24 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}
24 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}

Opening Google Places Account - How To Do It Without Real Address?

by krzysiek
19 replies
Hey guys,

I am looking to get my sites rented out as soon as I can. I really want to get the Google Places account opened up and ranked first before trying to rent my site out to a local business.

I was thinking to rent it out (the site) first, then once rented, send the post card to their address. This method is still fine with me, but ideally, I would have one made now and work on getting it ranked and providing results BEFORE getting a client, so that I can offer them a free month to see that my offer will actually get them results.

Naturally, I want to provide them the most results possible in that "free period", so by having a well ranked Google Places before actually trying to lease them the site, it would be very beneficial.

I actually tried to create one about 3 weeks ago, I put the suburb as the actual suburb of where I wanted it, and then I chose to "hide address" so that the actual street address would NOT show on the listing. Then for the address (even though it does not show in the public profile, they still ask for it ) I just put my actual home address and suburb and post code.

On the post card it would have looked like:

NAME
STREET ADDRESS, MY SUBURB & POST CODE
LEGITIMATE SUBURB & POSTCODE

In that format, but given that it has been 3 weeks... I can only assume this did not pass

Any ideas? Opening up one of those virtual boxes, does that even work?

Thanks,
#account #address #google #opening #places #real
  • Profile picture of the author Quentin
    The reason for this is that Google places is for offline businesses so you need a real address. Even if you use a fake one it will likley get deleted after a while with their new policy.

    Quentin
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4378303].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author krzysiek
      Originally Posted by Quentin View Post

      The reason for this is that Google places is for offline businesses so you need a real address. Even if you use a fake one it will likley get deleted after a while with their new policy.

      Quentin
      Hi Quentin,

      Thanks for replying. Please see the reply I had aimed at Rus, about a post or two above.

      What do you think of the idea of just changing over the address when a client stops working with me, to the address of a new client?

      I think it would be decently easy (but I can't be sure just yet) to rank the Google Places on the top of page one for these areas, as most of the listings are unclaimed currently and a few of them are even showing addresses/numbers that are no longer in business.

      So, likely, I will just need to optimise my Google Places account as per the normal guidelines, and perhaps build a few citations beforehand (and let them get indexed before making the account) and that should see me on first page.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4382358].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author VegasGreg
        Originally Posted by krzysiek View Post

        Hi Quentin,

        What do you think of the idea of just changing over the address when a client stops working with me, to the address of a new client?

        I think it would be decently easy (but I can't be sure just yet) to rank the Google Places on the top of page one for these areas, as most of the listings are unclaimed currently and a few of them are even showing addresses/numbers that are no longer in business.

        So, likely, I will just need to optimise my Google Places account as per the normal guidelines, and perhaps build a few citations beforehand (and let them get indexed before making the account) and that should see me on first page.
        You can't (for all logical purposes) change an address from one company to another for a Google Places listing. It's not like a normal website where you just edit a few lines.

        Well actually, you can edit the address, but the BUSINESS NAME (which NEEDS to be the exact business name) also needs to be associated with the address, so if you change the address to another company, you would also have to change the business name, in which case you really just need to start or claim the new owners business listing.

        I am guessing you don't really know how G-Places work and how (or what) REAL citations are and how Google verifies and improves rankings on real life factors. When you know these things you will realize that you just can't change a Google Places listing from one business address to another.

        Ranking a site alone and leasing just that site is achievable though.
        Signature

        Greg Schueler - Wordpress Fanatic... Living The Offline Marketing Dream...

        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4382608].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author krzysiek
          Hi Vegas,

          Thank you for your reply. While you may be right for the most part about not knowing much about Google Places, I do know a little - but am always ready for help to fill that knowledge gap. So thanks for your replies

          In regards to the business name, despite it possibly being against the rules, I would have it like this: If the town was called 'Melbourne' for example, my business listing would be called 'Melbourne Dental' or 'Melbourne Dental Practice'.

          It is obviously not within Google's rules, or at least the Melbourne Dental one might be if that is the legit name of the business (but most times it isn't) but the idea is to get the visitors coming.

          With using a more general name, such as above, all that would need to be done is to have the address changed. Once the address is changed, all should be well as I can update the phone number on my end & the Google Places listing name is still fine as it was a more 'general' name.

          In regards to the citations, I know how citations work and that I should build my citations before making or claiming a Google Places listing - however, in the areas I am targeting, all/most do not have their listing claimed, all/most do not have any citations. Thus the competition is very low. I presume filling in all possible details in the Google Places, coupled with my strong website SEO will put that listing to page 1 without much of a problem, or need for citations.

          Thoughts?

          Originally Posted by VegasGreg View Post

          You can't (for all logical purposes) change an address from one company to another for a Google Places listing. It's not like a normal website where you just edit a few lines.

          Well actually, you can edit the address, but the BUSINESS NAME (which NEEDS to be the exact business name) also needs to be associated with the address, so if you change the address to another company, you would also have to change the business name, in which case you really just need to start or claim the new owners business listing.

          I am guessing you don't really know how G-Places work and how (or what) REAL citations are and how Google verifies and improves rankings on real life factors. When you know these things you will realize that you just can't change a Google Places listing from one business address to another.

          Ranking a site alone and leasing just that site is achievable though.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4383066].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author brett301005
          Originally Posted by VegasGreg View Post

          You can't (for all logical purposes) change an address from one company to another for a Google Places listing. It's not like a normal website where you just edit a few lines.

          Well actually, you can edit the address, but the BUSINESS NAME (which NEEDS to be the exact business name) also needs to be associated with the address, so if you change the address to another company, you would also have to change the business name, in which case you really just need to start or claim the new owners business listing.

          I am guessing you don't really know how G-Places work and how (or what) REAL citations are and how Google verifies and improves rankings on real life factors. When you know these things you will realize that you just can't change a Google Places listing from one business address to another.

          Ranking a site alone and leasing just that site is achievable though.
          VagasGreg is correct.

          Google have set up the system to prevent people hi-jacking their local business listing and trying to lease it back to them, hint hint.

          I am assuming that you want control of the listing in case the business decided to leave.

          Get the client 1st, offer them a 30-60 day guarantee period so they may see the results once they have committed to you doing the work, which is more than you may think (may I suggest using fiverr, make videos,its not good for Australian citations etc.)

          Open a new Google Account with a gmail address "businessname at gmail.com" and claim the Google Places listing.

          If the client leaves delete the Google Places listing.

          Place 1 Goolge Places listing per Google Account, as you can not transfer them to another Google Account, this will provide you some flexibility in future.

          Up until about June 2011 you could verify the Google Places listing with Phone and SMS, this changed to Post Card only making it even harder to hi-jack a Google Places listing.

          The Google Places system is full of bugs, it will drive you crazy.
          You may think that you can log-in and change the address but the changes will not take affect, it often going into a PENDING status as its breached a guidline and leaves you guessing which guidline you've breached.

          Changes can take 4 weeks to take affect and they often have a human eye go over them.

          I've seen prices for the service at around $697 to setup and $197 per month maintance, and the site do require maintance, I seen a Consultant in the USA charge that for 2 hours a months and over that is billable.

          Duplicate listing, well I said the changes will drive you crazy above, a duplicate listing (I suggest checking for them monthly) will drive you absolutely bonkers, for about 4 weeks.

          You will need a contract with your client detailing ownership, if you use the payment structure I mentioned above, they own the site as they paid the setup fee.

          PM me if you want the details for a course on this stuff.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4383358].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author sudden
            Originally Posted by brett301005 View Post



            (may I suggest using fiverr, make videos,its not good for Australian citations etc.)
            Brett,

            Would you mind explaining this further?

            thanks
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4383829].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author krzysiek
              Originally Posted by sudden View Post

              Brett,

              Would you mind explaining this further?

              thanks
              Haha, same question I had! (asked below)

              PS: Brett, I would not be charging them for just Google Places. I would be charging a fixed monthly to send them leads. How I spend that money is my choice and if they stop, the marketing stops. They are paying month by month to have me keep sending them leads!
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4383852].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author VegasGreg
    Yea, you need a real physical address. You may get a fake one to "stick" once in a while, but the rankings will suck because you can't get real citations going to it because there is no real business there to build on.

    You would be doing more harm than good in the long run for any business that takes over (or leases) your site.
    Signature

    Greg Schueler - Wordpress Fanatic... Living The Offline Marketing Dream...

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4378536].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
    I was thinking to rent it out (the site) first, then once rented, send the post card to their address. This method is still fine with me, but ideally, I would have one made now and work on getting it ranked and providing results BEFORE getting a client, so that I can offer them a free month to see that my offer will actually get them results.
    What happens after they verify the Places page and then later down the road decide to cancel with you.

    If your going to rent a site you need to have ultimate control over the domain, 3rd party listings and the Places page.
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4378745].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author krzysiek
      Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

      What happens after they verify the Places page and then later down the road decide to cancel with you.

      If your going to rent a site you need to have ultimate control over the domain, 3rd party listings and the Places page.
      Thanks for your reply Rus.

      I have control over the domain, and over the few directory submissions that I have already done.

      If you don't mind me asking, how would you do it different to ensure that you still hold on to the Google Places even if they cancel on you? I don't anticipate them cancelling because I'm not signing anyone up 'till I see for myself that I am providing them more clients - at that point, I don't see them cancelling unless they are going out of business/closing down.

      I was thinking of making a Google Places account from my own email (an email that is associated with the website, such as sales@dentistcity.com) and make the Gooogle Places account through there.

      Then, just put the "address" as the address of my client. They verify it. We get it to the top. If they cancel, I have access to it because the email used was mine, not theirs. So then I would have the ability to log in and be in control.

      The only problem is: reviews being left are for the old business. But, I would try and get it ranking without reviews... I am in very non competitive areas right now where almost all listings have no reviews at all currently.

      The other problem is, changing the address. If I change the address, do they send a post card to the NEW address, or to the old address as well? I assume just to the new one? If this is the case, NO problems - I will just put in the new address of a new client and wait 2 weeks for the card to arrive.

      The number on the listings will be an number I own which redirects, so I can at any time set it to redirect to my new client, and in the mean time wait for the post card to come and get the address changed.

      However, I have also noticed you can set the business as a "mobile only" business which will NOT show your street address (perfect - because I doubt people will not click on the google places simply because a street address is not showing - then when they hit the main website the address will be there anyway). The mobile-only option will still show the suburb where the service is offered though, so it doesn't seem like a big issue.


      Any input is greatly appreciated, Rus. As always, thanks given.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4382336].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author rbrShorty
    I am not quite sure how you are going to create a Place page for a "website". Yes, you can create a Place page for a business, even for your own business if you are doing in-person contact with the clients, but it's more than obvious it is impossible to do it for a website. The Place page should be of a business, with a location and phone number.

    However, it is possible to rank over the Places results, so I don't really understand why you are pushing it for the Google Places?
    Signature
    Local Search Marketing by NGS Marketing

    Citation Building Service by NGS Marketing

    Phone (US): 347-535-4535 | Skype: NGS.Marketing
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4379208].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author krzysiek
      Hi there,

      Sorry, I was not clear The website I have is for local clients, ie - dentist, plumber, etc. So it is actually simulating a real business owners website, with a phone number, address etc all on there. So in that sense, I believe it qualifies.

      You are right about ranking above Google Places, I have done that on one of my websites (although traffic numbers don't really seem to have increased... I wonder if people are mistaking the website above Google Places to be an ad and just moving down without clicking on it?)

      But, having a high ranking website + Google Places, if possible, is just going to get my clients better/more results - something I will gladly welcome!

      Originally Posted by rbrShorty View Post

      I am not quite sure how you are going to create a Place page for a "website". Yes, you can create a Place page for a business, even for your own business if you are doing in-person contact with the clients, but it's more than obvious it is impossible to do it for a website. The Place page should be of a business, with a location and phone number.

      However, it is possible to rank over the Places results, so I don't really understand why you are pushing it for the Google Places?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4382348].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author krzysiek
    Hi Brett,

    Thanks for your long, detailed reply.

    Can you tell me the part about using Fiverr for some videos, you said they don't work for Aussie citations? What do you mean by that part?

    The way I was thinking of potentially doing it is to:

    1) Sign up a Google account with sales@mydomain.com.au
    2) Make "Suburb Dental" Google Places account.
    3) Put my current clients address in so the post card goes to them
    4) Activate the Google Places once post card is received
    5) Choose to 'hide' address so that only the suburb shows, not the address
    6) Rank it
    7) If client ever moves, just change the number (which I own) to redirect to a different number. So the number on the Google Places doesn't change, I just change the redirection in my admin panel of where I buy the numbers from

    Provided I have not missed anything obvious, the above should work?

    The only problem I can see is some sort of penalty for not 'showing' the address, but if changing the address eventually will be an issue, it might be worth my while to keep the address hidden.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4383847].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author VegasGreg
      Originally Posted by krzysiek View Post

      The way I was thinking of potentially doing it is to:

      1) Sign up a Google account with sales@mydomain.com.au
      2) Make "Suburb Dental" Google Places account.
      3) Put my current clients address in so the post card goes to them
      4) Activate the Google Places once post card is received
      5) Choose to 'hide' address so that only the suburb shows, not the address
      6) Rank it
      7) If client ever moves, just change the number (which I own) to redirect to a different number. So the number on the Google Places doesn't change, I just change the redirection in my admin panel of where I buy the numbers from

      Provided I have not missed anything obvious, the above should work?

      The only problem I can see is some sort of penalty for not 'showing' the address, but if changing the address eventually will be an issue, it might be worth my while to keep the address hidden.
      #2 and #3, "Superb Dental" would not match the business name associated to the address for your client.

      #5) Hiding address would not only raise red flags but take away your ranking potential for targeted searches.

      #6) Since you fudged all the details, ranking will not happen (maybe short term, but when Google catches it it will be zapped)

      #7) If you are referring to a phone #, again if that number is not exactly associated with the exact business name and the exact address, you lose it all.

      Citations and rankings are based on EXACT Business Name, Business Address and local Business Number combined. ANY variation within any of those will hurt (or eliminate) rankings and do more damage to a clients business than good.

      I appreciate that you are determined to make this happen, but if you put as much energy and effort into doing it right your results (and income) would go up significantly as companies would love you for helping them instead of hiring you and having you hurt their business.

      (This does not apply to leasing just a website that is SEOd properly, just Places)

      On that note, I am out of this conversation, everything has been explained and if you are still determined to 'fudge' your business, that's all you.
      Signature

      Greg Schueler - Wordpress Fanatic... Living The Offline Marketing Dream...

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4387335].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author brett301005
        VegasGreg is on the money again, listen to what he is saying, he's 100% correct.

        #2 and #3 - Google cross reference with the Yellow Pages (and others) for their business data.

        I'd actually suggest when starting a new Google Places page, find the listing that already exists (that has not been claimed) and claim it as the business owner or on their behalf if your doing the work for them. This avoids a duplicate listing being created as duplicates are VERY hard to get ride of.

        Using Fiverr (detailed explaination):
        Videos ~
        Google Places has capacity for 10 photos and 5 videos.

        Find photos from iStockPhoto.com for $1-2 each for royality free photos.

        You can find a gig on Fiverr to make you short videos with Animoto.com and have them uploaded to a YouTube account (make a new YouTube Account with the Google Account mentioned in previous post).

        In the description field for YouTube make sure you place ~

        URL
        Business Name
        Address
        Phone Number
        (You just created a citation from YouTube)

        Citations ~
        A citation is the name for a business directory listing such as the Yellow Pages, White Pages and is sort of like a backlink, however they are looking for 'Business Name' + Address + Phone Number.

        Your idea of owning the phone number and redirecting it to the business will only work for the Google Places page, however for ranking and the need for citations requires that that business details are mentioned in other key places all over the web.

        Citations need to be localized, so in your case Australian business directories weigh more favourible than UK or US directories.

        Australian Citations: (examples)
        yellowpages.com.au (free listing)
        truelocal.com.au
        startlocal.com.au
        bloo.com.au
        Industry Specific Sites - eg. Travel, Medical, Construction
        (Don't pay for these sites, its a waist of money, some call the business to confrim the details and try to upsell, advise your client is a waist of money)

        Fiverr has some gigs with people offer 25 citation listings, however they mostly appear to be USA directories like Yelp, which do not accept Australian addresses in the listings, only USA, Canada & UK. (at time of writing)

        Edmonton Web Design & Search Engine Optimization (SEO) | Whitespark is a citation finder, free service or $20 a month for the PRO version. I can recommend paying $20 for a month, get the work done then turn it off for your personal site, if you are doing it for clients its a huge time saver so you may consider keeping the membership.

        Google Search String for Citation:
        http://www.google.com.au/search?q="business name"+"number street name"+"phone"

        example: "northside plumbing" + "123 pipe st" + "1234 5678"

        Make 2 more search strings and save them (method below)
        "business name"+"number street name"
        "business name"+"phone"

        FireFox Add-on ~ Speed Dial
        Create a tab called 'Local' and add the above string to a cell.
        Use it to check your citations as its like counting backlinks.
        Also keep record of them in excel spreadsheet when you make them as some expire after 12 months. Don't bother for existing citation I don't think the effort is worth it.

        I was on a webinar a few days ago, Google move to verify accounts with a Post Card only appears to combate a tactis that some people used to list their business with a false address close to the city centre and confirm with phone or SMS (text). This also prevents hi-jacking.

        Google have created these Places Pages for the Business Owner, the system has been created in such a way that only the Business Owner can claim the site. Goolge are aware of the tactic of hi-jacking sites and leasing it back to the Business Owner, when Google intended it to be free.

        May I suggest instead of trying to beat the system, find another way to work withing the system. Google Places is going through constant changes and if you find a loop hole it may not be there in a few weeks.

        I am going to take some fantatic advise from VegasGreg.

        Originally Posted by VegasGreg View Post

        On that note, I am out of this conversation, everything has been explained and if you are still determined to 'fudge' your business, that's all you.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4388751].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author krzysiek
        Hi Vegas,

        Thanks for your reply!

        I have seen a lot of listings have something in the format of "suburb Dental" such as like "South Yarra Dental" or "South Yarra Dental Clinic" which were made by Google (unclaimed listings) so if I specifically made one along those guidelines, I am not sure why it would be a problem. The current existing ones seem to have been up for all eternity (the ones that follow this business name structure).

        I am aware it would not match my clients business name though, and that is something I would have to think about.

        With hiding the address, perhaps you are right that it might raise red flags. I am more inclined to think it might impact on ability to rank moreso, as otherwise I don't think it would be an option to choose.

        So basically, I understand that I should be working with the real clinic name and not a general name. That's fair enough and makes good sense. Even using the real address as they have it is fine.

        But with the phone number, I couldn't use their phone number on the places page because I would need to use my tracking number so that I will know that I am sending them a good amount of leads. I want to be certain I am helping them, otherwise I do not want their money - so I think I would need to have my tracking number in there to ensure that I am providing value.

        I am not sure how to bypass that above point (using my own number) with citations, etc.

        I have a meeting with a dental client soon. He is new to the area, virtually nothing on him on the net, so no Google Places or anything. Will have to take in these ideas.
        Originally Posted by VegasGreg View Post

        #2 and #3, "Superb Dental" would not match the business name associated to the address for your client.

        #5) Hiding address would not only raise red flags but take away your ranking potential for targeted searches.

        #6) Since you fudged all the details, ranking will not happen (maybe short term, but when Google catches it it will be zapped)

        #7) If you are referring to a phone #, again if that number is not exactly associated with the exact business name and the exact address, you lose it all.

        Citations and rankings are based on EXACT Business Name, Business Address and local Business Number combined. ANY variation within any of those will hurt (or eliminate) rankings and do more damage to a clients business than good.

        I appreciate that you are determined to make this happen, but if you put as much energy and effort into doing it right your results (and income) would go up significantly as companies would love you for helping them instead of hiring you and having you hurt their business.

        (This does not apply to leasing just a website that is SEOd properly, just Places)

        On that note, I am out of this conversation, everything has been explained and if you are still determined to 'fudge' your business, that's all you.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4389180].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author krzysiek
    Thanks Brett,

    Taking it all in. Checking out those links you provided right after this post.

    EDIT: Trying their free version right now to see how it works!

    EDIT2: Love it! Very good stuff on the free version!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4389184].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author brett301005
    Hi krzysiek,

    The Pro Version of WhiteSpark.ca is even better, it lists unlimited amounts of citations with the ability to rank them for strength of the citaton, they use 2 methods of ranking SEOmoz and MagesticSEO ranking, so I sorted each by the column with the highest at the top and grabbed the strongest citation. (Its virtually page rank for the citaton site)

    The free version provides 30 citation and no way to rank them.

    The time saver alone is work the $20 Pro Membership for 30 days.
    (Note: I cancelled before the 30 days as I had finished with the tool, or its $20 per month)

    Also use it to search for the citation from the competitors site and make sure you get them.

    Add them to your excel speadsheet to its easy to use a second time.

    There are a few tools out their to help with citation, all catering for the US & UK market, obviously they are bigger markets.

    Australian citations turned into a bit of a manual job, hang on, I'll attach my excel speadsheet of citation. I'll just clean it up to remove my data.

    There is about 20 hours of work in finding and submitting these citation, I'm feeling generous today so your lucky. I'd suggest outsourcing the job, it takes an hour to do 4 of them.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4390843].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author krzysiek
    Thanks Brett, once again! I have saved a copy of that locally and will put it to good use when I open a Google Places account soon. I have a meeting with a dentist coming up, where I plan on doing Google Places work for them. This will definitely come in handy!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4390930].message }}

Trending Topics