Computer for sale - $5,995

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  • Profile picture of the author ForumGuru
    Banned
    Yeah, I remember the days of 400-800 baud modems and learning to program simple stuff in BASIC.

    Cheers
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    Those were the days that my college curriculum counselor told me that I didn't need to worry about computer classes because I'd never need them - only my secretary would have to know how to use them.
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    When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
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    • Profile picture of the author joe golfer
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      Those were the days that my college curriculum counselor told me that I didn't need to worry about computer classes because I'd never need them - only my secretary would have to know how to use them.
      hahaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. I remember in the early days people at work pretending they were too cool by saying, "Me? I don't even know how to turn a computer on."

      Better learn!
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    • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      Those were the days that my college curriculum counselor told me that I didn't need to worry about computer classes because I'd never need them - only my secretary would have to know how to use them.
      While working my way through college, I had a co-worker was an aspiring sports writer.
      He could not write well at all. He said he would have a secretary for that.
      I lost touch with him and do not know how he did it, but he is now a very, very well
      known sports columnist.
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      "If you think you're the smartest person in the room, then you're probably in the wrong room."

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  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
    Banned
    Yeah 256 K RAM was an upgrade. My first computer had a whole 20 MB hard drive and I thought I'd never fill it up.
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    FG, You had 400-800baud modems? What standard were THEY? I used 110, 300, and 1200(202 and 212). There is a 600baud, and a couple even slower than 110 used for like TTD. Of course I used faster ones, but they really weren't available until quite a bit later.

    Well, I kind of built MY computer the opposite way, and it was like 1981-1982, and it didn't have the S-100 bus. And I didn't have the 132 column dot matrix printer, I only had a 80 column in normal print. I only had a 5MB drive BUT, if it had a 10MB drive, and a 132 column printer, the whole system would have cost about $3300! But it was 6502, 8080, z80 compatible. It had a 6502 and a z80, and the z80 was 8080compatible. Operating systems were Apple Dos 3.3 and CPM (I think it was the version JUST before v3.0).

    Maybe I'm lucky I never got that IMSAI. The idea of a standard bus IS neat though.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author ForumGuru
      Banned
      Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

      FG, You had 400-800baud modems? What standard were THEY?
      Good question! I took a computer programming class in 8th grade (which would be like like 1978) and that is where we had terminals that connected to the largest mainframe/data center in the city. The acoustic coupler modem that we used was 400/800 baud...we had a couple of them and they looked sorta similar to these below.



      I had a great time back then as I actually got a key to the computer room (actually a big closet) and was allowed to come into school in the evening hours, by myself, and logon to the system. Instead of of writing simple code I basically played the old star trek game, a drag racing game, and a couple of others tearing through reams of paper like they were going out of style.

      I quickly tried looking up the 400/800 baud standard but did not find much information.

      https://www.americanbar.org/newslett...adwarrior.html

      How fast was your first modem? [Archive] - DVD Talk Forum

      I did find this guy "overclocking" his 300 baud modem.

      https://groups.google.com/forum/#!to...ms/BoO9DrPlmgg

      Anyway, I think the days are long past when a teacher gives the key to the computer room to an eighth grader that gets unfettered access until the janitor locks the school doors at about 9PM.

      Cheers

      -don
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      • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
        Banned
        $5,995, in about 1980, or something? Is that a genuine advertisement, or an April 1st one?!
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        • Profile picture of the author seasoned
          Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

          $5,995, in about 1980, or something? Is that a genuine advertisement, or an April 1st one?!
          It's probably LEGIT, though it was probably a bit BEFORE 1980! The technology came out a bit after 1971, and WAS expensive. The 8080 became the basic processor, because it was a bit easier to interface than the 6800, and very capable.(The imsai, altair, TRS 80, and many others used the 8080) The z80 came out soon afterwards to compete. BOTH could run an OS called CP/M.

          Wozniak indicated that HE might have used the 8080, for the APPLE II, but went with the 6502 because, at the time, it was MUCH cheaper. With all the tricks they pulled on the APPLE II, at times, they could have lowered the price by over $500. I mean it was COLOR and had GRAPHICS and had SOUND and THAT was a big accomplishment at the time and for the price.

          The standard interface for the basic 8080 type of computer, and IMSAI was S-100. The maximum memory without banking was 64K, and hard disk drives and floppies DID exist. They were just very expensive. A 10MB drive could cost close to $1000, or into the 10s of thousands. That is JUST the disk drive, at least if it was SCSI. DMP printers ALSO existed, and 132 column was preferred for traditional programming and large accounting reports and the like.

          BTW realize that at THAT time they were AMERICAN MADE BY HAND! TODAY, most computers are made by cheap asian labor, and are FLOW SOLDERED! What used to take HOURS with a trained assembler can now be done automatically in less than a minute by machine!

          OLD WAY

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soldering

          NEW WAY

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flow_soldering

          Steve
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      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by ForumGuru View Post

        Good question! I took a computer programming class in 8th grade (which would be like like 1978) and that is where we had terminals that connected to the largest mainframe/data center in the city. The acoustic coupler modem that we used was 400/800 baud...we had a couple of them and they looked sorta similar to these below.



        I had a great time back then as I actually got a key to the computer room (actually a big closet) and was allowed to come into school in the evening hours, by myself, and logon to the system. Instead of of writing simple code I basically played the old star trek game, a drag racing game, and a couple of others tearing through reams of paper like they were going out of style.

        I quickly tried looking up the 400/800 baud standard but did not find much information.

        https://www.americanbar.org/newslett...adwarrior.html

        How fast was your first modem? [Archive] - DVD Talk Forum

        I did find this guy "overclocking" his 300 baud modem.

        https://groups.google.com/forum/#!to...ms/BoO9DrPlmgg

        Anyway, I think the days are long past when a teacher gives the key to the computer room to an eighth grader that gets unfettered access until the janitor locks the school doors at about 9PM.

        Cheers

        -don
        WOW! I NEVER heard of it! BTW the look of the gadgets you showed, is how MANY modems used to look. The phone company, in the US at least, USED to insist you register things, although people rarely did. Before THAT, they actually insisted you use leased equipment. To get past that, and make modems simpler, they had these devices where you dialed up the computer and put the handset on the couplers. The phone company couldn't complain, because the equipment on their side was all compliant. For a while, all the handsets were fashioned the same way. Later DC HAYES came up with a method almost everyone copied, and it was fully direct connect.

        WOW! I just checked to see what ever happened to hayes. They bet the WHOLE company on ISDN! ***I***could have told them it was a bad move. Anyway, it was a LOUSY standard! The ONLY reason it had to exist is that it could combine two lines, as most homes had at least 2 lines coming into the home, and run them at the highest compatible speed possible. It was STILL less than 1/10th the speed of a T1, and people kept using more and more bandwidth. They started leasing T1s, but they were expensive.

        They said ISDN DID catch on in Europe and Japan, but maybe the things were different. Maybe the lines were better, and it was faster. Maybe the cost of the line was lower. Maybe they adopted earlier, or things didn't change as fast. But in the US? Well, I started a job with a company that was to sell it and they gave me a book on it. I don't recall them EVER selling an ISDN line! They had NO ISDN modems. I don't remember seeing them in stores. I never got to use what I learned!

        Hayes didn't see the writing on the wall, and died a slow death.

        Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    Banned
    My first PC cost $1,200 & came with a free VCR (no joke).

    The day I went in to buy the PC was the last day of the promotion. The sales guy said they were out of free VCRs. I told him I'm leaving, I'll spend my money at another store. Less than 5 min. later I had a free VCR, lmao.

    I say free but I did end up spending over $1,200. I'm sure that PC was marked up to more than compensate for the VCR. I still got my free VCR, ha!
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by yukon View Post

      The first PC cost $1,200 & came with a free VCR (no joke).

      The day I went in to buy the PC was the last day of the promotion. The sales guy said they were out of free VCRs. I told him I'm leaving, I'll spend my money at another store. Less than 5 min. later I had a free VCR, lmao.
      Which PC and VCR were THEY? And WHEN? When I first looked for a VCR, non really looked cheap, and what one might call a PC didn't either! I wanted a cosmac elf when they came out. HEY, computers were expensive, and this was GREAT for hobbyists, and I was YOUNG! But a cosmac elf isn't what I would call a PC in the sense often understood.



      Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by yukon View Post

      The first PC cost $1,200 & came with a free VCR (no joke).

      The day I went in to buy the PC was the last day of the promotion. The sales guy said they were out of free VCRs. I told him I'm leaving, I'll spend my money at another store. Less than 5 min. later I had a free VCR, lmao.
      Which PC and VCR were THEY? And WHEN? When I first looked for a VCR, non really looked cheap, and what one might call a PC didn't either! I wanted a cosmac elf when they came out. HEY, computers were expensive, and this was GREAT for hobbyists! But a cosmac elf isn't what I would calla PC in the sense often understood.

      http://www.sparetimegizmos.com/Hardw...LF2K_small.jpg

      The again, I know the apple II dropped a good deal below $1000 around the 70s-80s. I only watched it around the time I was hoping to get one. I finally did, but not before it skyrocketed to about $1200. That was just the CPU UNIT! NO MONITOR! NO RF adapter! NO DISK DRIVE! NO TAPE DRIVE! NO PRINTER! It DID have 48K though!

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
    Those kinds of prices aren't surprising. When I bought my Amiga 3000, back in 1990, it was close to $4,000. Had a whopping 6 megs of ram, a 25 mhz CPU, and a 50 meg hard drive. And 2 floppy drives. Woot!

    Last time I even saw an acoustic coupler was on a college campus in the 70s. If you remember those, you're a dinosaur.
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    • Profile picture of the author ForumGuru
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

      Those kinds of prices aren't surprising. When I bought my Amiga 3000, back in 1990, it was close to $4,000. Had a whopping 6 megs of ram, a 25 mhz CPU, and a 50 meg hard drive. And 2 floppy drives. Woot!

      Last time I even saw an acoustic coupler was on a college campus in the 70s. If you remember those, you're a dinosaur.
      Dinosaur, eh? At least I was in college in the early 80's! While I very badly wanted a Heathkit in the 70's my pops would not spend the money.

      Once I was out on my own and got married the first machines I actually owned were the IBM 5155 Model 68 (4.77Mhz CPU)...



      IBM 5155 portable computer

      ...and a Tandy 1000HX (7.16 MHz CPU).



      Tandy 1000 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
      No Windows and not many crashes back then... ---> it seems the versions after 3.1, specifically 95,98 and XP did me no favors!

      -don
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      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by ForumGuru View Post

        ...and a Tandy 1000HX (7.16 MHz CPU).



        Tandy 1000 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
        No Windows and not many crashes back then... ---> it seems the versions after 3.1, specifically 95,98 and XP did me no favors!

        -don
        That tandy looks like one of the better ones. Most were either behemoths, or ones designed so poorly they practically fall apart.

        I think nearly all feel that 3.1, 95,98, 2000, XP, and 7 got progressively better. VISTA was a joke. I started with 3.0 and had some nice things, but it was like a DOG. The upgrade to 3.1 was a great improvement. And windows 3.0 was apparently when things started to take off. Look at us! ALL THESE years, and we STILL talk about 3.1, yet it seems that even 2 DECADES ago nobody spoke of earlier versions.

        That said, windows still has some BIG problems. I HOPE the next version addresses them. They COULD, for example, dedicate a core, on a multicore system to the O/S. You could have it to where windows nearly NEVER hangs, so you can deal with the problem processes in a timely fashion. Maybe they could have a settable idle to move old tasks into swap, so the tasks you need to run are in memory.
        They could have a media sanity switch that disables all audio graphic processes that aren't in focus.

        Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author Karen Blundell
      Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

      Last time I even saw an acoustic coupler was on a college campus in the 70s. If you remember those, you're a dinosaur.
      grrr you had to remind me, didn't you?
      lmao
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      • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
        Originally Posted by ForumGuru View Post


        I had a great time back then as I actually got a key to the computer room (actually a big closet) and was allowed to come into school in the evening hours, by myself, and logon to the system. Instead of of writing simple code I basically played the old star trek game, a drag racing game, and a couple of others tearing through reams of paper like they were going out of style.

        Cheers

        -don
        He, he, yep this was what l played around with in High School, or college for US, members.



        I pretty much lived in the computer room, full of these clunky things, (to scared to mingle outside and potentially get bashed).

        As a small group of others did, b/w screen, pixels you could see from a few metres away, and some cool games.

        Well, ping, snake, and some seriously crappy version of Doom, with 3D rooms, if you can call a few lines rooms?

        Atari 2600, was a step up from these, but not much of a step!

        Shane
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        • Profile picture of the author ForumGuru
          Banned
          Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

          Atari 2600, was a step up from these, but not much of a step!
          The first video game system owned was this version of the Tandy TV Scoreboard that I received as a Christmas present in 1976 or 1977.



          I still own and sometimes play my Atari 5200...



          ...about 15 years ago I built a working 5200 controller from a broken controller and a TV remote control, some solder, wire and duct tape. I still have that monstrous ugly thing I cobbled together...it is ugly but my kid still talks about it today.

          The actual 5200 controllers could be considered ahead of their time...but with all those "touch" buttons and switches they were not very reliable! The 5200 games I still have are Defender (one of my all time favorites), Qix, Pacman, Centepede, Joust and Pole Position.

          I have not yet purchased a Playstation 4 or an Xbox One as I am still using my Xbox 360 with about 75 disc games and over 200 arcade and indie games that I have on the hard drive and usb sticks.

          A couple of other working systems that I still have are an N64 and an original Playstation. I also kept some of my Sega Genesis and Super Nintendo games but I don't have working consoles for those games anymore.

          I think I may have put a few too many hours in on on game systems over the years!!!



          Cheers

          -don
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          • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
            Originally Posted by ForumGuru View Post

            The first video game system owned was this version of the Tandy TV Scoreboard that I received as a Christmas present in 1976 or 1977.

            I still own and sometimes play my Atari 5200...



            ...about 15 years ago I built a working 5200 controller from a broken controller and a TV remote control, some solder, wire and duct tape. I still have that monstrous ugly thing I cobbled together...it is ugly but my kid still talks about it today.

            The actual 5200 controllers could be considered ahead of their time...but with all those "touch" buttons and switches they were not very reliable! The 5200 games I still have are Defender (one of my all time favorites), Qix, Pacman, Centepede, Joust and Pole Position.

            I have not yet purchased a Playstation 4 or an Xbox One as I am still using my Xbox 360 with about 75 disc games and over 200 arcade and indie games that I have on the hard drive and usb sticks.

            A couple of other working systems that I still have are an N64 and an original Playstation. I also kept some of my Sega Genesis and Super Nintendo games but I don't have working consoles for those games anymore.



            Yep, l drulled over the 5200 one, but couldn't afford it!

            Yep, bought several for this one, Super Mario was my favorite, couldn't run around those green fields, and chase after the butterflys enough!

            I also played ET, arguably the worst game in history, and apparently Nintendo, buried a few million of them in the desert, they are unearthing them now!

            I also eventually got, an Atari 800 XL, with Miner 2049, (if l remember correctly)?

            Bloody hard game to get through, but l did it a few times.


            I am playing Zelda, now (the one after, Windwaker) and have finally gotten through a particularly hard level, l have been stuck on for months!

            This is for the Wii, from what l have heard the WiiU, Super Mario is like the 2600 one, can't wait to get my hands on that one!

            Shane
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  • Profile picture of the author whateverpedia
    Wow, did I ever get ripped off. I bought exactly the same system last week and it cost me $7000. Next time I'll shop around a bit more.
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    • Profile picture of the author Daniel Evans
      I remember when a mouse was a rock and the "VDU" was just a box with a fire in it.

      It used to run on Windows BC.
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  • Profile picture of the author waterotter
    If you remember those, you're a dinosaur.
    Lol, Guess that makes me a dinob!tch!
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  • Profile picture of the author SteveJohnson
    The first parts store I worked in changed over to a computerized inventory and invoicing system in 1979, it ran on an IBM System 3. The CPU was the size of a two-drawer filing cabinet, with the top taken up by a 12-inch Winchester disk drive. We rotated 7 disks that were labeled by day, taking home the current day's disk and replacing it with the next day's so we always had a week's worth of data. My boss destroyed the disk drive one night by not waiting till the drive had spooled down before lifting the disk up. There was supposed to be some kind of interlock to prevent that happening, but it didn't work.

    In the late 80s, at the car dealership I worked at I had a meeting with the owner, the general manager, and the office manager. The subject was whether to buy a 10MB hard disk for our utility IBM XT computer, or spring the extra $600 for a 20MB drive. It was an executive decision. I was just thrilled to have an amber monochrome display instead of green to go along with my cutting-edge Hercules VGA Graphics Card.

    My kids don't even know what a 160K 5-1/4" SSD floppy disk looks like. They don't believe me when I tell them that one disk would barely store just one of the hundreds of photos that they have on their phones, or that we actually had to load the operating system from floppies before the computer was even usable.
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    • Profile picture of the author lanfear63
      I learned to program in basic. Great fun!

      Went through a load of 8 bit/16 bit UK machines.

      8 bit

      Sinclair ZX 81
      Sinclair Spectrum
      Dragon 32
      Acorn Electron
      Sinclair QL, bought a twin 3.5 inch floppy drive for this to bypass the unreliable microdrives (100k endless loops of tape) and a serial printer and did Astrological profile printouts for cash in a small store I owned. First one that earned me money!

      16 bit

      Amiga 500 (Great 16 bit machine, had my first color 24 pin dot matrix printer with this) Attached it to a music keyboard and Yamaha synth and composed with it (16 track midi) using Octamed software. Sold 100 cassettes of my instrumental music.

      I enjoyed those machines!
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by SteveJohnson View Post

      My kids don't even know what a 160K 5-1/4" SSD floppy disk looks like. They don't believe me when I tell them that one disk would barely store just one of the hundreds of photos that they have on their phones, or that we actually had to load the operating system from floppies before the computer was even usable.
      Where do they think computers come from? I mean close to 99% of humanity would probably be dumbstruck, even if they had all the technology in 1980 to build a computer from scratch.

      PLEASE NOTE, I MEAN SCRATCH using standard devices like transistors, capacitors, etc.... NO ICs, and had to design it themselves.

      I read about Steve Wozniak's attempt to build a floppy disk interface! THAT was daunting! His goal was to have it done in time for the fast approaching christmas holiday. He got DESPERATE, and actually looked at an IBM controller to see how THEY did it. Surprisingly, he found he was doing too much, at least too much in hardware. He was probably trying to do hard sectored disks. MOST floppy systems at the time did soft sectored. While the hardware is simpler, the software is more complicated. And he had to do THAT ALSO!

      Computers are so relatively easy today because the CPUs are built almost in modules, and motherboard companies use so many ICs. Assemblers don't even have to wire the rear interface block as they used to, because on ATX and related form factor boards, it is on the BOARD!

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author ErinWalsh
    I remember those days! 5.75" floppy drives, programming in BASIC, the years before hard drives were invented and you were lucky to get a color monitor(instead of just a green screen).
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by ErinWalsh View Post

      I remember those days! 5.75" floppy drives, programming in BASIC, the years before hard drives were invented and you were lucky to get a color monitor(instead of just a green screen).
      The first commercial disk drive was apparently released in March 1973! Just saying! They used to be called winchester disk drives since the first one, made by IBM, came in paired units.

      The IBM 3340 Direct Access Storage Facility, code-named Winchester, was introduced in March 1973 for use with IBM System/370.[31] Its removable disk packs were sealed and included the head and arm assembly. There was no cover to remove during the insertion process. Access time was 25 millisecond and data transferred at 885 kB/s. Three versions of the removable IBM 3348 Data Module were sold, one with 35 megabyte capacity, another with 70 megabytes, the third also had 70 megabytes, but with 500 kilobytes under separate fixed heads for faster access. The 3340 also used error correction. It was withdrawn in 1984.

      The 3340 was developed in San Jose under the leadership of Ken Haughton. Early on the design was focused on two removable 30 megabyte modules. Because of this 30/30 configuration, the code name Winchester was selected after the famous Winchester .30-30 rifle;[32] subsequently the capacities were increased, but the code name stuck.

      The significance of this product, and the reason that disk drives in general became known as "Winchester technology" had nothing to do with the configuration of the product. This was IBM's first drive to not unload the heads from the media. The Winchester technology allowed the head to land and take off from the disk media as the disk spun up and down. This resulted in very significant savings and a large reduction of complexity of the head and arm actuating mechanism. This rapidly became a standard design within the disk manufacturing community.

      The name stuck in the USSR, Hungary and possibly other countries as an umbrella term for all hard drives; it is still in wide use today.
      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author ForumGuru
    Banned
    Anyone watching the new AMC series Halt and Catch Fire? I caught the first two episodes and I'm hooked.

    Wozniak himself hosted Halt and Catch Fire’s post-screening panel at SXSW and praised the show for both its accuracy and production values.

    “I give this show a 10 and that’s so rare for me,” he said.

    AMC's "Halt and Catch Fire" pilot brilliantly depicts the Wild West of the 1980s PC revolution - The Next Web
    If you have an interest in computers and/or the industry then this fictional story set in the early 80's may keep you entertained.

    Cheers!

    -don
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