Can 'Rent a Site' Model Become My Muse and Help Me Acheive The 4 Hour Work Week Lifestyle?

14 years ago

I'm new to this but gaining my first client has given me that self-confidence. Make sure you sell this model to those who are on page 3-4 for main keyphrases. Who wouldn't want a site ranking for great keyphrases?

If you can do this for decent keyphrases and multiple ones, I don't see how people wouldn't pay a good amount of money to be on first page of Google.

I'd focus on $1-2k/month clients. Depending on who you target, that's anywhere from 5-10 clients.

Of course, I'm a newbie, just my $0.02. Let's see what the pro Warriors here have to say.

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Aussieguy 14 years ago

Are you guys doing simple sites of 1 to a few pages highlighting the business....or more comprehensive sites?

I've read at least half a dozen WSO's on this topic now, and a couple non-WSO products....and have been putting a bit of a plan together for when I get the time to implement!

A lot of the WSO's focus on a "mini-site" type of idea.....content isn't talked about much, so I wonder what people actually doing it are doing.

Obviously content helps the SEO side of things, along with activity such as a blog or a news page etc......

The important thing (always) is offering the client a great product, and I want to go further into defining what that is - as that's the way to justify decent "rental fees".

I've tended to think on the lower end, figuring that even $100 a month is high....but of course, it really depends on the traffic, which is partly dependant on the size of the location of course....plus the dollar value of a customer etc.

The "can it last" part has played on my mind a little lately, with google+ and thinking about the future of the ever changing internet....and that's why I come back to thinking about content. Quality content (and social value) seem to be really important to the engines....so I am just thinking of how this applies to the rental site model also.

Great topic!
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iAmNameLess

14 years ago

Yes it can, and no it can't! IT just depends.

My goal is the 4 hour work week type lifestyle as well, but it isn't happening at my current pace. I can make the reasonable amount that I would need but I don't believe I can do it with how I am doing things right now.

I don't like rent a site models and people think I am dumb for not liking it. Of course it can work, it comes down to your preference. Offering web design in general, does not give that kind of flexibility unless you have an outsourcing powerhouse that can keep everyone in check.

I think you can make 10K a month for sure... but I'm not sure if you will be able to literally have a 4 hour work week lol.

To be honest though... people have told me I couldn't do things but I did.. I think you can do whatever you want if you are motivated and are working towards your goals!

Thanks

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gecko1

14 years ago

fated82,
I feel what you want to do. I am thinking the same. The whole thing is to keep control of whatever you are doing. So for me the rent a site model is perfect.

Right now I have site targeting ticket defense attorneys and I'm renting it out month by month at $97, so it's a no brainer for the client.

I also have hosting customers as well, I'm not near where I want to be monthly but all this is work. I need to find a way to scale up.

Thanks

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fated82

14 years ago

So is it possible? pump up

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raft

14 years ago

Probably only at first it is necessary to work - much

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sprks79

14 years ago

Good question, asked alot, as iAmNameLess has pointed out, yes it is possible, though not usually probable. I have a huge network of "rent a site" type sites (huge as in 76 last I counted) and am at the 10k+ a month point....However, way more than 4 hours a week. Even outsourcing most of my work I still average about 15 hour per week to make it run smooth. I could theoretically do it with less but I dont want to suffer quality for simply taking 11 hours off of my work week.

Yes possible, though not probable.

Its like wondering if I could be president....its possible, but not even close to probable

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KaterSD

14 years ago

Originally Posted by sprks79

Good question, asked alot, as iAmNameLess has pointed out, yes it is possible, though not usually probable. I have a huge network of "rent a site" type sites (huge as in 76 last I counted) and am at the 10k+ a month point....However, way more than 4 hours a week. Even outsourcing most of my work I still average about 15 hour per week to make it run smooth. I could theoretically do it with less but I dont want to suffer quality for simply taking 11 hours off of my work week.

Yes possible, though not probable.

Its like wondering if I could be president....its possible, but not even close to probable

Whats your average rent fee for the sites?.

Thanks
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sprks79

14 years ago

Originally Posted by vApor

Whats your average rent fee for the sites?.

I have some that perform decently and I charge between $99 and $199, and I have some that perform amazingly and charge between $299 and $599 depending on the niche and the area as well as the available traffic, and sometimes even look at the cpc for certain keywords. I make it affordable without leaving to much money on the table.

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KaterSD

14 years ago

Originally Posted by sprks79

I have some that perform decently and I charge between $99 and $199, and I have some that perform amazingly and charge between $299 and $599 depending on the niche and the area as well as the available traffic, and sometimes even look at the cpc for certain keywords. I make it affordable without leaving to much money on the table.

what makes a decent site compared to an amazing one?

How many leads it generates?

Thanks
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sprks79 14 years ago

Originally Posted by vApor

what makes a decent site compared to an amazing one?

How many leads it generates?

Yes, its all about the number of leads it produces. For example, I have a decent site in the home remodeling niche that brings in 5-20 leads a month...not to tough but still worth the $199 I charge. On the other hand I have a car dealership site which produces 25-45 closeable leads and charge a per lead basis at $250 per lead, but they are qualified leads, credit apps ran and all so it is a cinch to close. Or a bankruptcy lawyer that gets between 15-30 leads a month and pays $599 a month. Find an area, start small and scale and $10k per month is definitely doable....
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MaxxC

14 years ago

A few days ago I viewed a promotional video for a software which is already available to marketers. It produces websites - specifically for rental - in a few clicks.
In the video, the developer produced an optimized WP web site in ~5 minutes.

Here's a brief an description of the process:
1) Select your target country from the drop down menu... eg - USA, UK, Canada, Aus, NZ.
2) Select state > city > borough > district or whatever from next drop down menus.
3) Select one of multiple choices of WordPress templates / designs.
4) Select niche / business (from ~80 types), from drop down list eg roofer, plumber etc

Clickety - click, Clickety click ... Boom ! ... and out came the WP website complete with on page SEO (content / article), and ready for off page SEO (backlinks etc) provided by the said same software company for accelerated SERP ranking, as part of an all inclusive package... also where to look for site renters, email templates to pitch renters etc, etc.

So, in three months or 90 days, if you spend ~5 minutes per day, you can complete 90 sites, which can be rented for $150 - $750 per month.
You do the math.... cheers .

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Andy Bo

14 years ago

Originally Posted by MaxxC

A few days ago I viewed a promotional video for a software which is already available to marketers. It produces websites - specifically for rental - in a few clicks.
In the video, the developer produced an optimized WP web site in ~5 minutes.

Here's a brief an description of the process:
1) Select your target country from the drop down menu... eg - USA, UK, Canada, Aus, NZ.
2) Select state > city > borough > district or whatever from next drop down menus.
3) Select one of multiple choices of WordPress templates / designs.
4) Select niche / business (from ~80 types), from drop down list eg roofer, plumber etc

Clickety - click, Clickety click ... Boom ! ... and out came the WP website complete with on page SEO (content / article), and ready for off page SEO (backlinks etc) provided by the said same software company for accelerated SERP ranking, as part of an all inclusive package... also where to look for site renters, email templates to pitch renters etc, etc.

So, in three months or 90 days, if you spend ~5 minutes per day, you can complete 90 sites, which can be rented for $150 - $750 per month.
You do the math.... cheers .

Hi Maxx,
Can you remember the name of it?

)

Thanks
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MaxxC 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Andy Bo

Hi Maxx,
Can you remember the name of it? )

Read a PM from JohnMac today requesting the same info as Andy Bo at post #24 above.
And BTW, Right now, today, I'm seeing a reminder in my inbox - last chance to get in (at a grand a pop - $997 actually), but I can't afford it right now, but EVERYTHING is automated to acquire virtual real estate...

I cannot reply by PM due to my low post count, so I'll share the details here. OK ?
Also I'm not sure what the rules are here on WF re: hyperlinking, so I'll just describe and you do the googling.

The guy's name is Anik Singal, and I'm on his mailing list for his most recent Bollywood style promotion of the product named : Lethal Commission.
And here's the URL I copied from today's last chance / reminder email :

Lethal Commission: Discover why Niches are DEAD!!

It's still in my email inbox,
Hope this helps ... MaxxC
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beachrat

13 years ago

Originally Posted by MaxxC

Read a PM from JohnMac today requesting the same info as Andy Bo at post #24 above.
And BTW, Right now, today, I'm seeing a reminder in my inbox - last chance to get in (at a grand a pop - $997 actually), but I can't afford it right now, but EVERYTHING is automated to acquire virtual real estate...

I cannot reply by PM due to my low post count, so I'll share the details here. OK ?
Also I'm not sure what the rules are here on WF re: hyperlinking, so I'll just describe and you do the googling.

The guy's name is Anik Singal, and I'm on his mailing list for his most recent Bollywood style promotion of the product named : Lethal Commission.
And here's the URL I copied from today's last chance / reminder email :

Lethal Commission: Discover why Niches are DEAD!!

It's still in my email inbox,
Hope this helps ... MaxxC

Originally Posted by MaxxC

A few days ago I viewed a promotional video for a software which is already available to marketers. It produces websites - specifically for rental - in a few clicks.
In the video, the developer produced an optimized WP web site in ~5 minutes.

Here's a brief an description of the process:
1) Select your target country from the drop down menu... eg - USA, UK, Canada, Aus, NZ.
2) Select state > city > borough > district or whatever from next drop down menus.
3) Select one of multiple choices of WordPress templates / designs.
4) Select niche / business (from ~80 types), from drop down list eg roofer, plumber etc

Clickety - click, Clickety click ... Boom ! ... and out came the WP website complete with on page SEO (content / article), and ready for off page SEO (backlinks etc) provided by the said same software company for accelerated SERP ranking, as part of an all inclusive package... also where to look for site renters, email templates to pitch renters etc, etc.

So, in three months or 90 days, if you spend ~5 minutes per day, you can complete 90 sites, which can be rented for $150 - $750 per month.
You do the math.... cheers .

Hey guys allow me to chime in here with my opinion. I normally don't post much but when I feel I need to step in I will. I don't want anyone wasting $997 for a POS software. If you are referring to the software that creates sites like this Chicago Boat Rental - Boat Rental in Chicago then don't buy it.

Look at the adsense in the content. There is not even padding between it and the text.

I read a few places on how the guys who were hosting the webinar weren't even live. It was a recorded webinar. Some of their sales pitches went like.. " Oh! and other one just sold, oh man they flying like hotcakes."

Pff, I was on that webinar. I saw value in the method so I bought a local targeted domain name, outsourced some quality content, and did some SEO. My website is ranking above a competitor who used that software. I paid less than 100 bucks.

I have lost all respect for Anik Segal (how ever the heck you spell his name and I don't care) in the past year. I started in IM about 10 years ago and seen all the BS and scams. Anik use to have a good product way back in the day. I deleted Myself from his list and others who were promoting that product.

There are review threads in the review section on that product. Search for those and read them.

Be honest with your self and really take a look at the website. How does it look?

If you want to quickly get sites up for local markets or any market for that matter. I highly suggest you take a look at WPTwin by Jason Flanigan. I am not a partner Jason, nor does he know I even exist, LOL, but I do know that WPTwin will clone and deploy websites in seconds. Yes, plugins, databases, and all!

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Stranger Danger

13 years ago

Originally Posted by sprks79

yes it is possible, though not usually probable. I have a huge network of "rent a site" type sites (huge as in 76 last I counted) and am at the 10k+ a month point....However, way more than 4 hours a week. Even outsourcing most of my work I still average about 15 hour per week to make it run smooth.

-Thanks for posting this. I am curious about those 15 hours...what are you doing in that time?

Thanks.

Thanks

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trader2300 12 years ago

Is there any way I can contact you to find out more about the rent a site model
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gecko1

14 years ago

Awesome thing you have going for you sprks79!
glad to hear from someone that actually lives it.

I can live with a 15hr week. Again congrats.

Thanks
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sprks79 14 years ago

Thanks Gecko1,

Take it from me, my number one rule is I'M LAZY. If I can have the 4 hour work week, then awesome, but a 15 hour work week still gives me plenty of time to enjoy the finer things and laugh at my counterparts in their 40-60 hour a week job Takes time and patience but well worth it, and it gives me time to offer more services.
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deepestblue

14 years ago

Not only is it achievable but very possible. The only limit is in our own minds. There is no limit in reality. So when you put in the hard work up front with the first 2 or 3 clients, be writing down all of the steps you took in detail. Then when it is time to outsource, hand the outsourcers your lists. Everything has a certain number of steps.

Additionally, once you get your sales method down you could outsource this as well to 1, 2 or 100 sales reps. It's all up to you how much you want to grow the business.

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MRomeo09 14 years ago

Yes, you can definitely hit $10k in site rentals while having a minimal schedule.

It takes some thought on how to do it. But basically it's math.

I need $10k/mo profit.

I will need a virtual assistant to handle customer service issues which will cost $1-2k a month depending.

Hosting, link building, content changes and other tasks probably $1k a month.

So that number is more realistically $13k a month.

If you can average just $200/mo per site, you can do it with 65 sites. Certainly do able.

Mix in some lead-generation and you can be even more profitable. You might get to $10k a month with only 3-10 sites if you're doing lead-gen right.

Definitely worth doing. And definitely can be passive income. While I do like to argue with IAmNameless about site-rentals and lead-gen the main benefit is once you've hit your goal you're pretty much in maintain mode.

HTH,

Marcos
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RentItNow

14 years ago

I never considered an offline marketing model as being a 4 hour workweek business. My information site, however is and can, in time make $10K/month. I do webwork for a guy that has one product and is making $5K/mn and will likely double that in another year. I'm making 50% of my income that way (on one big info product). I'm sort of with iamnameless in that I do not see a rent-a-site model sustainable or popular. I would never be able to sell that to local bizes. Maybe on a national level, yes.

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I have no agenda but to help those in the same situation. This I feel will pay the bills.

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Aussieguy

14 years ago

iamnameless and Rentitnow....
can you guys please expand on your opinions on the sustainability (or lack of) with this model. I've done a lot of reading on this model, and it's only good business practice to consider the cons as well as the pros!

Really interested to hear more.

I just think of google+ and try and imagine the future of the internet...and I see a possibility of a different world, where (at least via google) people doing local search start to see results that are more, "google-ified" rather than random sites etc.
But really, I'm just daydreaming!

Talk more about it please guys! If it really isn't a great model for the future, I'd rather spend my time elsewhere, so if you see some downside - please detail!

Cheers!

Thanks
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iAmNameLess

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Aussieguy

iamnameless and Rentitnow....
can you guys please expand on your opinions on the sustainability (or lack of) with this model. I've done a lot of reading on this model, and it's only good business practice to consider the cons as well as the pros!

Really interested to hear more.

I just think of google+ and try and imagine the future of the internet...and I see a possibility of a different world, where (at least via google) people doing local search start to see results that are more, "google-ified" rather than random sites etc.
But really, I'm just daydreaming!

Talk more about it please guys! If it really isn't a great model for the future, I'd rather spend my time elsewhere, so if you see some downside - please detail!

Cheers!

Look, the type of model you go for, whether it is selling sites flat out, doing CPA or adsense sites, doing a rent a site model... they all can work. It is up to you to MAKE it work though.

I don't even pretend to do a rent a site model, I just don't care to give it a shot. I am successful, but that doesn't mean that just because I don't do a rent a site model, that you can't be successful with it!

Problems I see with it. They can't get google places, or at least after the first one or two renters, the site will be seen as spammy. You will also have to stay on top of SEO. The main reason I personally don't like it, is the work is up front. The return is more on the back end but I don't like doing that. It could be a lot of up front work, but it COULD pay off for you, just not likely to be immediate. Now... lightbulb just went off in my head. I suppose to make it more worthwhile, is to not just charge monthly, but charge a set up fee as well to put their content on there and customize it for them. I think a lot of people are just charging a monthly rate. Set up fee + monthly rate = winning situation. That would probably be worth it to me.

On the plus side... a rent a site model could be beneficial because the client is buying as is, instead of going from scratch. This could also be a gateway to get into a new market.

The truth about marketing, offline and internet marketing, is that everything can work... you just need to make it work for you!

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MRomeo09

14 years ago

Ok, let me see if I can answer IamNameless issues.

1. It's spammy- Not really, I do custom sites. They look, feel and smell like real sites. I don't do silly one page sites, I do full fledged- 7-9 page sites that look and convert better than their own site.

2. You can't do google places- Says who? If I'm renting the site, I can surely do Google places for them, and usually do. Guess what when you do that, when can you imagine they will leave you? Answer- probably never. Guess what, you can charge them extra take your $300 a month client and make them a $400 a month client.

3. You have to maintain SEO- Sort of, SEO is about the cheapest thing you can do. I can hire help from India/Philippines for $2-3 an hour to do all the SEO I need for most of my sites. Honestly there are some site rentals that I've not done a lick of SEO for in over 2 years, no new content, no new links still #1.

4. Work up front, paid on back-end- Yeah, but you only have to do it once. If I do work for a bankruptcy attorney and make a great site. How much work does it require to change the city names from Philadelphia to Houston? I've taken one site given an outsourcer a list of places to change the city name at and gotten other sites rolled out in about an hour each, at $2.50 an hour. So yeah the first one takes some work, the subsequent ones much less. Again the difference is every time you take a new web design client on, even if you're getting paid $3-10k to do it, you are starting from scratch, you have no idea if the client is going to make it easy on you or hard. Compare that to spending a few hours building a good site, buying 50 domain names and paying $100-200 to roll it out to 50 different locations. I do site rentals in niches and areas that are EASY to SEO. Think NOT Philadelphia plumber but instead Cherry Hill Plumber. So there ain't a lot of work involved SEO wise. So in my opinion there ain't a whole lot of work involved.

As far as getting paid on the back-end. Heck yeah! I get paid on the back-end FOREVER.

Edited to remove any semblance of boasting/income claims.

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iAmNameLess

14 years ago

Originally Posted by MRomeo09

Ok, let me see if I can answer IamNameless issues.

1. It's spammy- Not really, I do custom sites. They look, feel and smell like real sites. I don't do silly one page sites, I do full fledged- 7-9 page sites that look and convert better than their own site.

2. You can't do google places- Says who? If I'm renting the site, I can surely do Google places for them, and usually do. Guess what when you do that, when can you imagine they will leave you? Answer- probably never. Guess what, you can charge them extra take your $300 a month client and make them a $400 a month client.

3. You have to maintain SEO- Sort of, SEO is about the cheapest thing you can do. I can hire help from India/Philippines for $2-3 an hour to do all the SEO I need for most of my sites. Honestly there are some site rentals that I've not done a lick of SEO for in over 2 years, no new content, no new links still #1.

4. Work up front, paid on back-end- Yeah, but you only have to do it once. If I do work for a bankruptcy attorney and make a great site. How much work does it require to change the city names from Philadelphia to Houston? I've taken one site given an outsourcer a list of places to change the city name at and gotten other sites rolled out in about an hour each, at $2.50 an hour. So yeah the first one takes some work, the subsequent ones much less. Again the difference is every time you take a new web design client on, even if you're getting paid $3-10k to do it, you are starting from scratch, you have no idea if the client is going to make it easy on you or hard. Compare that to spending a few hours building a good site, buying 50 domain names and paying $100-200 to roll it out to 50 different locations. I do site rentals in niches and areas that are EASY to SEO. Think NOT Philadelphia plumber but instead Cherry Hill Plumber. So there ain't a lot of work involved SEO wise. So in my opinion there ain't a whole lot of work involved.

1.) Yes, it is spammy doing it like you suggest.

2.) You split up your points with what I was saying, it is spammy doing like you suggest if you ever have a flaky client. It is just like if a business goes out of business and a new business takes the address over, with a new google places account, then you are at a very high disadvantage. You could say this isn't a problem all you want, but it is. It is a very real problem. I like to go after high competition keywords, because I like the high payoff. The problem with that, is if it is high competition then that little issue there is going to cause major issues with ranking the places account. Have done 10 case studies, in 10 different markets, with 10 different keywords, and the outcome is the same. A big IF on them not leaving you, is too much of a variable to leave out.

3.) I understand what you're saying, but you aren't keeping current with what is happening in the search engines then. All the work you claim to not need to do SEO wise, is going to come back and bite you! Saying SEO is one of the cheapest things to outsource, clearly shows you aren't very involved in the SEO arena. You can have 100 VA's being paid $2/hr but I guarantee you that you can't touch some of the competition we handle. The price of outsourcing should not be a factor in this, and isn't a factor. You can either get results or not, doesn't matter how cheap it is to build a thousand useless backlinks.

4.) You have a great point here... and even though I can argue with you all day and night about the previous points, this one makes up for it. The only issue I see with this, is it has duplicate content written all over it. Now, don't get me wrong, I don't mind duplicate content, but if I rolled out 50 new sites with the same content in a day, I'm a little worried about the outcome in google. I suppose I could split the sites up on different IP addresses, but it is still a concern. Changing the city name in the content will only give about a 3% uniqueness. That would be my main hesitation here now.

Great post Romeo.

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MRomeo09

14 years ago

Originally Posted by iAmNameLess

1.) Yes, it is spammy doing it like you suggest.

Can you explain? What's spammy about it? I deliver good content which actually meets the customers demands, ie if they are looking for a plumbing company I give them a site where they can be assured that their plumbing needs will be addressed. I don't do lead-capture forms as the primary form of contact, it's always a phone number with lead-capture second. If you have a broken pipe you sure as hell don't want to fill out a form, you want to call someone to come out like half an hour ago. So no I completely disagree.

2.) You split up your points with what I was saying, it is spammy doing like you suggest if you ever have a flaky client. It is just like if a business goes out of business and a new business takes the address over, with a new google places account, then you are at a very high disadvantage. You could say this isn't a problem all you want, but it is. It is a very real problem. I like to go after high competition keywords, because I like the high payoff. The problem with that, is if it is high competition then that little issue there is going to cause major issues with ranking the places account. Have done 10 case studies, in 10 different markets, with 10 different keywords, and the outcome is the same. A big IF on them not leaving you, is too much of a variable to leave out.

I'm not sure why it's an issue, I don't own BobsPlumbingTacoma.com I own PlumbingTacoma.com(this is just an example). Why is it an issue if my client leaves. I also own the phone number, and the google places account says Plumbing Tacoma not Bob's plumbing. So again client leaves not a big issues.

In my experience if you price it right, and the ROI is there for the client, and you can PROVE it's there for the client, they don't leave. Some do, but it's not often.

3.) I understand what you're saying, but you aren't keeping current with what is happening in the search engines then. All the work you claim to not need to do SEO wise, is going to come back and bite you! Saying SEO is one of the cheapest things to outsource, clearly shows you aren't very involved in the SEO arena. You can have 100 VA's being paid $2/hr but I guarantee you that you can't touch some of the competition we handle. The price of outsourcing should not be a factor in this, and isn't a factor. You can either get results or not, doesn't matter how cheap it is to build a thousand useless backlinks.

I just think you're not clear on what I'm talking about. You do realize that I'm talking about something like Cherry Hill Plumber, NOT Philadelphia Plumber. Most of your competition will be PR 1 or so, and typically have single digit backlinks. With on-page SEO you can dominate that market, no backlinking required. However, I'll usually throw a few dozen really high quality backlinks over six months and get it to PR 3-4. So not sure what you think I'm going to have to do. I.e. my SEO Empire post.

4.) You have a great point here... and even though I can argue with you all day and night about the previous points, this one makes up for it. The only issue I see with this, is it has duplicate content written all over it. Now, don't get me wrong, I don't mind duplicate content, but if I rolled out 50 new sites with the same content in a day, I'm a little worried about the outcome in google. I suppose I could split the sites up on different IP addresses, but it is still a concern. Changing the city name in the content will only give about a 3% uniqueness. That would be my main hesitation here now.

You change it up when you get a new client, pretty simple really. If I own Cherry Hill Plumber.com I'll go and edit the content to match my new clients information. But you do it with THEIR dime not your own, ie I have money in hand and I have my VA call them, get their info and change it. I have a huge push to get testimonials and such which further make it more unique.

Steps.

1. Build it.
2. Spin it across multiple locations
3. Rent it.
4. Edit it.
5. Rinse and repeat.

Marcos

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iAmNameLess

14 years ago

Originally Posted by MRomeo09

Can you explain? What's spammy about it? I deliver good content which actually meets the customers demands, ie if they are looking for a plumbing company I give them a site where they can be assured that their plumbing needs will be addressed. I don't do lead-capture forms as the primary form of contact, it's always a phone number with lead-capture second. If you have a broken pipe you sure as hell don't want to fill out a form, you want to call someone to come out like half an hour ago. So no I completely disagree.
Just going to respond this way since its easier. I think we are talking about different things. I'm interested in giving it a shot, so then I can personally say what I do like and what I don't like instead of just the theory and logic. However, it seems you're referring to lead generation on sites you own, not renting? I don't have time to deal with the calls.

I'm not sure why it's an issue, I don't own BobsPlumbingTacoma.com I own PlumbingTacoma.com(this is just an example). Why is it an issue if my client leaves. I also own the phone number, and the google places account says Plumbing Tacoma not Bob's plumbing. So again client leaves not a big issues.

I'm talking about the literal address. If plumbingtacoma.com is owned by bobs plumbing, and then bob leaves and ronald's plumbing takes over, conflicting addresses reflecting by the google places pages that THEY own, are going to cause problems.

In my experience if you price it right, and the ROI is there for the client, and you can PROVE it's there for the client, they don't leave. Some do, but it's not often.
I'm not sure how many clients you have... we all have different experiences, but I can say within a period of 6 months, we deal with so many different types of people with different needs, and sometimes a bad apple sneaks in.. it isn't a matter of if, it is a matter of when. Always someone unhappy! I get you though, its like people talk about SEO thinking they will leave after they get their position, but that totally isn't the case! They 9 times out of 10 stay, and want to maintain their position and target additional keywords.

I just think you're not clear on what I'm talking about. You do realize that I'm talking about something like Cherry Hill Plumber, NOT Philadelphia Plumber. Most of your competition will be PR 1 or so, and typically have single digit backlinks. With on-page SEO you can dominate that market, no backlinking required. However, I'll usually throw a few dozen really high quality backlinks over six months and get it to PR 3-4. So not sure what you think I'm going to have to do. I.e. my SEO Empire post.

Maybe I'm not clear on it. I get it, small weak competition areas.. I just don't see how that would be better than what I do now, when I am getting recurring payments for SEO. I have my own private network, so it is very simple for me to stop the links on a flaky client. So why not just do what I do now and use my existing blog network, to rank sites in HIGH competition areas, and get a high payout? I'm not trying to argue with you, I'm down to try anything, but I need to believe it would benefit me more than what I'm doing now.

You change it up when you get a new client, pretty simple really. If I own Cherry Hill Plumber.com I'll go and edit the content to match my new clients information. But you do it with THEIR dime not your own, ie I have money in hand and I have my VA call them, get their info and change it. I have a huge push to get testimonials and such which further make it more unique.

I understand that completely. What I'm saying though, you're not going to be spamming the page with cherry hill plumber, at a 10% keyword density, so the truth is the website with a new domain is now is 95-97% duplicate content. This may not have been an issue with you and your sites in the past, but that is the past, and we have to look forward to the new changes that are about to take place. You know what I mean? I love SEO, I do it all day all night... Giving this a shot would be no problem for me, with the fact that I could spit out 50 sites in a day and a half targeting different cities. I would do it right now and come back in a month taking back all my posts, and telling myself to eat it. The only problem is, duplicate content.

Appreciate your responses... Mine are in bold!

Thanks
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MRomeo09

14 years ago

Can you explain? What's spammy about it? I deliver good content which actually meets the customers demands, ie if they are looking for a plumbing company I give them a site where they can be assured that their plumbing needs will be addressed. I don't do lead-capture forms as the primary form of contact, it's always a phone number with lead-capture second. If you have a broken pipe you sure as hell don't want to fill out a form, you want to call someone to come out like half an hour ago. So no I completely disagree.

Just going to respond this way since its easier. I think we are talking about different things. I'm interested in giving it a shot, so then I can personally say what I do like and what I don't like instead of just the theory and logic. However, it seems you're referring to lead generation on sites you own, not renting? I don't have time to deal with the calls.

No, I very rarely run the call center, what I mean is site-rental gets their phone number on it, lead-gen gets my tracking number on it, and lead-jv gets my number on it. Make sense?

I'm not sure why it's an issue, I don't own BobsPlumbingTacoma.com I own PlumbingTacoma.com(this is just an example). Why is it an issue if my client leaves. I also own the phone number, and the google places account says Plumbing Tacoma not Bob's plumbing. So again client leaves not a big issues.

I'm talking about the literal address. If plumbingtacoma.com is owned by bobs plumbing, and then bob leaves and ronald's plumbing takes over, conflicting addresses reflecting by the google places pages that THEY own, are going to cause problems.

But that's the point I'm in control, I ALWAYS own plumbingtacoma.com not them. Which means I also own and control the Google places for PlumbingTacoma.com. So if they choose to leave, I can change the address over to a new owner, I can't however remove the reviews. It's one of the reasons they usually don't leave, you kind of have them by the short hairs.

In my experience if you price it right, and the ROI is there for the client, and you can PROVE it's there for the client, they don't leave. Some do, but it's not often.
I'm not sure how many clients you have... we all have different experiences, but I can say within a period of 6 months, we deal with so many different types of people with different needs, and sometimes a bad apple sneaks in.. it isn't a matter of if, it is a matter of when. Always someone unhappy! I get you though, its like people talk about SEO thinking they will leave after they get their position, but that totally isn't the case! They 9 times out of 10 stay, and want to maintain their position and target additional keywords.

What you do from an SEO perspective I do ten fold. I have a protocol written down for client retention that I believe is unmatched in the biz. I also do a lot of things that appeal to their ego that typically causes them not to want to leave as well. From business cards, to t-shirts with the website for all their staff, to a monthly marketing tips newsletters that many insist is worth more than their entire rental fee. Plus where a lot of people just rent the site and move on, our process is completely different. We are HUGE into conversions, so we tweak and tweak and tweak the website. They get to see over six months time their conversions go from 1-2% to 5-15% or more. And they quickly come to realize that they will never replicate what we have done with them. Like I said, we don't let our customers leave, it's against my religion. But sometimes they do, can't really be helped.

I just think you're not clear on what I'm talking about. You do realize that I'm talking about something like Cherry Hill Plumber, NOT Philadelphia Plumber. Most of your competition will be PR 1 or so, and typically have single digit backlinks. With on-page SEO you can dominate that market, no backlinking required. However, I'll usually throw a few dozen really high quality backlinks over six months and get it to PR 3-4. So not sure what you think I'm going to have to do. I.e. my SEO Empire post.

Maybe I'm not clear on it. I get it, small weak competition areas.. I just don't see how that would be better than what I do now, when I am getting recurring payments for SEO. I have my own private network, so it is very simple for me to stop the links on a flaky client. So why not just do what I do now and use my existing blog network, to rank sites in HIGH competition areas, and get a high payout? I'm not trying to argue with you, I'm down to try anything, but I need to believe it would benefit me more than what I'm doing now.

http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...on-empire.html

That's a post I wrote about a year ago about building your own private network, so I definitely get building your own network, it's really where we spend most of our time, very rarely do links go DIRECTLY to a money site.

Again, you do whatever makes sense. I don't rent sites in HIGH competition areas, I lead-gen them. I rent sites in smaller cities and lead gen them in larger ones. Lead-gen is a whole nother ball game, but I make $5k/mo on some sites in high competition, large cities. It's a longer process however, site rentals can be done in a week which is appealing in it's own way.

You change it up when you get a new client, pretty simple really. If I own Cherry Hill Plumber.com I'll go and edit the content to match my new clients information. But you do it with THEIR dime not your own, ie I have money in hand and I have my VA call them, get their info and change it. I have a huge push to get testimonials and such which further make it more unique.

I understand that completely. What I'm saying though, you're not going to be spamming the page with cherry hill plumber, at a 10% keyword density, so the truth is the website with a new domain is now is 95-97% duplicate content. This may not have been an issue with you and your sites in the past, but that is the past, and we have to look forward to the new changes that are about to take place. You know what I mean? I love SEO, I do it all day all night... Giving this a shot would be no problem for me, with the fact that I could spit out 50 sites in a day and a half targeting different cities. I would do it right now and come back in a month taking back all my posts, and telling myself to eat it. The only problem is, duplicate content.

Again like I've said, it's pretty much irrelevant in my experience. I can roll out 20 sites in a few days with very minimal cross-site changes and they all rank. Perhaps Google will figure it out, hasn't happened yet. The duplicate content myth is just that a myth, in my experience it's kind of irrelevant. On occasion it becomes an issue, especially for sites that I can't get rented right away(I can think of maybe half a dozen or so), but then you just spin the text and it comes right back.

Don't guess, try it for yourself. Find a low competition keyword, buy a bunch of .info domains, just change up the city name on all of them, and then leave them alone. You'll find that if you buy 20 of them, 17-19 of them will be just fine. Now it's your choice whether to edit the 1-3 of them that got kicked off, or just let them go.

Just like the whole Class C IP myth, I took a medium difficult(for local) keyword and built 20 websites on the exact same host and completely dominated the first three pages of Google with only some sites like Yelp getting in the mix, but every "private" site was my own. Now with that said I still use over 100 different IP addresses for my private network. So while I don't think it's the issue people worry about, I still take some small measures to try to keep my networks reasonably separate. I also own over 30 LLC's, C-Corps, etc. So it gets a little complicated. But in real life I also own 7 different offline businesses, so most of this stuff is not just theory for me, but real life applications that puts food on the table for me and my family.

Thanks enjoying the conversation.

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iAmNameLess

13 years ago

Originally Posted by MRomeo09

Can you explain? What's spammy about it? I deliver good content which actually meets the customers demands, ie if they are looking for a plumbing company I give them a site where they can be assured that their plumbing needs will be addressed. I don't do lead-capture forms as the primary form of contact, it's always a phone number with lead-capture second. If you have a broken pipe you sure as hell don't want to fill out a form, you want to call someone to come out like half an hour ago. So no I completely disagree.

Just going to respond this way since its easier. I think we are talking about different things. I'm interested in giving it a shot, so then I can personally say what I do like and what I don't like instead of just the theory and logic. However, it seems you're referring to lead generation on sites you own, not renting? I don't have time to deal with the calls.

No, I very rarely run the call center, what I mean is site-rental gets their phone number on it, lead-gen gets my tracking number on it, and lead-jv gets my number on it. Make sense?

So basically, when you do this, the only thing you really need to change is the phone number... maybe the about us page? Of course if you dup the site 50 times for other random cities, then you would optimize accordingly... so really, there would only be 30 minutes of work with each site getting it up. Right? Now if you were doing lead gen then a bit different. Site rental would be easier I assume.

I'm not sure why it's an issue, I don't own BobsPlumbingTacoma.com I own PlumbingTacoma.com(this is just an example). Why is it an issue if my client leaves. I also own the phone number, and the google places account says Plumbing Tacoma not Bob's plumbing. So again client leaves not a big issues.

I'm talking about the literal address. If plumbingtacoma.com is owned by bobs plumbing, and then bob leaves and ronald's plumbing takes over, conflicting addresses reflecting by the google places pages that THEY own, are going to cause problems.

But that's the point I'm in control, I ALWAYS own plumbingtacoma.com not them. Which means I also own and control the Google places for PlumbingTacoma.com. So if they choose to leave, I can change the address over to a new owner, I can't however remove the reviews. It's one of the reasons they usually don't leave, you kind of have them by the short hairs.

You have a good point, and I DO agree with this. The only thing I am concerned about is the google places. Changing the google places address could effect your outcome don't you think? Of course, this is only IF they ever lead and you have a new renter. I just figure the citations with the name will conflict with the listings.

In my experience if you price it right, and the ROI is there for the client, and you can PROVE it's there for the client, they don't leave. Some do, but it's not often.
I'm not sure how many clients you have... we all have different experiences, but I can say within a period of 6 months, we deal with so many different types of people with different needs, and sometimes a bad apple sneaks in.. it isn't a matter of if, it is a matter of when. Always someone unhappy! I get you though, its like people talk about SEO thinking they will leave after they get their position, but that totally isn't the case! They 9 times out of 10 stay, and want to maintain their position and target additional keywords.

What you do from an SEO perspective I do ten fold. I have a protocol written down for client retention that I believe is unmatched in the biz. I also do a lot of things that appeal to their ego that typically causes them not to want to leave as well. From business cards, to t-shirts with the website for all their staff, to a monthly marketing tips newsletters that many insist is worth more than their entire rental fee. Plus where a lot of people just rent the site and move on, our process is completely different. We are HUGE into conversions, so we tweak and tweak and tweak the website. They get to see over six months time their conversions go from 1-2% to 5-15% or more. And they quickly come to realize that they will never replicate what we have done with them. Like I said, we don't let our customers leave, it's against my religion. But sometimes they do, can't really be helped.

I feel the same way about my services. Just discussing the reality of clients eventually leaving, not all.... but a few always do because they're cheap, and think they can focus efforts in more cost effective arenas.

I just think you're not clear on what I'm talking about. You do realize that I'm talking about something like Cherry Hill Plumber, NOT Philadelphia Plumber. Most of your competition will be PR 1 or so, and typically have single digit backlinks. With on-page SEO you can dominate that market, no backlinking required. However, I'll usually throw a few dozen really high quality backlinks over six months and get it to PR 3-4. So not sure what you think I'm going to have to do. I.e. my SEO Empire post.

Maybe I'm not clear on it. I get it, small weak competition areas.. I just don't see how that would be better than what I do now, when I am getting recurring payments for SEO. I have my own private network, so it is very simple for me to stop the links on a flaky client. So why not just do what I do now and use my existing blog network, to rank sites in HIGH competition areas, and get a high payout? I'm not trying to argue with you, I'm down to try anything, but I need to believe it would benefit me more than what I'm doing now.

http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...on-empire.html

That's a post I wrote about a year ago about building your own private network, so I definitely get building your own network, it's really where we spend most of our time, very rarely do links go DIRECTLY to a money site.

Again, you do whatever makes sense. I don't rent sites in HIGH competition areas, I lead-gen them. I rent sites in smaller cities and lead gen them in larger ones. Lead-gen is a whole nother ball game, but I make $5k/mo on some sites in high competition, large cities. It's a longer process however, site rentals can be done in a week which is appealing in it's own way.

I agree with you... I have some SEO clients in major markets with major competition. One in NYC stopped for a month and he dropped to the 2nd page after being ranked 1. I think you're right, site rentals would be appealing in that way.

You change it up when you get a new client, pretty simple really. If I own Cherry Hill Plumber.com I'll go and edit the content to match my new clients information. But you do it with THEIR dime not your own, ie I have money in hand and I have my VA call them, get their info and change it. I have a huge push to get testimonials and such which further make it more unique.

I understand that completely. What I'm saying though, you're not going to be spamming the page with cherry hill plumber, at a 10% keyword density, so the truth is the website with a new domain is now is 95-97% duplicate content. This may not have been an issue with you and your sites in the past, but that is the past, and we have to look forward to the new changes that are about to take place. You know what I mean? I love SEO, I do it all day all night... Giving this a shot would be no problem for me, with the fact that I could spit out 50 sites in a day and a half targeting different cities. I would do it right now and come back in a month taking back all my posts, and telling myself to eat it. The only problem is, duplicate content.

Again like I've said, it's pretty much irrelevant in my experience. I can roll out 20 sites in a few days with very minimal cross-site changes and they all rank. Perhaps Google will figure it out, hasn't happened yet. The duplicate content myth is just that a myth, in my experience it's kind of irrelevant. On occasion it becomes an issue, especially for sites that I can't get rented right away(I can think of maybe half a dozen or so), but then you just spin the text and it comes right back.

Now most of the time I would agree with duplicate content being a myth, unless it is dup content from the same IP, then it is definitely a problem.

Don't guess, try it for yourself. Find a low competition keyword, buy a bunch of .info domains, just change up the city name on all of them, and then leave them alone. You'll find that if you buy 20 of them, 17-19 of them will be just fine. Now it's your choice whether to edit the 1-3 of them that got kicked off, or just let them go.

Just like the whole Class C IP myth, I took a medium difficult(for local) keyword and built 20 websites on the exact same host and completely dominated the first three pages of Google with only some sites like Yelp getting in the mix, but every "private" site was my own. Now with that said I still use over 100 different IP addresses for my private network. So while I don't think it's the issue people worry about, I still take some small measures to try to keep my networks reasonably separate. I also own over 30 LLC's, C-Corps, etc. So it gets a little complicated. But in real life I also own 7 different offline businesses, so most of this stuff is not just theory for me, but real life applications that puts food on the table for me and my family.

Thanks enjoying the conversation.

Good stuff... I probably will try it out. I think for me it would put a damper on what I'm currently doing, but overall once it is built up I can see it working out well I suppose. So what do you target? Occupations in cities over 50K, 100K, 200K? I'm really not worried about competition, I have so many high competition niches that I do well in already, but would prefer the major markets to have on SEO contracts.

What is so appealing to me, is the ability to just duplicate the site, put on a new domain, and change the number and sell it.

Response in black again.

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humbledmarket Banned 14 years ago

HAHA Marcos, Fantastic Post. Thanks for the great info; checking out your WSO now...you really seem to know what you're talking about.
- Thanks
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RentItNow

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Aussieguy

iamnameless and Rentitnow....
can you guys please expand on your opinions on the sustainability (or lack of) with this model. I've done a lot of reading on this model, and it's only good business practice to consider the cons as well as the pros!

The original question was "Can Rent a Site Model become....4 hour work week lifestyle"

Now I am coming from this viewpoint. Should I put 4 hours into something I only have to put 4 hours into to provide my income that is proven to provide that income or many more hours into something that is untested (by me) to do so.

The direction I am coming at it is in my own city. Can I build rental sites and rent them out? Maybe but not very likely right now. Most business owners want custom solutions (at least in my area). So to try to spend 4 hours a week doing that or 4 hours into building my own sites that would make the same amount of money, I would take the later.

Again, this is my personal answer because I know myself and my geomarket. I have considered "franchising" an offline model to other cities and that way I am not limited by location, but at least in my own mind the amount of time I invest in that could have been investing in something I know makes money. (I make 50% on IM and 50% offline)

Not sure if this answers the question. Again, I am not saying it is not possible to do, just I would never point my guns that way to find out.

Sorry let me give you an example. This week I have not been able to put in all the hours necessary to my offline business. Only 4 hours because of issues I have dealing with to do with my family. However, I still made the same amount I would have working 40 hours. So to change my model would be insane.

Thanks

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I have no agenda but to help those in the same situation. This I feel will pay the bills.

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Aussieguy

14 years ago

sprks79, just wondering how long it took to get those 76 sites? You've posted both that you've been in offline consulting for 7 years, yet back in April this year, you said you were new to offline marketing so I'm a bit confused as to where the site rentals come in?

Thanks
1 reply

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sprks79

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Aussieguy

sprks79, just wondering how long it took to get those 76 sites? You've posted both that you've been in offline consulting for 7 years, yet back in April this year, you said you were new to offline marketing so I'm a bit confused as to where the site rentals come in?

Aussieguy,

Thank you for pointing that out. It was not supposed to say new to offline as a whole, yet new to the social marketing part of it. I edited the post to clear up any further confusion, my apologies to anyone who read it and had questions.

As far as the time it took to get the total number of sites, a long time, on average, I can complete 2 sites per week, leaving time for personal stuff as well, and outsource 2 per week. Taking time away for my travels and such, I estimate, it took about 18 months total to get them up, running and ranking and rented. However, doing them back to back it felt more fluid than one would think.

Thanks

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PBN site builder. Expired domain scraper. Website Hoster.....Oh, and an amazing guy. :)

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LBO

14 years ago

renting sites do work but it takes action people to people in public

Thanks

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coalminer

14 years ago

Now that's what I call a post..
Well motivating for me that is..
Cheers bro..
Lets rent on!
Nick

Thanks

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KaterSD

14 years ago

I have a roofing site. Generates about 10 - 15 leads a month.

Ranks in the top three for google places.

So to answer iamnameless. Yes you can get g places. Just gotta know how.

Is it rented nope. Not yet, working on that as we speak.

Thanks
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iAmNameLess

14 years ago

Originally Posted by vApor

I have a roofing site. Generates about 10 - 15 leads a month.

Ranks in the top three for google places.

So to answer iamnameless. Yes you can get g places. Just gotta know how.

Is it rented nope. Not yet, working on that as we speak.

Yes, I realize that, lol...

What I am referring to, is when a business has a place page and pointing to that website, if they stop renting and a new business leases from you, then you have an issue. If it is high competition, you simply will not rank as easily, or at all.

I have about 20 addresses from my own address, using suite A, B, C, etc. However, even doing that, google doesn't particularly care for it but it is a hell of a lot easier than ranking using the same address. You could always change the address on the place page, but then you have issues there too.

For ONLY ranking the website, easy, piece of cake... but throwing in places, and the new updates google is making, will cause a problem in my opinion.

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wuping

14 years ago

Hi guys! First post here

Really interesting topic and a big thank you to MRomeo09 for his elaborate answer, really interesting discussion going on. However I'm wondering about a few things.

When you say rent out a site? Do you make a site called www.somecity+dentist.com build that webpage with content, seo etc, get ranked (is it necessary to rank #1?) and then find a client. Then when you've found a client do you change the website www.somecity+dentist.com to match the info of the client? Or do you make some sort of squeezepage linking to the customers website?

Another question is. Would you take on several customers on in the same niche (dentists in this example)? Say you find 2 customers at page 2, and you get them both to page 1 (preferably spot 1+2)?

Hope you get what I mean

Thanks
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easygoingdude

14 years ago

Originally Posted by wuping

Hi guys! First post here

Then when you've found a client do you change the website www.somecity+dentist.com to match the info of the client? Or do you make some sort of squeezepage linking to the customers website?

I also want an answer to this question.

When people talk of "rent a site" I don't know whether they are talking about general sites with squeeze pages or sites that are customized.

In my opinion, creating local based blogs (Boston Dental Practice Source) with a ton of information, which don't rely on Google Places traffic, are the best long term investment. Once you get traffic, you can offer a local business to buy or rent the site. If they buy or rent you can rebrand the blog with pictures of the affiliated business, an "about us" section, "contact us" section, etc.

Thanks

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FredGillen

14 years ago

I certainly believe it is possible to get the the 10kpm and a 4 hour, thats why I am working on it.

I use the rented site as the lead in, then add Google places and SEO services for their existing site to increase the monthly income. I also use a weekly retainer $ figure when I talk to the client which sounds less that the actual monthly costs.

The more services you can add (and deliver on), the more you make and happier the client will be. You can't afford to put all your eggs in one basket!!

Fred
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dericks3

14 years ago

You can absolutely live the 4 hour work week lifestyle with this model.

I have 3 clients that I cold call for and phone close the sales using the website leasing model.

All 3 of these guys are outsourcing the site building and ranking for the domains and outsourcing the calling to me.

So its actually probably less than a 4 hour work week as he is just managing the site building.

One bit of advice,is be careful to select the proper niches to lease and make sure the towns are large enough,so you have a decent number of prospects to call.

Also be aware that not all your sites will be rented right away if at all.

We are finding that around 70% are leased in a fairly short time,the other 30% dont lease very quickly or at all.

Just keep building and ranking,that way you will always have something new in the pipeline.

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fated82

14 years ago

Seen some great replies and reassure me that this idea will work. My aim is to hit $10k a month and hopefully work less than 10 hours a week. With these advices, I am confident it can be done.

Keep them coming....

Originally Posted by sprks79

Good question, asked alot, as iAmNameLess has pointed out, yes it is possible, though not usually probable. I have a huge network of "rent a site" type sites (huge as in 76 last I counted) and am at the 10k+ a month point....However, way more than 4 hours a week. Even outsourcing most of my work I still average about 15 hour per week to make it run smooth. I could theoretically do it with less but I dont want to suffer quality for simply taking 11 hours off of my work week.

Yes possible, though not probable.

Its like wondering if I could be president....its possible, but not even close to probable

Thanks for the response. I guess you are someone I need to learn from. Like you said, I probably wont be able to work literally 4 hours a week. But working 15 hours a week is still a great thing for most ppl.

Can I PM you to seek advice on the 'rent a site' model?

Originally Posted by deepestblue

Not only is it achievable but very possible. The only limit is in our own minds. There is no limit in reality. So when you put in the hard work up front with the first 2 or 3 clients, be writing down all of the steps you took in detail. Then when it is time to outsource, hand the outsourcers your lists. Everything has a certain number of steps.

Additionally, once you get your sales method down you could outsource this as well to 1, 2 or 100 sales reps. It's all up to you how much you want to grow the business.

Yes, I will do that. I currently outsource the content and link building to Odesk. Will work on the processes and gradually make it hands free.

Originally Posted by MRomeo09

Yes, you can definitely hit $10k in site rentals while having a minimal schedule.

It takes some thought on how to do it. But basically it's math.

I need $10k/mo profit.

I will need a virtual assistant to handle customer service issues which will cost $1-2k a month depending.

Hosting, link building, content changes and other tasks probably $1k a month.

So that number is more realistically $13k a month.

If you can average just $200/mo per site, you can do it with 65 sites. Certainly do able.

Mix in some lead-generation and you can be even more profitable. You might get to $10k a month with only 3-10 sites if you're doing lead-gen right.

Definitely worth doing. And definitely can be passive income. While I do like to argue with IAmNameless about site-rentals and lead-gen the main benefit is once you've hit your goal you're pretty much in maintain mode.

HTH,

Marcos

Hmmm....I wonder how the lead generation model work.

Originally Posted by sprks79

Yes, its all about the number of leads it produces. For example, I have a decent site in the home remodeling niche that brings in 5-20 leads a month...not to tough but still worth the $199 I charge. On the other hand I have a car dealership site which produces 25-45 closeable leads and charge a per lead basis at $250 per lead, but they are qualified leads, credit apps ran and all so it is a cinch to close. Or a bankruptcy lawyer that gets between 15-30 leads a month and pays $599 a month. Find an area, start small and scale and $10k per month is definitely doable....

Can you share with us how you verify a valid lead?

Originally Posted by dericks3

You can absolutely live the 4 hour work week lifestyle with this model.

I have 3 clients that I cold call for and phone close the sales using the website leasing model.

All 3 of these guys are outsourcing the site building and ranking for the domains and outsourcing the calling to me.

So its actually probably less than a 4 hour work week as he is just managing the site building.

One bit of advice,is be careful to select the proper niches to lease and make sure the towns are large enough,so you have a decent number of prospects to call.

Also be aware that not all your sites will be rented right away if at all.

We are finding that around 70% are leased in a fairly short time,the other 30% dont lease very quickly or at all.

Just keep building and ranking,that way you will always have something new in the pipeline.

I am just starting out and I have got 5 sites up and running. 2 sites are already ranking and one of them is getting about 30 UV a day. I wonder how long on average are you able to get it rent and what do you do with those sites that you can't rent out?

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Huskerdarren

14 years ago

Rent a site? Maybe if the rental is high enough, like a $1000 a month, not $200. OR, sell leads for whatever you can get. What is it worth a doctor to get a Lasik client? Bucks.

They would pay $1000 a month for a lead generating site that produced 3 new billables a month. Lasik is a commodity. But who can get top rankings for their site and create good copy or video that builds a prospect list? If you slap together cheap looking sites it's not going to work. I think you have to put something really nice out there.

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John Durham

14 years ago

Turn it into a directory site and rent listings out to 100 biz owners for $100 per month apiece. This way you can have 100 clients and only one site to manage, and you can focus all of your energy on one project instead of 10 or whatever. Plus, each new client gives you more site content and makes your site more authoritative.

They will naturally go out and place links to their site all over the place (a percentage of them) so your clients actually do alot of your SEO work for you with this model.

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iAmNameLess

14 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

Turn it into a directory site and rent listings out to 100 biz owners for $100 per month apiece. This way you can have 100 clients and only one site to manage, and you can focus all of your energy on one project instead of 10 or whatever.

That is something I completely agree with.

People think that a simple listing couldn't be worth much, but it is. There are so many professional directories out there, making a KILLING!

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sprks79

14 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

Turn it into a directory site and rent listings out to 100 biz owners for $100 per month apiece. This way you can have 100 clients and only one site to manage, and you can focus all of your energy on one project instead of 10 or whatever. Plus, each new client gives you more site content and makes your site more authoritative.

They will naturally go out and place links to their site all over the place (a percentage of them) so your clients actually do alot of your SEO work for you with this model.

10000% agree. I have actually started leaning towards this model. I like the fact that you can have 100+ businesses, even in the same niche paying you monthly and only having to manage a single site. Imagine all of the separate niche(s) (sp??) out there. Absolutely endless opportunity. I only wish I had done this from the beginning. Would have be much easier for me.

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iInvent

13 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

Turn it into a directory site and rent listings out to 100 biz owners for $100 per month apiece. This way you can have 100 clients and only one site to manage, and you can focus all of your energy on one project instead of 10 or whatever. Plus, each new client gives you more site content and makes your site more authoritative.

They will naturally go out and place links to their site all over the place (a percentage of them) so your clients actually do alot of your SEO work for you with this model.

Love it John!! Exactly what I intend to do... A cross between a rent-a-page model & directory! Thanks for the post! I'll sleep better tonight...if I do sleep

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wuping

13 years ago

Don't let this thread die

!

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Dr Dan

13 years ago

Is It Possible?

Sure

Do I Work Only 4 Hours a Week?

No

Why?

Because I get too bored and don't know what to do with myself....lol

When you love what you do... You really don't keep track of your hours

Also you must find what works for you and your style.

For instance....

Alot of people like my partner like to work 9-5 monday thru friday and take the weekends off.

I like to work in spurts.

Sometimes I start at 10 am and sometimes at 2pm

Sometimes I work 7 days a week and sometimes I only work 2 days a week.

I like to work this way and it works for me.

Get some ideas here (great ideas and tips on this thread) and test them out for you.

Then once you find what works for you... Keep doing it

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imsirigiri

13 years ago

Couldn't thank the number of times I felt that this model is perfectly possible with a little work and a little more perseverance.

Romeo, iAmNameLess and fated82 - You guys are awesome for starting, providing fuel and sustaining the pace of the entire conversation. It was just like a roller coaster ride.

Here I come, my local city.

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HypeText

13 years ago

It's possible to win the largest Powerball Jackpot of all time....just not very probable.

Like the Lottery commercials say "You have to be in it to win it"

As for the 4 Hour work Week? Highly Unlikely...

What is not being mentioned here is that SEO algorithms change all the time. What might have you on the first page this week might not have you there next week.

Other Sites in the same niche may climb beyond your sites rankings and you have no control over their activities...that creates maintenance of the sites...more work, more time expended.

Personally, If I was able to generate $10k a month on 4 hours work I wouldnt be satisfied...I'd want to invest another 4 hours for another $10K...

The Internet is NOT a Get rich quick vehicle like so many claim it is. there is no "EASY" method for making money.

If making $10K a month for 4 hours worth of work was so viable then everyone would be doing it.

No matter how you are doing it, it's going to take time & effort.

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Falkonator 13 years ago

This year I will be focusing on the Rent-a-Site Model. I think it is a great model especially because of the recurring payments that are possibly endless.
My goal is to be at $8,000/month by summer. I need to crank out 2 sites a week. It is very possible. I will keep you posted.
The original question was if a 4 hour work week is possible AFTER he put in blood, sweat, and tears to achieve the $10,000 a month.
I know it will be a lot of work to get there. Personally, I have to agree with Dr. Dan that once I get there I don't think I can only work 4 hours. I would be too bored also.
There is always more work to be done with bigger and better projects and goals.
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dtaylor

13 years ago

Originally Posted by HypeText

What is not being mentioned here is that SEO algorithms change all the time. What might have you on the first page this week might not have you there next week.

Other Sites in the same niche may climb beyond your sites rankings and you have no control over their activities...that creates maintenance of the sites...more work, more time expended.

When you are doing local markets in cities under 100K population this is not that much of a concern. I have some of the ugliest sites you have ever seen in your life that maintain a #1 ranking (below G Places) with absolutely no maintenance of any kind. These are just very basic sites.

In fact, I was upset (kind of) when a site shot to the first page and stayed there.....all it had was the domain name and Wordpress installed. Just the domain name and a blank page got to the first page (# 2 or #3).

Just get a few decent local domains and put up some sites. You will see that ranking is not that tough. It is Much, Much better if you go the extra mile and get an address so you can get a places listing along with your website.....then you have a very rentable commodity.

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link82

13 years ago

Man, this post is awesome! I completely forgot about it and came back and read all the responses thoroughly. It's like... the Super Bowl of Rent-a-Site/SEO Marketers. The responses between iAmNameless and MRomeo09 (Marcus)... both very successful marketers doing what works for them.

So, a few months ago, I got my first client. I am doing video + sites I own (renting from me) + his site optimization + Google Places Fix. I am charging him close to $2k/month for two areas for six main keyphrases. He understands that he will break even with 1-2 customers/month from each city. Obviously, I want him to get way more than that many customers so my fee is justified and he hangs in with me for a long time.

So the month of January, I started targeting plumbers and electricians. After speaking to a few them, (sorry for the generalization that's about to come up here), seems like they may be a bit of a pain to do SEO/rental sites with. They didn't see the benefit in being on page 1; one though since he was signed on with AT&T/Yellow Pages that nothing else could be done. I will be following up with a page 1 ranked site and some #s, just to give him an idea.

So, now I have decided to target more prospects like my first client who know they will make my monthly fee back with 1-2 good customers (depending on what service they want done).

I want to earn $10k/month by June and am already behind in my goals. I ended up buying some local domains (in that niche) about 12 days ago and I see the small area ones are ranking on page 2. With some tweaking and a few backlinks, I can see them getting on page 1 very, very soon.

Maybe I'll have success, maybe I won't. Maybe it'll come down to the price point..? But seeing as how I'm naturally renting my sites to my first client along with doing other SEO work for him, renting/leasing seems natural.

Have you tried this for yourself yet, fated82?

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JustinG30

13 years ago

What are you doing about Google Places? Ive worked on some sites have then on the first or 2nd page, but i still cant get passed Google Places and no one wants a site thats #8 or #9 on a page. Just looking for some suggestions.

Thanks
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DABK

13 years ago

Used to think that too, till I passed Google places 7 pack. Two other sites passed with me, both ahead of me. It's funny now, wasn't back then.

Keep doing seo, and you'll pass.

Originally Posted by JustinG30

What are you doing about Google Places? Ive worked on some sites have then on the first or 2nd page, but i still cant get passed Google Places and no one wants a site thats #8 or #9 on a page. Just looking for some suggestions.

Thanks

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Dasilva.

13 years ago

I didnt get one thing....

When you guys "rent" the website do you actually rent it as in let the client use the website as he wants for the time he rents it???

Or do you "rent" it as in creating leads to the clients website???

Thanks
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Simoshere

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Dasilva.

I didnt get one thing....

When you guys "rent" the website do you actually rent it as in let the client use the website as he wants for the time he rents it???

Or do you "rent" it as in creating leads to the clients website???

From what I understand, after reading multiple rental and lead gen sites, Is that you never let the client touch the website. They just reap the benefits of it, which essentially is all of the leads it provides. They most likely will have their own website for customers to look at, update and such..

BTW,... I would NOT be bored with a four hour work week. lol. I would go back to working on my Youtube comedy channel that I had to put on hold to focus on my business. lol.

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link82

13 years ago

I have wondered about this. When you approach an prospect, how do work the 'rent this site' model? Do you mention 'renting' in particular?

Has the poster had any success in this? [Updates are always fun].

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phpPro

13 years ago

off-topic: - apart from renting sites/ cpa and all, im really liking the whole concept of four hour work week, .... and getting 10k off a it. .... umm.... now thats a target i want to achieve next.

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Dasilva.

13 years ago

I do see the value in creating and renting a website focused on lead generation,
but jst renting a website because is in the front page of google would be kind of useless...

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OliverRealize

13 years ago

The rent a site model is very doable. You just have to offer value. The whole premise of the rent a site model is that the client pays a monthly fee and you take care of the design, hosting and marketing. Just do that well and you'll do fine. Local or national.

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TheNightOwl

13 years ago

Firstly... good post, beachrat.

-----------

Secondly, I think I'm getting confused about the difference between rental sites and lead-gen sites. Would someone be kind enough to clarify, please?

Here's my current understanding (you may see the hole/error here that I can't):

* Rental Site Model

- Simple site (1-page, 5-page, 20-page, whatever) with the number for Tony's Electrical Services plastered on it

- client doesn't touch the site

- leads contact Tony directly

- I ensure it stays ranked at #1

* Lead-Gen Site

- I put a tracking number on the site that forwards the call directly to their Tony the Electrician's number or (less ideally) goes to a recorded message, which is emailed to him for follow up later

- I get a monthly report so I know exactly how many calls the site generated

- I add a Contact Form that sends the leads to me and forwards them directly to Tony for follow up (I suppose this could be done with the Rental Site Model, too, right?)

What am I missing here?

They seem almost the same and, in fact, #1 doesn't sound very good to my ears because I don't know whether it's performing or not.

I'd much rather be in a situation where I know exactly how many leads the site generates for all kinds of reasons -- the most important being that if Tony can't convert those leads and decides to stop renting the site, I can approach another electrician in that area and say "It's consistently generated [XX] leads per month over the last [YY period]. Are you interested?"

There has to be something I'm overlooking here...

EDIT >>>>> Yep, there sure is. I must have been having a bonehead moment the other day when I wrote this because the answer (I think) just came to me:

1. Rental site model

Flat monthly fee irrespective of how many leads they get.

2. Lead-Gen

No monthly fee. Pay per lead only.

Is that right?

Duh... :rolleyes:

------------------------

Here's another issue I see:

* Google Places

1. I have no idea how it works in the US, but in Australia they send out a little postcard to your physical business address -- a PO Box is no good.

How, then, do I get to "own/control" the GooglePlaces account for [localarea01]electricians.com, [localarea02]electricians.com, [localarea03]electricians.com, [localarea04]electricians.com, etc

2. Why would someone want to rent a site that ranks below the Google Places listings? Especially if their own GooglePlaces listing (claimed or not; that's irrelevant for the time being) actually ranks above my little rental/lead-gen site?

I've done a little bit of testing (admittedly not much) and it seems that on the very specific local keywords Google Places lists at the top every time.

So, again, why would they rent my site?

And if I offered to optimise their Google Places page, get citations, etc., doesn't that diminish the attractiveness of my rental site even further?

Thanks,
TheNightOwl

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systemload

13 years ago

Originally Posted by TheNightOwl

Here's another issue I see:

* Google Places

1. I have no idea how it works in the US, but in Australia they send out a little postcard to your physical business address -- a PO Box is no good.

How, then, do I get to "own/control" the GooglePlaces account for [localarea01]electricians.com, [localarea02]electricians.com, [localarea03]electricians.com, [localarea04]electricians.com, etc

Interesting question..also struggling with...

Thanks

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payoman

13 years ago

Originally Posted by TheNightOwl

Firstly... good post, beachrat.

-----------

Secondly, I think I'm getting confused about the difference between rental sites and lead-gen sites. Would someone be kind enough to clarify, please?

Here's my current understanding (you may see the hole/error here that I can't):

* Rental Site Model

- Simple site (1-page, 5-page, 20-page, whatever) with the number for Tony's Electrical Services plastered on it

- client doesn't touch the site

- leads contact Tony directly

- I ensure it stays ranked at #1

* Lead-Gen Site

- I put a tracking number on the site that forwards the call directly to their Tony the Electrician's number or (less ideally) goes to a recorded message, which is emailed to him for follow up later

- I get a monthly report so I know exactly how many calls the site generated

- I add a Contact Form that sends the leads to me and forwards them directly to Tony for follow up (I suppose this could be done with the Rental Site Model, too, right?)

What am I missing here?

They seem almost the same and, in fact, #1 doesn't sound very good to my ears because I don't know whether it's performing or not.

I'd much rather be in a situation where I know exactly how many leads the site generates for all kinds of reasons -- the most important being that if Tony can't convert those leads and decides to stop renting the site, I can approach another electrician in that area and say "It's consistently generated [XX] leads per month over the last [YY period]. Are you interested?"

There has to be something I'm overlooking here...

EDIT >>>>> Yep, there sure is. I must have been having a bonehead moment the other day when I wrote this because the answer (I think) just came to me:

1. Rental site model

Flat monthly fee irrespective of how many leads they get.

2. Lead-Gen

No monthly fee. Pay per lead only.

Is that right?

Duh... :rolleyes:

------------------------

Here's another issue I see:

* Google Places

1. I have no idea how it works in the US, but in Australia they send out a little postcard to your physical business address -- a PO Box is no good.

How, then, do I get to "own/control" the GooglePlaces account for [localarea01]electricians.com, [localarea02]electricians.com, [localarea03]electricians.com, [localarea04]electricians.com, etc

2. Why would someone want to rent a site that ranks below the Google Places listings? Especially if their own GooglePlaces listing (claimed or not; that's irrelevant for the time being) actually ranks above my little rental/lead-gen site?

I've done a little bit of testing (admittedly not much) and it seems that on the very specific local keywords Google Places lists at the top every time.

So, again, why would they rent my site?

And if I offered to optimise their Google Places page, get citations, etc., doesn't that diminish the attractiveness of my rental site even further?

Thanks,
TheNightOwl

The answer to this, thankfully, is that it is possible to beat the Google places maps. Here is an example from my town :

https://www.google.com.au/webhp?rlz=...w=1360&bih=624

As you can see, there are 3 sites that have obviously been professionally SEO'd and they sit at the top of the search. So, if I am correct, if you backlink/SEO enough you can simply outrank the maps.

Thanks

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chrisnotes

13 years ago

Turn it into a directory site and rent listings out to 100 biz owners for $100 per month apiece. This way you can have 100 clients and only one site to manage, and you can focus all of your energy on one project instead of 10 or whatever. Plus, each new client gives you more site content and makes your site more authoritative.

They will naturally go out and place links to their site all over the place (a percentage of them) so your clients actually do alot of your SEO work for you with this model.

cha-ching!

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4morereferrals

13 years ago

Here's another issue I see:

* Google Places

1. I have no idea how it works in the US, but in Australia they send out a little postcard to your physical business address -- a PO Box is no good.

You need to get more info on how to get "farther" outside of the box to overcome this issue. Google mails the postcard verifications here in the USA too ...

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syncjam

13 years ago

Two questions;

1. If something like houstonplumber.com is taken, would houston-plumber.com still work as well (SEO-wise) since they have the same keywords?

2. How does a site like this get so many listings; elocalplumbers dot com

Thanks
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HassanAjmal 13 years ago

That shouldn't be a problem..

Originally Posted by syncjam

Two questions;

1. If something like houstonplumber.com is taken, would houston-plumber.com still work as well (SEO-wise) since they have the same keywords?
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Dr Dan

13 years ago

Originally Posted by syncjam

Two questions;

1. If something like houstonplumber.com is taken, would houston-plumber.com still work as well (SEO-wise) since they have the same keywords?

2. How does a site like this get so many listings; elocalplumbers dot com

RockStar Ben and myself just spoke at Mario Browns event about the lease site model.

This is really huge and only going to get bigger!

Dont be the dancing monkey for your clients and dont chase a paycheck!

Be the Virtual Real Estate Tycoon!

Be the Donald of the Virtual Real Estate!

Now... To answer your question:

1. Yes... But I prefer to get domains with no "-" I prefer a domain that sounds better and not just a seo domain. I use other authority sites to rank higher in the searches and just point back to my lease site. This way I control everything.

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AussieT

13 years ago

What a great thread I had read half of it before but lost track of it and finished it today. Bookmarking it for future reference. Will come back with some questions.

Thanks

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Saito

13 years ago

I think just about any business model that meets the general criteria Tim Ferriss outlines could become such a "Muse," but you will still have to pay the price.

Here's how: Bust your ass, make some money, hire people, meticulously coach and train them until they can run it on their own.

There is NO getting around this. You have to pay the price.

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InTh3Moment

13 years ago

MRomeo and iAmNameless, thank you guys for contributing so much here in this thread. Lots of great ideas all around. This forum really is amazing.

MRomeo, I don't have enough posts to PM but I am very interested in your setup (multiple I.P.s and private server) and am wondering how you recommend going about setting this up. Feel free to pm me whenever you get a chance. Thanks.

Thanks

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bmcgoff

13 years ago

Are these little "rental" sites with just a few pages of not very helpful content ranking these days? Anyone take a hit from Penguin? I can't see these kinds of sites outranking authority sites right now...

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Dr Dan

13 years ago

Originally Posted by bmcgoff

Are these little "rental" sites with just a few pages of not very helpful content ranking these days? Anyone take a hit from Penguin? I can't see these kinds of sites outranking authority sites right now...

Yes... they still work and we spank the Penguin cause we don't try to game Google or focus on SEO tricks

Too many people are trying to game Google and trying to figure out how to play nice with Google next zoo or farm animal update.

Focus on what buyers need and want. Focus on what they are searching for on the web and not what some free Adword tool tells you.

I have been doing this method for a few years now and was contributing on the forums on leasing sites before the warrior forum even had an offline marketing section.

Not much has changed... what I did back then... I still do today... with a few new little tricks

Do this... and you will be above 99% of the other marketers chasing their own tails....

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IM nice guy

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Dr Dan

Yes... they still work and we spank the Penguin cause we don't try to game Google or focus on SEO tricks

Hey Dan,

What about KMDs for local, are they still effective?

I stupidly went an invested in like 100 of them last year, and just haven't had the time to get into leasing yet... lols

Just wondering if I should bother renewing them and going with KMDs for the lease model?

Any help appreciated

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AussieT

13 years ago

Originally Posted by IM nice guy

Hey Dan,

What about KMDs for local, are they still effective?

I stupidly went an invested in like 100 of them last year, and just haven't had the time to get into leasing yet... lols

Just wondering if I should bother renewing them and going with KMDs for the lease model?

Any help appreciated

What a KMD?

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IM nice guy 13 years ago

Originally Posted by AussieT

What a KMD?

KMD = EMD

knowwahmsayin...
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nonin

13 years ago

hummm... interesting business module :?

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Stranger Danger

13 years ago

Keyword-Match Domain?

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AussieT 13 years ago

Originally Posted by Stranger Danger

Keyword-Match Domain?

So same as EMD
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Stranger Danger

13 years ago

I would assume so, yes.

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100k

13 years ago

Hows it going?

Are you amusing yourself .... see what I did there Terrible... -_- im soz.

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Rent this space.

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nonin

13 years ago

car rental sites are one of the most competitive ones - one of the highest pay per click rate - therefore in this niche sit loads of blackhat sharks

think twice

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henry Argueta

13 years ago

i think this type of business is better because you are on complete control and if they are not happy you can just look for someone else in the niche that will treat you better

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trader2300

12 years ago

I would like anyone who has any experience renting websites to small business owners to send me a message. This is a niche that I am looking to get into.

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umc 12 years ago

Originally Posted by trader2300

I would like anyone who has any experience renting websites to small business owners to send me a message. This is a niche that I am looking to get into.

Use the search feature. There are tons of threads on the rent a website model, and the lead generation model.
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