Bad doctor

seasoned

12 years ago

In the US, EXPECT IT TO GET WORSE!!!!!!! ICSM!

Steve

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ThomM

12 years ago

Has anyone else had medical damage?

Ah, where to start

For the most part I do my best to just avoid doctors.
I stopped taking their prescriptions around 10 years ago and pretty much became my own doctor.
I went through my second bout of degenerate disk disease this summer and without seeing a doctor am around 99% healed.
It started in the beginning of May and by Aug. I was walking with two canes for support. After I found what worked in healing it I was walking without any aides or any pain a month later.
When I went through the same problem 10 years ago and used doctors, I was on heavy pain meds and ended up in surgery.
I will admit the surgery worked, but I was told if it happened again I would need more surgery and this time it would involve putting all sorts of metal in my back to support the two disks effected, and I would still be in pain and dependent on pain meds for the rest of my life.

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seasoned

12 years ago

Originally Posted by ThomM

Ah, where to start

For the most part I do my best to just avoid doctors.
I stopped taking their prescriptions around 10 years ago and pretty much became my own doctor.
I went through my second bout of degenerate disk disease this summer and without seeing a doctor am around 99% healed.
It started in the beginning of May and by Aug. I was walking with two canes for support. After I found what worked in healing it I was walking without any aides or any pain a month later.
When I went through the same problem 10 years ago and used doctors, I was on heavy pain meds and ended up in surgery.
I will admit the surgery worked, but I was told if it happened again I would need more surgery and this time it would involve putting all sorts of metal in my back to support the two disks effected, and I would still be in pain and dependent on pain meds for the rest of my life.

I had a SIMILAR experience! I didn't have the surgery though and only one medicine worked, a LITTLE, and it could destroy my liver, so I stopped. Luckily I saw a physical therapist that made it FAR better.

Steve

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MoneyMagnetMagnate

12 years ago

I have never quite figured out the general reasoning behind having a doctor take long shifts for 36-48 hrs -even longer, in a job that requires extreme focus, mental acuity and decisions that puts lives at stake...when they make a truck driver stop after 8 hours (no offense to LHT's, but you know what I mean) - or other positions where a 10 or 12 hr day would be considered exhausting.

*When I saw Hodad, I thought of a 'ho-daddy' -"A person who does not surf but who spends time at surfing beaches pretending to be a surfer. A wanna be."

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seasoned

12 years ago

Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate

I have never quite figured out the general reasoning behind having a doctor take long shifts for 36-48 hrs -even longer, in a job that requires extreme focus, mental acuity and decisions that puts lives at stake...when they make a truck driver stop after 8 hours (no offense to LHT's, but you know what I mean) - or other positions where a 10 or 12 hr day would be considered exhausting.

*When I saw Hodad, I thought of a 'ho-daddy' -"A person who does not surf but who spends time at surfing beaches pretending to be a surfer. A wanna be."

I don't think DOCTORS generally work that long. They DO have INTERNS that work that long, trying to get experience to become doctors.

Having said that, MY operation was about 13 hours with 5 doctors, and THEY WERE TAKING PHONE CALLS!!!!!!!!!! So YEAH, text on a phone while driving, and you can get a ticket, etc.... Talk on the phone while operating on a person? NO PROBLEM!

Steve

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Derek Player

12 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

I don't think DOCTORS generally work that long. They DO have INTERNS that work that long, trying to get experience to become doctors.

Having said that, MY operation was about 13 hours with 5 doctors, and THEY WERE TAKING PHONE CALLS!!!!!!!!!! So YEAH, text on a phone while driving, and you can get a ticket, etc.... Talk on the phone while operating on a person? NO PROBLEM!

Steve

Some Physicians can work close to 20+ hours, but I havent seen anything near 36 hours when I was in the Healthcare field. Generally, anything near 18+ and a pending surgery, relief is coming by way of a Hospitalist Physician or partner of the practice the doc is associated with. Even when "on-call", hours RARELY exceed 15-18 hours. REMEMBER... "Do no harm" is the ultimate goal in Healthcare.

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HeySal

12 years ago

Scared crapless of doctors. When I was a kid I had killer asthma and allergies. They had me on meds that made me feel sick 100% of the time. When I got my medical records to go overseas I found out that the last med they had me on was an experimental drug. I had ODd on that mixed with aspirin and it had almost killed me - the doctor never told my parents the drug was experimental - and they never told us that it didn't mix with aspirin. I got free of the pharms in Germany and never looked back.

Also when I was 18 I went to a party where we passed the wine around and many of us got hepatitis - when I was in the hospital, they woke me up to give me sleeping pills and I refused to take them and told them to call my doctor - people with hepatitis aren't supposed to take stuff like that. The doctor kinda freaked that they were trying to give them to me. I'm glad I had the sense to make them call the doctor about it.

They kill around a quarter million a year or so. Some in the hospital actually die of malnutrition from hospital food. We don't have health care. We have a medical industrial complex that exists solely for profit. Profit, and as many as they kill, maybe for population control. They've known many complete cures for cancer over the years and have done nothing but suppress it - if you add the amount of people that die from that every year to the "accidental" killings........the figures become nightmare genocide freaky.

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seasoned

12 years ago

In the US, they have a joke about how aspirin costs like $5, for TWO TABLETS!!!!! Well, the way I was told the medical industry prices it, they give you a dose, but charge for the package. If the smallest package is 100 tablets at $5, you pay $5 even if it is 1 tablet!

ALSO, from what I here, the average birth, with NO complications, costs $10K-$20K! So YEAH, 250K is "chump change"!

And I was shocked to find that the average TRAINED nurse is not that bright, and MOST ARE NOT TRAINED!!!!!! Trained nurses are called RNs(Registered nurses) Registered Nurses : Occupational Outlook Handbook : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics There IS another type of "trained" nurse called an LVN(Licensed vocational nurse) Licensed Practical and Licensed Vocational Nurses : Occupational Outlook Handbook : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics NOTE that an RN is NATIONAL and likely has at least an associates degree. An LVN is STATE and doesn't need any real college training. ALSO, an RN can just care for patients! An LVN must be directed by a doctor or an RN.

Apparently, there are even LOWER levels!

Steve

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KimW

12 years ago

"Has anyone else had medical damage?"

The more I learn the more I am convinced that a prescribed contributed to ,if not directly caused,my kidney failure.

Also, I never had any problems with my gastrointestinal system. After my prostate surgery in which the dr used me as his training material on the new (at the time) davinci robotic surgery machine, I have to take prilosec every day ,basically for the rest of my life, the days I don't within 12 hours I am getting nauseus and within hours after that I am vomiting.

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KimW

12 years ago

Steve.
They now train "Medical Assitants" at a local vocational college.
In the commericials it tells them how they can become trained professionals and learn how to do things like take blood pressure and and temperatures... :rolleyes:

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seasoned

12 years ago

Originally Posted by KimW

Steve.
They now train "Medical Assitants" at a local vocational college.
In the commericials it tells them how they can become trained professionals and learn how to do things like take blood pressure and and temperatures... :rolleyes:

YEAH, and in LESS than a year! A LOT of things contribute to kidney damage. MOST are FREELY prescribed, or even OTC!

Well, on MY problem, and I STILL have the receipt for this, I was declared HEALTHY!!!!!!!!!! That was after a "complete physical". Had he noticed my heart, or checked my blood pressure as ALL the cardiologists I have had did, he probably would have prescribed a drug like toprol, like I have now! If he had, I would likely have NOT had open heart surgery! You see, my blood pressure should have been consistant, but wouldn't be. They checked only ONE side, like 98% of the medical community does. FURTHER, my heart SHOULD have sounded like LUB DUB LUB DUB, but was probably LUB SHDUB LUB SHDUB. As it was, the VERY next month, I had that surgery! That ONE failing has cost me a LOT, physically, emotionally, and financially, and nobody here will likely ever know how much!

OK, flash forward a few years. A person MASQUERADING as a nurse came in to check my pulse and blood pressure. BTW a LOT of people MASQUERADE as doctors and nurses. You may never know. Some are temps, some are low end, some are from a school, etc.... SUPPOSEDLY she LISTENED to my heart, and took my BP(AGAIN, only HALF). She left!

A few minutes later, she came running back asking to listen to my heart AGAIN! I, of course, asked WHY! And THEN I found out THE REST OF THE STORY! Her SUPERVISOR asked if she heard the click. She DIDN'T! You see a normal heart is a rather inaudible "LUB DUB LUB DUB". MINE is NOW "LUB ****CLICK**** LUB ****CLICK****". In a quiet setting, with good hearing, sometimes you can HEAR the click, FROM A DISTANCE WITH NO STETHESCOPE". So I have to wonder how careful she was!

Steve

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hardraysnight

12 years ago

guess i am lucky living in a country where the medical profession are held in the highest respect and medical misadventure is not a growth industryo

i have never suffered from medical misadventure, and to the best of my knowledge, do not know anyone who has

perhaps another advantage of socialised medicine

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seasoned

12 years ago

Originally Posted by hardraysnight

guess i am lucky living in a country where the medical profession are held in the highest respect and medical misadventure is not a growth industryo

i have never suffered from medical misadventure, and to the best of my knowledge, do not know anyone who has

perhaps another advantage of socialised medicine

Well, it tends to become more prevalent when there is a personal advantage, or it is paid VERY well, etc... ICSM! Don't think YOU are immune! I didn't know exactly HOW bad things were until I started being forced to NEED it!

Steve

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KimW

12 years ago

Originally Posted by hardraysnight

guess i am lucky living in a country where the medical profession are held in the highest respect and medical misadventure is not a growth industryo

i have never suffered from medical misadventure, and to the best of my knowledge, do not know anyone who has

perhaps another advantage of socialised medicine

And of course, as in most cases, it could happen without you ever knowing it.
And even knowing it, as I'm sure Steve and others will agree, you can NEVER get anyone to admit it.

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seasoned

12 years ago

Originally Posted by KimW

And of course, as in most cases, it could happen without you ever knowing it.
And even knowing it, as I'm sure Steve and others will agree, you can NEVER get anyone to admit it.

Heck yeah! There was a time when washing your hands was a revelation! MANY that aren't in the medical industry defer to the "medical experts". Many in the medical field consider themselves to be EXPERTS! HELL, nurses tried to INSIST that I take things that could have KILLED ME, and refused to give me something I needed! SIMPLY because they felt that a "heart problem" was a heart problem even though mine really wasn't the heart AT ALL!!!!!!!

HECK, I was SHOCKED when I boarded a plane with a nurse recently and it turned out that SHE knew about the condition I had. FEW do, but it doesn't matter because they figure if it involves anything around the heart that they know ALL about it!

AMAZING! John Ritter had what had! They treated HIM for a heart problem. What happened? HE DIED!!!!! It turns out they did the OPPOSITE of what they should have.

I told you about the person that SUPPOSEDLY listened to my heartbeat and couldn't hear the click!!!!!!

It is a shame about John Ritter. Apparently he was a nice guy and died telling the doctors and nurses to take others first. He trusted that they were doing the right thing. THEY never bothered to check. Since his life was in danger every second, triage rules said/say that he probably should have been the FIRST to be helped. MOST visitors to the ER can live well over several minutes, and MOST over decades. But any heart beat(an average of one each second) could have killed John. Sadly, that beat came. The point of the ER is supposed to be that it is dictated by TRIAGE! Those that NEED to be helped first are to be helped before any that came before them, even if they have been waiting hours.

Steve

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derekwong28

12 years ago

Originally Posted by hardraysnight

guess i am lucky living in a country where the medical profession are held in the highest respect and medical misadventure is not a growth industryo

i have never suffered from medical misadventure, and to the best of my knowledge, do not know anyone who has

perhaps another advantage of socialised medicine

I think is generally true that the higher the proportion of private medicine in a country, the higher the suspicion and disrespect for the doctors. Although bad stuff do occur in public hospitals that are often covered up, the greed factor is not in the equation.

I have heard tons and tons of unethical and dangerous practice by private practitioners in Hong Kong. This concerns unnecessary return consultations, cross referrals to associates, wanton prescription of nervous system drugs and antibiotics.

I can only presume it is just as bad in America where private practice accounts for the vast majority of health care. For example, the way in which Michael Jackson prescribed an IV anesthetic for sleep is completely beyond the imagination of any trained doctor. Another example of an extremely unthinkable practice is how the doctor allowed octomom to be implanted with all these embryos.

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seasoned

12 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

I think is generally true that the higher the proportion of private medicine in a country, the higher the suspicion and disrespect for the doctors. Although bad stuff do occur in public hospitals that are often covered up, the greed factor is not in the equation.

I have heard tons and tons of unethical and dangerous practice by private practitioners in Hong Kong. This concerns unnecessary return consultations, cross referrals to associates, wanton prescription of nervous system drugs and antibiotics.

ACTUALLY, the WORSE stuff is done for PUBLIC insurance, such as medicare. WHY? Because it is almost anonymous and they are dealing with bureaucrats that don't know or care, and it is done behind the patients back with perhaps NO revelation. With PRIVATE insurance, there is more interaction with people that care more and may know more, and the patient likely WILL be told about it. The example I gave was someone doing this through medicare.

I can only presume it is just as bad in America where private practice accounts for the vast majority of health care. For example, the way in which Michael Jackson prescribed an IV anesthetic for sleep is completely beyond the imagination of any trained doctor. Another example of an extremely unthinkable practice is how the doctor allowed octomom to be implanted with all these embryos.

I don't know WHY they did that with MJ. When I was a kid, OTC they had great sleeping pills. I'm sure they MUST still have them as prescription. People used to take them to commit suicide, so they aren't OTC anymore. SURE, it doesn't work as quick, or wake you up quickly, but they are reliable, work rather well and are rather safe, and are CHEAP!

As for the embryos? It's my understanding that they put in about 3 per wanted child, and take out excess ones that remain and are viable. So maybe the doctors intent was 2 or 3 kids, whch normally might be reasonable.

There are like 3 big steps to invitro fertilization. the first two steps are complicated, not that reliable, and are *****VERY***** expensive! I'm sure storage is also expensive. So steps are taken to try to make sure it takes. the "octomom" may simply have not gone back.

Steve

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tagiscom

12 years ago

There are like 3 big steps to invitro fertilization. the first two steps are complicated, not that reliable, and are *****VERY***** expensive! I'm sure storage is also expensive. So steps are taken to try to make sure it takes. the "octomom" may simply have not gone back.

Yeah, l am always amazed by couples spending $100,000 over a year to do this, when there are other options, that don't require a second mortgage and have a very high success rate!!! :confused:

Moral is; don't blindly accept doctors advise, and seek out all other proven options before proceeding!

Shane

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derekwong28

12 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

I don't know WHY they did that with MJ. When I was a kid, OTC they had great sleeping pills. I'm sure they MUST still have them as prescription. People used to take them to commit suicide, so they aren't OTC anymore. SURE, it doesn't work as quick, or wake you up quickly, but they are reliable, work rather well and are rather safe, and are CHEAP!

As for the embryos? It's my understanding that they put in about 3 per wanted child, and take out excess ones that remain and are viable. So maybe the doctors intent was 2 or 3 kids, whch normally might be reasonable.

There are like 3 big steps to invitro fertilization. the first two steps are complicated, not that reliable, and are *****VERY***** expensive! I'm sure storage is also expensive. So steps are taken to try to make sure it takes. the "octomom" may simply have not gone back.

Steve

As far as I know, a doctor who makes a claim for Medicare is still a private doctor. As opposed to a doctor who is employed directly by the Government. In the UK, essentially all general practitioners are private doctors who subcontract their services to the Government. A lot of abuses do occur but they are not on the same scale as private doctors who have no connection with the government.

Under no circumstances could the use of a general anesthetic be justified for insomnia. What Michael Jackson needed was a stint at rehab to wean off the sleeping tablets. As far as Octomom is concerned, the doctor has an obligation to know the background of the patient. The fact that she is single already with mutliple children makes her unsuitable for treatment. Not only that, multiple fetus implantation on that scale endangers both the mother and the babies.

Whenever a doctor recommends a operation that is unnecessary, or that he recommends to more complicated (costly) procedure than needed. He needlessly endangers the patient for his benefit. I don't like seeing private doctors much in Hong Kong because I just know too many of the tricks they use. We have got pharmacies here where people can walk in there and buy almost any drug they want. At the end of the day, the pharmacy would make up false prescriptions and pay a doctor to sign them.

Greedy practices of private doctors are well known here. I had a family friend who was given a bill of more than US$70,000 after staying one and a half month in the second class ward of a private hospital. Her illness was a diabetic foot. What the lead doctor was to refer her to 4 other colleagues in his practice who saw here everyday. As a result, they billed her $1250 in consultation fees every day. There was absolutely no need for more than 2 doctors to visit her and this didn't have to be done daily.

The hospital where this occurred had some of the richest patients in world. However, the lead doctor involved was so rich that a gang decided to kidnap the doctor rather than the patients at that hospital. The doctor was subsequently found locked in the boot of his Mercedes. He is also reputed to the largest owner of Porsches in Hong Kong.

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seasoned

12 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

Under no circumstances could the use of a general anesthetic be justified for insomnia. What Michael Jackson needed was a stint at rehab to wean off the sleeping tablets.

I never said it was! I merely said he could have had a similar effect and be alive today, WITHOUT the anesthetic.

Originally Posted by derekwong28

As far as Octomom is concerned, the doctor has an obligation to know the background of the patient. The fact that she is single already with mutliple children makes her unsuitable for treatment. Not only that, multiple fetus implantation on that scale endangers both the mother and the babies.

Agreed, and I said they would have been removed before they really became fetuses.

Originally Posted by derekwong28

Whenever a doctor recommends a operation that is unnecessary, or that he recommends to more complicated (costly) procedure than needed. He needlessly endangers the patient for his benefit. I don't like seeing private doctors much in Hong Kong because I just know too many of the tricks they use.

Yeah, and doctors here are FORBIDDEN to do that! They take an OATH to "NOT DO HARM". Of course, nobody seems to know what the word OATH means these days.

Originally Posted by derekwong28

We have got pharmacies here where people can walk in there and buy almost any drug they want. At the end of the day, the pharmacy would make up false prescriptions and pay a doctor to sign them.

Still, SOME things SHOULD be freely available to some people.

Originally Posted by derekwong28

Greedy practices of private doctors are well known here. I had a family friend who was given a bill of more than US$70,000 after staying one and a half month in the second class ward of a private hospital. Her illness was a diabetic foot. What the lead doctor was to refer her to 4 other colleagues in his practice who saw here everyday. As a result, they billed her $1250 in consultation fees every day. There was absolutely no need for more than 2 doctors to visit her and this didn't have to be done daily.

AGREED. AGAIN, ILLEGAL here, and not only privately funded doctors do it.

Originally Posted by derekwong28

The hospital where this occurred had some of the richest patients in world. However, the lead doctor involved was so rich that a gang decided to kidnap the doctor rather than the patients at that hospital. The doctor was subsequently found locked in the boot of his Mercedes. He is also reputed to the largest owner of Porsches in Hong Kong.

Yeah, con artists seem to have NO limit!

steve

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derekwong28

12 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

Yeah, and doctors here are FORBIDDEN to do that! They take an OATH to "NOT DO HARM". Of course, nobody seems to know what the word OATH means these days.

Steve, I think the oath part is a myth. I never had to take an oath and nor did any colleagues or friends at any medical school from any county I knew took an oath.

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ThomM

12 years ago

Greedy practices of private doctors are well known here. I had a family friend who was given a bill of more than US$70,000 after staying one and a half month in the second class ward of a private hospital.

Your friend got off cheap.
I spent 24 hours in the hospital last year and the original bill for just staying there was $10,000. That didn't include any of the doctors. The er doctor tried to charge me $900+ for "an hour of critical care, plus reading 3 e.k.g.'s" when all he did was interview me which took less then 10 minutes, I guess he may have read the e.k.g.'s but I have no proof of that.
Meanwhile the Cardiologist who read 4 e.k.g.'s plus the results of the stress test and diagnosed my problem (pericardial infusion) only charged me $350 and settled for $175 when he found out I didn't have ins. to cover his bill.

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derekwong28

12 years ago

Originally Posted by ThomM

Your friend got off cheap.
I spent 24 hours in the hospital last year and the original bill for just staying there was $10,000. That didn't include any of the doctors. The er doctor tried to charge me $900+ for "an hour of critical care, plus reading 3 e.k.g.'s" when all he did was interview me which took less then 10 minutes, I guess he may have read the e.k.g.'s but I have no proof of that.
Meanwhile the Cardiologist who read 4 e.k.g.'s plus the results of the stress test and diagnosed my problem (pericardial infusion) only charged me $350 and settled for $175 when he found out I didn't have ins. to cover his bill.

Everybody knows that healthcare in America is extremely expensive. The hospital fees for our friend were actually quite reasonable. It was just over $100 per day plus extras that could be quite expensive. However, there weren't many extras because her condition required few investigations. She just required bed rest and a frequent change of dressings. The issue was that the doctors added an extra $50000 to $60000 to her bill because of unnecessary 5-10 minutes consults.

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seasoned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

As far as I know, a doctor who makes a claim for Medicare is still a private doctor.

MAYBE, but who they work for doesn't change their mindset. And medicare is medicare. Maybe YOUR system is different. HERE, they have special codes. Generally a given code gets a given amount. One person gave patients basically dr schoals inserts(a cheap thing that fits in shoes that you can buy in drug stores, and shoe stores, OTC, etc....), and made a BUNDLE off medicare!!!!!!!!!!

On American greed, they showed a person making a bundle off a kit to increase doctors income. HOW did it work? They used the general code which paid MORE! An insurance company would call and say NOPE, WE NEED MORE INFO! Medicare just pays it.

YOUR country may be different, but that is how it works in the US.

Steve
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derekwong28

12 years ago

I don't believe any sane doctor would want to kill or maim their patients. Mistakes happen for a number of reasons.

1. Tiredness due to volume of work - junior doctors often have to work long hours going for more than a day without sleep.
2. Inadequate training - nowadays, many doctors go into a specialty straightaway without having done much training in other specialties. This is especially so in the US when clinical training in medical school is already shorter than the UK by year.
3. Interference from HMO or health provider to provide a cheaper but less effective treatment.
4. Greed - in the private sector, doctors often recommend unnecessary treatments and operations. Not only that, many fail to keep up with current advances.

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seasoned

12 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

I don't believe any sane doctor would want to kill or maim their patients. Mistakes happen for a number of reasons.

1. Tiredness due to volume of work - junior doctors often have to work long hours going for more than a day without sleep.
2. Inadequate training - nowadays, many doctors go into a specialty straightaway without having done much training in other specialties. This is especially so in the US when clinical training in medical school is already shorter than the UK by year.
3. Interference from HMO or health provider to provide a cheaper but less effective treatment.
4. Greed - in the private sector, doctors often recommend unnecessary treatments and operations. Not only that, many fail to keep up with current advances.

It isn't that they WANT to! It is that THEY DON'T CARE!

A good example is a doctor that showed up on "American Greed". OK folks, ANOTHER TV show, but the doctor and all was REAL! A doctor would take moles off of people, and run them through a test and declared them CANCEROUS! OK, that is bad enough, since they WEREN'T, but he needed MORE money, and needed to look legit, so he had to sew up the wounds, that were sometimes BIG. OK, THAT was bad enough, but that might cost a few bucks, so he took the remaining thread, that was CONTAMINATED, and reused it in the NEXT patient. That was all meant to be a ONE USE deal!

WHY? Did he WANT to hurt the patients? NOPE! He just wanted to get paid by insurance and medicare, and DIDN'T CARE.

And the reason for getting into a specialty is SUPPOSED to be getting to be more competent in that area, NOT to make more money. BUT, regardless of the specialty, they SHOULD have basic knowledge of everything. If they don't, they could miss something and provide the wrong treatment.

Steve

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MoneyMagnetMagnate

12 years ago

Ben Goldacre on more bad data: this time from drug companies | The Loom | Discover Magazine

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Lloyd Buchinski

12 years ago

Here's a couple more articles. This one is by a doctor about how he was misled by the studies of a drug. This is the sort of thing that can affect anyone, socialized medicine or not.

Here's a quote from the article, then the link.

I did everything a doctor is supposed to do. I read all the papers, I critically appraised them, I understood them, I discussed them with the patient and we made a decision together, based on the evidence. In the published data, reboxetine was a safe and effective drug. In reality, it was no better than a sugar pill and, worse, it does more harm than good. As a doctor, I did something that, on the balance of all the evidence, harmed my patient, simply because unflattering data was left unpublished.

The drugs don't work: a modern medical scandal | Ben Goldacre | Business | The Guardian

And surgeons operate on the wrong body part rather often.

Doctors Perform Surgery on the Wrong Body Part About 40 Times a Week - National - The Atlantic Wire

Just a few of those hit the news. One was when a diabetic went in to have a foot amputated and the surgeon removed the wrong one. (oops)

Not every doc has spent enough time in the army to sort out all that left right stuff. That one was repeated every day for about a week, but most of them don't even get a mention.

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seasoned

12 years ago

Doctors should be THROWN IN JAIL if they operate on anything besides the item marked, and the person marking should be THROWN IN JAIL if he or she did not do it with the direction, and signed and filmed ADVISED consent, of the awake and lucid patient. REALLY, some things can only be answered by ONE person on the entire planet!!!!!!! They have NEVER found a reliable way of determining them otherwise. And that ONE person is THE PATIENT!

That is just LUDICROUS! HECK, I go in wide awake and willing to get my blood drawn for a test and the person asks me for my birthdate, etc... to make sure the paperwork is right. How much MORE careful should they be when amputating a foot?

This stuff is just SCARY! I once tried to hold my lip together and told the doctor that my lip had a cut ALL the way to the inside. I was forced to ALMOST risk my ability to have a normal outcome because she REFUSED to believe me. Luckily she realized she was wrong. In theory, if she had done what she wanted, I would have been forced to try to never open my mouth to talk or eat for fear that it would rip apart and disfigure me for life. IMAGINE trying to live a normal life with no talking or eating for 1-2 WEEKS! Anytime I go to sleep in a hospital I worry about some disaster happening.

Doctors really do have to learn to listen to the patient.

Steve

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tagiscom

12 years ago

A good example is a doctor that showed up on "American Greed". OK folks, ANOTHER TV show, but the doctor and all was REAL! A doctor would take moles off of people, and run them through a test and declared them CANCEROUS! OK, that is bad enough, since they WEREN'T, but he needed MORE money, and needed to look legit, so he had to sew up the wounds, that were sometimes BIG. OK, THAT was bad enough, but that might cost a few bucks, so he took the remaining thread, that was CONTAMINATED, and reused it in the NEXT patient. That was all meant to be a ONE USE deal!

Yeah, reminds me of a time when l had a mole on my neck, and my Mother said that she will pay to have it removed, (scalpel, big chunk of my neck out, etc).

And l instead went for an alternative, which was affirming every day that it wasn't there, etc, (in a nutshell).

My Mother insisted that it could be growing throughout my neck and would be impossible to treat, and she had an uncle die that way, etc, etc.

But l just affirmed every day that it was, neither good nor bad and l preferred that it wasn't there.

Then 8 months later after having a shower it popped off by itself!!!

So much for the doctors, treatment. And it wasn't cancerous but it could have been.

Doctors have way too much power! And because they have to bowl down to Pharmaceutical company's, and their expensive treatments, cheap, and free ones get swept under the carpet!

There are a lot of things about us, Doctors can't figure out, and probably never will; so researching your issue, thoroughly, before treatment is the best way to go. And researching the side affects, before a doctor approaches you, is a good idea, sometimes you don't find out the lifetime side affects until it is over!!! :rolleyes:

Shane

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Lloyd Buchinski

12 years ago

I'm surprised I ran into another one, but thirteen people received injections at a Nashville medical facility and come down with meningitis. 2 of them have died. (another oops)

Some kind of contamination, no news yet if it was a sterilization problem or what.

And an article about fraud in the scientific publications.

Two Thirds of Scientific Publications Retracted Are Fraudulent

Other problems mentioned include plagarism. The publications seem to be put together with the same sort of attitude as something on the sleazy side of IM.

If anyone is going in for surgery soon, you might want to unsubscribe from this topic

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derekwong28

12 years ago

If you want another example of extreme greed, here is one.

Singapore Doctor Lim Must Face Probe Into $19 Million Bill to Brunei Royal - Bloomberg

"Susan Lim, the Singapore doctor who billed a member of Brunei’s royal family S$24.8 million ($19 million) for seven months of treatment, lost her final legal bid to block a medical council inquiry into the charges."

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RyanEagle

12 years ago

Seriously? How come i don't see a lot of doctors being sued for their mistakes?

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seasoned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by RyanEagle

Seriously? How come i don't see a lot of doctors being sued for their mistakes?

Some are unknown! That is likely the MAJORITY!
Some might be embarrassed.
Some may figure they won't win, etc....
Some may not be able to afford it.
Some may settle.
Some may go after malpractice insurance.
Some may go after an umbrella policy.
Some may go after a fund to pay in such a case.
Only THEN will it make it to court and be recorded as a suit!

Steve
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Lloyd Buchinski 12 years ago

Originally Posted by RyanEagle

Seriously? How come i don't see a lot of doctors being sued for their mistakes?

That one is easy.

When doctors or hospitals lose and settle, they usually only pay if a non disclosure agreement is signed. This means the person who wins can't reveal how much the award was, or any of the details.

You will sometimes see just a small news item about it at about page 35 of a newspaper, with a note that details of the settlement cannot be revealed.
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derekwong28

12 years ago

Originally Posted by RyanEagle

Seriously? How come i don't see a lot of doctors being sued for their mistakes?

Cover ups are one issue. Another issue is that professional colleagues are generally reluctant to act as expert witnesses for the plaintiff. Sometimes, the use of an unnecessary procedure has become so widespread that it has become usual clinical practice. One example is to use of unnecessary cesarean sections. Almost half of all births in China are now done through cesarean sections. Sometimes, these are done for silly reasons such as the women wanting their baby to be born on a particularly lucky day or hour.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34826186...idemic-levels/

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seasoned

12 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

Cover ups are one issue. Another issue is that professional colleagues are generally reluctant to act as expert witnesses for the plaintiff. Sometimes, the use of an unnecessary procedure has become so widespread that it has become usual clinical practice. One example is to use of unnecessary cesarean sections. Almost half of all births in China are now done through cesarean sections. Sometimes, these are done for silly reasons such as the women wanting their baby to be born on a particularly lucky day or hour.

A LOT of people HERE, in the US, get cesarean sections ALSO! SLIGHTLY off topic, since NEITHER is cesarean.... A comedy recently showed a woman leaving the hospital because..... Well, it was the SAME reason why I will never know when I WOULD have been born! She threatened to leave the hospital because HER OB/GYN wasn't there! Likewise, MY birth was induced because the doctor was going to go on vacation, and my mother wanted HIM!! HEY, I can UNDERSTAND not wanting an unknown person to be involved, but that is all but guaranteed in a hospital.

Steve

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DireStraits 12 years ago

Originally Posted by derekwong28

Another issue is that professional colleagues are generally reluctant to act as expert witnesses for the plaintiff.

When a relative was admitted recently to the ICU/HDU at the hospital following a massive, almost fatal overdose, two of the doctors there requested an itemisation of the patient's recent prescription history from their GP(s). I was there personally to witness their reactions.

They tried their best to play down their surprise, of course, probably not wanting to land colleagues in the shitter; but they were doctors, not actors, and let's say their performances were a little short of academy award material.

Mercifully, a candid nurse who had been there was a little more revealing. Negligence in the extreme, especially considering the patient's history of addiction and abuse.

Well, the whole thing had me going home feeling a little more misanthropic than I already was.
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SandraLarkin

Banned 12 years ago

Every time I hear the phrase "Bad Doctor" I automatically think of this:

Will Ferrell:

BCmoney MobileTV - Will Ferrell - Bad Doctor

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Bad doctor

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