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11 years ago

I wonder what the truth is with Fukushima. Some reports said it was worse than Chernobyl. Are increased rates of birth defects starting to occur in Japan yet.

Birth defects and Fukushima?
"Health risks include birth defects and thyroid cancer."
Calls for US seafood testing after revelations of Fukushima radiation leaks - The Japan Daily Press
Fukushima's design made it particularly vulnerable to earthquakes. What were they thinking? This wouldn't have happened with the Canadian designed atomic plants, not that it would ever seem wise to have nuclear energy in earthquake zones.

All I know is the news media lies so much and covers up so much that it can't be trusted.

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Dennis Gaskill 11 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

All I know is the news media lies so much and covers up so much that it can't be trusted.

Yes, now if we could just get people to realize that goes double for politicians we might actually start making progress toward honesty in gov't and media.
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HeySal

11 years ago

FDA just ramped the radiation allowed in food a couple hundred percent -- and the amount of glysophate even more.

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serryjw 11 years ago

Hey Sal...I can't find a link to the FDA increase in rad in food...got one?
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- HeySal 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by serryjw
  
  Hey Sal...I can't find a link to the FDA increase in rad in food...got one?
  
  http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2012...2012-28967.pdf
  
  Might as well get it from the horse's mouth so nobody can yell "tinfoil". LMAO.
  
  Also - I'm on the west coast, kinda. There's a mountain rainge between me and the coast though - I'm in Central Oregon. Ricky and I take ATLANTIC kelp tablets. LOL - Used to take pacific, but, well - Doh.
  
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seasoned

11 years ago

I always wondered how they would handle such a situation. It is SAD! You need very knowledgeable team players to even DO this, and they will STILL be dead ducks.

As for birth defects, many in humans, or most mammals, aren't that obvious, or happen that quickly. It would likely be more obvious in reptiles, fish and birds first. Besides, humans will tend to stay away, for the most part.

As for this being worse than chernobyl? It sounds like it to me! Chernobyl was so bad because the reactors were among the worst made. With the fukoshima reactor, ALL BETS ARE OFF! It was so badly destroyed, that it might as well be just so much radioactive debris. I certainly don't envy anyone remotely involved.

Steve

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Kay King 11 years ago

Some is true and some fear mongering. Another totally undocumented claim of tens of thousands of US citizens sickened. For a time these people were claiming tens of thousands of deaths - but since they couldn't prove it happened it's now "sickened".

Christina Consolo replied, “The most serious complication would be anything that leads to a nuclear chain reaction.

Well, duh! What does she think makes spent fuel rods dangerous? The "nuclear reaction" that is occurring in them.

A new fuel rod can be handled safely by an unprotected worker before it's installed in a reactor. Once installed, the nuclear chain reaction in the fuel rod begins...that's where the power comes from.

That's why spent rods are so dangerous - the nuclear reaction in the rod continues. There's no way to turn it off - it goes on for years until the fuel in the rod has been used up by an ongoing nuclear reaction. That's why nuclear plants have cooling ponds for 'safe' storage of spent fuel rods.

Media people like Consolo get attention by raising fear in people - and this is a truly frightening scenario. But if you look back at the predictions of the same people just after the earthquake in Japan - you'll see their dire predictions of immediate global catastrophe did not materialize.

I think some of the danger and damage has been understated to prevent panic - but i think it's being overstated by those looking for media exposure at the same time.

The greatest risk at the moment is contamination of the ocean and of the massive quantities of marine life that provide a huge source of food around the globe.

This is a crisis where a tipping point (a meltdown) occurred. Like it or not, the experts have to try to limit the damage and contain the radiation. Doing nothing is not an option and there are no neat, clean solutions to the problem.

For me, the real story is what Sal mentioned above. Around the world, govts have raised the allowable radiation levels in food. It allows them to keep buying seafood from Japan?
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rondo

11 years ago

Fukushima made the mainstream news here today, so things must be pretty bad there.

Andrew

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Steven Wagenheim

11 years ago

And with all of this, the only thing I can keep asking myself is...

"How can they build a nuclear power plant in an earthquake zone?"

******* idiots.

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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

And with all of this, the only thing I can keep asking myself is...

"How can they build a nuclear power plant in an earthquake zone?"

******* idiots.

I said much the same when it happened. OK, how can give this 1000 thanks?!?!??!?

They *******KNEW******** this would happen! If they didn't, they should have asked ME a few decades ago. I mean it was built to withstand earthquakes less than 1/10th of what they got in the past. They KNEW they would get an earthquake! They KNEW they would get a tsunami! They KNEW there was a chance of flooding. They KNEW if the earthquake were large enough, they would have SERIOUS problems!

Steve

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HeySal

11 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

I said much the same when it happened. OK, how can give this 1000 thanks?!?!??!?

They *******KNEW******** this would happen! If they didn't, they should have asked ME a few decades ago. I mean it was built to withstand earthquakes less than 1/10th of what they got in the past. They KNEW they would get an earthquake! They KNEW they would get a tsunami! They KNEW there was a chance of flooding. They KNEW if the earthquake were large enough, they would have SERIOUS problems!

Steve

Indeed. Japan has some of the largest quakes in the world happening in that region - they are sitting on plate boundaries - look at the Kermadec Islands that string along some of those boundaries........they shake almost continually. Japan KNEW it has the propensity for throwing 8 and 9 mag quakes - yet they want a nuclear reactor. NOBODY in the world should be allowed to have a nuclear reactor. It's just sick to me the way we allow a few people to jeopardize the whole damned population.

Kay - did you see the number of rods they have to remove? That plant stores fuel, too. This isn't fear mongering at all. This is the largest risk to life on earth we've seen to date. It's not just worse than Chernobyl - it dwarfs it. As far as seafood from Japan - I have a friend in Alaska that said the seafood up there is already badly tainted, and the stuff coming in from CA, OR, WA coast is, too -- the Pacific fishing trade is going out the window soon it would seem.

I've already started Ricky and I taking Atlantic kelp daily.

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Brian John

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

And with all of this, the only thing I can keep asking myself is...
"How can they build a nuclear power plant in an earthquake zone?"
******* idiots.

indeed

reminds me of one of carlin's lines: "Or how about those people in Kilowaia, Hawaii, who built their homes right next to an active volcano, and then wonder why they have lava in the living room."

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ThomM

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Brian John

indeed

reminds me of one of carlin's lines: "Or how about those people in Kilowaia, Hawaii, who built their homes right next to an active volcano, and then wonder why they have lava in the living room."

Or as I like to put it.
"If brains caused pain, most people wouldn't feel a thing."

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Kay King

11 years ago

Dumbitude is pervasive - a few years ago in Georgia people built huge homes in the woods around a lake....then complained there were foxes in the woods and wanted "authorities" to remove the foxes.

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Fernando Veloso 11 years ago

Get ready for a bumpy ride.
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- Kay King 11 years ago
  
  This isn't fear mongering at all. This is the largest risk to life on earth we've seen to date.
  
  I agree - it's a major catastrophe.
  
  People should be afraid - there's good reason. The facts are enough to scare anyone - pseudo-facts or partial facts cloud the issue.
  
  The one thing I don't understand is why it appears this company that built and owns the reactors is still making all the decisions. There may be much more (and probably is) behind the scenes but I see this as a global problem that requires a global response.
  
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  Fernando Veloso 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Kay King
  
  There may be much more (and probably is) behind the scenes but I see this as a global problem that requires a global response.
  
  Japanese are known for their pride - will they ask for help?
  
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  Riptor 11 years ago
  
  Here are some more horrendous facts...
  
  11 Facts About The Ongoing Fukushima Nuclear Holocaust That Are Almost Too Horrifying To Believe | True Activist
  
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HeySal

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

Dumbitude is pervasive - a few years ago in Georgia people built huge homes in the woods around a lake....then complained there were foxes in the woods and wanted "authorities" to remove the foxes.

The Cascadia subduction zone is a bizarrely dangerous subduction zone. It puts out 8 and 9 mag quakes and runs 1,500 miles along N CA, OR, WA - and into BC. The last time it went off was 1710 and it sent deadly tsunamis all the way to Japan, all down the W coast, and inward at Columbia Gorge (where Vancouver, WA and Portland, OR sit).

A significant fault line runs right through the middle of Seattle and connects with the subduction rift. Seattle sits on sediment. There are how many million people in Seattle now? Hmmmmmm.

The zone is overdue to snap again. Japan's coast is completely built up where that tsunami will hit. We have cities up and down our coast - and San Fransisco is a freaking Island. Kewl.

Now when that blows, people are going to scream about how bad quakes are getting due to (pick one: HAARP, Global Warming, retribution via diety), yet quakes aren't really increasing (increases are due mostly to our ability to collect global seismic data now). What is increasing - and at an alarming level, is the amount of people who will park right on top of a subduction zone or major fault line.

Vesuvius is also overdue to blow again and has shown signs of doing so. There are now around 800,000 people living right ON Vesuvius.

Doesn't get more fun than this. It never ceases to amaze me when people are severely shocked by a disaster in places that are geologically prone to, and with a history of, major disasters. Duh. It's a wonder more people don't electrocute themselves. How is it they understand electrocution when they don't understand "earthquake zone" or "live volcano"?

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serryjw

11 years ago

Hey Sal, I like Global Research..I believe they have the best unfiltered information.
What do you make of this article?
West Coast of North America to Be Hit Hard by Fukushima Radiation | Global Research

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Kay King

11 years ago

Japanese are known for their pride - will they ask for help?

As I said - there may be much more going on than we know. If their problem threatens other countries and food sources, it should be a global effort to stop the destruction whether Japan wants help or not.

It may be they are the best trained and suited to keep working on this - I don't know.

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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

As I said - there may be much more going on than we know. If their problem threatens other countries and food sources, it should be a global effort to stop the destruction whether Japan wants help or not.

It may be they are the best trained and suited to keep working on this - I don't know.

HOW can ANYONE help? It is a SMALL area, and things have to be done CAREFULLY by people FAMILIAR with it! THEY are the ONLY ones that know it. If you had a hundred people that knew EVERYTHING, they would be DOOMED to failure because they would be BOUND to hinder one another. And what of INFRASTRUCTURE?

YEAH, everyone seems to think that 100 times the people can do 100 times more. MY response is that "YEP, and 9 women can have a baby in one month!"!

HECK, we can't even offer heavy machinery due to time and instability. A it is, they say it will take 40 years! Using the standard pounds for ton, and the lowest number of rods, each weighs over 615 pounds(280KG). The cranes they used to install them were ALSO destroyed.

They ARE, ironically, asking for, and getting help from the company that refined the plutonium for the bombs dropped there. The two most likely things seen like cleanup and cocooning. The later takes time and machinery, and the weight and instability, along with the likelihood of earthquakes, might be problematic.

This will likely spell the END of nuclear power plants. The fukushima powerplant apparently had problems **I** would consider dangerous as far back as 1978!

Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Plant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

IRONIC! They caused it to start, and killed it. And BOTH created problems on THEIR soil. Of course THIS problem could destroy SO many things, including "humanity".

Steve

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AeroBuilders

11 years ago

Originally Posted by serryjw

Hey Sal, I like Global Research..I believe they have the best unfiltered information.
What do you make of this article?
West Coast of North America to Be Hit Hard by Fukushima Radiation | Global Research

All true - already soil samples throughout US west coast (lots of crops grown there) are not looking good. Cumulative build since spring 2011 is the problem and mainstream media is helping to keep the lid on the realities.

BTW, there was over 600,000 spent fuel rods at Fukushima stored in pools above the reactors - that was a great idea!

http://www.infowars.com/letting-tepc...gery-on-a-vip/

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serryjw

11 years ago

Alex is on top of it...Ohhhhhhhhh, are we in trouble. I am in Denver!

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AeroBuilders

11 years ago

Originally Posted by serryjw

Alex is on top of it...Ohhhhhhhhh, are we in trouble. I am in Denver!

Arnie Gunderson goes on the Alex Jones show frequently with updates...critical months ahead for Fukushima.

BTW, if Fukushima goes nasty the whole US is screwed - Brazil will be the place to go (or anywhere south of the equator)!

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serryjw 11 years ago

I don't speak spanish!
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- AeroBuilders 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by serryjw
  
  I don't speak spanish!
  
  Learn Portuguese (Brazil) with Rosetta Stone
  
  LOL!
  
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serryjw

11 years ago

If you are on the west coast does taking iodine tablets make sense?

READ THIS!!
Fukushima Update | Nuclear News from Japan

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AeroBuilders

11 years ago

Originally Posted by serryjw

If you are on the west coast does taking iodine tablets make sense?

READ THIS!!
Fukushima Update | Nuclear News from Japan

Taking iodine will help keep your thyroid as safe as possible, but that is not good enough for ongoing cumulative exposure. You have to get out of the exposure area to be completely safe.

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serryjw 11 years ago

AERO...what about the food that is grown on the west coast that is shipped all over the country?
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- AeroBuilders 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by serryjw
  
  AERO...what about the food that is grown on the west coast that is shipped all over the country?
  
  It is tainted and that is why the various US govt agencies are now "adjusting" the acceptable radiation levels in foods.
  
  Fukushima update - North American food supply poisoned along Pacific Coast
  
  Great plan! (shaking head)
  
  BTW, this also includes what is taking place with seafood from the upper pacific (Hawaii and north).
  
  MAP of radioactive Pacific Ocean from NOAA - Radioactive Water From Fukushima Is Systematically Poisoning The Entire Pacific Ocean | The Daily Sheeple
  
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HeySal

11 years ago

Originally Posted by AeroBuilders

Taking iodine will help keep your thyroid as safe as possible, but that is not good enough for ongoing cumulative exposure. You have to get out of the exposure area to be completely safe.

No lie - agree fully, but am taking it until I can bug out. I'm looking to get GTFO of here within the next few months, and hope that it's soon enough. I just wish I could make my family in CA listen to some common sense. I saw milk from California on the organic shelf yesterday at the store and it made me shudder. Am checking the labels on all foods to see where it was produced now. Can't buy shrimp because NONE of it is labeled - either gulf or pacific is not food anymore.

Word from a friend in Alaska is that they are in a crisis over the fishing market up there.

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AeroBuilders

11 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

No lie - agree fully, but am taking it until I can bug out. I'm looking to get GTFO of here within the next few months, and hope that it's soon enough. I just wish I could make my family in CA listen to some common sense. I saw milk from California on the organic shelf yesterday at the store and it made me shudder. Am checking the labels on all foods to see where it was produced now. Can't buy shrimp because NONE of it is labeled - either gulf or pacific is not food anymore.

Word from a friend in Alaska is that they are in a crisis over the fishing market up there.

West Coast sourced crops are a crap shoot at this point - there is no independent group checking anything at this time. I feel for those in the Pacific fishing industry with such a huge mess - what a business killer.

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AeroBuilders 11 years ago

Arnie Gunderson is the guy to follow on Fukushima news.....

Mission Impossible? Fukushima scientists brace for riskiest nuclear fuel clean-up yet | Fairewinds Energy Education
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HeySal

11 years ago

Originally Posted by serryjw

Hey Sal, I like Global Research..I believe they have the best unfiltered information.
What do you make of this article?
West Coast of North America to Be Hit Hard by Fukushima Radiation | Global Research

It's got a lot of good news on it, but you have to decide each piece form referencing and the authors themselves.

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Kay King

11 years ago

Building that plant where they did was like putting a spent fuel depot over the Yellowstone caldera...

Exactly - which is why I don't understand why the rest of the world seems to be watching patiently while people who made the decision above try to find a solution.

Hoping for the best is fine - but planning for the worst is smarter. What steps are countries taking to protect their food sources, their land/air and people? Is it possible this is a disaster that can't be mitigated or contained? Do we have a disaster plan in place if the radiation spreads?

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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

Exactly - which is why I don't understand why the rest of the world seems to be watching patiently while people who made the decision above try to find a solution.

Hoping for the best is fine - but planning for the worst is smarter. What steps are countries taking to protect their food sources, their land/air and people? Is it possible this is a disaster that can't be mitigated or contained? Do we have a disaster plan in place if the radiation spreads?

Yeah, it is just bad because THEY built it and worked there and the whole thing is UNSTABLE. It is ironic, but they know the most about their failings, etc...

THIS is why such things, as PLACING AND BUILDING a plant as well as policies, should be managed by people recognized to be reliable and smart about all related subject matter. They ALSO should thoroughly research the area.

If it were me, I probably would have just said to build some other type of plant. Even if it were a DIESEL plant, you could just flip a switch somewhere to shut it down REMOTELY, and then take a century to clean it up if you wanted! I think nuclear is the only type that is not only so dangerous, but is more so in times of a disaster.

OK, so it would be more expensive. Given the area and history, IT'S WORTH IT!

I mean THINK about it. You have the foundation, building, coolant system, warning system, rod placement, rod containment, rod disposal, infrastructure and if ONE thing goes wrong it could be a disaster. If the foundation, or building break down, everything else likely will. That is RELATIVELY rare, but it happens. Here, it happened BIG TIME! BTW I emphasize relatively rare, because I have heard a lot about cracks and the like in nuclear plants. Granted, you are MORE likely to hear about such things THERE, but still there should be few.

Well, I guess this is the decade of irony! Maybe later I will get to explain that.

Steve

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serryjw 11 years ago

Sal, I agreed...that's why I read everything.
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- AeroBuilders 11 years ago
  
  Hmmmm? WHOA! Presidential Meeting Signals Catastrophic Event:
  
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  serryjw 11 years ago
  
  AERO...Have you read this?
  Massive US East Coast Disaster Warned Near As Dolphin Deaths Explode
  
  http://www.thetotalcollapse.com/
  http://www.thetotalcollapse.com/
  
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  AeroBuilders 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by serryjw
  
  AERO...Have you read this?
  Massive US East Coast Disaster Warned Near As Dolphin Deaths Explode
  
  http://www.thetotalcollapse.com/
  The Total Collapse
  
  Yes - for some reason there has been a huge FEMA/DHS build up in Region III for some activity/event in the next three months (all kinds of chatter about this from those still in the Military).
  
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  socialentry Banned 11 years ago
  
  The X files - Intro - Opening theme - Orginal HQ...
  
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Patrician

11 years ago

Seems to me I read a year ago or so that they had detected Fukishima contamination in California's soil, air and water but i can't find the link to that article right now.

OK - no reason I can't joke about my own situation.

I have always said California is the land of fruits, vegetables and nuts!
(and I have human examples for each of those 'entities').

Well it may soon be the land of GLOWING fruits, vegetables and nuts!

It's not just good weed here that medicates us best, nor is it a golden glow from the 'golden state' - but strangely enough it is a green glow - it's all the rage these daze. going green.

we are toasted.
we are glowing green toast.

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Kay King

11 years ago

HOW can ANYONE help?

Steve - I'm not referring to quantities of people - but to the best and most highly trained in the field of nuclear reactors and in disaster mitigation. That would be a very small group but could be a real brain trust in finding ways to isolate the fuel rods and limit contamination.

And I'm not thinking "US knows best". France produces over 75% of its power from nuclear plants, for example.

It's probably a silly thought as I expect the company in Japan is welcoming any expert help and advice they can get.

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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

Steve - I'm not referring to quantities of people - but to the best and most highly trained in the field of nuclear reactors and in disaster mitigation. That would be a very small group but could be a real brain trust in finding ways to isolate the fuel rods and limit contamination.

And I'm not thinking "US knows best". France produces over 75% of its power from nuclear plants, for example.

It's probably a silly thought as I expect the company in Japan is welcoming any expert help and advice they can get.

As I recall, when I heard about the top three reactor makers, France was #1! Still, they are probably CAREFUL and do they even have earthquakes? Under controlled circumstances, things are a LOT simpler and easier.

Steve

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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Patrician

Seems to me I read a year ago or so that they had detected Fukishima contamination in California's soil, air and water but i can't find the link to that article right now.

OK - no reason I can't joke about my own situation.

I have always said California is the land of fruits, vegetables and nuts!
(and I have human examples for each of those 'entities').

Well it may soon be the land of GLOWING fruits, vegetables and nuts!

It's not just good weed here that medicates us best, nor is it a golden glow from the 'golden state' - but strangely enough it is a green glow - it's all the rage these daze. going green.

we are toasted.
we are glowing green toast.

California has nuclear reactors too. Outside of seeing the radiation at the same time. I don't think they could say where it came from. It's interesting that anyone even uses the fruit and nuts joke anymore, considering what it means, and the current climate. BTW I never heard the vegetables comment before. You DO know that fruit does NOT refer to oranges, apples, etc... and nuts does NOT refer to almonds. GRANTED, they have those, but others do as well.

Steve

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Patrician

11 years ago

Coincidence?

Radioactive Leaks in Japan Prompt Call for Overseas Help

Yuji Okada, Jacob Adelman and Peter Langan, ©2013 Bloomberg News

Published 9:14 pm, Wednesday, August 21, 2013

Radioactive Leaks in Japan Prompt Call for Overseas Help - SFGate

ug. 22 (Bloomberg) -- The crippled nuclear plant at Fukushima is losing its two-year battle to contain radioactive water leaks and its owner emphasized for the first time it needs overseas expertise to help contain the disaster.
Tokyo Electric Power Co. is grappling with the worst spill of contaminated water since the March 2011 earthquake and tsunami caused a meltdown at theFukushima Dai-Ichi plant. The call for help from Zengo Aizawa, a vice president at the utility, follows a leak of 300 metric tons of irradiated water. Japan’s nuclear regulator labeled the incident “serious” and questioned Tepco’s ability to deal with the crisis. Prime Minister Shinzo Abe made similar comments earlier this month.

...As much as 20 trillion becquerels of cesium and 10 trillion becquerels of strontium leaked into the ocean since May 2011, Tepco spokeswoman Mayumi Yoshida said today. The total amount of cesium and strontium is equivalent to about 100 times the annual limit on radiation from the plant to the ocean under normal conditions, according to calculations based on Tepco data.

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Paul Myers

11 years ago

Building that plant where they did was like putting a spent fuel depot over the Yellowstone caldera...

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AeroBuilders 11 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Building that plant where they did was like putting a spent fuel depot over the Yellowstone caldera...

Exactly, and we can thank GE for part of this crime! GE is one of those HUGE globalist wealth entities who have infiltrated the US Govt at many levels (just like central banks, Big Pharma, Big Ag, Defense Companies, Energy Companies, etc). The US Citizenry no longer controls their own govt, so expect more nasty globalist wealth entity CREATED disasters ahead....they love their "order out of chaos" agendas.

I am a former US Military SPEC OPS troop and I know that within the military there are some serious plans in place if Fukushima goes into spent rod meltdown. The moving of all these nasty spent fuel rods will be a massive "manual" process - this period will be very dangerous during the many months it will take for real clean up.

I have a sister with two young kids who live in Portland and I am BEGGING her to move to Austin at this time - if Fukushima goes MELTDOWN during these critical months ahead it will be too late. How much do you think a $700,000 home in Portland will be worth once the REALITY of the overall situation sinks in. I told her to protect her kids and BAIL NOW to be "ahead of the power curve" before any mass panic may hit. Respiratory deaths in the West Coast are escalating out of normal year to year trends, so the area is already getting affected.
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rondo

11 years ago

What the heck is a becquerel?

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Dennis Gaskill 11 years ago

Originally Posted by rondo

What the heck is a becquerel?

A unit of radioactivity.

Becquerel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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socialentry Banned 11 years ago

Originally Posted by rondo

What the heck is a becquerel?

A type of rare bird found in the Amazon forest.
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- seasoned 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by socialentry
  
  A type of rare bird found in the Amazon forest.
  
  t can't be TOO rare! The plant is releasing a LOT of them.
  
  Sorry for the crass attempt at humor. I couldn't resist.
  
  Steve
  
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HeySal

11 years ago

Page not found. That's been happening just a little too frequently for comfort lately.

Edit: found it EU Times had the article: http://www.eutimes.net/2013/08/massi...eaths-explode/

Would like to know how major that volcano is. 5.8 isn't really that large a quake to get strung over, but if it's seismic activity from a volcanic cauldra, who knows what to expect? I would think that houses are built to code in the US, although along the East coast there's a lot of really old buildings.

The one really good thing I can see is that it's in Fema III - and that's DC, so we might just get rid of our damned corruption at the top in one whack.

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serryjw 11 years ago

HeySal...strange..the 2nd link works fine. The site maybe just too busy. Having problems, put url in your browser...
Let me know what you think.
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MissTerraK

11 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

The one really good thing I can see is that it's in Fema III - and that's DC, so we might just get rid of our damned corruption at the top in one whack.

LOL!

That's my girlfriend! Thanks for my first smile of the day.

But on to more serious matters, you need to get the heck out of there and come back home!

I'll restock the garage fridge with Asti.

Terra

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Steven Wagenheim

11 years ago

Okay, stuff like this scares the crap out of me because if half of what I'm reading
is true this could literally mean the end of this planet.

So before I go off into a panic and move my family to Brazil or wherever, I do a
little research. No offense, but the sources that have been given in this thread
are not what I would personally call credible. I've never heard of any of these
sites. So I have to take a lot of the alarmist stuff with a little grain of salt.

So what I did was I went to the New York Times to see what they have to say
about this, if anything. Mind you, none of this has been on my local news program
since the initial earthquake. There have been no reports of attempting to move
rods or contaminated seafood in California or any of it.

This is the most recent article from the New York Times. It was 8/20/2013.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/21/wo...ear-plant.html

You'll notice there is no talk of moving rods or Armageddon or contaminated
seafood in the US or rising deaths or anything.

I understand that we don't want to cause a panic. Can you imagine if the
President got on the TV one day and said "Residents of California, Oregon
and Washington, you MUST leave your states immediately."

Where the hell would all these people go?

But I have to wonder how much of what I've read is true and how much of
it is just selling news. I trust the New York Times. In fact, it's probably the
only paper I trust on this planet, as liberal as they may be. I also trust my
local news. Why nothing on the tube about any of this?

I'm not saying there's not a serious problem or that if there isn't yet there
won't be. I'm saying that I'm not entirely convinced that things are as bad
as reported yet.

Some confirmation from our government would be nice. I mean I'd hate to
think that we'd let millions of people die just to avoid causing a panic.

I'm not convinced.

But I'm still pretty scared.

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thunderbird

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

<snip>I trust the New York Times. In fact, it's probably the
only paper I trust on this planet, as liberal as they may be. I also trust my
local news. <snip>.

I don't trust the New York Times myself. They lie all the time and when caught in bare-faced lies and extensive documentation to back it up, don't correct their errors. Here's an example. Eventually an editorial admittance the the New York Times grossly misreported the story and broadcast barefaced lies was extracted:
The BRAD BLOG : Exclusive: NYTimes Public Editor Declines to Recommend Retraction for Multiple Erroneous Reports on False ACORN 'Pimp' Story

That is just one of many examples.

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AeroBuilders

11 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

I don't trust the New York Times myself. They lie all the time and when caught in bare-faced lies and extensive documentation to back it up, don't correct their errors. Here's an example. Eventually an editorial admittance the the New York Times grossly misreported the story and broadcast barefaced lies was extracted:
The BRAD BLOG : Exclusive: NYTimes Public Editor Declines to Recommend Retraction for Multiple Erroneous Reports on False ACORN 'Pimp' Story

That is just one of many examples.

The problem with the "corporate controlled" media........

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Fernando Veloso

11 years ago

Good media (about Fukushima) is nowadays small sites and small groups of individuals interested in one subject. They tend to get more reliable information - from respected sources, then any big corporate media.

At least they try to get real information...

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Steven Wagenheim

11 years ago

Here is an earlier article that clearly points to a coverup, but still nothing about
moving rods or Armageddon.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/08/wo...pagewanted=all

Sorry, but there is nothing that I hate more than sensationalist journalism just
to sell news. I think it's irresponsible.

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AeroBuilders

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

Here is an earlier article that clearly points to a coverup, but still nothing about
moving rods or Armageddon.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/08/wo...pagewanted=all

Sorry, but there is nothing that I hate more than sensationalist journalism just
to sell news. I think it's irresponsible.

Unfortunately, you will never find much REALITY in most all "corporate controlled" mainstream media reports - they are just a bunchs of pawn in a globalist game of lies and deception. The mainstream media is there to "sell you" the lies handed to them from their masters and that is about all they are good for.

I would suggest you get some info from a real live nuclear expert as you do your due dillgence.....

Epic Fukushima interview Arnie Gundersen & Helen...

Also, it has already been reported in the US there is a While House imposed "gag order" many mainstream media are following on Fukushima news........... "Tepco Has Lost Control" - What Is Really Happening At Fukushima In Four Charts | Zero Hedge News

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serryjw 11 years ago

AERO...Goebbels would be proud.
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- AeroBuilders 11 years ago
  
  Goebbels could never in a million years comprehend the power of THEIR current propaganda capabilities........
  
  BBC reports WTC 7 collapse 23 min BEFORE IT...
  
  Originally Posted by serryjw
  
  AERO...Goebbels would be proud.
  
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  AeroBuilders 11 years ago
  
  Removing "damaged" spent fuel rods manually at Fukushima is like 10 year olds playing with roman candles in a gasoline flooded obstacle course.
  
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  serryjw 11 years ago
  
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  AeroBuilders 11 years ago
  
  So......why do they need to HURRY UP and move all those spent fuel rods???
  
  1) Possibility of more quakes
  
  2) Fuel Rods not getting cooled properly at damaged facility
  
  3) Fukushima facility collapse............
  
  Fukushima Ground Turning to QUICKSAND, Buildings...
  
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  Kay King 11 years ago
  
  2) Fuel Rods not getting cooled properly at damaged facility
  
  Because some of the water towers being used to cool the rods since the meltdown have begun to leak.
  
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rondo

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

Here is an earlier article that clearly points to a coverup, but still nothing about
moving rods or Armageddon.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/08/wo...pagewanted=all

Sorry, but there is nothing that I hate more than sensationalist journalism just
to sell news. I think it's irresponsible.

Moving of the rods was announced and was reported in the mainstream news. See here and here.
There is fear and speculation because it's an extremely dangerous thing to try, and there is a lack of trust in the company and governments.

Who knows how it will play out but if there is a big problem I'm sure you'll here about it in your local news!

Andrew

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Kay King

11 years ago

Gundersen does have expertise - but also a reputation as a fear monger who exaggerates things from his creds to radiation risk.

Fact is there are fuel rods that must be moved or controlled. There is no low risk way to do it. It could make things worse at Fukushima - but it has to be attempted.

This is a real life example of what happens when a tipping point is exceeded...all bets are off.

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AeroBuilders

11 years ago

So far Arnie has "nailed it" on his "calls" since the Fukushima incident started....what he said in the beginning has turned out to be factual. If you knew what the US Military is planning for, if Fukushima let's go, you would see that Arnie is tame in comparison to what could be said.

Also, the moving of the spent fuel will have to done "manually" which is even more risk and nuclear experts are not excited about this fact.

Originally Posted by Kay King

Gundersen does have expertise - but also a reputation as a fear monger who exaggerates things from his creds to radiation risk.

Fact is there are fuel rods that must be moved or controlled. There is no low risk way to do it. It could make things worse at Fukushima - but it has to be attempted.

This is a real life example of what happens when a tipping point is exceeded...all bets are off.

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Kay King

11 years ago

will have to done "manually" which is even more risk and nuclear experts are not excited about this fact.

So - how do they propose moving the fuel rods...if not "manually"?

No one should be excited about this in any way - there's no good answer but we have to deal with the reality.

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AeroBuilders

11 years ago

Many facilities that are not "blown up" use robotic and automated process for removing fuel rods.

Originally Posted by Kay King

So - how do they propose moving the fuel rods...if not "manually"?

No one should be excited about this in any way - there's no good answer but we have to deal with the reality.

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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

So - how do they propose moving the fuel rods...if not "manually"?

No one should be excited about this in any way - there's no good answer but we have to deal with the reality.

There are three ways:

1. 100% manually. It is the most dangerous and hardest, but relies on nothing else.
2. Using cranes and all, which is suggested in the last video prior to this post. It requires a LOT of infrastructure, etc... HE suggested destroying the building, of which one is aleady done, and building a structure around it(as he said a building around a building), and have the crane run off of it.
3. Fully automatically. It is by far the safest, but is so hard to do now that nobody would even suggest it. That is what they WOULD have had if the building lasted through this.

So basically people are suggesting the first two. I have actually seen atomic fuel pellets, and they are small. One person said the rods merely contain those pellets, and suggested removing them to simplify movement. Who knows? People have said that the rods could be warped, etc... and frustrate moving them.

Steve

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HeySal

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

Here is an earlier article that clearly points to a coverup, but still nothing about
moving rods or Armageddon.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/08/wo...pagewanted=all

Sorry, but there is nothing that I hate more than sensationalist journalism just
to sell news. I think it's irresponsible.

Yellow journalism gets sick real quick. That's why I don't follow Alex Jones. He actually has some pretty good investigative skills and a great staff. He's been right so often on issues that most of the country thinks of as "tinfoil" conspiracy theory that he's worth at least browsing over. He sensationalized everything he says to the point that it's kinda sick listening to him, though. If he'd just report without the dog and pony show tactics, he'd find he would probably be a very respected personality.

That said, it's pretty hard to tell if ANYTHING we hear on ANY media is true or not. The press was given full reign to lie to us (legally) in 2001 or 2002, can't remember which year, now. Several MSM reporters complained very openly about how the news is being edited or fed to them from the WH with orders to just read it as is - not to investigate the validity. We have the same news system now as every fascist despot in history has had, with modernizations like TV added. People need to understand what corporate media means. It means that news is now a propaganda source - whatever benefits the company, and in a crony capitalism state, that means whatever benefits the leaders. You won't hear about things like the IRS scandal, Benghazi, or NDAA on MSM - until it's leaked far enough into the mainstream knowledge that they have to "control the info flow". After NSA domestic spying was leaked, what you heard on MSM was a major plug to make it sound like it was a good thing to have the gov watching which color undies you chose to put on that morning. They never once mentioned how individual profiles are built from this info, or why they need the detailed profiles of hundreds of millions of people in the first place.

When it comes to "news" in this day and age, we are on our own. EVERYTHING sounds like conspiracy theory now. Everything basically is now. We've allowed corporations and technical science run rampant and take over. Corporations have no soul, no ethics. They are money machines and damned anyone who stands in the way of a profit. Those hardcore enough to get to the top can feign humanitarian ethics - but if you dig, you'll find they are designing earth the way THEY want it to be and aren't all that concerned about us at all. Problems - they screw up. Like building nuclear plants all over the planet no matter how risky the area.

So who do we trust for the truth? Basically we are stuck for that one. What we need to look at is:
1. A proven track record for being right.
2. A track record of not just regurgitating what 100 other websites are posting.
3. An ability to hook what is being said to actual bills or laws or court cases.
4. Funding - above all, funding.

As far as Fukashima -- do you think our gov is just going to tell us that 1/5 to 1/4 of the population is in dire straights? Remember, you are talking about a gov that has allowed MONSANTO and Dupont, Dow, Syngenta take over our whole food supply with poisonous crop and chemical sprays at the risk of our health and environment. We have yet to hear the truth about the Gulf from ANY gov entity. I wouldn't live within 100 miles of that disaster where they are STILL spraying corexit. It's poisonous to life. Period. The alternative is to let the oil build up (since it's STILL leaking and they can't fix it) and stop the current cycle completely - which, at the time is accounting for shift in weather and ocean patterns because the water is heavy now and stagnating. Where's the report about exactly how toxic that water now is?

You want to trust these people? How much does it take to buy a government? $500 million seems to be the current figure. You got it and we can take it back. I don't have it.

I feel privileged to have the education in how to read bills and tie them to supporting bills and doctrines and have worked as a professional researcher. That's not enough anymore. "They" have messed up so many things and are taking control of so many others that it's impossible to find time to research everything I want to know about. It took me over 3 weeks to get through the damned Obamacare bill on its own.

I can't tell you who to trust completely. Nobody can. I listen to scientists I know, and who are not funded by gov. I have an acquaintance who is a civil rights lawyer with a very impressive rep at the federal level. I go inside for info as often as possible. I don't always have the inside track to information I want, though. So -- when stuff really seems soupy to me, I post it on FB or here, etc -- and let people hash it out together. Groups have a lot more ability to filter out the BS as long as people are not brainwashed (which is really easy to achieve, trust me on that one), or just Statist. Statists will dis anything anyone says that isn't the "official" view so are kinda useless where information deciphering goes on.

When in doubt - punt. I take my info on the "what's the worst that can happen, if........" point of view and figure it's best to take the road that turns out the best even if you are wrong.

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serryjw 11 years ago

HEYSAL...I agree with everything you said except...

When in doubt - punt

Things are getting to dire...when in doubt, go with your gut...WHEN has our gov't ever told us the truth..even JFK learned the hard way after the Bay of Pigs...The military is as bad as Wall Street with their lies.
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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

I feel privileged to have the education in how to read bills and tie them to supporting bills and doctrines and have worked as a professional researcher. That's not enough anymore. "They" have messed up so many things and are taking control of so many others that it's impossible to find time to research everything I want to know about. It took me over 3 weeks to get through the damned Obamacare bill on its own.

I can't tell you who to trust completely. Nobody can. I listen to scientists I know, and who are not funded by gov. I have an acquaintance who is a civil rights lawyer with a very impressive rep at the federal level. I go inside for info as often as possible. I don't always have the inside track to information I want, though. So -- when stuff really seems soupy to me, I post it on FB or here, etc -- and let people hash it out together. Groups have a lot more ability to filter out the BS as long as people are not brainwashed (which is really easy to achieve, trust me on that one), or just Statist. Statists will dis anything anyone says that isn't the "official" view so are kinda useless where information deciphering goes on.

When in doubt - punt. I take my info on the "what's the worst that can happen, if........" point of view and figure it's best to take the road that turns out the best even if you are wrong.

You're right. As for that bill, I read it enough to know what I know, and didn't have to go farther, but if I loved the bill, as described there, I would have to withhold judgement till I went through the pages that talked about subtle changes to other documents that said things like change the or to and in the third statement in such and such a section of such and such a document. Seriously, a speed reader could take days or more going through that.

I never liked the idea of nuclear. It is the one thing that can be DISASTROUS and there is NO way to shut it off. I don't know how long this world will last, but I have some good ideas how it will likely be destroyed.

Steve

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HeySal

11 years ago

Sherry - that's what I meant by "punt" - look around you, observe, and take everything with precaution. Better safe than sorry, and take the road of least dire results if you are wrong.

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serryjw 11 years ago

take the road of least dire results if you are wrong.

AGREED.

SERRY not SHERRY!
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- Riptor 11 years ago
  
  Comprehensive information on Fukushima.
  
  fukushimafaq.info
  
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yukon

Banned 11 years ago

Homer Simpson would have already had that mess cleaned up by now.

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seasoned

11 years ago

MAN, these people that talk about diluting.... WOW! Mercury would be diluted also! Doesn't seem to help anyone. The planet had a lot of pockets of relatively low radiation. HECK, it took maybe DECADES for curie to get cancer and she used one of the highest sources, maybe the highest, nuclear source EVER found in nature! But it is not worth much technically. So people over DECADES have refined such things, and taken the radiation in TONS of that stuff and compressed it into a very small area. In some cases it is so powerful that it would have INSTANTLY killed curie if she touched it, or breathed one molecule.

People have been playing around with this stuff for DECADES. Making things glow, taking xrays, etc.... Apparently most smoke detectors have a radioactive element in them. They use it in munitions, and obviously power plants. Perhaps the US shouldn't even have let the world know those bombs were atomic, but they certainly shouldn't have so easily told the world about everything and should have avoided the powerplants.
We get so little payback for all the effort. ICSM... That last video was telling. OH how I would love to remark on part of it. I have been against crazy building of nuclear power plants. I wasn't even happy to have power plants within a few hundred miles of me. They currently have TWO operating nuclear plants there. Where I live NOW, they have two that HAVEN'T BEEN COMPLETED! They were ABANDONED about 30 years ago! Wikipedia said one has the dubious honor of being the most expensive plant ever so abandoned.

Apparently both were abandoned because of caution after 3 mile island. Three Mile Island accident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Notice how 3 mile island started with the INEVITABLE failure of a small device followed by INCOMPETENT WORKERS! Apparently a worker on the NEXT shift almost instantly noticed the problem and did what COULD have fixed it had he done it in the previous shift. After those 2 hours though, it was too late!

But MAN, the irony!

Steve

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Kay King 11 years ago

There's been a lot of progress on safety with nuclear power and it is being produced in many parts of the world successfully/safely every day.

But - you don't build these plants in areas prone to natural disasters like earthquakes as the Japanese allowed.

Plants aren't being built today (neither are refineries, for that matter). Partly due to fear and public opinion - but more to do wtih uncertainty that affects financing.

With new regulations hitting constantly and the attendant reams of paperwork required for each new rule no matter how small....no investor groups will build nuclear plants or similar facilities.

They can't be sure the plant will ever be completed and most of all - they can't predict a completion date or production date because each new rule and regulation can stop construction for months or longer or shut down a half built plant forever. Investors don't like those odds.

It creates a problem in the US as initial nuclear plants were designed to be in use for 30 years. That time is up and newer plants have not been built. The solution? Add some retrofitting to the old plants and then extend the licenses far beyond the 30 years they were designed to be in use.
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HeySal

11 years ago

The problem with nuclear is that it has ALWAYS been dangerous and always will be. There are means of generating energy that are completely safe and self-replenishing. They refused to use them. They would make energy free for everyone - no more money flow, no more slavery. Nukes were sought for two purposes and two purposes only -- power. Who messes with a country with Nuclear capability to clean out the planet? Money. It's energy they can charge us up the ying for.

I'm sick of government, I'm sick of the 1% keeping us under their thumbs at all costs. I want free, clean energy. WTF is wrong with our heads that 7 billion people can't stop a few that are batsh*t crazy dangerous and will do anything for the buck, including destroying their own planet? Get rid of about 1000 of those top people and the rest of the planet would be living in peace and prosperity.

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Riptor 11 years ago

This is where investment should be going.

The Future of Free Energy is here now! The end of...
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Steven Wagenheim

11 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

The problem with nuclear is that it has ALWAYS been dangerous and always will be. There are means of generating energy that are completely safe and self-replenishing. They refused to use them. They would make energy free for everyone - no more money flow, no more slavery. Nukes were sought for two purposes and two purposes only -- power. Who messes with a country with Nuclear capability to clean out the planet? Money. It's energy they can charge us up the ying for.

I'm sick of government, I'm sick of the 1% keeping us under their thumbs at all costs. I want free, clean energy. WTF is wrong with our heads that 7 billion people can't stop a few that are batsh*t crazy dangerous and will do anything for the buck, including destroying their own planet? Get rid of about 1000 of those top people and the rest of the planet would be living in peace and prosperity.

I so feel your pain.

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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

The problem with nuclear is that it has ALWAYS been dangerous and always will be. There are means of generating energy that are completely safe and self-replenishing. They refused to use them. They would make energy free for everyone - no more money flow, no more slavery. Nukes were sought for two purposes and two purposes only -- power. Who messes with a country with Nuclear capability to clean out the planet? Money. It's energy they can charge us up the ying for.

I'm sick of government, I'm sick of the 1% keeping us under their thumbs at all costs. I want free, clean energy. WTF is wrong with our heads that 7 billion people can't stop a few that are batsh*t crazy dangerous and will do anything for the buck, including destroying their own planet? Get rid of about 1000 of those top people and the rest of the planet would be living in peace and prosperity.

I think I said this before here but... I once took a law class in highschool, and the teacher had some representatives come in from various parties. One person spoke about "solar energy". His idea, and supposedly that of his party, was to send up satellites(EXPENSIVE AND COMPLICATED), with SOLAR CELLS(WHERE could you put them, as most satellites use the precious real estate for solar cells to power their basic functions), that would generate the power and send it down as microwaves(DANGEROUS, expensive, and inefficient), which would then be converted by a ground station, to electricity, and sold to people. INCREDIBLE!

BTW he CLAIMED that solar power wasn't nearly as efficient on earth. It is efficient ENOUGH, and we can have structures that are FUNCTIONAL! In space, they have to unfold and are limited and the power is needed to even orient the satellite! Between the low realestate, heavy use of power, and inefficiencies of beaming it down as microwaves, we're better off with terrestrial pursuits.

If I were king, I would remind all of the fact that conduits have a LOT of use! Did you know one company bought a LOT of basically worthless underground pipe JUST so they could pull cable through it for the internet, etc? Among other things, I would have a conduit going from a support in the roof down to the electrical box which would have space for a transfer circuit. It might add $100-$200 to a home, but have a LOT of use including backup power and solar power. A lot of the more complicated and messier work would be made simple. I would ALSO work at making solar power cheaper. There is no reason it should be so expensive.

Steve

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SteveJohnson

11 years ago

By themselves, the fuel rods are 'merely' radioactive. The biggest danger in removing the spent fuel rods is that if one fuel rod were to get close enough to or touch another fuel rod in a certain way, the result would be a sustained nuclear reaction - without the benefit of a containment. Basically, you'd have the innards of a nuclear reactor without the outards, or the controls that keep the reaction from going out of control.

According to one of the stories, the previous methods of moving fuel rods was computer-controlled; the computer knew the position of the fuel rods in their containment to within fractions of a millimeter, and could control the robotic moving process. Now, it's all manual. Remember the board game Operation?

For all intents and purposes, if two fuel rods in close proximity went 'critical', there would be another meltdown, but right out in the open. Chernobyl would look like Disneyland.

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HeySal

11 years ago

I just looked at a radiation map and got sidetracked to a page showing where the Nuke plants are in the US. I can't believe we have so many. This just made me choke to see it:

Nuclear Radiation Map - Bing Images

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Sal
When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

I just looked at a radiation map and got sidetracked to a page showing where the Nuke plants are in the US. I can't believe we have so many. This just made me choke to see it:

Nuclear Radiation Map - Bing Images

MAN! My NEW state has NONE! But WHY does Illinois, which is NOT that much larger, have SEVEN!?!?!?!? I was safer in california with the TWO in the state! SICK! In the eastern half of the US, there are only THREE states that don't have nuclear reactors!

One state that should *********NEVER********** be allowed to have nuclear reactors because of the incompetence, theft, burglary, dishonesty, etc... is ILLINOIS! They seem to have the most!

Steve

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SteveJohnson

11 years ago

There aren't that many working nuclear plants. That map includes some closed/decommissioned plants and storage sites. The 'fallout' portion is 'extrapolated from Chernobyl data' - entirely worthless. Just a scare monger map. If people want to effectively oppose nuclear power generation, they have to use the truth, not made-up fantasies.

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HeySal

11 years ago

That was a reputable site (or maybe the click took me to another one?). Anyhow, it didn't say "open" or "closed" but I"m still just really shocked that we had that many in the US....ever. I thought we only had three or four.

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Sal
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SteveJohnson

11 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

That was a reputable site (or maybe the click took me to another one?). Anyhow, it didn't say "open" or "closed" but I"m still just really shocked that we had that many in the US....ever. I thought we only had three or four.

HANFORD had 6 or 8 working reactors in its heyday. We always used to joke that you could tell someone was from the TriCities (three cities 20 miles away) because they glowed in the dark.

You're right, it didn't say open or closed, but that's kind of my point. Arguments against nuclear power need to be above-board, because if people find the 'facts' being fudged even a little, they distrust the whole message.

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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

That was a reputable site (or maybe the click took me to another one?). Anyhow, it didn't say "open" or "closed" but I"m still just really shocked that we had that many in the US....ever. I thought we only had three or four.

Three or four? We closed down at least one because of a disaster. I think at least one other was almost closed down. There have been two in california. And that is just for starters. BTW the map is incomplete! I keep mentioning the 2 or so in california. There was at least one that was there and is not listed. There was also at least one in nevada that isn't listed. So CLEARLY, that map only shows the ones that are public commercial power plants. BTW the two I know of in Nevada and california that weren't on that list WERE decommissioned, and small for testing, etc... Clinton passed laws protecting one, from cleanup regulations and lawsuits, and the other is at least not on public land, but I think both have too much contamination, at least when I heard of them.

Steve

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seasoned

11 years ago

BTW the notice about alaska/hawaii implies these are only COMMERCIAL reactors. ALSO, two WERE planned in indiana, but never finished. As for chernobyl, etc? The size, type, weather, etc... play a part. I don't think the circles are too scary. They may not be big ENOUGH, and fallout could vary from an increase in exposure to a quick death. I heard the world heard about chernobyl because sensors in SWEDEN were tripped. That isn't to say anyone in sweden will get cancer or die, but they saw some fallout!

Steve

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AeroBuilders

11 years ago

** Update ** August 24, 2013

"New Leaks” have been discovered, 240 megatons of potentially explosive radioactive material on site, mutations of local plants and wild life, etc.

» The Coming Fukushima Global Disaster with Dr. Christopher Busby Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!

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seasoned

11 years ago

Originally Posted by AeroBuilders

** Update ** August 24, 2013

"New Leaks" have been discovered, 240 megatons of potentially explosive radioactive material on site, mutations of local plants and wild life, etc.

» The Coming Fukushima Global Disaster with Dr. Christopher Busby Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!

OK, 240 megatons may be more than is on the planet. Megatons is generally the measure of explosive force from a blast if it explodes. If they are seeing mutations in larger animals at this point, it is FAR worse than they should allow. Then again, that might be part of the reason why they make it sound so dire now.

Steve

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Patrician

11 years ago

Toxic Leaks At Fukushima Reach Lethal Levels of Radioactivity - Forbes

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waterotter

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Patrician

Toxic Leaks At Fukushima Reach Lethal Levels of Radioactivity - Forbes

A comment left about this article:

We've had at least half a dozen articles telling us how trivial the Fukushima disaster was..........comparing it to bananas...............telling us that the evacuation was needless.............how stupid the Japanese and Germans were for closing down their nuclear reactors...........and on and on.

I just saw an interview with a nuclear expert on PBS newshour. He discussed the actions that are being proposed to try to get the situation under control. It is quite clear---there is not much that CAN be done.

Let's hope that's NOT true, but the damage has already begun and that plant is like a run-away-train, out of control.

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seasoned 11 years ago

Originally Posted by waterotter

A comment left about this article:

Let's hope that's NOT true, but the damage has already begun and that plant is like a run-away-train, out of control.

sometimes, I am amazed at what people can do. Still, in theory, this is like star trek the wrath of khan. They had the ******EXACT****** same problem, except that the effort required was FAR less!

They knew that they would go critical and blow up, and also, an enemy would destroy them due to the lack of power. Spock decided that the right thing was to risk HIS life to save everyone elses. He ended up dying of course.

Of course HERE, the situation is far worse! Do we even know the effort involved? Do we know the risks? Do we know the stability of the area? Without that, we have to go in half cocked and even MORE may die!

You see, if the risks are imminent danger, we must go in NOW! All will have near full exposure. The risk of death will be HIGH, but it is to save everyone else.

If the risks are low level leakage, the effort is high, and the area is stable, we could get cranes and maybe do things more remotely and the risk of death will be lower. Guess wrong here, and all could die.

BTW The germans have just gone public with a NEW type of reactor! The PROS? The radioactivity will last only 300-600 years! It is also likely a bit safer and more powerful. The CONS? It is FAR more radioactive!

Can nuclear power be eco-friendly? | Environment | DW.DE | 03.09.2013

So what should we do? Use a nuclear plant that could leave the world safe for our great great great great grand kids, or one that is safer until then?

Now, as to a more direct answer to your question, HERE is another post about daiichi:

Can Japan's government stop the Daiichi crisis? | Asia | DW.DE | 04.09.2013

Steve

Steve
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Patrician 11 years ago

Originally Posted by waterotter

A comment left about this article:

Let's hope that's NOT true, but the damage has already begun and that plant is like a run-away-train, out of control.

Yes Jody and something else I heard yesterday or saw in the headlines - that the clean-up is the most dangerous thing to occur yet - in other words (well, as far as I figured) worse than the earthquake/tsunami dangerous, and worse than sit there and let it leak.

I think we all need to be very concerned but of course I don't know what we do about that other than take kelp and pray alot.

Toxic Leaks At Fukushima Reach Lethal Levels of Radioactivity - Forbes
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HeySal

11 years ago

Pat - while kelp does help a bit - there's only so much radiation it can help fight against. It won't help in a continual onslaught. If the radiation gets high enough, or continuous enough, you have one choice to be safe -- move. Period.

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Sal
When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
Beyond the Path

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waterotter

11 years ago

Japanese government to fund $470 million 'ice wall' to combat radioactive water

The plan to freeze the ground around the reactors is particularly ambitious. The Japanese government has previously described the task as "unprecedented."

The technology has been used before in the construction of tunnels, but never on the massive scale that the Fukushima plant would require. It also has never been used for the years or decades that experts think will be needed at the plant. It is likely to involve plunging tubes carrying a powerful coolant liquid deep into the ground.

The liquid would freeze the ground solid so that no groundwater could pass through it. Officials say that the ground freezing is "a good solution as an interim fix" until the leaks underneath the reactors are permanently sealed.

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OMG - they are going to move the fuel rods.

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