Selling SEO via leaflet distribution

luke4 9 years ago

Originally Posted by jazbo

I personally would chuck it in the bin.

Much better to connect with local businesses through social media.

We have social media accounts and we do do this. However, I'm looking for advice for leaflet distribution.
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nettiapina

9 years ago

If this sort of ad reached me I would be quite amused. Then again, I'm building web pages and doing some SEO too.

I think some businesses may react better to a slick leaflet than, say, email. Everyone needs a website nowadays, but there's quite a lot of entrepreneurs who are not good at that stuff.

Thanks
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Links in signature will not help your SEO. Not on this site, and not on any other forum.
Who told me this? An ex Google web spam engineer.

What's your excuse?

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luke4

9 years ago

Originally Posted by nettiapina

If this sort of ad reached me I would be quite amused. Then again, I'm building web pages and doing some SEO too.

I think some businesses may react better to a slick leaflet than, say, email. Everyone needs a website nowadays, but there's quite a lot of entrepreneurs who are not good at that stuff.

You'd laugh at a leaflet?

Well, this is why I have asked for some advice as to what would be best. If ROI claims and discounts don't work (these were just examples), what do you think will?

Thanks
1 reply

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nettiapina 9 years ago

Originally Posted by luke4

You'd laugh at a leaflet?

There was a disclaimer there. I'm doing SEO and websites, so I'd be amused about a flyer advertising those. I'm not in the target audience in any case.

Also, you might find my lack of faith in off-line marketing disturbing.

Well, I've not done that much of it, but the results were just abysmal. It's hard to find the right tone and content. I think Animal got it right, don't be too technical. You're probably not targeting the kind of guys who are already familiar with SEO and websites.
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Links in signature will not help your SEO. Not on this site, and not on any other forum.
Who told me this? An ex Google web spam engineer.

What's your excuse?
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DABK

9 years ago

Which businesses and why?

If it's general, it will work less effectively...

If you're doing SEO for orthodontists and I'm an orthodontist and your leaflet clearly says you're talking to orthodontists, you're a big step closer to me paying attention.

If it's for all orthodontist, it will work less effectively....

If it spoke to left-handed orthodontists and told them how your SEO gets left-handed orthodontists an advantage over right-handed orthodontists and I wanted to have an advantage over right-handed orthodontists, you'd be in business.

To summarize:
Be clear on who you're after and why: what pain they have that you address better (or, at least) differently than other people?

Read these threads for how to construct a good offer (don't forget to say, Thanks, Ewanmack:
http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...t-mailing.html

http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...-pages-ad.html

Originally Posted by luke4

So, I'm looking to doing some leaflet distribution in order to generate a few more sales for my SEO service. This will be B2B distribution across regions here in the UK mainly to industrial and business estates, not high streets.

As a business owner, what would you respond to on a leaflet advertising such services? Discounts, mentions of ROI, etc?

Any ideas would be appreciated!

Luke.

[ 2 ] Thanks
1 reply

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luke4

9 years ago

Originally Posted by DABK

Which businesses and why?

If it's general, it will work less effectively...

If you're doing SEO for orthodontists and I'm an orthodontist and your leaflet clearly says you're talking to orthodontists, you're a big step closer to me paying attention.

If it's for all orthodontist, it will work less effectively....

If it spoke to left-handed orthodontists and told them how your SEO gets left-handed orthodontists an advantage over right-handed orthodontists and I wanted to have an advantage over right-handed orthodontists, you'd be in business.

To summarize:
Be clear on who you're after and why: what pain they have that you address better (or, at least) differently than other people?

Read these threads for how to construct a good offer (don't forget to say, Thanks, Ewanmack:
http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...t-mailing.html

http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...-pages-ad.html

We will not be targeting individual industries or businesses, as this will mean we have to purchase lists and send these via Royal Mail at the price of a normal letter. Direct mail is something different and I already have a system in place for this. I'm looking for advice with regards to leaflets distributed to all businesses.

With the blanket distribution across industrial estates and business estates, we will be hitting all of them, no individual industries.

Thanks
1 reply

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DABK

9 years ago

So, what do the owners/presidents/managers of all these businesses have in common where SEO, and, more specifically, your way of doing SEO is the best answer?

When I ask my clients questions like these, they say: they want more leads or more money. And I can give that to them.

And that's true. But not enough.

I get lots of proposals like the one you're about to make... They all assume I'm interested in getting more leads/sales. They all propose a few minor changes to my site as the route to go. 99 out of 100 stop there.

Consider this:
some of the people will have tried SEO with good results
some of the people will have tried SEO with bad/indifferent results
some of the people are/were thinking about doing/buying SEO but don't because they don't know enough about it/a good provider
some of the people are about to go out of business

Each of the above responds differently... But, which one do you want as a client? Then fashion an offer to match that group.

Understand that most of your leaflets will get into the garbage bin without anyone reading more than 2 words. But if you have the right message for the interested ones, you'll make a sale or 5.

If you keep your message general, you'll have fewer, if any sales.

Then, make your leaflet scream to be read.

Your Last SEO Company Stole You Blind
will have no effect on the people who don't know/care about SEO but will get the ones whose last SEO company sucked to stop a sec.

Want to Triple Your Sales
will get all of them to say, Hell, yes... If they're like me, they'd say, Hell, yes while throwing your leaflet in the trash (jaded people response).

I've Tripled ABC Company's Sales in 4 Months and I Can Do The Same for Your Company

If they're like me and know ABC company, you've got their attention.
If, then, you move into SEO and don't address their SEO concerns, you lose them...

Just thinking in writing. My brain just got tired, so, see ya!

Originally Posted by luke4

We will not be targeting individual industries or businesses, as this will mean we have to purchase lists and send these via Royal Mail at the price of a normal letter. Direct mail is something different and I already have a system in place for this. I'm looking for advice with regards to leaflets distributed to all businesses.

With the blanket distribution across industrial estates and business estates, we will be hitting all of them, no individual industries.

[ 2 ] Thanks

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Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by luke4

So, I'm looking to doing some leaflet distribution in order to generate a few more sales for my SEO service. This will be B2B distribution across regions here in the UK mainly to industrial and business estates, not high streets.

As a business owner, what would you respond to on a leaflet advertising such services? Discounts, mentions of ROI, etc?

Any ideas would be appreciated!

Luke.

Luke;

It will work, but you'll have to do more than just hand out leaflets. If you just hand out 5,000 leaflets, you'll probably still get zero results.

But if you use the leaflet as a conversation starter, you'll have much better results.

It isn't the leaflet that sells. It's got to be you. You have to talk to your prospects in person. And a leaflet won't even get them to call for an appointment.

The leaflet is simply an excuse to talk to them. If you want to hand them a leaflet, fine. But it's incidental to talking to them.

Literally nobody is going to think, "Ahhh, a leaflet on SEO. I can't wait to read this!"

Again, a leaflet is simply something to do with your hands, while you talk to them.

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John Durham

9 years ago

My philosophy is to never hand them anything on paper, even a business card, until after you finish your presentation, including the close. Why? Because it's an excuse for them at the close to say "Okay, well I have your business card. I will think about this and call you if I'm ready", or "Okay, well I have your information, I will look it over with my colleges and get back to you".

Just my own take on it.

Thanks
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Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

My philosophy is to never hand them anything on paper, even a business card, until after you finish your presentation, including the close. Why? Because it's an excuse for them at the close to say "Okay, well I have your business card. I will think about this and call you if I'm ready", or "Okay, well I have your information, I will look it over with my colleges and get back to you".

Just my own take on it.

And that's exactly why anything I've handed out at conferences, in malls, when prospecting, is a simple sheet that has some advertising on it. I never hand out detailed lists of what I sell, or a detailed pitch. I want them to be able to read everything on the page in less than ten seconds. That makes the paper superfluous.

For example, in malls, I only hand out brochures to people that talk to me. But as I'm handing it over, I ask a couple of qualifying questions. It is the time that the flyer gives me, that makes it valuable. It isn't anything on the flyer itself. It's a prop.

To me, even leaving a detailed brochure when I leave, is a waste of time. The conversation is everything. The brochure is nothing.

Cards are things I give to people I don't want to talk to again.

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John Durham

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

Cards are things I give to people I don't want to talk to again.

Claude,

We, as old pro's who know, agree.

That doesn't come from reading the Warrior Forum alone....Hopefully it will now.

Claude, you stand for more than MERE money. You stand for the posterity of our great (timeless) art, and passing along the insights.

We are of the same heart in that way.

Consequently;

The guys who ignore us may be spinning their wheels for years...

Why do I care?

I don't know...You probably don't either... But it has something to do with paying it forward I'm sure.

Thanks
1 reply

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luke4

9 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

Claude,

We, as old pro's who know, agree.

That doesn't come from reading the Warrior Forum alone....Hopefully it will now.

Claude, you stand for more than MERE money. You stand for the posterity of our great (timeless) art, and passing along the insights.

We are of the same heart in that way.

Consequently;

The guys who ignore us may be spinning their wheels for years...

Why do I care?

I don't know...You probably don't either... But it has something to do with paying it forward I'm sure.

Sorry if I offend you here John, but what exactly did this post bring to the thread? Please don't refer to yourself as a "pro". Try to act with a little more humility, especially given your history.

I'm fed up of some of the arrogance and lack of modesty shown by a number of people on these forums. To answer your other recent thread God this subforum moves slow these days..., it's because of the conceited views of a certain few.

This forum and this subforum in particular has helped me a great deal of the years, but please refrain from trying to become an authority. I see past the sleaziness and a lot of your posts are coming across as the very opposite of genuine.

Thanks
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John Durham

9 years ago

Originally Posted by luke4

Sorry if I offend you here John, but what exactly did this post bring to the thread? Please don't refer to yourself as a "pro". Try to act with a little more humility, especially given your history.

There isnt any arrogance here luke. I am in fact an old professional. Around here that is not always a compliment. If you had any humility yourself, you just would say "Thank you for the advice. It was sound".

For someone to take time out of their day to offer their experience to your thread and for you to come back like that is what lacks humility. I felt the business card advice was helpful. Maybe you didnt...

Originally Posted by luke4

Sorry if I offend you here John, but what exactly did this post bring to the thread?

It was an encouraging commendation to another Warrior, saying I recognize and appreciate his intentions... and an affirmation that two people who have spent at alot of time selling are in agreement.

Pointing out the sense of agreement nails down that fact that it is good advice for others who may read. Maybe helping them to not make the mistake..

Thanks
1 reply

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luke4

9 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

There isnt any arrogance here luke. I am in fact an old professional. Around here that is not always a compliment. If you had any humility yourself, you just would say "Thank you for the advice. It was sound".

For someone to take time out of their day to offer their experience to your thread and for you to come back like that is what lacks humility.

Where was the advice exactly? I asked for advice regarding leaflet distribution, being mailed to business estates by a third party. Others had information to give based on my first post, but yours was completely irrelevant.

Your first post was absolutely nothing to do with leaflet distribution, it was just a chance to spout your "philosophy" on handing out business cards and presentations. Your second post was self-congratulating yourself coinciding with a little sucking up to Claude. Don't turn things around John, it makes you look silly.

I wholeheartedly agree with Underground, I think there's an ulterior motive to every post and every piece of "sound advice" you give. Because of this, any posts you put on here I just can't take seriously and I sit behind the laptop, cringing with awkwardness. God help those who buy your next WSO. I'm not grateful for your "advice" because I truly don't think it's sincere.

Thanks

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yukon

Banned 9 years ago

I would make a paper airplane & throw it across the office.

Thanks
1 reply

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DABK

9 years ago

You forgot the window was open, so it flew out the window and landed in the accountant's office across the street. They want to double their revenues by the end of next year and have money in the coffers, so, they say, Why the hell not?

And luke4 owes you 10% finder's fee and a big thank you.

Originally Posted by yukon

I would make a paper airplane & throw it across the office.

Thanks
1 reply

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yukon

Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by DABK

You forgot the window was open, so it flew out the window and landed in the accountant's office across the street. They want to double their revenues by the end of next year and have money in the coffers, so, they say, Why the hell not?

And luke4 owes you 10% finder's fee and a big thank you.

Really it landed three cubicles over but had some good hang time.

Handing out random flyers isn't very targeted. Just because someone owns a business doesn't qualify them as a client.

Thanks
1 reply

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DABK 9 years ago

Precisely. That's why you have to hand out tons and tons.

Fish lay 300,000 eggs to make a handful of babies... then they put no effort into the baking of the babies. Hens lay a handful of eggs to make a handful of babies... Then, they put effort into the baby-baking part.

In the end, they both end with what they want.

Same with marketing. Give 300k leaflets, you end up with a handful of sales. Target very narrowly, and you end up with a handful of sales.

You still put effort into it... just in different parts of the process...

Me, I'd get annoyed... no, it would kill me to give out thousands of leaflets... but doing some brainstorming on what the people I want as clients and where to reach them is exciting.

But, alas, I'm not The Mold, other people have different preferences. And, as long as they understand the limitations of the route they choose, they end up with what they want.

Originally Posted by yukon

Handing out random flyers isn't very targeted. Just because someone owns a business doesn't qualify them as a client.
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quadagon

9 years ago

Luke4 that only thing I'd add is that as a business owner I'm unlikely to see your flyer. Incoming mail and phone calls are filtered. The letters that bypass reception tend to be handwritten envelopes, ones marked private and confidential and from a select few of important clients. It's been months since a flyer landed on my desk.

As were a marketing firm we do have a swipe meeting once a month where we go through incoming mail but that's for inspiration.

Thanks

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luke4

9 years ago

Big thanks to all the helpful replies!

For those that decided to go off topic... cheers!

Thanks

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animal44

9 years ago

Originally Posted by luke4

As a business owner, what would you respond to on a leaflet advertising such services? Discounts, mentions of ROI, etc?

I'm dubious that many people would respond to a leaflet offering SEO. It's seen as a dodgy industry and if they know they need SEO, they'd try and find a referral rather than advertising.

If they don't know they need it then they probably won't know what you're talking about...

When I was still offering SEO, we distributed info leaflets at networking meetings. These were problem/solution information with a simple "call us if you need further info or help" type call to action. The info was basically a how to, for common problems we identified, but without too much technical detail. We stopped in Oct 2011 and we continued to have calls from these info leaflets this year...

We built our business on referrals and networking. I don't mean BNI type networking, I mean making it a habit to take someone new out to lunch or coffee every week. No selling, purely to find out what they do and why they do it. And hopefully they will want to know about you too (and in most cases they do). If they show interest, then make an appointment, but keep the lunch as social...

Also become a connector. You get them talking about any business issues, then refer someone you've previously met, perhaps inviting them both to lunch together. You then gain a reputation of being someone who knows useful people. Your name gets around without advertising...

Offering discounts attracts the wrong type of client. We started out offering a free SEO audit, then we started charging for the audit. We got less enquiries, but conversions sky-rocketed and the quality of client went up too...

If I were to start again in the SEO business, I'd find some other service as an entry point - one that produces results fast. That way you build trust in your expertise. We started offering customer reactivation sequences in order to quickly generate cash to pay for our SEO - free SEO

However we found most businesses were more interested in doing more customer reactivations than the SEO, so we more or less dropped SEO. We still do some onsite where necessary...

Gotta go...

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luke4

9 years ago

Originally Posted by animal44

I'm dubious that many people would respond to a leaflet offering SEO. It's seen as a dodgy industry and if they know they need SEO, they'd try and find a referral rather than advertising.

If they don't know they need it then they probably won't know what you're talking about...

When I was still offering SEO, we distributed info leaflets at networking meetings. These were problem/solution information with a simple "call us if you need further info or help" type call to action. The info was basically a how to, for common problems we identified, but without too much technical detail. We stopped in Oct 2011 and we continued to have calls from these info leaflets this year...

We built our business on referrals and networking. I don't mean BNI type networking, I mean making it a habit to take someone new out to lunch or coffee every week. No selling, purely to find out what they do and why they do it. And hopefully they will want to know about you too (and in most cases they do). If they show interest, then make an appointment, but keep the lunch as social...

Also become a connector. You get them talking about any business issues, then refer someone you've previously met, perhaps inviting them both to lunch together. You then gain a reputation of being someone who knows useful people. Your name gets around without advertising...

Offering discounts attracts the wrong type of client. We started out offering a free SEO audit, then we started charging for the audit. We got less enquiries, but conversions sky-rocketed and the quality of client went up too...

If I were to start again in the SEO business, I'd find some other service as an entry point - one that produces results fast. That way you build trust in your expertise. We started offering customer reactivation sequences in order to quickly generate cash to pay for our SEO - free SEO

However we found most businesses were more interested in doing more customer reactivations than the SEO, so we more or less dropped SEO. We still do some onsite where necessary...

Gotta go...

Interesting read, thanks! With regards to the leaflets, do you think it would be wise to advertise more leads/sales and then only mention SEO when they ring up? Although my website name has "seo" in it so this may prove to be difficult...

Thanks
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animal44

9 years ago

Originally Posted by luke4

Interesting read, thanks! With regards to the leaflets, do you think it would be wise to advertise more leads/sales and then only mention SEO when they ring up? Although my website name has "seo" in it so this may prove to be difficult...

I wouldn't mention SEO at all. Come up with analogies that the business owner understands.

When the business owner calls, I'd get them doing most of the talking. Ask lots of open questions.

SEO in the website URL probably won't matter, most won't know what SEO is anyway... though some will and may be put off...

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John Durham

9 years ago

Good luck man. If you can see through your ill feelings long enough to use the advice, it was good and will help you.

Later.

Thanks

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Steve The Copywriter

9 years ago

...Sorry to barge in here but I saw the word "leaflet."

Which to me is a phenomenal flyer (always use with care and caution - they are tremendous when people would much prefer not to be hassled with a "cold" verbal sales spiel * - make that around 97.979% of the worlds population).

And yes with the perfect message aimed at the ideal audience they can produce staggeringly good results.

It's the copy that will make or break it. For example nobody wants top notch copy - they want a huge boost in business with a massive surge of cash and profits.

SEO is not my main area of expertise - but I imagine nobody wants it either - they want their interweb site to be at the top of the page.

Steve

* not to be confused with the good people who are actively looking to make a purchase.

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luke4

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter

...Sorry to barge in here but I saw the word "leaflet."

Which to me is a phenomenal flyer (always use with care and caution - they are tremendous when people would much prefer not to be hassled with a "cold" verbal sales spiel * - make that around 97.979% of the worlds population).

And yes with the perfect message aimed at the ideal audience they can produce staggeringly good results.

It's the copy that will make or break it. For example nobody wants top notch copy - they want a huge boost in business with a massive surge of cash and profits.

SEO is not my main area of expertise - but I imagine nobody want it either - they want their interweb site to be at the top of the page.

Steve

* not to be confused with the good people who are actively looking to make a purchase.

Thanks Steve!

It seems that I need to focus on selling it as "more sales for your business" rather than mentioning SEO

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animal44

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter

Which to me is a phenomenal flyer (always use with care and caution - they are tremendous when people would much prefer not to be hassled with a "cold" verbal sales spiel * - make that around 97.979% of the worlds population).

Based on this forum you might believe that Americans enjoy being hassled by cold callers...

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quadagon

9 years ago

When I helped promote a web designer for 'mobilegedden' we used a two touch formula that you may be able to adapt.

On the first mailing we set it up as a challenge to find your site online through your mobile phone. We placed rules that you can't use URL, third party sites or your company name.

The idea was to get them to search something like 'emergency plumber Manchester'

We finished the mailing off with 'if it took longer than 30 seconds you lose.'

The follow up was industry specific so not quite what you are looking for. In this we sent a simple message saying 'In <month> you lost out on <£xxxxxxx> just because your site isn't mobile optimised. How much will you loose when mobilegedden strikes?'

We used keyword search volume and times it by published average job cost to attain the amount.

Probably the biggest point I'd make is that our fear of loss is stronger than our desire for gain. It may seem that ROI is attractive but lost business can be a bigger motivator.

Eric

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