Be Honest Now... Local Business Marketing is a Nightmare

by Local Banned
222 replies
Understand, I have built a nice business selling to local business owners, but I am still amazed at what a pain in the arse this business can be.

It is not as easy as the "gurus" say it is, I can tell you that.

And trying to really make a difference for these business owners, that is a full time job.

Just running down usernames and passwords, you'd think you were after the dead sea scrolls.

They refuse to follow the simplest directions, they are the biggest cry babies, constantly complaining about the economy this and the economy that, but never taking action to improve their own situation.

And when you give a solid recommendation that will bring them more customers, and even back it up with real life case studies, they suddenly become a marketing expert and tell you 100 reasons why that won't work for their business.

They pay late and even then, you have to hound them for payment like you are a collection agency for the IRS.

And I get the fact that they are so bombarded with BS, scam nonsense from the likes of eLocal, YellowBook, adzzoo, WSI, etc., etc. everyday, and that it is no wonder they don't trust anyone, but my point is they are getting so good at lying too it makes our job more difficult than ever.

OMG!

But it doesn't have to be that way, IF, you begin targeting the right business owners.

I have a handful of local consultants here in California that I have been mentoring, and while there are a number of factors that contribute to their struggles, I have identified the top 5.

1. Lack of focus. See #2.

2. Trying to shot gun every conceivable solution. Pick a single foot in the door solution and sell that to every prospect.

3. Hopeium. Stop believing you have a deal until the check is cashed. How many of these guys were celebrating all half-cocked when ultimately no deal was consummated. Even if a prospect says YES! wait until the check is cashed to celebrate.

4. Only meet with 9 and 10s. You need to be preaching to the choir when it comes to selecting business owners to do business with. If you have to teach them why marketing (let alone internet marketing) is important and they should be doing it, you are dead in the water.

Most new consultants are spending 100% of their time chasing the 1s and 2s. Even if they get them to sign, they will be a nightmare.

The 80/20 (more like the 90/10) rule applies here too.

10% of your clients will account for 90% of your income, why not build your consultancy with more clients that are just like that 10%?

5. Only meet with prospects that are already spending at least $1,000+ per month on advertising. Personally, I go after the $10K+ per month advertisers now. Sure, it is a longer process to seal the deal, but then again, you are earning 4-5 figures per month from one client.

In my experience, if you can stay focused, stick with one service to get your foot in the door, set aside your hopeium and concentrate on those prospects that get marketing and are spending money every month on advertising.

You'll have a chance at success at being a local business consultant.

Evie
#business #honest #local #marketing #nightmare
  • Profile picture of the author AdwordsMogul
    Great stuff Evie.

    What you say applies to every business, you know. Well, what doesn't kill you, only makes you stronger!
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  • Profile picture of the author sdentrepreneur
    Well put Evie !!!
    I am in same boat as you, no clients under $1,000 and look for bigger fish. I have been getting more consulting gigs lately, going into businesses one hour per week and coaching/training their Social Media/Internet Marketing people (can't believe the quality of people they hire)
    Good luck....we should talk shop ;-)
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    • Profile picture of the author cma01
      Originally Posted by sdentrepreneur View Post

      Well put Evie !!!
      . . . going into businesses one hour per week and coaching/training their Social Media/Internet Marketing people (can't believe the quality of people they hire)
      Do you mean this in a good or bad way?

      I would assume that even if they are hiring intern level people that they would have a familiarity with the platforms. Is it that their communication skills in general are poor?

      And that is, they are the guy whose dad left them his little all and suddenly they didn't have to work for no dumb boss-man no more. And some never got a job with their "I know it all" attitude so they scraped some capital together and started a local business.
      No, I don't think this is necessarily true. You may see it more in your market, but I see a lot of business owners who had an idea, or maybe they worked for someone else and decided to go out on their own. They are trying to make their dream come true. It just ends up being a lot more involved than they expected.

      The other thing that I've seen A LOT in the past couple of years are people that were laid off, can't find a job, and so they use their savings and retirement to open a business of their own. This REALLY scares me, because what that means is that if this business fails, not only does it have the economic impact that a business failure in normal circumstances would have, but it means that person will be completely wiped out financially.

      It means that this recession is not only affecting us today, but that there will very likely be a large group of people who took a risk and lost it all and will end up dependent on the government in their later years.
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      • Profile picture of the author KeyboardMonkey
        Originally Posted by cma01 View Post

        The other thing that I've seen A LOT in the past couple of years are people that were laid off, can't find a job, and so they use their savings and retirement to open a business of their own. This REALLY scares me, because what that means is that if this business fails, not only does it have the economic impact that a business failure in normal circumstances would have, but it means that person will be completely wiped out financially.

        It means that this recession is not only affecting us today, but that there will very likely be a large group of people who took a risk and lost it all and will end up dependent on the government in their later years.

        Very interesting macroeconomic view of things. Seems like things are set to go worse, then!
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      • Profile picture of the author Local
        Banned
        Originally Posted by cma01 View Post

        Do you mean this in a good or bad way?

        I would assume that even if they are hiring intern level people that they would have a familiarity with the platforms. Is it that their communication skills in general are poor?



        No, I don't think this is necessarily true. You may see it more in your market, but I see a lot of business owners who had an idea, or maybe they worked for someone else and decided to go out on their own. They are trying to make their dream come true. It just ends up being a lot more involved than they expected.

        The other thing that I've seen A LOT in the past couple of years are people that were laid off, can't find a job, and so they use their savings and retirement to open a business of their own. This REALLY scares me, because what that means is that if this business fails, not only does it have the economic impact that a business failure in normal circumstances would have, but it means that person will be completely wiped out financially.

        It means that this recession is not only affecting us today, but that there will very likely be a large group of people who took a risk and lost it all and will end up dependent on the government in their later years.
        I agree... seeing a lot of people that are reptile brains starting their own business for the first time.

        It amazes me that an engineer with 16 years of college, thinks they can pick up a business license for under $100 and suddenly, they're Sam Walton or Billy Gates. The thought never occurred to them to LEARN how to be a successful business owner, or God forbid, study marketing.

        They should make business owners take a 2 day workshop and pass a test before they can get their business license.

        LOL

        Seriously though, these poor *******s never thought they'd be working 16 hours a day for $8-10 an hour.

        And retirement?

        Yeah, that's a joke, they'd be doing these for as long as they can stand.

        If you are in a busy city, take a couple of hours and just sit in with a business owner and see how many times the phone rings and/or a sales person comes in with the next big advertising or marketing idea.

        And occasionally they do wipe out their check book only to be taken to the cleaners by some smooth talking mortgage broker that lost his/her business when the housing bubble collapsed and now is peddling adzzoo or elocal or yb door to door to local business owners.

        Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author LastWarrior
    Just as well could have been me Evie saying that! I see #3 here all the time and just laugh to myself. I too have learned not to get all worked up just because a client says they're interested and want to get something started. I get worked up when the cash is in hand! I finished an optimized package for someone about 3 weeks ago and still waiting for the balance.

    However, I never consider Local Marketing to be a nightmare because I never got caught up in the hype that it's a cake walk. Been self-employed for 2 decades and know going into new ventures is a risk and hard work.

    Nice post!

    LastWarrior
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Having made almost every mistake one could imagine (I started doing local almost 2 years ago, boy does time fly when you are having fun!) and I keep hearing from folks struggling to really "make it" in offline marketing.

      Kind of like the guy spinning the plates.

      One good prospect can easily pay you $2,500+ per month to be their online marketing department.

      Get 5 of those and for most of the folks here, it would be life changing.

      But start with number one first and make it happen with them.

      Chasing these $200, $500, even $1,000 one time deals is suicide.

      Let me expand on that a bit.

      Stop looking for the holy grail!

      The one magic button piece of software or service that will deliver 200 local business owners begging for you to help them with their online marketing.

      It is not going to happen.

      There are not very many guarantees in life, but I guarantee you, that is one of them, there is no such software.

      If you really want to build an offline consulting business, then I suggest you create a list of "dream" clients that you would love to work with. They MUST be spending money on marketing and advertising and have a viable business that is profitable. If they are struggling, pass.

      Then create a marketing calendar to continue contacting them in every way you can.

      And keep doing it again and again.

      Send them copies of magazine and newspaper clippings related to marketing online with your personal comments. PROVE to them that YOU are their new go to guy (or gal) when it comes to the Internet and marketing online.

      Also, STOP being a pesty sales person and forget about the sale for a moment and concentrate on HELPING these ideal clients.

      For example... a phone call should sound more like this....

      In a non-enthusiastic, almost monotone, slow voice...

      "Hi, my name is Evie, you and I haven't met yet, and I'm hoping you can help me out for a moment?"

      Pause for a response.

      "I'm just giving you a call to see if you'd be open to a different perspective on how to generate additional revenues using new marketing technologies?"

      And SHUT UP!

      Listen.

      Obviously your responses to their responses need to be equally non-salesy and non-threatening.

      If you are speaking to a decision maker that has a business that is growing and not struggling, one that is focused on growth, you will set an appointment 9:10 times.

      But ONLY if you are calling the right companies that fit our target demographics.

      "Would you be open to carving out some time to talk more about how I may be able to help you?"

      :-)

      Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author jrobconsult
        Originally Posted by Local View Post


        And SHUT UP!

        Listen.



        Evie
        Those few words will often be the difference between being another sales person or getting a contract.
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        • Profile picture of the author golf69
          Shut up and listen...great advice
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      • Profile picture of the author Bobster0007
        Originally Posted by Local View Post

        Having made almost every mistake one could imagine (I started doing local almost 2 years ago, boy does time fly when you are having fun!) and I keep hearing from folks struggling to really "make it" in offline marketing.

        Kind of like the guy spinning the plates.

        One good prospect can easily pay you $2,500+ per month to be their online marketing department.

        Get 5 of those and for most of the folks here, it would be life changing.

        But start with number one first and make it happen with them.

        Chasing these $200, $500, even $1,000 one time deals is suicide.

        Let me expand on that a bit.

        Stop looking for the holy grail!

        The one magic button piece of software or service that will deliver 200 local business owners begging for you to help them with their online marketing.

        It is not going to happen.

        There are not very many guarantees in life, but I guarantee you, that is one of them, there is no such software.

        If you really want to build an offline consulting business, then I suggest you create a list of "dream" clients that you would love to work with. They MUST be spending money on marketing and advertising and have a viable business that is profitable. If they are struggling, pass.

        Then create a marketing calendar to continue contacting them in every way you can.

        And keep doing it again and again.

        Send them copies of magazine and newspaper clippings related to marketing online with your personal comments. PROVE to them that YOU are their new go to guy (or gal) when it comes to the Internet and marketing online.

        Also, STOP being a pesty sales person and forget about the sale for a moment and concentrate on HELPING these ideal clients.

        For example... a phone call should sound more like this....

        In a non-enthusiastic, almost monotone, slow voice...

        "Hi, my name is Evie, you and I haven't met yet, and I'm hoping you can help me out for a moment?"

        Pause for a response.

        "I'm just giving you a call to see if you'd be open to a different perspective on how to generate additional revenues using new marketing technologies?"

        And SHUT UP!

        Listen.

        Obviously your responses to their responses need to be equally non-salesy and non-threatening.

        If you are speaking to a decision maker that has a business that is growing and not struggling, one that is focused on growth, you will set an appointment 9:10 times.

        But ONLY if you are calling the right companies that fit our target demographics.

        "Would you be open to carving out some time to talk more about how I may be able to help you?"

        :-)

        Evie
        Hi Evie,
        The language is verbatim to what Ari Galper teaches when cold calling. I believe this new mindset is the way forward in sales. I always enjoy reading your stuff! Thanks
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        • Profile picture of the author DevinRose
          Lol very good points I once had an Architect tell me that 599 was way too much and that I wasn't competitive enough. He said he had been quoted for $100 for a website. I said okay and moved on
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          • Profile picture of the author Local
            Banned
            Originally Posted by DevinRose View Post

            Lol very good points I once had an Architect tell me that 599 was way too much and that I wasn't competitive enough. He said he had been quoted for $100 for a website. I said okay and moved on
            Isn't that the truth!

            It has always amazed me that a business owner who is struggling to keep their doors open, is so resistant to invest in marketing their business.

            Yet, they wake up from the alarm clock advertised in their Sunday newspaper, after having slept on a mattress advertised on TV, brush their teeth using the toothpaste also advertised on TV, used toiletry items, deodorant, hair gel, cologne, all advertised on TV, radio, newspaper, magazines, billboards, internet, etc., put their suit on which was advertised in their local newspaper and online, drive to their business in their advertised SUV and when they have finally had enough and decide to sell their business...

            What do they do?

            Advertise it for sale in the newspaper and online at bizbuy.com!

            Oy vey!


            Evie
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Bobster0007 View Post

          Hi Evie,
          The language is verbatim to what Ari Galper teaches when cold calling. I believe this new mindset is the way forward in sales. I always enjoy reading your stuff! Thanks
          Yes, absolutely.

          In this current economy, even the large corporations are realizing business as usual in regards to their sales strategies is NOT working anymore.

          Ari hit on this 10 years ago and was ahead of the curve.

          Evie
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          • Profile picture of the author Bobster0007
            Originally Posted by Local View Post

            Yes, absolutely.

            In this current economy, even the large corporations are realizing business as usual in regards to their sales strategies is NOT working anymore.

            Ari hit on this 10 years ago and was ahead of the curve.

            Evie
            Can i assume that you have incorporated the "Mindset" into your telemarketing team? Have you been able to actually measure and compare the results against the traditional sales approach? Thanks Evie!
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            • Profile picture of the author Local
              Banned
              Originally Posted by Bobster0007 View Post

              Can i assume that you have incorporated the "Mindset" into your telemarketing team? Have you been able to actually measure and compare the results against the traditional sales approach? Thanks Evie!
              We are cheating.

              We have telemarketers that do the typical approach calling business owners that do not yet have a website or are on page two and beyond of Google Places and offering to create a 30 second online commercial for them in exchange for an appointment.

              We then send out a sales rep that specializes in either selling websites or Google Places optimization) and they conduct a 10 minute presentation (after warming them up) and company wide we are closing 1:3.

              But that is because we always have a bunch of new hires in the field.

              Now our sales managers, they go through a thorough Ari Galper style immersing. And whether on the phone, in person or sending an email, they incorporate what Ari teaches.

              It is the best of both worlds.

              I will tell you that of the clients we sign up using the first method, not as many as you think, end up becoming bigger clients.

              We may upsell them a time or two, but there is a reason they didn't have a website.

              Not all mind you, but most, do not grasp online as well as we would have liked.

              And most recently, we have launched a reputation management office that caters strictly to business owners, politicians, teachers, police officers, etc., that need reputation management.

              The average deal is $10,000 to $30,000 upfront and $300 to $10,000 a month, forever.

              It is an incredible niche that 99% of the companies doing it, suck at because with reputation management, you cannot paint every client with the same brush.

              You HAVE, HAVE, HAVE to reverse engineer each and every case and only do what is absolutely necessary to correct the issue for that month.

              A shotgun approach will backfire.

              Anyhow, enough of my babbling.

              Evie
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              • Profile picture of the author omurchu
                Originally Posted by Local View Post


                And most recently, we have launched a reputation management office that caters strictly to business owners, politicians, teachers, police officers, etc., that need reputation management.

                The average deal is $10,000 to $30,000 upfront and $300 to $10,000 a month, forever.


                Evie

                Evie:

                Great thread and love your take on the offline world.

                I have seen reputation management mentioned a lot in posts recently. Would you elaborate a bit more on exactly what this is for a business? Are you talking about Google alerts re the business and then liaising with the owner when negative comments appear? Or is there a whole lot more to it?

                from the questions you can see I'm not really up speed on this :confused: - just would like to know some more.

                Thanks,
                Frank
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                • Profile picture of the author Local
                  Banned
                  Originally Posted by omurchu View Post

                  Evie:

                  Great thread and love your take on the offline world.

                  I have seen reputation management mentioned a lot in posts recently. Would you elaborate a bit more on exactly what this is for a business? Are you talking about Google alerts re the business and then liaising with the owner when negative comments appear? Or is there a whole lot more to it?

                  from the questions you can see I'm not really up speed on this :confused: - just would like to know some more.

                  Thanks,
                  Frank
                  Lets say you are a pool contractor and you are doing $800,000+ a year.

                  Everything is going along well when you find out one of your sub-contractors has been doing shoddy work.

                  Before you fire him, you have a dozen angry clients posting all kinds of negative crap about you, your wife and your business.

                  Every ripoffreport style website has those inflammatory posts and unfortunately your wife tried to stick up for you and made matters worse.

                  Now when anyone Googles Gonzales Bros. Pools of La Jolla (NOT A REAL COMPANY!!!!!!) they see 5 pages of horrible, disgusting information.

                  There business is not getting many leads and now losing almost every bid from the leads they do get. And every time the phone rings, the owner's heart drops that it might be a current client wanting to cancel because of a family emergency or some lame excuse.

                  What we do is push all of the negative information beyond the first 3-4 pages and beyond and also attempt to have what we can removed, although it will be archived for life most likely.

                  Our success rate is 100%, but it can take some time and needs to be done forever or the stuff can come back... with a vengeance at times.

                  I will not reveal what we do or how we do it as I wouldn't sell this information for even a million dollars.

                  Not even $10 million.

                  Seriously.

                  I plan on retiring from reputation management money!

                  ;-)

                  Evie
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                  • Profile picture of the author omurchu
                    Originally Posted by Local View Post


                    I will not reveal what we do or how we do it as I wouldn't sell this information for even a million dollars.

                    Not even $10 million.

                    Seriously.

                    I plan on retiring from reputation management money!

                    ;-)

                    Evie
                    Thanks for the outline - I see there is more to reputation management than it looks at first.

                    Maybe you would consider $11 million?

                    Frank
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      • Every thing you say is spot on... Love your style in dealing with offline clients.
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      • Profile picture of the author mix_daylee
        Evie, how does the "unlock the game" approach work on prospects?

        If someone is not "open" to something new, I guess it's safe to move on, right?
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by mix_daylee View Post

          Evie, how does the "unlock the game" approach work on prospects?

          If someone is not "open" to something new, I guess it's safe to move on, right?
          One of the most difficult thing to really comprehend is the fact that MOST people are NOT going to be ideal prospects.

          For what ever reason.

          And quite honestly, many businesses, we shouldn't even be pitching them, because we CANNOT deliver.

          I find with with many newbies that believe all the BS courses out there and that giving a business page one of Google is the holy grail when in fact, it likely won't even bring ONE new customer.

          We shouldn't even be talking to a prospect unless we KNOW we can help them.

          With Ari's mindset, you are NOT worried about making the sale, in fact, you even tell the prospect "I don't even know if I can help you"...

          When I was cold calling, the way I looked at it was I was making friends, not sales.

          Today, I find business niches that I can seize and then I find the top businesses I can go to and share my findings.

          At that point I usually already have a keyword domain built out and doing well for a handful of "money" keywords, even creating leads already.

          But the domain is only a small part of it.

          I find out what the businesses goals are, where they want to be, what success looks like to them and then I basically review their current entire online marketing and show what I can do to make it better and I put the owner in THAT picture.

          Let them see what incremental increases across the board looks like to their bottomline.

          I make it real for them.

          Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author jtea858
        Thanks for the tips. I have been having success with keeping my prices in the hundreds and then setting them up on auto-pay plans. Did you get your cold call intro from Ari?
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by jtea858 View Post

          Thanks for the tips. I have been having success with keeping my prices in the hundreds and then setting them up on auto-pay plans. Did you get your cold call intro from Ari?
          I took Ari's basic and then advanced training and my pitch developed into what it is now, and Ari adjusted his from what he learned from all of his original mentees.

          Unfortunately, Unlock The Game came off the market today.

          There will be no more Unlock the Game products available for sale and Ari will only be doing corporate training.

          Ari's mindset works, but it is a shift and so easy to fall back into your old habits.

          Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author WorkSatisfaction
        Hi Evie,

        The advice you give does apply to most other businesses. Thank-you so much for that.

        There is indeed a fine line between 'feeling your customers pain' and providing a realistic solution and alienating them by trying to 'sell' to them.

        I make and market unique gifting hampers to local companies such as car dealerships, estate agencies, banks, etc.I however have been finding more and more of late that the decision makers who decide which gifts to give to their customers are constantly changing or rarely available to make an appointment with.

        Any tips on how to actually get to see these 'eternally busy' people as this is the key to me actually physically showing them samples of my products which has proven very successful in helping them decide what would suite their company's individual gifting requirements.

        I am not sure if the resistance is to one 'seeking information' when you call the company initially as I do my utmost to ensure that my call is in no way a 'sales blurb' but just an enquiry whether they do purchase gifts for their clients and whether they would be interested in viewing a brochure with some 'out of the ordinary' gifting ideas. I then mail them the brochure & give them a call about a week later to confirm that they have received the brochure & what their thoughts are. If there is further interest at this point, I enquire whether they would be interested in seeing some physical samples and make an appointment with them to view the samples.

        Any suggestions on how I can approach this differently to ensure more actual physical appointments as many respond that they have not had time to view the brochure when I call a second time. I have even gone as far as going door-to-door with a colour copy of my catalogue in my hand and samples in my car (incase someone was interested to view on the spot). Even then most indicated that they would prefer to receive the brochure electronically and call me if they need something. We all know how that usually turns out though!

        I would really appreciate a different spin on this process if I can be doing things more effectively to achieve results or at least grab my potential clients attention more effectively. Any ideas & suggestions on this front will be greatly appreciated.

        Looking forward to the brainstorming. Thank-you.
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by WorkSatisfaction View Post

          Hi Evie,

          The advice you give does apply to most other businesses. Thank-you so much for that.

          There is indeed a fine line between 'feeling your customers pain' and providing a realistic solution and alienating them by trying to 'sell' to them.

          I make and market unique gifting hampers to local companies such as car dealerships, estate agencies, banks, etc.I however have been finding more and more of late that the decision makers who decide which gifts to give to their customers are constantly changing or rarely available to make an appointment with.

          Any tips on how to actually get to see these 'eternally busy' people as this is the key to me actually physically showing them samples of my products which has proven very successful in helping them decide what would suite their company's individual gifting requirements.

          I am not sure if the resistance is to one 'seeking information' when you call the company initially as I do my utmost to ensure that my call is in no way a 'sales blurb' but just an enquiry whether they do purchase gifts for their clients and whether they would be interested in viewing a brochure with some 'out of the ordinary' gifting ideas. I then mail them the brochure & give them a call about a week later to confirm that they have received the brochure & what their thoughts are. If there is further interest at this point, I enquire whether they would be interested in seeing some physical samples and make an appointment with them to view the samples.

          Any suggestions on how I can approach this differently to ensure more actual physical appointments as many respond that they have not had time to view the brochure when I call a second time. I have even gone as far as going door-to-door with a colour copy of my catalogue in my hand and samples in my car (incase someone was interested to view on the spot). Even then most indicated that they would prefer to receive the brochure electronically and call me if they need something. We all know how that usually turns out though!

          I would really appreciate a different spin on this process if I can be doing things more effectively to achieve results or at least grab my potential clients attention more effectively. Any ideas & suggestions on this front will be greatly appreciated.

          Looking forward to the brainstorming. Thank-you.
          Without having all the fact and just off the top of my head, why not create a sales and networking workshop for car dealerships, estate agencies, banks, etc., and line up speakers that are experts in social media, lead generation, etc., and YOU also present and if you do a great job in a 30-40 minute presentation and demonstrate how talking to YOU will increase their bottom line, you will get a handful of new clients.

          A lot of work for a handful of clients, but then you build a professional referral program into each and every sale.

          In closing, a brochure is NOT going to sell you and your product.

          A request for one is a blow off.

          How many have you sold and why aren't those first clients slamming you with new business?

          Evie
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          • Profile picture of the author WorkSatisfaction
            Originally Posted by Local View Post

            Without having all the fact and just off the top of my head, why not create a sales and networking workshop for car dealerships, estate agencies, banks, etc., and line up speakers that are experts in social media, lead generation, etc., and YOU also present and if you do a great job in a 30-40 minute presentation and demonstrate how talking to YOU will increase their bottom line, you will get a handful of new clients.

            A lot of work for a handful of clients, but then you build a professional referral program into each and every sale.

            In closing, a brochure is NOT going to sell you and your product.

            A request for one is a blow off.

            How many have you sold and why aren't those first clients slamming you with new business?

            Evie
            Hi Evie,

            Thank-you for that information. There are alot of useful tips there which I will start integrating into my approach.

            Existing customers are purchasing consistently but it is getting my foot in the door to actually physically show my hampers to new clients which is the current challenge. I will have to brainstorm extensively to create a workshop which will appeal to the widest possible range of potential clients to ensure that the session adds value for them as well as serves the purpose of drawing them to affordable quality gifting ideas from my range.

            I have been calling in to companies, finding out whether they purchase hampers,etc and have been offering to mail them the brochure if they cannot see me right away. From your comment about the brochures, I am however assuming that I should withhold the brochure and rather secure a physical appointment to get my foot in the door better.

            The advice is much appreciated. Thanks again!

            Kind Regards Carmen
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  • Profile picture of the author Seanjtucker
    thanks for the info, its good insight. Had my first meeting with a prospect today and he thought he knew it all and didnt even have nothing done, didnt last too long.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dexx
    Good post!

    I follow 3 simple rules to keep my business very simple and very profitable:

    1) Get paid in advance before you so much as look at Google to research their competition.

    2) If they want to argue or debate the effectiveness of proven marketing strategies they are gone.

    3) If they aren't already spending money to market their business they will most likely not have the funds to afford my services--next.

    Cheers,

    ~Dexx
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    • Profile picture of the author jrobconsult
      Originally Posted by Dexx View Post

      Good post!

      I follow 3 simple rules to keep my business very simple and very profitable:

      1) Get paid in advance before you so much as look at Google to research their competition.

      2) If they want to argue or debate the effectiveness of proven marketing strategies they are gone.

      3) If they aren't already spending money to market their business they will most likely not have the funds to afford my services--next.

      Cheers,

      ~Dexx
      Excellent advice. From personal experience, the businesses who need you the most will be the most difficult to work with. The business who is already successful will follow your advice more readily. That is why they are successful.

      The problem is for the beginning offline marketer, most will try to sign any business owner instead of being selective. The bad business owner will have plenty of excuses why it will not work in their town or industry.

      It is better to have a few good clients than many who consumed your time with little payback and even then not satisfied with your efforts.
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    • Profile picture of the author Deidra Renee
      Originally Posted by Dexx View Post

      Good post!

      I follow 3 simple rules to keep my business very simple and very profitable:

      1) Get paid in advance before you so much as look at Google to research their competition.

      2) If they want to argue or debate the effectiveness of proven marketing strategies they are gone.

      3) If they aren't already spending money to market their business they will most likely not have the funds to afford my services--next.

      Cheers,

      ~Dexx
      I agree with this 100% When I first started, (which was only a few months ago) I never even considered doing anything for free even though several people told me that's the only way to getting a business owner to trust you and blah blah blah...most of the time those are the ones who are only looking for freebies and will be very difficult to deal with. Now I do give them *bonuses* or extra services at no cost, but I always get paid up front!
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    • Profile picture of the author SusieJones
      Dexx and Evie I have to agree, I spend too much time giving away free time - and have stopped this in favor of giving free time away at networking gigs where I give my 10 minutes of fame - if after that they want to meet with me I charge them an hourly rate unless a deal is done for a package of services.

      I personally love working with offline businesses, have set up a specialized local directory that I use as my platform and then post articles within the directory highlighting businesses sales - events whatever... easy to sell advertising too as I can beat the YP/TrueLocal fees hands down (I charge a fraction of the cost).

      Thanks for your insights - its always good to keep fresh with ideas and what other people are doing.
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    • Profile picture of the author tsneds
      Originally Posted by Dexx View Post

      Good post!

      I follow 3 simple rules to keep my business very simple and very profitable:

      1) Get paid in advance before you so much as look at Google to research their competition.

      2) If they want to argue or debate the effectiveness of proven marketing strategies they are gone.

      3) If they aren't already spending money to market their business they will most likely not have the funds to afford my services--next.

      Cheers,

      ~Dexx
      Great points man,short and to the point.
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    • Profile picture of the author Gaz Christian
      Originally Posted by Dexx View Post

      Good post!

      I follow 3 simple rules to keep my business very simple and very profitable:

      1) Get paid in advance before you so much as look at Google to research their competition.

      2) If they want to argue or debate the effectiveness of proven marketing strategies they are gone.

      3) If they aren't already spending money to market their business they will most likely not have the funds to afford my services--next.

      Cheers,

      ~Dexx
      My tactics exactly!
      I got real tired of being humble and offering my services at low cost so one day I said enough is enough, if you want my services you pay me up front and you do as I say - never looked back since!
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      Instant Authority Marketing Websites


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  • Profile picture of the author rolltide
    Awesome post Evie! What are your demographics?
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    • Profile picture of the author scarab
      Big thanks to Evie and Dexx. Your advice is very much appreciated.
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      • Profile picture of the author jenifer smith
        great post Evie, just don't give up on them . believe me that is actually the best they know,it is part of the huddles you have to go through in this business.
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      • Profile picture of the author jenifer smith
        if every one including local business owners should understand what it takes to prosper in any business, i mean the economy would be great.my advise is that you don't expect every body to understand the prospect of each business, because it will not happen, especially with the so called local business owners.
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  • Profile picture of the author phans
    if you are new to the offline marketing world i would think that it will be pretty hard to get a lot of deals if you ask a company to pay you upfront...
    if you are know in your area you can obv to it but i don't think it's the best choice if you are starting out...

    also if you are offering something like lead generation if they don't pay you (on time) tell them if they will do it again you will take your leads to the competition this way the chance of not getting paid on time is pretty slim... and if it happens well do what you said you will do got to the competition
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    • Profile picture of the author jgsketch
      Evie,
      Nice post and great info. However, did you start off with those low income deals to learn the business? If so, what was the turning point where you shifted to "better" clients? While I agree with what you say, I feel I need to go after the small clients first, learn my mistakes and learn the ins and outs of sales. But I also what to make sure I don't get stuck in this rut and can have the open eyes to make that shift at the right time.
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      • Profile picture of the author jrobconsult
        Originally Posted by jgsketch View Post

        Evie,
        Nice post and great info. However, did you start off with those low income deals to learn the business? If so, what was the turning point where you shifted to "better" clients? While I agree with what you say, I feel I need to go after the small clients first, learn my mistakes and learn the ins and outs of sales. But I also what to make sure I don't get stuck in this rut and can have the open eyes to make that shift at the right time.
        Low income deals are fine to start with to build confidence and experience. Just don't let the clients take advantage of you. Those are the ones who will never be satisfied and slow to pay and looking for an excuse not to pay you.

        When you get the confidence in yourself, the better clients will find you. Make sure you ask referrals of your existing clients. It is hard getting started (not as easy as some make it seem) and it takes lot of skill especially dealing with people, but the rewards can be huge.
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      • Profile picture of the author Local
        Banned
        Originally Posted by jgsketch View Post

        Evie,
        Nice post and great info. However, did you start off with those low income deals to learn the business? If so, what was the turning point where you shifted to "better" clients? While I agree with what you say, I feel I need to go after the small clients first, learn my mistakes and learn the ins and outs of sales. But I also what to make sure I don't get stuck in this rut and can have the open eyes to make that shift at the right time.
        I used myself as a client first and then used my own business to demonstrate.

        And yes, I started with the smaller clients and it almost burned me out completely.

        My first big client opened my eyes.

        Of course all of this is assuming you really can deliver what you are offering.

        If you can't do it yourself, you better learn how because outsourcing is hit and miss at best.

        It is YOUR reputation on the line!

        Today, if I want a $3,000 per month client, I carefully research and then approach them with all of my research and demonstrate without a doubt that I am the real deal.

        Today, I close 85%.

        I also make friends with the gatekeepers and I get them on my team.

        Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author absolutelee
    I don't know about this. I've basically had the opposite experience. I get paid up front, or at least half up front. No one's stiffed me, or even tried to. I have a number of clients who pay me $1k plus per month for ongoing services. They're glad to do it, because I add so much value to their bottom line. I actually increased one business's calls into their office by 6X! I don't know what the difference is.

    I will agree that this business is not as easy as "gurus" say. But then again, it's much easier than I thought it would be when I started it. I sold houses for 10+ years. It's a heck of a lot easier than that was!
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  • Profile picture of the author AshleyPS
    I'm a bit wary of going after the big businesses to start off with. I don't have the experience with dealing with those kinds of businesses and I would most certainly have to hire graphic designers and coders.

    Or is it a case of everyone chasing the small businesses meaning there is less competition for the big ones?
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by AshleyPS View Post

      I'm a bit wary of going after the big businesses to start off with. I don't have the experience with dealing with those kinds of businesses and I would most certainly have to hire graphic designers and coders.

      Or is it a case of everyone chasing the small businesses meaning there is less competition for the big ones?
      The harder they are to reach and set an appointment with, the easier the sale.

      Of course the bigger the check too.

      And I do not know what you are selling these businesses, but you can earn $1,000 to $3,000 per month just managing their Google Places.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Hugh
    I can still hear Doug Edwards screaming "SHUT UP".

    Another reason I don't do contracts. I really need to fire a client sometimes.

    Hugh
    Signature

    "Never make someone a priority in your life who makes you an option in theirs." Anon.
    "Some see private enterprise as a predatory target to be shot, others as a cow to be milked, but few are those who see it as a sturdy horse pulling the wagon." -- Winston Churchill

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    • Profile picture of the author Izesta
      Originally Posted by Hugh View Post

      I can still hear Doug Edwards screaming "SHUT UP".

      Another reason I don't do contracts. I really need to fire a client sometimes.

      Hugh

      I put that "right" in my contract. I reserve the right to terminate the contract. :-(
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  • Profile picture of the author bkat52
    Evie - on your #4. what do you mean by 9s and 10s?
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  • Profile picture of the author Local
    Banned
    On a scale of 1 to 10, 10's being companies that are at the top of their game and are profitable and spending a ton on advertising.

    They "get" marketing and when you talk to them about marketing, their eyes light up and they get super excited.

    Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    The very best part about local marketing?

    National chains and franchises.

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  • Profile picture of the author big steve
    Nice thread...just wondering Evie when the WSO will be coming out??lol..

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author Zach Crawford
      Originally Posted by big steve View Post

      Nice thread...just wondering Evie when the WSO will be coming out??lol..

      Steve

      Evie knows her stuff. I for one will buy it if she creates one. I have made strides in my offline business by following everything she shares here and telemarketing forum.

      Not all wso's are bad. Problem is you have people pushing them that never even tested the methods they are selling you.

      This information alone she shared is worth more then 90% of the wso's out there.
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      • Profile picture of the author Local
        Banned
        Originally Posted by 88crxsi View Post

        Evie knows her stuff. I for one will buy it if she creates one. I have made strides in my offline business by following everything she shares here and telemarketing forum.

        Not all wso's are bad. Problem is you have people pushing them that never even tested the methods they are selling you.

        This information alone she shared is worth more then 90% of the wso's out there.
        Thank you so much, you are too kind.

        Evie
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        • Profile picture of the author Zach Crawford
          Originally Posted by Local View Post

          Thank you so much, you are too kind.

          Evie
          Evie I meant to post in the telemarketing forum, but are you still offering to have a few people come out to California and to see how you operate. I would die for this opportunity to learn from someone like yourself.

          I'm doing pretty good starting out, but I'm positive learning from someone who has established their self and seeing how to structure my business would only skyrocket my success. If you end up doing this please sign me up
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          • Profile picture of the author Local
            Banned
            Originally Posted by 88crxsi View Post

            Evie I meant to post in the telemarketing forum, but are you still offering to have a few people come out to California and to see how you operate. I would die for this opportunity to learn from someone like yourself.

            I'm doing pretty good starting out, but I'm positive learning from someone who has established their self and seeing how to structure my business would only skyrocket my success. If you end up doing this please sign me up
            Message me in the telemarketing forum.

            I had a couple of great guys come down for 3 days last week.

            :-)

            My hubby and I are going to be vacationing a ton more over the next few months, but I am planning to set some time in August to have another open house.

            Evie
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by big steve View Post

      Nice thread...just wondering Evie when the WSO will be coming out??lol..

      Steve
      Hi Steve... sorry no WSO... I cannot imagine selling the very stuff I have given the last 2 years of my life to learn... and for the cost of a cheap dinner at that...

      NO THANK YOU!

      :-)

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author maricelu
    I like your thread Evie. It is nice to learn from people's mistakes and manage our starting point easier. I learned a lot more from the Offline section of the forum and your topic is a step forward in improving our business.
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  • Profile picture of the author Adwello
    Originally Posted by Local View Post


    They refuse to follow the simplest directions, they are the biggest cry babies, constantly complaining about the economy this and the economy that, but never taking action to improve their own situation.

    And when you give a solid recommendation that will bring them more customers, and even back it up with real life case studies, they suddenly become a marketing expert and tell you 100 reasons why that won't work for their business.

    They pay late and even then, you have to hound them for payment like you are a collection agency for the IRS.
    Hey you know what? Most local business owners have one thing in common whether they reside in Calcutta or Connecticut! And that is, they are the guy whose dad left them his little all and suddenly they didn't have to work for no dumb boss-man no more. And some never got a job with their "I know it all" attitude so they scraped some capital together and started a local business.

    So it follows they know it all and are not the easiest guys in the world to get along with. As to paying you, hey, they need the money more than you, right?

    Interestingly it's the business with the broader mindset that expands beyond local! The companies that do really well year after year are the ones who know the value of hiring experts and taking their advice. Coach a wise man and he will be wiser still.

    So I won't do any marketing consultancy for local businesses because, since they know it all, yeh, they can stay right there in Calcutta or wherever and be local. Seems after all, that is all they do know!

    It's certainly all the local business owner wants. He wants to be a fish in his own pond. Following the 80/20 rule where 80% of your clients give you 80% HARD TIME I make it a rule only to work with companies who understand the Success Mindset.

    But it's just the same online: cheapskate everywhere and save a few bucks on a professional graphic designer to bodge up your own graphics - let's see, yes, that looks slick! Like you invested in your presentation, right? Well, nothing gets you nothing, that's the way I see it.

    Anyway, nice post :rolleyes:
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  • Profile picture of the author cma01
    Just running down usernames and passwords, you'd think you were after the dead sea scrolls.
    LOL. This is SO true!

    And then there is the flip side, they never keep the user names and passwords that YOU send THEM and rather than look on their hard drive, it's much easier just to call YOU and ask you to email it to them again.

    Now I just bill them for it. It was weird for me to charge someone for something so simple, but it got to where I was spending way too much time on things like that just because people are lazy.

    Anything I send them that they need to keep, I put in big, bold, bright red letters, "PRINT A COPY FOR YOUR RECORDS" and something to the effect that if they call me again for it, they will get billed. And then each client has their own section in my billing system where I upload every document related to their account so they have access to it at any time to download on their own.

    But yes, some people are just a PITA and I try to cut down on my exposure to those kind of people.

    But you know, marketing isn't their business and most of them don't want to do it or think about it. They want to focus on doing whatever their business is.

    I've found that if I'm consistent about prepping them and framing the conversation with my newsletter (which all of my clients and prospective clients are on,) it really cuts down quite a bit on the issues that stem from ignorance.
    Signature
    "Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something."
    ~ Plato
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  • Profile picture of the author MKBridge
    Originally Posted by Local View Post

    Just running down usernames and passwords, you'd think you were after the dead sea scrolls.
    Evie
    Oh, you are so right Evie! This is my biggest problem right now - just give me the darn password so I can do the work! How can you not be sure what it is when you say you do some work on your website - jeezz.

    I love reading your posts here and on the telemarketing forum. You are very informative, interesting and funny. Keep on going.....

    Thanks MK
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  • Profile picture of the author jasonthewebmaster
    Banned
    Originally Posted by Local View Post

    Understand, I have built a nice business selling to local business owners, but I am still amazed at what a pain in the arse this business can be.

    It is not as easy as the "gurus" say it is, I can tell you that.

    And trying to really make a difference for these business owners, that is a full time job.

    Just running down usernames and passwords, you'd think you were after the dead sea scrolls.

    They refuse to follow the simplest directions, they are the biggest cry babies, constantly complaining about the economy this and the economy that, but never taking action to improve their own situation.

    And when you give a solid recommendation that will bring them more customers, and even back it up with real life case studies, they suddenly become a marketing expert and tell you 100 reasons why that won't work for their business.

    They pay late and even then, you have to hound them for payment like you are a collection agency for the IRS.

    And I get the fact that they are so bombarded with BS, scam nonsense from the likes of eLocal, YellowBook, adzzoo, WSI, etc., etc. everyday, and that it is no wonder they don't trust anyone, but my point is they are getting so good at lying too it makes our job more difficult than ever.

    OMG!

    But it doesn't have to be that way, IF, you begin targeting the right business owners.

    I have a handful of local consultants here in California that I have been mentoring, and while there are a number of factors that contribute to their struggles, I have identified the top 5.

    1. Lack of focus. See #2.

    2. Trying to shot gun every conceivable solution. Pick a single foot in the door solution and sell that to every prospect.

    3. Hopeium. Stop believing you have a deal until the check is cashed. How many of these guys were celebrating all half-cocked when ultimately no deal was consummated. Even if a prospect says YES! wait until the check is cashed to celebrate.

    4. Only meet with 9 and 10s. You need to be preaching to the choir when it comes to selecting business owners to do business with. If you have to teach them why marketing (let alone internet marketing) is important and they should be doing it, you are dead in the water.

    Most new consultants are spending 100% of their time chasing the 1s and 2s. Even if they get them to sign, they will be a nightmare.

    The 80/20 (more like the 90/10) rule applies here too.

    10% of your clients will account for 90% of your income, why not build your consultancy with more clients that are just like that 10%?

    5. Only meet with prospects that are already spending at least $1,000+ per month on advertising. Personally, I go after the $10K+ per month advertisers now. Sure, it is a longer process to seal the deal, but then again, you are earning 4-5 figures per month from one client.

    In my experience, if you can stay focused, stick with one service to get your foot in the door, set aside your hopeium and concentrate on those prospects that get marketing and are spending money every month on advertising.

    You'll have a chance at success at being a local business consultant.

    Evie
    I LOVE this advice.. very good!!
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  • Profile picture of the author Nspire
    Evie,
    Thanks for starting this post some very valuable information here!
    I totally agree Local Business marketing can be a nightmare.

    I found that listening is key to landing more deals!
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  • Profile picture of the author Creativegirl
    Great thread, posts and solid information. I often struggle with the one size doesn't fit all that I see other companies and IMs promote. And while I like to give my customers a range, because I really don't know their budget, I see the value in upping that range from what many of you are doing. So, thanks, a really good thread.
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Creativegirl View Post

      Great thread, posts and solid information. I often struggle with the one size doesn't fit all that I see other companies and IMs promote. And while I like to give my customers a range, because I really don't know their budget, I see the value in upping that range from what many of you are doing. So, thanks, a really good thread.
      That's why having even a menu of Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum is a joke.

      Even listing your products and services on your website, are you for real?

      That turns your business into a commoditized market and separates the real earners from the mere yearners.

      Each prospect should have a proposal that is personalized to them and their goals. You may be trying to sell them something that they do not even want or need.

      Anyhow, in a century of commoditization with buyer savvy, and cost controls, what matters most is the expertise WE bring to the table.

      Expertise that enables us to deliver insight that in turn creates value in the sales process itself.

      When I am done speaking to a prospect, there is no doubt in their mind that I can get the job done, and I do not give them any type of a laundry list that says:

      30 articles
      30 videos
      10 press releases

      etc., etc. which would allow them to commoditize my proposal and thus shop around.

      And I'm not really selling them articles, videos, press releases, etc. anyway.

      I'm selling them the end game.

      Where they want to be in 30, 90, 180 days.

      I am quantifying our relationship.

      Besides, we all know that articles can be had for as low as $2-$4, but how effective are they. And you can even spend $50, $100 or more for an article, and that doesn't guarantee that will be the best article for your particular strategy.

      But I KNOW exactly who to hire and what to request in the work order to get the results I am shooting for.

      It is THAT experience, not the actual article my clients are paying for.

      My clients are paying a premium for my knowledge.

      At this point in my career, a business owner could be paying me $3,500 per month and on top of that, paying for the vendors that I recommend to deliver on the actual marketing plan.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author redcell1
    I agree with Local. It seems like the smaller clients take up most of your time with petty things while the big clients just let you do your thing and check in once a month.
    Signature

    Just here to see the shenanigans.

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    • Profile picture of the author rainingproblems
      Evie,

      Great post especially for those who are beginning in this type of thing. I especially agree about the need to be selective on businesses you approach and going after those that are already spending on advertising.

      I try not to sweat the small stuff...you've gotta learn to move on.

      Thank you again for your post.
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      • Profile picture of the author Local
        Banned
        Originally Posted by rainingproblems View Post

        Evie,

        Great post especially for those who are beginning in this type of thing. I especially agree about the need to be selective on businesses you approach and going after those that are already spending on advertising.

        I try not to sweat the small stuff...you've gotta learn to move on.

        Thank you again for your post.

        My pleasure.

        It is hard for newbies to comprehend that some of these successful businesses are used to cutting 4 and 5 figure checks and more.

        Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author davidjames42973
        I completely know what you mean. My number 1 problem I have with clients is getting them to pay on time. I have this happen to me with 1-2 clients a month.

        I always joke around and call this a consulting/baby sitting/psychologist/collection job. Sometimes you have to sit down with clients and talk to them about their life problems, office problems, etc.

        But I sure love doing this A LOT MORE than working that dead end 9-5 job...
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        • Profile picture of the author mrbueno
          Start putting every account on automatic payments. I can tell you even $20/month accounts add up fast and are little work when you have an automated billing process in place. Even with this you have to keep up with credit card declines and bad expiration dates.

          Collections will always be some work, but it is better to chase the money you are owed than dreaming of the dollars you don't have.
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      • Profile picture of the author cjr126
        i was considering getting into offline marketing but after reading this i'm pretty depressed .. it sucks when u think u may have a way to make money and than u find out the real truth .. hurts pretty bad

        chris
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        • Profile picture of the author davidjames42973
          Originally Posted by cjr126 View Post

          i was considering getting into offline marketing but after reading this i'm pretty depressed .. it sucks when u think u may have a way to make money and than u find out the real truth .. hurts pretty bad

          chris
          Chris,

          In my opinion this is the best way to make good money fast. Don't let these things discourage you. Just like any business there are ups and downs. I would take these ups and downs over any 9-5 job.

          The best part is my wife and I have been able to do a ton of traveling while helping clients out. Trust me Chris, for every negative point there are about 20 positive points.
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          • Profile picture of the author mrbueno
            Here is the thing to remember. You are selling a benefit, not a feature.

            Most people don't care about the technological marvel of VoIP, but tell them their phone bill will next to nothing and they won't have to deal with AT&T's outsourced service department and you got a winner.

            So let me take a second and say there is more than one way to skin a cat or make a buck. In this thread some have said they only sell things in the $10,000 range, some say they are happy making $250 in their spare time. Both are right. You just have to find where you are comfortable.

            I made a very good living at $19.95/month for many years. I also do well with custom software development starting at $7k. Now I am attempting to create separate teams to work multiple methods and price points at once.

            Bottom line, you have to start where you feel comfortable. If you think you have a winning idea, or money making plan, go with it. If it doesn't show results, tweak it or pick another. I guarantee you will find one that works.

            Having said that, YOU MUST ACTUALLY WORK A SYSTEM! You can't just try something for three days or buy a WSO and put it in your downloads folder. It doesn't matter what kind of business you decide to start, you must have procedures in place to replicate success.

            Don't let the bad news get you down. There will always be someone willing to pay for something. You just have to talk with them and find out what that something is.

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      • Profile picture of the author Talladino
        Great post, all that you see lately is all the gurus pitching the offline business model and say how easy it is. All in all from what I have experienced is that you still need to know sales and enjoy sales. There are so many pushing these courses in the IM world that it seems most are just BS'rs and make their money selling you the how to's.

        It was nice hearing from someone who has done it, I am just sick of all the pitchfests myself, and my subscribe list is getting real small..
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  • Profile picture of the author sloanjim
    oh are you interested in if any of it is truthful or do you sdimply offer a service? Kind of like de defence lawyer who will defend anyone if the money is right...?
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by sloanjim View Post

      oh are you interested in if any of it is truthful or do you sdimply offer a service? Kind of like de defence lawyer who will defend anyone if the money is right...?
      In our experience, even the legitimate beefs, get blown out of proportion and the posts are full of lies and mistruths in an effort to inflict as much pain as possible.

      And there are a group of misfits that pile on, even though they do not even know the person they are defaming.

      It is not our job to separate fact from fiction, we are providing a valuable service and are all about second chances and starting over again.

      To learn more about these vicious attacks and character smears, I suggest you read AmazonAmazon
      Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author esdavis
        Originally Posted by Local View Post

        In our experience, even the legitimate beefs, get blown out of proportion and the posts are full of lies and mistruths in an effort to inflict as much pain as possible.

        And there are a group of misfits that pile on, even though they do not even know the person they are defaming.

        It is not our job to separate fact from fiction, we are providing a valuable service and are all about second chances and starting over again.

        Evie
        Hi, Evie.
        Good posts on reputation management.

        One thing I didn't see you mentioning on the ongoing maintenance side was bullet-proofing the company's reputation with positive reinforcement between potential disasters. When clients are doing well, sometimes they forget that it can turn on a dime, even with our help. Because the help takes time to succeed with.

        One thing we do for our clients is actively monitor their social presence and their industry for the positive "gems" about them. For us, it's not just watching reviews or waiting for disasters like you provided the example for. More like catching and amplifying the signal from positive industry and customer experiences. We find the gems and abstract that information onto the wider networks to build up a buffer of positive content. Then if something goes wrong, you have some additional fodder to work with to turn things around.

        There are lots of ways to do this, of course. Thinking outside the box is great for this.
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        • Profile picture of the author mikeroosa
          I definitely agree with a lot of what you are saying. I have been doing some web design and just got started with the SEO. I was able to get my first client, an mobile auto detailer on the first page for many search terms related to our area. In fact, I created videos, press releases, updated Google Places, and he now owns 3-4 spots on the Google front page for his terms.

          Guess what? He's still not getting any traffic and any calls.

          What are some thoughts on increasing his business through online marketing without the use of SEO?
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          • Profile picture of the author Local
            Banned
            Originally Posted by mikeroosa View Post

            I definitely agree with a lot of what you are saying. I have been doing some web design and just got started with the SEO. I was able to get my first client, an mobile auto detailer on the first page for many search terms related to our area. In fact, I created videos, press releases, updated Google Places, and he now owns 3-4 spots on the Google front page for his terms.

            Guess what? He's still not getting any traffic and any calls.

            What are some thoughts on increasing his business through online marketing without the use of SEO?
            That is the million dollar question.

            Literally.

            Without having all of the facts, it is impossible to know the answers.

            Personally, there are tons of businesses that for whatever reason, their niche, their market, their geographical area, that the numbers just are NOT there.

            We cannot manufacture searches where there are not any.

            We have a client whose service, for example, no one searches for.

            We began testing media buys and placed ads on properties where their target market hangs out.

            It was a process, and we had to use a professional ad server, doubleclick in order to know which accounts to terminate because they were not working, and of course protecting ourselves in each media contract with a 24 hour out clause.

            Ended up over 90% of the buys did not work, but the ones that did, we ramped up and found more properties that were "like" those sites.

            The last report I saw, this client has gross sales now of over $154,000 a month coming in from our online efforts.

            That represents am 11.4% increase in sales.

            We also did a past customer reactivation campaign that generated an additional $500,000 in new sales.

            Evie
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            • Profile picture of the author mikeroosa
              Originally Posted by Local View Post

              That is the million dollar question.

              Literally.

              Without having all of the facts, it is impossible to know the answers.

              Personally, there are tons of businesses that for whatever reason, their niche, their market, their geographical area, that the numbers just are NOT there.

              We cannot manufacture searches where there are not any.

              We have a client whose service, for example, no one searches for.

              We began testing media buys and placed ads on properties where their target market hangs out.

              It was a process, and we had to use a professional ad server, doubleclick in order to know which accounts to terminate because they were not working, and of course protecting ourselves in each media contract with a 24 hour out clause.

              Ended up over 90% of the buys did not work, but the ones that did, we ramped up and found more properties that were "like" those sites.

              The last report I saw, this client has gross sales now of over $154,000 a month coming in from our online efforts.

              That represents am 11.4% increase in sales.

              We also did a past customer reactivation campaign that generated an additional $500,000 in new sales.

              Evie
              Thanks, Evie. I think you're right. What I'm getting is that the searches aren't there. There are a few but at 30 searches a month, he'd be lucky to get a couple of visitors a week. Looks like the way to tackle this is to find the niches with bigger search numbers and target them.
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by esdavis View Post

          Hi, Evie.
          Good posts on reputation management.

          One thing I didn't see you mentioning on the ongoing maintenance side was bullet-proofing the company's reputation with positive reinforcement between potential disasters. When clients are doing well, sometimes they forget that it can turn on a dime, even with our help. Because the help takes time to succeed with.

          One thing we do for our clients is actively monitor their social presence and their industry for the positive "gems" about them. For us, it's not just watching reviews or waiting for disasters like you provided the example for. More like catching and amplifying the signal from positive industry and customer experiences. We find the gems and abstract that information onto the wider networks to build up a buffer of positive content. Then if something goes wrong, you have some additional fodder to work with to turn things around.

          There are lots of ways to do this, of course. Thinking outside the box is great for this.
          Oh, absolutely!

          You are correct.

          Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author rolltide
    Evie,
    I love your post. I would love to be a part of the August group.


    Chris
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  • Profile picture of the author Mrdvd
    Banned
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Mrdvd View Post

      I know a lot of you will disagree, but it is not about getting rich off of one client. If you try to get every client to pay hundreds or even thousands a month, of course they are going to want everything and complain about everything. I shot for a lower monthly amount they feel comfortable paying, and doesn't require me having to spend a lot of time with. With the economy the way it is, those who you charge a lot probably won't be around for the long haul.

      I would rather have 3 100 dollar clients that never bother me than having 1 300 client who wants all my attention.
      I don't know where you are working, but we now have offices in 5 areas (4 different states) and the $100 per month clients are at least 50 times more of a headache than our $1,000 per month clients.

      And out $2500+ clients are a pleasure to work and collaborate with.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author beamup
    Where I live, Marketing to local business is a hardcore of nightmare. Every time I am talking to them, they either listen with one ear and then take it out with another, or they first try to give impression of being very interested and then fall out. But I am still trying something new. But its really hard.
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  • Profile picture of the author social joe
    Hi Evie,

    You express a pain that only an offline marketer can truly understand! :-) Business owners are a tough bunch to deal with. Its true in all walks of life that most people are just plain lazy!

    Part of the challenge of being successful in the offline marketing world is being able to educate, inspire and motivate business owners to take action. Most of them spend too much time working IN their business rather than ON their business - As offline marketers thats what we specialise in - Identifying the right opportunities for the right business and supporting the implementation of action to take advantage of those opportunities.

    How does the old saying go...?, "You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make them drink!"


    @ Dexx

    A fantastic and important comment - Acting from an mindset of abundance - One of the most important lessons any offline marketer will learn is that you are the one who has final choice of when and who you work with. If a potential client is showing signs of being difficult, the sooner you get out the better.

    @ Offline warriors - Keep Sharing - Offline businesses enrich the lives of the communities they serve. Helping offline businesses succeed using your marketing expertise is a noble occupation. To Your Success! ;-)
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    Happy to be amongst like minded warriors!
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    • Profile picture of the author cshilling22
      I am back and forth on this thread. You seem to be very successful with your business and have many offices and employees in different locations. Yet at the same time you seem to make it sound like other people cannot achieve that as well because they cannot offer value to clients. You also give a lot of great advice throughout.

      You are right that if you offer SEO services getting a client to page one of Google will not even guarantee they get one new client. But if your service is SEO and you have a deal with a client that you will do your best to get them to page one of Google, and you do, and they do not get one new customer you still have nothing to be ashamed of because you completed the service you promised for the money you received. The business owner made a decision and it may not have turned out exactly the way he expected. Just do not expect to continue to retain that client or get positive referrals.

      Now if you are a smart marketer, while doing SEO, you will be advising the business owner that SEO is not the "fix all" and implement other strategies that combined with typical SEO will help the client increase business. That is how you build lifelong clients and a great reputation.

      So while people shouldn't drink the guru kool-aid it is possible for anyone on this forum to help business owners and be successful themselves. John Durham has a great thread on just building simple websites to give small businesses an online presence. There are many things we can do and it is important to stay positive because, like this thread points out, there are a lot of things out there that can make you very frustrated.

      So overall I like the thread but I feel it could be more positive in demonstrating how offline marketers can really help businesses and be successful despite the challenges.
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      • Profile picture of the author Local
        Banned
        Originally Posted by cshilling22 View Post

        I am back and forth on this thread. You seem to be very successful with your business and have many offices and employees in different locations. Yet at the same time you seem to make it sound like other people cannot achieve that as well because they cannot offer value to clients. You also give a lot of great advice throughout.

        You are right that if you offer SEO services getting a client to page one of Google will not even guarantee they get one new client. But if your service is SEO and you have a deal with a client that you will do your best to get them to page one of Google, and you do, and they do not get one new customer you still have nothing to be ashamed of because you completed the service you promised for the money you received. The business owner made a decision and it may not have turned out exactly the way he expected. Just do not expect to continue to retain that client or get positive referals.

        Now if you are a smart marketer, while doing SEO, you will be advising the business owner that SEO is not the "fix all" and implement other strategies that combined with typical SEO will help the client increase business. That is how you build lifelong clients and a great reputation.

        So while people shouldn't drink the guru kool-aid it is possible for anyone on this forum to help business owners and be successful themselves. John Durham has a great thread on just building simple websites to give small businesses an online presence. There are many things we can do and it is important to stay positve because, like this thread points out, there are a lot of things out there that can make you very frustrated.

        So overall I like the thread but I feel it could be more positive in demonstrating how offline marketers can really help businesses and be successful despite the challenges.
        More positive?

        Interesting.

        Personally I wish I had been able to read a thread like this when I first started.

        It might have saved me some really trying moments.

        Let me be very clear in my experiences:

        Business owners are NOT buying SEO services.

        PERIOD.

        Even the mention of SEO and they will shut you down.

        And they could care less about being on page one of Google.

        Even though part of our efforts includes SEO/SEM, etc., etc., that is not what they are REALLY investing in.

        They want more customers.

        To sell SEO that does not result in new business is a waste on my and their time.

        So, we have to look at the big picture and have the client communicate what success looks like to them and then we create a blueprint that will achieve that goal.

        We do not guarantee first page listings, but we do guarantee we will increase the amount of each client's business.

        And we do.

        For our larger clients, the biggest bang for their buck (and in order to see more immediate results) is for us to create a past customer reactivation campaign.

        We also can create joint venture and cross selling between multiple clients to help each business add new clients from the other businesses we are helping.

        It is fun and can create more immediate profit increases which typical SEO does not have the luxury of.

        Additionally, without an adequate direct response website, tripling their traffic is not going to make any difference. We have to fix the cart before we employ the donkey. :-)

        Evie
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        • Profile picture of the author cshilling22
          Originally Posted by Local View Post

          More positive?

          Interesting.

          Personally I wish I had been able to read a thread like this when I first started.

          It might have saved me some really trying moments.

          Let me be very clear in my experiences:

          Business owners are NOT buying SEO services.

          PERIOD.

          Even the mention of SEO and they will shut you down.

          And they could care less about being on page one of Google.

          Even though part of our efforts includes SEO/SEM, etc., etc., that is not what they are REALLY investing in.

          They want more customers.

          To sell SEO that does not result in new business is a waste on my and their time.

          So, we have to look at the big picture and have the client communicate what success looks like to them and then we create a blueprint that will achieve that goal.

          We do not guarantee first page listings, but we do guarantee we will increase the amount of each client's business.

          And we do.

          For our larger clients, the biggest bang for their buck (and in order to see more immediate results) is for us to create a past customer reactivation campaign.

          We also can create joint venture and cross selling between multiple clients to help each business add new clients from the other businesses we are helping.

          It is fun and can create more immediate profit increases which typical SEO does not have the luxury of.

          Additionally, without an adequate direct response website, tripling their traffic is not going to make any difference. We have to fix the cart before we employ the donkey. :-)

          Evie
          Great info. That was a lot more positive. lol. So what would you recommend someone just starting out does? If you could go back what steps would you take to get your business started?
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          • Profile picture of the author Local
            Banned
            Originally Posted by cshilling22 View Post

            Great info. That was a lot more positive. lol. So what would you recommend someone just starting out does? If you could go back what steps would you take to get your business started?
            I would find a niche that I had an affinity for and that was spending money on advertising and do my research.

            Then I would select the top 7 businesses which were doing well and at the top of their game and that I felt would be ideal clients, and I would create a 10-12 minute video of my breaking down their online presence, and showing where I could make improvements that would result in additional profits.

            I would show them what their competition was doing and how we could capitalize on holes in their marketing.

            Then I would print an image of thing business on a disc and burn the video on the disc, set for autoplay and hand deliver to each of the 7 businesses.

            Evie
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            • Profile picture of the author Dan B Rusu
              Originally Posted by Local View Post

              I would find a niche that I had an affinity for and that was spending money on advertising and do my research.

              Then I would select the top 7 businesses which were doing well and at the top of their game and that I felt would be ideal clients, and I would create a 10-12 minute video of my breaking down their online presence, and showing where I could make improvements that would result in additional profits.

              I would show them what their competition was doing and how we could capitalize on holes in their marketing.

              Then I would print an image of thing business on a disc and burn the video on the disc, set for autoplay and hand deliver to each of the 7 businesses.

              Evie
              What are some of the industries you've had alot of success with and enjoyed working in?
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              • Profile picture of the author Local
                Banned
                Originally Posted by Daniel7rusu View Post

                What are some of the industries you've had alot of success with and enjoyed working in?
                Look at who is buying full page ads in the Yellow Pages, and 1/4th and up in the newspaper, doing local TV and radio ads.

                No doubt you will need to KNOW your stuff, but it is well worth it.

                Evie
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            • Profile picture of the author ltplenus
              Originally Posted by Local View Post

              I would find a niche that I had an affinity for and that was spending money on advertising and do my research.

              Then I would select the top 7 businesses which were doing well and at the top of their game and that I felt would be ideal clients, and I would create a 10-12 minute video of my breaking down their online presence, and showing where I could make improvements that would result in additional profits.

              I would show them what their competition was doing and how we could capitalize on holes in their marketing.

              Then I would print an image of thing business on a disc and burn the video on the disc, set for autoplay and hand deliver to each of the 7 businesses.

              Evie
              Hi Evie,

              I think its a great way to get the foot in the door, as well as a great strategy overall. Can you elaborate a little bit more on that, maybe giving a real life example ? I would like to know exactly how you point out their weakness and how you present the solution to them...
              Thank you !
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            • Profile picture of the author Izesta
              Originally Posted by Local View Post

              I would find a niche that I had an affinity for and that was spending money on advertising and do my research.

              Then I would select the top 7 businesses which were doing well and at the top of their game and that I felt would be ideal clients, and I would create a 10-12 minute video of my breaking down their online presence, and showing where I could make improvements that would result in additional profits.

              I would show them what their competition was doing and how we could capitalize on holes in their marketing.

              Then I would print an image of thing business on a disc and burn the video on the disc, set for autoplay and hand deliver to each of the 7 businesses.

              Evie

              I know this is a typo, but what should it say here: "...print an image of thing business on a disc....." ?
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              • Profile picture of the author Local
                Banned
                Originally Posted by Izesta View Post

                I know this is a typo, but what should it say here: "...print an image of thing business on a disc....." ?
                thing = their

                Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Dan B Rusu
    Awesome post Evie, you reveal things in here that Wso sellers and the gurus out there wouldn't dream of saying. I've struggled with much of this in my own business, here are the things I've done to combat them:

    Originally Posted by Local View Post

    Understand, I have built a nice business selling to local business owners, but I am still amazed at what a pain in the arse this business can be.

    It is not as easy as the "gurus" say it is, I can tell you that.

    And trying to really make a difference for these business owners, that is a full time job.

    Just running down usernames and passwords, you'd think you were after the dead sea scrolls.

    Get all the information you need from them right when they signup and pay. So if you're building a website, get their host info, pictures, ftp info, ect.

    They refuse to follow the simplest directions, they are the biggest cry babies, constantly complaining about the economy this and the economy that, but never taking action to improve their own situation.

    Cant help on that lol. People are naturally whiners, and that's why so many businesses fail.

    And when you give a solid recommendation that will bring them more customers, and even back it up with real life case studies, they suddenly become a marketing expert and tell you 100 reasons why that won't work for their business.

    They pay late and even then, you have to hound them for payment like you are a collection agency for the IRS.

    Use recurring billing with authorize.net. They even have an echeck option that allows recurring directly from their debit accounts. Tell your clients you're switching over to this model so you can be more green (which is true). This instantly wiped out 90% of my accounts receivables

    And I get the fact that they are so bombarded with BS, scam nonsense from the likes of eLocal, YellowBook, adzzoo, WSI, etc., etc. everyday, and that it is no wonder they don't trust anyone, but my point is they are getting so good at lying too it makes our job more difficult than ever.

    OMG!

    But it doesn't have to be that way, IF, you begin targeting the right business owners.

    I have a handful of local consultants here in California that I have been mentoring, and while there are a number of factors that contribute to their struggles, I have identified the top 5.

    1. Lack of focus. See #2.

    2. Trying to shot gun every conceivable solution. Pick a single foot in the door solution and sell that to every prospect.

    3. Hopeium. Stop believing you have a deal until the check is cashed. How many of these guys were celebrating all half-cocked when ultimately no deal was consummated. Even if a prospect says YES! wait until the check is cashed to celebrate.

    4. Only meet with 9 and 10s. You need to be preaching to the choir when it comes to selecting business owners to do business with. If you have to teach them why marketing (let alone internet marketing) is important and they should be doing it, you are dead in the water.

    Most new consultants are spending 100% of their time chasing the 1s and 2s. Even if they get them to sign, they will be a nightmare.

    The 80/20 (more like the 90/10) rule applies here too.

    my favorite rule.

    10% of your clients will account for 90% of your income, why not build your consultancy with more clients that are just like that 10%?

    5. Only meet with prospects that are already spending at least $1,000+ per month on advertising. Personally, I go after the $10K+ per month advertisers now. Sure, it is a longer process to seal the deal, but then again, you are earning 4-5 figures per month from one client.

    Question - Why do you do to find the clients that are spending $1000/month or $10k/month?

    In my experience, if you can stay focused, stick with one service to get your foot in the door, set aside your hopeium and concentrate on those prospects that get marketing and are spending money every month on advertising.

    You'll have a chance at success at being a local business consultant.

    Evie
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Daniel7rusu View Post

      Awesome post Evie, you reveal things in here that Wso sellers and the gurus out there wouldn't dream of saying. I've struggled with much of this in my own business, here are the things I've done to combat them:
      Excellent input... especially on getting everything you need BEFORE you leave.

      Our sales reps used to be in such a hurry to get the heck out of there after they made the sale. I guess they were afraid it would unwind if they continued to talk.

      :-)

      How do we find the prospects that are spending $$$ on ads?

      Easy, look on Billboards, Bus Benches, Buses, Taxi Cabs, Newspaper Ads (not one time ads either, but ones that run day after day, week after week) TV, radio, full page Yellow Page ads, etc., etc.

      Also, look on competitive research sites for big spenders on PPC, especially the ones that are wasting a crap load of money on keywords that you know are not working or related to their product/service.

      Imagine if you could give a presentation and pitch them on the fact that if you could save them $20,000 a month on their PPC spend, and actually increase their traffic counts and conversions, if they would invest the $20,000 savings for your consulting each month?

      We have accumulated a list of business niches that routinely are big spenders on ads.

      We also use one of Denny Hatch's services to research successful direct mail pieces and the companies that are behind them.

      We have located and successfully engages companies spending millions a year on advertising using this one strategy.

      Anyhow, if you are a one man (or woman) shop, find a single niche that routinely spends $5-10K per month on advertising and become that industries "go to guy" for Internet/Mobile marketing.

      You can't go wrong, but it does take a lot of upfront work and research.

      I compare it to a doctor having spent 14+ years on college, med school, and residency, stuck with hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt and making low six figures if they are lucky.

      My main career is a nurse anesthetist, I work 10-11 days per month and made a very nice living, but with my consultancy business, I now earn more than any physician at my hospital, including our medical director.

      My point is, within a year, you can know this niche inside and out and be their hero.

      Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author Dan B Rusu
        Originally Posted by Local View Post

        Excellent input... especially on getting everything you need BEFORE you leave.

        Our sales reps used to be in such a hurry to get the heck out of there after they made the sale. I guess they were afraid it would unwind if they continued to talk.

        :-)

        How do we find the prospects that are spending $$$ on ads?

        Easy, look on Billboards, Bus Benches, Buses, Taxi Cabs, Newspaper Ads (not one time ads either, but ones that run day after day, week after week) TV, radio, full page Yellow Page ads, etc., etc.

        Also, look on competitive research sites for big spenders on PPC, especially the ones that are wasting a crap load of money on keywords that you know are not working or related to their product/service.

        Imagine if you could give a presentation and pitch them on the fact that if you could save them $20,000 a month on their PPC spend, and actually increase their traffic counts and conversions, if they would invest the $20,000 savings for your consulting each month?

        We have accumulated a list of business niches that routinely are big spenders on ads.

        We also use one of Denny Hatch's services to research successful direct mail pieces and the companies that are behind them.

        We have located and successfully engages companies spending millions a year on advertising using this one strategy.

        Anyhow, if you are a one man (or woman) shop, find a single niche that routinely spends $5-10K per month on advertising and become that industries "go to guy" for Internet/Mobile marketing.

        You can't go wrong, but it does take a lot of upfront work and research.

        I compare it to a doctor having spent 14+ years on college, med school, and residency, stuck with hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt and making low six figures if they are lucky.

        My main career is a nurse anesthetist, I work 10-11 days per month and made a very nice living, but with my consultancy business, I now earn more than any physician at my hospital, including our medical director.

        My point is, within a year, you can know this niche inside and out and be their hero.

        Evie
        Evie,

        Thanks for the response. Some follow up questions when you get some time away from fishing

        - Can you provide a link to Denny Hatch's services that you mentioned?

        - You wrote that if you were starting, you'd hire a telemarketer to call and set appointments for you for a $1000 product, Google Local was your suggestion. With so many business owners getting bombarded with calls and other advertisements for local marketing services, how do your telemarketers give their "spill" to land the appointment?

        - What I'm really interested in is the 4-5 figure a month clients. In order to land these clients, what is your approach? Do you use your telemarketers to make appointments? Do you sell them on a foot in the door service or on hiring you as an overall consultant

        - What would be really helpful is if you provided a sort of case study where you give some examples of the process your company took to land a few clients. Would you be willing to do this?
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Daniel7rusu View Post

          Evie,

          Thanks for the response. Some follow up questions when you get some time away from fishing

          - Can you provide a link to Denny Hatch's services that you mentioned?

          - You wrote that if you were starting, you'd hire a telemarketer to call and set appointments for you for a $1000 product, Google Local was your suggestion. With so many business owners getting bombarded with calls and other advertisements for local marketing services, how do your telemarketers give their "spill" to land the appointment?

          - What I'm really interested in is the 4-5 figure a month clients. In order to land these clients, what is your approach? Do you use your telemarketers to make appointments? Do you sell them on a foot in the door service or on hiring you as an overall consultant

          - What would be really helpful is if you provided a sort of case study where you give some examples of the process your company took to land a few clients. Would you be willing to do this?

          1. WHO'S MAILING WHAT! Archive

          2. Join John Durham's Telemarketing Forum and learn how to do telemarketing and then hire. Our TMs set appointments for all of our reps. We sell a simple "foot in the door" service for $997.

          3. 4-5 figure a month clients? We sign the "foot in the door" clients and upsell after they trust us and are happy.

          And a completely different beast, that I personally use, is I hand pick clients I want to work with that are spending $100,000 and up per year on advertising and then I go after them. I create a customized 30-40 minute presentation and make an appointment. Works almost every time, but you have to work your way up. It doesn't happen over night.

          I have NO FEAR, so this does not work for everyone.

          4. No I wouldn't be willing to do that for obvious reasons.

          :-)

          Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Dan B Rusu
    Oops, meant to say HOW do you do to find the clients that are spending $1000/month or $10k/month? What techniques and resources is your team using. We're just targeting companies that bring in $x/year, but dont have data on how much they spend in advertising.


    Another question came to mind - are the majority of your high paying clients paying for your reputation management service, or for marketing consulting (or do they purchase both)?
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Daniel7rusu View Post

      Oops, meant to say HOW do you do to find the clients that are spending $1000/month or $10k/month? What techniques and resources is your team using. We're just targeting companies that bring in /year, but dont have data on how much they spend in advertising.


      Another question came to mind - are the majority of your high paying clients paying for your reputation management service, or for marketing consulting (or do they purchase both)?
      Two separate beasts at the moment.

      Our reputation management business is relatively new and all of our clients are coming from referrals.

      We have a number of local politicians that have hired us, and each one we take on seems to refer at least 1-2 additional clients

      We'd never intended to go there, but here we are.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Clough
    "They want more customers".....very well said!!
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  • Profile picture of the author sloanjim
    Some interesting concepts........food for thought. I am sure there are many ways to skin the cat though. But thanks anyway for some great info. Taught me to look here the big money is instead of chasing cheapskates who will not adverise.

    "do not sell homes to the homeless"
    Signature

    15 Minute Forex Bar Trading System Free at
    http://www.fxscalpingmethod.com

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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by sloanjim View Post

      Some interesting concepts........food for thought. I am sure there are many ways to skin the cat though. But thanks anyway for some great info.
      That is a fact, but no matter how you do it, people need to just get off their lazy a$$es and DO IT!

      I had a small group of offine marketers visit me last week for a number of days and by the end of day one, they all were ready to take a nap!

      No disrespect but I'll get caught up on my sleep when I'm dead.

      This business is about doing and if you ain't selling, your dying.

      It is so easy to find a reason why you can't today.

      Set aside your fears and just do it.

      It isn't that bad.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author sloanjim
    oh so you aren't a fan of the 4 hour week then? LOL

    I had a small group of offine marketers visit me last week for a number of days and by the end of day one, they all were ready to take a nap!

    No disrespect but I'll get caught up on my sleep when I'm dead.

    This business is about doing and if you ain't selling, your dying.
    Signature

    15 Minute Forex Bar Trading System Free at
    http://www.fxscalpingmethod.com

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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by sloanjim View Post

      oh so you aren't a fan of the 4 hour week then? LOL
      4 Hour Week?

      Yeah right...

      The sequel will be titled "The $495 Bankruptcy..."

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author FullExMedia
    This forum has opened my eyes in to various aspects of the offline business niche. Thanks I'm learning so much
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  • Profile picture of the author InfoGirl
    Very good advice Evie thanks....I have Adam's program but have not pulled the trigger.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Dittberner
    If you are new to local marketing, reading things like the following can be really discouraging and another excuse for not taking action:

    "Business owners are NOT buying SEO services."

    "Chasing these $200, $500, even $1,000 one time deals is suicide."

    "Clients never pay on time."

    "That's why having even a menu of Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum is a joke."

    In reality, what works or doesn't work for one person isn't necessarily the case for someone else. Beware of "definitive" statements. ALL systems works, if implemented correctly.

    Business owners DO buy SEO services...all day long. $200 small accounts can turn into $2k accounts in a month or two if you have a GOOD sales funnel. Now I will say, not paying on time is common, but you just come up with a strategy for dealing with it. If you know this advance, you just prepare. Also, a "menu" is going to be VERY effective for some types of clients. Is it ideal?...probably not, but it works in a LOT of cases, and (more importantly) it puts the bug in their ear for "things to come" when you upsell them later. Once you start making them money/getting them more clients, what business won't invest more with you after you prove yourself?

    My point isn't to dispute specifics...it is simply to encourage new (and seasoned) local marketers to develop a system and to constantly work that system (and test). If you are cold calling, and it isn't working, change your approach. It doesn't mean "cold calling doesn't work." Use ALL of the tools in the toolbox. Don't just marry one strategy or only have one way of doing things or you will be killed in the long run.

    Once you find something that works...wash, rinse, repeat. There will, for sure, be someone in some thread swearing it doesn't work.
    Signature

    Connect with me on Twitter @jdittber

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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Jason Dittberner View Post

      If you are new to local marketing, reading things like the following can be really discouraging and another excuse for not taking action:

      "Business owners are NOT buying SEO services."

      "Chasing these $200, $500, even $1,000 one time deals is suicide."

      "Clients never pay on time."

      "That's why having even a menu of Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum is a joke."

      In reality, what works or doesn't work for one person isn't necessarily the case for someone else. Beware of "definitive" statements. ALL systems works, if implemented correctly.

      Business owners DO buy SEO services...all day long. $200 small accounts can turn into $2k accounts in a month or two if you have a GOOD sales funnel. Now I will say, not paying on time is common, but you just come up with a strategy for dealing with it. If you know this advance, you just prepare. Also, a "menu" is going to be VERY effective for some types of clients. Is it ideal?...probably not, but it works in a LOT of cases, and (more importantly) it puts the bug in their ear for "things to come" when you upsell them later. Once you start making them money/getting them more clients, what business won't invest more with you after you prove yourself?

      My point isn't to dispute specifics...it is simply to encourage new (and seasoned) local marketers to develop a system and to constantly work that system (and test). If you are cold calling, and it isn't working, change your approach. It doesn't mean "cold calling doesn't work." Use ALL of the tools in the toolbox. Don't just marry one strategy or only have one way of doing things or you will be killed in the long run.

      Once you find something that works...wash, rinse, repeat. There will, for sure, be someone in some thread swearing it doesn't work.
      Jason, are you opening with SEO and SELLING?

      If so, I will fly to you and accompany you on a weeks worth of sales calls.

      I will pay you handsomely.

      I currently have almost 100 sales reps and 15 sales managers that will strongly disagree.

      YES!

      We do SEO, but I am telling you... 99% of business owners that you open with SEO will tell you to bugger off!

      THAT IS A FACT!!!!

      And just because you work a system doesn't mean jack if your system SUCKS.

      That is like the BS that practice makes perfect.

      That is a crock.

      If you are practicing using improper form, you are NOT going to get ANY better.

      Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author Jason Dittberner
        Originally Posted by Local View Post


        I currently have almost 100 sales reps and 15 sales managers that will strongly disagree.

        YES!

        We do SEO, but I am telling you... 99% of business owners that you open with SEO will tell you to bugger off!

        THAT IS A FACT!!!!

        And just because you work a system doesn't mean jack if your system SUCKS.

        That is like the BS that practice makes perfect.

        That is a crock.

        If you are practicing using improper form, you are NOT going to get ANY better.

        Evie
        I would get a 100 new sales reps, and 15 new sales managers then...that don't suck. That's just absurd to think people aren't closing SEO services every single day. There's many people/companies that ONLY sell SEO services. How are they around if 99% of business owners tell them to bugger off? They must have developed a successful sales system.

        I appreciate your passion, and this is a good thread, but to make blanket statements as "fact" is just nonsense and not serving anyone any good...no matter how entertaining it is.

        Practice doesn't make perfect? OK.
        Signature

        Connect with me on Twitter @jdittber

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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Jason Dittberner View Post

          I would get a 100 new sales reps, and 15 new sales managers then...that don't suck. That's just absurd to think people aren't closing SEO services every single day. There's many people/companies that ONLY sell SEO services. How are they around if 99% of business owners tell them to bugger off? They must have developed a successful sales system.

          I appreciate your passion, and this is a good thread, but to make blanket statements as "fact" is just nonsense and not serving anyone any good...no matter how entertaining it is.

          Practice doesn't make perfect? OK.
          The BIG players, the ones that make me and my efforts look like an amateur, I have studied every company out there and currently am paying the salaries for 3 of our employees to work for Local, YB and I cannot give the 3rd because they are already suspicious LOL

          We also have the entire sales training Yelp, citysearch and a few other are using.

          Each of these companies is NOT opening with SEO.

          Even ignite is using social media as their foot in the door.

          I would not be saying this crap if it wasn't true.

          I HATE posers and misinformation.

          It is why I waste even a second on these boards when I can.

          If I can prevent even one person from making the same mistakes I did, then I have done my job and I'll crawl back into my WOMAN cave (although I have wallpapered!)

          And I stand behind the fact that practice does not make perfect. Only perfect practice makes perfect...

          Evie
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          • Profile picture of the author BradB
            Evie,...."If I can prevent even one person from making the same mistakes I did, then I have done my job and I'll crawl back into my WOMAN cave (although I have wallpapered!)"

            I have had a tough day and reading that,........well I cracked up..

            Thank-you you for the post the info......and the laugh...;-))
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    • Profile picture of the author Deidra Renee
      [QUOTE=Jason Dittberner;4173803]If you are new to local marketing, reading things like the following can be really discouraging and another excuse for not taking action:

      "Business owners are NOT buying SEO services."

      "Chasing these $200, $500, even $1,000 one time deals is suicide."

      "Clients never pay on time."

      "That's why having even a menu of Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum is a joke."

      In reality, what works or doesn't work for one person isn't necessarily the case for someone else. Beware of "definitive" statements. ALL systems works, if implemented correctly.

      Yes, it can be discouraging, but I think the point is, they don't really care about SEO, but the ending results of the seo or mobile website or whatever else it is you're offering them. I even had a business owner tell me one time, *don't give me this whole speech about internet marketing, just tell me what you can do for my business..how much more money can I make* So the point was he didn't care if I was using press releases, articles, videos, etc...he wanted to know how he would benefit from it! But I ALWAYS tell people you have to find out what works for you and DO THAT! people swore up and down to me that email marketing does not work and that is the ONLY way I get clients, so I would agree that you should not listen to someone say what didn't work for them and just go by that. Do something first and see what works for YOU!
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  • Profile picture of the author Mary Wilhite
    Many businesses rely on local marketing and are attempting to direct quantifiable targeted efforts.To bring light to the mobile opportunities in this space, one has to decide to take initiative by developing a series of experiments. In collaborating with several local businesses.i would say anything put together with hard work could be a success.
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Mary Wilhite View Post

      Many businesses rely on local marketing and are attempting to direct quantifiable targeted efforts.To bring light to the mobile opportunities in this space, one has to decide to take initiative by developing a series of experiments. In collaborating with several local businesses.i would say anything put together with hard work could be a success.
      Hi Mary!

      We have started a limited campaign of having 100 table tents printed up for each local restaurant we determine to be viable and then securing a keyword for each and allowing them to grow a list of up to 100 diners at no charge and send 100 messages per week, gratis.

      We are 36 for 39 in restaurants accepting our generous offer and it is too soon, but 9 have gone for a full paying package.

      For us, the profit will be in the consulting.

      Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author S3Ware
        Originally Posted by Local View Post

        Hi Mary!

        We have started a limited campaign of having 100 table tents printed up for each local restaurant we determine to be viable and then securing a keyword for each and allowing them to grow a list of up to 100 diners at no charge and send 100 messages per week, gratis.

        We are 36 for 39 in restaurants accepting our generous offer and it is too soon, but 9 have gone for a full paying package.

        For us, the profit will be in the consulting.

        Evie
        Hi Evie,

        Firstly, thanks for all the information and inspiration you have provided in this thread. As others have said, I have seen WSOs that don't offer a fraction of the practical, actionable information you have provided here.

        Regarding your initiative with restaurants, I have considered a similar approach. My problem with restaurants has been getting past the manager to the owner or ultimate decision-maker. I have found that the owners are so rarely there and it is very hit-or-miss getting to them, either on the phone or in-person. Would you mind sharing a little insight on how your salespeople are getting to the decision-maker?

        Thanks again,

        Rich
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by baib21 View Post

          Hi Evie,

          Firstly, thanks for all the information and inspiration you have provided in this thread. As others have said, I have seen WSOs that don't offer a fraction of the practical, actionable information you have provided here.

          Regarding your initiative with restaurants, I have considered a similar approach. My problem with restaurants has been getting past the manager to the owner or ultimate decision-maker. I have found that the owners are so rarely there and it is very hit-or-miss getting to them, either on the phone or in-person. Would you mind sharing a little insight on how your salespeople are getting to the decision-maker?

          Thanks again,

          Rich
          Hi Rich,

          I think I have a bunch of little piggies working for me because we all LOVE to eat.

          We have breakfast and dinner meetings all the time at different restaurants and all of our sales managers meet their sales teams for lunch at different restaurants.

          So, starting off by going to the restaurants you already visit would be a start.

          Next, we started borrowing restaurants menus and digitizing them and uploading them with that restaurant's information. Then we created a QR code and a postcard/table tent with the QR code and a nice headline that basically tells customers to scan the QR Code to take our menu with you.

          Then on the other side is a message for them to text the word "Pork" or whatever to 515151 (or whatever) and you'll instantly join our Preferred Diners Club. Receive specials, coupons and deals.

          Our system is set up to send a welcome text asking for their birthday, then later anniversary, etc., all the while building a database of information on each customer.

          Some of our clients we offer a free desert or appetizer when they join.

          We also offer a promotion where some of our clients text a certain number of office party winners.... or TGIW (Wednesday/Thursday, etc) Party for friends and family... and the restaurant provides all the party food and special drink prices.

          These have been very successful, especially on off nights.

          Sure, we put a bit of work in upfront, but we usually end up making a deal.

          Targeting Groupon/LivingSocial advertisers should be a no brainer, as they are crying out... HELP ME!!!!

          In fact, they are so desperate they have gone to Groupon/LivingSocial, etc. which they would have made a better decision had they gone to their local loan shark and borrowed $100,000 and invested it is solid, tested advertising/marketing opportunities.

          YOU can be their hero, if you catch them before it is too late.

          Evie
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          • Profile picture of the author Nathan Alexander
            Originally Posted by Local View Post

            Hi Rich,

            I think I have a bunch of little piggies working for me because we all LOVE to eat.

            We have breakfast and dinner meetings all the time at different restaurants and all of our sales managers meet their sales teams for lunch at different restaurants.

            So, starting off by going to the restaurants you already visit would be a start.

            Next, we started borrowing restaurants menus and digitizing them and uploading them with that restaurant's information. Then we created a QR code and a postcard/table tent with the QR code and a nice headline that basically tells customers to scan the QR Code to take our menu with you.

            Then on the other side is a message for them to text the word "Pork" or whatever to 515151 (or whatever) and you'll instantly join our Preferred Diners Club. Receive specials, coupons and deals.

            Our system is set up to send a welcome text asking for their birthday, then later anniversary, etc., all the while building a database of information on each customer.

            Some of our clients we offer a free desert or appetizer when they join.

            We also offer a promotion where some of our clients text a certain number of office party winners.... or TGIW (Wednesday/Thursday, etc) Party for friends and family... and the restaurant provides all the party food and special drink prices.

            These have been very successful, especially on off nights.

            Sure, we put a bit of work in upfront, but we usually end up making a deal.

            Targeting Groupon/LivingSocial advertisers should be a no brainer, as they are crying out... HELP ME!!!!

            Evie
            That right there is gold. Those new to working with businesses and wondering about services, steps etc, look at the process and think about it.

            Please don't neglect the value just because it wasn't in a WSO. She just gave some great info away. (I'm sure she doesn't even think she's "giving it away" as it's standard fare of sorts--that kind of solution and business generation for restaurants--for people who do what she does. And it's also true that few people will act on information they get for free...).

            Thanks Evie, you don't owe anyone anything. And as you're busy making a living, I hope most people appreciate (I do) the time and value you're adding here.
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  • Profile picture of the author maricelu
    My oppinion is that you are a real pro and your expertise is an example of what the Offline Consulting business should be actually- not only SEO but a lot of research on the prospect's online activity, and us trying to improve it even more.

    Thanks. You bring help to us! I have your posts in a doc.
    Signature

    I have no signature.

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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by maricelu View Post

      My oppinion is that you are a real pro and your expertise is an example of what the Offline Consulting business should be actually- not only SEO but a lot of research on the prospect's online activity, and us trying to improve it even more.

      Thanks. You bring help to us! I have your posts in a doc.
      Well thank you...

      Bringing sound marketing principles to small business owners can be very enriching and rewarding.

      The pay's not bad either!

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Dont listen to Evie...., she barely makes $100,000 a month at this. Cmon! Sheesh!

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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Dont listen to Evie...., she barely makes $100,000 a month at this. Cmon! Sheesh!

      Hi John!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      I owe my phone rooms to you my friend!

      And a couple of my business models were inspired by your great mind.

      Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author Local
        Banned
        By the way, one way you all can REALLY help local business owners is to get them to STOP acting like Wal-Mart and discounting their products and services to the point where they themselves almost need to get a second job.

        There's an excellent book titled "Escaping The Price-Driven Sale: How World Class..."Escaping The Price-Driven Sale: How World Class... available at Amazon.


        And no, it is NOT a $9.99 book, even on a Kindle, as the authors are practicing what they preach. But if you could help a business owner be more profitable, maybe they'd be willing to invest the initial increase in profits to HIRE you?

        Evie
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        • Profile picture of the author jrobconsult
          Originally Posted by Local View Post

          By the way, one way you all can REALLY help local business owners is to get them to STOP acting like Wal-Mart and discounting their products and services to the point where they themselves almost need to get a second job.

          There's an excellent book titled "Escaping The Price-Driven Sale: How World Class Sellers Create Extraordinary Profit" available at Amazon.


          And no, it is NOT a $9.99 book, even on a Kindle, as the authors are practicing what they preach. But if you could help a business owner be more profitable, maybe they'd be willing to invest the initial increase in profits to HIRE you?

          Evie
          Trying to build a customer base on price is the wrong way to go. They should stress value and that could be even from the highest price business owner in town. Excellent tip Evie.

          This same advice is for consultants also. You should not stress your price but the value you provide for the business.
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      • Profile picture of the author John Durham
        Originally Posted by Local View Post

        Hi John!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

        I owe my phone rooms to you my friend!

        And a couple of my business models were inspired by your great mind.

        Evie
        You dont owe me anything my friend, you pay it forward everyday! I can only share what I know, still 90% refuse to succeed... you are the one who made the difference for you.
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      • Profile picture of the author John Durham
        Originally Posted by Local View Post

        Hi John!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

        I owe my phone rooms to you my friend!

        And a couple of my business models were inspired by your great mind.

        Evie
        You dont owe me anything my friend, you pay it forward everyday! I can only share what I know, still 90% refuse to succeed... you are the one who made the difference for you.
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

          You dont owe me anything my friend, you pay it forward everyday! I can only share what I know, still 90% refuse to succeed... you are the one who made the difference for you.
          Isn't that just like John to try to get the last word in... AGAIN...

          LOL

          Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author dmb0319
        Thanks for taking time to give advice. I have gain alot of inspiration and learned a lot at the same time.
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        • Profile picture of the author buddy7
          Great thoughts, Evie. Thank you so much for sharing. All the best to you, Buddy
          Signature
          www.CEOShortcut.com Equiping Christ-Centered Entrepreneurs to Launch their own Business.
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      • Profile picture of the author Izesta
        Perhaps I missed it, but for clarification, what definition is everyone using for "mom pop" - "small business" - "medium business" - "large business?"

        Are you talking about sales, number of employees, advertising dollars, etc.?
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      • Profile picture of the author Izesta
        I love this: With Ari's mindset, you are NOT worried about making the sale, in fact, you even tell the prospect "I don't even know if I can help you"...

        It throws them off a bit and typically erases any expectation of a pitch and a "sale."
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    • Profile picture of the author philboy uk
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Dont listen to Evie...., she barely makes $100,000 a month at this. Cmon! Sheesh!

      Hi John,

      have you ever been able to sell SEO services to local businesses during your long career in telemarketing ?

      thanks

      Phil
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      • Profile picture of the author Local
        Banned
        Full fathom five thy father lies;
        Of his bones are coral made;
        Those are pearls that were his eyes:
        Nothing of him that doth fade
        But doth suffer a sea-change
        Into something rich and strange.
        Sea-nymphs hourly ring his knell

        Shakespeare, The Tempest

        Escape the price driven sale and attempting to offer value alone and you will exceed even your own dreams.

        Evie
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        • Profile picture of the author Drakuul
          Originally Posted by Local View Post

          Full fathom five thy father lies;
          Of his bones are coral made;
          Those are pearls that were his eyes:
          Nothing of him that doth fade
          But doth suffer a sea-change
          Into something rich and strange.
          Sea-nymphs hourly ring his knell

          Shakespeare, The Tempest

          Escape the price driven sale and attempting to offer value alone and you will exceed even your own dreams.

          Evie


          "Richard Cory"

          Whenever Richard Cory went down town,
          We people on the pavement looked at him:
          He was a gentleman from head to crown,
          Clean favored, and imperially slim.

          And he was always quietly arrayed,
          And he was always human when he talked;
          But he still fluttered pulses when he said,
          "Good-morning," and he glittered when he walked.


          And he was rich--yes, richer than a king--
          and admirably schooled in every grace:
          In fine, we thought that he was everything
          To make us wish that we were in his place.
          So on we worked, and waited for the light,
          And went without the meat, and cursed the bread;
          And Richard Cory, one calm summer night,
          Went home and put a bullet through his head.



          On both sides of the fence, everyone has their own limits, celebrations, their struggles, and ways of handling things. I don't believe that there is such a hard and fast rule as to what will and won't work. Tony Robbins once asked why is it that when it snows, some people freeze to death, while other people ski?

          I love the information provided in this thread, but at least in my experience, local business owners are nowhere near as nightmarish as the image presented here. I've created about 150 videos for about 90 businesses since January, part time, while going to school.

          I've only recently started managing some Bing and Google Places setups.

          No, not $10,000 a month clients, but the point is, they have for the most part, been genuinely appreciative and receptive to me. The majority that I've met and worked with have been a joy.

          Just luck?

          I read here on the forum long ago -- Christopher Griffith, who said not to say the word "SEO" -- just say "make it easier to find you when people use Google". I don't offer typical SEO, but I remember the concept of keeping the technical lingo out of the conversation.

          I also usually open by stating that "I don't know if this could help your business or not, but here's what I can do and we can try it for a few months for free and see if it helps", etc... After 2-3 weeks I go back to the owner and offer to do another video, for another keyword... or more recently, set up Google Places if they don't have it yet, also free. Yes, I knew I was taking a chance.

          But a month or two later, I'd go back and show them the monthly rates if they would like to continue... "or I could just take everything down and thank you for giving me a chance to try and help you."

          So far I only had one that said to take everything down, and that was because (I didn't know at the time) he was already set to close down.

          So just for me, I have a moderate income, even if I do nothing for a month (lol, like that will ever happen!), but the payments still come in. I don't have a mega-payroll or lots of salespeople to manage, but my car, rent, school, and a bit of tiny luxuries are being paid for by my local business friends.

          Again, I know I'm not playing at the same level as some of the gurus here, but for the smaller guys out there, and the newbies, you may learn what WON'T work for someone else, but you really can't know what works for YOU unless you try.

          Funny story -- Cover Baily (exercise/nutritionist), explained how metabolism may have an affinity to decrease as one gets old, and how exercise can keep the metabolism revved up throughout the day. He told the story of how little Jimmy wanted a third slice of chocolate pie. His mom told him that eating lots of pie will make him fat. Jimmy responded by saying, "No mom. Eating lots of chocolate pie makes YOU fat".

          Not everything works the same way for everyone.

          My first client... January 4th 2011, I walked in off the street (my only "client getting strategy" so far) and showed the owner what I could do and gave her a price range. Her response was that it was twice what the saleman offered that had just left. In one fell swoop, it hit me that DAMN, someone else is doing this already, and not only that, he's making his rounds and even charging half of what I'm charging.

          I asked if she was working with him, and was relieved when she said that they didn't like him; that he was kinda pushy and long winded and they had no idea what he was saying or promising.

          As she responded, I was sincerely packing away my laptop, preparing to leave, when she said, but with you, I understand and know exactly where we stand. She put half down and has been paying me monthly since then.
          (I started out that way -- half down.)

          Maybe the same salesman that didn't get the sale went home and listened to another course or bought a nicer laptop or fancier suit, then posted on the forums that cold calling doesn't work and just plain sucks.

          I honestly don't know what direction I would have went had the first attempt been with someone rude or hostile or demeaning. I'd like to think that I would have just went to the next business in the strip center, and the next, and the next, until it was time to stop for the day...

          But would it have changed my perception of business owners, thus changing my interaction or attitude or demeanor with the next owner?
          Would it have mattered? I just don't know.

          But in my relatively short work experience working with local business owners, I can in no way agree with the sweeping generalization that it "is a nightmare".

          And I sleep pretty good at night.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4184630].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author Local
            Banned
            Originally Posted by Drakuul View Post

            "Richard Cory"

            Whenever Richard Cory went down town,
            We people on the pavement looked at him:
            He was a gentleman from head to crown,
            Clean favored, and imperially slim.

            And he was always quietly arrayed,
            And he was always human when he talked;
            But he still fluttered pulses when he said,
            "Good-morning," and he glittered when he walked.


            And he was rich--yes, richer than a king--
            and admirably schooled in every grace:
            In fine, we thought that he was everything
            To make us wish that we were in his place.
            So on we worked, and waited for the light,
            And went without the meat, and cursed the bread;
            And Richard Cory, one calm summer night,
            Went home and put a bullet through his head.



            On both sides of the fence, everyone has their own limits, celebrations, their struggles, and ways of handling things. I don't believe that there is such a hard and fast rule as to what will and won't work. Tony Robbins once asked why is it that when it snows, some people freeze to death, while other people ski?

            I love the information provided in this thread, but at least in my experience, local business owners are nowhere near as nightmarish as the image presented here. I've created about 150 videos for about 90 businesses since January, part time, while going to school.

            I've only recently started managing some Bing and Google Places setups.

            No, not $10,000 a month clients, but the point is, they have for the most part, been genuinely appreciative and receptive to me. The majority that I've met and worked with have been a joy.

            Just luck?

            I read here on the forum long ago -- Christopher Griffith, who said not to say the word "SEO" -- just say "make it easier to find you when people use Google". I don't offer typical SEO, but I remember the concept of keeping the technical lingo out of the conversation.

            I also usually open by stating that "I don't know if this could help your business or not, but here's what I can do and we can try it for a few months for free and see if it helps", etc... After 2-3 weeks I go back to the owner and offer to do another video, for another keyword... or more recently, set up Google Places if they don't have it yet, also free. Yes, I knew I was taking a chance.

            But a month or two later, I'd go back and show them the monthly rates if they would like to continue... "or I could just take everything down and thank you for giving me a chance to try and help you."

            So far I only had one that said to take everything down, and that was because (I didn't know at the time) he was already set to close down.

            So just for me, I have a moderate income, even if I do nothing for a month (lol, like that will ever happen!), but the payments still come in. I don't have a mega-payroll or lots of salespeople to manage, but my car, rent, school, and a bit of tiny luxuries are being paid for by my local business friends.

            Again, I know I'm not playing at the same level as some of the gurus here, but for the smaller guys out there, and the newbies, you may learn what WON'T work for someone else, but you really can't know what works for YOU unless you try.

            Funny story -- Cover Baily (exercise/nutritionist), explained how metabolism may have an affinity to decrease as one gets old, and how exercise can keep the metabolism revved up throughout the day. He told the story of how little Jimmy wanted a third slice of chocolate pie. His mom told him that eating lots of pie will make him fat. Jimmy responded by saying, "No mom. Eating lots of chocolate pie makes YOU fat".

            Not everything works the same way for everyone.

            My first client... January 4th 2011, I walked in off the street (my only "client getting strategy" so far) and showed the owner what I could do and gave her a price range. Her response was that it was twice what the saleman offered that had just left. In one fell swoop, it hit me that DAMN, someone else is doing this already, and not only that, he's making his rounds and even charging half of what I'm charging.

            I asked if she was working with him, and was relieved when she said that they didn't like him; that he was kinda pushy and long winded and they had no idea what he was saying or promising.

            As she responded, I was sincerely packing away my laptop, preparing to leave, when she said, but with you, I understand and know exactly where we stand. She put half down and has been paying me monthly since then.
            (I started out that way -- half down.)

            Maybe the same salesman that didn't get the sale went home and listened to another course or bought a nicer laptop or fancier suit, then posted on the forums that cold calling doesn't work and just plain sucks.

            I honestly don't know what direction I would have went had the first attempt been with someone rude or hostile or demeaning. I'd like to think that I would have just went to the next business in the strip center, and the next, and the next, until it was time to stop for the day...

            But would it have changed my perception of business owners, thus changing my interaction or attitude or demeanor with the next owner?
            Would it have mattered? I just don't know.

            But in my relatively short work experience working with local business owners, I can in no way agree with the sweeping generalization that it "is a nightmare".

            And I sleep pretty good at night.
            This very well may have been YOUR experience, but I'm sorry, I cannot let this kind of BS advice be spewed without calling the poster out on it.

            This post is not as "positive" as it may appear at first and in fact can cause more harm than good.

            I have been doing this a long, long time. How many prospects I have seen, I haven't a clue, but for over 6 months I went door to door, 16 hours a day to every business within a 2-3 mile radius of where I was parked.

            Today, our sales reps run approximately 400-600 appointments per day. We have a pretty good handle on what works and what isn't working.

            And in my begining days, I did offer my services for free, and it was a total waste of time. I came to the conclusion that most successful business professionals have. When you give something away for free, it is very difficult to justify its value in the future.

            And you certainly cannot charge a premium.

            It is no different than the mentality that Groupon and LivingSocial customers have. They are couponers and once they purchase your product at 50-80% discount, they are NOT going to pay full price.

            Sure, there will be the odd exception, but overall, they just won't.

            Groupon and LivingSocial reps will have you thinking otherwise, but ask them to give you the data that backs up what they are saying. They won't because they do not collect it.

            Sure, you can incorporate sterling marketing concepts and collect each customers contact info and you can offer immediate upsells in an attempt to break the discount "spell" but it is tough.

            If you doubt what I am saying, go to a Costco and watch the grazers in action. Follow the folks that are going from free sample to free sample. Follow them to the checkout. 70% of the free sample crowd do not have even one of the free sample products in their cart, and most of those are not first time purchasers of that product. 99% do not have more than one.

            My assertion is even if gifting to 8, 9 and 10s you are taking a big chance.

            And from my experience, if you have not selected the perfect businesses, where there is an adequate number of searches, even if your videos were ranked 1 thru 10, that business owner is not going to see even ONE new customer walk in their business as a result of your videos.

            Sure, you can have a nice screen capture to show the next sucker, but what are you REALLY selling them? Smoke and mirrors is all it is, and that is not sustainable.

            It will not build you a real business and your days are numbered before business owners start talking and realize no one is benefiting from this relationship except you.

            Yes, I conducted business like you stated in the begining because I didn't know any better. It is what the gurus taught at the time, and some STILL ARE!

            And once I was invited to a round table by a couple of these gurus, I realized the folks they were basing their training on, were not being totally honest and forthright. A handful were flat out LYING.

            Almost everything I learned and was practicing was based on bogus nonsense. Providing FREE services was one of those ridiculous tactics.

            Now there is nothing wrong with writing a client up and agreeing that you will not get paid until the work is done, but make dang sure you do not have a freeloader on your hands.

            We subsribe to D&B and pull credit reports on clients before extending credit today.

            So, what was MY turning point?

            I met a few that were really doing it. Making it happen. these guys were earning 6+ figures per month. So, I spent week after week with them, in the field, in the trenches. And my mantra was if I didn't experience it myself, then it wasn't real.

            Harsh? Maybe, but I know what we are up against in regards to misinformation and total BS.

            And the title of this post, I stand behind 100%, if you are not working with 8, 9 and 10s, you are setting yourself you for certain failure. And MOST of the small business owners are 1-5s.

            That is unfortunate and I tried my best to help turn them into 10s but THAT was a nightmare!

            And hundreds of consultants have shared similar stories directly with me. Not just here on this forum, but at live seminars, SEO conferences, Social Media workshops, meetups for consultants, etc., etc.

            I even friended all of my competitors and learned what they were doing, including the high pressure sales the public corporations in this business use daily.

            I also subscribe to all of the lawsuits in our market area and using lexisnexis to follow trends and see what business owners are suing their seo/sem and local/marketing consultants for.

            That gives us a great idea of what business owners pain is and which services to avoid offering.

            Evie
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            • Profile picture of the author dunkinbbb
              Originally Posted by Local View Post

              This very well may have been YOUR experience, but I'm sorry, I cannot let this kind of BS advice be spewed without calling the poster out on it.

              This post is not as "positive" as it may appear at first and in fact can cause more harm than good.

              I have been doing this a long, long time. How many prospects I have seen, I haven't a clue, but for over 6 months I went door to door, 16 hours a day to every business within a 2-3 mile radius of where I was parked.

              Today, our sales reps run approximately 400-600 appointments per day. We have a pretty good handle on what works and what isn't working.

              And in my begining days, I did offer my services for free, and it was a total waste of time. I came to the conclusion that most successful business professionals have. When you give something away for free, it is very difficult to justify its value in the future.

              And you certainly cannot charge a premium.

              It is no different than the mentality that Groupon and LivingSocial customers have. They are couponers and once they purchase your product at 50-80% discount, they are NOT going to pay full price.

              Sure, there will be the odd exception, but overall, they just won't.

              Groupon and LivingSocial reps will have you thinking otherwise, but ask them to give you the data that backs up what they are saying. They won't because they do not collect it.

              Sure, you can incorporate sterling marketing concepts and collect each customers contact info and you can offer immediate upsells in an attempt to break the discount "spell" but it is tough.

              If you doubt what I am saying, go to a Costco and watch the grazers in action. Follow the folks that are going from free sample to free sample. Follow them to the checkout. 70% of the free sample crowd do not have even one of the free sample products in their cart, and most of those are not first time purchasers of that product. 99% do not have more than one.

              My assertion is even if gifting to 8, 9 and 10s you are taking a big chance.

              And from my experience, if you have not selected the perfect businesses, where there is an adequate number of searches, even if your videos were ranked 1 thru 10, that business owner is not going to see even ONE new customer walk in their business as a result of your videos.

              Sure, you can have a nice screen capture to show the next sucker, but what are you REALLY selling them? Smoke and mirrors is all it is, and that is not sustainable.

              It will not build you a real business and your days are numbered before business owners start talking and realize no one is benefiting from this relationship except you.

              Yes, I conducted business like you stated in the begining because I didn't know any better. It is what the gurus taught at the time, and some STILL ARE!

              And once I was invited to a round table by a couple of these gurus, I realized the folks they were basing their training on, were not being totally honest and forthright. A handful were flat out LYING.

              Almost everything I learned and was practicing was based on bogus nonsense. Providing FREE services was one of those ridiculous tactics.

              Now there is nothing wrong with writing a client up and agreeing that you will not get paid until the work is done, but make dang sure you do not have a freeloader on your hands.

              We subsribe to D&B and pull credit reports on clients before extending credit today.

              So, what was MY turning point?

              I met a few that were really doing it. Making it happen. these guys were earning 6+ figures per month. So, I spent week after week with them, in the field, in the trenches. And my mantra was if I didn't experience it myself, then it wasn't real.

              Harsh? Maybe, but I know what we are up against in regards to misinformation and total BS.

              And the title of this post, I stand behind 100%, if you are not working with 8, 9 and 10s, you are setting yourself you for certain failure. And MOST of the small business owners are 1-5s.

              That is unfortunate and I tried my best to help turn them into 10s but THAT was a nightmare!

              And hundreds of consultants have shared similar stories directly with me. Not just here on this forum, but at live seminars, SEO conferences, Social Media workshops, meetups for consultants, etc., etc.

              I even friended all of my competitors and learned what they were doing, including the high pressure sales the public corporations in this business use daily.

              I also subscribe to all of the lawsuits in our market area and using lexisnexis to follow trends and see what business owners are suing their seo/sem and local/marketing consultants for.

              That gives us a great idea of what business owners pain is and which services to avoid offering.

              Evie

              Evie

              (and all)


              Thanks for sharing.

              Its very cool to be around smart people who are on their game.

              People who are actually doing it speak definitively - based upon their own experience.

              And its easy to tell the difference.

              Thus the power of a coach/mentor who has been there and succeeded

              I'm old and there are a couple of thing that I know a lot about - Internet Marketing not being one of them - LOL! (but trading commodities/futures is, referencing your Dad, Evie) but when I speak about them, I speak from personal experience and I don't equivocate .

              As someone a lot smarter than me once said - My Guru is reality.

              best,

              dunkinbbb
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  • Profile picture of the author hotlinkz
    Evie, excellent observations! Nothing is ever as simple and straightforward
    as sales letters make it appear.

    Hopefully, this will help offline hopefuls understand why they should
    never skimp on their consulting and service fees. If you are going to
    put up with the demands of offline business owners -- at least charge
    accordingly and make it well worth the effort.
    Signature
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  • Profile picture of the author Local
    Banned
    It is kind of funny how one of my Dad's sayings from childhood, keeps resonating in my head, especially lately... "if you want to be successful, watch what unsuccessful people do, and don't do it."

    Said with tongue in cheek, but there's a lot of truth in there.

    Another was, to watch what the masses are doing, and do the opposite.

    Dad is in commodities and although semi-retired, he still doing well being an armchair psychologist on human behavior.

    All of this talk of Groupon and business owners thinking it is the next coming, will open incredible opportunity for those that refuse to drink the Kool-Aid.

    Think of yourself as a small business owner confronted with the following two offers.

    1. Invest $108,000 into advertising and marketing. In exchange you will get a guarantee of thousands of customers coming through your business at least once each over the next 6 months.

    OR...

    2. I'll pay you 3 payments over a 60 day period that total $36,338. $12,112 in 5 days, $12,112 in 30 days and another $12,112 in 30 more days. Your portion of the deal, is you provide the thousands of new customers I send you over the next 6 months with products discounted at a little over 50%.

    Which would you accept?

    Which would 99.9999% of small business owners take?

    Well, here's the catch.

    They are both the same offer.

    It is the anatomy of a Groupon deal.

    What is sold to these business owners as being totally risk free is in reality, putting their entire business at risk for financial ruin.

    Using direct response marketing tactics, ie., collecting names, addresses and emails from customers that purchase your Groupon deal, and offering immediate upsells when they redeem their coupon, a business has a chance at turning the tables.

    However, it is very difficult to turn discount buyers into full boat customers and clients.

    It can be done however, but shouldn't business owners know all the facts before they make a bad decision?

    Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author maricelu
    Evie, I have one qs to you: Where do your run your business? Do you target localc companies from cities with nearly no competitors? or you just don't target small businesses?
    I saw on a post you said u live in a 50000 ppl city. do you run offline biz in it?
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    I have no signature.

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    • Profile picture of the author Bennette
      Hi Evie,

      Thanks for all your informative information. I have a client that's having a problem with her competition slandering her on the Internet and giving her bad reviews, which has caused her business to drop tremendously.

      This is just what I was looking for to try and help her.

      I just ordered the book. Thanks for your recommendation.
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by maricelu View Post

      Evie, I have one qs to you: Where do your run your business? Do you target localc companies from cities with nearly no competitors? or you just don't target small businesses?
      I saw on a post you said u live in a 50000 ppl city. do you run offline biz in it?
      We now have offices in San Diego and Orange County, CA, two very competitive markets, but we sell in ALL of Southern California.

      We also have offices in Texas, Florida and South Carolina.

      I am not giving exact cities for obvious reasons, but we are systematically covering each state we are located in. At least the major cities. And we will open additional cities as a result of that work.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Barry Plaskow
    Originally Posted by Local View Post

    Understand, I have built a nice business selling to local business owners, but I am still amazed at what a pain in the arse this business can be.

    It is not as easy as the "gurus" say it is, I can tell you that.

    And trying to really make a difference for these business owners, that is a full time job.

    Just running down usernames and passwords, you'd think you were after the dead sea scrolls.

    They refuse to follow the simplest directions, they are the biggest cry babies, constantly complaining about the economy this and the economy that, but never taking action to improve their own situation.

    And when you give a solid recommendation that will bring them more customers, and even back it up with real life case studies, they suddenly become a marketing expert and tell you 100 reasons why that won't work for their business.

    They pay late and even then, you have to hound them for payment like you are a collection agency for the IRS.

    And I get the fact that they are so bombarded with BS, scam nonsense from the likes of eLocal, YellowBook, adzzoo, WSI, etc., etc. everyday, and that it is no wonder they don't trust anyone, but my point is they are getting so good at lying too it makes our job more difficult than ever.

    OMG!

    But it doesn't have to be that way, IF, you begin targeting the right business owners.

    I have a handful of local consultants here in California that I have been mentoring, and while there are a number of factors that contribute to their struggles, I have identified the top 5.

    1. Lack of focus. See #2.

    2. Trying to shot gun every conceivable solution. Pick a single foot in the door solution and sell that to every prospect.

    3. Hopeium. Stop believing you have a deal until the check is cashed. How many of these guys were celebrating all half-cocked when ultimately no deal was consummated. Even if a prospect says YES! wait until the check is cashed to celebrate.

    4. Only meet with 9 and 10s. You need to be preaching to the choir when it comes to selecting business owners to do business with. If you have to teach them why marketing (let alone internet marketing) is important and they should be doing it, you are dead in the water.

    Most new consultants are spending 100% of their time chasing the 1s and 2s. Even if they get them to sign, they will be a nightmare.

    The 80/20 (more like the 90/10) rule applies here too.

    10% of your clients will account for 90% of your income, why not build your consultancy with more clients that are just like that 10%?

    5. Only meet with prospects that are already spending at least $1,000+ per month on advertising. Personally, I go after the $10K+ per month advertisers now. Sure, it is a longer process to seal the deal, but then again, you are earning 4-5 figures per month from one client.

    In my experience, if you can stay focused, stick with one service to get your foot in the door, set aside your hopeium and concentrate on those prospects that get marketing and are spending money every month on advertising.

    You'll have a chance at success at being a local business consultant.

    Evie
    Evie, but the value of a client could be so great long term that is it often worth the initial investment of time/effort.

    2ndly, a good lead generation system in place can easily make all the difference.

    Barry
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  • Profile picture of the author rnsinformatic
    Yup, Evie.

    You must have source to deliver what you are offering. If you can't do it yourself, you better learn how because outsourcing is hit and miss at best.
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by rnsinformatic View Post

      Yup, Evie.

      You must have source to deliver what you are offering. If you can't do it yourself, you better learn how because outsourcing is hit and miss at best.
      We have moved 100% of our outsourcing in house.

      Even our telemarketers come to our offices now.

      We just couldn't risk our reputation on outsourcers.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Joe Motion
    It's actually quite refreshing to see someone come out and say this!

    You're average small business owner expects so much for so little!
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    Living in SE Asia.. BKK.. PM me for a beer!
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    • Profile picture of the author ATTENTION
      Originally Posted by Joe Motion View Post

      It's actually quite refreshing to see someone come out and say this!

      You're average small business owner expects so much for so little!

      Who doesn't?
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  • Profile picture of the author steveperch
    Beyond incredible thread. Thank you for starting and sharing all of your knowledge. I have two questions that I hope you can help with.

    1) How is it that you guarantee results? What exactly is your guarantee and how can you be certain you will hit your targets? If possible can you give a specific example.

    I ask because I would like to have the confidence to offer a guarantee too.

    2) You have gone further than any offline consultant I've ever come across. Kudos! But how did you stop doing what was wrong and begin doing what was right? You mention you found mentors and followed their lead. Can you describe how you found them and connected with them?

    Evie big thank you for this. I've read every one of your posts and have learned a lot.
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by steveperch View Post

      Beyond incredible thread. Thank you for starting and sharing all of your knowledge. I have two questions that I hope you can help with.

      1) How is it that you guarantee results? What exactly is your guarantee and how can you be certain you will hit your targets? If possible can you give a specific example.

      I ask because I would like to have the confidence to offer a guarantee too.

      2) You have gone further than any offline consultant I've ever come across. Kudos! But how did you stop doing what was wrong and begin doing what was right? You mention you found mentors and followed their lead. Can you describe how you found them and connected with them?

      Evie big thank you for this. I've read every one of your posts and have learned a lot.

      In regards to our online activities, ie. seo, sem, Google Places optimization, Bing, Yahoo!, social media and even our high ticket reputation management, our guarantee is that we will always do our best efforts.

      We do offer additional marketing efforts, ie, past customer reactivation campaigns, joint ventures, etc., etc.

      Anyone that follows Jay Abraham should be aware of the pillars, and you simply work each one with your clients and charge for each implementation.

      When we are engaged for example in these sort of campaigns, and we have done our research and homework, we KNOW in advanced what our numbers are likely to be and we will set a goal and guarantee we will hit that number or we will keep working until we do.

      It is very scientific, because we KNOW the numbers, and we do small test runs to assure we will hit our numbers.

      As for finding mentors, that was easy. As you speak with prospects, you will run into business owners that "have" someone and they are very happy with. You ask as many questions as possible, then reverse engineer and approach that person or company.

      I did have the luck to find someone I went to college with that has a local consulting business that likely will go public at some point.

      They are killing it using the old Kirby Vacuum, Cutco business model or building sales teams in every city they can.

      It is this model I am building my sales organization from and how we have 5 going on 6 offices in such a short time.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author WAWarrior
    hi Evie,

    thanks for sharing your experience. Focus on the 80/20 rule - getting the 20% client who provide the mainstream income - yes being selective of who you want to work with after you gain momentum..
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by WAWarrior View Post

      hi Evie,

      thanks for sharing your experience. Focus on the 80/20 rule - getting the 20% client who provide the mainstream income - yes being selective of who you want to work with after you gain momentum..
      Yes, exactly.

      And what blows me away is how many folks on this board, would be totally satisfied with one client paying them $3,500 per month.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author vijay gandhi
    good post Evie. very valuable advice.
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  • Profile picture of the author vijay gandhi
    good post Evie. thanks to share such valuable advice.
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    • Profile picture of the author dunkinbbb
      Evie:

      Just starting out - would love to pick your brain a bit :-)

      In a "getting started with a new client scenario" with the table top tents in a restaurant - how do you track results? Can it be done independently of the restaurant?

      100 people text/ opt in.

      You broadcast a text re: free dessert with dinner today (Tuesday) only if you show this text when ordering.

      Restaurant tracks results.

      Is there a way for the consultant to track results independent of the restaurant - or am I depending on the restaurant to do their own ROI analysis and inform me?


      Personally, I would like to be in the power position of doing the analysis and presenting the results.


      How can I accomplish this?
      And, in your opinion, am I right in wanting to proceed this way?

      Thanks so much,

      dunkinbbb
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      • Profile picture of the author Local
        Banned
        Originally Posted by dunkinbbb View Post

        Evie:

        Just starting out - would love to pick your brain a bit :-)

        In a "getting started with a new client scenario" with the table top tents in a restaurant - how do you track results? Can it be done independently of the restaurant?

        100 people text/ opt in.

        You broadcast a text re: free dessert with dinner today (Tuesday) only if you show this text when ordering.

        Restaurant tracks results.

        Is there a way for the consultant to track results independent of the restaurant - or am I depending on the restaurant to do their own ROI analysis and inform me?


        Personally, I would like to be in the power position of doing the analysis and presenting the results.


        How can I accomplish this?
        And, in your opinion, am I right in wanting to proceed this way?

        Thanks so much,

        dunkinbbb
        We are able to see the same tracking the client does and every time someone redeems an offer, the client scans or types in the offer code which also tells us who redeemed.

        Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Drakuul
    Originally Posted by Local View Post

    This very well may have been YOUR experience, but I'm sorry, I cannot let this kind of BS advice be spewed without calling the poster out on it.

    This post is not as "positive" as it may appear at first and in fact can cause more harm than good.

    I have been doing this a long, long time. How many prospects I have seen, I haven't a clue, but for over 6 months I went door to door, 16 hours a day to every business within a 2-3 mile radius of where I was parked.

    Today, our sales reps run approximately 400-600 appointments per day. We have a pretty good handle on what works and what isn't working.

    And in my begining days, I did offer my services for free, and it was a total waste of time. I came to the conclusion that most successful business professionals have. When you give something away for free, it is very difficult to justify its value in the future.

    And you certainly cannot charge a premium.

    ...go to a Costco and watch the grazers in action. Follow the folks that are going from free sample to free sample. Follow them to the checkout. 70% of the free sample crowd do not have even one of the free sample products in their cart, and most of those are not first time purchasers of that product. 99% do not have more than one.

    My assertion is even if gifting to 8, 9 and 10s you are taking a big chance.

    And from my experience, if you have not selected the perfect businesses, where there is an adequate number of searches, even if your videos were ranked 1 thru 10, that business owner is not going to see even ONE new customer walk in their business as a result of your videos.

    Sure, you can have a nice screen capture to show the next sucker, but what are you REALLY selling them? Smoke and mirrors is all it is, and that is not sustainable.

    It will not build you a real business and your days are numbered before business owners start talking and realize no one is benefiting from this relationship except you.

    Yes, I conducted business like you stated in the begining because I didn't know any better. It is what the gurus taught at the time, and some STILL ARE!

    And once I was invited to a round table by a couple of these gurus, I realized the folks they were basing their training on, were not being totally honest and forthright. A handful were flat out LYING.

    Almost everything I learned and was practicing was based on bogus nonsense. Providing FREE services was one of those ridiculous tactics.

    Now there is nothing wrong with writing a client up and agreeing that you will not get paid until the work is done, but make dang sure you do not have a freeloader on your hands.

    We subsribe to D&B and pull credit reports on clients before extending credit today.

    So, what was MY turning point?

    I met a few that were really doing it. Making it happen. these guys were earning 6+ figures per month. So, I spent week after week with them, in the field, in the trenches. And my mantra was if I didn't experience it myself, then it wasn't real.

    Harsh? Maybe, but I know what we are up against in regards to misinformation and total BS.

    And the title of this post, I stand behind 100%, if you are not working with 8, 9 and 10s, you are setting yourself you for certain failure. And MOST of the small business owners are 1-5s.

    That is unfortunate and I tried my best to help turn them into 10s but THAT was a nightmare!

    And hundreds of consultants have shared similar stories directly with me. Not just here on this forum, but at live seminars, SEO conferences, Social Media workshops, meetups for consultants, etc., etc.

    I even friended all of my competitors and learned what they were doing, including the high pressure sales the public corporations in this business use daily.

    I also subscribe to all of the lawsuits in our market area and using lexisnexis to follow trends and see what business owners are suing their seo/sem and local/marketing consultants for.

    That gives us a great idea of what business owners pain is and which services to avoid offering.

    Evie
    Wow, what an attitude. It's obvious that you believe only what you want to believe, and all others are beneath you. "Costco grazers" and "suckers", huh?
    Wow.
    And just because you can't do it, means it isn't real?
    Double wow.

    Did you ever think that if it didn't work for you in the beginning, maybe you were just doing it wrong? That is possible you know... that you could have changed your strategy up just a tad, rather than curse the concept.

    Everyone can see that Costco is a massive failure. What the hell are they thinking, giving away freebies?

    I was, and still am, giving away the razor blades, and selling the razors.

    Businesses know within a week if what I do is working for them. Some keep a list of new visitors, others just tell me, "we had 3-4 people show up last motht that said that they_____".... alway a cool feeling.

    You know nothing about what I do and how I do it, except for the brief overview I provided to underline the fact that I've met a few business owners and have not had the same negative, time wasting, blood sucking experience that you are having.

    Maybe they pick up on your condescending attitude, you think?

    So why all the hostility and judgement just because I share my experience? You don't know what I charge, what the terms are, where the videos are posted, how they are promoted, what goes along with them -- nothing. There is no contract, and businesses can cancel any time.

    Not like all the others wolves, but it works for me, and maybe it really does work for, at least, the gurus who I picked up most of it from.

    Even people who are really good at SEO in my city (one is a warrior on this forum) advertise on my _____ because they know it's a good thing and are impressed with what I have done... and it doesn't have a whole lot to do with Google, but it's effective.

    It's a combination of a few WSO's from Maria Gudelis, Christopher Griffith, John Durham, and Tim Castleman... plus one key thing that I picked up from a real estate investor named Terry Wygal down in Texas a few years ago.

    I've not seen anyone else doing this combination, and like you, I don't plan on sharing anytime soon.

    Whether you think I am a success, failure, or liar, is of no consequence to me. Again, my only intention was to defend the character of the small business owner just a bit from the verbal diahrea you are coughing up.

    Seriously, the whole thrust of your message seems to be that small business owners are idiots, newbies have no place in offline marketing, and that you are a goddess -- and what I posted somehow threatened your message... Did that sum it up?

    I'm sure that for every small business owner that spanked you, rejected you, or didn't find your abilities worthwhile, there's a big business owner who has felt the same way. Or are you closing 100%?

    Sorry, I just don't get your message. You share some great pointers, but I disagree with your intentions of "protecting" newbies" and the undeserving and nonparticipating business owner who doesn't give you the time of day. You give the impression that unless we ain't doing it the way your doing it, it's all wrong.

    And that just ain't right, mam.

    Everyone's got a gift, a unique perspective, and an opportunity to present it... but only if they want to. And anyone that wants it can buy it, with or without your training, permission, or blessings.
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    • Profile picture of the author dunkinbbb
      Evie>

      Another question if I may:

      You mention Jay Abraham.

      Way back when - pre-Internet :-) I did some of his courses.

      As I recall - one of the pillars - or at least principles - was risk reversal - take the risk of acting away from the customer - something the online world seems to have embraced.

      I interpret your suggestions/tactics as flying in the face of that?

      Thanks
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      • Profile picture of the author Local
        Banned
        Originally Posted by dunkinbbb View Post

        Evie>

        Another question if I may:

        You mention Jay Abraham.

        Way back when - pre-Internet :-) I did some of his courses.

        As I recall - one of the pillars - or at least principles - was risk reversal - take the risk of acting away from the customer - something the online world seems to have embraced.

        I interpret your suggestions/tactics as flying in the face of that?

        Thanks
        Oh no, you are right, we do incorporate risk reversal, I just don't discuss it here as it is a big reason we are able to close such a high percentage of our bigger clients.

        Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author Izesta
        Originally Posted by dunkinbbb View Post

        Evie>

        Another question if I may:

        You mention Jay Abraham.

        Way back when - pre-Internet :-) I did some of his courses.

        As I recall - one of the pillars - or at least principles - was risk reversal - take the risk of acting away from the customer - something the online world seems to have embraced.

        I interpret your suggestions/tactics as flying in the face of that?

        Thanks

        In fact, Jay Abraham is a master and true believer of giving away something of real value for free in the beginning stages of a client relationship. Many other successful marketers promote that also.
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Izesta View Post

          In fact, Jay Abraham is a master and true believer of giving away something of real value for free in the beginning stages of a client relationship. Many other successful marketers promote that also.
          This is going to cause some real controversy, but I believe Jay Abraham is struggling. If you are on his mailing list, you can see it.

          "I'm quitting the small entrepreneur and only working with big companies" and then in the next breath he is abandoning large business stating "I'm for the little guy, the small business owner" and on and on.

          And yes, he is giving the farm away. His life's work in a desperate attempt to gain some sort of market share again.

          Where are the $25,000 masterminds and the multiple $5,000 and $10,000 programs?

          And watching the JVs Spike made with every scam artist online was painful.

          My husband and I were even approached at a networking event a few years ago by Spike Hummer, Jay's operational manager, and that conversation was enlightening.

          Make no doubt about it, Jay is struggling.

          And when the master is having a tough time, God help us all.

          The Internet and social media has changed the game people.

          And if these stubborn, pig headed small business owners (and I am not being mean, it is fact) don't get that, and change the way they do business, they won't have a business to 'do".

          Evie
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          • Profile picture of the author dunkinbbb
            Controversy is good. It gets attention. (Is that a Jay Abraham quote :-) LOL)

            I'm not nearly as far under the tent as you, but it seems to me that lots of the most successful online IMers - Frank Kern, Rich Shrefron, etc have taken the offline small business wisdom of Jay Abraham, Mike Gerber, et.al. brought it online and made millions, at least for themselves.

            There are very few original thinkers out there.

            Who do you look to for fresh ideas, to emulate, to learn from and bring their thinking into your and your clients' business?

            Thanks,

            dunkinbbb

            ps - catch anything yet? :-)
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            • Profile picture of the author Local
              Banned
              Originally Posted by dunkinbbb View Post

              Controversy is good. It gets attention. (Is that a Jay Abraham quote :-) LOL)

              I'm not nearly as far under the tent as you, but it seems to me that lots of the most successful online IMers - Frank Kern, Rich Shrefron, etc have taken the offline small business wisdom of Jay Abraham, Mike Gerber, et.al. brought it online and made millions, at least for themselves.

              There are very few original thinkers out there.

              Who do you look to for fresh ideas, to emulate, to learn from and bring their thinking into your and your clients' business?

              Thanks,

              dunkinbbb

              ps - catch anything yet? :-)
              Yes, they have.

              Can't argue with the age old marketing principals.

              But it is the adapting and changing of the tactics and strategies that needs to morph.

              Even the stuff rank Kern, Rich Shrefron, etc. have used in the past is no longer working or as effective.

              Change, change, change.

              But before you can change, you better be testing, testing, testing.

              And our Skipper is getting ready to pull out in the next 15 minutes.

              I am eating breakfast overlooking the most beautiful scene.

              Eagles are below having their own breakfast and about 10 Orka's were playing.

              Talk about God's land.

              Someone caught a 364 pound Halibut yesterday, we looked at the photos this morning.

              We will be back about 4:00 pm.

              July is the PERFECT fishing season here, with all varieties of Salmon.

              We usually catch them as quickly as we can reel them in.

              Whoa!

              Evie
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          • Profile picture of the author Izesta
            Originally Posted by Local View Post

            This is going to cause some real controversy, but I believe Jay Abraham is struggling. If you are on his mailing list, you can see it.

            "I'm quitting the small entrepreneur and only working with big companies" and then in the next breath he is abandoning large business stating "I'm for the little guy, the small business owner" and on and on.

            And yes, he is giving the farm away. His life's work in a desperate attempt to gain some sort of market share again.

            Where are the $25,000 masterminds and the multiple $5,000 and $10,000 programs?

            And watching the JVs Spike made with every scam artist online was painful.

            My husband and I were even approached at a networking event a few years ago by Spike Hummer, Jay's operational manager, and that conversation was enlightening.

            Make no doubt about it, Jay is struggling.

            And when the master is having a tough time, God help us all.

            The Internet and social media has changed the game people.

            And if these stubborn, pig headed small business owners (and I am not being mean, it is fact) don't get that, and change the way they do business, they won't have a business to 'do".

            Evie

            It would not surprise me to hear Jay is suffering. I have some great marketing stuff by him but he always seemed a bit too hyped on himself and his prices have been off the charts since I first uncovered him over 20 years ago.
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Drakuul View Post

      Wow, what an attitude. It's obvious that you believe only what you want to believe, and all others are beneath you. "Costco grazers" and "suckers", huh?
      Wow.
      And just because you can't do it, means it isn't real?
      Double wow.

      Did you ever think that if it didn't work for you in the beginning, maybe you were just doing it wrong? That is possible you know... that you could have changed your strategy up just a tad, rather than curse the concept.

      Everyone can see that Costco is a massive failure. What the hell are they thinking, giving away freebies?

      I was, and still am, giving away the razor blades, and selling the razors.

      Businesses know within a week if what I do is working for them. Some keep a list of new visitors, others just tell me, "we had 3-4 people show up last motht that said that they_____".... alway a cool feeling.

      You know nothing about what I do and how I do it, except for the brief overview I provided to underline the fact that I've met a few business owners and have not had the same negative, time wasting, blood sucking experience that you are having.

      Maybe they pick up on your condescending attitude, you think?

      So why all the hostility and judgement just because I share my experience? You don't know what I charge, what the terms are, where the videos are posted, how they are promoted, what goes along with them -- nothing. There is no contract, and businesses can cancel any time.

      Not like all the others wolves, but it works for me, and maybe it really does work for, at least, the gurus who I picked up most of it from.

      Even people who are really good at SEO in my city (one is a warrior on this forum) advertise on my _____ because they know it's a good thing and are impressed with what I have done... and it doesn't have a whole lot to do with Google, but it's effective.

      It's a combination of a few WSO's from Maria Gudelis, Christopher Griffith, John Durham, and Tim Castleman... plus one key thing that I picked up from a real estate investor named Terry Wygal down in Texas a few years ago.

      I've not seen anyone else doing this combination, and like you, I don't plan on sharing anytime soon.

      Whether you think I am a success, failure, or liar, is of no consequence to me. Again, my only intention was to defend the character of the small business owner just a bit from the verbal diahrea you are coughing up.

      Seriously, the whole thrust of your message seems to be that small business owners are idiots, newbies have no place in offline marketing, and that you are a goddess -- and what I posted somehow threatened your message... Did that sum it up?

      I'm sure that for every small business owner that spanked you, rejected you, or didn't find your abilities worthwhile, there's a big business owner who has felt the same way. Or are you closing 100%?

      Sorry, I just don't get your message. You share some great pointers, but I disagree with your intentions of "protecting" newbies" and the undeserving and nonparticipating business owner who doesn't give you the time of day. You give the impression that unless we ain't doing it the way your doing it, it's all wrong.

      And that just ain't right, mam.

      Everyone's got a gift, a unique perspective, and an opportunity to present it... but only if they want to. And anyone that wants it can buy it, with or without your training, permission, or blessings.
      Your post just shows your ignorance.

      And like most posers, you take a statement and turn it around to say something else.

      What an attitude? You're right there, I'm pissed that people like you talk #@%$ and suck in not only those on this board that don't know any better, but if you are even doing what you are saying, then you are also screwing your clients, because what you are preaching is nonsense. It is medicine water.

      Believe what I want to believe? I believe the facts. And over the past two years, I have collected over 900 GB of data. My masters may have been in nursing, but my BS was in business with an emphasis in psychology and statistics. I know, lame, but it what has always interested me.

      The term "grazers" is what COSTO employees, executives and the sample workers call them. NOT ME! And I never inferred that Costco was failing, but many of the companies that are FORCED to do the sample circus complain that it does not increase sales as much as one would think. And as with anything in life, there ARE exceptions. My statement regarding free samples at Costco was NOT a generalization. I have 14 clients that have gotten products into Costco and there is a firm that provides the data.

      The Samples are something Costco benefits from greatly and it is written into your contract.

      Now, do NOT confuse sample circus with road shows. Road Shows can be very profitable.

      The term "suckers" is how certain consultants seem to feel the business owners they are pitching too. And in my opinion, selling a business owners on creating videos, even if you have 3-5 positions on page one, unless those videos are referring new business, that should be disclosed or else you ARE taking advantage of them and treating them like suckers.

      In the beginning, all I had were the "gurus" to learn from. They promised a system that unfortunately was BS. Look at the town I live in? La Jolla. I think we have our fill of "gurus" here.

      I even participated in helping certain gurus to learn what was working in the field and what wasn't but the truth would not sell courses.

      That is when I parted company and went solo, eventually hooking up with folks that were really doing it and could duplicate it.

      IT ISN'T A SYSTEM IF IT CANNOT BE DUPLICATED AND REPLICATED.

      I am not questioning you have limited success in a microcosm of your area. You are right, I don't have the facts.

      Your system works for YOU, but I doubt it can be taught and will work for others.

      Especially when for the past two years you have lived it and employ a ton of people doing it everyday.

      Personally, I can walk out of any business having made a friend and my closing average is over 85%, however, it is NOT replicatable.

      I cannot teach others to be me.

      But what we have now works.

      Our telemarketers average 10-15 appointments in a 6 hour shift.

      Our sales reps close 1:3.

      Our client satisfaction rate is 84% (and yes we are always working towards 100%)

      We are opening our 6th office now.

      We must be doing something right.

      My point in all of this is what you are SPEWING is NOT duplicatable no matter how you try to sugar coat is or spin it.

      If I though it were, I'd be on a plane there in a New York minute.

      Understand this, the failures we experienced in the past had nothing to do with the business owner, per se. It was OUR fault for talking with them in the first place.

      The majority of the business owners out there, do NOT spend money on advertising, yet these offline gurus show up, thinking they REALLY have a chance when they don't without a ton of work to first convince them they need to invest money in advertising, and then in Internet marketing.

      My post was to try to convey the fact that you will fare a whole lot better if you target business owners that are already spending money on advertising.

      Preaching to the choir.

      The 8, 9 and 10s.

      The struggling business owner is where 9:10 new consultants end up talking to and that is where the frustration comes in.

      If they do hire you, it is a hail mary pass.

      That is a ton of pressure for you and the business owner.

      In closing, your other points, just prove that you have had limited experience out in the field or you'd be in agreement.

      And anytime you want to come to LaJolla, I'll be happy for you to prove me wrong, but IN THE FIELD.

      Wishing you well.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Local
    Banned
    My hubby and I are vacationing in Ketchikan, AK for some major fishing and we will be doing a couple of fly-ins (or more accurately, float-ins) so I may be out of communication.

    I am usually too busy to spend any time here, so I spend down time while vacationing to stay in contact.

    Any one that knows me, knows I go pretty much 24/7 and joke that I'll sleep when I'm dead.

    In closing, for someone that really wants to blow their business up, I would learn how to set appointments via telemarketing and then hire someone to set 3-5 appointments a day for me.

    Selling one and only one simple, foot in the door service, priced around $1,000.

    Stick to ONE service and generate leads for prospects for that one service.

    I would recommend Google Places Optimization, and managing their reviews, photos and videos. Once you get your foot in the door and they are happy, you can now make an offer for additional services.

    Some will, some won't next.

    Then begin adding additional sales reps and telemarketers.

    But the sales reps only sell the front end.

    Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author sloanjim
    well it's like i said a few months ago it's all very well getting some of these local "mom and pop shops" top of Google but if they are getting next to no leads/sales/contacts from it it's been a win/loss relationship. I got shot down! Top of Google means nothing. Return on investment and a positive one at that is what it is all about.

    What about the post while back where some huckster sold a $5,000+ SEO program to a sweet shop? there was no vlaue in that at all.

    So yes i agree 100%. it has to be win/win and it's much beter to go after big business with a large ad costs that can actually turn a profit from our online efforts?
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  • Profile picture of the author maricelu
    I plan to offer some things for the client like: Google Places, Social media, Mobile website, SEO (on-page, off-page), Pop-ups, blog, video, testimonials, etc. Of course, I will choose ONLY the things they will REALLY need for their website. For example, a plumber might not need a Social media campaign, instead of having a mobile-friendly website to guarantee the accesibility to the user. I bought recently a mindmap with all the things a Marketing Consultant might have to offer and by now I only choose the easiest of these approaches.

    My question:
    Let's say I approach a client and I get him to meet w/ me. How to get the services I plan to have for their website in a way that not to say a word about SEO. Should I build packages maybe? I have read some FAQ's on some things like SEO, "will you give me page one?" etc. but I need to get it to him in a proper way.
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    • Profile picture of the author dunkinbbb
      Evie's gone fishing :-)

      So, if I may, even though I know you question was not directed to me, here is my two cents :-)

      I would do a mind map with your client to uncover what he really wants - even things he hasn't thought about.

      I'm going to say that no plumber wants a website, Google places nor SEO services.

      What they ultimate want is more profits. And when you question that - what they really really want is more profits with the same time/energy invested.

      And reverse engineer from there. And to help your/his thinking do it in a flow chart/ process map approach - could be hand drawn, I think.

      In order to get more profits what do they need - more business from new customers, more business from existing customers. We won't address the other side of the ledger here (cost reduction) except as it applies to your recommended actions.

      Now lets look at each.

      More business from new customers:

      Yes , he wants new business - but what he really wants is profitable new business - or new business that has a high probability of leading to profitable business. Otherwise - he could just lower his prices and get more business.

      So that comes down to identifying the niches he is willing/able to compete within. Emergency service, new kitchens and bathrooms, remodels, sub contracting, etc. He knows those if you pull it out of him.

      And then it comes down to how to let those people who are in "take action mode" find your plumber. Now that is someplace your SEO skills can add value - long tail buying keywords - just as many people teach here at WF for online marketing. I would check out google keywords tool - for buying keywords that he can easily rank for. And Google places, etc.

      Then once you are attracting the right kind of traffic, the issue of conversion comes up. Video testimonials, offers, easy to do business with, etc.

      I would guess a couple of additional sales a month would provide a healthy return for your plumber on his investment in your services

      And then, outside the domain of a SEO, website developer - but dead on for a marketing consultant committed to bringing him his original goal - more profits - is the whole category of the lifetime value of a customer, upsells, referrals, etc. This is something where just about any IM person has an advantage over most local business owners, because, as mentioned earlier, ideas spread quickly (people steal them LOL) over the internet so best marketing practices are readily available. And you can add value by translating them and making them accessible and applying them to your plumbers business.

      And, I daresay, a marketing consultant who can help generate additional profits is much more valuable that someone who comes in and says " I can get you a page one ranking on Google.")

      And, maybe, in there somewhere, is your "Unique Selling Proposition" or your elevator pitch for getting more new clients.

      You get the idea, I'm sure. And do the same with existing customers of his,

      Anyway, that's my - more than two cents worth - and now we await Evie's return.

      best,

      dunkinbbb
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      • Profile picture of the author maricelu
        Originally Posted by dunkinbbb View Post

        Evie's gone fishing :-)

        So, if I may, even though I know you question was not directed to me, here is my two cents :-)

        I would do a mind map with your client to uncover what he really wants - even things he hasn't thought about.

        I'm going to say that no plumber wants a website, Google places nor SEO services.

        What they ultimate want is more profits. And when you question that - what they really really want is more profits with the same time/energy invested.

        And reverse engineer from there. And to help your/his thinking do it in a flow chart/ process map approach - could be hand drawn, I think.

        In order to get more profits what do they need - more business from new customers, more business from existing customers. We won't address the other side of the ledger here (cost reduction) except as it applies to your recommended actions.

        Now lets look at each.

        More business from new customers:

        Yes , he wants new business - but what he really wants is profitable new business - or new business that has a high probability of leading to profitable business. Otherwise - he could just lower his prices and get more business.

        So that comes down to identifying the niches he is willing/able to compete within. Emergency service, new kitchens and bathrooms, remodels, sub contracting, etc. He knows those if you pull it out of him.

        And then it comes down to how to let those people who are in "take action mode" find your plumber. Now that is someplace your SEO skills can add value - long tail buying keywords - just as many people teach here at WF for online marketing. I would check out google keywords tool - for buying keywords that he can easily rank for. And Google places, etc.

        Then once you are attracting the right kind of traffic, the issue of conversion comes up. Video testimonials, offers, easy to do business with, etc.

        I would guess a couple of additional sales a month would provide a healthy return for your plumber on his investment in your services

        And then, outside the domain of a SEO, website developer - but dead on for a marketing consultant committed to bringing him his original goal - more profits - is the whole category of the lifetime value of a customer, upsells, referrals, etc. This is something where just about any IM person has an advantage over most local business owners, because, as mentioned earlier, ideas spread quickly (people steal them LOL) over the internet so best marketing practices are readily available. And you can add value by translating them and making them accessible and applying them to your plumbers business.

        And, I daresay, a marketing consultant who can help generate additional profits is much more valuable that someone who comes in and says " I can get you a page one ranking on Google.")

        And, maybe, in there somewhere, is your "Unique Selling Proposition" or your elevator pitch for getting more new clients.

        You get the idea, I'm sure. And do the same with existing customers of his,

        Anyway, that's my - more than two cents worth - and now we await Evie's return.

        best,

        dunkinbbb
        Thanks dunking!

        Here comes another question - how to get this new marketing approach to the clients( finding what really fits to them) and make them BUY? It is very important for me to get the "relation-building" and "selling" parts as I don't do the offline part actually. what tips you have, or maybe someone else have, for this part. I saw here on the forum a lot of approaches but don't know if these really fits the strategy covered in this thread.

        p.s plumber was just an example, but thanks for covering it in details, may use your post.
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        • Profile picture of the author dunkinbbb
          People buy from people. Especially offline, but even online.

          Just like in architecture , you can only build as high as the foundation is broad.

          Depending upon what you are selling your "plumber" the relationship needs to be in place first.

          And that is really not as hard as it sounds.

          As human beings, we are all related and very very similar, just that it is a function of the mind to notice what is different

          Look at a white wall, and one immediately notice the small black speck. An alien landing on Earth for the first time would be struck by how alike we humans all look.

          You get the idea,

          And that applies to people's want needs, dreams, etc., So that is where you come from - you and he/she are already related - and then just discover how. Sort of like meeting someone who it has been told to you is a long lost relative for the first time.

          Come from being related - and you will notice the similarities - not the differences.. And your prospect will feel the difference.

          I look at sales as a discovery process.

          Discuss his wants/needs/situation and see if you can truly provide a solution that adds value above and beyond what you charge.

          The conversation should be guided by what is best for his business and whether or not you can provide that, not what you can offer.

          After a while, it will be clear - to both of you - what the appropriate path of action is.

          And then there will be no selling - just moving to the next logical step.

          And I know that a lot of attention gets paid to close rates, etc, but the truth is that the close rate gets determined mostly by the homework/preparation done before the meeting, not during the meeting.

          Like the results of a football (American football :-) gets created during the week at practice - and even off season - not so much on the field during the game - even though execution is important - it will only bring you so far.

          Anyway - back to the meeting.

          So you have established the relatedness gently but clearly.

          You have identified the possibilities - defined by his wants and needs.

          Now identify - jointly - whether it makes sense to proceed to taking action.

          I think that would be a good mindset to have during the meeting.

          Way back when, I sold big systems to phone companies/ banks in the US, and had some success.

          I attribute a lot of the success to having a great product that was a great solution to one segment of the market, and then, during the conversation - gently but firmly qualifying the prospect - more than selling him - to make sure it was a legitimate fit, and being willing to walk away if it wasn't.

          That is also key - I know we all want that sale, that success - but , trust me, the best results are correlated with non-attachment to the result in the moment,

          Desire can drive you to practice your tennis serve 1 hour a day for months, but when you are serving at match point, the best performance will come if you allow the process to unfold, rather than efforting.

          Hope this is useful


          best

          dunkinbbb
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          • Profile picture of the author maricelu
            Originally Posted by dunkinbbb View Post

            People buy from people. Especially offline, but even online.

            Just like in architecture , you can only build as high as the foundation is broad.

            Depending upon what you are selling your "plumber" the relationship needs to be in place first.

            And that is really not as hard as it sounds.

            As human beings, we are all related and very very similar, just that it is a function of the mind to notice what is different

            Look at a white wall, and one immediately notice the small black speck. An alien landing on Earth for the first time would be struck by how alike we humans all look.

            You get the idea,

            And that applies to people's want needs, dreams, etc., So that is where you come from - you and he/she are already related - and then just discover how. Sort of like meeting someone who it has been told to you is a long lost relative for the first time.

            Come from being related - and you will notice the similarities - not the differences.. And your prospect will feel the difference.

            I look at sales as a discovery process.

            Discuss his wants/needs/situation and see if you can truly provide a solution that adds value above and beyond what you charge.

            The conversation should be guided by what is best for his business and whether or not you can provide that, not what you can offer.

            After a while, it will be clear - to both of you - what the appropriate path of action is.

            And then there will be no selling - just moving to the next logical step.

            And I know that a lot of attention gets paid to close rates, etc, but the truth is that the close rate gets determined mostly by the homework/preparation done before the meeting, not during the meeting.

            Like the results of a football (American football :-) gets created during the week at practice - and even off season - not so much on the field during the game - even though execution is important - it will only bring you so far.

            Anyway - back to the meeting.

            So you have established the relatedness gently but clearly.

            You have identified the possibilities - defined by his wants and needs.

            Now identify - jointly - whether it makes sense to proceed to taking action.

            I think that would be a good mindset to have during the meeting.

            Way back when, I sold big systems to phone companies/ banks in the US, and had some success.

            I attribute a lot of the success to having a great product that was a great solution to one segment of the market, and then, during the conversation - gently but firmly qualifying the prospect - more than selling him - to make sure it was a legitimate fit, and being willing to walk away if it wasn't.

            That is also key - I know we all want that sale, that success - but , trust me, the best results are correlated with non-attachment to the result in the moment,

            Desire can drive you to practice your tennis serve 1 hour a day for months, but when you are serving at match point, the best performance will come if you allow the process to unfold, rather than efforting.

            Hope this is useful


            best

            dunkinbbb
            Really useful,

            It's a joy for me to read long posts like this one. I see what you are talking about, and it even doesn't relies only on "ranking high-searchable keywords", so I could easily apply here in my country. It's a brad-new B2B model, I LIKE IT!
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            • Profile picture of the author dunkinbbb
              One more thing -

              In terms of the conversation:

              imagine two scenarios

              1) you are meeting with a friend who has just joined this new health club and is sharing his enthusiasm with you.

              2) you are meeting with a friend who is has just joined this new health club and is sharing his enthusiasm with you - and he gets a $100 rebate if you join, and he is not upfront about it.

              While acknowledging that you are meeting with the "plumber" in a sales environment - the closer you can get to model 1 - while being open and honest - the more successful you will be,

              He is a businessman - he knows you are one ,too. People do not have a problem with other people making a profit, nor having an agenda /purpose for the meeting. As a matter of fact, if you and I are meeting, I want to know the purpose/agenda.

              They have a problem with hidden agendas.
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              • Profile picture of the author dunkinbbb
                Now let me tell you about this little $97 on line sales training I'm offering.

                Notice how that just changed everything>

                Everything.

                Including all the stuff we previously discussed, is now tainted.

                Like pissing in the pool.

                You re-interpret the past based upon what just happened in the present.

                And very hard to clean up afterwards - Have to drain the pool :-)..

                And, no there is no course, yet . . . :-)
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                • Profile picture of the author kmalikis
                  I have greatly enjoyed this whole thread.. all the controversy alongside the nuggets of information Evie provided.

                  Your last comment was incredibly witty and insightful. You just proved your vast worldly business experience and in a very humble and low key manner.

                  Kamran



                  Originally Posted by dunkinbbb View Post

                  Now let me tell you about this little $97 on line sales training I'm offering.

                  Notice how that just changed everything>

                  Everything.

                  Including all the stuff we previously discussed, is now tainted.

                  Like pissing in the pool.

                  You re-interpret the past based upon what just happened in the present.

                  And very hard to clean up afterwards - Have to drain the pool :-)..




                  And, no there is no course, yet . . . :-)
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          • Profile picture of the author BradB
            My family and I completed our vacation up in Nootka sound and enjoyed the same scene.

            Didn't see much in the way of monster Halibut,..(though way ate our fair share),....but who needs halibut when the Springs are averaging 32 lbs...

            This is an excellent post thanks for starting it and sticking around after.
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            • Profile picture of the author Local
              Banned
              Originally Posted by BradB View Post

              My family and I completed our vacation up in Nootka sound and enjoyed the same scene.

              Didn't see much in the way of monster Halibut,..(though way ate our fair share),....but who needs halibut when the Springs are averaging 32 lbs...

              This is an excellent post thanks for starting it and sticking around after.
              The large ones aren't as good eating anyway!

              20-30 pounds are the best.

              :-)

              The 150+++ pound are the geriatric Halibut and hang out in senior housing areas.

              Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Gary Zaydman
    My experience has been that most important part of getting offline clients is to take away the risk.

    Most offline consultants go with contracts: example: 6-months, 1 year etc.
    They try to get everything they can out of one interaction.

    So for example if a business owner is paying $1000 per month. Instead of viewing the transaction as 1k per month they view as 6k contractual commitment.
    The way I do it is just to do it month-to-month. The reason is that if your good (which you should be) then you can get them results in the 1st month or two and they will see that it works and then they will stick around.
    It's much more natural that way and much easier to get started.
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    Best pressure-less sales method to get local small business clients to try your services www.reputationrebelsystem.com

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    • Profile picture of the author Izesta
      Originally Posted by Gary Zaydman View Post

      My experience has been that most important part of getting offline clients is to take away the risk.

      Most offline consultants go with contracts: example: 6-months, 1 year etc.
      They try to get everything they can out of one interaction.

      So for example if a business owner is paying $1000 per month. Instead of viewing the transaction as 1k per month they view as 6k contractual commitment.
      The way I do it is just to do it month-to-month. The reason is that if your good (which you should be) then you can get them results in the 1st month or two and they will see that it works and then they will stick around.
      It's much more natural that way and much easier to get started.

      Sometimes it is difficult to show results in 30 days, so that could create a whammy. For my own business, I have used a multitude of marketing tactics that took much longer than 30 days to show value/profit. I agree with your theory, but will often be difficult to practice - that I've found at least.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dan B Rusu
    What reputation management software are you using if any?
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Daniel7rusu View Post

      What reputation management software are you using if any?
      We don't use any reputation management software and I'd be really suspect of any such beast as I have said before, each client must be treated differently.

      No broad bush here.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author D. Spidey
    Great stuff Evie! Thanks for sharing your ideas and thoughts about local business marketing.
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  • Profile picture of the author maricelu
    will a Marketing faculty help developing my marketing consultant career in the future?
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  • Profile picture of the author CaliChristian
    Yeah it makes a big difference if you know what their advertising budget is already currently...

    I have super ninja ways of finding peoples ad spend, and once I have that list of the niche I want to target I start calling on them.
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    Christian Credit Counselors is a non-profit organization that has been credit counseling for 20 years and our credit counselors have helped over 200,000 individuals and families get out of debt in less than 4 years.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dan B Rusu
    I want to hire a telemarketer for full time coldcalling like you mentioned to set appointments for us. From your experience, what are the industries that coldcalling has worked best for and are most hungry for online marketing? I'd like to have the telemarketer, especially at the beginning, target the industries we'll have the most success with.

    I've gotten great response from Real estate agencies as they're seeing so many of their leads coming from the internet these days.

    As a side note, when's the next time you're doing an "open house?" Me and my business partner would love to come visit and share ideas. As of now, we've most been doing network marketing for our consulting service, but want to get into telemarketing as well.
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Daniel7rusu View Post

      I want to hire a telemarketer for full time coldcalling like you mentioned to set appointments for us. From your experience, what are the industries that coldcalling has worked best for and are most hungry for online marketing? I'd like to have the telemarketer, especially at the beginning, target the industries we'll have the most success with.

      I've gotten great response from Real estate agencies as they're seeing so many of their leads coming from the internet these days.

      As a side note, when's the next time you're doing an "open house?" Me and my business partner would love to come visit and share ideas. As of now, we've most been doing network marketing for our consulting service, but want to get into telemarketing as well.
      Hi Daniel,

      Here is the catch 22, the higher dollar, preferred clients do not do as well with our main sales process, ie., telemarketers, sales reps

      So we are working the numbers game.

      Each TM contacts hundreds of businesses each shift, so we must basically go after every industry we can.

      Now, I will say that the service industries that have a higher profit margin are no brainers but you have to catch them at just the right time.

      For MOST single person offline consulting businesses, you really will do better going after the big advertisers that are business owner driven.

      The type of business where the decision maker is the owner still, yet they are buying advertising each month and spending big bucks.

      Then, create a video of you analyzing their business, their competition and make recommendations. This is your turn to shine. Keep it under 10-12 minutes but BLOW THEM AWAY.

      Then print a screen capture of either their website or a photo of their business on the CD containing the video and drop it off.

      Do this for 10 businesses and you will get some appointments, as long as you are delivering in the videos.

      Currently I am only booking 2-3 day visits for The Telemarketing Forum members that I feel are contributing to others. I do require an NDA on what can and cannot be borrowed.

      :-)

      Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author Dan B Rusu
        Originally Posted by Local View Post

        Hi Daniel,

        Here is the catch 22, the higher dollar, preferred clients do not do as well with our main sales process, ie., telemarketers, sales reps

        So we are working the numbers game.

        Each TM contacts hundreds of businesses each shift, so we must basically go after every industry we can.

        Now, I will say that the service industries that have a higher profit margin are no brainers but you have to catch them at just the right time.

        For MOST single person offline consulting businesses, you really will do better going after the big advertisers that are business owner driven.

        The type of business where the decision maker is the owner still, yet they are buying advertising each month and spending big bucks.

        Then, create a video of you analyzing their business, their competition and make recommendations. This is your turn to shine. Keep it under 10-12 minutes but BLOW THEM AWAY.

        Then print a screen capture of either their website or a photo of their business on the CD containing the video and drop it off.

        Do this for 10 businesses and you will get some appointments, as long as you are delivering in the videos.

        Currently I am only booking 2-3 day visits for The Telemarketing Forum members that I feel are contributing to others. I do require an NDA on what can and cannot be borrowed.

        :-)

        Evie
        Thanks for the reply Evie,

        That's a great suggestion, using video to impress and land meetings with high paying clients. Definitely will do more research into that method.

        I wrote earlier that I'm most interested in the high paying clients, and see what you mean when you say reaching them through a traditional sales process does not work that great. However, I'm also interested and in the process of building a sales team that will follow a similar process flow that you're using:

        Telemarketers -> Set meetings for sales reps -> Meet for free consulting and sell "foot in the door" product -> upsell further services.

        The highest profit margin businesses the way I see it are often times medical and professional practices: dentists, lawyers, chiropractors, ect. If these are the industries we put our telemarketers on, how do they get past the gatekeepers?

        I'm actually a member on TTMF, just much more active here then I am over there. I will start being more active and supportive there if that'll get me a visit to your firm to network and learn more

        Thanks for the time you're taking to help us Warriors on here, the karma will come back to you
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  • Well said its not all gold what shines great job
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  • Profile picture of the author Local
    Banned
    I am back in California!

    I gave a presentation for 80 some attorneys today.

    OMG!

    I don't know how many times I heard "you are exactly what I need!"...

    And about 1/3rd still didn't have a website or they had one that they let expire.

    What the heck?!?!

    Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author peewhy
    Just this morning I received an email from a prospective client basically saying "if you are better than the other marketing idiots out there, call me"

    So I did. After he told me that he is suing three previous marketing people and was about to create a website to expose them, I took the decision to let him continue his quest for another victim!
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  • Profile picture of the author ryanjm
    ^^Does not surprise me. I had a website ranking #2 for "bankruptcy lawyers in city" and getting searches every day. I could not GIVE IT AWAY for a lawyer to try for free for a month. A small percentage get it and are making bank. The rest are clueless with online marketing.
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Lavoie
      ^^ I like the idea of taking a website up the ranks and then renting the spot to a related local business... This way you get numbers before taking action. You have something to show the owner. I figure if you get at least 10 hits per day it cant hurt and this could be a good start with any business. I give myself a year to try, learn and create new techniques.

      For example ,I have a friend who rent dump containers. Lets say for each contaiener the average cost is 500$ and he makes a net profit of 100$ each. I see searches on google for "rent container" and "container city" at around 600 per month (combined) in our area. Getting lets say 10 more sales each months (which is quite conervative if you understand that people typing these words are mostly looking to rent a container, not doing a school prject), I could probably seal the deal for many more months and I could also add some other services like facebook fanpage, google place, online videos, PR Codes, new business cards etc... Does any of this make sense? I know this is not the 1000$+/mnth contract, but I see this as an experiment as I need to learn the basics and master them before aiming for the big fishes

      BTW I am one of the big fishes right now. I have a business ( 2.5mil$+ contracts each year) and I can say I probably spend 60'000$ each year in marketing. Problem is I simply dont have the time to do any of this marketing on my own other than those golf games and cocktails I really hate to go to. I found out about IM and Offline marketing a couple months ago and I thought I could easily get great results in this kind of business because I know my skills. I know I can make more money and alot faster then what I make right now even though I make 6 figures. This is totally a new challenge for me and im pretty excited about it and I feel I need a change. Im not getting challenged anymore.

      Obviously if I want to perform, I will need to let go my current business, however before I ever do this, I will need to get a rock solid foundation and I really think that its better to aim for small clients at the beginning so you can gauge what work and what doesnt...You dont make much money but at least you hit the walls while you're going at low speed... I think alot of people HAVE to hit the walls to understand WHY they have to jump over it. I have had employees who never understood why we wanted some things done in a particular kind of way. They learned alot faster when making the mistakes first. :rolleyes:

      Anyways, thanks alot for this great thread and excuse my english, im french.
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      • Profile picture of the author Summertime Dress
        Evie,

        I have enjoyed reading your posts, but the analytical side of my brain is getting the best of me...

        You say you have been doing this a long, long time...yet you also say you are 19 months into your own business on the recommendation of a friend who taught you how he/she was making money in offline consulting.

        You also say you work 10-11 days as a nurse anesthetist...while also managing 100s of sales reps with offices in multiple cities?

        And then the final comment how you barely have time to give to forums such as this yet you're consistently logged in over a couple days?

        Don't mean any disrespect. You've given away some helpful information, and perhaps I'm reading these comments out of context.

        Thanks.
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        • Profile picture of the author Local
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Summertime Dress View Post

          Evie,

          I have enjoyed reading your posts, but the analytical side of my brain is getting the best of me...

          You say you have been doing this a long, long time...yet you also say you are 19 months into your own business on the recommendation of a friend who taught you how he/she was making money in offline consulting.

          You also say you work 10-11 days as a nurse anesthetist...while also managing 100s of sales reps with offices in multiple cities?

          And then the final comment how you barely have time to give to forums such as this yet you're consistently logged in over a couple days?

          Don't mean any disrespect. You've given away some helpful information, and perhaps I'm reading these comments out of context.

          Thanks.
          I have been living, breathing and working this for almost 2 years now and that IS a long time to be doing this, anyone that has been in the trenches will agree.

          I was introduced to local marketing 3 years ago, however, it took me a year to really begin a full time business of it.

          Each of my offices now has an office manager and each team or reps has a sales manager. The telemarketers also have their own manager.

          That doesn't mean I don't do a darn thing, but I work ON my business not IN my business.

          My husband and I have taken off almost the entire summer to enjoy the fruits of our labors and we have been travel.

          I'm sorry if I offend you by spending some of MY vacation time on this board, but I have been helping some people along the way and they keep pointing out how they were mislead on the boards. I enjoy the distraction I suppose and it keeps me talking about something I love.

          I'll be in Italy next week, I'm sure the business owners there will grow tired of me and all my questions and comments too.

          Also, since I use gotomypc, and my PCs back in La Jolla, I may appear online when my PC is doing all the lurking. ;-)

          But don't worry, come September I will be back to working at the hospital and building even more offices, so you won't have to put up with me and my nonsense much longer.

          LOL

          Evie

          P.S. Analytical people SUCK! Just don't tell my husband ;-)
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          • Profile picture of the author Summertime Dress
            Well, so do narcissists. Just don't tell my ex husband
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            • Profile picture of the author Local
              Banned
              Originally Posted by Summertime Dress View Post

              Well, so do narcissists. Just don't tell my ex husband
              Do you KNOW what a nurse anesthetist is, what we do, and who we work with?

              You have no idea what a narcissists is until you've spent some quality time in an OR with a group of surgeons.

              They make Donald Trump look like a socially awkward tween at their first dance.

              Evie
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              • Profile picture of the author Summertime Dress
                This is going to cause some real controversy, but I believe Jay Abraham is struggling. If you are on his mailing list, you can see it.

                "I'm quitting the small entrepreneur and only working with big companies" and then in the next breath he is abandoning large business stating "I'm for the little guy, the small business owner" and on and on.

                And yes, he is giving the farm away. His life's work in a desperate attempt to gain some sort of market share again.

                Where are the $25,000 masterminds and the multiple $5,000 and $10,000 programs?

                And watching the JVs Spike made with every scam artist online was painful.

                My husband and I were even approached at a networking event a few years ago by Spike Hummer, Jay's operational manager, and that conversation was enlightening.

                Make no doubt about it, Jay is struggling.
                Guess I am wondering how you have this special insight about a well-respected marketer while you state the following about yourself:

                I'm sorry if I offend you by spending some of MY vacation time on this board, but I have been helping some people along the way and they keep pointing out how they were mislead on the boards. I enjoy the distraction I suppose and it keeps me talking about something I love.
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                • Profile picture of the author Summertime Dress
                  And on top of this, you offer reputation management services? Geeeez.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Local
                    Banned
                    Originally Posted by Summertime Dress View Post

                    And on top of this, you offer reputation management services? Geeeez.
                    You sound like an angry Alanis Morissette song...

                    So sorry you have a bee in your bonnet, but you can always "click off"...

                    You obviously must have a lot to be angry about in your life... and for that I feel sorry for you... maybe give that narcissistic ex-husband a call and make nice... relieve some of that guilt and transference?

                    Evie
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                • Profile picture of the author Local
                  Banned
                  Originally Posted by Summertime Dress View Post

                  Guess I am wondering how you have this special insight about a well-respected marketer while you state the following about yourself:
                  I've spent some time with Jay and his family at his home in Rancho Palos Verdes/Pacific Palisades and his beach house at Capistrano Beach.

                  And yes, I do have some insight that I would never share, but what I did share is accurate.

                  Dead on in fact.

                  You are obviously threatened by female high achievers.

                  Sad for you.

                  Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author jkuhry
    Thanks Evie,, for this post... your really hit some value and knowledge that alot of people are not aware of.... Look forward to reading more of your stuff!
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  • Profile picture of the author emotainment
    Excellent post and points and thanks Daxx for the advice. The more I stray away from the businesses without budgets or willingness to listen and take action, the happier I am and the better the results are.
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  • Profile picture of the author joefalk
    Thank you for this thread Local! So true and very inspiring. Do you have some more tips other than "google bomb" on how to do reputation management? (to take "delete" the bad talking sites from the first two pages of google) Thank you again for all your posts!
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by joefalk View Post

      Thank you for this thread Local! So true and very inspiring. Do you have some more tips other than "google bomb" on how to do reputation management? (to take "delete" the bad talking sites from the first two pages of google) Thank you again for all your posts!
      In most instances, we do not delete the listings we simply push them further down so that they are not as easy to find.

      I would try to find someone with a bunch of solid testimonials that is teaching reputation management and start there.

      I am thinking about after summer, offering a turn-key Reputation Repair and Management business training for SERIOUS individuals that want to learn the A to Z of starting a Reputation Management business.

      The facts are that for 2013 online reputation is forecasted to be a $3++ BILLION dollar industry.

      And user-generated content has become the biggest threat to small business owners and they are scared.

      Currently, the small reputation management company I created out of my local business consulting firm is closing 80% of the prospects we talk to and we are averaging $1,000 to $40,000* upfront and then $1,500 to $5,000 per month.

      Again, I am toying with the idea of doing this training after summer, when we are done vacationing.

      The idea is if I can get a group of 10 or so "like minded" individuals to learn our reputation management business, my company could earn a small override on all of their deals, but also create a "brain trust" for dealing with the ever present changes in what our best practices are.

      I do not yet have any idea of the cost, nor how I would work out the licensing.

      Evie

      * We have had one company pay us $40K down and three pay us $30K down, but we have a number of businesses each paying us $5,000 per month, Understand that we do not yet have longevity to be able to study the long term viability of a client paying us monthly. However, it is my intention that each client stays for as long as they are in business because if we stop doing our think, the negative posts, pages and reviews, very well may creep back over time and we'd have to almost start over. It is on their best interest to keep working with us month in and month out.
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  • Profile picture of the author michel147
    Very interesting topic. I am honestly agree with your Local Business Marketing Ideas. Best of Luck.
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  • Profile picture of the author blillard
    Thanks for this useful post. Will come in handy when dealing with cheap and know it all business owners lol.
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  • Profile picture of the author jrod014
    Great post Evie!

    I've had those "I want everything for $200" clients. The worst clients to deal with.

    Jerry
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by jrod014 View Post

      Great post Evie!

      I've had those "I want everything for $200" clients. The worst clients to deal with.

      Jerry
      In my experience Jerry, the less they paid, the more they want.

      I have a close friend right now that I am managing her husbands reputation and helping get reviews posted, etc.

      I should be charging at least $500 per month but she caught me after too much vino and I agreed to do it for $50.

      When I was in Italy, she almost caused me to lose on of my very best employees.

      She is more demanding than my worse $2,000 per month clients!

      When I get back, I am going to have a long talk with her.

      We have already helped he husbands business go from being nowhere to page one of GP for about 6 of the very best keywords. Number one in fact for 3! And there now are 16 positive reviews online and we pushed the 3 negative pages to page two but that is not good enough.

      Holy cow!

      Evie
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      • Profile picture of the author SirThomas
        Originally Posted by Local View Post

        In my experience Jerry, the less they paid, the more they want.

        I have a close friend right now that I am managing her husbands reputation and helping get reviews posted, etc.

        I should be charging at least $500 per month but she caught me after too much vino and I agreed to do it for $50.

        When I was in Italy, she almost caused me to lose on of my very best employees.

        She is more demanding than my worse $2,000 per month clients!

        When I get back, I am going to have a long talk with her.

        We have already helped he husbands business go from being nowhere to page one of GP for about 6 of the very best keywords. Number one in fact for 3! And there now are 16 positive reviews online and we pushed the 3 negative pages to page two but that is not good enough.

        Holy cow!

        Evie
        LOL! If I could only recover my own "after vino" losses...

        There is no doubt that low paying clients are usually the most challenging. It becomes even more noticeable, if your service is the only form of promotion they use.

        In my experience, you can do fine charging small amounts, if your service is only an addition to their current advertising campaigns. In other words, if you find a company that advertises very aggressively, they'd very often spend extra $200-500 a month just for the sake of it... just to add few more leads or to have better coverage.

        BTW. Those aggressive companies are also good prospect for "reputation management" or as I used to call it: reputation control.

        Thomas

        PS. If you get to the point when you're ready to offer your "after summer" program, please contact me with details. I'd love to hear what your plans are. Thank you in advance!
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  • Profile picture of the author ZNICK
    Wow, you really hit the nail on the head, lol. They sound as bad as managing employees.

    Z
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  • Profile picture of the author VirtualName
    Great stuff Evie.

    What you say applies to every business, you know. Well, what doesn't kill you, only makes you stronger!
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  • Profile picture of the author Bayo
    Evie

    You're a woman after my heart!

    This is the message that more people need to hear.

    What we call 'Offline Marketing' is really Small Business Consulting' and you can't be successful at that by hanging out n IM forums and spending more of your time learning as opposed to earning.

    One of the respondents to a post on my site mentioned that "If you're learning more than you're earning, then you need to check what you're doing" - That statement is so true but seems to fall on deaf ears as folks seek out that magic, push-button, autopilot offline secret...IT DOESN'T EXIST.

    Well done

    Bayo
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Bayo View Post

      Evie

      You're a woman after my heart!

      This is the message that more people need to hear.

      What we call 'Offline Marketing' is really Small Business Consulting' and you can't be successful at that by hanging out n IM forums and spending more of your time learning as opposed to earning.

      One of the respondents to a post on my site mentioned that "If you're learning more than you're earning, then you need to check what you're doing" - That statement is so true but seems to fall on deaf ears as folks seek out that magic, push-button, autopilot offline secret...IT DOESN'T EXIST.

      Well done

      Bayo
      Bayo - I LOVE that quote!

      I use time blocking.

      Drives my husband nutz cause I am using it even on our vacations.

      I do spend about 60 minutes a day in learning mode and when I exercise, while I love to listen to music, from time to time I will listen to a good business audiobook.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author mattgsilver
    Hey Evie,

    Wow, what a riveting thread!
    Specially like the some of the "heated" discourse.
    (on a sidenote just seeing the words La Jolla brings back warm memories of Muirlands and breakfast at Pannikens)

    Anyway - what I can't wrap my head around is how or why the 9's and 10's are so willing to switch to your (or my ) services when most of the these companies already have an established relationship with other marketing companies?
    Even if I show them the "holes", won't they just go back to their current marketing company and ask them to plug them?

    Cheers,

    _matt
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by mattgsilver View Post

      Hey Evie,

      Wow, what a riveting thread!
      Specially like the some of the "heated" discourse.
      (on a sidenote just seeing the words La Jolla brings back warm memories of Muirlands and breakfast at Pannikens)

      Anyway - what I can't wrap my head around is how or why the 9's and 10's are so willing to switch to your (or my ) services when most of the these companies already have an established relationship with other marketing companies?
      Even if I show them the "holes", won't they just go back to their current marketing company and ask them to plug them?

      Cheers,

      _matt
      Matt -

      I have yet to find a business that I can't find one or two tactics and strategies that I can share that will make them want to engage me for.

      I am very good at what I do because I LOVE business and I LOVE marketing. I have been told it was my enthusiasm which made then want to work with me.

      And just because a business is doing many things right, there is no way they are doing everything.

      That is my point.

      The 8s, 9s, and 10s, just by the fact that thy are 8s, 9s and 10s NEVER put all of their eggs in one basket.

      What I have noticed with the 8s, 9s, and 10s, is it is also easy to get some time with, IF your elevator speech is spot on.

      And if you cannot score with an 8, 9, or 10, the reason is likely you did not bring your A game.

      It's as simple as that because they will never turn down an opportunity to earn additional profits, if they believe you, trust you and like you.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author Vrs
    I know I'm resurrecting a topic from much earlier in the thread but I don't think you'd need to worry about a WSO anyway Evie - since over 90% of us never do anything with the information anyway.

    No "easy" money?

    On to the next WSO!!!
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  • Profile picture of the author sammy123
    Amazing analysis and recommendations.. but it wont effect much if you are targeting a local business with less competition..
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Rivers
    Evie,

    I understand completely where you're coming from.

    You're actually running a challenging, but rewarding business, but some folks here don't currently run a business and will never make the conscious decision to step their game up.

    It took me almost 8 months to figure out the following 2 life-changing things which you just casually mentioned:

    1. Find a foot-in-the door service offering and sell it until the wheels fall off. I love buying offline wso's, but you go down a lot of rabbit holes that way. After getting off to a rough start in my offline business, I now have my bread-n-butter service offering.

    I'm changing my website, marketing materials and everything else to align myself with that as my main offering. Of course I will build other sales funnels into my business, but will do them seperately.

    2. Once you determine your foot-in-the-door service offering, go broad in your marketing efforts to get clients and then go deep with your existing clients in order to upsell them other needed services.

    I wasted so much time trying to work with stubborn clients and to be the expert in a niche that didn't invest in their business industry wide.

    Most of us shouldn't target ONLY one niche unless we have a concrete proven track record of that industry investing in our type of marketing services.

    My advice is to find that foot-in-the-door service and then do what Evie and the guys over at TMF suggest and hire a team of folks to help you "go broad" and then go deep with your clients.

    Thanks for this thread,

    Chris Rivers
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    • Profile picture of the author Local
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Chris Rivers View Post

      Evie,

      I understand completely where you're coming from.

      You're actually running a challenging, but rewarding business, but some folks here don't currently run a business and will never make the conscious decision to step their game up.

      It took me almost 8 months to figure out the following 2 life-changing things which you just casually mentioned:

      1. Find a foot-in-the door service offering and sell it until the wheels fall off. I love buying offline wso's, but you go down a lot of rabbit holes that way. After getting off to a rough start in my offline business, I now have my bread-n-butter service offering.

      I'm changing my website, marketing materials and everything else to align myself with that as my main offering. Of course I will build other sales funnels into my business, but will do them seperately.

      2. Once you determine your foot-in-the-door service offering, go broad in your marketing efforts to get clients and then go deep with your existing clients in order to upsell them other needed services.

      I wasted so much time trying to work with stubborn clients and to be the expert in a niche that didn't invest in their business industry wide.

      Most of us shouldn't target ONLY one niche unless we have a concrete proven track record of that industry investing in our type of marketing services.

      My advice is to find that foot-in-the-door service and then do what Evie and the guys over at TMF suggest and hire a team of folks to help you "go broad" and then go deep with your clients.

      Thanks for this thread,

      Chris Rivers
      Chris - good advice indeed.

      Evie
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  • Profile picture of the author SubUrbanHype
    Its funny I would run into this post today. I actually just fired all of my offline clients today. They were exactly the type of clients you were talking about, always a day late and a dollar short. I am re-planning my system in which I go about getting clients right now and this thread is quite helpful.
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    • Profile picture of the author jcbradley
      k, here are a few of my questions....

      1 - You have salespeople, so im assuming what you have been saying about you becoming the expert is what you train your salespeople to become... How much and what kind of training do you give your sales guys

      2 - Sales people, what are they all responsible for after the sale? And do they also create the 10-12 minute videos for businesses?

      3 - What kind of project management system do you run for this?


      4 - Do you offer to be the exclusive for your client in the city? so say for san diego painters, you would only work with one for that area.

      5 - You have many different services you provide but at the same time, you may be an expert in all but do you hire a person in each area to become an expert and manage that back end, for ex... you have your seo team, social media, ppc, etc?

      Thanks again for sharing all this,

      Chris
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  • Profile picture of the author jcbradley
    Hey Evie,

    I cant say enough about what you started here. I came to this section to post about selling local services and where I think many people are missing it and lo n behold i stumble across this thread and it answered many questions and also popped up even more questions,

    I can say I learned more here than most of the local WSOs ive bought over the last 6 weeks. I won't go into any rant on some of them, but geeesshh... I really wonder if these guys are selling to any local busineses or are they just rehasing other stuff they've bought and put a different spin on it.

    As for the person a few pages ago that got a little depressed readiing all this, I understand how you feel b/c i get the same feeling when i go and study conversion tactics, I realize how little i konw but understand this....you dont need to know every single thing Evie here is talking about. Start small and understand you have to take some sort of action. YOu may not have the goal of buidling an agency and prefer to be a one man operation, hey guess what, you can do that and make a comfortable living by taking some of the nuggets she gave..such as the types of businesses to go after. that is worth the weight in gold here. And remember, start small, trial and error, and develop your system.

    Start where you want to end up, and reverse engineer back. You don't have to be a full marketing operation but understand you are not selling seo but inceasing your clients business.

    Ill post again for some of my questions.

    Thanks,

    Chris
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  • Profile picture of the author brett301005
    What if you changed to payment in advance?

    It would cut out a lot of the follow up which is a total waist of time.
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  • Profile picture of the author MrIMVO
    What a great thread! It seems to have just suddenly died. Was it picked up elsewhere?
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    • Profile picture of the author tampamike
      Evie,

      I could totally relate to your story about your least profitable client being the most trouble.

      I have run into this several times in my short 2 year career doing this and I think from now on I'm not taking on any clients for less than $500/mo. and I'm going to tell them how it is on the first day lol.
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  • Profile picture of the author Talladino
    I plan on doing some local marketing, I plan on using the "rental model", as someone here mentioned. I plan on making a local site for XYZ and attract leads then I plan on selling those leads. I figure if I get traffic and leads I can shop them to locals and pitch to them that if they don't buy i will go to their XYZ competitor and sell to them.

    Kind of play one off the other, another thing that i am looking at is getting a commission. I have a local friend here that owns a roofing company, I plan on getting him leads then if he does the job get a commission on every job completed.

    I would not get any $$$ up front but if a lead turns to a sale I get more money, a roofing lead to my friend will pay like $200-300 depending on size of job, so a few of those a month will help him out as well as me. I first started looking at it just to help a friend out and can see it getting bigger than that.

    I see lots of so called SEO business here locally that want to sell this and that and promise this and that, but none that offer actual leads. So i figure even if they have a SEO already if i bring a lead and it turns into a job they won't pass on it , especially if it's free to start with, I get a cut of the profits once the job is done.

    For a roofing lead i can track it too, I know the address of the customer, i can go to the local city website and see permits pulled, so I would check on it and if a permit is filled I know they got the job as the roofing companies name is on it, so i can see which leads go thru.
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