob
                            Originally Posted by Jeremy123 View Post

                            Hi Barry,

                            I'd like to sign-up to get your affiliate materials,
                            but the box goes to low so I can't click ok.
                            You won't need it in the NWO.
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                        • Profile picture of the author HeySal
                          No you've got that backward. They lost control of us when we started breeding too fast for them. That's why they are desperate to whittle us down again like we were in their idealistic 'feudalist' system of the Middle Ages. The fewer we are, the easier to control resources (ie they get them cheap or free), the easier to control us.
                          Yeah that's what they want you to think. It takes the larger numbers to create chaos. Small numbers can unify easier and can support a unified goal easier....with large numbers you get chaos. They needed the large numbers to create enough conflicting problems to cause enough dis-unification to be able to slide through the cracks. Divide and conquer works much better if the populations are large and dis-unified. There would have been no way to pull off a NWO 30 years ago when our population was able to achieve unity on anything.....they had to do all the construction in hiding. You have people chasing their tails over all sorts of issues now and only the few are hitting on the core problem and attempting to irradicate that, realizing that you have to kill the root to kill the plant. It is becoming impossible for people to be pulled away from their little "key" terror issues into a comprehensive army against the controllers. Many have already succumbed and have been rendered drooling idiots whose only purpose is to mindlessly man increasingly fascist corporations and fuel the elite. They block all attempts at boycott via refusal to work or buy from fascists and allow dangerous entities such as Monsanto and AT$T to proliferate.
                          There are still enough awake to fight - but the dis-unification has made them useless to themselves or anyone else. Our only hope is that the small number of those who are awake can be unified effectively and that, at this point, is not highly likely. Just watch our protests here - they are becoming more agressive, but they still are not unified in purpose of which there is only one true one -- SAVE THE CONSITITUTION. All other problems will be erradicated if we can unify for that purpose. But we have the masses of droolers which they needed working against us feeding the corporate controllers- how do you pull masses of droolers out of the safety of their jobs and the comforts of consumerism? We could have worked a small number of them away, but we have masses of human fodder in our way now fueling the system, albiet unintentionally and with no understanding of their function. They are unreachable because of their numbers. They are able to herd into their own groups to avoid unpleasant decisions. They have no understanding that their real job is to feed the elitist machine nor can they foresee that once the take over takes place they will not be needed any further.

                          Nope - this couldn't have happened in a smaller population - we had to be put over carrying capacity - and when we wouldn't go there, they brought in illegals to do the job for us while creating one more diversification of unity in the process. It is all so brilliantly constructed at least we have to give credit to the intellect of the constructors. Unfortunately - brilliance used in this manor is not a good thing.................
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                          • Profile picture of the author Phnx
                            Originally Posted by HeySal View Post


                            Nope - this couldn't have happened in a smaller population
                            The chaos couldn't have resulted with less people, true, but the chaos is designed to take us back to their most effective system. NWO is just a new name for the Old (feudalist) World Order. It was only when plague wiped out too many of us, that there were then too few people to do the work. Unless they wanted to get their own hands dirty they had no choice but to cave in to the demands of this suddenly 'uppity' peasantry. The peasants knew their value now and while they could be bribed to work on some Nobs land, they could no longer be forced. The Industrial Revolution really put the seal on it.

                            They've been trying to get us back in our box ever since and they'll do it via economic clout. People can't travel if they can't afford the fuel. Carbon Credits really is a return of Sumptuary Law and of course the rich always bought themselves out of that, just as they can buy carbon credits now. If people have no money left over after paying for food and essentials then all they'll be concerned with in the future is survival. Just like back in the good old days of feudalism.

                            None of the economic strangleholds will ever effect the elite even if the whole system crashes. They can ride it out and fashion things back to the way they 'should' be (in their minds) once the dust has settled.

                            Our utility companies have just apologised for raising prices yet again - with promises that there'll likely be another hike before the year is out. For a lot of people this winter it's gonna be a choice between shivering their ass off or going hungry. Not the utility companies fault they whine, prices have risen soooo high (of course they have, the *******s are manipulating the Futures markets). But of course that means all their profits are down and they are having a bad time of it too. Except no.....at the same time as they announced the hike they were throwing a party to announce record profits of over a billion pounds (about $2billion ). As the previous article showed, the supermarkets are also not allowing a dent in their profits like they would have in previous years - business seems to be viewed as a cash cow now, and whatever happens it's the customer who gets screwed.

                            What they are doing is tantamount to saying "let them eat cake" and such actions are what cause deep social unrest - which we know would play right into "their" hands.There was a time when a Labour Government would have said "you lot are taking the piss so we are nationalizing the whole industry". Not happening now, "New" Labour have abandoned any pretence to socialism and concern over the 'working man' and are basically sitting back and letting these greedy *******s fleece the public.

                            - we had to be put over carrying capacity - and when we wouldn't go there, they brought in illegals to do the job for us while creating one more diversification of unity in the process. It is all so brilliantly constructed at least we have to give credit to the intellect of the constructors. Unfortunately - brilliance used in this manor is not a good thing.................
                            Geez, still with the overcarrying bollox. Until you take a look at the contrary evidence which highlights the SYSTEM at fault and not the "too many people" or "scarce resources", you are not in a position to start condemning your fellow citizens for not 'waking up' and looking at the evidence. The illegals are there to help dismantle National Identity - which is happening all over the world - as the whole point of a One World Government is that ultimately there will be ONE world culture, currency, religion etc. They've mentioned that numerous times, "national sovereignty must be surrended", and the EU, NAU, African Union etc are steps to that ultimate goal.

                            Mass immigration on this unprecedented level provides a focus for social strife, because while they are busy manipulating the markets so there appears to be 'shortages' and Joe Public starts blaming anyone 'not them' for their suffering, they can carry on doing what they are doing. (Swedens famed Welfare System is now on the verge of collapse because of the massive influx of Muslim immigrants and the identity of that country is rapidly changing.)

                            It's also a perfect excuse to bring in Martial Law when the tensions spill over. I wouldn't be at all surprised if in the US case the Mexicans have been specifically told (or even paid by vested interests) to march in the streets and goad you with the chants that they are "taking it back". It's an illogical way for illegals to behave if they merely want acceptance, unless the aim is to enrage you all into civil disturbance.

                            You want less people? It's very simple and doesn't involve killing them, or denying them liberty by enforcing birth control. RAISE THEIR STANDARD OF LIVING. The birthrate goes down dramatically every damn time, in every culture. To do that for everyone though, we'd have to completely change the globalist system. This is obviously not on the cards though, as they'd lose all their control, not to mention profits. As the idea is to get us back to a feudalist system under ONE World Government, they are obviously not inclined to share the spoils with the serfs. Therefore they'd have to be forced into it. But how is this likely when they have convinced people - especially nice caring liberals - to help them with their Agenda by manipulating their beliefs so that they genuinely believe it's for the 'greater good'?
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  • Profile picture of the author Tiger
    Originally Posted by bigjock View Post

    Is it true or is it crap?

    TRUE.

    Abortion. 3000 per day in my country alone, and how
    many more in China per day.


    40,000 children a day die of starvation.


    Of course there is population control underway.


    It could all be undone so easily just by making
    people care.... umm ... maybe that isnt
    so easy. . Remember the old statistic ? All the hunger
    in the world could be wiped out with what America throws
    in their trash.



    Also, the Europeans have been using biological warfare ( at least )
    since their invasion of Mexico. It killed many of the Indians
    before Cortez even landed.
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    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      This idea originated from Michael C. Ruppert, author of Crossing the Rubicon, creator of From The Wilderness (From The Wilderness Publications Home Page), and avowed defender of human freedom.
      This "idea" originated in the Rothschild Manifesto - a document which outlines how the world can be taken over by the financial few, and uses the mechanics of electricity to relate the the mechanics of society to depict the actions of the group - and does so quite successfully, I might add. It has also proven excessively accurate to date.

      If we could recalibrate our social energy we could zap the *******s.
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      • Profile picture of the author gareth
        By killing people of course.

        Ha ha ha hahaaaa.

        killem.

        Seroiusly I find the naivety of the whining and bitching here in the OT quite humourous.

        I'm glad its not my affliction.

        I'm into guru flaming - good day.

        Now... wheres that moffatt c**t ? wait no i harrassed him already this week.
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        • Profile picture of the author Barry Walls
          This wont be a popular answer, but I dont think population reduction is a bad idea. Not for a NWO, bequeath the earth to a handful of bloodlines, type agenda, but for a green, quality of life agenda.

          Not killing people, but managing population down to more sustainable levels over a few centuries. I think that eventually ticks can kill a dog if there are enough of them...and humans are like ticks on the earth. We cannot keep mining, farming, spraying, polluting and urbanising.

          It just cant go on forever...there has to be a tipping point.

          Barry
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          • Profile picture of the author Tiger
            Originally Posted by bigjock View Post

            This wont be a popular answer, but I dont think population reduction is a bad idea.
            Of course you do. You are still here.


            /Steve
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          • Profile picture of the author gareth
            what about in 30 years when there are more robots than people anyway.

            All this sustainablity stuff is hogwash - a creation of technological ignorance.

            Read a few books by hans moravec and ray kurzweil.
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          • Profile picture of the author myob
            Originally Posted by bigjock View Post

            This wont be a popular answer, but I dont think population reduction is a bad idea.
            Let's start now. Who wants to go first?
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            • Profile picture of the author HeySal
              Originally Posted by myob View Post

              Let's start now. Who wants to go first?
              Um...we can start with the American politicians, and then go to birth control, for negative replacement rates. I think that would work quite nicely. Not what the NWO has in mind, but with them gone who's to bitch?
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              • Profile picture of the author Barry Walls
                seriously guys...it cant go on like it is.

                I'm not for some awful bio terror, but we as a species need to find a different, better way.

                Look, we have some guy from Cambridge Uni talking about modern medicine and severe calorific restriction extending the lifespan of people to 150 within a century. None of this even includes biotech leaps that are coming. When I'm 150, at 2% PA growth rates, we will have a global population of 100bn....it will end in disaster unless something is done.
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                • Profile picture of the author Tiger
                  Originally Posted by bigjock View Post

                  seriously guys...it cant go on like it is.

                  I'm not for some awful bio terror, but we as a species need to find a different, better way.

                  Look, we have some guy from Cambridge Uni talking about modern medicine and severe calorific restriction extending the lifespan of people to 150 within a century. None of this even includes biotech leaps that are coming. When I'm 150, at 2% PA growth rates, we will have a global population of 100bn....it will end in disaster unless something is done.

                  Those things are not to be in the hands of mortal men. Who gets
                  to decide who lives and dies ? This is such an old debate.

                  Bottom line, elitists, who are worse in their attitudes than
                  normal folks, should definitely BE the first ones "culled".

                  Attitudes are a part of all humans, and their's really stinks.
                  See my other posts on selfishness.


                  Its the reason we have so many problems throughout
                  history. It has little to do with how many people are here,
                  and so much to do with the inner character weakness inherent
                  in human physiology.

                  For that reason, to blend the truth together with your goal means
                  the selfish people should be culled first. Hmmm... did I just decide ?

                  /Steve
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              • Profile picture of the author myob
                Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

                Um...we can start with the American politicians, and then go to birth control, for negative replacement rates. I think that would work quite nicely. Not what the NWO has in mind, but with them gone who's to bitch?
                Who decides which American politicians have to go first, and who decides which fetuses to abort?
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                • Profile picture of the author HeySal
                  The politicians that would go first are those that committed treason - an executable offense.

                  And - I said BIRTH CONTROL. To clarify: I said to not conceive so many children as opposed to kill a bunch of people to reduce population levels. That and get rid of the politicians that are involved in killing innocent people for some bucks and power.

                  Now, if that is all uncomprehensible to you, do not worry. There is a place for everyone here in the OT forum. Alex needs a drink over in the Nonsense thread, and the floors could use a bit of mopping.
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          • Profile picture of the author Phnx
            Originally Posted by bigjock View Post

            We cannot keep mining, farming, spraying, polluting and urbanising.
            No we can't. Curious how you get from that to depopulation though. Why not, y'know, just change the SYSTEM?

            I'm not for some awful bio terror, but we as a species need to find a different, better way.
            Well there's the thing, "they" have no intention of changing the system. In order to maintain it though, they'll have to get rid of most of us and turn the rest - who they graciously allow to live - into consumer serfs. Their vision is the old 'feudalist' society of Master and Serf. Take a guess which side you'll be on.

            Look, we have some guy from Cambridge Uni talking about modern medicine and severe calorific restriction extending the lifespan of people to 150 within a century. None of this even includes biotech leaps that are coming. When I'm 150, at 2% PA growth rates, we will have a global population of 100bn....it will end in disaster unless something is done.
            Oh don't worry about that. :rolleyes: It won't be the likes of you and I that get to live to 150. That'll only be for the favoured few not the rabble. The very same people who are sucking the life out of everybody else.

            Hitler used the exact same arguments in Mein Kampf that many "environmentalists" use today. Seriously. Very big on 'sustainability' and keeping a tight leash on race purity, was old Adolf.

            Fortunately for those who seek to control us, we have very short memories and our emotions can easily be manipulated in certain directions to bring about their desired outcome.

            Here's an insightful quote I'm rather fond of:

            "It is the job of thinking people, not to be on the side of the executioners." -
            -- Albert Camus

            edited to say: many people are starting to understand how they've rigged medical research, and are preventing many 'cures' from getting through if they cannot profit from it. Yet we who are familiar with that area know that if we just changed the damn system, our health would change immeasurably for the better. Well they have done the same thing with agriculture and every other arena you can think of. We change the system there, no more damaging the planet and no need to get rid of any of us. As any fool can demonstrate, populations drop significantly when living standards rise. They won't make as much money with a different model though, nor have the same level of control over us, so it ain't gonna happen.

            Just like a better healthcare model is not gonna happen any time soon.
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            • Profile picture of the author Barry Walls
              I think you've got me wrong.

              Theres no reason, according to the guy in Cambridge, that we cant live until we are 150 (Im 37) with some calorific depravation...according to his research.

              If you dont spray, pollute etc, its hard to see how the planet can support enough food on "pre oil age" crop yeilds to support 100bn people....thats how I got from stopping spraying to reducing population.

              I'll die before I become someones surf. Not out of principle...I just dont want to work that hard....bone idle, me.

              You've gott the wrong end of the stick with me and the Hitler stuff...if thats what you're insinuating.

              Cordially

              Barry
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              • Profile picture of the author Phnx
                No Barry, I'm not insinuating you have an affinity with Hitler. I'm pointing out that Hitler - a Malthusian Eugenist - used the same arguments as the people who set up the environmental movements - Malthusian Eugenicists too - and the driving force behind it.

                It plays on peoples guilt and fears and misdirects their perception so they place the blame elsewhere. Yet ponder this:

                “For the first time in history it is now possible to take care of everybody at a higher standard of living than any have ever known.

                Only ten years ago the ‘more with less’ technology reached the point where this could be done. All humanity now has the option to become enduringly successful.”

                – R. Buckminster Fuller, 1980

                This confident assertion was made in 1980 by the late R. Buckminster Fuller–inventor, architect, engineer, mathematician, poet and cosmologist. As early as 1959, Newsweek reported that Fuller predicted the conquest of poverty by the year 2000.

                In 1977, almost twenty years later, the National Academy of Sciences confirmed Fuller’s prediction. Their World Food and Nutrition Study, prepared by 1,500 scientists, concluded, “If there is the political will in this country and abroad... it should be possible to overcome the worst aspects of widespread hunger and malnutrition within one generation.”

                Even with tragedies like Ethiopia and Somalia, it is becoming clear that, as Fuller predicted, we have arrived at the possibility of eliminating hunger and poverty in all the world within our lifetime." ***

                And yet it is not happening. It will not happen. Not because they can't, after all it's been proven scientifically that is IS do-able, but because they won't. And they have manipulated the masses into ensuring they won't have too.

                Clever aren't they? Birth control? Oh that's all very reasonable until you start enforcing it when people don't do it voluntary, which is on the cards. "Liberty" goes out the window then, when the "Greater Good" is involved. But whose "Greater Good" is it truly, when you look behind the curtain?

                They've rigged the 'game' and conned people just the same as they conned people over 'medical research' - and you can blame John D. Rockefeller for that one. *spit*
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            • Profile picture of the author bendiggs
              I hate these stupid conspiracy theory threads. First of all, if the "Illuminati" (bunch of crap) were real, and truly sitting in the powerful positions that they are assumed to be in would this information be so easily obtained and readily available to anyone using Google? Obviously not.

              The reduction of population by 90% is both unfeasible to pull off just based on the logistics of it alone. Not only is it a nightmare to pull off, but it is just a stupid idea to think that some super powerful secret organization pulling the strings of the world can't come up with something better than mass murder.
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              • Profile picture of the author Phnx
                Originally Posted by bendiggs View Post


                The reduction of population by 90% is both unfeasible to pull off just based on the logistics of it alone. Not only is it a nightmare to pull off, but it is just a stupid idea to think that some super powerful secret organization pulling the strings of the world can't come up with something better than mass murder.
                Check out Dr Len Horowitz's work. As incredible as it may seem, he has the documentation (with names) to show there really is a concerted effort to get rid of most of us.

                Why do they have to worry about it being accessible on Google? They aren't yet in control of everything, but they understand us very well. They know how we think and react. They count on it, and we rarely fail them. They couldn't do what they do if we weren't so predictable. They know the vast majority of people will disbelieve simply because they cannot conceive of it.

                To throw in another apt quote:

                "The individual is handicapped by coming face-to-face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists."
                J. Edgar Hoover
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                • Profile picture of the author bendiggs
                  It isn't a matter of being unable to conceive a conspiracy so large and prevlent, it is a matter of a conspiracy being so overblown with unrealistic and untenable crap that there is no reason to believe it. I have read the studies and I have to say that nothing by Horowitz, or any of the other so called specialists in the "Illuminati Conspiracy" can sway me to believe that this conspiracy exists. I have done my research and it is pretty easy to punch holes in any argument for the conspiracy to exist.

                  Obviously those in support of the conspiracy will fire back with something along the lines of "That's just what they want you to think." and that's fine, but I am pretty sure that there is no conspiracy to bother with, and as a skeptic I will actively find ways to dismiss any argument.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Phnx
                    Originally Posted by bendiggs View Post

                    It isn't a matter of being unable to conceive a conspiracy so large and prevlent, it is a matter of a conspiracy being so overblown with unrealistic and untenable crap that there is no reason to believe it. I have read the studies and I have to say that nothing By Horowitz, or any of the other so called specialists in the "Illuminati Conspiracy". I have done my research and it is pretty easy to punch holes in any argument for the conspiracy to exist.
                    I don't believe you. You've 'skimmed' the more extreme sites and decided it's all bollox. You could not have seen the documentation that Horowitz had and still dismiss everything (FFS they've even got control of The Human Genome Project which was set up so vested interests couldn't exploit it. That didn't last long).

                    Obviously those in support of the conspiracy will fire back with something along the lines of "That's just what they want you to think." and that's fine, but I am pretty sure that there is no conspiracy to bother with, and as a skeptic I will actively find ways to dismiss any argument.
                    I debated whether to give this next link as it was the one to make me realise that there was no hope, and it seems pointless disturbing others needlessly. However sometimes people need a slap upside the head to see the evil hidden in plain sight. Former CIA Director William Colby himself knew it couldn't be changed, that the evil was too immense and all encompassing. He warned his friend Senator John DeCamp to stop probing if he wanted to live. Ironically Colby was the one to die in an 'accident'. I use the word evil advisedly.

                    Even though I knew it before - and had left links to various sites regarding it - sometimes you can know without truly knowing if you see what I mean. It's ironic that we conspiracists condemn the 'sheeple' for being blind, yet we are often guilty of the same thing. This is an area that few of us venture, but it is the heart of it all. It really is The Belly Of The Beast.

                    The drug running, murder and money laundering, are the least of it. The 'black network' are still around even though BCCI fell.

                    Cover Story: The Dirtiest Bank of All - TIME

                    No, that wasn't the link, that's tame stuff. But read it first it will help put things in context.

                    Always, always, the CIA are in the thick of it somewhere. They are monsters. Not surprising as they brought all the Nazi mind control experts over at the end of the war during Operation Paperclip.

                    What I'm going to show you now is how 'they' control the people who in turn control us. The very root of the conspiracy tree and why they can move their Agenda with very little real opposition even though there are far fewer of them than us.

                    Your Mind will try to avoid the implications and give you excuses to avoid continued reading. "Oh it's just Europe" or "It's just Belgium". Keep reading and you'll see there is not a country in Europe untouched by this network. Ireland and the UK. Australia, America, Israel, Japan, Russia and the Baltic states - even Argentina and Peru have popped up.

                    I remember seeing a vid on YouTube about Cathy O'Brien, and her lecture on this network and the CIA's MKUltra 'mind control' program. (This was controlled by Naval Intelligence and there were Congressional hearings condemning it in the 70's) Her husband Mark Phillips was her CIA handler at the time. She seemed genuine, but when she got to "I first met Gerald Ford" (yes the ex-President) I switched off. I understand why now, but at the time I just became agitated which translated into a feigned boredom and "oh whatever", and I closed the video. Now I think it's time I went back and listened to her. I might even buy her book.

                    It's a great exercise in psychology - watch how you behave and note any discomfort or anger. They of course understand this. "False Memory Syndrome" was one of theirs. I totally bought that, as most people do. We leap on it with relief because the mind can't handle being out of it's comfort zone. Of course the claims can't be true, and FMS explains it all away. Phew! Yet a closer look shows the handful of psychiatrists pushing this are themselves connected with this horror in some way, either directly or indirectly. But all they have to do is keep repeating it, and they'll get us to turn away.

                    Their 'placemen' are everywhere: the Churches, the Judiciary, Education, Science and Medical research, Social Sciences of course. Anywhere our world is shaped - and our perception of it - there they are. European Union, United Nations, Bilderbergs, NATO and on and on. Those who don't participate surely know what's going on. Ollie North and Bush Snr have been identified by three different witnesses as attending these parties. And then there is the media. It is controlled in more ways than one. How many of you remember this:

                    The Franklin Coverup Scandal The Child sex ring that reached Bush/Reagan Whitehouse

                    Now if you have the courage - and you will need it - read everything here. Force yourself to keep at it when your Mind find reasons to escape. There are a small number of pictures from the official files. They are thumbnails and they are censored, but you will have no doubt at all what's going on. Then read the testimonies. These are very similar to Cathy O'Briens claims, particularly the 'hunting' games. The hell of it is, many aren't even pedophiles. Those at least pretend a 'love' for their victims, as warped and perverted as it is. These guys, most do it because they want to break every taboo and know they can get away with it. Absolutely zero empathy for their victims.

                    And these are the people who they'd have you believe give a shit about us and the Planet. The irony of previously using the analogy of the paedophile worming his way into positions of trust, when that is what literally happens. THIS IS WHO THEY ARE! Look into their black heart and realise this is what you are up against.

                    ISGP - Beyond the Dutroux Affair

                    ISGP - Belgian "Nebuleuse" tied to child abuse networks, Iran Contra and the BCCI's "Black Network"

                    Ex FBI man Ted Gunderson is doing his bit, though they are currently trying to smear him via their shill, Art Bell.

                    http://www.tedgunderson.com/
                    The Gunderson Report

                    Senator John DeCamp prosecuted some of them (minnows and a drop in the bucket). There are a couple of Brit ones in the News at the moment but they are nobodies, they'll get thrown to the wolves so we think something is being done and it's really just a few perverts.

                    Read his interviews with the kids and you'll see they match the European testimonies (and there is no doubt that the 'tall redwoods' and 'giant owl' could only have been Bohemia Grove, playground of the great and the good. They were flown there first class so that rules out the staff being responsible.

                    The recent scandal at The Presidio where Lt Col. Michael Aquino (a self confessed practicing 'Satanist') was accused of taking children from the day care centre on the base for his perverted amusement. Parents sued for $60 million but it was all hushed up and he is still free. Read Kay Griggs testimony, she's all over the net. Her husband is a Major or General there and she read his diary. She talks of his descriptions of child abuse and other horrors. On it's own she could be dismissed as a sad deranged woman nobody can take seriously (and of course many do say that). However, in the bigger picture she's just another piece in the jigsaw and is saying nothing unusual. They don't have to silence her - who on earth is gonna believe her?

                    You betcha ass I want some catastrophe to 'cleanse' this Planet in 2012. It HAS to end, because if it doesn't and they get their One World Government, then god help us all.

                    It will be our disbelief that enables it to happen.
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                    • Profile picture of the author greymatrixx
                      Off you go Bendiggs...Bonne chance...Interesting to view your responce...Have not gone away Lee...My reply...Will arrive...Bissou...Indy
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                      • Profile picture of the author myob
                        What we need to do first is kill all the terrorists that are trying to kill all of us so that there will be more of us to kill all of the politicians that are trying to kill 90% of us. Then we can have the moral majority to decide on which fetuses to destroy to prevent more people from being born that we will eventually have to kill.
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                        • Profile picture of the author Barry Walls
                          I just watched the Benjamin Fulford interview with David Rockefeller, then watched another interview of Benjamins where he said 6m Asian secret society members are ready to take down the NWO if it gets out of hand.

                          Now...he has interviewed Rockefeller...so thats a huge credibility boost IMO, and he says that the Triads or whoever they are are all over teh mutha f****er should s**t happen with the NWO crowd...

                          Panic over!
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                          • Profile picture of the author gareth
                            I know - seen as you are all so unhappy about the world and want to reduce the population...

                            Why not kill two birds with one stone ?
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                            • Profile picture of the author Barry Walls
                              Garth,
                              You sound pretty unhappy...don't go harming yourself!
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                              • Profile picture of the author Phnx
                                Originally Posted by greymatrixx

                                Off you go Bendiggs...Bonne chance...Interesting to view your responce...
                                Interesting response wasn't it Robert? :rolleyes:

                                As long as we ignore that elephant in the room and leave it free to shit everywhere, we'll never win.

                                Okay, bendiggs, here's an easier one for you. WWF chicanery. You have to marvel at fascist corporate scavengers getting liberals to do their dirty work. This one is quite an eyeopener, so I hope you don't donate to these gits.

                                Mafia dons, intelligence agents, and raw materials executives striving for a sustainable future

                                Lambs to the slaughter, that's us.

                                They really are laughing at us.
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                                • Profile picture of the author Tiger
                                  More evidence population control has been underway for quite some time.



                                  Excerpt : "More than enough food is produced to feed a healthy global population. Distribution and access to food is a problem - many are hungry".



                                  No one, absolutely no one in the world has to die of starvation, and
                                  those 40,000 children who died yesterday of it could have been prevented.



                                  We can send men to the moon, but we cant feed our own
                                  hungry children ? Is "distribution" of surplus food and the lives of 40,000 children a lesser priority than getting to the moon ?

                                  NO

                                  /Steve
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                                  • Profile picture of the author Mal Keenan
                                    I don't know about any of this stuff but I am quite open minded and believe that human beings are capable of unimaginable horrors. They have proven it throughout history.

                                    Consider this, if a human mind has the capacity to march other human beings into gas chambers and exterminate over 6 million - Hitler, Germany - and, in another part of the world kill over 10 Million of it's own citizens pursuing a communist ideal - Stalin, Russia - why is it so impossible to believe that others in power would consider or actively pursue the extermination of a portion of the worlds population????

                                    The insanity that led to the above events hasn't gone away. In fact, looking at todays world, I think it's intensified. If the right conditions exist, who knows what's possible by those in power.

                                    Because your Govt. leaders appear on TV and tell you they have your best interests at heart doesn't make it so.
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                • Profile picture of the author Michelle Brouse
                  Originally Posted by Phnx View Post

                  Check out Dr Len Horowitz's work. As incredible as it may seem, he has the documentation (with names) to show there really is a concerted effort to get rid of most of us.

                  Why do they have to worry about it being accessible on Google? They aren't yet in control of everything, but they understand us very well. They know how we think and react. They count on it, and we rarely fail them. They couldn't do what they do if we weren't so predictable. They know the vast majority of people will disbelieve simply because they cannot conceive of it.

                  To throw in another apt quote:

                  "The individual is handicapped by coming face-to-face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists."
                  J. Edgar Hoover
                  And that there, is the truth.

                  Bendiggs - You have to have a very open mind, and not be into "religion" or "politics" or any other major game so much that you can stand back and see the ties. Everyone wonders why none of this crap makes sense.

                  But it DOES. It all makes PERFECT sense when one is able to stand back and look at what is "really" going on. It's like a big game of chess. I love chess, but I'll tell you what, it can be a complicated game. We are "sacrificial pawns" in the hands of those playing the game.

                  I'm not doing this promotionally, and should probably put it back in my sig line, but check out Symbols Of The Illuminati for one. (Yeah I'm a crazy goofball, and I really don't care.) Google folks like Alex Jones, David Icke, Micheal Tsarion, Eustace Mullins - you'll see a pattern.

                  Not everyone thinks alike, but these people have put massive amounts of time and research into finding out about this "illuminati" - then attempting to do their best to inform others. The more people who can open their minds and see it for what it is, the better off WE ALL are.

                  I thought this was very cool. I donated for David Icke to get into the whole "big brother" situation in the UK. Just a week or so ago, I got a refund. Kind of freaked me out, until I realized - well, he must have got enough money to get there, said what he needed to, then came home and refunded whomever donated after he had enough money to do what he needed to. How flippin cool is that?

                  Personally, I'm still attempting to figure out how to wipe out the Illuminati, so we can all get on with our lives. Most of the guys I mentioned above, are informing, which is great, just like the wonderful intelligent people here in OT - but I'm still looking for the "do this - then this" type of info. Best I can do for now is sign petitions, look for current news, spread it - and think about infiltration and assassination! LOL - Ok, kidding on the killing, but I'm not done on the research yet.

                  People in here though, always flip a link on what to watch for, where you can stand up, and different things that can be done - so I like to stay tuned here as much as I can.

                  Tiger - "All the hunger in the world could be wiped out with what America throws in their trash."

                  No kidding. I HATE throwing food out. If the kids don't eat dinner, I wrap it up - stick it in the fridge - and when they get hungry? Guess what they get.

                  It also irritates the heck out of me to waste food in a restaurant. I'll ask for a to go box every time we have food left, but it still never fails that at least some of the stuff never gets eaten.

                  Never mind the huge garden in the back that is available for the entire family, but nobody will come PICK the food. My husband works very hard to plant, weed, pick, and even when you personally PICK the food, and give it to others - it goes wasted in the fridge, because nobody gets to it.

                  We are all going to pay for our past misdeeds if people don't wake the F up. It's a mass consciousness and karmic kind of thing. This country is going to be third world in a hurry. I'm ready to move.

                  Thinking Australia. In the southern hemisphere, where they keep their noses to themselves, don't get into anybody else's business. If you think I'm kidding, I'm not.

                  If things continue on their current fast track, the entire northern hemisphere is going to be a flippin wasteland.

                  ah well, on to the next thing to piss me off - before I go to bed! LOL!

                  Thanks!
                  Michelle
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    • Profile picture of the author acreativetouch
      a child dies every 15 seconds from water contamination.

      Dorothy Carlson

      Originally Posted by Tiger View Post

      TRUE.

      Abortion. 3000 per day in my country alone, and how
      many more in China per day.


      40,000 children a day die of starvation.


      Of course there is population control underway.


      It could all be undone so easily just by making
      people care.... umm ... maybe that isnt
      so easy. . Remember the old statistic ? All the hunger
      in the world could be wiped out with what America throws
      in their trash.



      Also, the Europeans have been using biological warfare ( at least )
      since their invasion of Mexico. It killed many of the Indians
      before Cortez even landed.
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      Dorothy Carlson
      Phoenix Natural Health

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