I closed 13 out of 15 meetings!

13 years ago

Great job.

What type of service did you sell?
How many contacts before close?
What was the intro contact method?
What was the follow up contact method
What niches?

-Brian

Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by BC27

Great job.

What type of service did you sell?
How many contacts before close?
What was the intro contact method?
What was the follow up contact method
What niches?

-Brian

I sold SEO services, social marketing, email marketing, web design... and ppc services.
I outsourced most of it....

I dont know what you mean by "how many contacts before close".... so I will let you explain that questions.

The intro contact method was cold calling...

There wasnt usually a "follow up", i cold called to get the meetings, then closed the meetings... but if did need to follow up (lets say he wasnt In), then I just called them again.

Thanks

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mr2monster

13 years ago

That's pretty much the standard walk through on the sales process, but very good results!

Congratulations!

I think the previous poster means how many times did you have to contact each client before they closed the deal with you.

Thanks
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BC27 13 years ago

Originally Posted by mr2monster

I think the previous poster means how many times did you have to contact each client before they closed the deal with you.

That's exactly what I meant, thanks.

Congrats again on your success.

-Brian
- Thanks
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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

It does seem to be the best way to deal with meetings, but its not how I started doing it..... how would I know lol!

either way, trust first, questions next, then product after that!.. its the only order that works.

And I only had to contact them once to set up the meeting, and I only went to one meeting in order to close.

Thanks

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salomeh

13 years ago

Nice post. This will help a lot of people.

Thanks

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slickback

13 years ago

Wow congrats on your success! You said that your intro was cold calling, were your close face to face meetings?

Thanks

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Voasi

13 years ago

Nicely done - this is EXACTLY what I try and teach. In today's age, with so many scam artists and people who's WORD is worth nothing, business owners are always on their guard.

You've got to build trust out the gate, doing whatever you can. I personally teach using "free" as a trust builder, but there are several ways to build trust, like writing a book, showing case studies or just building rapport.

One of the things I teach my guys is to LET THE BUSINESS OWNER TALK. Once they start talking to you, they REALLY START TALKING TO YOU...giving you there pain points and telling you what's wrong with their business and marketing approach.

Makes it extremely easy on us, because to the business owner, we look like we're building rapport and listening (which of course we are), but the reality is that he's telling us exactly what we need to offer him as marketing services.

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

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herbaluss

13 years ago

Originally Posted by drummer05

yeah, you got it right... I stopped offering free stuff as a recipricol type action when i learned about building rapport with hypnotic techniques... its really interesting stuff.

Im coming out with an e-course showing my process of getting clients and converting them with meetings... and I have a whole section on building rapport..

Its gonna be huge, i cant wait for people to get their hands on it.

Josh

interesting I can't wait to view this.

Thanks

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creationz

13 years ago

Congrats on your success!

Thanks

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thelibidoguy

13 years ago

I'd like to see it too. The way you put it Josh, it just seems more fundamental and simple. I've seen alot of "stuff" out there that has so much it can look discouraging for many folks.

Thanks

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Joshua Morris 13 years ago

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- Tracy411 13 years ago
  
  Hi Drummer05 (Josh),
  
  I would say the best place to give away an ebook or report would be in the War Room.
  
  I look forward to hearing more about your methods. Do let us know if you make this a WSO. Congrats on all those closes
  
  Tracy
  
  Thanks
  
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SirThomas

13 years ago

Josh, just to let you know, this thread might get deleted, because it looks like a simple "pre-sell" for your upcoming product...

Try to take a little more time to share your findings and then offer the product, ...if you feel like to. Just saying... :-)

Congrats on your success!

Thomas

[ 3 ] Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by SirThomas

Josh, just to let you know, this thread might get deleted, because it looks like a simple "pre-sell" for your upcoming product...

Try to take a little more time to share your findings and then offer the product, ...if you feel like to. Just saying... :-)

Congrats on your success!

Thomas

Hey sorry it came across as that, I really didnt mean for it to turn out that way.
I started the tread with some real insights on how to plan your meetings and how to improve your meetings, and was just showing my success using this plan.... so I hope the warrior forum will find value in that.

Lets get off the topic of my e-book and back on improving the meetings.

If anyone has any questions or comments about the method in the first post, please post them so we can get back on discussion.

Josh M

Thanks

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WillST

13 years ago

Josh - all I can say is... WOW!

They are incredible and enviable results... Im in the process of redesigning my offline consulting business (while my website gets redesigned) and I have been creating a similar sort of sales funnel which you explained earlier...

But to achieve 13 closes out of 15, from one COLD CALL and then ONE follow up meeting, that certainly is impressive!

I've got the 'asking questions' and then 'providing a solution to fit the owners needs' bits down to a T. But I too would love to learn more about your 'hypnotic rapport building' techniques!

Love the success you've had so far, can't wait to emulate what you're doing :-D

Thanks

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Thanks alot..

Yeah, the hypnotic rapport building is what i think really did it. When the client fullly trusts you and believes in you, its very hard NOT to close.. I absolutely swear by these techniques.

I am defintaly gonna make this guide, and ill include alot more than hypnotic rapport building

my hypnotic mind controls can almost force the client to buy, become emotional about your product, see your complete hypnotic confidence in your product and so so much more..

I cant wait for this

Looking forward.

Josh M

Thanks

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Max Shakhbazov

13 years ago

Sorry, but I would have to agree. This is a total pre-sell. Not to rain on your parade, but if your interest lies in helping other Warriors, let's provide some tangible / actionable facts and data.

Maybe something like this:

This is specific to the United States, as it's my operating territory, and it's what I know. I'm sure this can be tweaked according to your locale... Go to your Secretary of State website. At this point in time, this government department should be tech-savvy enough to regularly update (online) their repository of recently registered businesses. Typically, you can search by Business City, and date of registration. There lies a handful of fresh leads right here. Go into each business listing and find the name of the principal. Beware of listings that are not businesses, but rather organizational groups, trusts, etc. Typically, you can dissect these by using your intuition, but then again, I assume most people here have a fairly practical grasp on business intuition....please don't prove me wrong! :rolleyes:
Take the Principal's name, and cross-reference this using a Google search for their name, in addition to their business' registered city. For example, go to Google and type in "John Smith Boise" and see what pops up. Usually you'll get some LinkedIn references as well as some from Spokeo, maybe a Facebook contact if you're lucky, etc. You'll find that the more "legitimate" prospective targets will have some local media mentions as well...this is a good thing.
Setup a spreadsheet with the Business Name, Principal Name, and any contact information you've found (phone, Facebook, etc.) This is very important! I recommend Google Docs, because after you've done this once, rinse and repeat using an outsourcer. The method is easy and can be learned. In fact, if you want more details, PM me and I'd be glad to share. This is the exact method that I use to generate hot, relatively untouched leads that almost guarantee an appointment.
Next step is to make the first contact. Use whatever means are available to you. However, there are some key points of interest here. You never want to come across to the business owner that you're "intruding on their time." Rather, you've got a valuable proposition that they should better pucker up to if they want to make their business a success. Who goes into business without the prospect of success on their mind? No one.... not even a "non-profit", which, as you'll learn, is never not-for-profit. So use that trigger as an entryway. Don't speak using intangible figures and metrics and data....use real-life examples. If you're just starting out, these examples don't need to be from your own empirical data...they simply need to be proven results achieved by similar businesses in similar verticals. Now, don't get me wrong...business owners aren't "easily swayed," but they are eager to achieve results. This is where the focus of any communication should lie. Sure, it's fine to say "build trust" to get sales, but what does that really mean? I don't believe in the whole hypnotic mumbo-jumbo, and have never even thought of anything like that when speaking with a prospective client. I speak with authority, because I can provide results, and that's all I need.
Closing is the easy part. Clients that are ready to buy will close themselves....PERIOD! I know there will be some that disagree with me, and I honestly could care less, because I know this from real action with real results. I've never had to hard close anyone, and this is from 6 figures worth of sales in less than a year's time (my 2nd year running this business), because they've already sold themselves before I even ask for the check.

I didn't mean to hijack the thread, but honestly, it's 10 AM here on a Friday, I've already had a couple Bloody Mary's, and was feeling quite perturbed about the original post. As you'll see, this is my first post on the WF, and I've never felt more motivated to post that today, for some reason. If you want real results from your "offline" efforts, you need to know that they are 100% achievable if you stop chasing the dream, and start pursuing the money. Find a process that actually works (which means it is directly income-producing in 80% of the activities involved) and do it over and over and over again. You will make money....in fact, you will make more money than you ever thought achievable, because, let's face it, you're here because you're not confident. Make a sale, and the confidence will follow...it's not hard!

[ 5 ] Thanks
3 replies

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LakiPolitis

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Max Shakhbazov

Sorry, but I would have to agree. This is a total pre-sell. Not to rain on your parade, but if your interest lies in helping other Warriors, let's provide some tangible / actionable facts and data.

....

Make a sale, and the confidence will follow...it's not hard!

Can I get a thumbs up button please? Excellent advice. ACTIONABLE ADVICE

Especially with well established accountants, lawyers, etc. They don't want to be found by everyone. They would MUCH rather have small businesses referred to them through business networks by people they trust so they can weed out the horrible clients from the quality ones. You can't sell an eskimo flip flops, man. If they don't want or need it, don't build any expectations for sales. Be confident and knowledgeable, maybe you can help elsewhere (automate a business process, or even spruce up their user workflow...)

Thanks

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iwillberich

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Max Shakhbazov

Sorry, but I would have to agree. This is a total pre-sell. Not to rain on your parade, but if your interest lies in helping other Warriors, let's provide some tangible / actionable facts and data.

Maybe something like this:

This is specific to the United States, as it's my operating territory, and it's what I know. I'm sure this can be tweaked according to your locale... Go to your Secretary of State website. At this point in time, this government department should be tech-savvy enough to regularly update (online) their repository of recently registered businesses. Typically, you can search by Business City, and date of registration. There lies a handful of fresh leads right here. Go into each business listing and find the name of the principal. Beware of listings that are not businesses, but rather organizational groups, trusts, etc. Typically, you can dissect these by using your intuition, but then again, I assume most people here have a fairly practical grasp on business intuition....please don't prove me wrong! :rolleyes:
Take the Principal's name, and cross-reference this using a Google search for their name, in addition to their business' registered city. For example, go to Google and type in "John Smith Boise" and see what pops up. Usually you'll get some LinkedIn references as well as some from Spokeo, maybe a Facebook contact if you're lucky, etc. You'll find that the more "legitimate" prospective targets will have some local media mentions as well...this is a good thing.
Setup a spreadsheet with the Business Name, Principal Name, and any contact information you've found (phone, Facebook, etc.) This is very important! I recommend Google Docs, because after you've done this once, rinse and repeat using an outsourcer. The method is easy and can be learned. In fact, if you want more details, PM me and I'd be glad to share. This is the exact method that I use to generate hot, relatively untouched leads that almost guarantee an appointment.
Next step is to make the first contact. Use whatever means are available to you. However, there are some key points of interest here. You never want to come across to the business owner that you're "intruding on their time." Rather, you've got a valuable proposition that they should better pucker up to if they want to make their business a success. Who goes into business without the prospect of success on their mind? No one.... not even a "non-profit", which, as you'll learn, is never not-for-profit. So use that trigger as an entryway. Don't speak using intangible figures and metrics and data....use real-life examples. If you're just starting out, these examples don't need to be from your own empirical data...they simply need to be proven results achieved by similar businesses in similar verticals. Now, don't get me wrong...business owners aren't "easily swayed," but they are eager to achieve results. This is where the focus of any communication should lie. Sure, it's fine to say "build trust" to get sales, but what does that really mean? I don't believe in the whole hypnotic mumbo-jumbo, and have never even thought of anything like that when speaking with a prospective client. I speak with authority, because I can provide results, and that's all I need.
Closing is the easy part. Clients that are ready to buy will close themselves....PERIOD! I know there will be some that disagree with me, and I honestly could care less, because I know this from real action with real results. I've never had to hard close anyone, and this is from 6 figures worth of sales in less than a year's time (my 2nd year running this business), because they've already sold themselves before I even ask for the check.

I didn't mean to hijack the thread, but honestly, it's 10 AM here on a Friday, I've already had a couple Bloody Mary's, and was feeling quite perturbed about the original post. As you'll see, this is my first post on the WF, and I've never felt more motivated to post that today, for some reason. If you want real results from your "offline" efforts, you need to know that they are 100% achievable if you stop chasing the dream, and start pursuing the money. Find a process that actually works (which means it is directly income-producing in 80% of the activities involved) and do it over and over and over again. You will make money....in fact, you will make more money than you ever thought achievable, because, let's face it, you're here because you're not confident. Make a sale, and the confidence will follow...it's not hard!

Hi, I saw your post in some thread where you share your experience on getting leads on linkedin. I already have a profile, 1,500 connection, and some recommendations but NO leads. How can get some success on linkedin?

Thanks

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PaulFL

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Max Shakhbazov

Sorry, but I would have to agree. This is a total pre-sell. Not to rain on your parade, but if your interest lies in helping other Warriors, let's provide some tangible / actionable facts and data...

Find a process that actually works (which means it is directly income-producing in 80% of the activities involved) and do it over and over and over again. You will make money....in fact, you will make more money than you ever thought achievable, because, let's face it, you're here because you're not confident. Make a sale, and the confidence will follow...it's not hard!

Max - I agree with most of what you said except for the confidence issue.
The OP definitely looked like a presell, particularly with the inclusion of what is best for a sales letter. Maybe my logic is off but saying someone is here due to a lack of confidence seems to infer that's why all are here. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Personally, I'm here because I never stop learning (after 30 years). To me, this is an online classroom from which I can learn from other folks' real world experiences and give back with contributions of my own. It's no different than buying a marketing or sales book. I don't get them because I lack confidence but to insure I'm always at the top of my game.

@JohnDurham
You raise several great points, particularly about the explosion of offline marketers. It's amazing when I buy a decent product from a person who gives their background - which has nothing to do with marketing. Next thing you know, they're endorsing the best offline product they've ever seen! That would be like me endorsing a new piece of CAD software.

By the way, offline marketers - I believe the best sources for free marketing information for offline consulting is Michael Senoff's http://www.hardtofindseminars.com. You can get the equivalent of an MBA in small business marketing. No affiliate links here but if you're serious about offline marketing, do yourself a favor and check it out. I bought his HMA system 6 years ago and used it to start my marketing consulting business (back when it was called marketing consulting, not offline!)

[ 1 ] Thanks
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Qamar

13 years ago

Originally Posted by PaulFL

By the way, offline marketers - I believe the best sources for free marketing information for offline consulting is Michael Senoff's http://www.hardtodindseminars.com. You can get the equivalent of an MBA in small business marketing. No affiliate links here but if you're serious about offline marketing, do yourself a favor and check it out. I bought his HMA system 6 years ago and used it to start my marketing consulting business (back when it was called marketing consulting, not offline!)

Hey Paul thanks a lot for this link.
I found it very informative. Right now I am listening to Ari Galper and this guy have been teaching successful cold calling method that generally went against most methods show here.
Great share!

Qamar

Thanks
1 reply

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PaulFL

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Qamar

Hey Paul thanks a lot for this link.
I found it very informative. Right now I am listening to Ari Galper and this guy have been teaching successful cold calling method that generally went against most methods show here.
Great share!

Qamar

You're welcome Qamar. The Ari Galper interview is excellent. He also has an interview from a guy from Sandler Sales on cold-calling that is very good.

Michael Senoff is a great interviewer and has a way of pulling great information from the people he's interviewing. He interviewed me for the incentive programs I was selling and I can tell you he was pretty thorough in getting me to open up on the topic.

Thanks

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Well thanks for your input Max!

Im glad my something motivated you to post, it seems you are having some great results.

To be honest, the more you say this thread is a pre-sell, the more people will be interested in finding out what it is im selling...(thanks).... so if you just stayed on topic then we wouldn't be having this issue.

My first post provides a valuable outline to a meeting, and i given my results from this structure.

By the fact that you said "hypnotic mumbo-jumbo" just makes you sound a tad uneducated....
Stage hypnotists, illusionists, mentalists, hypnotherapists, mental therapists, and pro salesmen use the powers of language to come across as more convincing and authoritative.
You say you just "speak with authority"... well you havent exactly explained what that means.

There are thousands of books on the art of suggestion, the power of persuasion, and NLP, So maybe the reason your so closed minded is because you DONT HAVE A CLUE.

Maybe you should slow down on the drinks and really think about what your saying.

Jeez, this is why i hate the warrior forum! Why cant people keep their negative attitudes to themselves!

And lets talk about providing content for one minute...

"Next step is to make the first contact. Use whatever means are available to you" -

first of all, what the hell does that mean, and secondly, you just carried on babbling about what NOT to do......... not very helpful to be honest.

"Closing is the easy part. Clients that are ready to buy will close themselves....PERIOD!"

Another gem of wisdom........ just brilliant (sarcasm)

What you say is the opposite of helping, you are providing bad information in a negative way....... stop it, its not good for anyone.

If you want to post your methods, then start your own thread!

ahhh!!

Thanks
1 reply

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Max Shakhbazov

13 years ago

Listen, attack me all you want....I'm just saying that I've heard it all before. Trust me, I've been around the block. You just come across as full of #@* and I don't want ready-to-trust Warriors to jump on your bandwagon because I don't believe, based on your language, how much real info you're withholding, and your inability to provide empirical proof, that you'd be able to help these people with your product.

Straight up...you sound like a bull#$!tter...and I've heard MANY of them.

Have a good day.

[ 1 ] Thanks
2 replies

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Max Shakhbazov

Listen, attack me all you want....I'm just saying that I've heard it all before. Trust me, I've been around the block. You just come across as full of #@* and I don't want ready-to-trust Warriors to jump on your bandwagon because I don't believe, based on your language, how much real info you're withholding, and your inability to provide empirical proof, that you'd be able to help these people with your product.

Straight up...you sound like a bull#$!tter...and I've heard MANY of them.

Have a good day.

listen man... You sound like your the one attacking... I dont know if your in a foul mood or what, but seriously, control your attitude.
You wont get far in life with this attitude!

The fact that you have labeled me a bullsh**er, and YOU DONT EVEN KNOW ME... makes you a complete cynic. How can you say that about me by reading one thread....

and also, This thread was NEVER promotion for my product... SO I DONT NEED TO PROVIDE ANY PROOF.

I am just saying how this plan has given me these results.... I dont care if you believe them or not...maybe open your mind a fraction and realise that YOU are being the A**HOLE around here....

Thanks
2 replies

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sethdrebitko 13 years ago

Impressive close rate! Congratulations.
- Thanks
- 1 reply
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- Joshua Morris 13 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by sethdrebitko
  
  Impressive close rate! Congratulations.
  
  Thanks...
  
  Thanks
  
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Max Shakhbazov

13 years ago

You're funny, and disturbingly defensive for someone who has supposedly achieved a level of success that so many others are yearning for.

In an effort to avoid a pissing match, which I'm not interested in at all.... tell all of these kind people how you went about capturing your 15 leads within a month's period, in order to sell 13 of them.

Unlike you, I provided an actual strategy for finding leads...never once purported to show people how to approach them. Although, if you'd like (and I'm sure you would), I would be more than happy to share exactly how I go about contacting these leads in the first place. I have many lead generation strategies I use on a daily basis, and ALL of them work because I've tested them vigorously.

So, let us all hear...how do you find leads, and what do you do to initiate contact with them? Please spare us the cliches, as your original post was chock full of them.

Thanks!

Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by benjaedging

This is a huge success man,

What products have you offered ?

I offer SEO, PPC services, and web design. I outsource 99% of the work at odesk and private outsourcers.

If I see the client is lacking in social marketing, email marketing or any other types of online marketing, I will see if they are interested in those as well.
These tasks are all easily outsources, so its not hard for me to offer them.

I never offer anything without finding out what they want and need first though, then my offer is extremely compelling becuase its based on what they want.

Originally Posted by Max Shakhbazov

You're funny, and disturbingly defensive for someone who has supposedly achieved a level of success that so many others are yearning for.

In an effort to avoid a pissing match, which I'm not interested in at all.... tell all of these kind people how you went about capturing your 15 leads within a month's period, in order to sell 13 of them.

Unlike you, I provided an actual strategy for finding leads...never once purported to show people how to approach them. Although, if you'd like (and I'm sure you would), I would be more than happy to share exactly how I go about contacting these leads in the first place. I have many lead generation strategies I use on a daily basis, and ALL of them work because I've tested them vigorously.

So, let us all hear...how do you find leads, and what do you do to initiate contact with them? Please spare us the cliches, as your original post was chock full of them.

Thanks!

Why shouldnt I be defensive, I was called a BullSh**er by a complete stranger today...! Jeez!

The way I found my leads was a simple google search, something like "accountant in london", it helps if your more targeted to a very local area.

Then I go over to page 2 or 3, or onwards, and look through websites.

All of these sites are potential customers, because they are not on the front page........ they clearly need some help!

Then I cold call! (Which I think i mentioned earlier). That is my method....

I have posted another thread where I talk about the biggest problems I faced during my cold call - you can go have a look if you want. http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...solutions.html

I hope that answers your pressing questions!

Thanks
2 replies

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Max Shakhbazov 13 years ago

Actually, most businesses that are not on the front page of search results are in that position for a reason, and it's not because they're completely oblivious to the benefits that a search-optimized site can produce.

How many other SEO providers do you think adopt the same strategy as you, selling the same services? When you're talking to Warriors who don't have a track record of success, a strategy like this makes it nearly impossible for them to compete. It's been done over and over again, and these businesses have heard the pitch....they know the game.

Most traditional practices like accountants, lawyers, etc. are built from a steady base of referral clients and word of mouth. SEO and PPC have NOTHING to do with this. In fact, SEO and PPC are not valuable investments to these types of clients, and it's not a viable entryway to trust.

Bottom line, you're giving false expectations to people here.

Like I said, I've been around the block...I work with successful, legitimate businesses everyday, and I didn't achieve this union with them by scouring the search results from the 2nd pages and on, hoping somebody will bite. Again....you don't think other SEO/PPC providers do the same thing? A little late to be jumping on that bandwagon, don't you think?

I stand by my original instinct....you haven't achieved the level of success you claim, and as such, don't venture to say you can help others achieve that, through the use of your "product."

If you're actually closing sales to these businesses, you'll realize that it takes much more than hypnotic persuasion, NLP, or any other tactics. You need real world experience.
- Thanks
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MrSDPromo 13 years ago

Do you have a cold call script you could share with us? I am having difficulties in landing appointments! Ouch
- Thanks
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John Durham

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Max Shakhbazov

Listen, attack me all you want....I'm just saying that I've heard it all before. Trust me, I've been around the block. You just come across as full of #@* and I don't want ready-to-trust Warriors to jump on your bandwagon because I don't believe, based on your language, how much real info you're withholding, and your inability to provide empirical proof, that you'd be able to help these people with your product.

Straight up...you sound like a bull#$!tter...and I've heard MANY of them.

Have a good day.

I dont believe (based on language) that he ever even made ONE sale personally. BTW "Hi max". Glad Im not the only one around here who isnt professional fanboy! Our breed gets rarer in the offline forum every day to my observation. So many super robotic systems and magic motherlode secrets ... spread by internet opportunists who can write a whole book on prospecting in the first person, having never actually prospected, or even "shaved" in some cases... but its okay, because they are only transparent to people who know better and have already been to the OFFLINE sales rodeo... although in this case... you wouldnt have to have been to the rodeo if you had any sense to see it coming.

The sad part is that you could really pull a thread off like this if you had actually been just a little more covert and less obvious. Yes I know something about online sales too.... learned it "OFFLINE".

Sales is sales, and an old pro can see Bull**** coming from a mile away. I passed this thread up days ago because it was too deep to even deserve a response in here, but Max brought me out of the shadows on it.

Of course, "I", presenting myself as a skeptic here on this issue, being so obviously a pre launch that it has riled up the (rightful) righteous indignation of other warriors...could ALSO be creating a mini covert set up (playing devils advocate) to lump myself in with the ole pro's like Max, and have people saying "he makes down to earth common sense... the good ole 'country' kind...", covertly gaining credibility myself in this thread... and thus getting someone to buy my reports...

AHA!

One could make a sale from this thread with the right angle of "anti fan boy" response that would endear and oblige those in disagreement with the OP's mannerism.

Whether you are right wing or left.... there is a group that buys you. If more people got that then they would be selling themselves instead of trying to buy everybody elses views. Someone buys you. In fact someone buys drummerboy here... probably a bunch of people.

You are either selling or buying 90% of the time. Selling your view, or buying someone elses.

There's a sale for everyone.

There are people who will buy just because you say "balls"... and some who wont for the same reason. There are others who will buy just because you have a bible scripture on your website... and some who wont for the same reason.

There are women who will date you "just because you have a tattoo", or "just because you play guitar", or "just because you have long hair"...

Markets. Demographics.

Cant get a date? Put a spike in your lip and paint your fingernails black - There is a market of women who will be attracted to you for NO OTHER REASON than the fact that you put a spike in your lip and paint your fingernails black - Pick a market and appeal to it.

We are talking demographics and sales here... follow me.

Lots of angles, lots of ways to appeal... Lots of people to appeal to, even for drummer boy if he can get through the next one without a bust.

Marketing is marketing, and bull**** is , well all over this thread.

I gotta get outta here.

I know so much about sales that I scare me.... seriously sometimes I run from the mirror because Im afraid Im gonna sell myself something! lol

Ps. If you think this post is irrelevant, thats just because you arent buying me, but its okay, because someone else is.

They are even buying me MORE now, because I just gave them recognition for recognizing, even though I only called them "someone else", and they are buying me for that, though now they wont because they now see that I recognized that they were about to buy and they saw me capitalize on it too overtly like our friend the OP here

, so now that sale is gone, but if you "get" this post, dont worry you dont have to buy anything. Much love, much love.

The "OP" gets this post, just like Max got HIM... just like "I" got Max...

Someone else is saying "Why are they picking on that poor drummer boy" and that person is buying what he is selling, which is now the idea that he isnt selling anything. Hey, "I'll buy it" for sure now! lol.

Note: Even as I use the word "they" (as in; "are picking on drummer05...") , I classify myself with a "group" or "side"... and create an "us" and "Them" scenario with my words... Can you see this manipulation?

OR....I could play "dumb" and say "Why is everyone picking on drummer boy", and classify myself in the minds of readers as a person who cant understand why everyone is so mean... endearing some in the process... and projecting the image of one with a heart so pure he cant understand why some pick on others...

It gets deep.

Dont hate me for understanding these things... its called EXPERIENCE.

Thats why ole pro's rock, because they have seen all this before/Hint: you should buy from me because Im lumping myself in with the ole pro's - WAIT! No you shouldnt buy from me because Im an ole pro, and Im not up with the new trends...!! (See how this works?)

In any event, Im with Max. Callin the BS on this one. To the OP, sorry to hijack, but you need to smooth out your transition some if you want to do something like you are endeavoring to here.

Of course, now that the cover has been blown, plausible deniability is an option. In fact you could even use it to make "us" (note quotes) look like jerks and endear some sales... There's a new plan... yes there is always a silver lining if you are much much sharper than this attempt reveals.

Advice borrowed and paraphrased from Paul Myers: (Ooooohhhh... He's quoting Paul Myers.... he must know alot, or have big associations) :rolleyes:.

Not quoting, but here is an example of a principle he teaches:

I always ignore emails from overseas buyers who dont ask industry specific questions about my offers... because I know they cant be serious players. If someone says "I saw your products I want to buy" and they dont know the industry language... then I know they arent a regular buyer of my type of product.

Likewise:

You are selling sales tactics to salesman here, and they can tell you arent one. Thats the mistake in this attempt. Were it not for Max, others like myself may have just ignored it because it wasnt worth a response... but good thing , now it has turned into a lesson for everyone who reads... especially the OP, who undoubtedly will have a much brighter future at launching WSO's as a result.

In short; "if you are going to pretend to be a martial artist, dont do it in a room full of karate experts".

BUT, dont take it from me, I might just be posing , or grouping myself as an expert by merely making the suggestion and dispensing the advice.

Word to the wise.

[ 3 ] Thanks
1 reply

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superrooster

13 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

I dont believe (based on language) that he ever even made ONE sale personally. BTW "Hi max". Glad Im not the only one around here who isnt professional fanboy! Our breed gets rarer in the offline forum every day to my observation. So many super robotic systems and magic motherlode secrets ... spread by internet opportunists who can write a whole book on prospecting in the first person, having never actually prospected, or even "shaved" in some cases... but its okay, because they are only transparent to people who know better and have already been to the OFFLINE sales rodeo... although in this case... you wouldnt have to have been to the rodeo if you had any sense to see it coming.

The sad part is that you could really pull a thread off like this if you had actually been just a little more covert and less obvious. Yes I know something about online sales too.... learned it "OFFLINE".

Sales is sales, and an old pro can see Bull**** coming from a mile away. I passed this thread up days ago because it was too deep to even deserve a response in here, but Max brought me out of the shadows on it.

Of course, "I", presenting myself as a skeptic here on this issue, being so obviously a pre launch that it has riled up the (rightful) righteous indignation of other warriors...could ALSO be creating a mini covert set up (playing devils advocate) to lump myself in with the ole pro's like Max, and have people saying "he makes down to earth common sense... the good ole 'country' kind...", covertly gaining credibility myself in this thread... and thus getting someone to buy my reports...

AHA!

One could make a sale from this thread with the right angle of "anti fan boy" response that would endear and oblige those in disagreement with the OP's mannerism.

Whether you are right wing or left.... there is a group that buys you. If more people got that then they would be selling themselves instead of trying to buy everybody elses views. Someone buys you. In fact someone buys drummerboy here... probably a bunch of people.

You are either selling or buying 90% of the time. Selling your view, or buying someone elses.

There's a sale for everyone.

There are people who will buy just because you say "balls"... and some who wont for the same reason. There are others who will buy just because you have a bible scripture on your website... and some who wont for the same reason.

There are women who will date you "just because you have a tattoo", or "just because you play guitar", or "just because you have long hair"...

Markets. Demographics.

Cant get a date? Put a spike in your lip and paint your fingernails black - There is a market of women who will be attracted to you for NO OTHER REASON than the fact that you put a spike in your lip and paint your fingernails black - Pick a market and appeal to it.

We are talking demographics and sales here... follow me.

Lots of angles, lots of ways to appeal... Lots of people to appeal to, even for drummer boy if he can get through the next one without a bust.

Marketing is marketing, and bull**** is , well all over this thread.

I gotta get outta here.

I know so much about sales that I scare me.... seriously sometimes I run from the mirror because Im afraid Im gonna sell myself something! lol

Ps. If you think this post is irrelevant, thats just because you arent buying me, but its okay, because someone else is.

They are even buying me MORE now, because I just gave them recognition for recognizing, even though I only called them "someone else", and they are buying me for that, though now they wont because they now see that I recognized that they were about to buy and they saw me capitalize on it too overtly like our friend the OP here

, so now that sale is gone, but if you "get" this post, dont worry you dont have to buy anything. Much love, much love.

The "OP" gets this post, just like Max got HIM... just like "I" got Max...

Someone else is saying "Why are they picking on that poor drummer boy" and that person is buying what he is selling, which is now the idea that he isnt selling anything. Hey, "I'll buy it" for sure now! lol.

Note: Even as I use the word "they" (as in; "are picking on drummer05...") , I classify myself with a "group" or "side"... and create an "us" and "Them" scenario with my words... Can you see this manipulation?

OR....I could play "dumb" and say "Why is everyone picking on drummer boy", and classify myself in the minds of readers as a person who cant understand why everyone is so mean... endearing some in the process... and projecting the image of one with a heart so pure he cant understand why some pick on others...

It gets deep.

Dont hate me for understanding these things... its called EXPERIENCE.

Thats why ole pro's rock, because they have seen all this before/Hint: you should buy from me because Im lumping myself in with the ole pro's - WAIT! No you shouldnt buy from me because Im an ole pro, and Im not up with the new trends...!! (See how this works?)

In any event, Im with Max. Callin the BS on this one. To the OP, sorry to hijack, but you need to smooth out your transition some if you want to do something like you are endeavoring to here.

Of course, now that the cover has been blown, plausible deniability is an option. In fact you could even use it to make "us" (note quotes) look like jerks and endear some sales... There's a new plan... yes there is always a silver lining if you are much much sharper than this attempt reveals.

Advice borrowed and paraphrased from Paul Myers: (Ooooohhhh... He's quoting Paul Myers.... he must know alot, or have big associations) :rolleyes:.

Not quoting, but here is an example of a principle he teaches:

I always ignore emails from overseas buyers who dont ask industry specific questions about my offers... because I know they cant be serious players. If someone says "I saw your products I want to buy" and they dont know the industry language... then I know they arent a regular buyer of my type of product.

Likewise:

You are selling sales tactics to salesman here, and they can tell you arent one. Thats the mistake in this attempt. Were it not for Max, others like myself may have just ignored it because it wasnt worth a response... but good thing , now it has turned into a lesson for everyone who reads... especially the OP, who undoubtedly will have a much brighter future at launching WSO's as a result.

In short; "if you are going to pretend to be a martial artist, dont do it in a room full of karate experts".

BUT, dont take it from me, I might just be posing , or grouping myself as an expert by merely making the suggestion and dispensing the advice.

Word to the wise.

This is awesome! This response is probably worth a few K in lessons.

Thanks

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WillST

13 years ago

Wow, this has turned interesting.

Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris 13 years ago

Originally Posted by JSTEF

Wow, this has turned interesting.

haaha

right!!
- Thanks
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benjaedging

13 years ago

This is a huge success man,

What products have you offered ?

Thanks

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Wow, I love how everyone suddenly knows me already, from just afew posts

its great!

But seriosly though, im not a "old sales pro", im 21 years old, and started doing offline marketing when i was 19...

everything that I have learned, i have picked up in the last year......

I have had a hobby of persuasion and suggestsion techniques from my magic hobbies, I was learning to be a hypnotist and mentalist like derren brown. Most of the techniques i learned were very useful when selling to offline clients.

Im not giving anyone false expectations, I have just said what "I DID", and that it worked for me..........

obviosly there is alot more too it, but with the outline in the original post, many people can improve thier meetings straight away.

I love how the "old sales pros" think that they know everything as well........... we dont care how much you have been through, and how much "real world" experience you have had...

The fact is..... I found 58 businesses from the google results, called them all up, got through to about 30, setup about 15 meetings, and closed 13 of them!

I didnt think I had to put an "earnings disclaimer" on my thread.....

Let me tell you how it is...
I am not selling anything to anyone, (unless i create a WSO) I am not a sales pro, I am a person with no experience that has had to learn in order to survive..........

I love making money online, and I had to start with offline SEM business because wanted quick money, and i needed a way to start without any risks....

now Im moving away from SEM consulting, but I would love to teach others what I have learned.

Back to my original post..

Usually my meetings went like this.
Go in,
Ask questions
Try to sell something.

or,
Go in
tell them what i am selling
see what they need.

or
Tell them what i am selling
ask them what they wanted
etc..

So based off of these bad experiences, I realised I was doing ALOT wrong...... hence I had to learn the ways of the real "sales pros", and i found myself becoming alot better, much faster.

Add that to my interest in NLP, hypnotic and mentalist techniques, and I put togethor a system that really works for me.

There is nothing deeper going on here...... this is not a presell to any product.... I just though my OP would GENUINLY HELP others improve thier meetings.

If you dont like it, then please give some real advice on how I can improve these tactics, or tell everyone how you would do it instead.

Thanks
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John Durham

13 years ago

Originally Posted by drummer05

I love how the "old sales pros" think that they know everything as well........... we dont care how much you have been through, and how much "real world" experience you have had...

Great, you will go far then. Having a love for the old pro's and their experience will take you places. I just read "Marlon Sanders" latest report this morning.... He's a dinosaur, in IM, but he has better advice than someone who just made 5 sales last month for sure.... I mean, that only makes sense.

Again, its good that you respect old pro's. Even old pro's have other old pro's they respect, and thats how they get to be like them, while others fall off the charts every year.

Experience should be honored. I agree. I love how the old pro's operate, and Im glad you do to, that will take you somewhere.

That being said... How do we know these numbers arent accurate?

We just do, and when you are us you will know how. At 21 you got a little road ahead of you to get that perceptive "SORRY" but its just true.

Originally Posted by drummer05

The fact is..... I found 58 businesses from the google results, called them all up, got through to about 30, setup about 15 meetings, and closed 13 of them!

I didnt think I had to put an "earnings disclaimer" on my thread.....

I still dont buy it, but okay.

Not hating, just seriously you are talking to people who KNOW numbers.

You dont NEED me to buy it though, so no big deal right?

"We" , like you, are just expressing our authenticity.

Some of the people reading this are pretty experienced, and pretty passionate about sales...and they know what they are reading.

In any event,

None of my biz. Just wanted to chime in with Max.

If Im wrong I apologize, but if Im not, then you are spreading false information that isnt thoroughly tested... and that harms newbies, so Im glad I posted. Im sure you will stick by your story.... Great.

Still dont buy it. Someone sticking by their story with apparent conviction doesnt make it true.

Lastly,

Most anyone else who is smart enough to read through this kind of stuff just ignores it and starves it for energy until it fizzles out.... Hence I will follow suit in this thread, and I would be shocked if you didnt too.

Again, Bravo on the attitude....about the old pro's.

It just makes sense that a person who has been down more roads, and repeated the actions and processes more times... has a more intimate knowledge of how they work and has observed them working or "not" over more fads and more situations and circumstances... and would have more intimate knowledge.

Listening to experience will save you alot of reinventing the wheel and banging your head against the Wall... Thats why I invested in Marlon this morning.

Sure new things pop up everyday... The reason they are able to keep popping up is because the basic underlying principles that drive everything NEVER change.

Personally , old pro or not, Im still growing and going to make more money next year than I did this one, by listening to an OLD PRO...

There is something to be said for getting better with time...

Good luck on your ventures.

Originally Posted by drummer05

If you dont like it, then please give some real advice on how I can improve these tactics, or tell everyone how you would do it instead.

I dont have to change everything I dont like. Just identify it and stay away from it. You learn that in the twenty one years between my age and yours.

How would I do it?

The way I "did" and "do" and "teach".

How should you improve it?

Use real numbers.

Thanks

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dancorkill 13 years ago

Nice one mate you are crushing it.

If you haven't already I would suggest reading SPIN selling. It's basically what your already doing but may help understand more of why it works.

SPIN
Situation ( questions )
Problem ( questions )
Implication ( questions )
Need-payoff ( questions )

SPIN selling summary

The book isn't just someones guess on what works it's based on research of over 35,000 sales calls. It points out why techniques to sell low value items do not work for high value sales like marketing services.
- Thanks
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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Alright, my quip about the "old pros" wasnt fair......... your right, everything I have learned has been taught by sales pros, so I have alot of respect for the older generation of sales people.

In fact everything that I have learned comes from more experienced and more knowledgeable sales people, and I owe everything that I have to these people.

I try to get about 15 meetings a month......and this was my best month... these numbers are real!!! lol.. but however much i say that it sound like im sticking to my story "with conviction"........ i guess i cant win here.

Usually I close about 7 sales a month from 15 meetings, and it would take about 35-40 successful calls (calls that I get through to a business owner) to get those 15 meetings.

I dont know if these numbers "make sense"... to you, but these are the numbers that I have managed to attain..

John I am pm'ing you, I want to ask you something privately!

Thanks
1 reply

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John Durham 13 years ago

Originally Posted by drummer05

! lol.. but however much i say that it sound like im sticking to my story "with conviction"........ i guess i cant win here.

Thats sales experience... hit you with a pre objection stopper and locked you down lol. Good call. There other pre objection stoppers Im sure in there but they havent come up.... I can do this habitually now. Its all from learning telemarketing and saying hello to 100 people per hour for months on end, then watching over others doing it for years... The numbers are like clock work, certain actions create certain outcomes in certain circumstances... but they never change. Its just that you have to have seen that circumstance 100 or more times before you begin naturally seeing it coming. You are learning its nature, but it isnt new, once you learn it, and "own" it, you see it never changes.

There is a difference between "knowing" and "owning", but thats another subject.

So for instance, on pre objection stoppers:

"If you know a persons objections ahead of time, given a certain pitch, personality type, circumstance (certain elements)..., then stop them before they come out", they will lose about 90% of their strength.

Over hundreds of calls in your niche you begin to understand the common questions and selling becomes more natural because you address every objection at the pass and create optimism surrounding the subject before the objection you know is coming even had a chance to really form in the mind of the customer. In a sense, you know what they are about to think before they do.

So there was a quick lesson on the importance of pre objection stoppers...

This is basic I know, but worth putting into a post somewhere. Now back to the subject.

About your claims...

I believe you can make 15 sales in a month easy, but hearing out of 58 cold calls is is a red flag. Perhaps you arent remebering the numbers correctly. I have seen it done with incoming inquiries and even more amazing things... but with cold calls? Never. Again, this is coming from someone who has watched literally probably a million numbers go by his desk... and watched in real time how calls from different people, pitches, lists and personality types convert, as well as different types of sales, ticket prices, offers...

There's a first time for everything though...

Will answer email Monday. This here is creative fun, not work. Im taking the weekend off. So if I dont respond till monday...you know Im not ignoring.
- Thanks
- 1 reply
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- dericks3 13 years ago
  
  You got 15 meeting out of 30 people you got in touch with?
  
  Man I better fire all my appointment setters,lol.
  
  And I have been doing this 20 plus years....
  
  Thanks
  
  1 reply
  
  Signature
  
  Appointment Setting Services With 20 Years In Telemarketing...Very Affordable Rates....
  Guaranteed Results...Pm Me For Details
  
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  Joshua Morris 13 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by dericks3
  
  You got 15 meeting out of 30 people you got in touch with?
  
  Man I better fire all my appointment setters,lol.
  
  And I have been doing this 20 plus years....
  
  It was a good week
  
  Usually i go for 30-50 calls in a week, and I try for 10 appointments... of which i expect to close 5!
  
  I had a very good month!
  
  I usually get a third of my successful calls to turn into meetings.....
  I dont let them go until they get a meeting..
  Im stubborn!!
  
  Thanks
  
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John Durham

13 years ago

Cough...... Bull****.... Did I say that?

Thanks
1 reply

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Deidra Renee 13 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

Cough...... Bull****.... Did I say that?

Mr Durham...I PM'd you about a problem I'm having with the telemarketing forum a few days ago...
- Thanks
- 1 reply
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- John Durham 13 years ago
  
  Sorry Deidra, you KNOW I would answer you if I saw your email.... Will check again.
  
  ps. Are you bein a squeaky wheel? lol
  
  Thanks
  
  1 reply
  
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  Deidra Renee 13 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by John Durham
  
  Sorry Deidra, you KNOW I would answer you if I saw your email.... Will check again.
  
  ps. Are you bein a squeaky wheel? lol
  
  actually I am..and you can ship me the mean cat lol
  
  [ 1 ] Thanks
  
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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

john has become all high and mighty.... and thinks he is the only telemarketer in the room....

Look john, I dont get results like this every week.... and its way off the chart with my numbers as well... but there is no need to call me a bullshi*er....

edit: looking around at johns posts and wso's i can see that he is the biggest baby i have every seen.... way too full of himself, and not ready to give out any VALUABLE content, and then take critisim where it is due!
Im not stating this to start an argument... just seeing what is really obvios.

So call me a bullshi*er..... coming from a self obsessed crybaby it dousnt really mean anything!

Oh and i got your "report".... haha, if I could call it that........ im just glad a friend sent it to me and i didnt have to waste my money!
maybe the reason your getting such a crap response rate is because you are using THIS opening..

“Hi Bob? This is ____________ I am a new web designer in town, I just recently opened for business …
Real quickly Bob, I’m just calling around, trying to let folks know about our service, and hopefully drum up some interest … I was wondering if you folks already had a website for your company, or had maybe given any thought to doing any web projects in the future”?

seriosly??? If I was using that opening, i could expect maybe 1 meeting out of 50+ calls!!!! What a waste of time.

(This was after wading through 17 pages of FLUFF first)

Also, this is golden... Im quoting YOU now..

"If there is not interest move on, if there is interest then pitch them."

This is so stupid..... if there is no intrest... ITS BECAUSE YOU ARE COLD CALLING.... not because they dont NEED your services...

They DO need it, and they WILL buy from someone.......... why are you flaking out so easy john...

Oh, and then you say in your e-book to offer a free report????!!!
"I’d love to do a free diagnostic
check up on that for you, and send you a performance report … what’s your email?

Is that honestly how you conduct your cold calls............ by offering a FREE REPORT!!!... 99% of businesses will never get back to you if you do that!!

In fact 80% of your answers to rebuttels and other problems are "Let em go, they are not worth it"..

I mean jeez, think of all that business you lost out...

I feel sorry for you john........ you are really not doing it right!!!

And i dont care how long you have been in the business....... i have been doing it for 1 year and I have learned from the best.......(and that is certainly not you)

I finished reading your e-book....... if I was going to follow 90% of the advice in here, i would lose 90% of my sales overnight..

omg... shock, you say your price over the phone........!!!!!!!!!!!!! ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

If this is really your out come
"13 - Total hours worked $400 earned $20 - est. phone bill based on mix of chargeable minutes and using free minutes on mobile and landline Hourly earnings $29.23"

Then why dont you just get a real job!!!!!!!!

I though doing internet marketing was meant to mean that we are FREE!!!!!....

finished reading your report...... had to skim through most of the fluff.... but honestly, after reading this, your opinion is NO LONGER VALID..

Say what you want about my results, or about telemarketing in general........but after reading all of that crap, i realised that anything you say is just based on your terrible experience, and your egocentric, self involved attitude

Thanks
1 reply

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Deidra Renee

13 years ago

Originally Posted by drummer05

john has become all high and mighty.... and thinks he is the only telemarketer in the room....

Look john, I dont get results like this every week.... and its way off the chart with my numbers as well... but there is no need to call me a bullshi*er....

edit: looking around at johns posts and wso's i can see that he is the biggest baby i have every seen.... way too full of himself, and not ready to give out any VALUABLE content, and then take critisim where it is due!
Im not stating this to start an argument... just seeing what is really obvios.

So call me a bullshi*er..... coming from a self obsessed crybaby it dousnt really mean anything!

Oh and i got your "report".... haha, if I could call it that........ im just glad a friend sent it to me and i didnt have to waste my money!
maybe the reason your getting such a crap response rate is because you are using THIS opening..

"Hi Bob? This is ____________ I am a new web designer in town, I just recently opened for business ...
Real quickly Bob, I'm just calling around, trying to let folks know about our service, and hopefully drum up some interest ... I was wondering if you folks already had a website for your company, or had maybe given any thought to doing any web projects in the future"?

seriosly??? If I was using that opening, i could expect maybe 1 meeting out of 50+ calls!!!! What a waste of time.

(This was after wading through 17 pages of FLUFF first)

Also, this is golden... Im quoting YOU now..

"If there is not interest move on, if there is interest then pitch them."

This is so stupid..... if there is no intrest... ITS BECAUSE YOU ARE COLD CALLING.... not because they dont NEED your services...

They DO need it, and they WILL buy from someone.......... why are you flaking out so easy john...

Oh, and then you say in your e-book to offer a free report????!!!
"I'd love to do a free diagnostic
check up on that for you, and send you a performance report ... what's your email?

Is that honestly how you conduct your cold calls............ by offering a FREE REPORT!!!... 99% of businesses will never get back to you if you do that!!

In fact 80% of your answers to rebuttels and other problems are "Let em go, they are not worth it"..

I mean jeez, think of all that business you lost out...

I feel sorry for you john........ you are really not doing it right!!!

And i dont care how long you have been in the business....... i have been doing it for 1 year and I have learned from the best.......(and that is certainly not you)

I finished reading your e-book....... if I was going to follow 90% of the advice in here, i would lose 90% of my sales overnight..

omg... shock, you say your price over the phone........!!!!!!!!!!!!! ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

If this is really your out come
"13 - Total hours worked $400 earned $20 - est. phone bill based on mix of chargeable minutes and using free minutes on mobile and landline Hourly earnings $29.23"

Then why dont you just get a real job!!!!!!!!

I though doing internet marketing was meant to mean that we are FREE!!!!!....

finished reading your report...... had to skim through most of the fluff.... but honestly, after reading this, your opinion is NO LONGER VALID..

Say what you want about my results, or about telemarketing in general........but after reading all of that crap, i realised that anything you say is just based on your terrible experience, and your egocentric, self involved attitude

WOW!!! This literally has me laughing out loud..if you really looked at John's other posts you would see that he probably gives out more FREE information than he sells and people actually come back to his threads and say that they've made money. And he has a telemarketing FORUM, so how is he not doing it right? lol But anyway, you are about to come out with a wso correct? How would you like it if someone went out and bought your report, gave out a free copy, and then the person that received it for free came back and told everyone exactly what it has in it for FREE? The reason you SELL something is to make money..that's not right for you to go and tell everyone what his reports say. Whether I like someone's report or not, I would NEVER say word for word what's in it..now if it sucks, I would just tell ppl so they won't waste their money and move on..but for you to tell people what's in his report is just a mess lol I don't think your wso sells will be too great..but hopefully I can bum a free copy off someone and just freely give it away later

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Deidra Renee

WOW!!! This literally has me laughing out loud..if you really looked at John's other posts you would see that he probably gives out more FREE information than he sells and people actually come back to his threads and say that they've made money. And he has a telemarketing FORUM, so how is he not doing it right? lol But anyway, you are about to come out with a wso correct? How would you like it if someone went out and bought your report, gave out a free copy, and then the person that received it for free came back and told everyone exactly what it has in it for FREE? The reason you SELL something is to make money..that's not right for you to go and tell everyone what his reports say. Whether I like someone's report or not, I would NEVER say word for word what's in it..now if it sucks, I would just tell ppl so they won't waste their money and move on..but for you to tell people what's in his report is just a mess lol I don't think your wso sells will be too great..but hopefully I can bum a free copy off someone and just freely give it away later

im sure he did help people... thats great. and to be honest i was pissed off at what john was getting at the entire time....

I didnt give away too much in the report, at least not anything that anyone could have figured out on thier own or just guessed... because i guess that is what john has been doing the whole time.

I just hope my comments spared some peoples time and effort, so they could go and find out how to cold call from someone who knows what they are talking about...

Who the hell wants to make 100 cold calls before they get a meeting...... i know I didnt, but thats what i managed to do before i learned how to cold call properly, and really learnt what works and what doesnt...

all im saying, things in johns report might work.... but you will have to take into account that it will be a "numbers game" with those methods...

he turns down so many clients just because they were reluctant on a cold call.... what a waste of business.

TBH i just lost respect for john after I had seen his report, i would have been just as happy to come here and apologise, saying "i read your report, it was very enlightining, and i realise that you are truly a cold calling master, and you are very knowlagable"........ i just honestly cant say that stuff...

and yeah, setting up a forum makes you an expert... i suppose im an expert in DIY, fast cars, mobile phones, and several other niches...

jeez!

Thanks

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John Durham

13 years ago

Didnt call you a bull****ter... I was referring to the **** itself. But yeah there is a reason... and its not because Im all high and mighty... I wasnt the only telemarketer in a room with 100 others... I was just the best and most proficient- by loooong shot, not a narrow margin...and probably still am. Its okay to know your ability and own your knowledge, and its also okay if others are offended by your confidence in what you say.

Not being arrogant, just addressing your comments with my authenticity. If you read the LARGE body of my posts and not just a little out of context here and there, you will see that is much bigger for me than ego... However, on a smaller level I can see how it would appear that. If I could run a four minute mile I would say it, and it wouldnt be arrogant if it was true.

Even if I didnt call you a bull**** , everyone here with sales experience would know you were full of ****.

You say this isnt a pre launch thread, but email me and say you are getting ready to launch a WSO... Thats Bull**** dont you agree?

Ps. Sorry for being real, I dont attack every thread I see, but I happened to run across something that didnt add up....sorry you put it there. Wasnt my fault...As for giving out "valuable" content, did you read the first post of this thread?

Originally Posted by drummer05

obviosly there is alot more too it, but with the outline in the original post, many people can improve thier meetings straight away.

....There is nothing deeper going on here...... this is not a presell to any product.... I just though my OP would GENUINLY HELP others improve thier meetings.

.

Outline?

You are right, thats valuable. I should move out of the way, and not block all the Valuable content you are giving out here.

Originally Posted by drummer05

It was a good week

Usually i go for 30-50 calls in a week, and I try for 10 appointments... of which i expect to close 5!

....

I usually get a third of my successful calls to turn into meetings.....

No comment.

Thanks

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Tim@AffEdge

13 years ago

I'll sidestep the discussion happening about what is truth and just say that Max shared a real gold nugget in his first post.

New businesses are fantastic targets and if you can get a few good places to find them you'll have a never-ending supply of fresh leads.

Thanks
2 replies

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John Durham

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Tim@AffEdge

I'll sidestep the discussion happening about what is truth and just say that Max shared a real gold nugget in his first post.

New businesses are fantastic targets and if you can get a few good places to find them you'll have a never-ending supply of fresh leads.

Nice distinction. Revolutionary. I agree.

Again, there are a million threads here that nobody attacks, but when "we" (look out for quotes like that "we", they can be manipulating, and that lesson will teach you more than this whole thread...) see something that aint right, we attack it like scrubbing bubbles.

I personally get attacked sometimes for appearing arrogant, and maybe even BEING that way a bit at times... But I never get attacked for being full of **** because I only repeat what I know like the back of my hand, and dont make it up as I go along.

Kurt in the Off Topic section knows more about music than anyone, not because he says he does, but because he does... It isnt really arguable. In telemarketing... and offline sales, I have applied myself like kurt has to music for many years... So Im not afraid to state my opinion as fact in this area. It usually is.

As for your quote to Max:

Originally Posted by drummer05

The fact that you have labeled me a bullsh**er, and YOU DONT EVEN KNOW ME... makes you a complete cynic.

No it doesnt.

Thanks

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Tim@AffEdge

I'll sidestep the discussion happening about what is truth and just say that Max shared a real gold nugget in his first post.

New businesses are fantastic targets and if you can get a few good places to find them you'll have a never-ending supply of fresh leads.

This is very true......

Banks are a good place to start..... in most banks they have a "new businesses" team where new businesses have to sign up with a bank account..... if you can work out a deal with the bank where they get a certain commission for every sale that is made....... or you can even do this with an individual working at the bank.....

Also business advisors are great for promoting your services, if you can work out a deal with them... maybe do some free marketing for them or something...

Making deals with accountants and having them offer thier business contancts with your services.......... again, you can make some sort of deal or give them free marketing.

Also web designers are just golden for new marketing opportunities.... making a deal with them usually works better than offering free marketing, but either way, its a great way for finding new clients.

All these methods are for finding HOT leads..... so your calls will actually be referred, and you will have a much higher success rate.

Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

lets get this thread back on track then..

We were talking about finding new places to get clients..... here are some thoughts.

Originally Posted by drummer05

This is very true......

Banks are a good place to start..... in most banks they have a "new businesses" team where new businesses have to sign up with a bank account..... if you can work out a deal with the bank where they get a certain commission for every sale that is made....... or you can even do this with an individual working at the bank.....

Also business advisors are great for promoting your services, if you can work out a deal with them... maybe do some free marketing for them or something...

Making deals with accountants and having them offer thier business contancts with your services.......... again, you can make some sort of deal or give them free marketing.

Also web designers are just golden for new marketing opportunities.... making a deal with them usually works better than offering free marketing, but either way, its a great way for finding new clients.

All these methods are for finding HOT leads..... so your calls will actually be referred, and you will have a much higher success rate.

Thanks
1 reply

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Rocket Media

13 years ago

Originally Posted by drummer05

lets get this thread back on track then..

We were talking about finding new places to get clients..... here are some thoughts.

You're ridiculous man. Every time someone brought to attention how obvious it is that this is a presell or the fact that your appointment setting numbers are outrageously high you just write a super long post bashing that person individually.

It's very obvious that you aren't the all-knowing offline marketer. What is your business name and what is your website?

Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Rocket Media

You're ridiculous man. Every time someone brought to attention how obvious it is that this is a presell or the fact that your appointment setting numbers are outrageously high you just write a super long post bashing that person individually.

It's very obvious that you aren't the all-knowing offline marketer. What is your business name and what is your website?

How is this thread a presell??

I cant post on the forum without it being a presell just cos im bringing out a WSO...

Ill just sell it on clickbank if everyone is gonna be a baby about it!

and noone said my numbers were high....... i agree with that, they are..

its just not buls*** thats all!!

Thanks
1 reply

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Rocket Media

13 years ago

Originally Posted by drummer05

How is this thread a presell??

I cant post on the forum without it being a presell just cos im bringing out a WSO...

Ill just sell it on clickbank if everyone is gonna be a baby about it!

and noone said my numbers were high....... i agree with that, they are..

its just not buls*** thats all!!

Why don't you share your business name/info with us since you are the great master kung fu mr. miyagi of offline marketing?

I'm not saying that for a fact you are BSing your numbers, I'm just saying that that's obviously what seasoned marketers and telemarketers alike are seeing. OBVIOUSLY you are going to receive negativity for claiming ridiculously high numbers that motivate people and then blatantly begin talking about a WSO...

Why do people even sell WSOs? It blows my mind that people are so selfish that they need to sell their methods that have made them great money for a couple hundred bucks... If your method is good enough to be a WSO then it should have already gotten a few clients in which case I would be more inclined to share it for free rather than come up a few hundred bucks.

Thanks
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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Rocket Media

Why don't you share your business name/info with us since you are the great master kung fu mr. miyagi of offline marketing?

I'm not saying that for a fact you are BSing your numbers, I'm just saying that that's obviously what seasoned marketers and telemarketers alike are seeing. OBVIOUSLY you are going to receive negativity for claiming ridiculously high numbers that motivate people and then blatantly begin talking about a WSO...

Why do people even sell WSOs? It blows my mind that people are so selfish that they need to sell their methods that have made them great money for a couple hundred bucks... If your method is good enough to be a WSO then it should have already gotten a few clients in which case I would be more inclined to share it for free rather than come up a few hundred bucks.

i never said I was the great kung fu whatever of offline businesses... I am just someone who has been doing IM for a while, a big part of that was having an offline SEM company....

My name is Josh M, 21, from london, My company is SupremeSEM LTD... I dont know what you mean by my website... i have many... if you want my offline website its supremesem.com

and im getting out of offine business to work with affiliate marketing, e-commerce, and info product creation....

I jst thought i would come here, offer my knowlage on offline marketing that I have built up........ offer a few products to get my name out there and build a subscriber list.... and get going with info product creation from the warrior forum...

Ok... you know what im doing, but that really isnt the point.

I want to help others succeed in the same ways that I have... And im sure when im more successfull in Affiliate marketing, and e-commerce, i will come out with Info products related to those markets as well..

I have always liked bringing out info products ......

" It blows my mind that people are so selfish that they need to sell their methods that have made them great money for a couple hundred bucks"

Are you seriosly saying that helping other achieve thier goals... while at the same time earning a decent living, is selfish...???

I will never sell a crappy WSO... in fact I despise BAD product....... I want to build a customer base of HAPPY CUSTOMERS.... not people who buy crap over and over again....

I actually want to help others succeed!!!!!

Now can we give it a break! I am not making this thread about WSO's... If you want to keep on talking about my WSO, ill ask a mod to delete the thread!!!!

Thanks
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Max Shakhbazov

13 years ago

This thread is beyond entertaining!

Listen, Drummer (Josh)... there's a very simple reason this thread raised my eyebrows (and not in a good way)... Your figures sound like complete sh$%. No doubt about it. Maybe you had a good week, and if that's the case, bravo to you... I still call bull.

The issue lies in the fact that numbers like this, if you had even achieved them once, are not sustainable...especially not to those new to this business that you seem to possess a heart of gold in trying to help. There's nothing wrong with launching an info product, absolutely nothing at all.

In fact, I've sold many in my time. My beef lies in the fact that you're using your statistical anomaly of a successful week (which I still completely doubt), and you pose as if the product you're looking to launch will actually help others achieve those figures.

Beyond that, you attack others relentlessly once attacked, all under the guise that you wish to make this a productive thread?

Listen, I'll start my own thread, and make my own contributions to it. That way, I know that everything being said is true, achievable, and accurate.

---------------------------------

To John Durham:

I respect your hustle and the time that you've put into your work. Nothing in this business is learned simply from conjecture and theory. You know this, and respect the time and toil that it takes to achieve even a moderate level of success.

---------------------------------

Back to my "target".....Drummer, if your "offline" business is so damn successful, what's your exact reason for dumping it and moving into "info product creation, affiliate marketing, blah blah blah"?

You know, I've built my firm up starting with myself and a partner only...doing EVERYTHING. We were smart enough to know that we didn't possess enough throughput to satisfy clients, build the business, and remain profitable consistently. So, what did we do? We built a business. It didn't happen overnight, and it certainly didn't come with any stellar sales weeks like you claim to have. But, it has set us up for the long term. It's allowed myself and my partner to build other businesses, and to develop relationships that provide even more mutually profitable opportunities.

Let me ask you this...let's assume you really did close 13 out of 15 meetings. How do you plan on making each and every one of these campaigns successful? What's your turnaround time on these clients? Didn't you have other client projects running at the same time as you were out hitting a grand slam with your 13-client week? How many employees do you have? Were these projects profitable? How much was outsourced, and how did you go about managing these?

I ask these questions because, from experience, 13 clients in one week is a logistical nightmare, and when the most profitable sales opportunities come from satisfying existing clients and leveraging those experiences for more direct sales and more referrals, I don't see you having much success. You're prompt when responding to attacks on the Warrior Forum, are you as prompt with these 13 clients?

Thanks
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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Max Shakhbazov

This thread is beyond entertaining!

Listen, Drummer (Josh)... there's a very simple reason this thread raised my eyebrows (and not in a good way)... Your figures sound like complete sh$%. No doubt about it. Maybe you had a good week, and if that's the case, bravo to you... I still call bull.

The issue lies in the fact that numbers like this, if you had even achieved them once, are not sustainable...especially not to those new to this business that you seem to possess a heart of gold in trying to help. There's nothing wrong with launching an info product, absolutely nothing at all.

In fact, I've sold many in my time. My beef lies in the fact that you're using your statistical anomaly of a successful week (which I still completely doubt), and you pose as if the product you're looking to launch will actually help others achieve those figures.

Beyond that, you attack others relentlessly once attacked, all under the guise that you wish to make this a productive thread?

Listen, I'll start my own thread, and make my own contributions to it. That way, I know that everything being said is true, achievable, and accurate.

---------------------------------

To John Durham:

I respect your hustle and the time that you've put into your work. Nothing in this business is learned simply from conjecture and theory. You know this, and respect the time and toil that it takes to achieve even a moderate level of success.

---------------------------------

Back to my "target".....Drummer, if your "offline" business is so damn successful, what's your exact reason for dumping it and moving into "info product creation, affiliate marketing, blah blah blah"?

You know, I've built my firm up starting with myself and a partner only...doing EVERYTHING. We were smart enough to know that we didn't possess enough throughput to satisfy clients, build the business, and remain profitable consistently. So, what did we do? We built a business. It didn't happen overnight, and it certainly didn't come with any stellar sales weeks like you claim to have. But, it has set us up for the long term. It's allowed myself and my partner to build other businesses, and to develop relationships that provide even more mutually profitable opportunities.

Let me ask you this...let's assume you really did close 13 out of 15 meetings. How do you plan on making each and every one of these campaigns successful? What's your turnaround time on these clients? Didn't you have other client projects running at the same time as you were out hitting a grand slam with your 13-client week? How many employees do you have? Were these projects profitable? How much was outsourced, and how did you go about managing these?

I ask these questions because, from experience, 13 clients in one week is a logistical nightmare, and when the most profitable sales opportunities come from satisfying existing clients and leveraging those experiences for more direct sales and more referrals, I don't see you having much success. You're prompt when responding to attacks on the Warrior Forum, are you as prompt with these 13 clients?

first of all, the 15 meetings were in a month period....

I am getting out of SEM consulting because its boring...I just dont like it really..I dont like dealing with other businesses, and know that I am responsible for other businesses... I would prefer to help other people do that, if they so choose.

.I have always found more interest in affiliate marketing, Info product creation, and e-commerce... but i started an SEM company because I wanted quick money... Im not the most outward business type person, so i never really wanted to be a part of the offline world at all...

When i first started in sem consulting, i had a tough time getting 2 clients a month... this went of for several months. Then i decided I was doing something wrong, so I spoke to a lot of people, read a lot of material, about cold calling, meeting settings, handling clients, running a business, outsourcing etc... I cant begin to think of how much I have stuffed into my head in the last year.

I mean, i decided not to go to uni, but i probably learned more than most uni students do..

anyway, My cold calls improved dramatically, i was making more, and getting more meetings.... And I just stuck to a plan and went with it.

"Let me ask you this...let's assume you really did close 13 out of 15 meetings. How do you plan on making each and every one of these campaigns successful? What's your turnaround time on these clients? Didn't you have other client projects running at the same time as you were out hitting a grand slam with your 13-client week? How many employees do you have? Were these projects profitable? How much was outsourced, and how did you go about managing these?"

I outsourced 99% of the work.

I have outsourced research, seo, website creation, social media setup and everything else.
I have outsourced a manager to keep track of my outsources and thier progress with the clients individual sites., and pays them etc etc...

turn around time for seo is under 90 days... and I have only had a few problems with regards to that....

13 client month.. not week btw!!

I have had a few difficult clients... but i like to let them go pretty quickly, I have a month to month contract deal so they can get out whenever they choose, and it also gives me the same option...

I had about 7 clients before this "unbelievable" month..... and i was already outsourcing all the work at that point.

The first thing I did when i was remodelling my business was to outsource everthing.

The only thing I did up until about 1 month ago, was cold call, and go to meetings....... about 4-6 hours a day... at my busiest, and checking with my manager...

This is extremely attainable for anyone that puts thier mind to it...... im not promising numbers like 15 meetings out of 30 successful calls....... but there is more than enough business out there to support that.

If every offline marketer got 20 new clients a month from now on, there would still be enough business out there to last another 10 years!!

did I answer your questions?

Thanks

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Rocket Media

13 years ago

Originally Posted by drummer05

i never said I was the great kung fu whatever of offline businesses... I am just someone who has been doing IM for a while, a big part of that was having an offline SEM company....

My name is Josh M, 21, from london, My company is SupremeSEM LTD... I dont know what you mean by my website... i have many... if you want my offline website its supremesem.com

and im getting out of offine business to work with affiliate marketing, e-commerce, and info product creation....

I jst thought i would come here, offer my knowlage on offline marketing that I have built up........ offer a few products to get my name out there and build a subscriber list.... and get going with info product creation from the warrior forum...

Ok... you know what im doing, but that really isnt the point.

I want to help others succeed in the same ways that I have... And im sure when im more successfull in Affiliate marketing, and e-commerce, i will come out with Info products related to those markets as well..

I have always liked bringing out info products ......

" It blows my mind that people are so selfish that they need to sell their methods that have made them great money for a couple hundred bucks"

Are you seriosly saying that helping other achieve thier goals... while at the same time earning a decent living, is selfish...???

I will never sell a crappy WSO... in fact I despise BAD product....... I want to build a customer base of HAPPY CUSTOMERS.... not people who buy crap over and over again....

I actually want to help others succeed!!!!!

Now can we give it a break! I am not making this thread about WSO's... If you want to keep on talking about my WSO, ill ask a mod to delete the thread!!!!

Uh no, I said that I believe in giving things like that away for free. Not selling it for chump change. Overuse of exclamation points show your idiocy. I said what needed to be said. I'll let the people who have enough time to go ahead and continue posting.

Cheers!

Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Rocket Media

Uh no, I said that I believe in giving things like that away for free. Not selling it for chump change. Overuse of exclamation points show your idiocy. I said what needed to be said. I'll let the people who have enough time to go ahead and continue posting.

Cheers!

No it shows my frustration from people like you!

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why would I give it away for free... I work my ass off to put a guide togethore and to get it out there... and not only that, they are bound to make a lot of money out of it.......

Also, if you offer something for free, 90% of people will shelve it!!!!

This means my material goes wasted...... and I get nothing for it...

You clearly dont understand IM at all if you dont see the market opportunity... I like writing, I like teaching, i like making good products..... Why give it away for free??

Thanks

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John Durham

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Rocket Media

If your method is good enough to be a WSO then it should have already gotten a few clients in which case I would be more inclined to share it for free rather than come up a few hundred bucks.

Quick answer here, and Im totally with you Rocket Media. We do both.

As I said I missed my appointment today, but the reason many people sell reports is because they love marketing, and for most of us who were around before the internet, buying classified ads reports off TV, spending $400 per pop on national enquirer ads that you could only tweak once every six weeks...For those; "Direct Marketing Without Face To Face Sales" has eluded us for years...".

The process was too slow, it took weeks sometimes to get print ads approved and published and MONTHS to tweak them... It could have taken years to master.

So we are excited about finally getting the breakthrough we have sought for years through the internet. Now we can make distinctions faster, that even makes us better MAIL ORDER marketers than we were before.

It still blows me away when someone clicks a link and buys a report because, back in the day the mere IDEA of that was like the holy grail!

Its really just a wanting to master new kinds of marketing. Evolving. A telemarketer is just an entry level marketer... and I am just a telemarketer who embraced the training and eventually advanced to other types of marketing.

Evolution. Its exciting to evolve.

Im sure if you think about it you can relate, however you are right; for some, its a chance to use smoke and mirrors.

Ps. Some guys do 50-100k product launches (Im not one) ...so it can be much more than just a few hundred dollars you are trading for your knowledge.

Thanks

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

@ John...

I love this quote...

"Not being arrogant, just addressing your comments with my authenticity"....

haha.. seriously??

I read your book, you have about as much authenticity as an outsourcer I might hire with no experience in cold calling...

Oh and just because Im bringing out an WSO.... does that mean that every thread that I start is a presell??

Thanks
1 reply

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John Durham

13 years ago

Originally Posted by drummer05

@ John...

I love this quote...

"Not being arrogant, just addressing your comments with my authenticity"....

haha.. seriously??

I read your book, you have about as much authenticity as an outsourcer I might hire with no experience in cold calling...

Oh and just because Im bringing out an WSO.... does that mean that every thread that I start is a presell??

You are boring me. Im done.

Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris 13 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

You are boring me. Im done.

again... giving up to early!... no wonder your sales numbers are crap!

good day!
- Thanks
- 1 reply
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- John Durham 13 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by drummer05
  
  again... giving up to early!... no wonder your sales numbers are crap!!
  
  Yeah, that. :rolleyes:
  
  Thanks
  
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Qamar

13 years ago

I think this blog post will help some of us who are afraid of making cold calls (and that includes me

) (non aff link)

Enjoy!

Qamar

Thanks
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Joshua Morris 13 years ago

Originally Posted by Qamar

I think this blog post will help some of us who are afraid of making cold calls (and that includes me ) (non aff link)

Enjoy!

Qamar

Thanks for that post... that looks really helpful for people who have a fear or nervousness about getting on the phone,

Thanks Qamar!
- Thanks
- 1 reply
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- John Durham 13 years ago
  
  Thanks Deidra, but he has already stated in another post that he believes this controversy is going to help him sell his report better.
  
  As for whatever your name is... Good thing you didnt tell us, because the way you are headed you are going to need a second chance at this).
  
  Dude, I can teach you fast, slow, Hi probability, high conversion -
  
  Whatever you want to learn. You havent even reached the tip of the ice berg on the knowledge and experience I could unleash on you... and yes there are many ways to telemarket, but you dont teach advanced people and newbies the same way...so you give what is appropriate.
  
  I can give you a 2o second phone pitch or a two hour seminar...whichever you want... or I can write you a book in 3 hours with 20 pages on whatever aspect of telemarketing you want to talk about - With no reference manuals to take answers from....
  
  I have sold deals VIA "Email", but you dont see me talking about it here much...or releasing a WSO on the subject.
  
  I have sold web pages door to door - But you dont see me talking about it...with flyers, through referrals, and through different types of networking
  
  I have done direct marketing, Don Lapres classifieds ad style marketing... all with a degree of success, and made money in marketing before there was even an internet
  
  Again, you dont see me talking about it much- or starting a pre launch on email marketing, but that doesnt mean I havent made a few email sales here and there.
  
  I believe in telemarketing, and not just for money, but for personal development, and just because I made a few email sales doesnt make me an email sales pro.
  
  Important point here:
  
  I dont argue with people in the adsense forum, because I dont know adsense... If I did that, I would probably look like you do now. Because I dont know adsense, and my story would be shallow and full of holes lijke yours is.
  
  I wouldnt argue with Marlon Sandors about list building,even though I have a list of 3,000 people.
  
  Im still a newby, and that says alot, because with 3,000 people on your list you learn ALOT fast, but that doesnt mean you are in the league of Marlon Sandors...
  
  He has done it for 20 years and with alot more success than I have, even though i have a narrow view of success on the subject...for every one angle I know, he knows twenty SUB angles on JUST that one angle.
  
  You see, Im a moderately successful list builder... But I dont even know the tip of the iceberg compared to a guy like Marlon. Im still wet behind the ears so to speak.
  
  I would think that of you, that you are just wet behind the ears, but honestly you have convinced me that you are lying PERIOD... and that this is all shallow info you got from several wso's you are piecing together.
  
  But I DO know telemarketing, and I WOULD argue with Marlon about it if he challenged me, and I WOULD probably be the one with the more qualified opinion, and I could probably give him 20 angles on every angle he knows.
  
  You think a person could teach all this and be so ignorant that they dont know the basics of "follow up"..."?
  
  Lol. Thanks for the credit. The truth is I dont focus on it with newbs, because they dont know how to "prioritize it" in the beginning when their head is spinning from the phone ... So I tell them, "forget it, move on, keep dialing". Once they get the break through I add more to their plate.
  
  I have done more follow up than you could possibly imagine. I could write a whole book just on "following up" by itself, but just dont...
  
  The people that need "my" help most are the ones who afraid of that INITIAL cold call... and those are the ones I speak to, because they will never get anywhere till they break down that wall, so I teach them to forget follow up, for answering machines, forget taking notes... forget EVERYTHING for a minute -and dial, and run straight through that wall and break through it.
  
  Still thats not all thats taught either... You are manipulating with your out of context excerpt.
  
  Being smart enough to know where newbies are at in the learning process, and how much they are able to assimilate at a time... is understanding.
  
  You assume that alot of intentional stuff is really said out of ignorance, but its out of a deep understanding of working with Hundreds of TMS, even thousands. I may not be a genius, but its clear Im not ignorant about this.
  
  If you think thats arrogant so be it.
  
  Your narrow picture painted here is inaccurate.
  
  You see, learning a few guitar chords means you can play a song, but it doesnt make you a guitar teacher...
  
  I dont teach everything that I have had a little experience with - Only stuff I know like the back of my hand and have succeeded at THOUSANDS of times. Enough to know the complete nature of that subject.
  
  I know it well enough to see you are full of BS, as did 2 or 3 other warriors on this thread before me, one of them highly credible and well respected (Sir Thomas) in my book.
  
  So it isnt like JD is the only ONE protecting our dignity here by calling you out.
  
  I guess Sir Thomas very graceful rebuke didnt move you, so someone had to be rude.
  
  In any event, I would start saving my best posts for the new username I am going to need in a week if you keep this direction.
  
  As for me, I made 5 report sales off your BS last night , so thanks. I wouldn't assume you are going to do the same based on your posts here.
  
  If I had any agenda to hide I wouldnt be saying this.
  
  Good news for you though, I will prob lose money because Im running late for an appointment wasting my time on you here. Later.
  
  Thanks
  
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GriffinWebDesign

13 years ago

In the offline world, I am more of the "old pro" variety in this discussion, and I have enjoyed the useful tidbits scattered here and there. I would specifically like to thank Max and John D for the tips and entertainment. I also appreciate the comment by PaulFL that one never stops learning; that's why I often enjoy stopping by and skimming the posts here. I actually have not posted very often (guess you could say I do a lot of lurking!), so the forum won't let me use the "thanks" feature yet. Thus, I am writing a bit of prose here to officially say thanks.

[ 2 ] Thanks

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Ok, thanks for your input John... I think we got off on the wrong foot.. so sorry about that.

Thanks

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John Durham

13 years ago

No we didnt get off on the wrong foot.... You are being predator, almost such an ignorant one (in my view only) that I feel sorry for you more than offended... and if I were God, I would let you apologize and give you a second chance... As it stands you will probably need a new user name.

So its not the wrong foot all all. I think we have nailed the right foot here. When Sir Thomas noticed, I took notice, and when I did so did others... The story is just an obvious fabrication... Not that success is unbelievable to us...but the FORMULA you described is.

This is a bust. I would bury this thread if I were you.

Ps. I say that with compassion and not maliciousness... I sorted feel like you are halfway apologetic in your heart, but just in too deep to turn back now.

Dont try to BS Warriors man... there are hundreds of thousands of posts here, there isnt much that hasnt come by our screens.

Thanks
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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Whatever you say John... I have made my points, I might as well sum them up here.

Its not BS... Its not an outline for the entire sales process, just a few pointers for people who go to meetings... My numbers for cold calls were very good that month, and thats really the end of it.

This is why I hate the warrior forum.... You cant make a simple post without it turning into a personal debate!

If you want to bash be privately please waste both our time with the Private Messenger function...... I think thats why this forum has it... I would be happy to go back and forth via PM.. but this is truly a waste of forum space!

Thanks
1 reply

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John Durham

13 years ago

Hey its your thread man. I start threads and get bashed sometimes too, comes with the territory.

Rescheduled appointment. Im disapointed in my self for wasting so much time on this, but Ill get over and still close this wednesday.

Seriously the last post here, I dont know why this is so important to me, it certainly doesnt harm me personally in any way...

But you hate the warrior forum because we recognize wolves in sheeps clothing, thats the reason you hate it. and unless you are legit, you make a hundred posts and get busted and lose all your work repeatedly, and have to start over... Im sure thats frustrating. Be glad you dont have 500 posts.

Much easier just to be legit. I wouldnt stick to my point about fabrication unless I believed it. There are hundreds of threads around here that nobody bothers... But this one is being picked on for a reason, NOT JUST BY me.

Now, one last piece of advice, and this is real, not a jab or a stick...

Dont argue with people who get looked up alot unless you are damn sure of yourself, its negative link juice, not positive.

I understand you are a marketer, and Im giving you big brother marketing advice, because somehow I like you for some reason. I know everyone makes mistakes, and just because a person is being predatory doesnt mean thats all they are. Its just something to work on.

You are young, sorry if I was harsh. Still, stand by my point, but I wish I would have just commented and moved on instead wasting all this time...

In the end it was passionate time though and this thread WILL teach people some things...so its all good. Anyone who reads it and still buys the report did it out of a sound mind after reading all of this.

As for you, I hope change your ways of approaching things.

You are going about it wrong, but your progressiveness shows potential and also your language at certain places... I hope you tame it and make it serve you and others with Goodness.

Good luck with your endeavors.

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

Rescheduled appointment. Im disapointed in my self for wasting so much time on this, but Ill get over and still close this wednesday.

Seriously the last post here, I dont know why this is so important to me, it certainly doesnt harm me personally in any way...

But you hate the warrior forum because we recognize wolves in sheeps clothing, thats the reason you hate it. and unless you are legit, you make a hundred posts and get busted and lose all your work repeatedly, and have to start over... Im sure thats frustrating. Be glad you dont have 500 posts.

Much easier just to be legit. I wouldnt stick to my point about fabrication unless I believed it. There are hundreds of threads around here that nobody bothers... But this one is being picked on for a reason, NOT JUST BY me.

Now, one last piece of advice, and this is real, not a jab or a stick...

Dont argue with people who get looked up alot unless you are damn sure of yourself, its negative link juice, not positive.

I understand you are a marketer, and Im giving you big brother marketing advice, because somehow I like you for some reason. I know everyone makes mistakes, and just because a person is being predatory doesnt mean thats all they are. Its just something to work on.

You are young, sorry if I was harsh. Still, stand by my point, but I wish I would have just commented and moved on instead wasting all this time...

In the end it was passionate time though and this thread WILL teach people some things...so its all good. Anyone who reads it and still buys the report did it out of a sound mind after reading all of this.

As for you, I hope change your ways of approaching things.

You are going about it wrong, but your progressiveness shows potential and also your language at certain places... I hope you tame it and make it serve you and others with Goodness.

Good luck with your endeavors.

Thanks, I wish you luck with your endeavors too...

and that wasnt the reason I hate the warrior forum... Its just people here are much less understanding and compassionate on this forum...

Im sure people will judge me on the products that I product, not some back and forth banter on a thread in the warrior forum....so im sure none of this matters.

take care john!

[ 1 ] Thanks

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Dwalters

13 years ago

Building trust is key
No matter who you're talking to
No matter what you're selling, Trust the sole most important thing

You can sell dog crap in a bag, if the person trusts you, he'll but it

Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Dwalters

Building trust is key
No matter who you're talking to
No matter what you're selling, Trust the sole most important thing

You can sell dog crap in a bag, if the person trusts you, he'll but it

I love that

your so right!!

it applies to husbands and wives, parents and kids, and sales people and buyers........ Really important lesson!

Thanks

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GriffinWebDesign

13 years ago

By the way, offline marketers - I believe the best sources for free marketing information for offline consulting is Michael Senoff's http://www.hardtodindseminars.com. You can get the equivalent of an MBA in small business marketing. No affiliate links here but if you're serious about offline marketing, do yourself a favor and check it out. I bought his HMA system 6 years ago and used it to start my marketing consulting business (back when it was called marketing consulting, not offline!)

Sounds like a great resource! Thanks for the tip! It looks like a typo in the URL. I think this is the correct link:
http://www.hardtofindseminars.com

Thanks
1 reply

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PaulFL 13 years ago

Originally Posted by GriffinWebDesign

Sounds like a great resource! Thanks for the tip! It looks like a typo in the URL. I think this is the correct link:
http://www.hardtofindseminars.com

Thanks Griffin. I corrected the link in my OP
- Thanks
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vero

13 years ago

Hello Josh,

First of all, congratulations on your great success!!

I have a few questions if you don't mind taking the time and sharing on them. I have been doing cold calling for the company I currently work for for about 6 months, my success offering their service (insurance) is great considering I had no experience before starting. Now it is a easy for me to get good response.
When it comes to promoting my own business though ( I just started cold calling last week) I just can't seem to spark their interest and I get to set the appointment. You see, I want to leave my current job and dedicate my time to my own SEO, SEM and SSM business, so my questions are:

1. How does your initial conversation go once you get to talk to the person for the first time? more or less you don't have to be too specific. what do you say to them?
2. What type of businesses are you calling? Individual professionals such as attorneys, accountants or businesses like furniture stores, grocery stores and the like
3. Once in the meeting, you interview them and they tell you what they want. Do you ask for a down payment up front? Monthly payments?
4. According to your experience, what is the best time to call them?
5. Do you call every day?

I guess I am just trying to see a clearer image of the big picture here. I would love to do what you are doing full time. I want this to be my business.

I hope this is not too much

Thanks so much for your time and congratulations again.. keep it up!

Vero

Thanks
1 reply

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by vero

Hello Josh,

First of all, congratulations on your great success!!

I have a few questions if you don't mind taking the time and sharing on them. I have been doing cold calling for the company I currently work for for about 6 months, my success offering their service (insurance) is great considering I had no experience before starting. Now it is a easy for me to get good response.
When it comes to promoting my own business though ( I just started cold calling last week) I just can't seem to spark their interest and I get to set the appointment. You see, I want to leave my current job and dedicate my time to my own SEO, SEM and SSM business, so my questions are:

1. How does your initial conversation go once you get to talk to the person for the first time? more or less you don't have to be too specific. what do you say to them?
2. What type of businesses are you calling? Individual professionals such as attorneys, accountants or businesses like furniture stores, grocery stores and the like
3. Once in the meeting, you interview them and they tell you what they want. Do you ask for a down payment up front? Monthly payments?
4. According to your experience, what is the best time to call them?
5. Do you call every day?

I guess I am just trying to see a clearer image of the big picture here. I would love to do what you are doing full time. I want this to be my business.

I hope this is not too much

Thanks so much for your time and congratulations again.. keep it up!

Vero

Hey Vero, I would be happy to answer your questions...

1. 1. How does your initial conversation go once
you get to talk to the person for the first
time? more or less you don't have to be too
specific. what do you say to them?

Well the most important thing first is to build trust... you need trust to get a client to buy from you, so talk general conversation for a few minutes first,a bout his business, about your business, about him and you, how both of you got into the business, etc... this could go on for a few minutes... the point here is to build trust.
Use a technique called "pacing", its an NLP technique that is used to build trust and rapport....(look it up on google, there is free stuff, youtube) and do this while you are talking about the medial things...

Then I go through a process of asking them about their needs and wants, i ask several questions here, and I listen very carefully to their needs... while they are talking I am building my sales pitch..

When you have flushed out as much as you can about them and thier needs, sell to them exactly what they are looking for... package it up nicely and offer it with a USP..

I am gonna stop here and continue on question 3 cos they kinda run into each other...

2. What type of businesses are you calling?
Individual professionals such as attorneys,
accountants or businesses like furniture stores,
grocery stores and the like

I try to only contact small businesses that deal with consumers... I feel like the online market has more to offer them... However dealing with B2B businesses is great for some sort of referral scheme.
When i started the company I offered my services free to accountants and asked for a referral email to be sent out to his clients who had websites.... I didnt even look at any of them...
So doing some free marketing, or if you have the money, outsource it... is a great way to get hooked up with hot leads.
You can also build some quick reputation this way.

Then I moved on to cold calling to B2C businesses only...

3. Once in the meeting, you interview them and they
tell you what they want. Do you ask for a down payment
up front? Monthly payments?

You definitely don't just go to the meeting with a list of questions and ask them... you have to build trust first... one of the good ways is using an NLP technique called "pacing", look it up....
Then when some rapport has been built through general conversation about his site, his business, your business, how you got started, how he got started online etc...you can move on to questions.

The questions should be about finding out his needs and wants with regards to internet marketing, just ask them...once rapport has been built they are talking completely honestly and openly with you..

Make sure you listen to the answers, dont just sell after one questions, ask several probing questions that cover all bases. Ask if they are working with anyone else, or have been thinking about it, ask them if they have looked at any other web marketing services....

Listen to their answer very carefully, this is the lifeblood of your sales pitch.... The might tell you they have been thinking about doing SEO and have spoken to 3 companies about it but are unsure of what to do..... You now know you can sell them SEO, and you know they are comparing competition so you need a unique edge...
But dont pitch yet, keep digging and find out more with some of the question ideas above...

When you have found out everything from the client, no doubt both of you are very excited to get to the pitch.... (you are more excited though.. trust me).
Then you sell to him exactly what his needs are, and his wants are, but supercharge them and make them sound spectacular.... talk about how his competitors are doing just that, and he has made the right choices and it all sounds great...

Make sure you have a unique selling point, a lowest price, a best value service, a free something or other, a discount, something that is different...

if you have done that, you have created a perfect package that he has described to you, and topped it off with a sugar coating and a cherry on top...

You will of course talk about your product a fair bit... and pricing obviosly... The best advice I can give here is be vague about your product.... remember, its not a 500 backlinks anchor text package.... no, thats internet marketing talk... offline talk is, Its a powerful marketing campaign that will boost awareness and sales....
Be vague, no technical jargon or IM talk.., if they are asking about it allot, then give them something... but try to keep it brief.

4. According to your experience, what is the best time
to call them?

I like to place my calls before 9am..... I have tried other times during the day and get many busy business owners.... during lunch they are on thier break.. and do not want to be bothered... and after work they just want to go home..... So early morning is best!!... Others might do different and have different results, but this is my experience..

5. Do you call every day?

More like every other day... one day i would look for leads, one day i would call them... some days with more than 1 meeting i probably wont call at all..

I hope I answered your questions ok, let me know if you want me to elaborate on something..

Josh M

Thanks
1 reply

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vero

13 years ago

Thanks so much for the response Josh, I really appreciate it.

I am eager to start my offline consulting but this has been a throw back for me since I do not seem to get good response from my calls.

I will try your advise, thanks so much

I will get back to you if I have any further questions, which I'm sure I will

Thanks.
Vero

Thanks
1 reply

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MRomeo09

13 years ago

I haven't been on here in months, thanks for the entertainment boys.

The thing is Drummer there are those of us who aren't 21. It's no knock on you and your age. But, we've been in business for more than two years, some of us 15-20. You can kind of smell the bullcrap within seconds. Sadly the WF is full of scam artists looking to fleece the newbies who are addicted to being fleeced.

As John so elegantly put it, the numbers are the numbers, they don't lie. The reason why you're called out here on a post is because it can't happen in a WSO. I can say your post is BS all day, but if I say your WSO is BS then I can get banned. It is what it is, and that's how they choose to run this site. It's unfortunate so the newbies keep on getting sold the dreams which are not likely to come true if they follow BS plans.

I buy pretty much every offline WSO that comes out every few months or so. And I'd say 90% of them are complete BS by people who have never done what they say they've done. It is what it is. But I get a new wrinkle here and a twist there. I'm sure that if you put up your WSO you'll sell some of it, it doesn't mean it won't be one of the 90% though.

Anyway, thanks for the fun.

Marcos

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

We do not have to become heroes overnight. Just a step at a time, meeting each thing that comes up ... discovering we have the strength to stare it down. - Eleanor Roosevelt

Your opinion of yourself becomes your reality. If you have all these doubts, then no one will believe in you and everything will go wrong. If you think the opposite, the opposite will happen. Itâ€™s that simple.-Curtis Jackson- 50 Cent

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Joshua Morris

13 years ago

Originally Posted by MRomeo09

I haven't been on here in months, thanks for the entertainment boys.

The thing is Drummer there are those of us who aren't 21. It's no knock on you and your age. But, we've been in business for more than two years, some of us 15-20. You can kind of smell the bullcrap within seconds. Sadly the WF is full of scam artists looking to fleece the newbies who are addicted to being fleeced.

As John so elegantly put it, the numbers are the numbers, they don't lie. The reason why you're called out here on a post is because it can't happen in a WSO. I can say your post is BS all day, but if I say your WSO is BS then I can get banned. It is what it is, and that's how they choose to run this site. It's unfortunate so the newbies keep on getting sold the dreams which are not likely to come true if they follow BS plans.

I buy pretty much every offline WSO that comes out every few months or so. And I'd say 90% of them are complete BS by people who have never done what they say they've done. It is what it is. But I get a new wrinkle here and a twist there. I'm sure that if you put up your WSO you'll sell some of it, it doesn't mean it won't be one of the 90% though.

Anyway, thanks for the fun.

Marcos

Trust me marcos, I know exactly what your talking about.... And I have been doing offline business for 2 years....... but I have been doing Internet marketing since I was 12... I basically grew up on it, its really deeply ingrained in me. I know "business" is a different game entirely, but why would I need 15 years of experience with offline business to know how online business works.....

I am very passionate about the actual IM niche, and especially Info product creation where my objective is to create PURE VALUE!!!...

i HATE bad WSO's, and my goal here is not to make a quick buck, but to build up a reputation that will last me a lifetime, by bringing out helpful and quality products that bring value to peoples businesses.

I completely appreciate that the warrior forum is wary of scams and the like popping up, people wasting their money on "fad" techniques, and generally bad WSO's that seem to slip into the market more often than not.

Im not a part of that, seriously, that would be damaging to my reputation, it would not help out people and their businesses, and it would get noone nowhere, fast!

Also I will NOT bring out my WSO, until I have PROVEN case studies from at least 5 SEM business owners, im not talking about a review of the product, i mean actually trying out the techniques and proving they work! - If I dont get this, the product will not go to market.

Think about it...... If i bring out an amazing product, you will buy from me again... right?

If I bring out a crap product, you wont buy from me again......

I know it may not be as simple as that.. but why would I risk future business, AND happy customers, by bringing out crappy products??

That's awesome! Keep up the good work.

It's always nice to see the success stories that are based on sound principles and practices... Not the latest fad.

Thanks James

Thanks

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James Kurt

13 years ago

That's awesome! Keep up the good work.

It's always nice to see the success stories that are based on sound principles and practices... Not the latest fad.

Thanks

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John Durham

13 years ago

Hey Bob, this is John Durham and I run a local web design company here in town... Hope you are doing well today. Great. Listen just real briefly, Im calling around to local business owners like yourself today trying to let folks know we are here and hopefully drum up some interest... I was wondering what kind of internet projects you folks might have going on there or if there was anything I could help you with?

Oh okay you are looking to do that later down the road then...? No problem, i understand with the Christmas season and all... You folks get pretty busy this time of year?

Right? Right?

Yeah Im sure you're swamped, I understand... but thats a good problem to have right? lol (Business owner chuckles with you).

Okay Bob, I will let you go but , just so you know before I do, our company primarily specializes in doing website design for small business owners like yourself, and we have some really affordable effective packages that include features like ______ , ______, and ___________. Also we offer pretty flexible payment options if needed. Being that we are a small local operation, we understand how to work with small business owners budgets....

Honestly, you'd be amazed at how simple and cost effective it could be to have a first class website...,most people think its more complicated to get started than it really is... Have you ever recieved a quote on web design before?

Right? Wow, that sounds pretty steep... (Bob; "Yeah thats what I thought too...")

Tell you what Bob, why dont I go ahead and stop by and offer you a quick 15 minute consultation, no need to buy anything now... but I can at least give you some ideas of the costs you are looking at to start, and how to go about it for future reference if nothing else... , are you going to be around early afternoon tomorrow around this time?

No? Okay, let me see... I have a 1:00 or a two oclock open on Wednesday....Which of those would work best for you...

No? Let me see if I can move something around here, are mornings better for you Bob?

Okay I could probably stop by for a few minutes on Wednesday morning then around nine hows that sound?

Okay great!

Note: Does it sound bold? Do you sound like you are steamrolling your way through it?

Good news, you are telemarketing like a champion. Buyers are liars. The last words are often "Im not buying right now, maybe down the road". Go in and sell them something. If you dont walk out with the whole sale then set them up a domain for $100.00 and lock yourself in as their "web guy".

Good luck.

Ps. This is just off the cuff, you could come at it from alot of angles, but it will work just fine.

[ 3 ] Thanks

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I closed 13 out of 15 meetings!

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