Are any Warriors interested in this idea..... (or does it already exist?)

by garyfromdurham 35 replies
Hi

I am getting a lot of offline work and know the basics enough to make a good living but I don't have enough knowledge for a lot of the extra jobs I could be getting and I hate the thought of leaving money on the table.

There must be others who are like me!!


Some Warriors are experts on Google Places. Others specialise in QR codes and mobile web sites, while others excel at SEO etc.

There are also some who are great salespeople but they don't have the SEO knowledge to fulfill the job.

Would a group of Warriors be interested in teaming up and pooling our experience and resources together to create a 'supergroup' so that no matter what job needed to be done on behalf of our offline clients, there would be somebody who could do it and we would not have to turn work down.

The logistics would need to be sorted out such as how the money would be divided, but I am sure that there is potential in this idea.

What I am proposing is not just outsourcing but to work with a team that we knew and trusted.

Does this idea have legs? Is it already being done and I don't know about it? Let me know your thoughts.

Thanks

Gary
#offline marketing #exist #interested #warriors
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  • Profile picture of the author John Sullivan
    I think this is a good idea Gary. There are probably many people who simply don't have the time or knowledge to do all the tasks that businesses may want.

    John
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    • Profile picture of the author garyfromdurham
      Originally Posted by John Sullivan View Post

      I think this is a good idea Gary. There are probably many people who simply don't have the time or knowledge to do all the tasks that businesses may want.

      John
      John

      Thanks.

      That is what I was thinking.

      For example I have some great clients but there is no way that I could create a mobile web site for them and I am still trying to get my head round QR codes and some aspects of SEO.

      However, because I already have my foot in the door and they know and like me it would be so much easier to suggest other essential services to them.

      A reliable group where we could all pool our resources and services together could be a great solution.

      I am sure that something could be done to make this work?

      Regards

      Gary
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  • Profile picture of the author jr1228
    Yes, I would be very interested in something like this.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nevin McQ
    I would be interested but before I give full identity and other particulars..though not perfect I would all want us to be on a conference call or webinar.

    I need to see these people and hear them

    Originally Posted by garyfromdurham View Post

    Hi

    I am getting a lot of offline work and know the basics enough to make a good living but I don't have enough knowledge for a lot of the extra jobs I could be getting and I hate the thought of leaving money on the table.

    There must be others who are like me!!

    Some Warriors are experts on Google Places. Others specialise in QR codes and mobile web sites, while others excel at SEO etc.

    There are also some who are great salespeople but they don't have the SEO knowledge to fulfill the job.

    Would a group of Warriors be interested in teaming up and pooling our experience and resources together to create a 'supergroup' so that no matter what job needed to be done on behalf of our offline clients, there would be somebody who could do it and we would not have to turn work down.

    The logistics would need to be sorted out such as how the money would be divided, but I am sure that there is potential in this idea.

    What I am proposing is not just outsourcing but to work with a team that we knew and trusted.

    Does this idea have legs? Is it already being done and I don't know about it? Let me know your thoughts.

    Thanks

    Gary
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  • Profile picture of the author winston
    I would be interested.
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    • Profile picture of the author garyfromdurham
      Its good to see some interest, but does anybody have some ideas on how it would work?

      How big should the group be?

      How would you prove credentials?

      Has anybody seen a group like this in practise?

      I think it has a lot of potential but Nevin expressed some concerns that he had.

      Looking forward to seeing some suggestions.

      Gary
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  • Profile picture of the author WillDL
    I'd be very interested in something like this, and I've considered starting something like this as a side line.

    There are two ways to go about doing this. The simplest would be to build a rolodex of other consultants who specialize in what you don't want to touch. Simply don't mention to the client someone else is doing the work, outsource the services you don't want to do to whomever, and take 20%. Sign non-competes stating that so long as the referer provides service to that client, the referred can't offer services directly.

    The much harder, but far more powerful option is to create an LLC with each member a specialist in something. Leverage each others' credibility and client base into one new organization. You would no longer be your own company but a member of a new corporation. Agree on something like even profit sharing and start a concerted marketing effort to bring together new clients for your new business.

    Obviously this requires a lot more caution. You don't want to be permanent partners with someone you know very little about. And you have to create a company, and that means you take on a level of legal liability for each other (granted not much). But the rewards would be amazing. Each person can specialize in whatever they are best at and not worry about the other stuff while still providing phenomenal service.

    Also, say Gary, myself (located in Charleston SC) and someone in San Fransisco decide to create the firm "Business Matrix International". Suddenly, we are one international firm, with offices in England, and both coasts of the US. 3 specialists in one firm with triple (well double, I'm in house, but I could leave and keep my current employer as a client) the number of clients.

    Instant international powerhouse. And our annual board meeting in the Caribbean is a business expense.
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    • Profile picture of the author garyfromdurham
      Originally Posted by WillDL View Post

      I'd be very interested in something like this, and I've considered starting something like this as a side line.

      Also, say Gary, myself (located in Charleston SC) and someone in San Fransisco decide to create the firm "Business Matrix International". Suddenly, we are one international firm, with offices in England, and both coasts of the US. 3 specialists in one firm with triple (well double, I'm in house, but I could leave and keep my current employer as a client) the number of clients.

      Instant international powerhouse. And our annual board meeting in the Caribbean is a business expense.
      That was an excellent post and thank you for putting so much thought into it. I really appreciate your suggestions.

      Your example of how powerful having a resource like this at our finger tips was very powerful. Instead of being a small independent geeky web guy/gal it would be much more impressive to be part of an international company.

      Thanks again for your great ideas

      Gary

      PS. The board meeting in the Bahamas sounds perfect ha ha
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      • Profile picture of the author WillDL
        Originally Posted by garyfromdurham View Post

        That was an excellent post and thank you for putting so much thought into it. I really appreciate your suggestions.

        Your example of how powerful having a resource like this at our finger tips was very powerful. Instead of being a small independent geeky web guy/gal it would be much more impressive to be part of an international company.

        Thanks again for your great ideas

        Gary

        PS. The board meeting in the Bahamas sounds perfect ha ha

        Like I said, I've been thinking about this for a while. The risk of going into business with people I don't really know has turned me off so far.
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        • Profile picture of the author garyfromdurham
          Originally Posted by WillDL View Post

          Like I said, I've been thinking about this for a while. The risk of going into business with people I don't really know has turned me off so far.
          That is the challenge.

          If we can work round this and manage to create a trustworthy, talented super-group this idea could be dynamite

          Gary
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          • Profile picture of the author WillDL
            Originally Posted by garyfromdurham View Post

            That is the challenge.

            If we can work round this and manage to create a trustworthy, talented super-group this idea could be dynamite

            Gary
            I'm of the opinion it can't be done without real names, proof of identity, etc. being exchanged from when serious talks begin. And at least three of the following four (preferably all of them).

            1) A year of communication in the build up, with referrals between each other (think the simple method) to make sure we work well together. Could be a great idea, and everyone be great, but still just not get along or work well together.
            2) Dynamite lawyers to set up company and exit strategy, and how to handle dissolving the business if it doesn't work out all spelled out and agreed upon from the start. We need one for each country we would have a members in.
            3) An international Law firm or consulting business to advise on the best structure and banking procedures.
            4)Multiple in person meetings. Because, I trust a handshake more than an email. And hey, tax deductible vacations as we visit each other's cities.

            EDIT: Another huge benefit of the "form a company together model" you can invest in a much better infrastructure and spread the cost of the investment. For example, call routing systems and hiring really good, in house receptionists gets cheaper. I'm a big fan of in housing your receptionist if you can afford it. The person who answers the phone is just too important to leave to outsourcing.

            Before you started this thread, I was really close to taking the half-assed approach and creating "SEO Backoffice" Comprehensive CRM, SEO, and Payment Handling. Hire and train a really good telemarketing room and a few really good receptionists then charge for our services. Follow up by having a vetted referral exchange among members. I just couldn't decide if there were enough real businesses around to support it.

            But honestly, developing all that for strict in house use (spreading the cost among, say five partners) would be way better and create the infrastructure we'd need to scale out into a real, sustainable multi-national firm.
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            • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
              Gary not interested.

              Reason being have one business model which
              is very well structured for the most profit.

              Plus it is very scalable.

              Plus it allows us to be known as a specialist.

              Specialist tend to be more valued and have less resistance to higher fees.

              Those are the reasons off the top of my head.

              Best,
              Ewen

              P.S. Stops the time wasting distractions too.
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              • Profile picture of the author WillDL
                Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

                Gary not interested.

                Reason being have one business model which
                is very well structured for the most profit.

                Plus it is very scalable.

                Plus it allows us to be known as a specialist.

                Specialist tend to be more valued and have less resistance to higher fees.

                Those are the reasons off the top of my head.

                Best,
                Ewen

                P.S. Stops the time wasting distractions too.
                Marketing firms run by specialists, and make no mistake you should continue to build yourself up as a brand personally, can command higher fees. And they can pitch to Nike a lot more easily than a single specialist.

                Another nice thing is, when you decide to retire you have an asset that you can sell without destroying the brand. If you build yourself as the brand, it's harder to pass the business along. One of the rockstar partners in an international firm retiring... No one cares, the firm still has its track record and authority.

                The ideas are two very separate things. An outsource pool is a great resource. It will help you grow your business, better serve your clients, not worry about outsourcers flaking out, and hopefully cut costs.

                I have a rolodex (by which I mean contact book in outlook) of outsourcers I use regularly. It saves me a lot of headache.

                A merger between existing businesses is different. The only reason to do it is because all the partners have something real and tangible to offer. There'd be no taking a chance on the new guy, no risking dead weight. Say five of us, the ones with established authority as marketers not just "web guys" form a national, or international multi-office firm.

                We are then much better positioned to offer services to national and international clients. Could you do it on your own? Sure! But as a collective you'll do it better and handle more, major accounts.

                Then the new firm keeps using its outsourcers and when it pays an individual outsourcer enough to justify it offer them a full time job. Build a permanent talent pool you control. Programmers, presenters, copywriters, the works. Again you can do it on your own, but I firmly believe there is a point where you want to build brand in your business rather than brand in yourself. Then if something were to happen to you, your spouse and kids would own 20% of a major company, instead of your clients scattering to the wind.

                No, I'm not trying to start a new business. But the benefits, to the right group, are staggering.
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            • Profile picture of the author Nevin McQ
              All excellent and exactly the way I think on this topic.

              I have been involved in to many great ideas where things all just seem to fall apart.

              I always say to potential partners "look you have chased me but I only do when people are serious"

              This is a great idea and I am glad to see some of the thinking to move it forward.

              Some type of video conference call would be needed

              Originally Posted by WillDL View Post

              I'm of the opinion it can't be done without real names, proof of identity, etc. being exchanged from when serious talks begin. And at least three of the following four (preferably all of them).

              1) A year of communication in the build up, with referrals between each other (think the simple method) to make sure we work well together. Could be a great idea, and everyone be great, but still just not get along or work well together.
              2) Dynamite lawyers to set up company and exit strategy, and how to handle dissolving the business if it doesn't work out all spelled out and agreed upon from the start. We need one for each country we would have a members in.
              3) An international Law firm or consulting business to advise on the best structure and banking procedures.
              4)Multiple in person meetings. Because, I trust a handshake more than an email. And hey, tax deductible vacations as we visit each other's cities.

              EDIT: Another huge benefit of the "form a company together model" you can invest in a much better infrastructure and spread the cost of the investment. For example, call routing systems and hiring really good, in house receptionists gets cheaper. I'm a big fan of in housing your receptionist if you can afford it. The person who answers the phone is just too important to leave to outsourcing.

              Before you started this thread, I was really close to taking the half-assed approach and creating "SEO Backoffice" Comprehensive CRM, SEO, and Payment Handling. Hire and train a really good telemarketing room and a few really good receptionists then charge for our services. Follow up by having a vetted referral exchange among members. I just couldn't decide if there were enough real businesses around to support it.

              But honestly, developing all that for strict in house use (spreading the cost among, say five partners) would be way better and create the infrastructure we'd need to scale out into a real, sustainable multi-national firm.
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              • Profile picture of the author marcopetriz
                With my experience, the best thing you can do is, do it yourself of hire someone for an expecific work and that's it. Less problems.
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                • Profile picture of the author BruceWood
                  Originally Posted by marcopetriz View Post

                  With my experience, the best thing you can do is, do it yourself of hire someone for an expecific work and that's it. Less problems.
                  I'm with Marco on this one. Your idea is idealistic, and that's great, but no matter what you call it, it looks like a marketing agency. There's a lot of profit to be made, and a ton of potential headaches with a formal organization like that. By simply assembling a team for new projects and keeping a good Rolodex to farm things out, you can thrive as a one-man shop.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Amir Luis
                    Originally Posted by BruceWood View Post

                    I'm with Marco on this one. Your idea is idealistic, and that's great, but no matter what you call it, it looks like a marketing agency. There's a lot of profit to be made, and a ton of potential headaches with a formal organization like that. By simply assembling a team for new projects and keeping a good Rolodex to farm things out, you can thrive as a one-man shop.
                    This is basically what I have done... It has taken some time + trial and error.


                    But instead of an agency model... what about an association of internet marketing professionals.

                    By professionals for professionals.
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            • Profile picture of the author John Williamson
              I might be interested in something like this.

              Originally Posted by WillDL View Post

              I'm of the opinion it can't be done without real names, proof of identity, etc. being exchanged from when serious talks begin. And at least three of the following four (preferably all of them).

              1) A year of communication in the build up, with referrals between each other (think the simple method) to make sure we work well together. Could be a great idea, and everyone be great, but still just not get along or work well together.
              2) Dynamite lawyers to set up company and exit strategy, and how to handle dissolving the business if it doesn't work out all spelled out and agreed upon from the start. We need one for each country we would have a members in.
              3) An international Law firm or consulting business to advise on the best structure and banking procedures.
              4)Multiple in person meetings. Because, I trust a handshake more than an email. And hey, tax deductible vacations as we visit each other's cities.

              EDIT: Another huge benefit of the "form a company together model" you can invest in a much better infrastructure and spread the cost of the investment. For example, call routing systems and hiring really good, in house receptionists gets cheaper. I'm a big fan of in housing your receptionist if you can afford it. The person who answers the phone is just too important to leave to outsourcing.

              Before you started this thread, I was really close to taking the half-assed approach and creating "SEO Backoffice" Comprehensive CRM, SEO, and Payment Handling. Hire and train a really good telemarketing room and a few really good receptionists then charge for our services. Follow up by having a vetted referral exchange among members. I just couldn't decide if there were enough real businesses around to support it.

              But honestly, developing all that for strict in house use (spreading the cost among, say five partners) would be way better and create the infrastructure we'd need to scale out into a real, sustainable multi-national firm.
              I don't think he's exactly talking about a 'company,' more of a group to help each other get tasks done.
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  • Profile picture of the author ejb2059
    Originally Posted by garyfromdurham View Post

    Hi

    I am getting a lot of offline work and know the basics enough to make a good living but I don't have enough knowledge for a lot of the extra jobs I could be getting and I hate the thought of leaving money on the table.

    There must be others who are like me!!

    Some Warriors are experts on Google Places. Others specialise in QR codes and mobile web sites, while others excel at SEO etc.

    There are also some who are great salespeople but they don't have the SEO knowledge to fulfill the job.

    Would a group of Warriors be interested in teaming up and pooling our experience and resources together to create a 'supergroup' so that no matter what job needed to be done on behalf of our offline clients, there would be somebody who could do it and we would not have to turn work down.

    The logistics would need to be sorted out such as how the money would be divided, but I am sure that there is potential in this idea.

    What I am proposing is not just outsourcing but to work with a team that we knew and trusted.

    Does this idea have legs? Is it already being done and I don't know about it? Let me know your thoughts.

    Thanks

    Gary
    Great idea
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  • Profile picture of the author AnthonyR
    board meeting in the Bahamas...ok I'm in.

    It does sound like a great idea. Maybe you could hire people from your area

    who have some knowledge with marketing and then have a specialist train them

    or have them take a course on whatever it is that you want them to do specifically.

    It's a process but I think it would be worth it. Thanks for posting the question, now

    I have my wheels turning
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  • Profile picture of the author deannatroupe
    I like the idea of building a rolodex or directory of people that you trust to work with. I think the people you choose would have to have done work with other Warriors that can vouch for them. Maybe you could set up a website where people could register their business information and then there could be an overseeing body that would verify their references. I'll probably have more ideas later on. This is just off the top of my head. I'd be interested in participating in something like this as a service provider. I'm great at doing the tasks, just not all that interested in doing the prospecting right now.
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    • Profile picture of the author Doran Peck
      Originally Posted by deannatroupe View Post

      I like the idea of building a rolodex or directory of people that you trust to work with. I think the people you choose would have to have done work with other Warriors that can vouch for them. Maybe you could set up a website where people could register their business information and then there could be an overseeing body that would verify their references. I'll probably have more ideas later on. This is just off the top of my head. I'd be interested in participating in something like this as a service provider. I'm great at doing the tasks, just not all that interested in doing the prospecting right now.
      Yes this really simplifies things. There would need to be a leader or governing body...I think the OP Gary is a fine choice...watched his comments...seems pretty solid...plus its his brilliant idea

      It would essentially be his thing to own and control....so...build it and we will come

      interested service providers could set up service packages, and offer them to the group at "wholesale" like pricing ( sort of like a WSO) for the group to tap into them as a resource.

      Perhaps there may be a mastermind type aspect to this where a group of people are asked to collectively input on what the best set of packages will be for a particular client project. - After the actual service providers are taken care of, a preset percentage of profit revenue would divide amongst mastermind contributors - and if that client was brought in by centralized website property, then some of that revenue would go back to self marketing/promotion or other needs of the association and its owner.

      If A member captures a client personally, then he would be able to tap into the available package offerings at their wholesale price. If mastermind is envoked, then those members also benefit based on the preset percentage of a sale...and the remaining revenue to the originator of the sale.

      if service providers underperformed then they could be replaced ( kinda like band members) at the descretion of the association government or owner.

      Just some thoughts for chewing on.


      DP
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Grant
    Pending on the particulars, I may be interested as this may help me scale even further but we'd have to figure something out because you're in the UK, I think, Gary. There's a ton of Is to be dotted and Ts to be crossed if this was to take place.
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    • Profile picture of the author Amir Luis
      Originally Posted by mgtarheels View Post

      Pending on the particulars, I may be interested as this may help me scale even further but we'd have to figure something out because you're in the UK, I think, Gary. There's a ton of Is to be dotted and Ts to be crossed if this was to take place.

      I do agree.... with the I and T's ... But... This is an excellent idea.


      Joint Ventures on Crack. The idea has crossed my mind a time or three too.

      It would just make logistics easier...

      Sell the deal... the send out the work orders... But to trusted people with agreed upon pricing... and a solid track record....

      I think the idea is solid.... the logistics could turn into a nightmare.


      But not really... I mean... I have an SEO guy... a Video Guy... a web guy... and a social media guy...

      I am already doing what you are proposing....

      I judge people by what they do and not by what they say... If one guy/girl falls short of my chosen ideal or doesn't perform up to par... I move on... I have three in each field.

      Most are on this forum....
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  • Profile picture of the author realdude
    Gary, great idea. If this was being proposed in the public forum I would be very skeptical, but this forum lends itself to a level of comfort.

    From my experience you don't need to go through the hassle of forming a legal entity. As already pointed out it can be expensive and unnecessary. For nearly a decade teams have formed around a project, completed it successfully and then a new team forms around the next project. Each team member has clearly defined tasks and time-line. There are gazillions of collaboration programs, both online and off line. Here is a list from my ancient archive:

    Web Collaboration Software & Services

    Initially the project could be posted and the team members "bid" on the project. The bid being both cost and time. The team leader, the person bringing forth the project, would select the team, assign tasks and be responsible for the deliverable's. After all, it is their client. Monies would be distributed based on percent of completion, materials required, etc. Its really nothing more or less complicated than building a house.

    Confidentiality and non-compete agreements are helpful, but usually don't have any legal legs. A far better guard is the persons standing in the community.

    I do have server space that can be used if that helps move this from concept to reality. Just let me know.

    Thanks,

    Dan
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  • Profile picture of the author scotth
    Hi Gary,
    Great Idea! I can add my mobile website design to the mix that I am currently doing for local businesses here in my City.
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  • Profile picture of the author awww1some
    That is a great idea. Let me know.
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  • Profile picture of the author dezchamps
    Yes, probably the best model is just to gather your list of 'go-to' people, that are willing to do the particular job, are available to you, and reliable. Just keep a percentage of the work you send them. No different than being a general contractor in a construction project. The general contractor doesn't do everything, he sub-contracts out the skilled specialties, the drywall (the content), the foundation (web design), Excavation (keyword and SEO), and electrical (social media to light it all up) and so on.
    You can do the same thing. Contract the stuff out to your trusted subcontractors. Take your 20% markup. And don't forget to keep track of it for your 1099's at tax time!
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  • Profile picture of the author WillDL
    I really am talking about a company.

    Specifically a Co-op. Increased buying power, distributed infrastructure cost, leveraged marketing power. User owned and operated for user benefit.
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  • Profile picture of the author hallpart
    I am not interested in it
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  • Profile picture of the author imageworx
    Yes I would definitely be interested. It's Impossible to do it all yourself
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  • Profile picture of the author Amir Luis
    The wheels are in motion my friends....
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    • Profile picture of the author Russell Hall
      Originally Posted by marcopetriz View Post

      With my experience, the best thing you can do is, do it yourself of hire someone for an expecific work and that's it. Less problems.
      Originally Posted by BruceWood View Post

      I'm with Marco on this one. Your idea is idealistic, and that's great, but no matter what you call it, it looks like a marketing agency. There's a lot of profit to be made, and a ton of potential headaches with a formal organization like that. By simply assembling a team for new projects and keeping a good Rolodex to farm things out, you can thrive as a one-man shop.
      Gary,

      full credit to you for proposing this idea.
      In principle it's great but I've got to agree with Marco and Bruce here and say that I think it's fraught with practical issues that are probably bigger than envisaged.
      Finding people (partners,... I mean like "real" partners that you can trust, that have skills equal or greater than yours but different to yours,.. and that are willing to commit) is a tall order indeed.

      I'm not saying it can't be done but I tend to think that the outsourcing model is best. Sure that takes effort and patience and trial and error to produce the right team of people,.. but at least you stay in control AND,.. you get to take home the lion's share of the profits.

      Having said that,... if you could put together a group of like minded people that were willing to brainstorm and help each other out on a regular basis then that would be great. I hear that there have been some solid WF meetup groups that have been able to collectively produce some good results.
      Anyway... good on you for throwing your hat in the ring.
      Keep at it,.. I know you've got talent because I bought your WSO on the Google ranking presentation to local businesses and it is terrific!

      Cheers,
      Russ
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      Mvlti svnt vocati, pavci vero electi - Many are called [but] few are chosen

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      • Profile picture of the author Nevin McQ
        So where are we at with all of this? Again great idea but very hard to get these things going

        In the past I have been a 2nd leader on many of these but it has burnt me out to the idea..however as an optimist I am still very open.
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