Cold Calling - How many no's before you move on?

71 replies
I'm no pro at cold calling but I've had mixed successes. In fact I have a client that been with me since Nov 2012 through a cold call which is why I'm starting this again.

Here are my limited stats today (BTW I've never had a structured daily cold call campaign)

23 Dials
Time on phone 1hr 37mins
9 rejects (Hangup/No/ Long call No's)

I'm more concerned about the time I'm talking to those that are saying no but are NOT for some reason hanging up on me by not being rude. I'm think I'm spending too much time trying to persuade their opinion.

Eg. was speaking to the guy for 14 mins and I was trying to close for a 5 min appointment, rejection after rejection until I finally gave up. To improve this call time by decreasing it, I think I should wait for about 3-5 types of no's / pushbacks before I give up.

Your ideas would be great, back to the phones.

Michael
#calling #cold #move
  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    I would have to hear your pitch to fully answer. Anyone who said they could guess without knowing that would be just trying to hear themselves talk. Sales is a process. You have to have AIDA Attention, Interest, Desire, and Action.


    After "desire" and before action I would also add "agreement", but usually that is supposed to be included under the umbrella of "desire".

    AIDA is the classic formula, although people will try to rebrand it all kinds of ways.

    Questions:


    Are these people saying yes they will listen because you rebutted them into it, or because they were really interested? Are you getting any buying or interest signals that are telling you they are worth pitching before you proceed?


    Are you asking them to take action without properly gauging their desire, sense of urgency, or sense of perceived value?


    If you start asking for a close before their perceived value is high enough to blow your price away, then you are going to get a lot of No's. If you are not properly incorporating some things to increase their sense of urgency, then you are going to get a lot of "Maybe down the road", or "Let me get back to you on this..."


    Urgency is when they HAVE to have "YOU", and they have to act NOW in order to get you.

    What kinds of answers are you getting? No interest? Already have someone? Dont have the budget?

    Simply too little details in the OP to give a precise answer , however, I would say to you; "good determination".


    This is one of the reasons I encourage doing as close as possible to 100 dials per hour, because people who focus on conversion more than finding a truly interested prospects end up telling the story you are telling here most of the time.


    It's easy to make 30 extra dials or so, barely talk to anyone except your true prospect, and then save your energy for when you are talking to someone truly interested, than it is to bang your head all day trying to close every suspect you come across, or rebut them into listening.


    "Interest" is easier to work with.


    Yes rebutting people into yeses works, but it often results in buyers remorse and you will KILL yourself trying to get a sale, and go home feeling like you got ran over by a truck or have been in a wrestling match all day. This is exactly what "would be" cold callers are afraid of, and PRECISELY the reason I encourage hi probability selling.


    Not because I don't know different, but because I know that ESPECIALLY working from home, it is discouraging to get into the head butting thing... you wont last long if you don't see easy success fast.


    If I were you I would just be dialing 100 numbers per hour, being nice to everyone and pressuring NO ONE... only stopping when I sense true interest, and giving ALL of my sales energy ONLY to those who express it.


    For now, even hearing your 30 second elevator pitch would help us to help you more. Also, at what point are you breaking down? The close? The body of the pitch?


    Sounds like you are getting past the greeting just fine, but your conversion to pitches is pretty high... if you are skilled enough at sales to take that all the way then it's great, but if you aren't then you will be spending most of your time in mental wrestling matches with people...


    At first sight, it sounds like you may be rebutting them into listening initially, and you aren't disqualifying enough people fast enough.


    It was explained to me like this; "There is a monkey with his hand stuck in a jar grasped around 5 peanuts.... there is a whole pile of peanuts 15 feet away but he cant get to them because he won't let go of the ones in the jar in order to free his hands."


    Traditionally telemarketers are taught to never let go, and rebut the hell out of every person who comes on the phone.... That's why telemarketers generally hate their job.


    If you don't see success fast enough , easy enough, or if you have to feel like a high pressure person all day every day...you are going to hate telemarketing.


    If you just say hi and enjoy greeting people and ONLY PITCH WHERE THERE IS INTEREST, then you are going to have a REALLY good experience, good friendly conversations... and STILL get sales.


    There are two ways to do it, and one is much easier on you. The other will wear you out, make you dread cold calling, and wont be any more effective in the long run.


    Trust me, I'm old school, and NEW school, and have done it both ways plenty.


    Some people are going to come on this thread and say to generate your leads differently, and that's all great, but it isn't relevant to your question. The kind of selling we are talking about here can be done from a phone book, even though YES, there are ways to have people contacting you first... You obviously don't have that kind of funnel working at the moment, so those kinds of points are mute, unless you have a few weeks, and some money to invest in reworking your lead acquisition strategy.

    If so , then great. If not; then what we are talking about can be done from a phone book any day of the week, even TODAY.

    I want to challenge you to spend two hours disqualifying the hell out of people (in a nice way) and make it your point to get them off the phone ASAP unless you can REALLY sense interest, then tell me how it was easier and made a difference.


    Thank you for asking a great question Michael. Good going with the effort!


    Hope this helps.


    -JD


    Ps. You WILL eventually get a sale through rebutting hard, but it will be a hard earned one...and it may be just as hard to keep the customer long term. People who want a lot of reassurance, usually KEEP wanting it... people who have to be initially pushed, tend to have to be dragged like a mule for miles down the road, later. People who demand every little explanation and argue with you..., don't tend to stop demanding them after the sale. You want to do business with people who wanted to do business with YOU.


    Rebutting your ways to sales can be an effective thing, but making a strategy out of it for a beginner is hard even when you have a trainer over your shoulder pressuring you every minute, let alone doing it by yourself at home.
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    • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      I want to challenger you to spend two hours disqualifying the hell out of people (in a nice way) and make it your point to get them off the phone ASAP unless you can REALLY sense interest, then tell me how it was easier and made a difference.
      This is the right approach.

      Make it easier on yourself by putting the pressure where it belongs: on the prospect. Not you.

      Look for the path of least resistance. If someone doesn't want to talk (to anyone; it's not just you), or is hostile, or just doesn't have a need for what you offer, politely disconnect and move on.

      Here's another helpful thing: get a 3 or 4 minute sand hourglass eggtimer from Amazon. They're like eight bucks. When you start the call, flip the timer over and have the sand start falling to the bottom bell. Qualify during that period. If you don't get pain on the table by the time the sand runs out, say, "Hmm. I guess there's no reason for us to continue. Sounds like you just don't have a need for what we offer. Do you agree?"

      Some prospects will move forward, "No, wait--I didn't say that!" because of the takeaway.

      Others will agree and you can move on knowing this wasn't a prospect that was interested in proceeding anyway.
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
      Thanks for that, in bold and my 30 second pitch just below.

      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      I would have to hear your pitch to fully answer. Anyone who said they could guess without knowing that would be just trying to hear themselves talk. Sales is a process. You have to have AIDA Attention, Interest, Desire, and Action.

      Thank you sir for the reply and very insightful here is my pitch

      https://soundcloud.com/michael-nguye...itch-cold-call
      That is the classic formula, although people rebrand it all kinds of ways.


      Are these people saying yes they will listen because you rebutted them into it, or because they were really interested? Are you getting any buying or interest signals that are telling you they are worth pitching before you proceed?

      All have only listened because I was able to rebut them and "sidestep" them and carry on with my script. You've pretty much answered it, none showed true interest but I was able to keep them on the phone.

      Are you asking them to take action without properly gauging their desire, sense of urgency, or sense of perceived value?

      My value statement is: "I have a proven marketing process that has helped my clients increase more visits to their website, which means more customers, more sales, and regular repeat orders. I need to gather some information to see if we're a fit for each other."

      I sense they are busy and this is where I close for a 3-5 min phone appointment to talk about this but this is where the brush offs happen.
      If you start asking for a close before their perceived value is high enough to blow your price away, then you are going to get a lot of No's. If you are not properly incorporating some things to increase their sense of urgency, then you are going to get a lot of "Maybe down the road", or "Let me get back to you on this..."

      Alot of, hangups, doing it in house, not interested, too busy, want do do it ourselves etc

      At this point, I have my brush of scripts. Acknowledged and proceed format, which has enabled me to keep many of them on the phone

      Urgency is when they HAVE to have "YOU", and they have to act NOW in order to get you.

      What kinds of answers are you getting? No interest? Already have someone? Don't have the budget?

      No detail of urgency, I guess there was none, which is why none have really wanted to talk. I have scripts for all initial brush offs so this is telling me I'm staying on too long with those that have no interest.


      I think you're right, I'm not disqualifying fast enough and I'm trying to turn ever contact into a sale.
      Simply too little details in the OP to give a precise answer , however, I would say to you; "good determination".


      This is one of the reasons I encourage closer to 100 dials per hour, because people who focus on conversion more than finding a truly interested prospect end up telling th story you are telling here most of the time. It would be doubly as frustrating if you had spent two hours. It's easy to make 30 extra dials or so, barely talk to anyone except your true prospect, and then save your energy for when you are talking to someone truly interested, than it is to bang your head all day trying to close every suspect you come across, or rebut them into listening.


      "Interest" is easier to work with.


      Yes rebutting people into yeses works, but it often results in buyers remorse and you will KILL yourself trying to get a sale, and go home feeling like you got ran over by a truck or have been in a wrestling match all day. This is exactly what "would be" cold callers are afraid of, and PRECISELY the reason I encourage hi probability selling.


      No because I don't know different, but because I know that ESPECIALLY working from home, it is discouraging to get into the head butting thing... you wont last long if you don't see easy success fast.


      If I were you I would just be dialing 100 numbers per hour, being nice to everyone and pressuring NO ONE... only stopping when I sense true interest, and giving ALL of my sales energy ONLY to those who express it.


      For now, even hearing your 30 second elevator pitch would help us to help you more. Also, at what point are you breaking down? The close? The body of the pitch?


      Sounds like you are getting past the greeting just fine, but your conversion to pitches is pretty high... if you are skilled enough at sales to take that all the way then it's great, but if you aren't then you will be spending most of your time in mental wrestling matches with people...


      At first sight, it sounds like you may be rebutting them into listening initially, and you aren't disqualifying enough people, fast enough.


      It was explained to me like this; "There is a monkey with his hand stuck in a jar grasped around 5 peanuts.... there is a whole pile of peanuts 15 feet away but he cant get to them because he won't let go of the ones in the jar in order to free his hands."


      Traditionally telemarketers are taught to never let go, and rebut the hell out of every person who comes on the phone.... That's why telemarketers generally hate their job.


      If you don't see success fast enough , easy enough, or if you have to feel like a high pressure person all day every day...you are going to hate telemarketing.


      If you just say hi and enjoy greeting people and ONLY PITCH WHERE THERE IS INTEREST, then you are going to have a REALLY good experience, good friendly conversations... and STILL get sales.


      There are two ways to do it, and one is much easier on you. The other will wear you out, make you dread cold calling, and wont be any more effective in the long run.


      Trust me, I'm old school, and NEW school, and have done it both ways plenty.


      Some people are going to come on this thread and say to generate your leads differently, and that's all great, but it isn't relevant to your question.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
    "I have a proven marketing process that has helped my clients increase more visits to their website, which means more customers, more sales, and regular repeat orders. I need to gather some information to see if we're a fit for each other."

    This is generic. How about:

    "I work with business owners and marketing executives who are disappointed with the low number of visitors to their website, frustrated with worse-than-expected revenue, and are eager for regular repeat orders from well-paying clients. But I don't suppose any of these are a concern for you?"

    It's personalized this way. Rather than, "I need to ask a few questions to find out if..." you are asking an open-ended question that involves them.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Michael,


    No problem.


    Havent check out the pitch yet, but good job again for rebutting them into staying on the phone, it isn't the easiest way, but it does show determination on your part, and that you intend to make this work!


    AIDA's first rules are "Attention, and Interest", if you want to follow classic sales advice, it starts with making sure those two are there before proceeding.


    Rebuttals are for taking another shot at creating interest... if it still is not there after a rebut, then don't waste time pitching them. That is CLASSIC advice, not mine.

    In other words;

    If interest is not there, then you can try to create some with a rebut... but if it's still not, then there is no point in pitching without it.

    Some advise 3 rebuts , but they all need to take place in the very beginning of the pitch. If you cant generate genuine interest in under a minute, it's time to let go and move on.


    Will be back.
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post


      Rebuttals are for taking another shot at creating interest... if it still is not there after a rebut, then don't waste time pitching them. That is CLASSIC advice, not mine.

      Some advise 3 rebuts , but they all need to take place in the very beginning of the pitch. If you cant generate genuine interest in under a minute, it's time to let go and move on.
      Exactly the advice I need! I need to stop the attitude of trying to convert all calls and FIND only the interested one. BTW most have asked me to leave a message etc from the GK but I have sidestepped it all and have managed to get info on where they are and best time to call back. Whether its a lie or just to get me off the phone. Its kinda worked.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Indeed.


    Again, it's not my advice, it is the classic advice. AIDA is classic for a reason. You will find it rebranded all kinds of ways but its the same basic principles.

    Which brings me to another answer for you here:

    You are creating an AGREEMENT in the beginning of the conversation with them, by telling them they have a choice whether to proceed or not, and then you say you start "pitching".

    "Pitching" is what happens after interest has been established, but it seems you are pitching before you have established that.


    In other words;


    You are saying "I will tell you why I called, and then afterward you can tell me if you are interested in proceeding"... and they agree to THAT.


    Then, you break the agreement you made with them in the first line, by continuing to pitch even after they have expressed that there is no reason to proceed.


    I also don't hear where you are going back to confirm with them after the initial elevator pitch as to whether they are interested in proceeding or not. How you ask that question can be a factor, but you must have an indicator that they may want to proceed before doing so, or else 80% of your energy is wasted on kicking a dead horse.


    I would just skip the whole first line, and say "Hi this is Michael with __________, hope you are doing well today? Great. "


    "Bob, Thanks for taking my call, I know I probably caught you a bit off guard, so I will try to make this brief. The reason Im calling is because my company......"


    (Be clear and concise about what you do, not vague)


    I was just wondering if that is something you have ever given any thought to?


    Or "I was just wondering if you could use any help in that area?"


    Or "I was just wondering if you already had that or if it was something you were planning on doing in the future?"


    If the answer is positive then say:


    "Great, well like I said, I know I caught you off guard so I will try to keep it brief... right now , we are offering...."


    Then proceed to pitch, because you have established that there is at least SOME degree of interest.


    This whole process should take 30 seconds or so... if not, then move on and say a polite good bye and end with good, positive energy that will bleed into your next call. *Make every interaction proactively positive, and it will build your energy throughout the session instead of draining it. Ingratiate people to your energy, even if they aren't interested. It enriches your own sense of "people like me", and positively affects the way you project in future calls.


    Pitching interested prospects will make a world of difference.


    It all begins with attention and interest. Anything other than that is putting the cart before the horse, and we all know that a cart doesn't pull a horse.

    Your job is to FIND interest, more than to create it. Interest that already exists is ten times easier to work with.

    Many people spend their whole day trying to create interest where it isn't, instead of capitalizing on where it already is.

    Hope this helps.


    Will follow this thread as much as possible.


    -JD
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    I feel much more prepared mentally after this thread, thank you both. I'm on a mission to gain at least 1 client from cold calling this month to increase my confidence. Call reluctance is not the problem, for me its more the tactics and approach.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

      . I'm a mission to gain at least 1 client from cold calling this month to increase my confidence.

      You will get THAT goal like a breeze at this rate, even if you don't take my advice.


      Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post


      a good example are the many "lead generation" reports and wso....makes me laugh hhahaha

      "rank and rent">> yeah baby....just try getting through to the owners, and explain this concept to a plumber, electrician...oh yeah

      You certainly wont have a very easy time explaining it if you haven't sparked interest first that's for sure. You might go through more numbers to uncover interest, but they will be easier calls and when you find the interest it is like GOLD, and ten times easier to close.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      John and Jason have already given great advice.

      My only question is..how did you get the list? If you are scraping it from Google listings, then your source is unlimited, and I'd go through the names very quickly. In other words, the first objection would get me off the phone. If these are qualified names that you have already researched...and you have a limited supply (or paid a higher cost), then I would tend to keep pitching the appointment until they just said "No".

      For example, when I was calling local home owners...and all I had was a name and number, I ran through them very quickly. I was looking for the low hanging fruit.

      Then, I got a list of names that were already credit approved, and I knew they had already bought a product, similar to mine, and financed it...Meaning, they were pretty likely to buy from me.

      Those people? I didn't let go. If it took 15 minutes..I took 15 minutes. Why? Because they were limited in quantity, and I knew they would almost certainly buy from me.

      Another question is, when you are answering objections, are they becoming more likely to buy? I mean, after 15 minutes on the phone, have you already half sold them? Or are you still just trying for an appointment, or are you furthering the sale...by answering buying objections?

      Appointment objections are not the same as buying objections.


      One great thing you are doing, is making the calls yourself. Soon, you'll be able to decide..by their objections..whether they are worth spending time with, before the appointment.


      This thread should be read by everyone making appointments. Great stuff here.
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      • Profile picture of the author DABK
        You got great advice. I looked at what you said you say and one thing struck me: you don't have a fast way of determining if they even get any sales off their site right now and if they do, do they value them? What you have is too vague.

        Jason's way will instantly separate those who've tried to get sales off their site from those who have not and more.

        Think about who's most likely to buy what you sell. Make a list. Then, make sure you bring up each point on your list fast.

        Have you sold your system to anyone already?

        If yes, use that.

        If you sold it to a mortgage broker, call mortgage brokers and tell them your system has brought your existing mortgage broker x more visitors; that translated into x extra closings.

        If you are calling some other industry, mention it anyway, my system's made my mortgage broker client an additional $x a month.

        I don't think it's just me but if you can talk specifics, I'm more likely to be interested as I can translate a lot of them to my situation and, if the numbers are good, I'm interested.
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    The rule of three rebuttals is ONLY if you get interest....

    I think of telemarketing as looking for interest....once you find it, then you go in and try to find the "key" to unlock it and seal the deal

    If there is no interest at all...move along...don't think about it, don't worry about it. I have seen a misconception on here that "sales" ability will overcome every objection and situation . It won't

    You will be calling businesses that are about to fail, the owner may be planning to close...you will call business that just hired a high priced agency and redid all their graphics, website and has no intention of changing....you wlll run into biz who don't believe in advertising or social media or whatever you are selling...or biz that are just broke...or biz that will ONLY use their nephew, or fellow "church member" or whatever....

    NEXTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

    Now...when you call someone and they engage in conversation with you, and keep talking then you keep going...you are looking for that spark of interest that you can turn around

    Sort and sift...rinse and repeat

    IMHO some of the so called "guru" crap leads people to believe this is all a lay down...NOT

    a good example are the many "lead generation" reports and wso....makes me laugh hhahaha

    "rank and rent">> yeah baby....just try getting through to the owners, and explain this concept to a plumber, electrician...oh yeah
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    • Profile picture of the author Joe Stewart
      Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

      "rank and rent">> yeah baby....just try getting through to the owners, and explain this concept to a plumber, electrician...oh yeah
      Actually, I've used the three "no" rule for years in my niche. I don't want to make them mad or waste my time, but I do want to get three shots at a "yes", so it makes sense for me to use that as a cutoff point.

      Regarding "rank and rent", I'm already doing it. I'm not intimidated by contractors. Most are very intelligent. You just need to explain the end goal of more business = more money and keep the means of getting there fairly simple.

      I've been calling contractors for years and most business owners do understand marketing. They have to advertise somewhere, right? You just have to ask questions regarding how effective their current marketing strategy is and see if there's a way you can improve on it.

      I just spoke to a long time product customer the other day about lead generation and HE told ME that the Yellow Pages are worthless and most searches are done online these days. These are the people that you need to target. Go for customers that are already spending money online. Look at the Adwords ads for targeted keywords. These guys are already spending money and a rental site may save them money each month. It could at least increase their presence on the page, right?

      Also, what about contractors with sites that are on page two or three for those same keywords. I'd think they'd like to be on page one, too, right?

      Anyhow, I didn't mean to get off topic. I just felt the need to respond to that comment. A lot of people are doing lead generation successfully. Just because one person doesn't do it or doesn't think that it can be done, doesn't mean that others can't.

      Actually, I'm starting to focus the majority of my business on doing just that. :-)
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  • Profile picture of the author Matthew North
    Try reframing what you are doing conceptually.

    Instead of calling for an appointment, you are now looking for buyers.

    I love the responses here. I hope this helps to connect these ideas together.
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  • Profile picture of the author daniyal100
    As a sales person you should be able to know within 30 seconds or a minute max whether its gonna be sale or no sale. Does not matter how many times he say no or yes

    Don't worry much about perfecting your script and spending money on it. Believe me only you can perfect your script and its not a one time thing but an on going process.. It's 90% tonality and the impression you made with it.

    If you keep doing it for a while you'll come to know that yourself. wish you all the best
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    Update:

    Started calling 10.25am
    Finished 12.36pm

    ~110 Dials - Softphone

    81 Call backs = No pickup / got information
    8 Dead numbers = I know there was more but recorded late.
    20 No's = Again recorded late, 4 DM no's, the rest were gatekeeper no's

    Results = 2 leads
    Lead 1 = Sounded interested and asked to call back at 2pm today
    Lead 2 = Is getting quotes from a company and is willing to share information about that quote

    I would say 1 leads is warm, the other is luke warm. Promising

    My aim was 200 dials but I realised it was going to take longer when I already have work to do.

    Probably a quarter way into the calls I decided to count 15 seconds before hanging and moving on. All calls were kept to a minimum. Less of the objection handling. I kinda enjoyed it. Like digging for gold

    What I would change / improve:
    1. Sort my VOIP call quality out. They reported bad sound and delay. Some not. Might have to change to my landline, I will lose seconds and minutes physically punching numbers...we'll see
    2. Count 15 seconds before next number, then call back later
    3. Save time by staying on the line with the GK max 1 minutes with my layering questions.
    4. Fix my excel sheet

    Tomorrow another 100 new dials and call backs from today.

    Always be in control and find information and never leave a message, just sidestep their question and ask "When is the best time etc".

    My conversion to customer when a lead is qualified is about 60% and for the next month, I'm looking for at least 3 new cold calling customers. I'm on a mission.

    Michael
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    • Profile picture of the author Matthew North
      Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

      Update:

      Started calling 10.25am
      Finished 12.36pm

      ~110 Dials - Softphone

      81 Call backs = No pickup / got information
      8 Dead numbers = I know there was more but recorded late.
      20 No's = Again recorded late, 4 DM no's, the rest were gatekeeper no's

      Results = 2 leads
      Lead 1 = Sounded interested and asked to call back at 2pm today
      Lead 2 = Is getting quotes from a company and is willing to share information about that quote

      I would say 1 leads is warm, the other is luke warm. Promising

      My aim was 200 dials but I realised it was going to take longer when I already have work to do.

      Probably a quarter way into the calls I decided to count 15 seconds before hanging and moving on. All calls were kept to a minimum. Less of the objection handling. I kinda enjoyed it. Like digging for gold

      What I would change / improve:
      1. Sort my VOIP call quality out. They reported bad sound and delay. Some not. Might have to change to my landline, I will lose seconds and minutes physically punching numbers...we'll see
      2. Count 15 seconds before next number, then call back later
      3. Save time by staying on the line with the GK max 1 minutes with my layering questions.
      4. Fix my excel sheet

      Tomorrow another 100 new dials and call backs from today.

      Always be in control and find information and never leave a message, just sidestep their question and ask "When is the best time etc".

      My conversion to customer when a lead is qualified is about 60% and for the next month, I'm looking for at least 3 new cold calling customers. I'm on a mission.

      Michael
      Good.

      I'd be interested to know more about your 81 call backs.

      To me, a callback is the same as a warm lead.

      If no one physically answers the phone then that is called a No Answer.

      Here are a few ways to reduce that callback number:

      Start sending 20-30 cold emails per day describing what you do and asking a simple question. If you get just one appointment doing this emailling then it will be worth it.

      Try calling tradespeople on their mobile phones as that is never screened by a gatekeeper.. and they almost always answer.

      Good luck.
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  • Profile picture of the author Justin Tyme
    Some good pointers and tips here.

    In my industry, 25 dials generally results in 9 contacts, which results in 3 apts. Out of those 3 apts, 2 of them will confirm and 1 will sell.

    This is just a guideline, but tends to hold pretty true for me.

    But my script is on point, and dedicated to only 1 thing.
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    Update

    A call back is when there is no pickup but here are todays stats. No leads on 200 new dials:
    Started: 8.58am
    Finished: 12.15pm
    Duration: 3hrs 13mins

    200 Dials
    34 GK No's
    17 DM No's
    28 Dead numbers
    33 Call backs with information
    88 No pickup (to call back)

    No Leads at all today. I had fun today, didn't know I could even dial that many! At this rate, I could definitely do 400 a day. I will probably switch the 2 batches to afternoon on Monday/ Tuesday.

    From yesterdays call which I thought was luke warm, have followed up and is sending me information. So a lead has been generated.

    I know I need to make a second pass at yesterdays numbers and today but too busy to even do that..really bad and I need to find a way to do that.
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    Update

    Past few days have been setbacks,

    Total numbers dial over that period was:

    310 dials. I made a second pass over the first 100 dials and only completed about 64 today. Made more contact with DM & No interested.

    Best of all, I generated an appointment for next week with a hot lead.

    More to come soon.
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    • Profile picture of the author sandalwood
      Great advice so far. I say so far because mine might not be great.

      This is how I did it and managed to scare up 1200 accounts in our first year in business. I was working from a list of folks I knew needed our service = home and auto insurance.

      I had one of those open ended yes or no scripts that was 2 sentences long. Why so short? I didn't want to waste my time. I don't care about their time. They either want what I have to offer or they don't.

      So, my friend, my answer to your question is 1. BTW, when I was an active stock broker, I used the same formula. 1 no and I'm gone.

      What I thought I realized was that in my business there are an unlimited amount of fish in the pond. How many are in your business?

      Why waste my time trying to haul in one that probably would bolt the first time the market went down or in the case of home/auto insurance the company raised its rates. I wanted clients who would stay with me because of me.

      Not bragging but my approach put me in the top 10% of my class of brokers. That means my checks were nice. That also means I spent a lot of time calling. But, once I built a book of steady revenue my fishing expeditions became shorter.

      That's a lot of fluff to say my answer is still 1. I realize the final answer is up to you but the magic number remains 1 contrary to the song that tells us 1 is the loneliest number in the world.
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by sandalwood View Post

        Great advice so far. I say so far because mine might not be great.

        This is how I did it and managed to scare up 1200 accounts in our first year in business. I was working from a list of folks I knew needed our service = home and auto insurance.

        I had one of those open ended yes or no scripts that was 2 sentences long. Why so short? I didn't want to waste my time. I don't care about their time. They either want what I have to offer or they don't.

        So, my friend, my answer to your question is 1. BTW, when I was an active stock broker, I used the same formula. 1 no and I'm gone.

        What I thought I realized was that in my business there are an unlimited amount of fish in the pond. How many are in your business?
        I love you.

        Same here. One "No" and I'm gone. I'm the easiest guy in the world to get rid of, when I'm prospecting. And very hard to get rid of, when I'm closing.

        I was canvassing years ago, and training a new guy. He asked "What are the odds that we will do a presentation?"

        He said it as we were walking up to a door. I said, "The odds that we will do a presentation here? One in six. The odds that we will do a presentation in the next hour? 100%".
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        • Profile picture of the author sandalwood
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          I love you.

          Same here. One "No" and I'm gone. I'm the easiest guy in the world to get rid of, when I'm prospecting. And very hard to get rid of, when I'm closing.

          I was canvassing years ago, and training a new guy. He asked "What are the odds that we will do a presentation?"

          He said it as we were walking up to a door. I said, "The odds that we will do a presentation here? One in six. The odds that we will do a presentation in the next hour? 100%".
          Ha, ha, thanks Claude. I love you too. Yep in 100% of the time you will do a presentation. When we had our office I used to hand out my cards waiting in line at the check out stand at WalMart's, WINCO, etc.

          Why? Because they all drove cars and some owned homes. Nobody ever told me my presentation had to be a certain length. 3 seconds to give you my card that screamed what I did seemed long enough to me.

          We even wrote business off some of those cards. That sir was the real ha ha in the pudding.
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        • Profile picture of the author joe golfer
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          I love you.

          Same here. One "No" and I'm gone. I'm the easiest guy in the world to get rid of, when I'm prospecting. And very hard to get rid of, when I'm closing.

          I was canvassing years ago, and training a new guy. He asked "What are the odds that we will do a presentation?"

          He said it as we were walking up to a door. I said, "The odds that we will do a presentation here? One in six. The odds that we will do a presentation in the next hour? 100%".
          Just thought of something unrelated but I'm curious: When you were selling vacuums door-to-door, did you carry a machine around all day, ready to go for a presentation? Some of those high-end models are hefty!
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Originally Posted by joe golfer View Post

            Just thought of something unrelated but I'm curious: When you were selling vacuums door-to-door, did you carry a machine around all day, ready to go for a presentation? Some of those high-end models are hefty!
            That's interesting. I've never been asked that.

            I had one or two machines in my car, with my demonstration kit. I would walk up to the door with a clipboard, a pad of questionnaires, And a gift (like a set of cutlery).

            I would do a quick survey (basic qualifying questions), and if I was interested, I'd offer them the gift for a presentation. then, I'd go back out to my car and get my stuff. I gave them the gift, before I went to the car.

            Even with referrals, I would talk to them first, before I got the machine out of the car.

            The machine maybe weighed 35 pounds, and my demonstration kit maybe weighed 20 pounds. If they were on the third floor of an apartment building, I'd be just a tad out of breath from carrying it up the steps.
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  • Profile picture of the author pietjeplukt
    how many no´s?
    unlimited!! keep going till you get a YES, every no brings you closer to a YES

    i used to do cold calling years ago for a company, my prospects had only 2 choices say YES or hang up on me.. lol
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    • Profile picture of the author Joel
      As others have said, qualifying is key.

      After your pitch, add these simple 5 words, "is this something you want?".

      Joel
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      "Without data or facts, you are just another person with an opinion"

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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    Great advice above. I'm no longer doing the initial brush off handling, I could be on the phone all day just handling that when I could be making calls. As most have said, you'll know after 1 min if the call is going to be productive.

    Todays stats: Duration 2hrs 25mins

    Second pass on the same 327 Numbers

    253 dials
    91 Not interested
    65 No answer
    30 Dead numbers
    3 Call backs (1 possible lead to pin down tomorrow)


    Total results so far for this campaign

    3 Call backs (DM instructions to call back shortly)
    3 Leads
    - Lead 1 was just curious but asked to reply in a month,
    - Lead 2 we have talked and exchanged emails
    - Lead 3 was busy, said "he's done this before, bad experience" but was intrigued, said to call back tomorrow
    1 Appt set for next Wednesday for Website Design

    I also qualify the GK and ask what she thinks the DM would do, to decide if I should pursue it. More calls tomorrow.
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    • Profile picture of the author Matthew North
      Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

      Great advice above. I'm no longer doing the initial brush off handling, I could be on the phone all day just handling that when I could be making calls. As most have said, you'll know after 1 min if the call is going to be productive.

      Todays stats

      Second pass on the same 327 Numbers

      253 dials
      91 Not interested
      65 No answer
      30 Dead numbers
      3 Call backs (1 possible lead to pin down tomorrow)


      Total results so far for this campaign

      3 Call backs (DM instructions to call back shortly)
      3 Leads
      - Lead 1 was just curious but asked to reply in a month,
      - Lead 2 we have talked and exchanged emails
      - Lead 3 was busy, said "he's done this before, bad experience" but was intrigued, said to call back tomorrow
      1 Appt set for next Wednesday for Website Design

      I also qualify the GK and ask what she thinks the DM would do, to decide if I should pursue it. More calls tomorrow.
      I love how you are breaking this down for everyone.

      I would try one day where you just phone mobile numbers of tradespeople to see what the result is. I don't know what kinda product you are selling though. It works much better for me, although I'm not selling a B2B product altho I'm calling a B2B list during the day.

      200 dials I'd expect would be a mininum commitment. 400 dials and you are really getting somewhere. This is if you are calling a cold list as Claude pointed out.
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      • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
        Originally Posted by Matthew North View Post

        I love how you are breaking this down for everyone.

        I would try one day where you just phone mobile numbers of tradespeople to see what the result is. I don't know what kinda product you are selling though. It works much better for me, although I'm not selling a B2B product altho I'm calling a B2B list during the day.

        200 dials I'd expect would be a mininum commitment. 400 dials and you are really getting somewhere. This is if you are calling a cold list as Claude pointed out.
        Thanks, your advice has helped alot!

        Yes I have split the numbers out from landlines, mobile numbers, and non landline numbers etc 0845 / 0800. This is for another day. I really want maybe 3-4 pass on this list before moving on.

        I sell marketing from SEO / PPC / Web Design. Cold calling is fun, like digging for gold and totally not scared anymore lol

        Thanks
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  • Profile picture of the author misterme
    I didn't read all the comments above, but in case it was overlooked:

    I hope you're a hell of a lot more upbeat when you speak with people than you were on your recording. You even mumble. That could be a reason people are saying no. No enthusiasm for what you offer and a lack of sounding like you're on the ball.

    Then also, the reason you get objection after objection is ONLY because you keep trying to force yourself on them. Like with this: "I need to gather some information..." - - - Sounds like something The Terminator says to Sarah Connor when he comes back to kill her son. Stop pushing. Something more involving as "let's find out real quick if this is a good fit" might serve you better.
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  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    You should try incorporating Jason's "Is now a bad time to talk?" - I've been getting that from callers
    and if it is something I am interested in, I really appreciate the courtesy. I have the time then,
    I don't have the time then, or I anticipate not having the time then for a focused conversation.
    (I run a hotel and ingrained into my mind is that Friday through Monday I have to focus on the business at hand.) If I tell a rep to call back, they better listen as it is not a blow off.

    It sounds like you are calling a cold list. Maybe separately, or the same day, you might want to
    peruse for suspected clients by looking at their web presence and activity and call the likely ones.
    Similar to Matthew North's idea of setting aside at least a couple of hours for whale hunting, but now you are targeting lower hanging fruit - bread and butter clients.

    Who knows, you might find the DM's direct number this way.

    Not meaning to go off subject, but it seems for most business there are 3 to 7 marketing/customer
    retention activities that if done consistently will lead to an excellent amount of business. Consistent amount.

    Dan
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelWinicki
      Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

      Not meaning to go off subject, but it seems for most business there are 3 to 7 marketing/customer
      retention activities that if done consistently will lead to an excellent amount of business. Consistent amount.

      Dan
      That's pretty good insight Dan.

      Applies to prospecting too.

      Just this morning I thought, "I need to do more than just use telemarketing to find clients."

      I need to ramp up a direct mail program and space ads in trade journals.

      The telemarketing is fine.

      But I've found in the past that when I do "They call us instead of us calling them" marketing, that the quality of the prospect is higher.

      I need several ways to bring in potential clients.
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    Update.

    My number keeping has got a bit messy but I can present the following

    323 numbers
    3rd pass over

    5 leads in total

    3 leads in talks and chasing that have showed interest & curiosity & call back in a few months
    2 appointments attended today:
    1 set from last week - Is seeing another provider to compare, high change I might land this one
    1 deal closed today after coming back from first appointment and dialling 10 numbers and set appointment same day.

    1 Sale made for web design.

    I will probably make 2 more passes over the GK information numbers and Not answered just to make sure and then start my new batch next week sometime.

    Stay strong on the phone and hunt!

    Michael
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    • Profile picture of the author tryinhere
      Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

      1 Sale made for web design.
      Michael
      So from all of this work you have made one sale ? how many man hours have been put in at this stage ? as it seems like you have done a lot of hard yards to get this sale ? and has the $ per hour added up in a positive outcome
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      .

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      • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
        Originally Posted by tryinhere View Post

        So from all of this work you have made one sale ? how many man hours have been put in at this stage ? as it seems like you have done a lot of hard yards to get this sale ?
        Honestly?.....probably about 10 hours + plus driving time / gas. 120 total miles driving.

        It may seem it doesn't stack up but at this stage of my business and this new venture, I just want a result so I can refine in the future. I'll practice more calls and get my first 1,000 dials under my belt so I can get great.

        At some point I need to figure out how to close website deals over the phone and somehow avoid physical meetings. Still figuring that out.
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        • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
          Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

          Honestly?.....probably about 10 hours + plus driving time / gas. 120 total miles driving.

          It may seem it doesn't stack up but at this stage of my business and this new venture, I just want a result so I can refine in the future. I'll practice more calls and get my first 1,000 dials under my belt so I can get great.

          At some point I need to figure out how to close website deals over the phone and somehow avoid physical meetings.
          Still figuring that out.
          Each phone call and each visit will teach you something important.

          Try your best to keep good notes, or get your self some type of easy to
          use recording device.

          Closing on the phone ... easy stuff once you get systematic about things.

          With webdesign in particular ... you and them paint a picture together
          it doesn't have to be perfect. Perfect comes after you collect the money
          and you go back and forth on the actual "stage proofs"

          Don't get super techie - as a matter of fact, do your very best to
          not use any technical speak at all. Keep what your going to do for them
          on the level of a what a five year old will understand.

          You do that by breaking anything techie related into terms they
          are familiar with - like "hits, clicks and visitors " can be related
          to newspaper and magazine circulation.

          That's really the key, finding out what they relate to.
          If you can, it's the holy grail of the conversation.
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

          Honestly?.....probably about 10 hours + plus driving time / gas. 120 total miles driving.

          It may seem it doesn't stack up but at this stage of my business and this new venture, I just want a result so I can refine in the future. I'll practice more calls and get my first 1,000 dials under my belt so I can get great.

          At some point I need to figure out how to close website deals over the phone and somehow avoid physical meetings. Still figuring that out.
          Personally, I think you are miles ahead of most small business owners. You can always refine activity, and get better results. But it sure helps that you are really working.

          Yeah, closing the sale over the phone is probably the way to go. There are some real experts on that here, that I'm sure can help with that.

          But, if you are like me, one day...you'll just fall into a closed sale, over the phone...and it will feel as natural as walking. And you'll wonder why you ever did it any other way.
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          • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
            Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

            Personally, I think you are miles ahead of most small business owners. You can always refine activity, and get better results. But it sure helps that you are really working.

            Yeah, closing the sale over the phone is probably the way to go. There are some real experts on that here, that I'm sure can help with that.

            But, if you are like me, one day...you'll just fall into a closed sale, over the phone...and it will feel as natural as walking. And you'll wonder why you ever did it any other way.
            Always strikes me odd when people don't.

            I know it's a rare breed that can close in person AND on the phone.

            Luckily, I am one of those.

            I truly don't "get" why sales people are so locked into one or the other.

            Do you? Do you think it's just a comfort zone type of thing?
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            • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
              Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

              Always strikes me odd when people don't.

              I know it's a rare breed that can close in person AND on the phone.

              Luckily, I am one of those.

              I truly don't "get" why sales people are so locked into one or the other.

              Do you? Do you think it's just a comfort zone type of thing?
              I can definitely close over the phone. I have done so many times from inbound leads and referrals but when it comes to outbound cold prospects into leads, something happens, I just get the feeling I can close them better in person and that if I try to close over the phone, they will just back out completely.

              I wont know until I try. Lets try and if worse come sto worse, I can just drive to save the deal.
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              • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
                Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

                I can definitely close over the phone. I have done so many times from inbound leads and referrals but when it comes to outbound cold prospects into leads, something happens, I just get the feeling I can close them better in person and that if I try to close over the phone, they will just back out completely.

                I wont know until I try. Lets try and if worse come sto worse, I can just drive to save the deal.
                Most inbound salespeople have a hard time getting good at outbounds.
                Even when working "hot" lists.

                So much so, I wont hire them. The years have taught me that i'm on the
                losing end of that gamble.

                If its any consolation or if it means anything to you ....

                The few I have seen make the cross over - became super stars.

                I have asked all of them how/why, what make you different.

                The responses were all basically the same.

                When someone called them for something - they knew the prospect had
                high interest and wanted it.

                When doing out bounds they had to learn to create the interest first
                and then they had to learn to trust themselves that they actually
                created it.

                - that's not verbatim and its kinda wordy ... but its close enough
                for you to get the point, hopefully you find it helpful in your quest.
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            • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
              Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

              Always strikes me odd when people don't.

              I know it's a rare breed that can close in person AND on the phone.

              Luckily, I am one of those.

              I truly don't "get" why sales people are so locked into one or the other.

              Do you? Do you think it's just a comfort zone type of thing?
              Maybe unawareness of the fact that they are almost exactly the same process.

              We get used to our own patterns. At least, that's my excuse.
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            • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
              Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

              Always strikes me odd when people don't.

              I know it's a rare breed that can close in person AND on the phone.

              Luckily, I am one of those.

              I truly don't "get" why sales people are so locked into one or the other.

              Do you? Do you think it's just a comfort zone type of thing?
              I think it comes down to them getting comfortable with one and then sticking to it

              I also can do both with no problem, no 'nerves"...it is very natural to me, it is "what I do" LOL

              JMO - all this overthinking and buying all these "methods" makes people more unsure and insecure
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    I'm on a mission and will report back that result!
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    Update - New batch of numbers

    Evening cold calling starting at 5pm - 6pm

    1 hour call time

    43 Dials
    30 No Answers
    6 Gate Keeper with directions to call
    5 Not interested
    1 Hot lead
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  • Profile picture of the author momentum909
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author DABK
      Sears is a brand. It ain't thriving.

      Borders was a brand; it ain't no more. (Could cold calling have saved them?)

      Dominick's Food Stores was one of 2 big brand names. Is no more.

      Linen n things is gone too, was a well-known brand (Maybe they should have cold called?)

      How about Lehman Brothers and Delta Airlines?
      How about Pan Am or Eastern Airlines?
      How about Crown Books?

      Originally Posted by momentum909 View Post

      brands thrive....everything else cold call.
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      • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
        Originally Posted by DABK View Post

        Sears is a brand. It ain't thriving.

        Borders was a brand; it ain't no more. (Could cold calling have saved them?)

        Dominick's Food Stores was one of 2 big brand names. Is no more.

        Linen n things is gone too, was a well-known brand (Maybe they should have cold called?)

        How about Lehman Brothers and Delta Airlines?
        How about Pan Am or Eastern Airlines?
        How about Crown Books?
        LOL.....Monkey Wards.....Blockbuster.....Radio Shack is about to pull the plug...

        I have to laugh at a "stock" pusher who is against telemarketing

        Maybe could not cut it? Not everyone is good at phone calls
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        • Profile picture of the author colzinfobiz
          Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

          LOL.....Monkey Wards.....Blockbuster.....Radio Shack is about to pull the plug...

          I have to laugh at a "stock" pusher who is against telemarketing

          Maybe could not cut it? Not everyone is good at phone calls
          Yeah I can vouch for the phone calling part
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    Update: 5pm to 6pm

    1 Hour total calling time

    Followed up with an in depth chat with the lead from yesterday. Scheduled for Tuesday to continue. Confident a proposal will be put forward.

    Today's dials:
    Same list resuming from line 43
    19 Dials
    16 No answer
    2 Gatekeepers with directions to call
    1 Dead number

    Ecommerce list
    7 Dials
    1 DM - Not interested
    2 Gatekeepers
    3 No answers
    1 Lead

    Good result I think, the last lead seem talkative and suggested I start the process via email. Time to qualify him.

    If I'm being honest, these are not the big time types of clients I want. The client size I need are about 10+ employees so I will need rework the game plan and really infiltrate a larger business.

    Funny guy mr 909, not trying to build a brand with this venture btw, its a means to an end.
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    • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
      Is the end completely unrelated to this venture?

      If it is related, then you are building a future client and referral base. "Did you know we also do this.....?"
      (Even if these are "smaller" clients than you want.They may grow/acquire, own other businesses already, and know other business' Decision Makers. Eventually build in systematic, effective referral system.)

      Dan


      Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

      Update: 5pm to 6pm

      1 Hour total calling time

      Followed up with an in depth chat with the lead from yesterday. Scheduled for Tuesday to continue. Confident a proposal will be put forward.

      Today's dials:
      Same list resuming from line 43
      19 Dials
      16 No answer
      2 Gatekeepers with directions to call
      1 Dead number

      Ecommerce list
      7 Dials
      1 DM - Not interested
      2 Gatekeepers
      3 No answers
      1 Lead

      Good result I think, the last lead seem talkative and suggested I start the process via email. Time to qualify him.

      If I'm being honest, these are not the big time types of clients I want. The client size I need are about 10+ employees so I will need rework the game plan and really infiltrate a larger business.

      Funny guy mr 909, not trying to build a brand with this venture btw, its a means to an end.
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  • Profile picture of the author jackcarr
    Pretty interesting thread, looks like you made massive improvements by taking onboard the information given

    I would love to see a daily/weekly update in this thread on how your calls are going and how you are growing.

    Great job!
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    • Profile picture of the author kimwillis
      What a great thread - it's more like a sales clinic than a typical forum thread. Let's keep it going! And thanks to all contributors esp to John Durham.

      My 2 cents worth:

      1. Michael, if your recording is an accurate reflection of what happens on the actual call, I detect a big problem. You don't project well, and the core proposition is not compelling - it will be hard to stimulate interest.

      2. How You See Yourself. If you see yourself as a pitch man you probably push too hard and in response people naturally respond with a flight or fight response - they get angry or they run a mile, or both. It's better to see yourself as a player in the Game of Seduction. Seduction is about drawing people to you - to get them to lean forward so they WANT to learn more about your service.

      3. .Sifting More Than Pitching. Notwithstanding the previous point, the other contributors are spot on - sift as many people as possible. But unless you are really effective in the first 20 seconds of a call you may find that you are trawling through more people than you need to.
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    Update:

    Previous 3 leads have been closed so just waiting for payment which is frustrating as they have said yes.

    Today's calls
    Start Time 10.02
    Finish Time 12.17
    2hrs 15Mins

    78 Dials (Was abit slow today)

    21 GK
    22 NA
    13 NI-DM
    11 NI-GK
    4 VM - Left 4 but I should have left more
    4 Dead numbers
    2 Call Backs - Disconnection, most likely not interested but it wasn't confirmed.
    1 Lead - Scheduled phone meeting tomorrow

    The main thing to qualify tomorrow onwards is budget before presentation.
    Things to improve: by concentrating and counting 15 seconds before moving to next number for NA. I know I lost many minutes here.
    I'm going to do another round of cold calling later this evening at 5pm

    Michael
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    • Profile picture of the author savidge4
      Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

      Things to improve: by concentrating and counting 15 seconds before moving to next number for NA. I know I lost many minutes here.

      There is a bit of Phone Etiquette here that may be of some use for you. 6 rings is what is considered standard in the amount of rings you allow before hanging up. It is much easier to count rings than it is to figure out how long 15 seconds is... its right about the same time 6 rings vs 15 seconds. ( I called 3 different numbers I have 2 that were 12 seconds, and the last was 14. )
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      • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
        Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

        There is a bit of Phone Etiquette here that may be of some use for you. 6 rings is what is considered standard in the amount of rings you allow before hanging up. It is much easier to count rings than it is to figure out how long 15 seconds is... its right about the same time 6 rings vs 15 seconds. ( I called 3 different numbers I have 2 were 12 seconds, and the last was 14. )
        TY, needed that. I use a VOIP so not sure how many rings I hear, shows on the other end. Gonna try that out but great tip!
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    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

      Update:

      Previous 3 leads have been closed so just waiting for payment which is frustrating as they have said yes.
      In my world its not closed until you have the payment.

      When you say "waiting for payment" alarms bells go off for me ... as in you have a great chance that your going to be wasteing a lot of time chaseing phantom clients.

      If you don't mind me asking - how are you collecting payment, what
      is your process and why do you do it that way?

      Its very possible - I or a lot of others here can show you a better way.
      - If you want.

      Edit: I did not read the part below before I posted
      and its exactly what I mean about chasing phantoms

      Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

      "What's frustrating is all that work and still no payment even when closed, so now its the chasing game. Probably a total of maybe 21 hours put into this excluding 2 physical meeting costs."
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      • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
        Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

        In my world its not closed until you have the payment.

        When you say "waiting for payment" alarms bells go off for me ... as in you have a great chance that your going to be wasteing a lot of time chaseing phantom clients.

        If you don't mind me asking - how are you collecting payment, what
        is your process and why do you do it that way?

        Its very possible - I or a lot of others here can show you a better way.
        - If you want.

        Edit: I did not even read the part below before I posted
        and its exactly what I mean about chasing phantoms
        I get that, maybe its not closed. Both has said yes, all I can do is chase to get the budget it. Payment is bank transfer. Yes what is the better way? Is there one?
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        • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
          Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

          I get that, maybe its not closed. Both has said yes, all I can do is chase to get the budget it. Payment is bank transfer. Yes what is the better way? Is there one?
          Yes - Several of them actually.

          Since you did not tell me why your doing it that way - I have to
          make assumptions, please tell me if anything I say is wrong.

          Your doing bank transfers because you don't have a merchant account?

          On that assumption I'm going to ignore the obvious and not bother with
          explaining how to take credit cards.

          You, right now (as in today) - can do check by phone or check by fax.
          - check by phone is better.

          You can buy software that will allow you to manually type in
          the clients info and then print a check via your pc and then deposit it
          into your bank account. - its maybe $30.00 and you goto office
          depo to buy blank checks. They cost around 20.00 for 50 or 100.
          (I'm sure you can order them online as well)

          Doing it like this allows you to make the sale right then and there
          without any of the (will he or wont he send this to me)

          - That is one way. There are more. But this way is something you can start today
          and you don't have to mess around with credit inquiries, background checks or red tape.

          When you close them instead of saying "go grab your credit card ...."

          instead say -

          "Go grab a pen, a piece of paper and your check book and ill hold while
          you go do that."
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        • Profile picture of the author Barry Unruh
          Originally Posted by Michael Nguyen View Post

          IPayment is bank transfer. Yes what is the better way? Is there one?
          Ken's suggestion is great, but is there a reason you don't use a PayPal invoice if you do not have a different credit card processor?

          You can customize the header, add a logo, and make it look professional in the email.

          I have not used it for web design services, but I did use it extensively when I was writing for clients. I never once had a client hesitate to pay via a PayPal invoice, including several small corporate accounts.

          Then your phone close could include..."Do you prefer to pay check by phone, or should I email you an invoice so you can pay by credit card online?"

          Of course, if they are nearby, you can always pickup the check in person and shake their hand.
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    I forgot, today marks 1 month of cold calling!

    My stats are kinda messy tbh but it goes something like this:

    429 unique numbers. There was at least 3 passes over it on average
    Total 1,287 dials

    4 Leads
    2 Call back leads (Things might change their end)
    Total 6 leads

    2 Leads have been closed (still not paid, very frustrating)
    1 Lead was the influencer and was going to recommend me (high hopes for this)

    What's frustrating is all that work and still no payment even when closed, so now its the chasing game. Probably a total of maybe 21 hours put into this excluding 2 physical meeting costs.

    If it pays off, the total confirmed sales would be about $3947.51, just under $4k

    $3947.51 / 21 hours so far = $187ph or £118ph,
    Margins might be 50% so the hourly rate could be $93 or £59ph

    All the above means f'all until they all damn pay so I'm hopeful.

    I'm going to find a way to be more effiecient to increase that hourly rate.

    Good luck all.
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelWinicki
    Continues to be a very interesting thread...

    We've run into the same challenges cold-calling. The least desirable clients seem to be the easiest ones to get a hold of.

    Certainly there's a place for cold-calling.

    After spending several months at it, Dan Kennedy's model of putting out enough "hooks" and letting the clients raise their hands and come to you certainly has its merits also with maybe the most desirable being that potential clients are allowed to "gestate" until they realize they need your services and their level of skepticism has dwindled.
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Nguyen
    Update. Sorry I haven't kept this thread alive but I have big news:

    First major milestone!

    Just to give you an idea of my business. My main source of leads is through referrals and also leveraging a database of an development agency.

    I have cold called companies, to get face to face meetings (only a handful) and have closed deals.
    I have had referrals where I've closed on the phone without meetings.
    I have closed deals via leveraging an existing database / represented them, closed without meeting.

    BUT today is the first time I've been paid via a pure cold call with no face to face meeting for just under $800pm.

    This figure might seem low to some people but this figure represents that I can cold call and close deals without face to face meeting.

    This is big news to me, couldn't see it happening because I was working on this lead for 1.5 months.

    My back is still against the wall though so I'm not slowing down. I pulled 2 more leads out the bag today from 31 dials and 1hr 45m call time. I should give a bigger picture regarding my stats and how I'm progressing but its abit messy.

    Thanks for the support. Will be back.
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  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    ^^^^
    I know of at least a couple of people here who work internationally. It can definitely be done.
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    "If you think you're the smartest person in the room, then you're probably in the wrong room."

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  • Profile picture of the author MarcParkinson
    Personally, I have heard my cold-calling friends saying they don't completely give up even after getting 100's of NO's, they just keep improvising their script and approach till they make it work!
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    Michael....that is great that you closed one on phone only....congrats

    You sound like you are doing well, "almost there"....what may be lacking is the actual process - making it easy for them to pay

    While I like paypal....I was a betatester in 1998 LOL...you should know they changed their rules in June - virtual products (like online, or a web design) are now totally refundable - with like a 3 month leeway...so that might be something to consider

    I like the pay by check phone idea

    IMHO you need to work on the close too...when you close them get them involved and excited...."send over your graphics, lets' get your hosting set up, blah blah blah" so that "we" are moving right along

    close strong....get them involved

    If you are having trouble on the close, and you decide to drop the price a little, make it A CONDITION....TO DO IT NOW>..LIKE "WELL I GUESS I COULD GIVE YOU A BREAK HERE JOE BECAUSE I HAVE SOME TIME AVAILABLE THIS WEEK...SO IF YOU WANT ME TO START TODAY I CAN DO IT FOR $1000 (WHATEVER).....NOW....HOW DID YOU WANT TO DO THAT? MOST OF MY CLIENTS JUST DO THE CHECK ON THE PHONE...VERY EASY FOR BOTH OF US....I CAN HOLD WHILE YOU GET THE CHECKBOOK"
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  • Profile picture of the author PennyBurgess
    Personally I tweak my scripts after 50 No's (Not 50 calls) and I completely change the angel after 80 No's..

    Works for me..
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    • Profile picture of the author SashaLee
      Originally Posted by PennyBurgess View Post

      Personally I tweak my scripts after 50 No's (Not 50 calls) and I completely change the angel after 80 No's..

      Works for me..
      Hi there,

      All due respect, but if that's your approach then you really should read up on tele-selling techniques with particular emphasis on planning your calls. If this is truly your approach then you are the type of detested telemarketer who doesn't have the foggiest notion about message-to-market matching.

      "50 No's" "80 No's" - ridiculous.

      All the best,

      Sasha.
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      • Profile picture of the author Barry Unruh
        Personally I tweak my scripts after 50 No's (Not 50 calls) and I completely change the angel after 80 No's..
        Originally Posted by SashaLee View Post

        If this is truly your approach then you are the type of detested telemarketer who doesn't have the foggiest notion about message-to-market matching.
        Oh C'Mon Sasha.

        Surely you misunderstood her intent.

        If she can't get a yes on that 1 phone call after 50 No's, then she hangs up, tries one more call. When she gets to 30 No's on that call, she starts praying to God to send her another Angel.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rickeydt
    A list of some highly recommended book on cold calling:

    - Lessons from 100,000 Cold Calls by Stewart Rogers
    - Cold Calling Techniques: That Really Work! by Stephan Schiffman
    - Smart Calling: Eliminate the Fear, Failure, and Rejection from Cold Calling by Art Sobczak
    - I'd Rather Have a Root Canal Than do Cold Calling! by Shawn A. Greene
    - Red-Hot Cold Call Selling: Prospecting Techniques That Really Pay Off by Paul S. Goldner
    - Selling to Big Companies by Jill Konrath

    Also something highly profitable to take note of is the law of averages... you can find more info on this subject if you choose, but it basically states that no matter how many people you share your opportunity with, no matter how many people may not be interested - You will have a ratio, and once a ratio starts it tends to continue... so if you talk to 20 people and get 1 then your ratio is 1:20, so if you want five clients or conversions then talk to 100 people. So a person can make up in numbers what they lack in skill, and over time of course skill inevitably increases.
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  • Profile picture of the author SalesGod
    Skipped reading a lot of the stuff in between just read your first post and 2 others as I scrolled down. If your getting past your intro and getting them qualified you should be closing 90% on the appointment. Never give up and let them off the phone that's what average cold callers do. Champions set the appointment or get hung up on. No inbetween. If you pm me I can critique your script and get your closing ratio way up. I train appointment setters daily.
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