Psychedelics: Let's Hear Your Views & Experiences!

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Ahhh psychedelics... the wonderful and mysterious chemicals which throw open the doors of perception... are being used for many healing purposes around the world... and are generally misunderstood within society due to fear mongering and negative propaganda.

Psychedelics are not anything like drugs of abuse like alcohol, heroin, meth, cigarettes, cocaine, etc... Psychedelics are actually being used to help break such abusive habits in addicts... and also as powerful tools to experience things on a completely new level.

What do you think of psychedelics? Have you even heard of psychedelics being used as medicine (such as ayahuasca)? What are your experience on psychedelics? Do you think the government doesn't want us to have them because they realize that powerful mind-expanding agents can be dangerous to the status quo if used on a mass level? Let's hear your thoughts...
#ayahuasca #drugs #life #medicine #psychedelics
  • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    Ah yes. LSD. Used to be my drug of choice during the hippie "revolution". About that time Timothy Leary was making some shocking discoveries about the drug - the info was confiscated and he was put in jail. LSD was illegalized. Sound familiar? Anyway - some of that info got out before the feds started trying to clean it out of public channels.

    The drug makes a link between the conscious and subconscious mind. While you are "tripping" your mind takes information and associates in in new ways - and files it with the new coding. While your "high" is advancing toward the "peak" your mind clears out massive amounts of information. At this point, subconscious material will surface and be experienced as if it were all really happening at the time - visual and aural hallucinations predominate, as well as unusual thoughts. Once the "peak" has been reached, super-learning is possible for a few hours, during which time the memory is enhanced. Later the person will find new applications for re-associated data.

    In college I led two study groups and we used it as a study tool. My groups were well known, and everyone in them raised their GPA by a substantial amount. We produced honor grads.

    Metaphysically, the drug was supposed to clean out and open the chakra's and the pineal gland. At one point it was said that the drug would cause birth defects, but I've never seen evidence for it. Everyone I know who took the drug but one person had healthy children.

    People taking the drug were advised to have people there that were used to it so they didn't start responding to ideas such as "I can fly" - which claimed a few lives, but the drug itself never has as far as I've ever heard.

    This is a drug I would not touch today - not because I am afraid of the effects. I've always found those to be positive other than eating a lot of vitamins etc out of your system that you need to replace. It's because I'm older and can't imagine being "high" for 8 to 12 hours anymore. Just too long for me to want to try to handle at my age.
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  • Profile picture of the author whateverpedia
    Wasn't LSD "invented" by the CIA as part of the MKUltra program?
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    • Profile picture of the author Joe Mobley
      Everything we do is for the purpose of altering consciousness. We form friendships so that we can feel certain emotions, like love, and avoid others, like loneliness. We eat specific foods to enjoy their fleeting presence on our tongues. We read for the pleasure of thinking another person's thoughts. Every waking moment--and even in our dreams--we struggle to direct the flow of sensation, emotion, and cognition toward states of consciousness that we value.
      (Note 6/4/2014: I have revised this 2011 essay and added an audio version.--SH)

      Drugs and the Meaning of Life : : Sam Harris

      Excellent.

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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by whateverpedia View Post

      Wasn't LSD "invented" by the CIA as part of the MKUltra program?
      Nope it was Albert Hoffman a Swiss scientist who discovered it back in the 40"s.
      By the way, MK Ultra is now a strain of Cannabis that is named after the CIA program and supposedly one of the strongest strains in the world (not that I would know ).

      I stopped taking LSD back when people started cutting it with everything and the kitchen sink.
      I still like mushrooms and Peyote, but haven't done either in quite a few years.
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  • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
    Originally Posted by mrozlat View Post

    What are your experience on psychedelics? Do you think the government doesn't want us to have them because they realize that powerful mind-expanding agents can be dangerous to the status quo if used on a mass level? Let's hear your thoughts...
    I think you are on to something. The government knows (but keeps it from us) that if we take psychedelic drugs, it will release our minds, unlock our Chakras, and release the power of our pineal glands.

    We would become a nation of superhumans that would threaten our government control.

    It's what sank Atlantis.

    LSD is good for you. It's like a vitamin. Nothing bad can come from seeing something that isn't there. There is no downside. Even when driving.

    And the people who post that they took it in their youth, show no signs of later effects.
    I heartily recommend it.

    Go team.
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

      I think you are on to something. The government knows (but keeps it from us) that if we take psychedelic drugs, it will release our minds, unlock our Chakras, and release the power of our pineal glands.

      We would become a nation of superhumans that would threaten our government control.

      It's what sank Atlantis.

      LSD is good for you. It's like a vitamin. Nothing bad can come from seeing something that isn't there. There is no downside. Even when driving.

      And the people who post that they took it in their youth, show no signs of later effects.
      I heartily recommend it.

      Go team.
      You may be on to something Claude.
      14 Famous Scientists and Inventors who Experimented with Drugs | Science Blog
      After all Bill Gates and Steve Jobs took LSD as did Richard Feynman.
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

        You may be on to something Claude.
        14 Famous Scientists and Inventors who Experimented with Drugs | Science Blog
        After all Bill Gates and Steve Jobs took LSD as did Richard Feynman.
        So did I. And most people have been drunk at one time or another. Lots of intelligent people have taken LSD, and are fine. And lots of famous people have tried a variety of drugs.

        I just don't think it's a brilliant thing to do. It's just an opinion.

        Have you ever spent 10 hours with someone who thinks that demons are trying to tear off their skin, because they were the wrong person to take LSD? Or someone sitting on the floor, in a corner in the living room, sweating bullets...because they are convinced that "they" are trying to come through the walls, and take them away? I have. It ain't all unicorns and rainbows.
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        • Profile picture of the author ThomM
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          So did I. And most people have been drunk at one time or another. Lots of intelligent people have taken LSD, and are fine. And lots of famous people have tried a variety of drugs.

          I just don't think it's a brilliant thing to do. It's just an opinion.

          Have you ever spent 10 hours with someone who thinks that demons are tearing off their skin, because they were the wrong person to take LSD? I have. It ain't all unicorns and rainbows.
          Nothing is.
          Have you ever watched someone drown because they where in water? I have. They where the wrong person to be in the water. Have you ever seen someone killed in a motorcycle accident? I have. He was the wrong person to be on a motorcycle. Yet millions of people swim and ride motorcycles with no ill effects. Same with LSD.
          So what's your point with the person who had a bad time on LSD?
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

            Nothing is.
            Have you ever watched someone drown because they where in water? I have. They where the wrong person to be in the water. Have you ever seen someone killed in a motorcycle accident? I have. He was the wrong person to be on a motorcycle. Yet millions of people swim and ride motorcycles with no ill effects. Same with LSD.
            So what's your point with the person who had a bad time on LSD?
            No point. Have at it.
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          • Profile picture of the author lanfear63
            Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

            Nothing is.
            Have you ever watched someone drown because they where in water? I have. They where the wrong person to be in the water. Have you ever seen someone killed in a motorcycle accident? I have. He was the wrong person to be on a motorcycle. Yet millions of people swim and ride motorcycles with no ill effects. Same with LSD.
            So what's your point with the person who had a bad time on LSD?
            Water plays a big part in the drowning process but never seen someone swim and ride a motorcycle?
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            • Profile picture of the author ThomM
              Originally Posted by lanfear63 View Post

              Water plays a big part in the drowning process but never seen someone swim and ride a motorcycle?
              I could tell you some stories about that
              I will say those I've seen try it have failed, no matter what drug they where doing.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dennis Gaskill
    Originally Posted by mrozlat View Post

    Ahhh psychedelics... the wonderful and mysterious chemicals which throw open the doors of perception...
    Ah yes, that sounds much more inviting than drug-induced psychosis, doesn't it?
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  • Profile picture of the author candoit2
    LSD long term use and effects include:
    • Tolerance, which causes a person to take more of the drug, which can lead to life-threatening overdoses
    • Acid flashbacks, or hallucinogen persisting perception disorder, an uncontrolled event where the person experiences the effects of LSD use again without taking the drug
    • Damage to vision
    • Lack of motivation
    • Mood swings
    • Loss of ability to communicate
    • Reduced ability to reason and think rationally
    • Delusions
    • Difficulty recognizing reality
    • Psychosis
    • Schizophrenia
    • Depression
    • Anxiety
    • Panic attacks
    • Suicidal thoughts and feelings
    Source:LSD Long Term Use and Effects - LSD Addiction
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by AaronJones View Post

      LSD long term use and effects include:
      • Tolerance, which causes a person to take more of the drug, which can lead to life-threatening overdoses
      • Acid flashbacks, or hallucinogen persisting perception disorder, an uncontrolled event where the person experiences the effects of LSD use again without taking the drug
      • Damage to vision
      • Lack of motivation
      • Mood swings
      • Loss of ability to communicate
      • Reduced ability to reason and think rationally
      • Delusions
      • Difficulty recognizing reality
      • Psychosis
      • Schizophrenia
      • Depression
      • Anxiety
      • Panic attacks
      • Suicidal thoughts and feelings
      Source:LSD Long Term Use and Effects - LSD Addiction
      Wow a site that is in the business of treating LSD addiction.
      Not just not bad, but maybe even good (beyond the individual's own decision that they did or didn't value the experience, something this sort of science can't really capture, but of vital importance):
      The researchers found that lifetime use of psilocybin or mescaline and past year use of LSD were associated with lower rates of serious psychological distress. Lifetime use of LSD was also significantly associated with a lower rate of outpatient mental health treatment and psychiatric medicine prescription....
      ....."recent clinical trials have also failed to find any evidence of any lasting harmful effects of psychedelics," the researchers said, which supports the robustness of thePLOS ONE findings.
      "Early speculation that psychedelics might lead to mental health problems was based on a small number of case reports and did not take into account either the widespread use of psychedelics or the not infrequent rate of mental health problems in the general population," Krebs explains.
      "Over the past 50 years tens of millions of people have used psychedelics and there just is not much evidence of long-term problems," she concludes.
      LSD, Other Psychedelics Don't Drive You Crazy, New Research Says - Hit & Run : Reason.com
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      • Profile picture of the author candoit2
        Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

        Wow a site that is in the business of treating LSD addiction.
        You say that like it discredits them as being experts on the subject. (which symptom is that logic?)

        Do you also take your advice on the effects of alcohol abuse on the brain from experts who treat patients or from an alcoholic patient who tells you all is fine?
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        • Profile picture of the author ThomM
          Originally Posted by AaronJones View Post

          You say that like it discredits them as being experts on the subject. (which symptom is that logic?)

          Do you also take your advice on the effects of alcohol abuse on the brain from experts who treat patients or from an alcoholic patient who tells you all is fine?
          Why do you assume they're experts?
          I also posted an article which pretty much disproves what they are saying based on actual non biased research.
          So to answer your question on which symptom is that logic, it's the symptom of doing actual research.
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          • Profile picture of the author candoit2
            Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

            Why do you assume they're experts?
            I also posted an article which pretty much disproves what they are saying based on actual non biased research.
            So to answer your question on which symptom is that logic, it's the symptom of doing actual research.
            Why do you assume they are not experts? Why do you assume the article you read was written by experts?
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            • Profile picture of the author ThomM
              Originally Posted by AaronJones View Post

              Why do you assume they are not experts? Why do you assume the article you read was written by experts?
              Why do you assume they are?
              Any article that sources the DEA is suspect. After all it's the DEA's job to keep drugs illegal so they don't loose their funding. Look at the DEA's "fact" sheet on LSD. All it is is statements with no research to back them up.
              In fact every link they use for a source are just statements without any references to any research or studies.
              Meanwhile here's the source from the article I posted.
              PLOS ONE: Psychedelics and Mental Health: A Population Study

              So let me ask you again why do you conceder your link as coming from experts when they don't have any research listed to back up what they say?
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    • Profile picture of the author Daniel Evans
      Originally Posted by AaronJones View Post

      LSD long term use and effects include:
      • Tolerance, which causes a person to take more of the drug, which can lead to life-threatening overdoses
      • Acid flashbacks, or hallucinogen persisting perception disorder, an uncontrolled event where the person experiences the effects of LSD use again without taking the drug
      • Damage to vision
      • Lack of motivation
      • Mood swings
      • Loss of ability to communicate
      • Reduced ability to reason and think rationally
      • Delusions
      • Difficulty recognizing reality
      • Psychosis
      • Schizophrenia
      • Depression
      • Anxiety
      • Panic attacks
      • Suicidal thoughts and feelings
      Source:LSD Long Term Use and Effects - LSD Addiction
      With respect, refering to the title of the thread, that's not your view nor your experience, rather a dictation that you've put yourself on the receiving end of.
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  • Profile picture of the author domainarama
    In the very early 1960s I worked for Dr Humphrey Osmond, the man who invented the word "psychedelic." He gave LSD to Aldous Huxley (which Huxley acknowledged in The Doors of Perception). I was supposed to meet Huxley and be given LSD with him, but Huxley died on Nov 22, 1963. Osmond gave LSD to many alcoholics and hospitalized schizophrenics (they were hospitalized then). Those experiments were failures. They led neither to cure nor improvements. Osmond was a pleasant fellow, in my experience.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    The DEA is a viable source? LMAO. Okay. Sure. Aren't they the ones that called pot deadly - even though not one person has ever died from it in the history of its use - I've not even seen an indirect death due to something like allergic reaction. But the DEA wanted YOU to think it's deadly. It's much more profitable for them if you are scared shytless of it.

    I have never seen one study ever that shows any of the symptoms you have listed, Aaron. Many of the "trippers" I knew well were GMI students (bizarre high IQs), U of M students, etc. All very high IQs and very motivated people.

    In my own experience - my IQ went up 20 points during my own LSD use. Coincidence? Everyone in my study groups raised their GPA by quite some margin. Another "coincidence". Every one of them graduated with high honors. Note - not everyone was allowed into the groups because some just didn't seem to be stable enough for us to trust being able to handle it. Had Leary's final works been available, we might have been able to figure out how to fix that. It was not. We had to run with what we knew.

    The issue of tolerance? That's because it burns vitamins and minerals out of your system (that's what it runs on). If you keep replenishing the elements that it burns, you don't get the "tolerance" effect. Also true of seeming "tolerance" is that once you get used to the effects, you are able to control them and function more normally during the high. You're still high - you just are more able to think around the chemical effects.

    Also true - people that seem to be addicted do a lot of other drugs as well. It's not the LSD that's addictive or causes a lot of the reactions you have listed. It's the other pure crap they take along with it. This is the same hype that is spewed about pot causing a bad memory. The only time that pot effects the memory is during the high, and, again, people that get used to the high aren't as effected as people that only get high once in awhile. Also - if they are smoking a strain known to be a relaxant, well, yeah, that's gonna slow em down a little - that's what that particular strain is supposed to freaking do. :rolleyes:

    Also true - some people can't tolerate the chemical and shouldn't play with it. Period. If someone has mental problems from the get, it's not going to do them any good -- that I know of anyhow. Someone more experienced in authoritative research on the chemical may be able to cite me wrong on that one.

    For those who have never taken the chemical, there's really not much anyone can do to relate what goes on when you do it. It's a whole different perception and brain function going on from usual. Parts of your subconscious are actually brought into conscious and play at the same time the conscious reality is. I've only met a few people that ever had the problem of not knowing what was hallucination and what was real while stoned. Those are people that shouldn't have been taking chemicals of any kind in the first place, let alone hallucinogenics. Then again, sometimes those kind of experiences were caused by unethical dealers who would lace the chemical with poisons (such as strychnine) to mask dilution of the actual chemical - to make more money.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    What's with the "thanks" buttons? Thom - I thanked you twice and it's not showing. Not sure what's up with that - but anyhow, you made some really good points.
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      What's with the "thanks" buttons? Thom - I thanked you twice and it's not showing. Not sure what's up with that - but anyhow, you made some really good points.
      I guess the button doesn't like one of us Sal.
      I remember eating or drinking something to replenish the vits. and such when I did LSD.
      As far as hallucinating I remember some wild ones. The thing about them was when happening everyone would be saying "wow good acid". In other words we all knew they where just hallucinations from the acid.
      Only twice did I have a bad trip and both times they where caused by the massive amounts of speed I was doing at the time. But both times I knew they where bad trips and not reality (so to speak). For a while I worked as an assistant for a friend who painted motorcycles. We where both tripping when we worked and some of his paint jobs won awards at bike shows. Over a period of about 2 years there was very little that I did that I wasn't on LSD for. I don't know if it effected my IQ or not. I do know I've never tested below 135 since I was a teenager.
      But yeah some people shouldn't take LSD or smoke cannabis or do any type of mind altering substance. But then you can't alter what you don't have
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Well, I think the important thing here...is that this thread has proven that there are no long term effects from doing LSD.
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        • Profile picture of the author ThomM
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          Well, I think the important thing here...is that this thread has proven that there are no long term effects from doing LSD.
          Yep the study I posted pretty much said that.
          The classical serotonergic psychedelics LSD, psilocybin, mescaline are not known to cause brain damage and are regarded as non-addictive. Clinical studies do not suggest that psychedelics cause long-term mental health problems. Psychedelics have been used in the Americas for thousands of years. Over 30 million people currently living in the US have used LSD, psilocybin, or mescaline.
          Being someone who claims to believe in science I can understand why you agree.
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          • Profile picture of the author ThomM
            Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

            "You can't alter what you don't have."

            LMAO! Ho, that's one for the quote thread.

            My mom wanted to try pot before she died. I didn't think it was a good idea because the laughing gas at the dentists made her feel anguished and violent. Now I wish she had. Might have kept her heart from exploding. What the doctors were doing to her sure didn't.

            I had one bad experience "tripping". I was kinda sick and shouldn't have been messing with it. Like you said, though - it didn't make me think that reality was altered in any way. Just really didn't feel good and was having a hard time going to sleep to wear it off.

            I took an IQ test while in the prime hour just before the peak and only tested at 115. LOL. The next day I took another and was back to normal. So yeah, it affects you while you are high - but then you've seen me before and after a few hits on a doob, too. Thank god it's not permanent, huh? I'm sure there are people here that think I spend my life tokin'. They'd be surprised how infrequently I do, and how strongly it effects me, I think. Being one of the healthier people I know in my age bracket, though, I absolutely can't take any seriousness in some of the ideas people have been indoctrinated to believe about the stuff.

            Having experience in experimenting, though, I can say with certainty that there are substances out there that people shouldn't be putting in their bodies whether they are legally prescribed to them or not. The medical industrial complex really did a lot of damage to me. There are extremely few drugs out - legal or not - that I will have anything to do with, and a few so dangerous and destructive, I won't have anything to do with people who are taking them.
            I've never taken an IQ test while on acid, I don't imagine I'd do well. The whole idea of it is funny to me and I'd probably screw it up on purpose. I have taken numerous IQ and other physiological tests after smoking Cannabis though. I always scored higher on the IQ tests then I did when straight. All the physiological tests showed was that I'm not very social, well actually anti-social. I didn't need any tests to tell me that
            I've had bigger problems from a few prescribed medications I've done than any illegal drug I've done, except for meth.
            I've never worried about long term effects of anything I've done in the past, except meth. Meth is the most dangerous drug you can get including pharmaceuticals.
            I've heard many horror stories about meth and none of them have come close to what it truly does to a person.
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            • Profile picture of the author HeySal
              Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

              I've never taken an IQ test while on acid, I don't imagine I'd do well. The whole idea of it is funny to me and I'd probably screw it up on purpose. I have taken numerous IQ and other physiological tests after smoking Cannabis though. I always scored higher on the IQ tests then I did when straight. All the physiological tests showed was that I'm not very social, well actually anti-social. I didn't need any tests to tell me that
              I've had bigger problems from a few prescribed medications I've done than any illegal drug I've done, except for meth.
              I've never worried about long term effects of anything I've done in the past, except meth. Meth is the most dangerous drug you can get including pharmaceuticals.
              I've heard many horror stories about meth and none of them have come close to what it truly does to a person.
              I can't imagine taking an IQ test after smoking. Might be an easy way to get living funds for being disabled, huh?

              Meth is definitely one drug that I meant when I said I didn't want to be around people who are doing it. I can't imagine how those people find anything beneficial or even fun in that drug. How often can they look in a mirror and not be able to actually see that major damage is being done? That's without even stopping to think about the paranoia and psychosis it creates.

              I once saw someone on that stuff freak out at the front door of a store over all the birds flying out of the doors and why did the rest of us seem to think that was normal -- it was all a conspiracy against him. People were trying to calm him down and he had started swinging at them by the time the police got there and hauled him off.

              The corker in that one is that meth isn't supposed to be a hallucinogenic - but this guy was hallucinating very strongly, and not able to tell the hallucinations were not real. To me that's pretty scary crap. Even scarier is that some of them don't normalize completely after the effects of the drug wear off.
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              • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
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                Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

                Even scarier is that some of them don't normalize completely after the effects of the drug wear off.
                Many don't normalize after the effects of the drug wear off. Meth is one drug I never touched except by "accident" when someone told me what they gave me was something else. It made me quite ill.

                But I've seen some long term users ... this one poor guy in San Francisco. I was visiting a house and he showed up at the door. The guy let him in. He stood there trembling and he was in an excited state and couldn't control his body movements ... in that, his arms were all over the place, he swayed and he talked gibberish. The owner of the house patted him on the back and agreed with him and said some things to calm him down. When the meth guy left, I asked the home owner what that was all about. He said oh, that's just so and so (forget the name). He did a lot of Meth and never came down. Been like that for years. He wasn't the only one like that I met. There were lots of them in that area. That drug kills your soul long before it kills your body.
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                • Profile picture of the author ThomM
                  Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

                  Many don't normalize after the effects of the drug wear off. Meth is one drug I never touched except by "accident" when someone told me what they gave me was something else. It made me quite ill.

                  But I've seen some long term users ... this one poor guy in San Francisco. I was visiting a house and he showed up at the door. The guy let him in. He stood there trembling and he was in an excited state and couldn't control his body movements ... in that, his arms were all over the place, he swayed and he talked gibberish. The owner of the house patted him on the back and agreed with him and said some things to calm him down. When the meth guy left, I asked the home owner what that was all about. He said oh, that's just so and so (forget the name). He did a lot of Meth and never came down. Been like that for years. He wasn't the only one like that I met. There were lots of them in that area. That drug kills your soul long before it kills your body.
                  I seem to have run out of thanks.

                  I've always been thankful I stopped when I did and pretty much returned to "normal" (whatever that is).
                  Hearing voices all the time, seeing something moving just out of the corner of your eye. Having to leave a room with people in it because they are thinking so loud and their thoughts are plotting against you. Knowing you are being followed all the time and every stranger you see is a potential threat.
                  Speed burns (black scabs) all over your body. Shaking so bad you can't hold a coffee cup without spilling it. Trying to talk and having the words come out so fast your sentence is jumbled and mumbled. Going to bed after being up for 3 or 4 (or more) days and getting leg cramps so bad that you fly out of the bed and squirm on the floor in agony.
                  Not a good or fun drug by any definition.
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                  • Profile picture of the author ThomM
                    Originally Posted by Jack Gordon View Post

                    I have never touched the stuff, so cannot share any personal experience.

                    However... I remember reading years ago what Carl Sagan thought about them. I believe it was in his book Broca's Brain, but I could be wrong about that.

                    He recounted the common experience that users report extraordinary sensory expansion.

                    His hypothesis (and that is all it was), was that hallucinogenics actually cause a mental contraction, and that the experiences reported are a result of senses reinterpreting your surroundings with their new, lower capacity.

                    I prefer to keep both feet grounded in reality.
                    You do know Carl Sagan was a Cannabis smoker.
                    I'm not saying his hypothesis isn't a valid one.
                    He could very well have thought of it while he was high.
                    Carl Sagan's essay on cannabis - News - Azarius
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                    • Profile picture of the author Jack Gordon
                      Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

                      You do know Carl Sagan was a Cannabis smoker.
                      I'm not saying his hypothesis isn't a valid one.
                      He could very well have thought of it while he was high.
                      Carl Sagan's essay on cannabis - News - Azarius
                      You know, I may have been aware of that at one point, but it had completely escaped me.

                      My brother is going to die very soon from a horrible form of cancer. I have never had an inherent problem with cannabis, but through this process I have gained a strong appreciation for all it has to offer.

                      I say this not as a user of it (I am not), but as an educated person who has been exposed to the science and the experiences of those who draw great comfort from it.
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                      • Profile picture of the author ThomM
                        Originally Posted by Jack Gordon View Post

                        You know, I may have been aware of that at one point, but it had completely escaped me.

                        My brother is going to die very soon from a horrible form of cancer. I have never had an inherent problem with cannabis, but through this process I have gained a strong appreciation for all it has to offer.

                        I say this not as a user of it (I am not), but as an educated person who has been exposed to the science and the experiences of those who draw great comfort from it.
                        I'm very sorry to hear about your brother. My wife died from cancer 12 years ago. All I can say is I understand what you both are going through.
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              • Profile picture of the author ThomM
                Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

                I can't imagine taking an IQ test after smoking. Might be an easy way to get living funds for being disabled, huh?

                Meth is definitely one drug that I meant when I said I didn't want to be around people who are doing it. I can't imagine how those people find anything beneficial or even fun in that drug. How often can they look in a mirror and not be able to actually see that major damage is being done? That's without even stopping to think about the paranoia and psychosis it creates.

                I once saw someone on that stuff freak out at the front door of a store over all the birds flying out of the doors and why did the rest of us seem to think that was normal -- it was all a conspiracy against him. People were trying to calm him down and he had started swinging at them by the time the police got there and hauled him off.

                The corker in that one is that meth isn't supposed to be a hallucinogenic - but this guy was hallucinating very strongly, and not able to tell the hallucinations were not real. To me that's pretty scary crap. Even scarier is that some of them don't normalize completely after the effects of the drug wear off.
                Yeah that's bull. The only way you could say it's not a hallucinogenic is because what you see and what you hear is real. I've wondered for years how or if I would be different today if I never did meth. The only mental problems that I'm aware of are ones I've been dealing with since I was a kid. Both only crop up occasionally and both I can control with homeopathic or natural remedies and understanding what's going on.
                Except for certain benefits of a life long affair with Cannabis I can't say I've experienced any long term effects of any drug I've done, good or bad. Except for meth When your speeding like that your heart is going incredibly fast. I've never done the math, but I'd say I trimed at least 6 years off my life because of that.
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          • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
            Banned
            Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

            Quote:
            The classical serotonergic psychedelics LSD, psilocybin, mescaline are not known to cause brain damage and are regarded as non-addictive. Clinical studies do not suggest that psychedelics cause long-term mental health problems. Psychedelics have been used in the Americas for thousands of years. Over 30 million people currently living in the US have used LSD, psilocybin, or mescaline.
            Yep the study I posted pretty much said that.
            Being someone who claims to believe in science I can understand why you agree.
            I'm an expert on the topic of LSD and addiction and long term effects of psychedelics. If a substance is in the least bit addictive and I've used it, I was addicted to it (and that's not meant to be facetitious... it's just the truth). I used LSD a fair amount and never was addicted or even close. I did not build up a tolerance to the drug nor have I ever seen anyone build up a tolerance to LSD (meaning by tolerance, that it subsequently took more and more LSD to achieve the same high).

            As for long term effects, I would say there are none (although some acquaintances and former spouses and such would dispute that, but they are not impartial).

            So, AaronJones, your source is incorrect. The above study is correct.
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        • Profile picture of the author lanfear63
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          Well, I think the important thing here...is that this thread has proven that there are no long term effects from doing LSD.
          "Wibble, bark, my old mans a mushroom"
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    "You can't alter what you don't have."

    LMAO! Ho, that's one for the quote thread.

    My mom wanted to try pot before she died. I didn't think it was a good idea because the laughing gas at the dentists made her feel anguished and violent. Now I wish she had. Might have kept her heart from exploding. What the doctors were doing to her sure didn't.

    I had one bad experience "tripping". I was kinda sick and shouldn't have been messing with it. Like you said, though - it didn't make me think that reality was altered in any way. Just really didn't feel good and was having a hard time going to sleep to wear it off.

    I took an IQ test while in the prime hour just before the peak and only tested at 115. LOL. The next day I took another and was back to normal. So yeah, it affects you while you are high - but then you've seen me before and after a few hits on a doob, too. Thank god it's not permanent, huh? I'm sure there are people here that think I spend my life tokin'. They'd be surprised how infrequently I do, and how strongly it effects me, I think. Being one of the healthier people I know in my age bracket, though, I absolutely can't take any seriousness in some of the ideas people have been indoctrinated to believe about the stuff.

    Having experience in experimenting, though, I can say with certainty that there are substances out there that people shouldn't be putting in their bodies whether they are legally prescribed to them or not. The medical industrial complex really did a lot of damage to me. There are extremely few drugs out - legal or not - that I will have anything to do with, and a few so dangerous and destructive, I won't have anything to do with people who are taking them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jack Gordon
    I have never touched the stuff, so cannot share any personal experience.

    However... I remember reading years ago what Carl Sagan thought about them. I believe it was in his book Broca's Brain, but I could be wrong about that.

    He recounted the common experience that users report extraordinary sensory expansion.

    His hypothesis (and that is all it was), was that hallucinogenics actually cause a mental contraction, and that the experiences reported are a result of senses reinterpreting your surroundings with their new, lower capacity.

    I prefer to keep both feet grounded in reality.
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Jack Gordon View Post

      I prefer to keep both feet grounded in reality.
      ... and there's nothing wrong with that at all. I quit both alcohol and drugs over 20 years ago. It was either that or die. Some people can drink socially. I can't. Some people can just smoke pot. I can't. I want more. That's the nature of addiction. For me it's all or none, so I've chosen none.
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by Jack Gordon View Post

      I have never touched the stuff, so cannot share any personal experience.

      However... I remember reading years ago what Carl Sagan thought about them. I believe it was in his book Broca's Brain, but I could be wrong about that.

      He recounted the common experience that users report extraordinary sensory expansion.

      His hypothesis (and that is all it was), was that hallucinogenics actually cause a mental contraction, and that the experiences reported are a result of senses reinterpreting your surroundings with their new, lower capacity.

      I prefer to keep both feet grounded in reality.
      You do know Carl Sagan was a Cannabis smoker.
      I'm not saying his hypothesis isn't a valid one.
      He could very well have thought of it while he was high.
      Carl Sagan's essay on cannabis - News - Azarius
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    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      Originally Posted by Jack Gordon View Post

      I have never touched the stuff, so cannot share any personal experience.

      However... I remember reading years ago what Carl Sagan thought about them. I believe it was in his book Broca's Brain, but I could be wrong about that.

      He recounted the common experience that users report extraordinary sensory expansion.

      His hypothesis (and that is all it was), was that hallucinogenics actually cause a mental contraction, and that the experiences reported are a result of senses reinterpreting your surroundings with their new, lower capacity.

      I prefer to keep both feet grounded in reality.
      I don't get that one ( the mental contraction).

      During the "high", senses are actually more acute (albeit somewhat distorted). Imagine you are sitting about 150 feet off a main highway. You are talking to someone and not really noticing the traffic. You aren't going to hear it that much - or at least notice hearing it because your attention is on the conversation. Yet if you stop to listen to the traffic, it will sound much louder. That's all that is happening is because of the physical feel of the sensory data coming in, you are paying more attention to it. That and the fact there is a physical feel to the sensory data, it just seems more pronounced.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    My roomie's daugher is in rehab for it right now. She got popped driving high and her license got revoked - then she got pregnant, and they found meth in her blood while pregnant so child services were called in. She didn't stop doing it, so CS took her baby when it was born. It's in a foster home and she was allowed visits. Then she got popped for driving without a license and wound up in court. The court put her in rehab for, I think 30 days. While she was in rehab she had a court date to make so was supposed to come over here, a friend would pick her up, take her to court, then she'd spend the night and get a ride back to rehab.

    Her car had been brought over here and parked for the time she's in rehab. So I wake up and the car I parked behind is not there. She and "friend" had gotten in my vehicle, pushed it out of the way - drove hers out, then pushed mine back in the drive. She proceeded, after all these issues she's having, to drive her car in a small town where the cops now know her. She came back at about 1:30 AM and was high as a kite.

    Mommy tried to convince me that the story they moved a lot of huge rocks out of the way to back out of the drive - and I had 2 words for her "tire tracks".

    I railed the girl and told her if I saw her in my car without my permission - for ANY reason, she was toast, I'd have her drug tested right then and there. She tried to lie out of it, then finally called me a bitch. I just told her that she better start realizing exactly how much of a bitch I can be - and please give the lighter and mascara that she took with her back to me.

    Anyhow - mommy thinks rehab is doing wonders for her. As far as I can tell (and I did do crisis counseling at one time although I'm not a shrink, so could be wrong), that little chick is history. If she's risking what she is now, after 3 weeks of rehab, I don't think she's rehabable at all.
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      Anyhow - mommy thinks rehab is doing wonders for her. As far as I can tell (and I did do crisis counseling at one time although I'm not a shrink, so could be wrong), that little chick is history. If she's risking what she is now, after 3 weeks of rehab, I don't think she's rehabable at all.
      Sal ... 3 week rehab is nothing. Most addicts do have a bottom and she obviously hasn't reached hers yet. Some never do, but 3 weeks in rehab is not enough. I was in outpatient counseling for over a year. At 3 weeks, your skin is still crawling from withdrawals. I've seen some amazing recoveries and it would take a lot more before I would call someone not "rehabbable."
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      • Profile picture of the author ThomM
        Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

        Sal ... 3 week rehab is nothing. Most addicts do have a bottom and she obviously hasn't reached hers yet. Some never do, but 3 weeks in rehab is not enough. I was in outpatient counseling for over a year. At 3 weeks, your skin is still crawling from withdrawals. I've seen some amazing recoveries and it would take a lot more before I would call someone not "rehabbable."
        I was an extreme exception to the norm.
        I was a very heavy addict, in fact the other meth addicts I knew did less then a 10th of what I did daily.
        The day I quit I shot up my usual amount and there was no rush or high. There was a voice from right next to me that said very plainly "if you do that again you will die". I didn't have any real withdrawal symptoms to speak of. To this day the closest I've come to doing speed is drinking Cuban coffee.
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        • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
          Banned
          Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

          I was an extreme exception to the norm.
          I was a very heavy addict, in fact the other meth addicts I knew did less then a 10th of what I did daily.
          The day I quit I shot up my usual amount and there was no rush or high. There was a voice from right next to me that said very plainly "if you do that again you will die". I didn't have any real withdrawal symptoms to speak of. To this day the closest I've come to doing speed is drinking Cuban coffee.
          ... and that would be my definition of amazing recoveries. I've seen so many flounder several times before quitting and I've seen some die trying, but I've seen many people that others have given up on a long time before, quit and never go back and go on to have wonderful lives.

          Funny thing ... I was like you ... a hard case. When I entered the outpatient rehab program, my counselor and another patient bet against me making it. They didn't tell me for a long time, but they lost their bet.
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          • Profile picture of the author ThomM
            Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

            ... and that would be my definition of amazing recoveries. I've seen so many flounder several times before quitting and I've seen some die trying, but I've seen many people that others have given up on a long time before, quit and never go back and go on to have wonderful lives.

            Funny thing ... I was like you ... a hard case. When I entered the outpatient rehab program, my counselor and another patient bet against me making it. They didn't tell me for a long time, but they lost their bet.
            I WANT MY THANKS BUTTON BACK
            I know some friends of mine that lost money on me living to 21,lol.
            Everyone I knew that did meth either died or quit. Going by what they went thorough I knew I was the rare lucky one.
            I've got that addictive personality thing going on myself.
            I usually don't have a problem quitting the addiction, even if it is just before it's to late. The exception being nicotine of course
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            • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
              Banned
              Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

              I WANT MY THANKS BUTTON BACK
              I know some friends of mine that lost money on me living to 21,lol.
              Everyone I knew that did meth either died or quit. Going by what they went thorough I knew I was the rare lucky one.
              I've got that addictive personality thing going on myself.
              I usually don't have a problem quitting the addiction, even if it is just before it's to late. The exception being nicotine of course
              You are definitely one of the rare ones. Meth is not easy to quit by all accounts. Neither was my drug of choice. You still trying with the electronic cigarettes on the nicotine habit?
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              • Profile picture of the author ThomM
                Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

                You are definitely one of the rare ones. Meth is not easy to quit by all accounts. Neither was my drug of choice. You still trying with the electronic cigarettes on the nicotine habit?
                Yep in fact I'm hitting the e-cig as I type this. I haven't totally quit the real cigs but I'm still smoking less then half of what I did before.
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  • Profile picture of the author stevebent
    They're illegal for a reason....... side affects can cause an actual awakening, and you'll realize who and what is really in control
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  • Profile picture of the author Jack Gordon
    My above-mentioned brother managed to kick a decade+ long heroin addiction (through rehab) in the 1990's. He transitioned to methadone, then kicked that after a couple of decades. He began to take care of himself, eat healthy, and repair all of the relationships left in his wake over the decades of drug abuse. He was in the best place of his life right before the cancer struck.

    I never cease to be amazed at his accomplishment, and devastated by the ironies of his life.
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Jack Gordon View Post

      My above-mentioned brother managed to kick a decade+ long heroin addiction (through rehab) in the 1990's. He transitioned to methadone, then kicked that after a couple of decades. He began to take care of himself, eat healthy, and repair all of the relationships left in his wake over the decades of drug abuse. He was in the best place of his life right before the cancer struck.

      I never cease to be amazed at his accomplishment, and devastated by the ironies of his life.
      It is irony and I'm very sorry to hear it. It's the same kind of irony as Sam Kinison quitting drugs and alcohol and then getting killed, right after getting married, by a drunk driver. I lost my mother to cancer and I still miss her.

      Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

      Yep in fact I'm hitting the e-cig as I type this. I haven't totally quit the real cigs but I'm still smoking less then half of what I did before.
      lol. So am I. Glad to hear it. Like you, I occasionally have an excuse for a real cigarette ... like I'm going to be in town and don't want to haul out the ecig that looks like drug paraphernalia, but most of the time, I'm smoking vapor.
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    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      Originally Posted by Jack Gordon View Post

      My above-mentioned brother managed to kick a decade+ long heroin addiction (through rehab) in the 1990's. He transitioned to methadone, then kicked that after a couple of decades. He began to take care of himself, eat healthy, and repair all of the relationships left in his wake over the decades of drug abuse. He was in the best place of his life right before the cancer struck.

      I never cease to be amazed at his accomplishment, and devastated by the ironies of his life.
      I'm so sorry to hear this. Has he tried cannabis oil at all?
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      • Profile picture of the author Jack Gordon
        Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

        I'm so sorry to hear this. Has he tried cannabis oil at all?
        Unfortunately, Sal, he put all of his faith into it, to the point where he pushed off chemo until he knew if it was working.

        Sad to say, it was a catastrophic choice for him. He was really hoping to be the miracle case, the poster child for cannabis oil curing cancer. Instead, if it is possible, it just became even more aggressive.

        The worst part is he ran out the clock waiting for his miracle, and by the time he could start chemo, there wasn't much point.

        If faith and optimism were enough to push cannabis oil over the edge for him, he would be healthy today.

        I reserve judgement on it as a cancer treatment, but stand by it an essential tool to bring comfort to those who are suffering.
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        • Profile picture of the author HeySal
          Originally Posted by Jack Gordon View Post

          Unfortunately, Sal, he put all of his faith into it, to the point where he pushed off chemo until he knew if it was working.

          Sad to say, it was a catastrophic choice for him. He was really hoping to be the miracle case, the poster child for cannabis oil curing cancer. Instead, if it is possible, it just became even more aggressive.

          The worst part is he ran out the clock waiting for his miracle, and by the time he could start chemo, there wasn't much point.

          If faith and optimism were enough to push cannabis oil over the edge for him, he would be healthy today.

          I reserve judgement on it as a cancer treatment, but stand by it an essential tool to bring comfort to those who are suffering.
          Once it hits the brain it's a real toss of the dice what's going to work or not. If it started there, it most likely wouldn't have mattered what he did. The brain is a lot touchier than the rest of the body. Chemo doesn't often come through for brain cancer either. Once it's in your brain- you're tossing the dice no matter what you do or don't.

          Strength and fortune to him, you, and your family.
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    • Profile picture of the author mrozlat
      Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

      You may be on to something Claude.
      14 Famous Scientists and Inventors who Experimented with Drugs | Science Blog
      After all Bill Gates and Steve Jobs took LSD as did Richard Feynman.
      just to add to that list here are some more: Famous Trippers « Reset.me Reset.me (some overlaps)

      Originally Posted by domainarama View Post

      In the very early 1960s I worked for Dr Humphrey Osmond, the man who invented the word "psychedelic." He gave LSD to Aldous Huxley (which Huxley acknowledged in The Doors of Perception). I was supposed to meet Huxley and be given LSD with him, but Huxley died on Nov 22, 1963. Osmond gave LSD to many alcoholics and hospitalized schizophrenics (they were hospitalized then). Those experiments were failures. They led neither to cure nor improvements. Osmond was a pleasant fellow, in my experience.
      the co-founder of Alcoholics Anonymous (AA) believed LSD could be used to cure alcoholics and credited the drug with helping his own recovery from often debilitating depression: LSD could help alcoholics stop drinking, AA founder believed | Science | The Guardian

      Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

      Many don't normalize after the effects of the drug wear off. Meth is one drug I never touched except by "accident" when someone told me what they gave me was something else. It made me quite ill.

      But I've seen some long term users ... this one poor guy in San Francisco. I was visiting a house and he showed up at the door. The guy let him in. He stood there trembling and he was in an excited state and couldn't control his body movements ... in that, his arms were all over the place, he swayed and he talked gibberish. The owner of the house patted him on the back and agreed with him and said some things to calm him down. When the meth guy left, I asked the home owner what that was all about. He said oh, that's just so and so (forget the name). He did a lot of Meth and never came down. Been like that for years. He wasn't the only one like that I met. There were lots of them in that area. That drug kills your soul long before it kills your body.
      interesting you mention that as Iboga may be able to normalise people in that sense:


      if you know of anyone struggling with drug addiction i'd probably take a look into ibogaine treatment (its a psychedelic) as it seems to work for many people... just youtube the testimonials and heaps of people dropping all sorts of addictions from alcohol and cigarettes to heroin and meth

      Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

      Yep in fact I'm hitting the e-cig as I type this. I haven't totally quit the real cigs but I'm still smoking less then half of what I did before.
      heard you may as well smoke the real thing
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  • Profile picture of the author alistair
    I haven't really got any real views on psychedelics. My experiences tripping though have been what I would describe as weird, funny, amazing, but most of all vivid.
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by mrozlat View Post

      the problem is that cannabis is just one part of the solution... it works and there are many studies (for example:xxxxxxxxxxxxx - xxxxxxxxx and success stories stating just that... the people that usually get through and cure their cancer and see success also change their diet... use one or more proven protocols (for example: Dosage for the type of cancer they have... etc... etc... it's combination of things... IMO the more holistic approach then the better success rate... as a society we shouldn't have to be dealing with cancer although our "progress" has led us to where we are today... such a crying shame

      you may enjoy this video which explains more:
      This thread is nothing more than self promotion of your site. Did you actually think no one noticed that you dropped your link in your very first post. Hover over it and see what it says now. This is a link to your own site, which is not allowed on WF.
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      • Profile picture of the author Khemosabi
        Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

        This thread is nothing more than self promotion of your site. Did you actually think no one noticed that you dropped your link in your very first post. Hover over it and see what it says now. This is a link to your own site, which is not allowed on WF.
        Well Suzanne, when he brought up EVERY thread on marijuana the other day with all of his links in them and they were deleted, he simply found another way around it.

        Link dropping in the OT forum... hilarious.

        ~ Theresa
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        • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Khemosabi View Post

          Well Suzanne, when he brought up EVERY thread on marijuana the other day with all of his links in them and they were deleted, he simply found another way around it.

          Link dropping in the OT forum... hilarious.

          ~ Theresa
          Yeah ... that didn't go unnoticed either. Typical link spammer, and it's not even really his site he's promoting. He's just an affiliate of iherb, so it's all just affiliate promotions.
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  • Profile picture of the author Khemosabi
    I have never tried psychedelics and until this thread, I had no idea that they were actually beneficial to some.

    Thank you all for sharing your experiences! <-- in case you can't see it, there is actually a smiley there!

    ~ Theresa
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Khemosabi View Post

      I have never tried psychedelics and until this thread, I had no idea that they were actually beneficial to some.

      Thank you all for sharing your experiences! <-- in case you can't see it, there is actually a smiley there!

      ~ Theresa
      There is a degree of self-enlightenment that occurs for some, but as with most drugs, there are people who will absolutely become paranoid and have a very bad experience. I thought it was enlightening for the first few times and then not so much fun after that.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by Khemosabi View Post

      I have never tried psychedelics and until this thread, I had no idea that they were actually beneficial to some.

      Thank you all for sharing your experiences! <-- in case you can't see it, there is actually a smiley there!

      ~ Theresa
      I had a salesman, years ago...that wouldn't go on an appointment without doing a line or two of cocaine first. He was convinced that it made him smarter, and more personable. It didn't. It made him talk faster, and be oblivious to what the other person was saying. But he still made sales, occasionally, and credited the cocaine.

      But I know it made him more energetic. Maybe cocaine is good for you too.


      Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

      There is a degree of self-enlightenment that occurs for some, but as with most drugs, there are people who will absolutely become paranoid and have a very bad experience. I thought it was enlightening for the first few times and then not so much fun after that.
      Suzanne...it's rare indeed that I find myself not agreeing with everything you say. A few thoughts I had...

      Can LSD make you more aware of how you see the world? I think so. So can a near death experience. So can fighting someone (I mean real fighting, where the object is to down the other person). So can being frightened to death. So can a huge personal loss. These experiences tell you more about yourself.

      I'm guessing that being in combat has much the same effect. You become hyper aware of everything around you. Again, a guess.

      I never tried LSD myself, although I used so many hallucinogenic drugs, as a young man, that maybe I did. I came to the conclusion that they were not making me high...they were making me sick. And the high feeling was just a side effect.

      For example, when I returned to normal, I never felt refreshed. I always felt ill. I can't believe it took over a decade to realize that this meant what I was doing was poisoning my system. The brain produces some amazing effects, when it isn't working properly.

      A question for the people who have used LSD; How did you feel after the effects wore off? Better? Refreshed? Energized? If you did, then that is evidence that LSD has beneficial effects.

      But, if you felt drained, weak, or had a headache...that means that the drug is harming you.

      Again, I've never done LSD (not knowingly, anyway). But I've inhaled and swallowed hallucinogenic drugs. So I have no direct knowledge of the after effects of LSD. (Except by observing two others. Not pretty. But two isn't statistically significant)

      And I believe (but am not certain) that I would be sharper today, if that whole experience never happened.

      On the other hand, I don't remember a bad experience, at all... the few times I smoked marijuana.
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      • Profile picture of the author ThomM
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        I had a salesman, years ago...that wouldn't go on an appointment without doing a line or two of cocaine first. He was convinced that it made him smarter, and more personable. It didn't. It made him talk faster, and be oblivious to what the other person was saying. But he still made sales, occasionally, and credited the cocaine.

        But I know it made him more energetic. Maybe cocaine is good for you too.
        Bill Cosby made the best comment ever about coke.
        He said he was at a party and someone asked him if he wanted to do some coke. He asked what it did to you.
        The guy said "it heightens your personality".
        Bill said "What if you're an asshole?"
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        • Profile picture of the author AprilCT
          I had a best friend that used drugs. She has passed away now, far too young. It would not surprise me if that was what finally caused her death far too young.

          A former co-worker's only child died at 22. She was divorced at the time and her son, an only child, decided to host a party at their home while she was on vacation. Her vacation was cut short to come home and bury him due to an overdose.

          Another friend's daughter was found in the nick of time slumped over in her car--she got medical attention that saved her life. Just a little longer in her car by herself and she would have also been dead. In and out of jail and rehab programs and now my friend is raising her child since shortly after he was born.

          And so on. What happens to people due to drug use is just heartbreaking.
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          • Profile picture of the author Daniel Evans
            Originally Posted by AprilCT View Post

            What happens to people due to drug use is just heartbreaking.

            Another friend's daughter was found in the nick of time slumped over in her car--she got medical attention that saved her life.
            ...in a drugless hospital?
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          • Profile picture of the author ThomM
            Originally Posted by AprilCT View Post

            I had a best friend that used drugs. She has passed away now, far too young. It would not surprise me if that was what finally caused her death far too young.

            A former co-worker's only child died at 22. She was divorced at the time and her son, an only child, decided to host a party at their home while she was on vacation. Her vacation was cut short to come home and bury him due to an overdose.

            Another friend's daughter was found in the nick of time slumped over in her car--she got medical attention that saved her life. Just a little longer in her car by herself and she would have also been dead. In and out of jail and rehab programs and now my friend is raising her child since shortly after he was born.

            And so on. What happens to people due to drug use is just heartbreaking.
            April you do understand that also goes for prescription or so called legal drugs also.
            In fact notice here that there are twice the number of deaths from pharmaceutical or legal drugs then there are from illegal drugs.
            http://www.drugwarfacts.org/cms/Caus....yzJsNukA.dpbs
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        • Profile picture of the author ThomM
          A question for the people who have used LSD; How did you feel after the effects wore off? Better? Refreshed? Energized? If you did, then that is evidence that LSD has beneficial effects.

          But, if you felt drained, weak, or had a headache...that means that the drug is harming you.
          That's a little flawed logic there Claude.
          How do you feel after jogging?
          Usually drained, weak, and possibly having a headache.
          How do you feel after surgery?
          I've never felt better, refreshed or energized.
          I've had days at work where I've felt drained, weak, and had a headache afterwards. Same with exercising.
          Now after you give your body time to recover you fell better, same goes for hallucinogens.
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      • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        Suzanne...it's rare indeed that I find myself not agreeing with everything you say. A few thoughts I had...

        Can LSD make you more aware of how you see the world? I think so. So can a near death experience. So can fighting someone (I mean real fighting, where the object is to down the other person). So can being frightened to death. So can a huge personal loss. These experiences tell you more about yourself.
        All I can tell you is my own personal experience. LSD was the first drug I ever used. I was very unhappy. I left my first husband (that didn't make me unhappy), but moved back in with my parents. I had married this jerk at 17 precisely to get away from home. My mother was a very judgmental and controlling woman and had her own ideas about exactly who I should be and all I knew is that it didn't sound like anything I wanted to be. I didn't have a clue who I wanted to be.

        So, my brother, who was into drugs gave me some LSD. It changed my life in that I was not going to be coerced and pushed into a life I didn't want to live. Not long after, I moved to San Francisco and lived what you might call an alternative lifestyle. I was happy and free and experiencing new things and while it had plenty of negatives, I would not change that part of my life for anything.

        So I've never had a near death experience or come close to killing someone. I have suffered great personal loss, however, and I don't consider deep depression to be enlightening in any way. Quite the opposite.

        As for how I felt after LSD, the same as before I took LSD physically. No side effects. I really didn't use it much in CA. I didn't enjoy the CA variety much. There was something different about it, but again, no physical side effects at all.

        I would never promote drug use. The fact is that some will experiment and others will not. LSD was not harmful in any way for many people, unlike some other drugs I've tried and drugs others have tried that I haven't, including some prescription drugs. I'll never really understand the how or why the first couple of highs on LSD made such a dramatic difference in my life, and I don't really care about the technical reasons. All I know is that it did, and I wouldn't change it.
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post


          I would never promote drug use. The fact is that some will experiment and others will not. LSD was not harmful in any way for many people, unlike some other drugs I've tried and drugs others have tried that I haven't, including some prescription drugs. I'll never really understand the how or why the first couple of highs on LSD made such a dramatic difference in my life, and I don't really care about the technical reasons. All I know is that it did, and I wouldn't change it.
          The two experiences I talked about earlier..I was told they had taken LSD. Truth be told, I don't know what else they took. I also don't know their history.

          Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

          Forgot to mention the most destructive drug I ever used in my life. It's the drug that finally brought me to my knees and made me come to the place where it was quit or die, literally. That drug was alcohol. Do you drink Claude? Ever drink too much? How do you feel when you drink too much? Alcohol kills 1 in 10 people of working age.
          I don't drink much at all now. Maybe a beer a year. But in my twenties, I would drink until I was sick. But the next day, I could function. Now, two beers, and the next day, I swear it off for another year.

          In fact, I don't ever remember feeling good, after the alcohol wore off....even after only a couple of beers. You would think, that with all the vomiting and pounding headaches...it would be easy to quit. Nope, I was a slow study.

          The time I said I almost died (in the thread about "fearing death")? I was so drunk, I knew I was going to pass out...so I took about 12 Caffeine pills, I bought at a convenient store. Somehow I made it home, and woke up on the stretcher (or whatever you call it)..and the EMT told me that they thought I had died. I was so sick, I couldn't move my head for two days.

          Yep, Almost died, and had a $12,000 hospital bill to boot. My wife was not happy.
          This was maybe 18-20 years ago.
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          • Profile picture of the author ThomM
            I've had a few close calls with alcohol myself Claude including almost dieing from alcohol poisoning. I don't drink anymore myself.
            I don't look at my past drug use as something to be proud or ashamed of. I am glad I lived through it all and made it out in one piece.
            I do recommend Cannabis to people all the time, usually because they are complaining about some health issue. But I also tell them to do their own research and not just take my word for it.
            If someone asked about doing any other drug I've tried, I wouldn't tell them anything but what I experienced good (if any) and bad. I have a problem with people telling me what to do or not do, so I won't tell anyone else what to do or not do. It's their decision.
            If after talking to me about hard drugs someone thinks they sound like fun, they've got bigger problems then drug use to deal with.
            With Acid I always start out with "I stopped doing acid when it started getting cut with other things". You couldn't pay me enough money to do a hit today.
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      • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        A question for the people who have used LSD; How did you feel after the effects wore off? Better? Refreshed? Energized? If you did, then that is evidence that LSD has beneficial effects.
        Forgot to mention the most destructive drug I ever used in my life. It's the drug that finally brought me to my knees and made me come to the place where it was quit or die, literally. That drug was alcohol. Do you drink Claude? Ever drink too much? How do you feel when you drink too much? Alcohol kills 1 in 10 people of working age.
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