Bill Gates: My Plan to Fix The World's Biggest Problems

51 replies
  • OFF TOPIC
  • |
Bill Gates on the Importance of Measurement - WSJ.com
  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    Measurement of success is a difficult thing that is HEAVILY corrupted! Why doesn't he FIRST try it in the US!?!?!?

    Steve
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7660990].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author AprilCT
      We need a lot more than measurements to change the world's biggest problems. It's not the be all, end all.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661066].message }}
    • Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

      Measurement of success is a difficult thing that is HEAVILY corrupted! Why doesn't he FIRST try it in the US!?!?!?

      Steve
      Many people ask that question - I myself ask that question from time to time, but I think what Gates is trying to do here is not a test, or experiment to achieve the measurement that will take it forward, but more as a triage, to assign degrees of urgency to the problems he is working on. He does invest in homeland problems, they just don't seem to get as much exposure.

      I myself have gone from disliking this guy as a head of a controlling evil empire (MSFT) - to what he has taken what he has, and become a philanthropist with it, and seems genuinely trying to make a change (who knows? maybe it is all an evil plot) and for that, I have come to admire what he is doing...

      Even 'retired', he will still have the title: 'King of the Nerds' :p (he made nerds what they are today! )
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661112].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post

        Many people ask that question - I myself ask that question from time to time, but I think what Gates is trying to do here is not a test, or experiment to achieve the measurement that will take it forward, but more as a triage, to assign degrees of urgency to the problems he is working on. He does invest in homeland problems, they just don't seem to get as much exposure.

        I myself have gone from disliking this guy as a head of a controlling evil empire (MSFT) - to what he has taken what he has, and become a philanthropist with it, and seems genuinely trying to make a change (who knows? maybe it is all an evil plot) and for that, I have come to admire what he is doing...

        ... even 'retired', he will still have the title: 'King of the Nerds' :p (he made nerds what they are today! )
        Well, you KNOW they need education, and often water, food, and basic health care. But that is all FAR HARDER, FAR more dangerous, has to be MORE successful to do ANY good, and returns a paltry benefit!

        If he did it in the US, it would be easier, cheaper, safer, and could return a HUGE benefit. He could refine things, and go back there with something that would WORK! ALSO, with the record, he would have more workers, etc....

        Steve
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661132].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author hardraysnight
        Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post

        Many people ask that question - I myself ask that question from time to time, but I think what Gates is trying to do here is not a test, or experiment to achieve the measurement that will take it forward, but more as a triage, to assign degrees of urgency to the problems he is working on. He does invest in homeland problems, they just don't seem to get as much exposure.

        I myself have gone from disliking this guy as a head of a controlling evil empire (MSFT) - to what he has taken what he has, and become a philanthropist with it, and seems genuinely trying to make a change (who knows? maybe it is all an evil plot) and for that, I have come to admire what he is doing...

        Even 'retired', he will still have the title: 'King of the Nerds' :p (he made nerds what they are today! )
        and i always thought nerds made him what he is today
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7665894].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Jeff Williams
    Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post

    Very well written article with good ideas that, of course, cast his foundation in only the most heroic light.

    However, I wonder if Bill is promoting and implementing his strategies for the "good of all mankind", or just control and money ...

    Bill Gates, Monsanto, and eugenics: How one of the world's wealthiest men is actively promoting a corporate takeover of global agriculture

    I guess we'll find out soon.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661208].message }}
    • Originally Posted by Jeff Williams View Post

      Very well written article with good ideas that, of course, cast his foundation in only the most heroic light.

      However, I wonder if Bill is promoting and implementing his strategies for the "good of all mankind", or just control and money ...

      Bill Gates, Monsanto, and eugenics: How one of the world's wealthiest men is actively promoting a corporate takeover of global agriculture

      I guess we'll find out soon.
      Thanks - that was interesting and enlightening...who knows, as I surmised, maybe he has ulterior motives after all...(We've got to keep an eye on these Bilderberg / Davos / NWO types! )
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661232].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author yukon
        Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post

        Thanks - that was interesting and enlightening...who knows, as I surmised, maybe he has ulterior motives after all...(We've got to keep an eye on these Bilderberg / Davos /NWO types! )

        Gates & Warren Buffett both will turn a profit from their so called charity case project, especially Buffett, that guy doesn't spend a dime unless he's going to get a $1 return. Buffett also has a history of only targeting long term investments that other people ignore, most people want the return on money ASAP.

        They will make a profit in the end.
        Signature
        - Friend me on Snapchat -
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661281].message }}
        • Originally Posted by yukon View Post

          Gates & Warren Buffett both will turn a profit from their so called charity case project, especially Buffett, that guy doesn't spend a dime unless he's going to get a $1 return. Buffett also has a history of only targeting long term investments that other people ignore, most people want the return on money ASAP.

          They will make a profit in the end.
          Making a profit is not necessarily a bad thing - too much control is a bad thing, so we certainly don't want to give guys like Monsanto that...but like that old Zig Ziglar saying: "You can have everything in life you want, if you will just help other people get what they want."- unless they are secretly building a death-star from the profits or something...:p

          Though sometimes I can picture Bill Gates in a big chair with a fluffy white cat...:p
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661344].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author lcombs
    No wonder Steve Jobs hated him so much.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661396].message }}
    • Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

      No wonder Steve Jobs hated him so much.
      From Job's biography, that didn't seem to be the case as the public sometimes saw it. Sure they started out as fierce competitors, but as two warriors that respect the other for their skill, they grew to become friends who just occasionally disagreed - albeit on a very large scale from time to time. I think they may have admired each other for some part of their personality that they lacked - and both were known for being difficult (to say the least), but that is the mark of a driven person - they often don't care if they are.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661459].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post

        From Job's biography, that didn't seem to be the case as the public sometimes saw it. Sure they started out as fierce competitors, but as two warriors that respect the other for their skill, they grew to become friends who just occasionally disagreed - albeit on a very large scale from time to time. I think they may have admired each other for some part of their personality that they lacked - and both were known for being difficult (to say the least), but that is the mark of a driven person - they often don't care if they are.
        I think Jobs and Gates have the SAME personality.

        Steve
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661506].message }}
        • Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

          I think Jobs and Gates have the SAME personality.

          Steve
          For the most part - true. But what I meant was that Jobs saw things from a more creative, out of the box aspect - while Gates sees them from a code/techie side - Gates is probably more like Woz in that manner of speaking...
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661546].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author seasoned
            Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post

            For the most part - true. But what I meant was that Jobs saw things from a more creative, out of the box aspect - while Gates sees them from a code/techie side - Gates is probably more like Woz in that manner of speaking...
            Gates isn't like woz AT ALL! I think WOZ wrote the first basic for the APPLE II. If not for compatibility, sales from MSbasic, and the fact that he didn't have an IEEE compliant floating point, and was busy with other things, he probably would have done it HIMSELF, and most of you would never have heard of bill gates!

            Steve
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661616].message }}
            • Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

              Gates isn't like woz AT ALL! I think WOZ wrote the first basic for the APPLE II. If not for compatibility, sales from MSbasic, and the fact that he didn't have an IEEE compliant floating point, and was busy with other things, he probably would have done it HIMSELF, and most of you would never have heard of bill gates!

              Steve
              Well, Woz wanted to basically do it for himself, and give it away to other 'hobbyists' - he wasn't really seeing 'the big picture' then - Jobs said "why should we give away something people will pay money for?"

              Bill liked to play with code, but after all, his grandfather was a banker, dad's an attorney, and his mom was on the board of directors for 1st Interstate, so he wasn't "programmed" to give it away then - he does have a very astute business sense (obviously) but not as intuitive as Jobs as to thinking outside of the box.
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7662432].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    Yeah, I hated steve jobs, but he didn't go as far as microsoft to gain control of everything. Microsoft DID try to take over the internet. They DID create cracks that even TODAY they are trying to use to get control. But the methods they were using aren't open to them anymore. At this point, Microsoft has virtually NOTHING going for it other than the platform acceptance(that is showing cracks), official package acceptance(like office), and partnerships and developer things for that. Otherwise, NOTHING!!!!!! And you know.... if they made a version of windows for tablets, they could milk this for more. What they DID was make an OS for laptops that they CALLED windows. Windows RT, to be exact. It could end up hurting them MORE!

    As for buffet? He has used every tax shelter and even berkshire hathway is created to be a tax shelter. If you bought a share in 1999 you would today have added assets of about $138,000 TAX FREE!!!!!!!! You wouldn't have to pay a PENNY until you sell it. The way it is now, with Apple, you would have to pay taxes on about 10% of your apple assets every single year, if you DON'T sell it! If you sold the apple stock, you would ALSO have to pay tax on any increase in sales price, as you would on berkshire hathway as well.

    And with increased tax rates and inheritance taxes, he can buy some companies for a song! I don't know if buffet has a company like aflac, but these times ALSO help things like THAT.

    Steve
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661500].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    That is something I never really thought about. If woz were never born, and everything else ran as I heard it did.....

    1. Apple would not exist! No original product.
    2. Jobs might have worked at atari until it went bankrupt, and never gotten rich.
    3. Bill gates and paul allen would have broken up, and Microsoft would probably be GONE!
    4. IBM would likely have started MUCH later, if at all, and probably used UNIX.
    5. Kildall would probably be a houshold name, if unix took too long.


    Who knows what else could have happened. You know, the story goes that IBM tried to reach kildall FIRST! HIS company wrote an MSDOS like system. IBM went to bill who claimed they had a similar system, and they licensed a knockoff of kildalls system.

    But Woz WAS born, so a friend named Jobs decided that woz's computer would be sellable, so apple existed, and they licensed basic from MS which caused MS to stay in business, the Apple and some competitors made it clear to IBM that they BETTER do something, so they came up with the PC. They snubbed kildall and became competitors. Kildalls company was bought be Novell in 1991.

    Steve
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661656].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
      What he is doing is a step in the right direction, but he really needs to do something radical to really save the poor, or give the poor a better life!!!

      Investing heavily into free energy systems, would be a good place to start. Some actually do work, but it seems that he wants to keep in good with his political, etc friends in high places?

      So, he tends to clean up the floor but leave all the old furniture in place!

      Shane
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7661959].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Kay King
        Why doesn't he FIRST try it in the US!?!?!?
        Why should he? The richest country in the world with massive social programs doesn't need more handouts. Yes, there are poor people here - but there aren't tens of thousands of people drinking dirty water or starving to death.

        I think Gates and Jobs had one thing in common - they were authentic versions of themselves. They were both originals, visionaries and innovators and both were devoted family men.

        I admire Gates dedication to his charity efforts and the way in which it's done through his foundation. He isn't handing out money - he is fixing things where he can. I wish I had half the brains and drive that guy has.

        In the future I think Jobs will be celebrated for his technical expertise and vision - while Gates will be revered for his business sense and his charitable foundation. Nothing wrong with that.
        Signature

        Saving one dog may not change the world - but forever changes the world of one dog.

        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7662344].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author seasoned
          Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

          Why should he? The richest country in the world with massive social programs doesn't need more handouts. Yes, there are poor people here - but there aren't tens of thousands of people drinking dirty water or starving to death.
          AFRICA is ALSO rich! Maybe the RICHEST! OIL, GOLD, PLATINUM, SILVER, DIAMONDS, from AFRICA!!!!!!!! What is your point?

          Is there poverty in Africa? OF COURSE! There is ALSO poverty in the US! HEY, if his idea is giving handouts, his plan is DOOMED TO FAILURE! And MANY have done that elsewhere!

          How do YOU know the relative level of starvation? AGAIN, WHAT DOES IT MATTER?

          I think Gates and Jobs had one thing in common - they were authentic versions of themselves. They were both originals, visionaries and innovators and both were devoted family men.
          Yeah, I don't know if anyone can really say that but, ok....

          I admire Gates dedication to his charity efforts and the way in which it's done through his foundation. He isn't handing out money - he is fixing things where he can. I wish I had half the brains and drive that guy has.
          I was saying that trying to do it in a far off land is complicated and needs are higher. He could do more HERE. If he works elsewhere, I wish him well. If he fails, I can say "TOLD YOU SO!"!

          Steve
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7663879].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author ikhwanudin
    Bill Gates should focus on eradicating poverty from various nations. The amount of money he has, if he spends 20% of his money many poor people can get benefits from it.
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7664888].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by ikhwanudin View Post

      Bill Gates should focus on eradicating poverty from various nations. The amount of money he has, if he spends 20% of his money many poor people can get benefits from it.
      YOUR DREAMING! 100s of billions have been spent! BGs whole "networth" is 61 Billion. SO, if he wanted to become destitute and maybe brake some laws, he might squeeze out maybe 50Billion. It is more likely it is like 30Billion. In either case, t is LESS than the 100s of billions sent out, so don't think half cocked effort will work. That is INCREDIBLY rare, and I have NEVER heard of it working on a large scale. NOT ONCE!!!!!

      BTW Warren buffet is an ACTIVE CEO with a company with NO dividends, etc... and ANY sale is significant, so he is likely to find it harder to extract that much from his smaller "net worth"!

      Steve
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7666368].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author LarryC
    I guess when you have that much money, it's hard not to become a megalomaniac. I would be very cautious about anyone who claims to be able to fix all of the world's problems -especially if he's connected to companies like Monsanto!

    As for the article, it's true if rather obvious that measuring important data can be useful. In that way, it's like an introductory IM article telling you to test everything. However, if you take this principle too far (as someone like Gates inevitably does), you end up with the typical technocratic/bureaucratic mentality that thinks everything can be quantified.

    In my opinion, this mindset is revealed in most Windows products. They are functional (though with lots of glitches) but lack imagination and inspiration for the most part. Inflicting this sensibility on the whole world doesn't sound like the greatest idea to me. But then I'm a Mac user, so I'm probably biased
    Signature
    Content Writing, Ghostwriting, eBooks, editing, research.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7665991].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
      Originally Posted by LarryC View Post


      I guess when you have that much money, it's hard not to become a megalomaniac. I would be very cautious about anyone who claims to be able to fix all of the world's problems -especially if he's connected to companies like Monsanto!

      Bingo. Only half sane response here.

      Forget his words, go by actions.

      This guy is part of the New World Order , he joined either willingly or unwillingly. He is under the power of combined Trillionaire families that could easily crush him.

      He is a Duke, Baron, Earl, Count, Land Lord , King, NOT an EMPEROR class, thats all billionaires are.

      This "who is the richest man in the world" crap is a purposeful distraction to hide the REAL power behind The Presidency and other world governments.

      You got a system, in addition to a world system, with so many corrupted holes of so many sizes and shapes that is looks like glass....and he wants to worry about one hole that he thinks is important when the ship has so many that the total is still incalculable because NEW one's are being created daily......, by his bosses and ego-powercentric people like him.

      The solution will come from the FORCED unity of the people, one way or another because they want to cull the population by 80% or so, and have the rest as permanent stock cattle.

      The Patriot Act forever destroys the Constitution and he has ideas...., brilliant....., rich idiot.


      The 13th Warrior
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7672671].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Ernie Lo
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7672730].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
      Bingo. Only half sane response here.

      Forget his words, go by actions.

      This guy is part of the New World Order , he joined either willingly or unwillingly. He is under the power of combined Trillionaire families that could easily crush him.

      He is a Duke, Baron, Earl, Count, Land Lord , King, NOT an EMPEROR class, thats all billionaires are.

      This "who is the richest man in the world" crap is a purposeful distraction to hide the REAL power behind The Presidency and other world governments.

      You got a system, in addition to a world system, with so many corrupted holes of so many sizes and shapes that is looks like glass....and he wants to worry about one hole that he thinks is important when the ship has so many that the total is still incalculable because NEW one's are being created daily......, by his bosses and ego-powercentric people like him.

      The solution will come from the FORCED unity of the people, one way or another because they want to cull the population by 80% or so, and have the rest as permanent stock cattle.

      The Patriot Act forever destroys the Constitution and he has ideas...., brilliant....., rich idiot.


      The 13th Warrior
      Yep, agree, he has 40 billion but seems to do a token amount! You would think that someone like that would be like the Virgin founder. He has created a record breaking deep sea sub, and the worlds first commercial space ferrying service, or zero grav, service!


      And Bill Gates just seems to flounder around????

      With his brains and money, he could set up a research dept, and develop real tech, to help the poor. The gravity globe, (developed by others) is a good example.


      Not sure about the culling the population, sounds a bit Sci-Fi to me!


      Bill Gates may develop good OS, but he seems to be Full of S*** for the "helping the poor bit"!

      Shane
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7672881].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author whateverpedia
        Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

        You would think that someone like that would be like the Virgin founder. He has created a record breaking deep sea sub, and the worlds first commercial space ferrying service, or zero grav, service!
        Which benefits the poor of the world how?

        I'm sure starving Africans are soooo grateful that rich people will be able to take a joy ride through space courtesy of Richard Branson.

        Obligatory Disclaimer: I'm not defending Gates in any way, shape or form.
        Signature
        Long time Warrior HeySal is fighting for her life. Click here to help her out: https://www.gofundme.com/heysal
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7673420].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author seasoned
          Originally Posted by whateverpedia View Post

          Which benefits the poor of the world how?

          I'm sure starving Africans are soooo grateful that rich people will be able to take a joy ride through space courtesy of Richard Branson.

          Obligatory Disclaimer: I'm not defending Gates in any way, shape or form.
          First of all, WHOA! EVERY new email is like 180degrees from how it was for bill gates, WOW!

          You know, simply feeding a starving people that have been starving so long does NOT help. Starving, they may remain starving. Feed them and they may have kids, do who knows what, etc... Tomorrow they will just be hungry again with a BIGGER problem.

          If you can't go over there and BOOTSTRAP them somehow, by giving them a viable industry and/or teaching THEM how to get things going, it is best to leave well enough alone. Haven't people learned that from the hundreds, and possibly thousands, of years of history?

          Steve
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7673527].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author whateverpedia
            Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

            First of all, WHOA! EVERY new email is like 180degrees from how it was for bill gates, WOW!

            You know, simply feeding a starving people that have been starving so long does NOT help. Starving, they may remain starving. Feed them and they may have kids, do who knows what, etc... Tomorrow they will just be hungry again with a BIGGER problem.

            If you can't go over there and BOOTSTRAP them somehow, by giving them a viable industry and/or teaching THEM how to get things going, it is best to leave well enough alone. Haven't people learned that from the hundreds, and possibly thousands, of years of history?

            Steve
            First of all, WHOA. I have no idea how your reply connects to what I wrote.

            I know that merely feeding people isn't going to solve anything.

            The person I was responding to stated that Gates actions were misguided, and that he should do something more focussed like providing a space joy ride service that few will ever be able to afford. My reply was asking how the world's poorest people would benefit from that.
            Signature
            Long time Warrior HeySal is fighting for her life. Click here to help her out: https://www.gofundme.com/heysal
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7673606].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
              Which benefits the poor of the world how?

              I'm sure starving Africans are soooo grateful that rich people will be able to take a joy ride through space courtesy of Richard Branson.

              Obligatory Disclaimer: I'm not defending Gates in any way, shape or form.
              Just using them as examples, but you are right, it isn't directly related.

              Or another way of putting it is, Richard Branson, has more drive and would come up with something that would help the poor for the long term.

              Bill Gates just seems to hardly do anything except token help! The token help is important, eliminating some viruses, etc, but with his brains and cash, this is only the tip of the iceberg!


              I suppose his wife and family, (l am guessing he has one) takes up all his time, and his "see spot run, efforts". Or his wealthy friends, have him on a leash?


              Or it could just be wealth? When some people get wealthy, they just seem to produce crap, overall, or don't bother.

              Spielberg, is one that comes to mind, he did brilliant movies early on, Jaws, Raiders, etc. Then when Paramount gave him a more than 1 billion movie lot, his creative talents tended to dry up. Back to the future was his last great movie. Transformers went from good to crap.

              He may vindicate himself with Lincoln, but the point is, if some get too much money they tend to give up, or their brains tend to go numb?

              Bill Gates has shown us that he could do something revolutionary, or invent something, but so-far he looks like a fizzer!

              Shane
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7673763].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author seasoned
              Originally Posted by whateverpedia View Post

              First of all, WHOA. I have no idea how your reply connects to what I wrote.

              I know that merely feeding people isn't going to solve anything.

              The person I was responding to stated that Gates actions were misguided, and that he should do something more focussed like providing a space joy ride service that few will ever be able to afford. My reply was asking how the world's poorest people would benefit from that.
              And I said that if you don't somehow bootstrap them, it WON'T!

              Steve
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7673824].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      Originally Posted by Ernie Lo View Post

      "Allegedly" He also thinks its important to reduce population and let old people die instead of getting treatment so that money can go towards hiring more teachers, nice bloke he is.

      Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate

      I myself have gone from disliking this guy as a head of a controlling evil empire (MSFT) - to what he has taken what he has, and become a philanthropist with it, and seems genuinely trying to make a change (who knows? maybe it is all an evil plot) and for that, I have come to admire what he is doing...

      Even 'retired', he will still have the title: 'King of the Nerds' (he made nerds what they are today! )

      This is a man who wants forced vaccinations. I don't trust his "charity" one whit. I've listened to him talk enough. He needs to shut up and let us and our gov run things. I'm not getting forcibly vaccinated because some dude that got rich being a techy whiz wants me to.
      Signature

      Sal
      When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
      Beyond the Path

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7673389].message }}
  • {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7674741].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      How easy it is to bash people who do donate a lot of time and money to help others. Gates wife is fully involved in his foundation work as are other members of his family.

      To say someone else would do it better is a bit silly. They either do it or they don't. I think most of the criticism of Gates work in third world countries comes from people who don't give to any charity except themselves. Can't imagine any other reason to diss ANYONE who provides help for those who need it...except jealousy, envy, greed.
      Signature

      Saving one dog may not change the world - but forever changes the world of one dog.

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7675775].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Kurt
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

        How easy it is to bash people who do donate a lot of time and money to help others. Gates wife is fully involved in his foundation work as are other members of his family.

        To say someone else would do it better is a bit silly. They either do it or they don't. I think most of the criticism of Gates work in third world countries comes from people who don't give to any charity except themselves. Can't imagine any other reason to diss ANYONE who provides help for those who need it...except jealousy, envy, greed.
        There's a few people on this forum always looking for the bad and evil in others. I guess they think by putting down others that it makes them look better, when if fact nothing could be further from the truth.

        Instead of putting down the generousity of others, maybe they should try helping. Microloan sites like www.kiva.org are a great way to start.

        I recently read how cell phones greatly impact the economy in many third world areas. A portable solar panel and charging system to charge the phones would be very useful and could create a cottage business for someone. Lend money for someone to buy a breeding goat or a sewing machine to make clothes to sell.

        Instead of all the bitching and put downs, how about spending that time actually doing and helping for a change?
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7675920].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author LarryC
          Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

          There's a few people on this forum always looking for the bad and evil in others. I guess they think by putting down others that it makes them look better, when if fact nothing could be further from the truth.

          Instead of putting down the generousity of others, maybe they should try helping. Microloan sites like www.kiva.org are a great way to start.

          I recently read how cell phones greatly impact the economy in many third world areas. A portable solar panel and charging system to charge the phones would be very useful and could create a cottage business for someone. Lend money for someone to buy a breeding goat or a sewing machine to make clothes to sell.

          Instead of all the bitching and put downs, how about spending that time actually doing and helping for a change?
          So now we're not allowed to question the motives of someone just because they are extremely wealthy and claiming to be helping people? We should just ignore troubling evidence that he might be working on projects that may ultimately do more harm than good? Sorry, I guess I forgot my place.

          I actually like the whole concept of Kiva and microloans. Despite the self-righteous way you presented this topic, it's definitely a step in the right direction as it involves grassroots efforts rather than decisions made from high up.
          Signature
          Content Writing, Ghostwriting, eBooks, editing, research.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7676085].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author Kurt
            Originally Posted by LarryC View Post

            So now we're not allowed to question the motives of someone just because they are extremely wealthy and claiming to be helping people? We should just ignore troubling evidence that he might be working on projects that may ultimately do more harm than good? Sorry, I guess I forgot my place.

            I actually like the whole concept of Kiva and microloans. Despite the self-righteous way you presented this topic, it's definitely a step in the right direction as it involves grassroots efforts rather than decisions made from high up.
            Sure, you can question the motives. Just as I can question YOUR motives. Your motives aren't intended to help, they are to tear down others. The difference is, Bill Gates isn't here to defend himself, but you are.

            BTW, I'll bet you a coke that you'll feel much better after helping someone out on Kiva than you did trying to bring me down. You can call it "self righteous". I call it taking up my own challenge.

            I didn't do it to impress you. I did it to try to motivate you. You said you like the idea of micro loans. Go make one. Now. Like I did.
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7676184].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author LarryC
              Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

              Sure, you can question the motives. Just as I can question YOUR motives. Your motives aren't intended to help, they are to tear down others. The difference is, Bill Gates isn't here to defend himself, but you are.

              BTW, I'll bet you a coke that you'll feel much better after helping someone out on Kiva than you did trying to bring me down. You can call it "self righteous". I call it taking up my own challenge.

              I didn't do it to impress you. I did it to try to motivate you. You said you like the idea of micro loans. Go make one. Now. Like I did.
              You don't know my motives. "Bringing down" someone on a discussion forum is really not high up on my list of thrills. You managed to change the subject bringing up these Kiva loans. Anyone can say, "You people are just here arguing on a forum while I'm taking real action." As I said, I totally support that project, but that has nothing to do with Bill Gates... unless he helps fund these projects. But even then that doesn't mean everything he does is laudable.

              What I and others were questioning were some of his actions done in the name of saving the world. If the accusations that he is working with Monsanto are unjustified (as some claim), then I'm open to hearing it. However, to try to shut people down by accusing them of complaining, bitching, whining or whatever is an old tactic that just implies we shouldn't question something.
              Signature
              Content Writing, Ghostwriting, eBooks, editing, research.
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7676272].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
                Cause and Effect.

                One cannot know or solve a problem "permanently" if you do not accurately get to the root cause.

                From the most acclaimed "educated" to non-educated, majority deal with symptoms and the complications.

                Poverty, this or that , mostly are man-made "artificially" caused problems masking as "normal" .

                Most that have degrees or are considered educated have a base of a mix of truth and falsehood which gives some measure of power to execute in life, but not really to tackle problems at their core because the data of knowledge they are tapping into has a false premise, and it was purposefully designed so because who in power or ANY measure of power wants to give it up for ANY reason, let alone truth?

                Teachers and Professors are mostly little to no help in this regard , as they are regurgitating a premise someone else taught them, and them and them.

                " The cause" of World War one, two, the cause of disease, most have an standard academic base of these causes spoon fed thru schools, but never get to the "why" and cause of things, that 2nd and 3rd layer deep of why something "really" happened.

                People can quote the history of Napoleon and his actions all day long, but few question the help he had and needed and the core reason of that help. The same help that "helped" everyone he was fighting also.

                A small percentage of people know , to some extent, for example, a fair amount of Wars in history was intentionally caused under false premises or artificially enhanced, they were not organically caused, if there such a thing....but most start or stop right there.

                But few will dig further and get at the "the one" single starter, cause, conceptual creator , mastermind, singular/group creator and "the first" ultimate conception to such an artificial historic condition, like Paul Warburg.

                Even then, another layer is digging even deeper to the cause of what brings the type of mind the will conceptualize a chain of events in the first place. Words like psycho-pathology, sociopath do not "source" the cause of such evil, the "reason" such comes into existence.

                Don't expect the typical sources to tell you all you need to know about this dude, you simply get more academic propaganda to add to an already powerless education to free yourself , your government and the world .

                Alas, a lot of people are content to believe The Matrix is the real world that always was and will be.......some will fight, gladly and willingly, for their masters to kill anyone who wishes to eradicate such an illusion of what life and existence is all about.

                The word "natural", for another example, is a word people and very smart people throw around but have no concept of what it really is.

                Some will argue its semantics and context, this or that.

                Because if you don't know what is truly natural, how do you know what is artificial?

                How would you classify a problem as natural or artificial to properly deal with it at its root cause, the reason it came into existence?

                That which is natural is a daily procession of the universe, like that what was already here before man was aware of it, touched it or that which came with the planet. Few know what I'm talking about, most will take it a thousand places, but lets simply put it in context as simply cause and effect , historical facts of disease and war vs propaganda and artificially induced problems masking as natural occurrences as the "facts" and origins of disease and war.

                A rhinoceros and a lion would never mate , but if some scientist did some gene splicing and created a creature from these two, is it natural? Does it behave naturally?

                Something artificial can NEVER do what something "natural" can do, can never be its equal or surpass it, it will always have qualities lacking.

                Corn, beets or carrots can NEVER do what a Burdock plant can do, never, neither even come close to its benefits.

                Its kinda funny when the talk about GMO corn and organic corn, when corn itself is a GMO....if you want natural a natural substance, starch free, cyanide free, acid free, gluten free substance that has minerals that will turn into flesh and organs, what The Mayans truly ate, get that wild plant where corn comes from, corn is from a laboratory.

                So whoever or where ever you seek help or source of knowledge to assist you, if it is not natural, what good is it really doing us?

                3rd world countries and even that phrase, as an example, are not natural, that was also produced in someone's laboratory for a nefarious reason.

                Psychologist, psychiatrist and sociologist only add confusion with their theories of what is naturally occurring cause of things, they mostly have nothing to solve the problems of anything except more academic minutiae and drivel.

                What can doctors and other "experts" tell you about cancer if they don't know its cause, or know if it is natural or artificial?

                They deal with cancer the same way they deal with sociological cancer...., they drug the symptoms...... they compound an artificial problem with more artificial solutions and because the seemingly temporary relief of pain "feels good" , most accept THAT and the doctor as an expert treatment.


                To each his own.



                The 13th Warrior
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7676778].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
                  How easy it is to bash people who do donate a lot of time and money to help others. Gates wife is fully involved in his foundation work as are other members of his family.

                  To say someone else would do it better is a bit silly. They either do it or they don't. I think most of the criticism of Gates work in third world countries comes from people who don't give to any charity except themselves. Can't imagine any other reason to diss ANYONE who provides help for those who need it...except jealousy, envy, greed.
                  Ok, maybe l am coming on a bit strong, it is just that he has substantial wealth and brains, and just seems to be wasting it!!!!

                  It's a bit like approaching Leonardo Da Vinci, and instead of asking him to create a machine that would generate a lot of electricity for little mechanical effort, (obviously l am disregarding time periods) he instead gives to the poor!

                  The first thing could save countless poor family's across the globe forever, and the second eventhough good, is considerably less helpful long term!

                  That is what annoys me about him, he could do so much, and just gives a token!

                  It all comes back to giving a man a fish, and teaching him to fish!

                  Shane
                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7677053].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author Kay King
                    I don't think you know much about the Gates Foundation. Gates and his wife have donated 25 billion dollars and much of the work of the Foundation focuses on helping people help themselves. Simple machines that provide clean water and can be maintained in the future - grants for farmers and equipment/training to improve yields for sustainable food sources. More importantly - he's doing what he wants with money he earned.

                    Sorry, but it irks me to see people complaining about the charity other people are doing. When you donate your money, you can do it any way you want. It all helps.

                    The $25 billion number is probably a total of all donations to the Gates Foundation, but it's the number often quoted.
                    Signature

                    Saving one dog may not change the world - but forever changes the world of one dog.

                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7677444].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Kurt
    And instead of just talking about it, I decided to make a small micro loan through Kiva.

    Since I'm an ex cab driver and into green energy, I selected Dugersuren who lives in Mongolia. He needs money to buy a hybrid taxi that runs off both gas and electricity.

    Kiva - You're invited to Join Kiva
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7675997].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    13th,

    Corn predates that kind of technology. It is a natural hybrid. MOST vegetables are in SOME way. But they didn't use a virus or genesplicing or special chemicals to do it. It was selective grafting, polinating, cross breeding, etc.

    And YEAH, corn grew from something similar to wheat to something like what we have today. There are, as I recall, 3 main types of corn often used in the US, and each has many types within it. And that isn't even accounting for blue corn, or indian corn.

    But NONE were created as you imply, and they ALL have LOTS of history behind them. Some people believed the tomato was poisonous! It IS related to a plant that can be very poisonous. We now it generally ISN'T now because it has SO much history behind it.

    And YEAH! world wars were caused because one LARGE group had to fight against another. That is generally because one was the aggressor. There is NO way that could happen without someone coordinating it. The only questions are who and why.

    Steve
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7677519].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author SandraLarkin
    Banned
    Bill Gates supports Eugenics and GMOs. That is all that needs to be said. It is very, very sad.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7677639].message }}
    • Originally Posted by SandraLarkin View Post

      Bill Gates supports Eugenics and GMOs. That is all that needs to be said. It is very, very sad.
      Having an interest in or supporting research in both these areas of study can lead to advances in disease and germ resistant strains which could be beneficial to mankind if properly administered. Not everyone is Hitler - or Monsanto (which I do know he has worked with, they are one of the world's leading GMO companies) - and every experiment does not have to turn into a Frankenstein monster - whether we like to admit it or not, organisms and germs modify on their own, and we constantly need to develop ways to be resistant to them, or eradicate them.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7677688].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      Originally Posted by SandraLarkin View Post

      Bill Gates supports Eugenics and GMOs. That is all that needs to be said. It is very, very sad.

      That's where I fall out on Gates. Charity is supposed to be done to help people - "forced vaccines" isn't "help". It's not "charity". It's an attempt to rule, and I don't like it. Promoting farming would be great - but not when it's Monsanto style farming. This guy is duping everyone calling his work "charity".

      There are a lot of people that are involved with REAL charity. I am more respectful of Kurt's charity that actually helps someone get a substainable life, than of Gates manipulations that go under the guise of charity. Charity isn't always charity just because someone is pouring money into it under a legal financial spigot. There are people that really deserve admiration and respect for what they are doing. Gates isn't one of them in my view. Sorry if people don't like that. I don't feel that respecting someone just because they have money and power is all that great a boast either.
      Signature

      Sal
      When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
      Beyond the Path

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7678097].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
        Having an interest in or supporting research in both these areas of study can lead to advances in disease and germ resistant strains which could be beneficial to mankind if properly administered. Not everyone is Hitler - or Monsanto (which I do know he has worked with, they are one of the world's leading GMO companies) - every experiment does not have to turn into a Frankenstein monster - whether we like to admit it or not, organisms and germs modify on their own, and we constantly need to develop ways to be resistant to them, or eradicate them.
        Yep, funny thing about GMO, crops and food is no one in 1st world economies want it!

        Maybe that's why he is pushing 3rd world GMO crops! Seems like a good idea on the surface, (better to have food on the table that's is genetically modified, than none) but long term?

        True nature does it all the time, but within limits. We tend to get genetic material from Animals, and paste it over, scary stuff.

        Shane
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7678150].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author LarryC
    As the article below points out, GMOs have the potential to quickly bring about mass contamination of crops. If it's proven a couple of years from now that they are dangerous, it will be hard to turn back. This can also be seen as a type of colonialism, as Monsanto and other large companies will be in control of much of the world's food supply.
    Op-ed: Gates Foundation should step away from funding genetically modified crops in Africa | Opinion | The Seattle Times

    Genetically modified crops threaten conventional and organic production as well as the autonomy of African producers and nations. In 2002, Emmy Simmons, then-assistant administrator of the U.S. Agency for International Development, stated that, “In four years, enough (genetically engineered) crops will have been planted in South Africa that the pollen will have contaminated the entire continent.” Biotechnology cannot coexist with agro-ecological techniques and traditional knowledge.
    Signature
    Content Writing, Ghostwriting, eBooks, editing, research.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7679143].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      Sal - Interesting. You are always posting about the need to reduce population. Gates is promoting the right to and education about abortions (and is a big supporter of Planned Parenthood) and the need to produce less population in areas where people are struggling to survive. He is promoting childhood shots to prevent common diseases in the countries with the goal of keep kids alive and leading to a healthier population in that country.

      Melinda Gates has written about eugenics and the resurgence - read the last couple of paragraph of the page below and you'll find it doesn't support your claim:

      Articles: Melinda Gates Talks Eugenics


      Back in 2003, the Gates Foundation invested $25 million in "GM (genetically modified) research to develop vitamin and protein-enriched seeds for the world's poor," a move that many international charities and farmers groups vehemently opposed (http://healthfreedoms.org). And in 2008, the Gates Foundation awarded $26.8 million to Cornell University to research GM wheat, which is the next major food crop in the crosshairs of Monsanto's GM food crop pipeline (Global Small Farmers Denounce Gates Foundation Purchase of 500,000 Monsanto Stock Shares).
      Of course, some will form opinions based on slanted opinions on sites like
      Bill Gates, Monsanto, and eugenics: How one of the world's wealthiest men is actively promoting a corporate takeover of global agriculture

      That site claims Planned Parenthood is eugenics. It frequently prints some very "out there" ideas and most are "out to get us" articles.

      Now - because the words are used, it is assumed Gates supports all these "bad" things. What he is doing is trying to find ways to support huge population of people living at starvation level. Currently, Monsanto (bad as it is) is the leader in GMO research.

      GMOs as currently exploited by Monsanto - is bad. That doesn't mean there is not a future potential of increasing crop production with future GMO research. Things can always be done better - but not if there is a knee jerk reaction that anything associate with GMO is horrendous.

      For generations farmers have increased yields in this country through using methods and hybrids and cross-strains of crops where research found ways to produce more food per acre. Yet the idea of "hybrids" was argued when they were first developed. They were called unnatural and potentially dangerous...but there was no internet to make them into a cause or world conspiracy so the research continued and succeeded.

      When dealing with an entire population of people that are living at subsistence level, you can't afford the luxury of eliminating research and development that could potentially offer solutions. You can't base what you do on a rich country where people are quick to abandon ideas after labeling them based on one corporation. You can't use a US-based mindset of judgment of corporations and conspiracies to feed hungry people.

      No one needs to approve of what Gates or other charitable foundations do. But argue from a position of knowledge rather than from pushing your own beliefs on the charitable work done by someone else. I don't get the point in the complaints - would it really be better if Gates shut down his charitable work?


      Signature

      Saving one dog may not change the world - but forever changes the world of one dog.

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7679531].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author HeySal
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post


        No one needs to approve of what Gates or other charitable foundations do. But argue from a position of knowledge rather than from pushing your own beliefs on the charitable work done by someone else. I don't get the point in the complaints - would it really be better if Gates shut down his charitable work?


        Yeah thanks Kay. I am educated to produce propaganda. I know how to reverse engineer it. No lecture needed.

        You are right - GMOs might someday be able to be produced safely. But now it's not and it's sheer stupidity to promote something that is PROVEN unsafe for both the environment and human health. Study it, fine - but to plant it all over the world and force farmers into that system is a travesty of ignorance and greed. Fortunately, country after country agrees with me and Monsanto is being banned - 50 countries and counting.

        You want to start looking at things in a whole instead of snippets as long as you're accusing me of ignorance of the issue? Kewl - get this............Planned Parenthood (which I actually support strongly) -- okay, now stick that together with GMO farming...........and what do GMOs do besides kill almost everything in and on the soil and that eats it? It sterilizes people.

        Maybe you should take some of your own advice and study the issue a little bit deeper.
        Signature

        Sal
        When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
        Beyond the Path

        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7680017].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Kay King
          I know you support Planned Parenthood and population control - as I do.

          The big picture to me is to find ways for poor countries to produce enough food and clean water to improve their standards of living. To do that requires research - even into areas where I might not approve of what is currently done in the area.

          I was raised in large part on a farm and I remember my Grandfather talking about progressive methods of farming. He was willing to test them but some of his friends were not - their reasons were not dumb but were rooted in small problems that, in time, were overcome through the experience of people willing to give a new method a try and report their results.

          It's a process and there are downsides and questionable companies like Monsanto. But there are also potential results that can only be found through research and testing.

          When the goal is to help a country where starvation of children is the norm I can understand using a combination of population control through birth control education AND available abortions. I can understand testing of soil amendments and enhanced seed so that people with small plots of land or poor soil can raise enough food to feed a family.

          We all tend to approach problems from our own experience and beliefs and that's normal. When a problem is huge and one we don't experience, sometimes we have to broaden our acceptance of methods used. That's all I'm saying. We'll never solve the world's hunger problems if we don't research and test every possible option to improve safe food production.

          I think in the end Monsanto has done more to harm the potential of GMOs than anything else - and all for profit.

          Sal - my comments are aimed people in general, not at you. Sorry if they came across that way.
          Signature

          Saving one dog may not change the world - but forever changes the world of one dog.

          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7680090].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    I'm certainly not against hybrids. But the idea of forcing them, putting in pesticides and the like, and monopolizing and bribing, etc.... I am very much against THAT! The idea of suing miners because your invention TRESPASSED on THEIR property? They should sue YOU for stealing THEIR property, and endangering their livelihood! Monsanto has done PLENTY of bad!

    Steve
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[7680203].message }}

Trending Topics