Any ideas on this Local Lead Gen Sites Flipping

by zoro
159 replies
Hi, I recently received an email from someone called Mario. He sent a video (link below) explaining that he can generate thousands every month from flipping local lead gen websites.

Wondering if anyone has bought this product, or if anyone have success with this type of business model?

#flipping #gen #ideas #lead #local #sites
  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
    From what I can tell you will have to successfully rank on a search engine, roll out a successful PPC campaign or a combination of both.

    Can you do this now?

    If you don't know how to do that then this is likely where you will initially need to invest your time/money/whatever.
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    • Profile picture of the author zoro
      Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

      From what I can tell you will have to successfully rank on a search engine, roll out a successful PPC campaign or a combination of both.

      Can you do this now?

      If you don't know how to do that then this is likely where you will initially need to invest your time/money/whatever.
      Well, if I recall correctly, he says in the video that they show you an easy fast and way to rank without spending more?
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      • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
        Originally Posted by zoro View Post

        Well he says in the video that they show you easy fast way to rank without spending more?
        I wouldn't necessarily describe it as easy. It might be easy for those who know keyword research and building a site that will rank high enough to generate those leads, or building an effective PPC in a competitive market. IF you already have that knowledge base and experience doing it.

        Otherwise... no I wouldn't describe it as easy. You will need to invest in time and money to figure out how to do it. I'm sure they have some great material that will get you going! These guys have been around a while I think, so they are probably doing things successfully.

        And I'm not discouraging you or anyone here! Just stating what will likely be required.
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    I don't think this is easy at all.

    Along with some investment and some great seo ability, plus ability to create compelling website, you then have to sell this to biz owners who may not understand the concept. Not near as easy as these gurus will make it seem

    Think about it..if this was so great why are they wasting time selling the system, why wouldn't they just go out and do it more and more for themselves? I wonder how much "success" they even have achieived

    There is another factor to leads - will the biz even treat them right ? I did some lead generation and I found the office workers trashed some of them...it also takes a lot of "tracking" to prove the worth

    IMHO this is way over simplified...yes some people make money at this..but most who buy these "systems" won't be able to pull it off.
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    • Profile picture of the author zoro
      Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

      I don't think this is easy at all.

      Along with some investment and some great seo ability, plus ability to create compelling website, you then have to sell this to biz owners who may not understand the concept. Not near as easy as these gurus will make it seem

      Think about it..if this was so great why are they wasting time selling the system, why wouldn't they just go out and do it more and more for themselves? I wonder how much "success" they even have achieived

      There is another factor to leads - will the biz even treat them right ? I did some lead generation and I found the office workers trashed some of them...it also takes a lot of "tracking" to prove the worth

      IMHO this is way over simplified...yes some people make money at this..but most who buy these "systems" won't be able to pull it off.
      Yes, I appreciate what you're saying and the thought did cross my mind as to why they would even be bothered selling this information for $27 if they are making so much money with it.
      However, in the video above he does clearly state that he will show how to rank a website on google in just a few days. He also also goes on to say, they have a 100% closing rate.

      As for the business owner not knowing how to handle leads, well I guess that's their problem because this is only about us selling the site to him. Perhaps after the business has purchased the website I could offer suggestions on how to best handle the leads and how to setup an autoresponder etc.

      I know I could simply buy it, but to be honest, I've spent so much $ on WSO's and don't want to waste money, so I guess by posting this thread I was hoping for information from someone who has done this type of site flipping or who has bought this course and can shed some more light on it for me.
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  • Profile picture of the author umc
    I'll shed some light on it for you. How many of those WSO's have even remotely lived up to their claims? I bought many too. Most are built on hype that draw in suckers like you and I. Walk away and don't look back. There's a lot of great information to be had for free all over.

    Or you could pay me just $25 and I'll show you my system that has a 250% success rate. The customers will be beating down your door to get in, and it is all outsourced. See how easy it is to make claims?
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  • Profile picture of the author zoro
    Well said. Yes, I have been a sucker for some of those WSO's. However I did learn some good information in a few of those WSO's, so they are not all bad.

    Thanks for your post.
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    • Profile picture of the author Highway55
      In case you don't already know - Mario is Kenny Cannon.

      Do some research on Kenny Cannon and you'll get an idea about the guy.
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      • Profile picture of the author zoro
        Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

        In case you don't already know - Mario is Kenny Cannon.

        Do some research on Kenny Cannon and you'll get an idea about the guy.
        Thanks, I did not know that he used a different name.

        If he is not legit then why does Warrior Plus promote his products.? Just wondering.
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  • Profile picture of the author Highway55
    I'll give you my opinion on Kenny Cannon. I know he was kicked off the WF a while ago. For what, I don't know. He has a bad reputation for some reason. But for myself... I think this guys is really good at what he does. I bought his Craigslist course a long time ago and made some ridiculous money for a span of about 6 months (until CL made it cost prohibitive to continue...)

    I may grab this product. I'm watching the video now.
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    • Profile picture of the author zoro
      Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

      I'll give you my opinion on Kenny Cannon. I know he was kicked off the WF a while ago. For what, I don't know. He has a bad reputation for some reason. But for myself... I think this guys is really good at what he does. I bought his Craigslist course a long time ago and made some ridiculous money for a span of about 6 months (until CL made it cost prohibitive to continue...)

      I may grab this product. I'm watching the video now.
      OK, thanks. If you do buy it please fill me in.
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  • Profile picture of the author zoro
    Kenny Cannon has this glowing video testimonial:

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    • Originally Posted by zoro View Post

      Kenny Cannon has this glowing video testimonial:

      A Testimonial For Kenny Cannon - YouTube
      That "testimonial" is hilarious!!! The fact that he thought that was good enough to put up on youtube is amazing.
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      • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
        Originally Posted by Phillip Blackwell View Post

        That "testimonial" is hilarious!!! The fact that he thought that was good enough to put up on youtube is amazing.
        Fiverr should have their own version of Oscars and Razzies.
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  • Profile picture of the author Highway55
    Fiver chick (from somewhere overseas) in front of a green screen?
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    • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
      Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

      Fiver chick (from somewhere overseas) in front of a green screen?
      LOL....the fiverr "testimony" videos crack me up

      this gal speaks of "our industry">> but it looks as if she is naked?

      what a riot
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      • Profile picture of the author zoro
        Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

        LOL....the fiverr "testimony" videos crack me up

        this gal speaks of "our industry">> but it looks as if she is naked?

        what a riot
        Don't they say that sex sells ? lol
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  • Profile picture of the author Highway55
    Just bought the $27 base product. Watching some videos now...
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    • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
      Personally, I'm fine with most WSO offerings that fall short or people don't see success with. If somone cannot extract value out of aninformational product, implement its core components and bring it to market... that's all on them. It's pretty clear that there is no one thing you can buy other than a lotto ticket that will provide revenue.

      With that said....

      Learning SEO and building a Lead gen site from scratch is an excellent project to take on because you will be gaining new skills and experience. The ability to rank a site right away, picking an appropriate niche, setting up and deplying the funnel with social and video, etc. should not be downplayed. It's a significant amount of effort.
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      • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
        Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

        Personally, I'm fine with most WSO offerings that fall short or people don't see success with. If somone cannot extract value out of aninformational product, implement its core components and bring it to market... that's all on them. It's pretty clear that there is no one thing you can buy other than a lotto ticket that will provide revenue.

        With that said....

        Learning SEO and building a Lead gen site from scratch is an excellent project to take on because you will be gaining new skills and experience. The ability to rank a site right away, picking an appropriate niche, setting up and deplying the funnel with social and video, etc. should not be downplayed. It's a significant amount of effort.

        Ummm....yeah

        so if you get nothing out of a product it is all good?

        I personally use the library if I feel like it or search the internet for info

        there are many places where you can learn seo, forums and more ....where people are not desperately trying to sell ya something

        Not to mention...a lot of the seo stuff out there may be changing with the new stuff that Google is doing
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        • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
          Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

          Ummm....yeah

          so if you get nothing out of a product it is all good?

          I personally use the library if I feel like it or search the internet for info

          there are many places where you can learn seo, forums and more ....where people are not desperately trying to sell ya something

          Not to mention...a lot of the seo stuff out there may be changing with the new stuff that Google is doing
          I am not going to assume whether or not the content in this thing has value. But hype and oversell doesn't necessarily negate any good content. For someone going into it with zero seo, ppc or sales funnel setup experience will probably pickup some skills if they are paying attention.

          Make millions? Not so much
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  • Profile picture of the author Underground
    You was told the facebook thing wouldn't work. I wish you would have listened.

    You've gone out and done the work, and it's a no go. Instead of sinking into that state where we can become victims of sociapaths like Kenny Cannon, you have to regroup and keep going, but change things up by offering something proven.


    Get Bob Ross's stuff. You've already put in some work contacting people and they probably did not have the first clue what you were offering and frankly there was no value to them if you didn't have a real sizeable fan base.

    Bob's stuff is something that is proven. You've already proven your up to your side of the bargain in being willing to put the work in.

    Time to start finally making a real income providing a good, honest, proven service don't you think?
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    • Profile picture of the author zoro
      Originally Posted by Underground View Post

      You was told the facebook thing wouldn't work. I wish you would have listened.

      You've gone out and done the work, and it's a no go. Instead of sinking into that state where we can become victims of sociapaths like Kenny Cannon, you have to regroup and keep going, but change things up by offering something proven.


      Get Bob Ross's stuff. You've already put in some work contacting people and they probably did not have the first clue what you were offering and frankly there was no value to them if you didn't have a real sizeable fan base.

      Bob's stuff is something that is proven. You've already proven your up to your side of the bargain in being willing to put the work in.

      Time to start finally making a real income providing a good, honest, proven service don't you think?
      Thanks, I think you're referring to another thread and you suggestions and assistance was much appreciated. I'm still working on that project, I haven't given up, far from it.
      Bob Ross's stuff, if I'm correct, is about printing business ads on cards and delivering those cards into homes. That's ok, but a bit different to what I was wanting to achieve.

      I was interested to learn about this new system of Lead Gen Website Flipping because I already understand a bit about lead generation for local businesses, so I thought I'd ask here if anyone has tried Mario's course and what they thought about it.

      All Good, thanks Mate.
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      • Profile picture of the author Highway55
        Just reviewed the entire course. Its got some decent info, but the ranking process is almost pure spam in my opinion. And the sites you're selling are not likely to stay in place after the sale.

        That's my review.
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        • Profile picture of the author McGruff
          Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

          Just reviewed the entire course. Its got some decent info, but the ranking process is almost pure spam in my opinion. And the sites you're selling are not likely to stay in place after the sale.

          That's my review.
          Do you believe that he sold his sites for the screenshot amounts shown in the video?
          What is it to lead you to believe they won't stick after they're flipped?
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          • Profile picture of the author Highway55
            Originally Posted by McGruff View Post

            Do you believe that he sold his sites for the screenshot amounts shown in the video?
            What is it to lead you to believe they won't stick after they're flipped?
            The ranking process is pure spam.

            I believe they sell the sites they teach you to rank for $500... perhaps a little more. Every once in a while you might make $1000 if you get lucky and a business owner is willing to pay and thinks you have a gem of a site.

            But these sites are thin, with very little content. And they have spam links in my opinion. Even if you added content (say, 10-15 articles) you still have spam links.

            But they claim you can rank them fast, within 10 days - they claim. There were no dates or proof of that, however.

            As I watched the videos (it's all video by the way) I had a thought that you could rank the sites and probably sell them to a buyer on flippa for about the same price as selling to a business owner.

            Hope that helps.
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            • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
              Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

              The ranking process is pure spam.

              I believe they sell the sites they teach you to rank for $500... perhaps a little more. Every once in a while you might make $1000 if you get lucky and a business owner is willing to pay and thinks you have a gem of a site.

              But these sites are thin, with very little content. And they have spam links in my opinion. Even if you added content (say, 10-15 articles) you still have spam links.

              But they claim you can rank them fast, within 10 days - they claim. There were no dates or proof of that, however.

              As I watched the videos (it's all video by the way) I had a thought that you could rank the sites and probably sell them to a buyer on flippa for about the same price as selling to a business owner.

              Hope that helps.
              This is what I was referring to in prior posts... You are expecting to do 1, 2, 3 and make $15k a site. That's not what I got from this or any other information I might pull from this place.

              I agree that the work to build out the site is downplayed and will required quite a lot more content and commitment to research the niche and develop that content. Will it rank in a couple of weeks? Not sure --- that's part of the niche research you do at the start I would think.
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        • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
          Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

          Just reviewed the entire course. Its got some decent info, but the ranking process is almost pure spam in my opinion. And the sites you're selling are not likely to stay in place after the sale.

          That's my review.
          Fyi: i left out the spammy backlinking stuff and focused more energy into onpage seo and spent a lot of time on keyword decisions. I don't think it would be a good idea to mess around with spammy backlinking directly to the main page, maybe the social media components but i didnt do much of that because i have a concious and would likenfor the site to be somewhat robust and last for the purchaser.
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      • Profile picture of the author Underground
        Originally Posted by zoro View Post


        I was interested to learn about this new system of Lead Gen Website Flipping because I already understand a bit about lead generation for local businesses, so I thought I'd ask here if anyone has tried Mario's course and what they thought about it.

        All Good, thanks Mate.

        Fair enough on the other stuff, I thought the situation might still be how you described in pm a while back.

        But my point was you shouldn't even be entertaining stuff like this from a conman. I'm sure you've seen rent'a'serp and other models. You'll know how it's done.

        Long-tails business name and surburb with no competition in high-ticket niches, buy an old domain if possible, if not just get some quality PBN's. But they advocate junk sites with no content that are going to get slapped sooner rather than later. Or on the back end they upsell you other stuff about how to get content on your pbns and all that and do all the other stuff, but it's a lot of time and money

        This model has legs when done right, and I've seen some good stuff, but expensive for the course and paying for all the pbns and written content and link building.


        But this guy has not found some mystery trick that no one else knew about that makes him $100,000's a month. He's a conman. I was trying to say stop wasting time on stuff like this basically. You know I'm coming from the right place here. Hoping you'll be a success with all the graft you've put in.

        You're putting the action in, and soon all the stuff is gonna pay off if you have the right vision and direction, but not with ideas like easy six figures a month on some quick ranking loophole that ''shows you a fast easy way to rank without spending more''.


        That last bit in bold, which you references in the OP, is the deception, if it's what interested and got you curious, then that's what I was trying to advise not to waste your time on.

        That statement is what keeps consumers in a whole industry on the hook, and has them continually falling prey to people who exploit that.
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        • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
          Originally Posted by Underground View Post

          Long-tails business name and surburb with no competition in high-ticket niches, buy an old domain if possible, if not just get some quality PBN's. But they advocate junk sites with no content that are going to get slapped sooner rather than later.
          All fair points! But there are still useable content if paying attention, which I made clear at the start. I think most of us see thru the hype but I also see that if you build value no matter if it's short lived, can be a viable product and capable of generating revenue. If I had sold a site that delivered for the business that purchased it, I'm perfectly fine with that.

          I can certainly provide additional services to keep it ranked if that's of interest but I wouldn't be comfortable with that scenario unless it was made clear prior to domain purchase and transfer that they understand it will eventually not rank and will require work to keep it up.

          Anyway it's an interesting model. Not really a passive one but I still think going thru the process is a good skill building experience rather than immediate income generator.


          ...gotta look thru the obvious bs to take advantage and apply the things that work.
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          • Profile picture of the author Underground
            Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

            All fair points! But there are still useable content if paying attention, which I made clear at the start. I think most of us see thru the hype but I also see that if you build value no matter if it's short lived, can be a viable product and capable of generating revenue. If I had sold a site that delivered for the business that purchased it, I'm perfectly fine with that.

            I can certainly provide additional services to keep it ranked if that's of interest but I wouldn't be comfortable with that scenario unless it was made clear prior to domain purchase and transfer that they understand it will eventually not rank and will require work to keep it up.

            Anyway it's an interesting model. Not really a passive one but I still think going thru the process is a good skill building experience rather than immediate income generator.


            ...gotta look thru the obvious bs to take advantage and apply the things that work.

            That completely true. And if people check them out now and again and glean a thing or two here and there while knowing all the hype and manipulatory copy is BS then they have the right attitude.

            I actually got taught something worthwhile in a previous course he put out. He was emailing 500 businesses a day and then following up on the phone and had some system to do that. His claims then were just a wild about the type of conversion rates and figures he was pulling and basically advised lying and ripping people off and doing anything to get the sales and saying you had no balls if you didn't do that.


            There's a ploy that Kenny Canyon uses, who I think worked in Jordan Belfort's office back in the day and is still a hardcore sales guys, and that is playing to a single mindset.

            ''This is an easy method to make massive fast money for very little work and very little money needed''.

            Some people still want to find that and are still taken in by that very promise, not just learning a thing or two. And I can't think of a person more adept at taking advantage of people of looking for than ''Mario''.

            I understand complete what you're saying and wouldn't argue against that people can still learn and pick up things.
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        • Profile picture of the author zoro
          Originally Posted by Underground View Post

          Fair enough on the other stuff, I thought the situation might still be how you described in pm a while back.

          But my point was you shouldn't even be entertaining stuff like this from a conman. I'm sure you've seen rent'a'serp and other models. You'll know how it's done.

          Long-tails business name and surburb with no competition in high-ticket niches, buy an old domain if possible, if not just get some quality PBN's. But they advocate junk sites with no content that are going to get slapped sooner rather than later. Or on the back end they upsell you other stuff about how to get content on your pbns and all that and do all the other stuff, but it's a lot of time and money

          This model has legs when done right, and I've seen some good stuff, but expensive for the course and paying for all the pbns and written content and link building.


          But this guy has not found some mystery trick that no one else knew about that makes him $100,000's a month. He's a conman. I was trying to say stop wasting time on stuff like this basically. You know I'm coming from the right place here. Hoping you'll be a success with all the graft you've put in.

          You're putting the action in, and soon all the stuff is gonna pay off if you have the right vision and direction, but not with ideas like easy six figures a month on some quick ranking loophole that ''shows you a fast easy way to rank without spending more''.


          That last bit in bold, which you references in the OP, is the deception, if it's what interested and got you curious, then that's what I was trying to advise not to waste your time on.

          That statement is what keeps consumers in a whole industry on the hook, and has them continually falling prey to people who exploit that.
          Yep, you're 100% correct and I have a lot of respect for honest and well meaning guys like you. Thanks Mate, it's appreciated.
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          • Profile picture of the author Underground
            Originally Posted by zoro View Post

            Yep, you're 100% correct and I have a lot of respect for honest and well meaning guys like you. Thanks Mate, it's appreciated.
            Thanks. I have a lot of respect for you and know you're a grafter.

            And kind of assumed you're just like me in that when we've put a lot of hard work into a concept and idea and it doesn't go to plan as we wanted, you think there must be something that is faster and easier because other people have met success without all this BS and hardship involved. That's a tendency we all have. And we're more inclined to be curious about stuff that seems to offer a solution. The biggest successes, from what I've seen, did have it hard. It wasn't easy for them either. They just got even more determined.

            If there is a proven revenue generator that is fast and doesn't require much start up stuff, it's Bob Ross system. And if I wasn't so invested and near completion on a project that has taken me years, major sacrifice and to the brink of despair many times in delays but is about to get going, I would be all over Bob Ross's stuff, and would not waste a single second stuck in the malaise, or the stupor, I've been in far too many times pissing about with stuff that was going nowhere. To some it's a hobby and they'll never put in the work. Neither of us are one of those people.

            Bob's stuff will be work and graft like you've been doing and are no stranger to, but that is one thing that has paid off most for those willing to give it their all.


            There's good money in lead gen. Like there is in the OMG model of building, ranking and selling sites, and many other models and what you're doing, but you need money to invest..

            With something that is proven seller among small businesses, like Bob Ross's stuff, and keeping going hard at it, you could raise some good capital and get the essential foot up to take a model that most appeals and make it work.

            Good luck mate.
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    JMO......anything that is supposed to be so easy....and so profitable...why would he sell it for $27?

    SEO specialists get paid big money to help sites rank....who knew all the info you need was available for $27?? Well the answer is that it probably is not all that easy or simple as they would make you think

    the other part of the equation of course is selling or leasing these sites to biz owners, or selling the leads.

    I think some of these "gurus" oversell and oversimplify things

    I would like to see his "proof"?
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  • Profile picture of the author Jbarzok
    Some great comments added by James, I do agree.

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  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
    I've been in business for a while, mostly doing offline prospecting, some emailing, etc... Never have attempted any SEO options. So this sort of intrigued me a bit and I ended up following thru on the approaches.

    Mind you, this is all about domain flipping and building out lead generation sites on very local levels, it is NOT applying SEO to your main business website for the long term. It is simply to quickly build a site that gets ranked and generating phone calls.

    Anyway...

    Not knowing what spammy-techniques were or "white hat" this or grey that... I just went ahead and applied the techniques that were presented. Granted, I am a software developer and capable of creating and optimizing a website in a very short period of time -- I didn't use a Wordpress thingy and built out from my own library of code. I just never really focused on incorporating SEO principles into the pages.

    So this was actually a VERY good experience for me to go thru.

    At current state less thant 1 week into going live I'm ranking less than page 8 at the moment, that's without full indexing of the whole site, no backlinks (just on-page seo), a youtube video and for keywords that match my domain fairly closely in the locale it is setup. No phone calls as I expect just yet but we shall see about mid-May how far rankings have improved.

    I've learned quite a bit, especially related to the importance of keyword search, competition review and how that should affect the decisions for building out something.

    I still stand by my comments: yes, over-hype is common here but that does not mean we should just dismiss the content. There NEVER is a step 1, 2, 3 to success --- it's a process of learning, failing and applying what works over time to see any sort of advancement.
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    • Profile picture of the author zoro
      Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

      I've been in business for a while, mostly doing offline prospecting, some emailing, etc... Never have attempted any SEO options. So this sort of intrigued me a bit and I ended up following thru on the approaches.

      Mind you, this is all about domain flipping and building out lead generation sites on very local levels, it is NOT applying SEO to your main business website for the long term. It is simply to quickly build a site that gets ranked and generating phone calls.

      Anyway...

      Not knowing what spammy-techniques were or "white hat" this or grey that... I just went ahead and applied the techniques that were presented. Granted, I am a software developer and capable of creating and optimizing a website in a very short period of time -- I didn't use a Wordpress thingy and built out from my own library of code. I just never really focused on incorporating SEO principles into the pages.

      So this was actually a VERY good experience for me to go thru.

      At current state less thant 1 week into going live I'm ranking less than page 8 at the moment, that's without full indexing of the whole site, no backlinks (just on-page seo), a youtube video and for keywords that match my domain fairly closely in the locale it is setup. No phone calls as I expect just yet but we shall see about mid-May how far rankings have improved.

      I've learned quite a bit, especially related to the importance of keyword search, competition review and how that should affect the decisions for building out something.

      I still stand by my comments: yes, over-hype is common here but that does not mean we should just dismiss the content. There NEVER is a step 1, 2, 3 to success --- it's a process of learning, failing and applying what works over time to see any sort of advancement.
      Thanks for giving an update on your progress using their site flipping method. Please give us another progress update as you see fit.
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      • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
        Originally Posted by zoro View Post

        Thanks for giving an update on your progress using their site flipping method. Please give us another progress update as you see fit.
        Update 5/4/2015: my website is on page 2 of google search result for 2 keyword.phrases i am targeting. Keep in mind that is an important component to this, proper keyword choices have a huge influence on how this works. With that said, these are not hugely searched monthly, but within the suggestion guidelines that were presented.

        This is also only with good onpage seo and a few localized citations.

        Next milestone will be how well I did on the website, if it actually generates some leads and if they actually convert for a business i direct them to.

        To be honest, i'm impressed. It's no panacea and I've employed existing techical skills that many likely do not have, especially as it relates to setting up the site and doing the onlage seo work.

        The larger benefit i believe is that i am taking away some good basics and essentials that i can apply to some more competitive keywords and markets that will be more difficult to tackle and more time required to commit. Which is just fine as now i have a fairly good understanding of where to start and where i can improve.
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        • Profile picture of the author Highway55
          Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

          Update 5/4/2015:

          Next milestone will be how well I did on the website, if it actually generates some leads and if they actually convert for a business i direct them to.
          Great info! I'm interested in you reaching page 1 and verifying the number of leads that a site may be contacted for - based on the search volume (per google's numbers)

          Excellent follow up post.
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          • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
            Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

            Great info! I'm interested in you reaching page 1 and verifying the number of leads that a site may be contacted for - based on the search volume (per google's numbers)

            Excellent follow up post.
            Will do.

            I would say this: I am much more in-tune with what to look for when fleshing out markets and keyword ideas. we've already identified a really good opportunity for a.product sales and drop-shipping setup that would be much more passive compared to constantly building out lead generation sites and selling them. But i can see being capable of doing 1 per month easily, perhaps selling 9 or 10 each year as an additional source of revenue.
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        • Profile picture of the author zoro
          Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

          Update 5/4/2015: my website is on page 2 of google search result for 2 keyword.phrases i am targeting. Keep in mind that is an important component to this, proper keyword choices have a huge influence on how this works. With that said, these are not hugely searched monthly, but within the suggestion guidelines that were presented.

          This is also only with good onpage seo and a few localized citations.

          Next milestone will be how well I did on the website, if it actually generates some leads and if they actually convert for a business i direct them to.

          To be honest, i'm impressed. It's no panacea and I've employed existing techical skills that many likely do not have, especially as it relates to setting up the site and doing the onlage seo work.

          The larger benefit i believe is that i am taking away some good basics and essentials that i can apply to some more competitive keywords and markets that will be more difficult to tackle and more time required to commit. Which is just fine as now i have a fairly good understanding of where to start and where i can improve.
          Appreciate your latest update. Sounds like you could be on a winner. As you know I have not picked up this course because I was a bit dubious and skeptical about the product claims and the people behind it, hence this thread.
          I do not have the additional skills that you say you're employing, but I guess I could learn them, time permitting.
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          • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
            Originally Posted by zoro View Post

            Appreciate your latest update. Sounds like you could be on a winner. As you know I have not picked up this course because I was a bit dubious and skeptical about the product claims and the people behind it, hence this thread.
            I do not have the additional skills that you say are employing, but I guess I could learn them, time permitting.
            It could be, still to be seen how well the site converts. There's just so many variables that might contribute: the industry I chose, the keywords, the purchase process prospective customers in that industry typically go thru (estimates/quotes seemed to be the norm as the first step), how they perceive the online presence (my design/layout), even the actual sales funnel itself may be out of synch with how this market usually interacts with vendors --- all of this is really unknown at the moment and really just going thru the motions and building with some basic common sense.

            ...And let me just say that all of the things I am mentioning here may not necessarily be the fault of the course/material should things totally fail.

            I definitely didn't just choose a random WordPress theme, write up some nonsensical runon about the product/service and then head on over to fiverr to buy some gig that spams out 10,000's of backlinks. It takes effort/work not only to build this stuff, but to digest the information and then apply it in effective ways. It's totally doable, don't get me wrong!
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            • Profile picture of the author Rodgers15
              Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

              It could be, still to be seen how well the site converts. There's just so many variables that might contribute: the industry I chose, the keywords, the purchase process prospective customers in that industry typically go thru (estimates/quotes seemed to be the norm as the first step), how they perceive the online presence (my design/layout), even the actual sales funnel itself may be out of synch with how this market usually interacts with vendors --- all of this is really unknown at the moment and really just going thru the motions and building with some basic common sense.

              ...And let me just say that all of the things I am mentioning here may not necessarily be the fault of the course/material should things totally fail.

              I definitely didn't just choose a random WordPress theme, write up some nonsensical runon about the product/service and then head on over to fiverr to buy some gig that spams out 10,000's of backlinks. It takes effort/work not only to build this stuff, but to digest the information and then apply it in effective ways. It's totally doable, don't get me wrong!
              Pretty much agree. DIY strategy is the only guarantee that anyone can get, based on effort given.
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  • Profile picture of the author unifiedac
    My general response to people selling profitable websites is, "Why would they?"

    If you had a lead generation website earning passive income, why would you flip it? Anyone with true passive income methods does not give them to someone else.

    In my experience, most people flipping sites are taking advantage of those that don't have the ability (or are too afraid to learn) how to build their own website. It's easy find people that get enticed by saying, "Earn $100/month with this website, only $600 purchase price!"

    Most sites that are flipped or rely on templates with PLR content are garbage. Just like any project (online or offline), you have to work if you want it to be successful. People who buy flipped sites are looking for a handout.
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    • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
      Originally Posted by unifiedac View Post

      My general response to people selling profitable websites is, "Why would they?"
      Building and selling assets is nothing new and is a perfectly normal way to generate wealth. It applies to MANY things, including websites that have value.

      If you had a lead generation website earning passive income, why would you flip it? Anyone with true passive income methods does not give them to someone else.
      Hiring others to perform the bulk of the work, even hiring people to sell it, would be generating passive income for me. I'd sell it to recoup my costs and generate profits. I'm not sure what you mean by giving something away?

      In my experience, most people flipping sites are taking advantage of those that don't have the ability (or are too afraid to learn) how to build their own website. It's easy find people that get enticed by saying, "Earn $100/month with this website, only $600 purchase price!"
      Nice strawman. Your phantom offer sounds like it reads like something from the WSO section. We are talking about building out websites that are getting calls from local markets for products and services that are sold by businesses in those local markets. There most certainly is value in acquiring a resource that makes the phone ring. Certainly more than $600 --- I'd never sell one of my sites for that cheap, I'd be losing money.


      Most sites that are flipped or rely on templates with PLR content are garbage. Just like any project (online or offline), you have to work if you want it to be successful. People who buy flipped sites are looking for a handout.
      This isn't about selling some ebook.
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    • Profile picture of the author DABK
      If I had a few websites I could sell for $15k, I could take that $15k buy a condo, fix it up and sell it for $45K within 2 months.

      If creating enough sites to make the equivalent profit took me 2 times longer, I'd be an idiot not to sell a few websites to get the cash to buy the condo.

      But, you're right, a lot of people who sell sites don't have profitable sites. I.e, they might make them make money (as in gross) but not profit.

      I once talked to a guy who was making $2000 a month with his website (he was not interested in selling it) but it took him 12 hours a day/6 days a week, week in and week out and he was tired (he was looking for a way to make the $2000 with less work).

      Originally Posted by unifiedac View Post

      My general response to people selling profitable websites is, "Why would they?"

      If you had a lead generation website earning passive income, why would you flip it? Anyone with true passive income methods does not give them to someone else.

      In my experience, most people flipping sites are taking advantage of those that don't have the ability (or are too afraid to learn) how to build their own website. It's easy find people that get enticed by saying, "Earn $100/month with this website, only $600 purchase price!"

      Most sites that are flipped or rely on templates with PLR content are garbage. Just like any project (online or offline), you have to work if you want it to be successful. People who buy flipped sites are looking for a handout.
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  • Profile picture of the author flightlayaway1
    thanks buddy for this useful information.
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  • Profile picture of the author Highway55
    @jamesfreddyc - great contributions
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  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
    Since last update my rank jump around a bit and back down on page 4. I'm a newb at this so I didn't really know or expect that, but it is what it is.

    On another note, I'm currently on page 1 in Bing! (if that matters! lol)... Hovering around 12th on page 1 (around 3.2 million results for keywords in total), just below the "Local Results" section. I'm not very familiar with Bing results and haven't actually looked at any statistics in their webmaster tools. Well, I have but it is taking a long time for that information to get current.

    Since I've already gone thru adding citations and such I've moved on to exploring some possible ways to get quality backlinks. This stuff if really time consuming so I haven't really put my heart into it but basically I've got some content that might be appealing to other sites and I'm just trying to locate one that has some PR and willing to link me.

    Not planning to put too much into that just yet but I'm picking away at it here and there. I'd like to get more of that type of content inter-page linked, maybe 10 or so more pages and that should help a bit I believe.

    This is a side project so it's tough to find the time for researching and writing content.

    Anyway -- there you go.
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    While the "course" may contain some good "SEO" info, the real problem is with the blatant overstating as to what you can sell these site/s for...

    $15,000? Oh please...let's get real here

    Not to mention that Google has changed their "rules" a lot, some of the old "tricks" might not work

    IMHO you could go to a lot of effort and time, build site,work on SEO and even "rank" it but really then you need to be able to sell...pick up the phone....walk in the doors....and you need to find someone to buy that site.

    Now...many will have their own site, not want a site, offer you a couple hundred. Some biz might pay you ? $500 or so, maybe more $800 if you "redo " it with their logo, pictures, info etc...

    IMHO a huge amount of work and risk. I have no respect for the guy who wrote this with his fake $15000 nonsense and his fake East European fiverr gal "testimonial"...heck poor William McCorkle went to federal prison for this sort of nonsense, he was simply more successful LOL
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    • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
      Did you review the whole video series?

      Only asking because many of those things are actually addressed and discussed.

      I hadn't intended to make this an endorsement of anything to be honest. Just a view into what it REALLY takes in comparison to what some might perceive as outlandish statements. I've also addressed many of this things you mention in various posts I've made as it relates to my own experiences with the techniques offered up.

      I think I've been very clear that this thing is no panacea and requires a bit more work. I'd disagree with your assertion that,

      Now...many will have their own site, not want a site, offer you a couple hundred. Some biz might pay you ? $500 or so, maybe more $800 if you "redo " it with their logo, pictures, info etc...
      We're not talking about just building and selling a site whipped together with pretty graphics and good copy. This is about a process to build a lead generation website that is actually ranking and making the phone ring. The vast majority of the target prospects will not have this.

      Price is entirely dependent upon the market and niche you are targeting, the lifetime value of a single customer within that space, and how far into the future you can negotiate (as an example, if the site can generate 5 conversions each month @ $500 per sale for the business, then a 1 month proration would be $2500). Again, that's not on the course/material/them, that's on how you apply the concepts and choosing markets, keywords, etc wisely.


      Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

      While the "course" may contain some good "SEO" info, the real problem is with the blatant overstating as to what you can sell these site/s for...

      $15,000? Oh please...let's get real here

      Not to mention that Google has changed their "rules" a lot, some of the old "tricks" might not work

      IMHO you could go to a lot of effort and time, build site,work on SEO and even "rank" it but really then you need to be able to sell...pick up the phone....walk in the doors....and you need to find someone to buy that site.
      Now...many will have their own site, not want a site, offer you a couple hundred. Some biz might pay you ? $500 or so, maybe more $800 if you "redo " it with their logo, pictures, info etc...

      IMHO a huge amount of work and risk. I have no respect for the guy who wrote this with his fake $15000 nonsense and his fake East European fiverr gal "testimonial"...heck poor William McCorkle went to federal prison for this sort of nonsense, he was simply more successful LOL
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      • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
        Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

        Did you review the whole video series?

        Only asking because many of those things are actually addressed and discussed.

        I hadn't intended to make this an endorsement of anything to be honest. Just a view into what it REALLY takes in comparison to what some might perceive as outlandish statements. I've also addressed many of this things you mention in various posts I've made as it relates to my own experiences with the techniques offered up.

        I think I've been very clear that this thing is no panacea and requires a bit more work. I'd disagree with your assertion that,



        We're not talking about just building and selling a site whipped together with pretty graphics and good copy. This is about a process to build a lead generation website that is actually ranking and making the phone ring. The vast majority of the target prospects will not have this.

        Price is entirely dependent upon the market and niche you are targeting, the lifetime value of a single customer within that space, and how far into the future you can negotiate (as an example, if the site can generate 5 conversions each month @ $500 per sale for the business, then a 1 month proration would be $2500). Again, that's not on the course/material/them, that's on how you apply the concepts and choosing markets, keywords, etc wisely.
        Have you ever done lead generation, tracking with a call number, etc, on a (fairly) high ticket item? I have done it...and it is not near as easy as you think

        First of all....tracking gets subjective when the people in the company don't handle leads right....the owner can also try to screw you out of the commission (or in this case, screw you around with saying it is not converting)

        Second...there are many lead gen peeps running around and can't close the sale, lots of them "give away" leads (I never did that)....

        Third....best be able to sell...and I mean sell...get through gatekeepers, meet the owner, show stats....it is not near as easy

        Care to tell me why this guru has an Eastern European Fiverr shill praising him?
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        • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
          Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

          Have you ever done lead generation, tracking with a call number, etc, on a (fairly) high ticket item? I have done it...and it is not near as easy as you think

          First of all....tracking gets subjective when the people in the company don't handle leads right....the owner can also try to screw you out of the commission (or in this case, screw you around with saying it is not converting)

          Second...there are many lead gen peeps running around and can't close the sale, lots of them "give away" leads (I never did that)....

          Third....best be able to sell...and I mean sell...get through gatekeepers, meet the owner, show stats....it is not near as easy

          Care to tell me why this guru has an Eastern European Fiverr shill praising him?
          As I've maintained all along, i am coming from the stance of removing any ridiculous claims. I'm just not that gullible.

          I am also familiar with sales.and prospecting and.is entirely separate from my whole point of commenting here: I am strictly interested in picking a profitable market"niche, ranking the site by applying the seo.

          It's been a very goid experience to go thru and Have gained some really good skills to apply elsewhere (i mentioned earlier how i've uncovered a great keyword and product/dropship opportunity that i will apply newly acquired skills).

          Along with the immediate small successes comes the ability to find and effectively filter out seo techniques that can be used outside of lead gen model.

          ....IOW's i don't give a rat's butt what fiverr girl says or how ridiculous it seems. I'm applying the important things and chucking what isn't.
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          • Profile picture of the author jake12293
            I have also been trying out this method, I recently setup a basic site within a certain niche, I did some keyword research and did my on-page seo until I was happy with it, and I think i'm on one backlink so far. cut a long story short, the site is ranking in top 5 of google for the type of service the business offers and the state that I live..so it will be "locksmith merseyside". So people searching using those keywords will find my site. Its super easy to rank for local search terms because there is little to no competition form other SEO's. Most business don't have a clue about SEO so your site will easily bypass theirs, which generates phone calls, phone calls you can sell to businesses below you!

            So, the SEO side of things really does work and it isn't hard if you put some time an effort into learning it. The problem with my site is that i chose a business where the profit from a lead wouldn't be worth the effort in my opinion, which was stupid on my part, but it has helped me learn so i can apply the same technique to another lead gen site where the leads are worth thousands. local businesses are paying through to nose for google advertisements so if a lead was worth a few thousand to your business i'm sure your willing to pay at least $100 a lead. if your ranking in top 3 for a search term that gets 90 searches a month locally your bound to get at least 30 calls, and at $100 a call thats alot of money a month!

            I read the other guys comment above me about call tracking nightmares and actually making this business model convert, and i can see his point, but its worth a shot! if you just devise a good sales pitch and don't just cold call the business then your bound to get some interest! after all, your clients will be making more money, people are always interested in making more money trust me.
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            • Profile picture of the author savidge4
              You are going to find that the niches that presumably pay more, are going to be harder to rank for. but what about the site you have? does it make the phone ring?

              Are you confusing poor conversion with a no good niche?

              With something like "Locksmith" you understand it would be human behavior to start at the top of the list as in #1 position and try to get ahold of them. then #2 and #3 etc.

              #5 needs work still - its close but this aint horseshoes.. and particularly when the CTA is going to be a phone call. you REALLY need to be #1 or #2

              I spoke with a few of my local lock smiths today - out of curiosity from another thread. in my small little metro 50 mile radius community of 40,000 the 5 locksmiths in my area on average each "answer" 20 calls a day.

              I would say forget selling "Leads" and look more at renting the site. if 5 of the 20 calls come from a site each and every day.. 150 times a month.. what is that worth? $300? $450? $1200? 150 calls at a value of $100 each is $15,000 in revenue. its NOT chump change.

              Originally Posted by jake12293 View Post

              I have also been trying out this method, I recently setup a basic site within a certain niche, I did some keyword research and did my on-page seo until I was happy with it, and I think i'm on one backlink so far. cut a long story short, the site is ranking in top 5 of google for the type of service the business offers and the state that I live..so it will be "locksmith merseyside". So people searching using those keywords will find my site. Its super easy to rank for local search terms because there is little to no competition form other SEO's. Most business don't have a clue about SEO so your site will easily bypass theirs, which generates phone calls, phone calls you can sell to businesses below you!

              So, the SEO side of things really does work and it isn't hard if you put some time an effort into learning it. The problem with my site is that i chose a business where the profit from a lead wouldn't be worth the effort in my opinion, which was stupid on my part, but it has helped me learn so i can apply the same technique to another lead gen site where the leads are worth thousands. local businesses are paying through to nose for google advertisements so if a lead was worth a few thousand to your business i'm sure your willing to pay at least $100 a lead. if your ranking in top 3 for a search term that gets 90 searches a month locally your bound to get at least 30 calls, and at $100 a call thats alot of money a month!

              I read the other guys comment above me about call tracking nightmares and actually making this business model convert, and i can see his point, but its worth a shot! if you just devise a good sales pitch and don't just cold call the business then your bound to get some interest! after all, your clients will be making more money, people are always interested in making more money trust me.
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      • Profile picture of the author ajaysofttrix
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      • Profile picture of the author Carsten Tiensuu
        Hi,

        If I where you I would seriously stay away from tis Mario Bruno guy aka Kevin Cannon. He has together with his buddy Cameron Benson aka MoneyMindset (Warrior id) over 25 different account on the WF. Mario/Kevin Cannon even brags about this on a blackhat forum.

        See link: [GET] $2 Million In 4 Years...How I did It....DIRECT


        Check this video... does Kevin Cannon not sound like Mario from the video in the beginning of this thread?
        Telling you these guys are the worst in this industry. I bought From Kenny Cannon before I knew Cannon was Mario and Cameron was the Cameron that runs around scamming people with Mario... I can live with bad products, but not if the product does not excist...

        Bought a product from them 3 days ago and the oto for $27 ... but the OTO does not excist IRL... it´s just a scam and now i struggle getting my money back

        This is the download url to the OTO https://warriorplus.com/buy/get/jxk6wmww

        and this should be the download page http://autoincomefunnels.com/kwh-o1o-0jscxm/


        I´ve attached his lame excuses from emails...
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    I agree it may be easier to "rent" the site or sell it outright

    I still maintain that few local biz will pay $15000 for a website and I think the guy who wrote this is full of it.

    Anyone who pays that for a website will have totally custom stuff, not some generic wordpress site put together by people who are "new" at it...let's get real here.

    And this is NOT going to sell itself - you will have to get out there and cold call, email , maybe send snail mail and/or walk in doors. At least in the beginning...you can't get someone to "do it for you" as you do not really know what the market in your area is like, you have not done this before so you have no way to train a salesperson. I just wonder about the time and effort put into this - so much work and what if the best you can get for such a site is $500 or so?
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    • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
      Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

      I agree it may be easier to "rent" the site or sell it outright

      I still maintain that few local biz will pay $15000 for a website and I think the guy who wrote this is full of it.
      If you choose a market that has customers with a LTV of $100 and only generating a few each month, then yeah. So, choose markets and keywords wisely.

      Anyone who pays that for a website will have totally custom stuff, not some generic wordpress site put together by people who are "new" at it...let's get real here.
      The value is solely based upon numbers of leads and sales it generates, not the functionality. Probably a good idea to include some form submission so that it emails information from a visitor requesting something along with NAP.

      And this is NOT going to sell itself - you will have to get out there and cold call, email , maybe send snail mail and/or walk in doors. At least in the beginning...you can't get someone to "do it for you" as you do not really know what the market in your area is like, you have not done this before so you have no way to train a salesperson. I just wonder about the time and effort put into this
      Nothing sells itself. There is always someone or some business system that either sets something in motion that goes viral and takes on a life of its own, or there is a consistent sales process applied over time.

      To be fair, there is about 30 minutes of video on the sales aspect of this particular course. Its thin but there are some ideas that are very focused on the flip sale that can apply, and it's specific to phone sales.

      so much work and what if the best you can get for such a site is $500 or so?
      Again, if you choose niche and keywords poorly then you will limit the overall value of the asset. Targeting customers with high LTV will allow you to position the price much higher.
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    Oh please ......I recently saw one of these sites.....the guy spammed many biz on facebook in "his" niche....with a stupid site that looks like something from 2005...stock photos, header, some plr articles,
    all the "sign up here" forms that the gurus taught him to use

    it looked like crap....I told him to take his 14 fans on facebook and shove off

    I sometimes wonder how many here actually work with local biz, small biz owners? Don't underestimate their smarts.

    If you want to rank and rent or sell or whatever...do it,come back and show us you made $15,000 but please please spare us a "fivver" testimony

    IMHO there might have been some people who made/make money doing this, but they probably are quick at putting these sites together and slick about selling them and I bet they don't sell them for $15000. What I really think - they make their real money selling this dream to people like the spammer with his stock/generic site and his 14 fans.


    Sometimes you have to get real - face it..if a guy made all this money, had the secret to success, why would he sell it here for 27 bucks?
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  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
    The past 7 days position rank has danced around and has remained right about at 36th overall. Again, I did't do any significant backlinking, just the citations and onpage optimization.

    Edit: forgot to mention that all of the pages are indexed by google as of now. The site is basically structured:

    Index.html
    Legal.html
    Privacy.html
    ThankYou.html
    (contact form is a popup and writes send me an email)
    sitemap.xml
    Blog(subdir)
    -article1 (linked to index.html, article 2/3)
    -article2 (linked to index.html, article 1/3)
    -article3 (linked to index.html, article 1/2)

    That's about it really.

    This past weekend I added 3 originally written keyword-optimized articles and did a bunch of internal linking between them and the homepage. I really don't know if that will do much of anything unless they are linked to somewhere else. I've been mulling over ways to generate purely whitehat generated backlinks, but hesitant to jump into any significant effort. Not sure, I may try and shop around the content I just created so far but I know that can become a time-sucker really quickly.

    It's still not ranking high enough to generate any calls but the effort so far has been well worth it. I've approached this as a side project and a way to learn by doing, in my spare time, and my expectations were quite low. However, I've managed to learn a TON and have found additional resources for building quality niche sites that are far more comprehensive than what this original course was. My plan is to continue with the current site (it's only been 2 weeks!) but I have also started to build a niche site focused on actual product sales that I intend to keep.
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  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
    Last check for the day and.... I've hit the #1 spot for my exact match keyword.

    ...on Bing

    It's 5th on Yahoo search.

    The site for this particular long tail keyword is currently 44th in Google SERPs and is only a FRACTION of the traffic in Bing. So, have some work to do still

    I'm probably going to seek out some backlinking opportunities, but again I just don't have the time to fully commit. But it might be just what is needed to get me moving on google. I'll probably just see what happens next week before commiting to anything else.
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  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    This seems relevant and adaptable to what you're doing, James. RE: back lining and keywords on Youtube. Google hangouts is mentioned as well cause, gee, it's a Google product so it will rank.


    http://source-wave.com/video/1-milli...be-amazon-seo/
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  • Profile picture of the author Highway55
    jamesfreddyc, good info. Very interesting experiment so far...
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    • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
      Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

      jamesfreddyc, good info. Very interesting experiment so far...
      I'm considering using a resource to generate the backling. Of course I'm really hesitant but it's not just a random fiverr gig and I've seen their process. the site is such a small fish and i can see the top 10 competitors for the keywords are using pbn's to backlink, so it may be a necessary evil to get it moving and competitive.
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      • Profile picture of the author Highway55
        Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

        I'm considering using a resource to generate the backling. Of course I'm really hesitant but it's not just a random fiverr gig and I've seen their process. the site is such a small fish and i can see the top 10 competitors for the keywords are using pbn's to backlink, so it may be a necessary evil to get it moving and competitive.
        I wouldn't go that far yet. If I were you - and you care about not being de-indexed - I would build some tier 1 web 2.0 themed properties on Blogger, Wordpress.com, Tumblr, Youtube.com, Slideshare, Dailymotion, etc... and link to your site from them.

        Then I would buy fiver links to those properties -

        This would give your site some juice, while still protecting it.
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        • Profile picture of the author DABK
          You might also want to build a couple of sites in related niches, do to them what you've done to this site, and link from them to your current site.
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        • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
          Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

          I wouldn't go that far yet. If I were you - and you care about not being de-indexed - I would build some tier 1 web 2.0 themed properties on Blogger, Wordpress.com, Tumblr, Youtube.com, Slideshare, Dailymotion, etc... and link to your site from them.

          Then I would buy fiver links to those properties -

          This would give your site some juice, while still protecting it.
          I've done this for Youtube & FB per the guidance in the course. Main site hasn't been backlinked to yet and I may hold off or perhaps do something like what DABK suggests.

          On a side note: It's very frustrating that GoogleWebmaster and BingWebmaster stats are always a few days behind the current date. It's really difficult to have to wait to see any effects of changes, updates or additions I've made to the site!
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          • Profile picture of the author Highway55
            Google has little respect for new domains trying to rank. I have a domain I registered in March and have been pushing for a very difficult local keyword - bouncing around page 4 right now... takes time...

            Also takes time for Google to find links, and give them credibility.
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            • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
              Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

              Google has little respect for new domains trying to rank. I have a domain I registered in March and have been pushing for a very difficult local keyword - bouncing around page 4 right now... takes time...

              Also takes time for Google to find links, and give them credibility.
              Keyword research is a whole other topic that wasn't fully vetted out in the material but i learned enough to understand the choices you make at this stage will have big influence on the time required to rank. Competition research WAS covered and goes hand in hand with the previous step. Both should not be skimmed over and are critical to making a successful move.

              ....these things are part of "seo" IMO, if you view the overall goal: "rank, gen some calls, sell the site".

              I'm still not entirely certain if my choices were wise but is part of the learning.
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    What am I missing here....?? I thought this "wso" was .....rank in 4 hours and sell the site for $15000...
    with a 100% closing rate....and the naked Eastern European gal gives her testimony too

    How are you doing at selling this site or "renting" it to an actual business owner? Is it bringing in leads?

    I don't doubt that there might be some viable info on seo in that report but really for a newbie to think they are going to sell sites for $15000 is such a crock. Reality is like a cold shower in this macho land of dreams IMHO
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    • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
      Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

      What am I missing here....??
      Just about everything.
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      • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
        Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

        Just about everything.

        Just about "everything"??? Huh? I thought this wso was golden....rank in 4 hours, sell for $15000....100% closing rate....I'm a freaking queen on the phone but I never had a 100% closing rate ....so where is the sale and the $15000?

        again.what am I missing here?
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        • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
          Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

          Just about "everything"??? Huh? I thought this wso was golden....rank in 4 hours, sell for $15000....100% closing rate....I'm a freaking queen on the phone but I never had a 100% closing rate ....so where is the sale and the $15000?

          again.what am I missing here?
          That you are completely ignorant of just about everything that I've said all along.
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          • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
            Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

            That you are completely ignorant of just about everything that I've said all along.
            Completely ignorant? Nuh

            this thread - start from the beginning....was "should I buy this wso to rank a site quick and sell it for $15000"..

            if you want to play with seo there are many ways to do it and many educational methods

            regarding this MONEY MAKER SCHEME/PLAN/COURSE OR WHATEVER YOU CALL IT...apparently it does not work

            no site ranked in 4 hours, sold for $15000 with closing rate of 100%

            The fact these guys get away with this is that they are simply not raking in the bucks like the Wolf of Wall Street or William McCorkle did.....part of the reason he went to prison over fake testimonials - it would be interesting to verify the naked gal's video LOL
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            • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
              Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

              Completely ignorant? Nuh

              this thread - start from the beginning....was "should I buy this wso to rank a site quick and sell it for $15000"..

              if you want to play with seo there are many ways to do it and many....
              Yes you are being ignorant of my comments, which have been very consistent since my first one. I'm sorry if you don't have the capacity to understand and follow along, that's your fault and you can re-read at your own speed.

              In case you missed it, I'm going thru the motions to:

              1. Go from total seo newb to having a base of understanding.

              2. To take what I've learned to better identify additional resources and information about seo.

              3. To show what a real attempt, not a testimonial, looks like.

              All 3 have been achieved regardless of your disruptions. And none have anything to do with the claims made by the authors.
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              • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
                Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

                Yes you are being ignorant of my comments, which have been very consistent since my first one. I'm sorry if you don't have the capacity to understand and follow along, that's your fault and you can re-read at your own speed.

                In case you missed it, I'm going thru the motions to:

                1. Go from total seo newb to having a base of understanding.

                2. To take what I've learned to better identify additional resources and information about seo.

                3. To show what a real attempt, not a testimonial, looks like.

                All 3 have been achieved regardless of your disruptions. And none have anything to do with the claims made by the authors.
                So the answer to the original question is - NO don't bother to buy this if you think that you will quickly and easily make money and sell sites for $15000
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                • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
                  Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

                  So the answer to the original question is - NO don't bother to buy this if you think that you will quickly and easily make money and sell sites for $15000
                  That's been the message all along.
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  • Profile picture of the author zoro
    I'm still getting emails from WarriorPlus about this site flipping course of Mario's. Except the price has now gone down from $27 to $9. I have not bought it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Highway55
    It's WSO again of the day with Kenny Cannon and the crew! Mike Lantz doesn't care - he's making money, too!
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    • Profile picture of the author zoro
      Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

      It's WSO again of the day with Kenny Cannon and the crew! Mike Lantz doesn't care - he's making money, too!
      Yes, it keeps on getting WSO of the day and the price is now lower. I wonder if the course now offered for just $9.00 is just a fraction of the original course.?

      I wonder if anyone has bought it, implemented the course as per their instructions, and made money from it?
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      • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
        Originally Posted by zoro View Post

        Yes, it keeps on getting WSO of the day and the price is now lower. I wonder if the course now offered for just $9.00 is just a fraction of the original course.?

        I wonder if anyone has bought it, implemented the course as per their instructions, and made money from it?
        That's what I've been commenting on this whole time. I have implemented just about everything in the material that was presented in the seo portion. However, I have been adding additional content (pages) focused on the keyword(s) I am targeting, which was not in the material but is info I've found at other resources (specifically from nichepursuits and a particular podcast that interviewed Claire Smith, who is pretty darn successful ranking her niche sites without ANY backlinks. It's all done with good keyword research, decision making and consistently adding content).

        I think there was some Google algo stuff getting implemented over the weekend because I noticed that my page jumped to the #1 spot for my long tail keyword on the 16th. It was brief and returned to the 25th position where I am at today (which is page 3).



        Overall it's an upward trend in position. Still not sure if I will reach 1st page. Again, what I've learned since this attempt is big for my own level of knowledge and well worth the $9 or whatever I paid, but I knew going into this that it would probably be a bit more work.
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        • Profile picture of the author trevstar22
          I Got the course that Mario and Cameron were selling. I thought it might be hype, but then I remembered
          the webinar that Alex Becker of Source Wave did. Alex who I totally respect and who has given away enough free material for 100 WSO. Alex said that he and his partners are making an absolute killing ranking sites
          like mobiledentrepairmiami or plano rhinoplasty, selling them for thousands! This is after the sites are set up and getting calls. Alex (remember this is free info he gave on the webinar) has said time and time again this is the easiest money on the internet and he makes millions a year. A site like Plano rhinoplasty
          did not take more than 3 comment backlinks to rank because it is has so few searches. But even though
          it only gets a few calls, a doctor will pay thousands for that site to get those calls! Actually, I do not think
          it is as easy as he says because many people would not even begin to have the sales skills to approach a doc and sell them a site for thousands, but it seems easy to those who have those skills.
          I may have my doubts about "Mario" but he says he is only good at two things. Fishing and sales
          and I tend to believe him when he says he sells these sites. He is an absolute SHARK on the phone
          no question about that.
          But guys do yourself a BIG favor go over to source-wave.com and scroll down and check out the FREE
          videos. Your mouth will be hanging open. Check out the Italian SEO trick, you will LOVE it!
          Some of Beckers claims make Marios look tame, but Becker is for REAL!

          Trevor
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          • Profile picture of the author DABK
            I don't know anything about Mario. I agree about Becker.

            I looked up Plano Rhinoplasty. The 1st site is this: findrhinoplastysurgeons.com/rhinoplasty-surgery-plano/#

            This is some 30% if the content on the homepage: Rhinoplasty Surgery Plano

            Email Us At: Rent@findrhinoplastysurgeons.com to rent this page

            In the search results, they misspelled Rhinoplasty (Rhinplasty, though.

            I wonder if he's rented it out since they made it in 2013 and the tenant moved out or he's still trying to rent it.

            Or if he made the site just to show he can rank it.

            But, at ranking, Becker's good.



            Originally Posted by trevstar22 View Post

            I Got the course that Mario and Cameron were selling. I thought it might be hype, but then I remembered
            the webinar that Alex Becker of Source Wave did. Alex who I totally respect and who has given away enough free material for 100 WSO. Alex said that he and his partners are making an absolute killing ranking sites
            like mobiledentrepairmiami or plano rhinoplasty, selling them for thousands! This is after the sites are set up and getting calls. Alex (remember this is free info he gave on the webinar) has said time and time again this is the easiest money on the internet and he makes millions a year. A site like Plano rhinoplasty
            did not take more than 3 comment backlinks to rank because it is has so few searches. But even though
            it only gets a few calls, a doctor will pay thousands for that site to get those calls! Actually, I do not think
            it is as easy as he says because many people would not even begin to have the sales skills to approach a doc and sell them a site for thousands, but it seems easy to those who have those skills.
            I may have my doubts about "Mario" but he says he is only good at two things. Fishing and sales
            and I tend to believe him when he says he sells these sites. He is an absolute SHARK on the phone
            no question about that.
            But guys do yourself a BIG favor go over to source-wave.com and scroll down and check out the FREE
            videos. Your mouth will be hanging open. Check out the Italian SEO trick, you will LOVE it!
            Some of Beckers claims make Marios look tame, but Becker is for REAL!

            Trevor
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          • Profile picture of the author zoro
            Originally Posted by trevstar22 View Post

            I Got the course that Mario and Cameron were selling. I thought it might be hype, but then I remembered
            the webinar that Alex Becker of Source Wave did. Alex who I totally respect and who has given away enough free material for 100 WSO. Alex said that he and his partners are making an absolute killing ranking sites
            like mobiledentrepairmiami or plano rhinoplasty, selling them for thousands! This is after the sites are set up and getting calls. Alex (remember this is free info he gave on the webinar) has said time and time again this is the easiest money on the internet and he makes millions a year. A site like Plano rhinoplasty
            did not take more than 3 comment backlinks to rank because it is has so few searches. But even though
            it only gets a few calls, a doctor will pay thousands for that site to get those calls! Actually, I do not think
            it is as easy as he says because many people would not even begin to have the sales skills to approach a doc and sell them a site for thousands, but it seems easy to those who have those skills.
            I may have my doubts about "Mario" but he says he is only good at two things. Fishing and sales
            and I tend to believe him when he says he sells these sites. He is an absolute SHARK on the phone
            no question about that.
            But guys do yourself a BIG favor go over to source-wave.com and scroll down and check out the FREE
            videos. Your mouth will be hanging open. Check out the Italian SEO trick, you will LOVE it!
            Some of Beckers claims make Marios look tame, but Becker is for REAL!

            Trevor
            So you say you bought it, but then you say go look at someone's else s course, what? How about letting us know if you thought this course by Mario was any good and if you've ranked your site ?
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            • Profile picture of the author savidge4
              Originally Posted by zoro View Post

              So you say you bought it, but then you say go look at someone's else s course, what? How about letting us know if you thought the course was any good and if you've ranked your site ?
              You want to rank a site and don't really have an idea of how to do it? you go spend the time and watch Becker. You watch his stuff enough you will hear the name "Kotton Grammer" Go into Google and type "Tokyo SEO" and who has the top 2 spots? try "Chicago SEO" or "St Louis SEO" and guess who is in the #1 position? Kotton Grammer.

              Sure a bunch of how Kotton is where he is - is not revealed in Beckers videos ( It is revealed fairly transparently from the OMG mailing list and videocast's ) but there is MORE than enough revealed in Beckers videos to make it worth your while.

              I don't know who Mario is.. cant say anything about him.. but you look at OMG, Becker, Kotton, Fletcher, Mike Long ( Nashville SEO - and a member of OMG ) and it is very clear this stuff is not all smoke and mirrors. Even at half the truth anything you pick up from these guys is worth it. And the truth is like I say these guys are really pretty transparent in what they do and how they do it.

              And yes.. they do offer training material.. wouldn't call it WSO type material.. its a hefty $6000 or so.
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            • Profile picture of the author trevstar22
              Originally Posted by zoro View Post

              So you say you bought it, but then you say go look at someone's else s course, what? How about letting us know if you thought the course was any good and if you've ranked your site ?
              Hi Zoro.
              The course is rather overwhelming, you have Mario saying you can build a Site set up
              for PPC and and sell it with a 100 percent closing rate for $500 minumum. He said he
              always sells his, not right away in many cases, but he just goes down the the list of
              businesses in that niche in the search engines and calls them one by one till it is sold.
              He tells you how to get sites into google places so that your phone
              number is up there on the first page with leads coming in big time so you can sell
              that site for at least $1,000 minumum. He says a lot more. The thing is he does not
              have the best reputation and I know he and Cameron tend to cut corners ethically.
              However as I pointed out Alex Becker says some of the same things
              that Mario does and in fact makes even bigger claims and Becker is solid.
              If fact, I wonder if Mario and Cameron got their ideas from Becker.
              There are many detailed videos in the course PLUS he has videos from the
              previous course so there is a lot to go through and I haven't had time to go through them
              all, much less build a site. T

              You want the bottom line?
              Some of it makes sense. If you have a site on page one of google that is
              on google places or local or whatever they call it now, you are going to get calls
              and leads and that site should sell. So yes, I think this will work. HOWEVER,
              guys like Mario tend to forget that not everybody is a PHONE SHARK.
              You listern to this guy and you realise he could sell barbecue grills to eskimos
              so if you don't feel like calling up businesses to sell your site it may
              not be that easy. Mario suggested hire a telemarketer for $100.
              So, yes there is probably some value to this course, but you must take your
              phone selling skills into account before you go into this.
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              • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
                Originally Posted by trevstar22 View Post

                Hi Zoro.


                You want the bottom line?
                Some of it makes sense. If you have a site on page one of google that is
                on google places or local or whatever they call it now, you are going to get calls
                and leads and that site should sell. So yes, I think this will work. HOWEVER,
                guys like Mario tend to forget that not everybody is a PHONE SHARK.
                You listern to this guy and you realise he could sell barbecue grills to eskimos
                so if you don't feel like calling up businesses to sell your site it may
                not be that easy. Mario suggested hire a telemarketer for $100.
                So, yes there is probably some value to this course, but you must take your
                phone selling skills into account before you go into this.
                (snip)

                Hi Trevstar...

                I so agree and this is something I pointed out from the start

                Bottom line is you are going to have to be able to sell the site..

                that means...you will have to cold call....walk in doors....and or find lists of prospects to email and to snail mail

                So we are talking - you will need skills to set the site up....get it "ranked"...

                then you need sales skills to sell it...(and to look good your own website, business cards, printed materials)

                all for speculation that you will sell this site

                the "leads" often will mean nothing unless they are quickly distributed so in order to do that you will also need a call system in place.....call tracking

                and for what? $15000 sounds good but $500??

                Honestly this might be of some value to a person *maybe JamesFreddy who already designs sites and has coding skills and hopefully sales skills

                but for a newbie, this is not gonna work

                The whole thing seems deceptive to me and I have zero respect for some of these clowns. The fake names and the "fiverr" testimony should be a big tip off right from the start. If all this was so easy no one would be flippin burgers they would be flippin websites and domains and selling diet pills online

                The sad fact is lots of people with no real skills or talent get hooked on the idea of making money online (and offline) and these predators cash in on it
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              • Profile picture of the author zoro
                Originally Posted by trevstar22 View Post

                Hi Zoro.
                The course is rather overwhelming, you have Mario saying you can build a Site set up
                for PPC and and sell it with a 100 percent closing rate for $500 minumum. He said he
                always sells his, not right away in many cases, but he just goes down the the list of
                businesses in that niche in the search engines and calls them one by one till it is sold.
                He tells you how to get sites into google places so that your phone
                number is up there on the first page with leads coming in big time so you can sell
                that site for at least $1,000 minumum. He says a lot more. The thing is he does not
                have the best reputation and I know he and Cameron tend to cut corners ethically.
                However as I pointed out Alex Becker says some of the same things
                that Mario does and in fact makes even bigger claims and Becker is solid.
                If fact, I wonder if Mario and Cameron got their ideas from Becker.
                There are many detailed videos in the course PLUS he has videos from the
                previous course so there is a lot to go through and I haven't had time to go through them
                all, much less build a site. T

                You want the bottom line?
                Some of it makes sense. If you have a site on page one of google that is
                on google places or local or whatever they call it now, you are going to get calls
                and leads and that site should sell. So yes, I think this will work. HOWEVER,
                guys like Mario tend to forget that not everybody is a PHONE SHARK.
                You listern to this guy and you realise he could sell barbecue grills to eskimos
                so if you don't feel like calling up businesses to sell your site it may
                not be that easy. Mario suggested hire a telemarketer for $100.
                So, yes there is probably some value to this course, but you must take your
                phone selling skills into account before you go into this.
                Thanks Mate, appreciate your honest review.

                I may go take a look at what Becker has to offer, but for me, what got me interested originally with this course offer, was Mario's claims of minimal SEO required. I personally hate doing SEO, and last year had the Big Bad Panda knock 4 of my sites out of the universe, never to be found again...lol.
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    So I am still waiting to see people who buy this wso rank a site in "4 hours" and/or sell said site for even $1500 let alone $15000

    If these guys are doing so good why are they groveling around for 9 bucks?

    It reminds me of the old joke....a billionaire asks a beautiful classy young woman if she will go to bed with him for a million dollars.....she is shocked, reluctant..but a million?

    SHE SAYS YES....I WILL GO TO BED WITH YOU FOR A MILLION DOLLARS

    He then says, great,,...well how about I pay you $50 to go to bed with me instead?

    SHE IS ANGRY AND SAYS "WHAT KIND OF GIRL DO YOU THINK I AM"

    He replies...."we already established you are a wh//re.....now we are just negotiating the actual price"
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    • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
      Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post


      If these guys are doing so good why are they groveling around for 9 bucks?
      It's their segmentation sale to other products.
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    • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
      [QUOTE=Freebiequeen1999;10072336]If these guys are doing so good why are they groveling around for 9 bucks?


      Freebie,

      You know the answer.

      It's pretty obvious, isn't it?

      Some posters in this thread (not jfreddy)
      are here, just to pump up the hype and
      keep the sheeple interested.

      And that's obvious too.
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  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
    Trevstar, you are glossing over the fact that these $9 courses and material ARE their segmentation sales to the "big idea" to sell you on the high ticket offer.

    I've never suggested that the material will help you rank 1st page in 4hrs, and that's absurd to most of us. But i have said that there is worthwhile content (i am applying it) that will jumpstart into seo and a decent overview of quickly building a lead gen site.

    1. Most will not even do what i have done so far and will look for the next shiny object.
    2. Those who start will likely not rank because they chose an extremely competitive niche and set of keywords. Ultimately will just give up.
    3. Very few will actually use the experience gained to seek out better, more effective information about seo and figure out how to apply it.
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    • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
      I think I read that you are a coder, so you have a bit of a leg up on tech skills.

      How are you at the look pretty part?




      Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

      Trevstar, you are glossing over the fact that these $9 courses and material ARE their segmentation sales to the "big idea" to sell you on the high ticket offer.

      I've never suggested that the material will help you rank 1st page in 4hrs, and that's absurd to most of us. But i have said that there is worthwhile content (i am applying it) that will jumpstart into seo and a decent overview of quickly building a lead gen site.

      1. Most will not even do what i have done so far and will look for the next shiny object.
      2. Those who start will likely not rank because they chose an extremely competitive niche and set of keywords. Ultimately will just give up.
      3. Very few will actually use the experience gained to seek out better, more effective information about seo and figure out how to apply it.
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      • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
        Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

        I think I read that you are a coder, so you have a bit of a leg up on tech skills.

        How are you at the look pretty part?
        It's good. Just like most will just use a CMS, i will take an design from a proven source and rework it to make it my own. One thing i've done is to use a LeadPages page and extended the functionality from there. For example i will replace the email optin box with a Text optin so that i capture cell phone numbers and they recieve notifications as an option.

        Copy is my next focus. I will probably begin adding ppc component to the site since i already have a collection of landing pages from previous ppc campaigns on another site i built. Its something i can do in tandem with the seo.
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    • Profile picture of the author trevstar22
      Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

      Trevstar, you are glossing over the fact that these $9 courses and material ARE their segmentation sales to the "big idea" to sell you on the high ticket offer.

      I've never suggested that the material will help you rank 1st page in 4hrs, and that's absurd to most of us. But i have said that there is worthwhile content (i am applying it) that will jumpstart into seo and a decent overview of quickly building a lead gen site.

      1. Most will not even do what i have done so far and will look for the next shiny object.
      2. Those who start will likely not rank because they chose an extremely competitive niche and set of keywords. Ultimately will just give up.
      3. Very few will actually use the experience gained to seek out better, more effective information about seo and figure out how to apply it.
      Hi James.
      No, I am not glossing over it at all, I just do not see it as an issue. A marketer
      that has upsells, well, that is hardly a surprise. Almost every reputable marketer
      on the forum adds upsells to their products. It would be an issue if the product
      you buy is incomplete without the upsell but that is not the case here.
      I was surprised to see people saying if they are making so much money why
      are they selling this for 9 bucks. Just about every well known marketer on the
      warrior forum has their own low priced offer out there and some are making millions.
      Now don't get me wrong, I am not a huge fan of Mario and Cameron, I have a lot
      of doubts about some of their tactics. But they come up with some interesting
      ideas unlike most regurgitated WSOs out there
      I do want to make money, and if you can build a PPC site that does not
      even rank and turn around and sell it, I want to know about it. The source
      may be dubious but the info may be good. I may be setting up some sites
      soon using a cool twist on their ideas to make it much easier to rank..
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  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
    Speaking of call tracking....

    I'm amazed at the IVR feature on CallFire! How cool is that? it uses xml to build your entire phone system for processing incoming calls. You know, "press 1 for sales, 2 for tech support, etc...".

    the phone listed on my lead gen site is 100% hands off and my plan (once it starts getting calls) is to quickly hand over the lead to a local biz in the niche that i've already identified. I may gen 2-3 leads free for them before pitching anything.

    Anyway --- the calls are immediately handled and i am notified of the incoming call via email. I had no idea about CallFire before any of this so its something useful for all of my other efforts.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kate Luella
    Ok, so I do training for offline consultant training from time to time, and I've seen the mario and cameron show and their very unique training style. Most of their strategies are completely misleading and would never fly in the real world. I believe their are internet marketers only and have never sold offline. they have no offline reputation that I can see to verify they are real - a fiver testimony by a pretty woman kind of reinforces the obvious - buying their products will not make you any money, or get you any new clients.

    tbh, some of their concepts were outrageous.

    I'll leave it at that.

    I've seen Becker's work (I think I know the becker you speak of) and I loved his work. But i didnt' know he did offline marketing training... not sure.
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    • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
      Originally Posted by Kate Luella View Post

      Ok, so I do training for offline consultant training from time to time, and I've seen the mario and cameron show and their very unique training style. Most of their strategies are completely misleading and would never fly in the real world. I believe their are internet marketers only and have never sold offline. they have no offline reputation that I can see to verify they are real - a fiver testimony by a pretty woman kind of reinforces the obvious - buying their products will not make you any money, or get you any new clients.

      tbh, some of their concepts were outrageous.

      I'll leave it at that.

      I've seen Becker's work (I think I know the becker you speak of) and I loved his work. But i didnt' know he did offline marketing training... not sure.
      I don't disagree with you. I just differ in my assessment and outlook of things.

      If you take the things learned, apply them, test, seek out additional related information, adjust then re-test --- then it will be worth it. Most however just want a 1-2-3 to riches and simply unwilling to do the real work it takes to succeed at something (not just this material).

      I've taken what I've learned and gone from total newbie with zero SEO understanding to ranking a fairly high-ticket service on page 2 (today it's at 15th spot) because of the things I mentioned above. I didn't arrive there solely from the content of the course, but I used much of that material to jumpstart me into SEO, sought out additional info, implemented some things to see what works and what doesn't, then consistently worked on it. This is all spare time activity which is tough to do.
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    • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
      Originally Posted by Kate Luella View Post

      Ok, so I do training for offline consultant training from time to time, and I've seen the mario and cameron show and their very unique training style. Most of their strategies are completely misleading and would never fly in the real world. I believe their are internet marketers only and have never sold offline. they have no offline reputation that I can see to verify they are real - a fiver testimony by a pretty woman kind of reinforces the obvious - buying their products will not make you any money, or get you any new clients.

      tbh, some of their concepts were outrageous.

      I'll leave it at that.

      I've seen Becker's work (I think I know the becker you speak of) and I loved his work. But i didnt' know he did offline marketing training... not sure.
      Thanks so much for honest evaluation of some of the sludge that is promoted.

      Did you see the "fiverr" gal spouting off her praises LOL

      I feel sorry for people who get hoodwinked by these "dun for ya" deals

      On another forum here there is a woman pushing a so called crowdfunding (Ponzi) scheme who wonders why CL threw her off..she says she is broke and looking to get a few "fish" on the hook ?? Ouch...her words not mine..."fish"

      I wonder what these guys call their marks when they have a few beers and laugh it up about how they got more sales LOL
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  • Profile picture of the author Kate Luella
    I just saw his website.

    Kenny Cannon - Business Transformation Specialist | Market Dominator

    The DIVI theme logo is still on it. Seriously? I don't think so.

    No credible client portfolio, maybe a few marketers he has managed to persuade to pay him for his insights, but that's probably it.

    If he taught good quality strategies, I would be the first here to say that.
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    • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
      Originally Posted by Kate Luella View Post

      I just saw his website.

      Kenny Cannon - Business Transformation Specialist | Market Dominator

      The DIVI theme logo is still on it. Seriously? I don't think so.

      No credible client portfolio, maybe a few marketers he has managed to persuade to pay him for his insights, but that's probably it.

      If he taught good quality strategies, I would be the first here to say that.
      Kenny's site says over 12,000 businesses served. I think the number claimed was much higher
      somewhere else. Maybe web.com or homestead have served that many businesses. LOL (in a sad way)

      I think one would have to create more of an authority site to flip, or lease, to a high ticket profession
      to make anywhere near the money they claim. You could cookie cutter it though and sell nationwide
      to non-competing businesses - say a Dentist in Dallas and a different Dentist in Denver, and so on.
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      • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
        Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

        Kenny's site says over 12,000 businesses served. I think the number claimed was much higher
        somewhere else. Maybe web.com or homestead have served that many businesses. LOL (in a sad way)

        I think one would have to create more of an authority site to flip, or lease, to a high ticket profession
        to make anywhere near the money they claim. You could cookie cutter it though and sell nationwide
        to non-competing businesses - say a Dentist in Dallas and a different Dentist in Denver, and so on.
        I don't believe it has to be an authority site. It just has to be one that makes the phone ring.

        Dentists and attorneys are a good generic example but is probably too competitive to enter for most markets (even the small locales). There certainly are some high-ticket products and services that can be a good opportunity if done correctly, but definitely takes creative thinking to identify something that isn't already saturated.

        I'm convinced that specific niche and keyword decisions will determine success in this whole thing.

        I still maintain that most who buy these courses simply won't do what it takes, or even make a decent attempt to give themselves a chance to make it work. That's on them. Nothing comes easy no matter what anyone says or claims. NOTHING.
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        • Profile picture of the author Highway55
          Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post


          I'm convinced that specific niche and keyword decisions will determine success in this whole thing.
          ^^^That's the key to this whole thing.
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          • Profile picture of the author Kate Luella
            Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

            ^^^That's the key to this whole thing.
            really, you think its that easy?

            Gee, I have never found this industry that easy.

            there is so much more to offline marketing, I'd love to see someone making 6 figures from a well keyworded website. In my experience, of my peers working in this industry and consistently doing $20K months, it is a combination of so many things:

            branding, product, good communicator, hard working, smart, good level of knowledge, good marketing and sales process, and so on.

            I think anyone telling you it is as easy as 1-2-3 - has never actually done it.

            I distinctly remember someone's training, I'm not sure if it was this guy's training, but he referred to a client (saying it was his) - it was a generic logo (and business name on the generic logo) for sale for $12.

            They really do assume the listened is 100% stupid I think...
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            • Profile picture of the author Highway55
              Originally Posted by Kate Luella View Post

              really, you think its that easy?
              My comment didn't say it was easy.

              This is what I meant...

              Unless you have the patience and time to rank "tougher, higher searched" keywords - then the key to this smaller niche stuff is to build and rank several different low volume local keywords from several different service related niches and then see if you can sell them to their respective businesses.

              Then...

              Once you do sell 1or 2 for a specific niche, concentrate ONLY on that niche and go across the entire US using those sales as social proof while you sell the same (or similar) thing over and over again.

              During this time you will become an expert and it will show as you refine your ranking and sales process.

              Will it work?

              Yes, it will work "if" you're willing to put in the time and learn and be willing to fail at the beginning. You could make a great income - if you put in the time (like anything else).

              The end.
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              • Profile picture of the author zoro
                Originally Posted by Highway55 View Post

                My comment didn't say it was easy.

                This is what I meant...

                Unless you have the patience and time to rank "tougher, higher searched" keywords - then the key to this smaller niche stuff is to build and rank several different low volume local keywords from several different service related niches and then see if you can sell them to their respective businesses.

                Then...

                Once you do sell 1or 2 for a specific niche, concentrate ONLY on that niche and go across the entire US using those sales as social proof while you sell the same (or similar) thing over and over again.

                During this time you will become an expert and it will show as you refine your ranking and sales process.

                Will it work?

                Yes, it will work "if" you're willing to put in the time and learn and be willing to fail at the beginning. You could make a great income - if you put in the time (like anything else).

                The end.
                I haven't bought this course, but I have dabbled in the past with trying rank long-tailed keywords. I was reasonably successful and was getting ready to sell any leads I got from the websites to local business owners. Then one day... BAM !! Ca-POW !!! ... the BIG Bad Panda came alone, and my sites have never been found since....Lol.
                That's just another reason why I was half interested in this course and hence this thread, because from his claims, it seemed like he had found a solution to easy rankings, but clearly he has not, is what I can gather from the comments here.
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                • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                  Originally Posted by zoro View Post

                  I haven't bought this course, but I have dabbled in the past with trying rank long-tailed keywords. I was reasonably successful and was getting ready to sell any leads I got from the websites to local business owners. Then one day... BAM !! Ca-POW !!! ... the BIG Bad Panda came alone, and my sites have never been found since....Lol.
                  That's just another reason why I was half interested in this course and hence this thread, because from his claims, it seemed like he had found a solution to easy rankings, but clearly he has not, is what I can gather from the comments here.
                  a solution to easy rankings? Sounds like you already know how to do it... But you got smacked around by Panda. So basically what got you is "thin" content.

                  Thin content shows itself in really only a few ways. thin meaning very little, Duplicate content.. so it counts on the site of origin and not yours, and then there is machine generated content.

                  That's really about it.. that's what mean bad panda does, it smacks those that are not willing to write 500+ word articles ( I personally don't ever write less than 1000 words - UNLESS the target of the content is for social media, and I will do about 500 words for that )

                  So Zoro.. the question of the day.. did you ever correct the thin content issues on the 4 sites? or do they sit as they were, when they got the plug pulled? Did you know that a Panda update is due sometime soon? if its fixed.. the sites will gain rank again.
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                  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
                    Been a while since the last update and this will probably be the last one as I've gone way beyond the original SEO work and just no longer relevant to the intent of progress posts....

                    I'm currently ranking #5 position page on 1 for the original "main" keyword I had intended to rank for. A couple of other keywords are ranking in the top 10 spots too. I started at level 0 and have progressed to this place since about April 25th or so (the site was added to Webmaster Tools on 4/27/2015).

                    #1. I am still very glad to have gone thru the original steps laid out in the material. I've already explained many reasons and what I hoped to achieve outside of just ranking a website for some keywords --- I wanted to peel away some of the typical hype, employ some of the info presented and then (most importantly) use that as a base of knowledge by which I could then expand to better sources resources.

                    #2. Picking the right niche and the appropriate keywords needs to be done at the start before any domain is purchased and website building is started.

                    #3. Competition analysis needs to be done in conjunction with #2. I've separated it out because it's a whole other task that needs just as much effort as niche and keyword research, yet holds just as much weight.

                    #4. I am a programmer and I know how to rapidly stand up a site, do the on-page seo work, integrate opt-in components and everything else technical. I don't do wordpress. I started with a specific LeadPages template and expanded it A LOT from it's original state.

                    #5. Content was created manually as well as purchased (iWriter). The purchased content required revision by me.

                    #6. CallFire is damn awesome. That IVR dealeo is slick and can really help to filter and automate the incoming calls.

                    #7. SEO is an ongoing process, results (including the time it takes to rank) is very much dependent on #2, #3 and THEN onpage (#4) and (#5).

                    #8. Webmaster tools must be learned. Creating and submitting sitemaps, robots.txt files and some other things require some knowledge collection.

                    #9. The nichepursuits and incomebully blogs are great resources that provide both specific tactics as well as conceptual ideas that have been a tremendous help.

                    There's a ton more I could list but I'm tired and focused on other things. What I would say one of more important lessons is that if you show this community your action and desire, you will get assistance ---- I say that because there are a couple of forum members in this section that offered advice thru PM's, I implemented that advice and I'm convinced it influenced the speed and quality of the rankings I am seeing. I mean I just get a PM out of the blue and strike up a conversation. That probably wouldn't occur unless I am/was serious about doing this thing and not just "trying" some WSO --- I've done some significant work to self educate.

                    They know who they are and I am saying a big THANK YOU. I appreciate that assistance and offer to help. The concepts and specific instructions were well received and I took the action necessary to understand them and implement them as it was a bit more advanced than what is offered in the material.

                    There ya go.
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                    • Profile picture of the author zoro
                      Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

                      Been a while since the last update and this will probably be the last one as I've gone way beyond the original SEO work and just no longer relevant to the intent of progress posts....

                      I'm currently ranking #5 position page on 1 for the original "main" keyword I had intended to rank for. A couple of other keywords are ranking in the top 10 spots too. I started at level 0 and have progressed to this place since about April 25th or so (the site was added to Webmaster Tools on 4/27/2015).

                      #1. I am still very glad to have gone thru the original steps laid out in the material. I've already explained many reasons and what I hoped to achieve outside of just ranking a website for some keywords --- I wanted to peel away some of the typical hype, employ some of the info presented and then (most importantly) use that as a base of knowledge by which I could then expand to better sources resources.

                      #2. Picking the right niche and the appropriate keywords needs to be done at the start before any domain is purchased and website building is started.

                      #3. Competition analysis needs to be done in conjunction with #2. I've separated it out because it's a whole other task that needs just as much effort as niche and keyword research, yet holds just as much weight.

                      #4. I am a programmer and I know how to rapidly stand up a site, do the on-page seo work, integrate opt-in components and everything else technical. I don't do wordpress. I started with a specific LeadPages template and expanded it A LOT from it's original state.

                      #5. Content was created manually as well as purchased (iWriter). The purchased content required revision by me.

                      #6. CallFire is damn awesome. That IVR dealeo is slick and can really help to filter and automate the incoming calls.

                      #7. SEO is an ongoing process, results (including the time it takes to rank) is very much dependent on #2, #3 and THEN onpage (#4) and (#5).

                      #8. Webmaster tools must be learned. Creating and submitting sitemaps, robots.txt files and some other things require some knowledge collection.

                      #9. The nichepursuits and incomebully blogs are great resources that provide both specific tactics as well as conceptual ideas that have been a tremendous help.

                      There's a ton more I could list but I'm tired and focused on other things. What I would say one of more important lessons is that if you show this community your action and desire, you will get assistance ---- I say that because there are a couple of forum members in this section that offered advice thru PM's, I implemented that advice and I'm convinced it influenced the speed and quality of the rankings I am seeing. I mean I just get a PM out of the blue and strike up a conversation. That probably wouldn't occur unless I am/was serious about doing this thing and not just "trying" some WSO --- I've done some significant work to self educate.

                      They know who they are and I am saying a big THANK YOU. I appreciate that assistance and offer to help. The concepts and specific instructions were well received and I took the action necessary to understand them and implement them as it was a bit more advanced than what is offered in the material.

                      There ya go.
                      Awesome update, thanks Mate!.

                      Currently I am doing research on best niches I could go after with low competition and reasonable search volume. I use the Adwords tool to see how many monthly searches and if there is much Ads competition. My current thinking is to Rent pages on my blog once I've found the right niche. I have a basic knowledge of SEO and will utilize that along with some paid traffic.
                      Once again, I thank you for all of you updates and wish you good luck with your venture.

                      PS: I too have received PM'S from a couple of warriors who offered me some great suggestions and ideas. They know who they are and they deserve a Big Thank You.
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                      • Profile picture of the author animal44
                        Well done James.

                        Especially for ignoring the "expert" naysayers. "Expert" sales people who can't sell a website for more than $500.

                        Have you heard of silo structures? You should be able to rank a local site quickly and easily just with decent content and internal linking.

                        Rental and selling leads are both fraught. With an outright sale, you get a lump sum, no arguments over individual leads, and the possibility of upselling maintenance and SEO and other services. If you just rent or sell leads, you'd have to do the maintenance and SEO anyway.

                        I saw the early OMG and I wouldn't touch their methods. I don't think I've seen the WSO mention by OP.
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                        • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
                          Originally Posted by animal44 View Post

                          Well done James.

                          Have you heard of silo structures? You should be able to rank a local site quickly and easily just with decent content and internal linking.
                          Yes. I wish I had known prior to starting, but that is a perfect example of using the original material as a launch board into other resources that provide additional information. There are some specific things to do for ranking locally, but adding SILO to the setup seems to help.
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                      • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
                        Originally Posted by zoro View Post

                        Awesome update, thanks Mate!.

                        Currently I am doing research on best niches I could go after with low competition and reasonable search volume. I use the Adwords tool to see how many monthly searches and if there is much Ads competition. My current thinking is to Rent pages on my blog once I've found the right niche. I have a basic knowledge of SEO and will utilize that along with some paid traffic.
                        Once again, I thank you for all of you updates and wish you good luck with your venture.

                        PS: I too have received PM'S from a couple of warriors who offered me some great suggestions and ideas. They know who they are and they deserve a Big Thank You.
                        From what I can tell those avg mo search volumes should only be used as a general guide. If you run an actual ppc campaign you get to see actual impressions --- because i added a ppc section to my lead gen site i was able to go thru this.

                        I am still running that campaign and doing split testing with the copy.
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                      • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                        Originally Posted by zoro View Post

                        Currently I am doing research on best niches I could go after with low competition and reasonable search volume. I use the Adwords tool to see how many monthly searches and if there is much Ads competition.
                        I understand why people do this. its seems logical and it some ways it makes sense. But the time tested reality is, it is probably the least effective method to finding terms that pay, let alone professions to target that would be willing to pay.

                        For the most part anymore I do not use "tools" in my keyword research. as I will explain below there simply is no reason to. Google itself is the only tool you really need. Once you understand what Google does, and how it does it I promise you will never look at another tool again.

                        I go into Google and search a Core term say "chiropractor" and I look at 2 things and 2 things only on the page. The results number in the top left of the search results and then all the way to the bottom I look at "Searches Related"

                        So in Google USA there are 27,200,000 matches and in Google AU there is 22,900,000 matches. This is the number of pages that make reference to this term. 22 million is for all practical purposes a term that is high Competition. ( I say practical, because for myself.. this is a number I like to play in after developing the steps below. - A term such as "xbox" with 294,000,000 results is what I consider "high" volume" LOL )

                        So after looking at that number as I said I look at related terms. In USA results there is nothing that says hey I might be of interest. however in AU results there is the term "chiropractor vs physiotherapist" and if I click on that I see the results drop down to 61,700 pages. This would go on my target list. - anything less than 1 million for sure goes on my list.

                        Again for each term you click to, you want to look at the "Searches related" section and keep a list terms to look at and as you go click on terms to see what type of page volume or competition there is. You might want to also keep track of which pages have ads on them. - I don't personally, but if you are going to target select terms this is one of those slight indicators there is more traffic for that term - but the flip side is it may not be a true indicator.

                        So back to the primary term "Chiropractor". My next search after that us usually "Chiropractor <insert city>" and then followed up with "Chiropractor <insert city and state>". For USA terms, <insert city and state> is a Google default in the auto fill. There is going to be more traffic there. Experience has shown me that <insert city> is usually not that far behind - BUT they are in un themselves 2 different terms. You would think that ranking for the longer term <insert city and state> would produce equal results for both terms.. that simply is not the case. One will rank higher than the other if you are trying to use a single piece of content to rank this.

                        AU is a bit different in the "state" portion that we use in the states. There is a tendency to have terms such as Northside and Southside or West Shore or North Shore etc. There is also the twist of using the major metro area in a term and then adding the more specific community such as "Chiropractor Brisbane new farm" An interesting thing I noticed is "Chiropractor Sydney" there are no top ads. - again using ad data can be convoluted.

                        So you keep going with this and you can quickly develop a pretty decent list of terms "Sports Chiropractor" or "Chiropractor open on Sunday" all kinds of stuff.

                        So why does this work? The part that has to be understood is what Google is giving you... those "related terms" on the bottom ( and the auto fill terms for that matter ) they aren't just blind suggestions, they are the output of "data" that suggested based on the term you type, these ARE the terms used MOST to narrow down a search. - In the case of auto fill, they are immediately suggesting "Chiropractor <insert city state>" so not only are they offering terms that are used most, but they are geo targeting the plausible suggestions to get you ( the searcher ) better results.

                        On the SEO provider side of this, if you want to get real "Technical" and collect the best possible set of terms I might suggest using a GEO specific proxy server to create your list. How terms play out in West Virginia.. may differ from those that are geo specific in Sydney Australia ( and I can tell you YES there is a difference )

                        Hope that Helps!
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                        • Profile picture of the author zoro
                          Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

                          I understand why people do this. its seems logical and it some ways it makes sense. But the time tested reality is, it is probably the least effective method to finding terms that pay, let alone professions to target that would be willing to pay.

                          So why does this work? The part that has to be understood is what Google is giving you... those "related terms" on the bottom ( and the auto fill terms for that matter ) they aren't just blind suggestions, they are the output of "data" that suggested based on the term you type, these ARE the terms used MOST to narrow down a search. - In the case of auto fill, they are immediately suggesting "Chiropractor <insert city state>" so not only are they offering terms that are used most, but they are geo targeting the plausible suggestions to get you ( the searcher ) better results.

                          On the SEO provider side of this, if you want to get real "Technical" and collect the best possible set of terms I might suggest using a GEO specific proxy server to create your list. How terms play out in West Virginia.. may differ from those that are geo specific in Sydney Australia ( and I can tell you YES there is a difference )

                          Hope that Helps!
                          Thanks Mate! Great SEO Tips and Suggestions.

                          I did already know about the Google search suggestion drop down, and also about the related search terms at the bottom. However, when I collect a long tail search term that I think might be a good keyword and will not have too much competition, like for example ie, "Chiropractor Brisbane Northside Open 24 hrs", the Google keyword tool shows NIL search results. So, to me, if there's no one searching for that term, its not likely my website would get much traffic.
                          Perhaps you know a way around this?
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                          • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
                            Originally Posted by zoro View Post

                            However, when I collect a long tail search term that I think might be a good keyword and will not have too much competition, like for example ie, "Chiropractor Brisbane Northside Open 24 hrs", the Google keyword tool shows NIL search results. So, to me, if there's no one searching for that term, its not likely my website would get much traffic.
                            Perhaps you know a way around this?
                            Right but "Chiropractor Brisbane Northside" does get some volume.

                            Go listen to the podcast on nichepursuits that had interviewed Claire Smith. I got a lot out of that one because she details quite a bit on her process for choosing niches to go after and her approach to keyword research. It's surprisingly simple and apparently she doesn't do any link building at all -- the ranking comes from really good prep work and content development.

                            For example applying a portion of her approach using the allintitle would indicate that searchers are starved for content with a "Chiropractor Brisbane Northside" keyword. There were a couple of consecutive 170 avg mo searches in March/April for that keyword, yet only 9 results for allintitle:Chiropractor Brisbane Northside --- there's more searches then there are optimized content available. That's possibly an opportunity to rank some pages!

                            Also, there are a few really good detailed posts on nichepursuits too that go into the specifics of picking niches, competition analysis, keyword research, etc... you just can't skim over that stuff.

                            I don't claim to be an expert by any means but I just got a ton of information, all for free at that blog that really fast-tracked my own development and overall effort.

                            IncomeBully (IamNameLess's blog) has some good info as well specific to local ranking. Although I can understand how you might have to adapt to your own locale/country.
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                          • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                            Originally Posted by zoro View Post

                            Thanks Mate! Great SEO Tips and Suggestions.

                            I did already know about the Google search suggestion drop down, and also about the related search terms at the bottom. However, when I collect a long tail search term that I think might be a good keyword and will not have too much competition, like for example ie, "Chiropractor Brisbane Northside Open 24 hrs", the Google keyword tool shows NIL search results. So, to me, if there's no one searching for that term, its not likely my website would get much traffic.
                            So let me throw a term at you to go look up: "Mystile Theme" only 32,000 pages show up in Google USA. This happens to be a core term very near and dear to me. in that term alone I have 2 out of the 10 listings. if you look at "Mystile CSS" I have spots 1,2 and 4 in the top 10.

                            Now here is where this gets interesting... that Wordpress theme has been downloaded more than 1,000,000 times. and that site uploadwp.com draws dang near 50,000 visitors a month. So a "nil" is meaningless to me in Adwords.

                            Let me throw this at you now. if for example the term "Chiropractor Brisbane Northside" pulls you 100 visitors a month and 3% or 3 in this case convert into a lead for you.. not to bad. what happens if "Chiropractor Brisbane Northside Open 24 hrs" only gets 10 visitors a month... BUT you convert 100% of the traffic? which would you rather have?

                            SEO is not about picking 10 terms and running with it. its about diving into 100 200 and 300+ deep to get the full spectrum of traffic. the good the bad the ugly. There are reasons to get traffic for traffics sake. there are obvious reasons to get targeted traffic. SEO if done correctly is going to find the terms that convert by percentage GREATER than terms that pull more traffic. In many cases this digging pulls terms that not only by percentage but by the conversion numbers themselves out perform the "best" keywords.

                            Personally, I really don't play much in the "niche" segment. "Chiropractor <insert city state>" just isn't that exciting for me. I target markets like "Soccer" "Leather" "Skinny Jeans" "Television" I have a soccer site right now that is hitting top 5 listings in about 2200 searches. my keyword target list... sits at about 10,000 terms in total. the site is just over a year and a half old and I just hit 1500 pages of content mark. Again the goal ( pun not intended ) is to have 10,000 pages of content reaching every term on my list. - and not only reaching but RANKING.

                            Every term I add increases the bottom line. Basically incremental growth. I get to 3000 pages and my income from that site should double or more. When I reach 10,000 I will without question be at 5x+ where I am today. All of this work and dedication and bloody fingers from typing for an affiliate site LOL

                            Success in SEO is work.. and lots of it. In the time it takes for you to analyze a term and think about it, and figure is it worth it or not.. you could have been 500 words into writing an article already. EVERY term counts. EVERY term you target that produces 1 visitor or 3000 a month is worth it.

                            If it takes you 2 hours to write 1000 words to target a term.. and that term produces only 1 visitor a month and every month that term visitor converts. that's 12 conversions a year. that's 60 over 5 years that's 120 over 10 years. If that conversion is worth $50 to you... thats $50 a month. $600 a year. $3000 every 5 years. $6000 10 years from now. And that's just one term.. what if you hit 50 of those? Can you afford to leave a stone unturned?

                            Originally Posted by zoro View Post

                            Perhaps you know a way around this?
                            Not that I have to answer this at this point. the way around it, is right through it. There are no short cuts in SEO success.
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                            • Profile picture of the author tryinhere
                              Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

                              Personally, I really don't play much in the "niche" segment. "Chiropractor <insert city state>" just isn't that exciting for me. I target markets like "Soccer" "Leather" "Skinny Jeans" "Television" I have a soccer site right now that is hitting top 5 listings in about 2200 searches. my keyword target list... sits at about 10,000 terms in total. the site is just over a year and a half old and I just hit 1500 pages of content mark. Again the goal ( pun not intended ) is to have 10,000 pages of content reaching every term on my list. - and not only reaching but RANKING.
                              That is some serious long term work there, on average it seems 1,000 terms a year, giving this project a time span of ten years to complete at its current rate. Most people here have a 10 day / 10 minute time span.

                              Do you plan on brining in paid writers to help speed this process or is it all ball and chain hard yacka by yourself.
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                              • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                                Originally Posted by tryinhere View Post

                                That is some serious long term work there, on average it seems 1,000 terms a year, giving this project a time span of ten years to complete at its current rate. Most people here have a 10 day / 10 minute time span.

                                Do you plan on brining in paid writers to help speed this process or is it all ball and chain hard yacka by yourself.
                                I think most all of my projects are in the long term development long term growth category. I am not big on outside labor. On that project in particular I do have my oldest son that writes a bit. But its not about cant afford it or not wanting to get it done faster...

                                Its about the voice of the site... There are some blogs I follow that the Owner / author have gone to paid content.. and it shows. I don't want to read content from a person that knows nothing, on a site that the owner is an authority. make sense? I have been there done that myself and it falls apart.

                                I look at content writing a bit different than most. I see it as the voice of the site. I see it as the #1 traffic bringer of the site. I see it as the #1 retention variable on the site. I see it as the most valuable asset of the site. You don't get multiple pieces of content in the top 10 of search terms by accident. There is a whole methodology behind the way I write, a mathematical equation if you will.

                                The whole "Just write naturally" thing works really well <sarcasm> the reality is it doesn't. You have to know how to load a page with the right terms and get them in the right places. Dead SEO terms like "Keyword Density" and "Keyword Proximity" are alive and well in todays SEO environment - more so than most are willing to admit, if at all. ( go over to the SEO forum and these 2 terms are rubbish to most )

                                So I write my own content... not just for that one site, but for a list of sites at this point. My wife helps... My employees help, as soon as my 6 year old can write well enough he will help. but the thing is, these people understand my requirements. And its not that I am not willing to share my "requirements", because I do. Its the fact that most wont follow them.

                                So If I send out to a writer and say I need this this this and this... It ends up taking longer to clean it up, than it does to do it from the beginning. So why bother?

                                I have said it time and again here, success is driven by the repeating of systems and structure that work. Writing happens to be one of those things. I would go as far to say in an affiliate environment, the MOST important thing you can spend your time doing is writing. - Or you can end up on freebiequeens short list for using fiverr videos and content! LOL
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                                • Profile picture of the author tryinhere
                                  Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

                                  So I write my own content... not just for that one site, but for a list of sites at this point. My wife helps... My employees help, as soon as my 6 year old can write well enough he will help. but the thing is, these people understand my requirements. And its not that I am not willing to share my "requirements", because I do. Its the fact that most wont follow them.
                                  Not many people would do or understand the long term thinking behind what your doing as it is not instant pudding and pay me a gazzilion dollars yesterday, and I am guessing the writing would fall into and run parallel with the results obtained during your keyword research.

                                  What also confuses me a little (but i would get me head around to an answer) is the work / planning that must be involved in the site design / layout structure (I have worked on lead gen / style sites but never to the depth or size that's being built here) to pull all of that work into a workable and methodology for better words to make it all fall into place, before you have even probably typed your first word must have been difficult to some degree to get down and working.

                                  I am guessing at the top of my head there is a basic site structure and a lot of feeder / capture / keyword pages that would lead into the main site structure ?

                                  All in all it is a massive task and you mention not one but multiple sites in the same idea being built.

                                  Impressive and good to read your replies / help here.
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                                  • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                                    To throw another variable in this, these are commerce sites. I personally use the prosociate plugin ( Amazon affiliate site plugin ) in conjunction with woocommerce ( all of my sites are built using wordpress ) STRUCTURE is everything.

                                    I am a H U G E fan of Silo structure. The irony is with using wordpress and woocommerce that structure is not entirely 100% possible. The moment you introduce a wordpress powered blog into the equation Silo structure is lost. the moment you bring woocommerce in, silo is lost. BOTH and its so fragmented its not even funny really. LOL ok maybe it is - well, to me it is!

                                    One of the best pages I have found to explain the overall structure is: How To Create A Silo Structure In WordPress - Scratch99 Design Even with this, Silo in wordpress is not perfect. its close, but not perfect. There are some added tricks once you are adding content that makes it a bit better, but again it will never be as dead on as if you were to be using a less database driven platform.

                                    Now when you do get in and read this article he does make some warnings. Keep in mind the likes of Amazon uses Silo structure. Google uses it all the time. most all of the big sites we use on a daily basis use it. its not black hat, its not wizardry, its structure. ( I will note you can get yourself into trouble with this like anything else if your content you use is weak - there are programs out there that create video silo's and in my opinion they are weak at best. )

                                    So if you read the article you then start to see how you start grouping by CONTEXT. The other thing done here is the development of working URL's ( he doesn't come out and say that so much ) But, do a search on Google. there are 10 results there on the first page. what do those results consist of? <hint - there is a core of 3 elements>

                                    The URL, The title, and the description. that's it.. unless it pulls schema data. So how important is it to have keywords in those 3 sections? The URL, if you have read the article, IS all about structure. so that means that 1/3 of the data shown in a Google listing, is dictated by the time and effort you place into the development of STRUCTURE.

                                    I personally use a white board and a whole bunch of stick-it notes. Its sounds crazy, but a mistake in this process today.. its not so easy to fix later. I have more than once in my life yanked a site out of Google... just to fix it and let it all re-rank again. Nerve racking to say the least.

                                    What's ironically funny with the first sentence in your post is the fact that everyone wants to build a site that will supply the income needed to feed their families take vacations etc. and you are absolutely right... it needs to be done yesterday. Rome was not built in a day, nor should a business ( nor CAN a business ). its all kinds of planning and strategy. And that's just before you open the doors! why would that process stop there?

                                    Writing is the work that continues. Spending the time to develop social media is the work that continues. Staying on top of trends - jeeze never ends. An example here of trends. I have a few UHD ( Ultra high definition 4000k ) sites. I have had them up for a while now - as in before you could buy a 4000K TV ( for less than 5 digits ). I scour every word that Samsung releases for that heads up of what the 4000K player is going to be called. It aint going to be "DVD" or "Blu-ray" that's all I know!

                                    I make more money in the 4000K market space on affiliate content providers. IE Directv and Netflix right now than I do with the actual hard product. ( and I do alright with that ) Expendables is where the real money has been, and will always be. HP don't make money on printers.. its the Ink. The fashion industry is all about expendable. where has more money been made DVD players or DVD's?

                                    So we get into positioning... getting in early... or getting in and making a name for yourself in an existing market... and how is all of this done? CONTENT! LOL

                                    Originally Posted by tryinhere View Post

                                    Not many people would do or understand the long term thinking behind what your doing as it is not instant pudding and pay me a gazzilion dollars yesterday, and I am guessing the writing would fall into and run parallel with the results obtained during your keyword research.

                                    What also confuses me a little (but i would get me head around to an answer) is the work / planning that must be involved in the site design / layout structure (I have worked on lead gen / style sites but never to the depth or size that's being built here) to pull all of that work into a workable and methodology for better words to make it all fall into place, before you have even probably typed your first word must have been difficult to some degree to get down and working.

                                    I am guessing at the top of my head there is a basic site structure and a lot of feeder / capture / keyword pages that would lead into the main site structure ?

                                    All in all it is a massive task and you mention not one but multiple sites in the same idea being built.

                                    Impressive and good to read your replies / help here.
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                                    • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
                                      Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

                                      I personally use a white board and a whole bunch of stick-it notes. Its sounds crazy, but a mistake in this process today.. its not so easy to fix later. I have more than once in my life yanked a site out of Google... just to fix it and let it all re-rank again. Nerve racking to say the least.


                                      So we get into positioning... getting in early... or getting in and making a name for yourself in an existing market... and how is all of this done? CONTENT! LOL
                                      Right on. Love the white board and post it notes, I do that ALLL the time. Especially useful for pillar content.

                                      10K posts on a site though... all by yourself... man that would 6 posts a day every day of the year for a little less than 5 years. Intense. And you also have other properties you work on, on top of that? Craziness.
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                                      • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
                                        Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

                                        Right on. Love the white board and post it notes, I do that ALLL the time. Especially useful for pillar content.

                                        10K posts on a site though... all by yourself... man that would 6 posts a day every day of the year for a little less than 5 years. Intense. And you also have other properties you work on, on top of that? Craziness.
                                        And he only works 60 hours a week -just that his weeks have two weeks in them.LOL
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                                        • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
                                          Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

                                          And he only works 60 hours a week -just that his weeks have two weeks in them.LOL
                                          I wouldn't be able to do that working 100 hours a week. LOL

                                          Savidge needs to share his adderall prescription.
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                                          • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                                            and when you all are snug in your little beds... IM STILL UP! and Im still writing. anyone need an article?


                                            ***update 5am*** that's what I thought! night kids see you in a few hours!
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                                            • Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

                                              and when you all are snug in your little beds... IM STILL UP! and Im still writing. anyone need an article?


                                              ***update 5am*** that's what I thought! night kids see you in a few hours!
                                              What's your day like? I would love to know that. I've started waking at 5am so I get much more done.

                                              Thanks for all you've shared in this thread... I'm definitely going to work on my content. Great insights on the kw research as well... I always wondered why some of the keywords I targeted got my traffic than Google's tool said they would.
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                                              • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                                                Originally Posted by Phillip Blackwell View Post

                                                What's your day like? I would love to know that. I've started waking at 5am so I get much more done.

                                                Thanks for all you've shared in this thread... I'm definitely going to work on my content. Great insights on the kw research as well... I always wondered why some of the keywords I targeted got my traffic than Google's tool said they would.
                                                I get up every morning at 7am I spend the first hour of my day with my Son. I then head into the office for 2 hours. These 2 hours are multi tasking, getting caught up with whatever got missed and doing contact list research. and this is my routine 7 days a week.

                                                The time slot 10 to 12 in both AM and PM is slated for Client interaction. I am currently working in 13 time zones through out the world so time is an "Issue" LOL

                                                Noon to 1pm is a complete time line check straight across the board with every aspect of my business. By 1pm every day I know where everything is was and should have been - and direct things as needed. This is technically the only hour in a day that I "watch over" my business. I do also have a glass board that is independent of my software tracking that allows at a glance to see what project is where and what has been done, is being done, and has to be done.

                                                Its summer time right now and so the next 4 to 5 hours are dedicated to my son 5 days a week. I tend to spend this time with the business getting my hands dirty and assisting in my produced goods departments as needed, or stepping in and coding etc.

                                                6 to 8 is family time - youth soccer coach - homework - dinner - you get the idea.

                                                8pm til 10pm is dedicated to writing 100% as in close the doors turn up the music and type till my fingers bleed. 10pm is the 2nd client interaction time frame until midnight - I write in this time frame as time warrants. Midnight til usually 4am and that stretches to 5 sometimes depending is again Volume up and fingers going at it.

                                                In a very rough sense that is my day.
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                                            • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
                                              Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

                                              and when you all are snug in your little beds... IM STILL UP! and Im still writing. anyone need an article?


                                              ***update 5am*** that's what I thought! night kids see you in a few hours!
                                              Can I have a rain check on the article?
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                                              • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                                                Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

                                                Can I have a rain check on the article?

                                                Dan... an article on the West Mid West or hotels.. yeah in my sleep and more than likely with original images! LOL
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                                                • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
                                                  Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

                                                  Dan... an article on the West Mid West or hotels.. yeah in my sleep and more than likely with original images! LOL
                                                  Too good to pass up. Deal!
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                          • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                            [QUOTE=zoro;10110822 However, when I collect a long tail search term that I think might be a good keyword and will not have too much competition, like for example ie, "Chiropractor Brisbane Northside Open 24 hrs", the Google keyword tool shows NIL search results. [/QUOTE]

                            I felt the need to add to this. to hit this term ( Chiropractor Brisbane Northside Open 24 hrs ) "just because" would not be advised. if in this case your client does offer this service then YES hit it for sure. but to aim for it, simply for the sake of traffic... not a term I would target. Pure traffic terms I generally go the other direction and aim for the core and 2 word terms. "Chiropractor" and "Sports Chiropractor" as examples.

                            I did say in the post above there are reasons you do want to go after traffic building terms as the 2 I mention above ( as they relate in CONTEXT to your page ) not so much "targeted" per se but pushing a volume of traffic across your site does have overall SEO benefit. I will note this is not a strategy that I would suggest to a beginner. Unless you understand the why in this strategy I would just kinda stay away from it.
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      • Profile picture of the author Kate Luella
        Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

        Kenny's site says over 12,000 businesses served. I think the number claimed was much higher
        somewhere else. Maybe web.com or homestead have served that many businesses. LOL (in a sad way)

        I think one would have to create more of an authority site to flip, or lease, to a high ticket profession
        to make anywhere near the money they claim. You could cookie cutter it though and sell nationwide
        to non-competing businesses - say a Dentist in Dallas and a different Dentist in Denver, and so on.
        I actually have found all of his claims to be baseless. I could say it to, it doesn't make it so.

        This would not be a good mentor if his training is propped up by baseless claims, I have a feeling he assumes the buyer is such a newbie they will accept his claims as fact.
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        • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
          Originally Posted by Kate Luella View Post

          I actually have found all of his claims to be baseless. I could say it to, it doesn't make it so.

          This would not be a good mentor if his training is propped up by baseless claims, I have a feeling he assumes the buyer is such a newbie they will accept his claims as fact.
          Baseless and unbelievable claims. It would take a very naïve newbie, I think. Sadly, they are out there.

          >>>>

          What Jamesfreddy is doing is very valuable. Demonstrating a reality of a process.
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    • Profile picture of the author Highway55
      Originally Posted by Kate Luella View Post

      Just checked out a video on his site. He doesn't look as healthy as he used to.
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    Ouch.....that Kenny Cannon site is a total joke

    He does have the "Divi" logo as his logo (it is a wordpress theme haha)

    He is skinny and wearing a tee shirt and a gimme cap....and his freaking desk is a folding table like you might use at a picnic

    Good heavens...so sad to see the snake oil being pushed.
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  • Profile picture of the author Highway55
    @jamesfreddyc - You mention callfire (which I've used) - any calls? If no, do you anticipate any for the keywords you chose?

    Can you sell the site - or do you plan to - which was the ultimate goal of the course?
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  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
    I will likely stick to the goal to sell the site. It's not a task to take lightlly, I understand nothing sells itself and will require a whole other effort to prospect for a buyer and close the sale. Luckily I've been around here long enough to know how to do that too.
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  • Profile picture of the author Highway55
    Cool. If you do... please post an update. I'd love to know that you did...
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  • I have to weigh in on this because this is how I primarily made money from clients - by creating sites and ranking them, then renting them. I've gotten anywhere from $400/mo to $750/mo in non-big niches.. (i.e. not attorneys or dentists).

    I picked cities and niches that are not hard to rank in, where competition had not optimized their Google maps positions. But the cities are big enough to show around 300+ website visitors a month.

    I would end up with the first organic position by doing on-site seo and supplementing very basic Adwords campaigns. What works best is sending some leads to the client to prove yourself.

    Also, if you already have a relationship with them (you're a customer) and you can go ahead and get the client before you're ranked, and use their address, you can do citations (local off-site seo). A Fiverr gig in this case actually worked for me. (definitely be careful about using Fiverr for seo)

    I think the easiest way I ever got clients, which is a great way to get started, was by "proving" myself using bartering techniques. They want more business or a website, I want their service. They get hooked on the influx of customers and end up switching to a paid model.

    And remember, I OWN THE DOMAIN, so if they don't want to pay, they lose all the traffic, and I go get another client. The local address can present a problem here, but I actually haven't seen it be that difficult to rank again after an address change.

    I didn't have good luck selling any sites because those clients I mentioned didn't have that kind of cash. I ALMOST sold one, but that's another story.

    Hope this is helpful...

    Phil
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    • Profile picture of the author zoro
      Originally Posted by Phillip Blackwell View Post

      I have to weigh in on this because this is how I primarily made money from clients - by creating sites and ranking them, then renting them. I've gotten anywhere from $400/mo to $750/mo in non-big niches.. (i.e. not attorneys or dentists).

      I picked cities and niches that are not hard to rank in, where competition had not optimized their Google maps positions. But the cities are big enough to show around 300+ website visitors a month.

      I would end up with the first organic position by doing on-site seo and supplementing very basic Adwords campaigns. What works best is sending some leads to the client to prove yourself.

      Also, if you already have a relationship with them (you're a customer) and you can go ahead and get the client before you're ranked, and use their address, you can do citations (local off-site seo). A Fiverr gig in this case actually worked for me. (definitely be careful about using Fiverr for seo)

      I think the easiest way I ever got clients, which is a great way to get started, was by "proving" myself using bartering techniques. They want more business or a website, I want their service. They get hooked on the influx of customers and end up switching to a paid model.

      And remember, I OWN THE DOMAIN, so if they don't want to pay, they lose all the traffic, and I go get another client. The local address can present a problem here, but I actually haven't seen it be that difficult to rank again after an address change.

      I didn't have good luck selling any sites because those clients I mentioned didn't have that kind of cash. I ALMOST sold one, but that's another story.

      Hope this is helpful...

      Phil
      Phil, thanks for posting and sharing your experiences here. The Rent-A-Website biz model is one I'm currently looking into and researching.
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      • You're welcome Zoro!

        Thing is.. you can scale this up and go after more profitable niches... I have done a few attorney ones and they will pay more than that... you could pull in $2,000k or more, or sell it for more. But as has been discussed here, it's harder to rank those faster... unless...

        ...if you do the research and find cities that don't have as many "savvy" marketers doing it, you can do it. I ranked several divorce attorney websites in a "big enough" city within weeks. I didn't keep doing it because I just decided to move in a different direction with my business altogether. But I had one guy begging to pay me $3,000. Those small independent attorneys can get pretty desperate to get a steady influx of clients.

        I still have one attorney client that is in a very narrow niche ranking #1 in San Diego.

        So you can #1 rank a competitive niche in a smaller (but still big enough) city, or #2 go to a very narrow niche in a bigger city.

        Would you guys be interested in a course on what I've done? (this is what I do now - create courses and work with those who create them, but mostly for other niches - only done a small amount in the IM space). Was thinking of giving away more info for free but creating a course around some of the specifics would take a lot of my time.

        I also have a friend who created a killer course on getting bigger clients. She blew my mind actually. Built her business to $500k within 3 years (at this point I met her) and then one year later she was at $1M. She got one client worth $40,000 a month. That's her secret. Instead of getting, for example a ton of doctors, you would get a doctor's rep. Calls them "trophy clients".

        ... in this case, it's even better because you don't have to deal with the egos lol
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        • Profile picture of the author zoro
          Originally Posted by Phillip Blackwell View Post

          You're welcome Zoro!

          Thing is.. you can scale this up and go after more profitable niches... I have done a few attorney ones and they will pay more than that... you could pull in $2,000k or more, or sell it for more. But as has been discussed here, it's harder to rank those faster... unless...

          ...if you do the research and find cities that don't have as many "savvy" marketers doing it, you can do it. I ranked several divorce attorney websites in a "big enough" city within weeks. I didn't keep doing it because I just decided to move in a different direction with my business altogether. But I had one guy begging to pay me $3,000. Those small independent attorneys can get pretty desperate to get a steady influx of clients.

          I still have one attorney client that is in a very narrow niche ranking #1 in San Diego.

          So you can #1 rank a competitive niche in a smaller (but still big enough) city, or #2 go to a very narrow niche in a bigger city.

          Would you guys be interested in a course on what I've done? (this is what I do now - create courses and work with those who create them, but mostly for other niches - only done a small amount in the IM space). Was thinking of giving away more info for free but creating a course around some of the specifics would take a lot of my time.

          I also have a friend who created a killer course on getting bigger clients. She blew my mind actually. Built her business to $500k within 3 years (at this point I met her) and then one year later she was at $1M. She got one client worth $40,000 a month. That's her secret. Instead of getting, for example a ton of doctors, you would get a doctor's rep. Calls them "trophy clients".

          ... in this case, it's even better because you don't have to deal with the egos lol
          Thanks Mate, good to hear from some one who walks-the-walk and talks-the-talk. I cannot understand why not more offline marketers are providing Rent-A-Sites to local businesses. It seems like a Win Win for everyone. The business only pays a small monthly fee, which would provide them with a professional lead generation website fully maintained The Offline Marketer would generate recurring income which can be scaled up.
          So like I said, this is a biz model I am currently researching, but I'm a bit surprised that not more offliner's are offering this service.
          Perhaps I am missing something?

          I for one, would be very interested to learn from you.


          Side Note:
          I recently pursued a biz model that I thought would be valuable to restaurant owners, but I failed miserably ... Lol. It was a Local Restaurant Directory where I placed flyers into hotels pointing guests to a mobile restaurant directory. I got the hotels onboard but I could not get any interest from the restaurants. So, hence my reason for wanting to try the website lease biz model.
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          • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
            Originally Posted by zoro View Post

            So like I said, this is a biz model I am currently researching, but I'm a bit surprised that not more offliner's are offering this service. Perhaps I am missing something?
            Maybe in your geographic area this is the case? I know that it seems like every time I begin to research a new niche and keywords I will almost always find a lead generation site in the results for the markets I've looked into.

            It's not that uncommon.
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            • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
              I see a lot of lead generation sites

              I do know small biz who use "Thumbtack" for some leads.

              I know of service biz who tried some lead sites and did not think it was worth it
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            • Profile picture of the author zoro
              Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc View Post

              Maybe in your geographic area this is the case? I know that it seems like every time I begin to research a new niche and keywords I will almost always find a lead generation site in the results for the markets I've looked into.

              It's not that uncommon.
              I do come across a lot of lead gen sites, but are they a rented website?
              If I search on google for providers of Rental / Lease websites I find very few business who provide them.
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          • Profile picture of the author animal44
            Originally Posted by zoro View Post

            I cannot understand why not more offline marketers are providing Rent-A-Sites to local businesses.
            Because most offline marketers are not marketers at all. They're website builders and they're not very good at marketing. How many websites have you seen that make you want to buy? Make you want to pick up the phone right now!
            What's most important is the message and the message has to be focused on the client's issues, not the product or service offered. Few websites do this, so there's a huge open market there for someone who understands DR advertising...

            In UK, we found people prefer to buy rather than rent. And the advantage of selling your site is you can upsell maintenance and SEO or PPC. So lump sum plus monthly.

            Personally I prefer JVs and Customer reactivation because they give pretty instant results and customer lists tend to be more constant and aren't subject to algorithm changes
            Sending an offer out to say 100,000 proven buyers generates far more sales in a far shorter time than waiting for people to search on your particular product or service and then trying to persuade them to buy. Indeed, the one big issue is ensuring the product/service owner has the capacity to service the flood of orders!
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          • Profile picture of the author tryinhere
            Originally Posted by zoro View Post

            Side Note: I recently pursued a biz model that I thought would be valuable to restaurant owners, but I failed miserably ... .
            Zoro / John, nobody can really fail miserably in the context of your post, I would guess every single person here has had learning curves if they are honest.

            If I were to count what people call failures I would have run out of fingers and toes long ago, and if being really honest I still if using the term failure, still make them on a daily basis in some small way or another.

            I can not count the number of scrapped sites I made especially in the early day, the number of stupid ad mistakes I made along with every other mistake.

            In the early days I was embarrassed to say or admit I made a mistake / felt like a failure (people might point laugh or giggle at me if I did), that is until you understand it is OK to make mistakes / fail if we are using that term and to understand that this just really is life telling us quietly what does not work as best as it could and in understanding that, you can embrace mistakes as knowledge and growth and not be afraid to make errors.

            The only true way to not make errors is to lock your self in the middle of an empty room and sit there and do nothing, anything else expect life's lessons to guide you not hinder progress going forward.
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            • Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

              ...

              8pm til 10pm is dedicated to writing 100% as in close the doors turn up the music and type till my fingers bleed. 10pm is the 2nd client interaction time frame until midnight - I write in this time frame as time warrants. Midnight til usually 4am and that stretches to 5 sometimes depending is again Volume up and fingers going at it.

              In a very rough sense that is my day.
              Savidge4, You sleep 2-3 hours a night?

              Originally Posted by tryinhere View Post

              Zoro / John, nobody can really fail miserably in the context of your post, I would guess every single person here has had learning curves if they are honest.

              If I were to count what people call failures I would have run out of fingers and toes long ago, and if being really honest I still if using the term failure, still make them on a daily basis in some small way or another.

              I can not count the number of scrapped sites I made especially in the early day, the number of stupid ad mistakes I made along with every other mistake.

              In the early days I was embarrassed to say or admit I made a mistake / felt like a failure (people might point laugh or giggle at me if I did), that is until you understand it is OK to make mistakes / fail if we are using that term and to understand that this just really is life telling us quietly what does not work as best as it could and in understanding that, you can embrace mistakes as knowledge and growth and not be afraid to make errors.

              The only true way to not make errors is to lock your self in the middle of an empty room and sit there and do nothing, anything else expect life's lessons to guide you not hinder progress going forward.

              Right on! I agree 100%
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              • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                Originally Posted by Phillip Blackwell View Post

                Savidge4, You sleep 2-3 hours a night?

                Probably 6 days out of 7 usually. I get 5 hours in every once in a while.. but yeah
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    • Profile picture of the author Chris Grable
      Originally Posted by Phillip Blackwell View Post

      I have to weigh in on this because this is how I primarily made money from clients - by creating sites and ranking them, then renting them. I've gotten anywhere from $400/mo to $750/mo in non-big niches.. (i.e. not attorneys or dentists).

      I picked cities and niches that are not hard to rank in, where competition had not optimized their Google maps positions. But the cities are big enough to show around 300+ website visitors a month.

      I would end up with the first organic position by doing on-site seo and supplementing very basic Adwords campaigns. What works best is sending some leads to the client to prove yourself.

      Also, if you already have a relationship with them (you're a customer) and you can go ahead and get the client before you're ranked, and use their address, you can do citations (local off-site seo). A Fiverr gig in this case actually worked for me. (definitely be careful about using Fiverr for seo)

      I think the easiest way I ever got clients, which is a great way to get started, was by "proving" myself using bartering techniques. They want more business or a website, I want their service. They get hooked on the influx of customers and end up switching to a paid model.

      And remember, I OWN THE DOMAIN, so if they don't want to pay, they lose all the traffic, and I go get another client. The local address can present a problem here, but I actually haven't seen it be that difficult to rank again after an address change.

      I didn't have good luck selling any sites because those clients I mentioned didn't have that kind of cash. I ALMOST sold one, but that's another story.

      Hope this is helpful...

      Phil
      Phil,

      I am curious about your use of citations sites. Are you building citations to your leased site or to the clients primary? If to your leased site (my assumption is that's what you are doing) do you use their NAP data or do you build the citations around your leased site using some other data.

      Hope that makes sense!

      Thanks!
      Chris

      EDIT: I went back and reread your post. It does seem like you are using their address. How about phone number? Theirs or a call tracking number?

      thanks!

      cag
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      • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
        Originally Posted by Chris Grable View Post

        Phil,

        I am curious about your use of citations sites. Are you building citations to your leased site or to the clients primary? If to your leased site (my assumption is that's what you are doing) do you use their NAP data or do you build the citations around your leased site using some other data.

        Hope that makes sense!

        Thanks!
        Chris

        EDIT: I went back and reread your post. It does seem like you are using their address. How about phone number? Theirs or a call tracking number?

        thanks!

        cag
        It's a little confusing as to what he was doing because typically most are not going to have a "relationship" with a local business. I'd go further and estimate that most who are building a site like this would never even start there, not understand how to approach them, or even pick up the phone to try,

        Also, if you already have a relationship with them (you're a customer) and you can go ahead and get the client before you're ranked, and use their address, you can do citations (local off-site seo).
        But he also mentioned just sending out a few free leads to them,

        What works best is sending some leads to the client to prove yourself.
        So a bit of a chicken and egg situation he is presenting. Or my guess is that these are two different scenarios, in which case with the later your question is valid: "what is your NAP for a local market?"

        As for call tracking --- CallFire is your answer.
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  • Profile picture of the author Gorst
    Learning SEO and building a Lead gen site from scratch is an excellent project to take on because you will be gaining new skills and experience. The ability to rank a site right away, picking an appropriate niche, setting up and deplying the funnel with social and video, etc. should not be downplayed. It's a significant amount of effort.
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    • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
      Originally Posted by Gorst View Post

      Learning SEO and building a Lead gen site from scratch is an excellent project to take on because you will be gaining new skills and experience. The ability to rank a site right away, picking an appropriate niche, setting up and deplying the funnel with social and video, etc. should not be downplayed. It's a significant amount of effort.
      This sure sounds familiar.
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    • Originally Posted by Gorst View Post

      Learning SEO and building a Lead gen site from scratch is an excellent project to take on because you will be gaining new skills and experience. The ability to rank a site right away, picking an appropriate niche, setting up and deplying the funnel with social and video, etc. should not be downplayed. It's a significant amount of effort.
      In general, I agree with you. But if you know how to find the right location, it doesn't take much effort at all. I can rank a "local" micro site within 2 weeks (sometimes faster). PPC will be zero competition too, so you can generate leads that way while waiting on your site to rank.

      These areas exist in abundance.. and you can find niches that are profitable as well. Most savvy marketers go after more competitive niches and locations, so these places are wide open.
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  • Hey guys... sorry for the confusion.

    I am indeed presenting different scenarios.

    Sometimes I build a site and start sending leads (cheap PPC, organic ranking). If the client bites I can then upsell them to a rental model, optimize map listings, and do citations using their NAP to rank in the maps as well. (documenting in case there is ever a change) So ideally you have 3+ positions on page 1.

    The first clients I got in this model I built a relationship with them first by using their services, basically trading for whatever they offered. I had serious health problems 5 years ago and was without health insurance, but got all of my needs taken care of by trading (chiropractor, doctor, massage therapist, dentist, podiatrist... can't think of any more lol) That got them hooked on the leads and then I transitioned them to a paid model (and now I have health insurance

    After I had some proof I was comfortable going out and getting other businesses in different ways. Sometimes I build a site and send leads first, others I get the client first and then build the sites.

    I have in the past used UPS, USPS, and other methods for having my own business address for several niches. It worked fine in my niches where the customer didn't need to go to the actual business (plumbers, pest control, etc), and I never got banned or slapped, but I stopped doing it because I knew I would get caught eventually and it was breaking TOS. Once the client bites you can use their NAP. If you get a new client or they move to another address, it takes a little work to get the ranking back up but in my experience, not much.

    The main thing is to pick a great niche and location in the first place, where there is little to no competition. Otherwise, it's harder to rank. And of course, some niches and locations are worth more than others. But even if you're getting $200 per month, it's worth it in the right location and niche because it requires so little attention to maintain it.

    And yes I use Callfire. That's mostly for proof and to record the calls to see how the leads are handled. Most of my sites don't need it. I only do rentals now instead of selling the leads.

    I hope that makes sense..

    Phil
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  • Profile picture of the author jamesfreddyc
    Carsten,

    Kenny is on twitter, there's also many other contact sources for them. You should certainly pursue a refund if you're not happy with your purchase.

    I personally went into my purchase knowing and understanding that i was just a segmentation sale at that point and at the opening of their sales funnel. It's very obvious to me and so I understood well what i had purchased.

    ...I am not part of the marketplace that believes I can build millions of dollars in revenue from a $27 wso. Sorry but it takes a lot more work, time and personal development to achieve that.

    However, I am satisfied with the results i got. I wanted a quick start into the world of SEO and absolutely know 100% without a doubt i got my money's worth. Here's why :

    Its not that building a sniper lead gen site is the money maker. In fact some of the methods presented would not provide long-term rankings. However I was able to take the info and use it as a base to initiate ADDITIONAL RESEARCH to figure out how to better optimize the content and internal linking structure to remain at spots 1 and 2 for the keywords i was ranking for to this day.

    I learned a ton from the material but it was only a primer to get the knowledge base built up that allowed me to locate additional information related to SEO that increased the knowledge base i had started with since purchasing the wso.
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  • Profile picture of the author bananapeel
    jamesfreddyc i thoroughly enjoyed reading this thread, thanks for the updates
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    • Profile picture of the author Carsten Tiensuu
      Sure... I do not expect to be a billionaire or anything from a wso...just expect to get what I pay for. I did not receive anything not even a 1 page pdf.. I would never request a refund if i got something from a purchase. not even if it was shit...
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      • Originally Posted by Carsten Tiensuu View Post

        Sure... I do not expect to be a billionaire or anything from a wso...just expect to get what I pay for. I did not receive anything not even a 1 page pdf.. I would never request a refund if i got something from a purchase. not even if it was shit...
        Seems like something is wrong if you didn't get anything. Did you try to contact the product creator?

        I'll be glad to help you with this strategy - if you're interested, PM.
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