Create my own Boiler Room or Outsource Telemarketing?

20 replies
I'm kind of torn right now between creating my own boiler room with 3-5 appointment setters and 2-3 sales reps, or buying leads from telemarketing firms and/or work-from-home callers.

Pros of a boiler room: high energy of 5-8 people working together in one place at one time in a concentrated manner. The energy built up will help everyone involved. Daily contests and fun can also help production AND retention in a high turnover field. It would also help ME be a lot more productive and efficient, focusing primarily on expansion during those boiler room hours, and on the other aspects such as delivering the goods and customer support at other times.

Cons of a boiler room: high start up and running costs. That includes the callers, but also leasing a big enough room, and the phone bill. I have to find a way that the room/phones contracts are not binding but month to month. It also requires paying for ads and doing the interviews, training, etc. TIME. Plus the damn governments required paperwork since I have paid employees…


Here's how I figured the boiler room:

I had thought of only 3 working days, Tuesday to Thursday, 7 hour shifts that include 15 min of peptalk/training, 15m of "paperwork", 30m lunch break, so that's 6 hours of actual calls, in two 3 hour sessions, for only 3 days a week. Intense, concentrated work.

Sales reps/closers are on hand too to make calls of their own and get forwarded interested parties on the spot. $20 bills taped to the wall and nerf balls with surprise money as John Durham mentioned in another thread.

4 callers + 2 reps + myself = 7 people x 18 working hours = 126 hours of concentrated prospecting and closing in 3 days! Pretty good things can come out of this. Biggest pro is that it's scalable too. But of course it might not be as easy as it sounds to get 8 productive people and until then, there's money issues, not just time invested.


Feel free to find the flaws in this or to give tips for improvement. I have worked in a telemarketing firm but that was years ago. These days I do make calls but not with the volume I plan to do with a boiler room, and have only hired commission sales reps, not callers paid in hourly wages, so that's new to me. What do you think?
#boiler #create #outsource #room #telemarketing
  • Profile picture of the author pandemicsoul
    Have you implemented this plan yet? If so, any success? Very interested in hearing more, as I've been working on a very similar plan.

    One thing I've already done is track down an office for rent. Instead of doing a monthly contract, I found a company (there's lots of them!) that lease offices by the day. One of them was able to cut me a deal for a week, and I have that cost set in my budget. My thought is to use this for a week, and if I'm actually making money, use that to rent a permanent office space for my telemarketers. But until I can prove the model, I don't want to do that.
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  • Profile picture of the author MaxwellB
    If you have the money and failure won't cripple you financially, It sounds like your really want to do it. I think it's every business owners dream to have a kick ass sales team all in the same place, so is it a conflict of interest to tell you to do that? Yes

    But I honestly think you should do what you are passionate about and risk it failing before you do something that your not passionate about.

    So do it and let us know how it works out
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  • Profile picture of the author electronik69
    I personally think you should just be setting appointments over the phone not closing, your sales would at least triple, if you were actually meeting with the prospect, also you would be able to sell the service for more if you are meeting in person.

    But that's just my opinion.
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    • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
      Originally Posted by electronik69 View Post

      I personally think you should just be setting appointments over the phone not closing, your sales would at least triple, if you were actually meeting with the prospect, also you would be able to sell the service for more if you are meeting in person.

      But that's just my opinion.
      I don't think so.. too much time NOT being productive... when you consider the amount of time you have to prepare, drive, present, leave, you lose a lot of precious time that you could have closed another 1 or 2 sales.

      I never ask for the appointment.. but that's just me.
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    • Profile picture of the author MonteMichaels
      Originally Posted by electronik69 View Post

      I personally think you should just be setting appointments over the phone not closing, your sales would at least triple, if you were actually meeting with the prospect, also you would be able to sell the service for more if you are meeting in person.

      But that's just my opinion.
      You can't triple the sales with appointments. You will need someone to run those appointments, then pay for the transportation to get there. May be a higher closing ratio than closing on the phone, but not going to be anywhere near triple the sales.

      The cost per sale will most likely be higher.
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      • Profile picture of the author RedShifted
        Originally Posted by MonteMichaels View Post

        You can't triple the sales with appointments. You will need someone to run those appointments, then pay for the transportation to get there. May be a higher closing ratio than closing on the phone, but not going to be anywhere near triple the sales.

        The cost per sale will most likely be higher.
        That does depend on the business my friend.

        In our business you more than triple sales. We'd be out of business if we tried to close sales on the phone. For a lot of home improvement businesses it will be like that. I know this site is mostly internet marketers, but just saying.
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  • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
    Jay,
    toooo much to post discussion wise. For me any ways...

    If you want and you have an hr or maybe 2 for some phone time, some time tomorrow evening.

    I can answer some of the questions you might be having.

    I prob wont give you any advice, but i can definitely tell you what i have been through with , appointment setters, sales rooms, and virtual sales rooms.

    As well as give you some real world numbers that we track , like calls vrs sales / talk time... hidden expenses and what not.
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  • Profile picture of the author Aermud
    I recommend getting your reps on Callburner. It handles voicemail drops, emails, and has a good CRM
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    • Profile picture of the author pandemicsoul
      Originally Posted by Aermud View Post

      I recommend getting your reps on Callburner. It handles voicemail drops, emails, and has a good CRM
      Do you have a link? the only one I can find on Google by that name seems to just be a a Skype call recorder.
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      • Profile picture of the author Aermud
        Originally Posted by pandemicsoul View Post

        Do you have a link? the only one I can find on Google by that name seems to just be a a Skype call recorder.
        More contacts. Faster results! - Phone Burner

        I always get these two confused! It's Phone Burner not Call burner... I recommend picking up The Chase Formula by Mike Kooch. That training has helped me build my offline business. I have two 1099'd appointment setters on phone burner two days out of the week. It's really helped me build my business.
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  • Profile picture of the author The Sales Guy
    Originally Posted by Jay Rhome View Post

    I'm kind of torn right now between creating my own boiler room with 3-5 appointment setters and 2-3 sales reps, or buying leads from telemarketing firms and/or work-from-home callers.

    Pros of a boiler room: high energy of 5-8 people working together in one place at one time in a concentrated manner. The energy built up will help everyone involved. Daily contests and fun can also help production AND retention in a high turnover field. It would also help ME be a lot more productive and efficient, focusing primarily on expansion during those boiler room hours, and on the other aspects such as delivering the goods and customer support at other times.

    Cons of a boiler room: high start up and running costs. That includes the callers, but also leasing a big enough room, and the phone bill. I have to find a way that the room/phones contracts are not binding but month to month. It also requires paying for ads and doing the interviews, training, etc. TIME. Plus the damn governments required paperwork since I have paid employees…


    Here's how I figured the boiler room:

    I had thought of only 3 working days, Tuesday to Thursday, 7 hour shifts that include 15 min of peptalk/training, 15m of "paperwork", 30m lunch break, so that's 6 hours of actual calls, in two 3 hour sessions, for only 3 days a week. Intense, concentrated work.

    Sales reps/closers are on hand too to make calls of their own and get forwarded interested parties on the spot. $20 bills taped to the wall and nerf balls with surprise money as John Durham mentioned in another thread.

    4 callers + 2 reps + myself = 7 people x 18 working hours = 126 hours of concentrated prospecting and closing in 3 days! Pretty good things can come out of this. Biggest pro is that it's scalable too. But of course it might not be as easy as it sounds to get 8 productive people and until then, there's money issues, not just time invested.


    Feel free to find the flaws in this or to give tips for improvement. I have worked in a telemarketing firm but that was years ago. These days I do make calls but not with the volume I plan to do with a boiler room, and have only hired commission sales reps, not callers paid in hourly wages, so that's new to me. What do you think?
    Jay, be careful what language you use on an open forum. "Boiler room" isn't a term I would bandy about on here. Do understand, it makes not a peep of a difference to me - as I've surely worked in a few. However...

    1. People might get the wrong idea about you or your intentions

    2. As I mentioned above, this being an open forum, there's no telling who reads these boards, and the words "boiler room" could catch the wrong persons attention, hint, hint

    Just throwing it out there
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    • Profile picture of the author Jay Rhome
      Wow. Obviously when I came back to the forum a few times, my thread was so buried I didn't think anyone had replied to it! Well nobody had replied for 21 days. So sorry about my lack of response I actually found it by looking for phoneburner reviews! It was one of two systems recommended by Mike Cooch as Aermud stated.


      Originally Posted by electronik69 View Post

      I personally think you should just be setting appointments over the phone not closing, your sales would at least triple, if you were actually meeting with the prospect, also you would be able to sell the service for more if you are meeting in person.
      Like others have said, sure the RATIO of closes is much higher in person, but you can talk to so many more people over the phone, and all over the map, that I'm convinced it makes a lot more money over the phone. If I was in a local business model, or where leads are scarce, then I'd meet face-to-face. But not with my current model.


      Originally Posted by The Sales Guy View Post

      Jay, be careful what language you use on an open forum. "Boiler room" isn't a term I would bandy about on here.
      Ah? I have no idea why, but I'm sure there is one! I didn't think it was a "forbidenn topic" around here


      Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

      Jay,
      toooo much to post discussion wise. For me any ways...

      If you want and you have an hr or maybe 2 for some phone time, some time tomorrow evening.

      I can answer some of the questions you might be having.

      I prob wont give you any advice, but i can definitely tell you what i have been through with , appointment setters, sales rooms, and virtual sales rooms.

      As well as give you some real world numbers that we track , like calls vrs sales / talk time... hidden expenses and what not.
      Obviously I missed your post and very generous offer. I'll PM you about this.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jay Rhome
    Originally Posted by pandemicsoul View Post

    Instead of doing a monthly contract, I found a company (there's lots of them!) that lease offices by the day. One of them was able to cut me a deal for a week, and I have that cost set in my budget. My thought is to use this for a week, and if I'm actually making money, use that to rent a permanent office space for my telemarketers. But until I can prove the model, I don't want to do that.
    Wow. Day to day renting? In my parts, it's usually 3 YEARS for commercial offices - but it won't stop me from negotiating. Many commercial places are empty so they can't all play hard ball!

    What I'll probably do now, is partner up with a running company, that has space in their office. I have already two possibilities - and one of them have clients which could totally benefit from my offers so we'd both make more money as well :p

    And if it doesn't work out, I just move out and find somewhere else.
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    • Profile picture of the author pandemicsoul
      Originally Posted by Jay Rhome View Post

      Wow. Day to day renting? In my parts, it's usually 3 YEARS for commercial offices - but it won't stop me from negotiating. Many commercial places are empty so they can't all play hard ball!
      Well, keep in mind that these aren't normal office set-ups. They're for people who generally work from home or whatnot, for them to have an office for a few days of the month that they need to have a professional appearance. But, at least in my area (major metropolitan) there are a ton of these places that are very flexible with their space.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Most people get it Jay; "boiler room"... I wouldnt worry about it, you're legit.

    Ps. You are right on about the 'live energy' element.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jay Rhome
    My current "calling center" challenge is I have an Asian man, with obvious business experience and ability to drive sales and sales people, come see me about my project and services, and wants me to hire him at a Base Pay + commission. I did plan to hire a manager later on, AFTER the reps where there already and I wanted to delegate this part, but with a steady cashflow already running.

    He turns this around on its head. He basically would do the hiring and a lot of the managing, at least for the Asian guys he gets on board, and focus his part of the sales mainly on the Asian markets in North America. I'd mix in my own reps and callers as I oversee everything still.

    It can be a massive growth opportunity for me, but it also raises the risks - both financially as I have to pay him, and well, he could potentially run with my intellectual property. He has contacts for a room ideal to set up a call center, and with a sales terminal business that has restaurants as clients, has owned a restaurant himself, etc. And Asians can penetrate their market more easily that any "outsider" ever could. The fact that he finds the set up, and does the hiring, etc. justifies that he gets paid.

    But then again, I don't need him, he doesn't me. I'm torn about this, but I did want to set up a calling center (to use another term without any boiling in it ) for the energy, and this guy has a ton. He'd kick my butt as well and frankly, I need it too. This is what I feel would be more useful in this. I have to craft a thorough agreement though of what I want in exchange for that base pay, and do it step-by-step. Anyone ever come across a similar situation?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by Jay Rhome View Post

      My current "calling center" challenge is I have an Asian man, with obvious business experience and ability to drive sales and sales people, come see me about my project and services, and wants me to hire him at a Base Pay + commission. I did plan to hire a manager later on, AFTER the reps where there already and I wanted to delegate this part, but with a steady cashflow already running.

      He turns this around on its head. He basically would do the hiring and a lot of the managing, at least for the Asian guys he gets on board, and focus his part of the sales mainly on the Asian markets in North America. I'd mix in my own reps and callers as I oversee everything still.

      It can be a massive growth opportunity for me, but it also raises the risks - both financially as I have to pay him, and well, he could potentially run with my intellectual property. He has contacts for a room ideal to set up a call center, and with a sales terminal business that has restaurants as clients, has owned a restaurant himself, etc. And Asians can penetrate their market more easily that any "outsider" ever could. The fact that he finds the set up, and does the hiring, etc. justifies that he gets paid.

      But then again, I don't need him, he doesn't me. I'm torn about this, but I did want to set up a calling center (to use another term without any boiling in it ) for the energy, and this guy has a ton. He'd kick my butt as well and frankly, I need it too. This is what I feel would be more useful in this. I have to craft a thorough agreement though of what I want in exchange for that base pay, and do it step-by-step. Anyone ever come across a similar situation?

      Always hire on your terms. Never position yourself where the tail could wag the dog.

      Hire people who are going to do what you say and implement your plan.
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      • Profile picture of the author Jay Rhome
        Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

        Always hire on your terms. Never position yourself where the tail could wag the dog.

        Hire people who are going to do what you say and implement your plan.
        I couldn't agree more... before meeting this guy.

        He would have too much leverage and power for my liking, the tail could indeed wag the dog, BUT, the most he can do if he's got bad intentions is steal my pricing structure, contracts, etc. What it mean is if doesn't pan out, I simply go my own way. I don't lose my company. Just some market shares and reps, all which can be rebuilt.

        I admit it would suck quite a lot for someone to come in and use all my hard work like that, could get nasty with lawsuits (I do have NDA and do not contact my clients for one year after you leave in the contract) yet he could still have given a good boost which in the end benefits me as well. That's for the worst case scenario. I still do the contracts to my company name, customer service, product delivery, etc.

        My plan was to hire guys like him after the cashflow was there and reps were on board. So it's not my plan... but it's still in line with my objective. Plans can be adapted.

        In my fact, I feel that with a driven stick & carrot manager that has a more nasty streak than I have, I can lower the pay structure for reps yet hire the same amounts and have them produce more than by my current "carrot" method. And after X amounts of sales, they'll be back to the higher payouts anyway, but only for the producers. The lower pay structure for new reps would pay his salary.

        So there are potential downsides here, but benefits as well.
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          Originally Posted by Jay Rhome View Post

          I couldn't agree more... before meeting this guy.

          He would have too much leverage and power for my liking, the tail could indeed wag the dog, BUT, the most he can do if he's got bad intentions is steal my pricing structure, contracts, etc.
          Most people dont "come on" with bad intentions, they develop over time.

          Also, its natural for a man who has more control over your business than you do, to want to overtake you.

          I would keep it simple, keep the big keys out of site as much as possible.

          For instance if I had a room of telemarketers they would be convinced that I had 80% over head.

          No way I would let them know they were making me a ton of profit.

          They would think I was partnered up with a web design company who got 50% of the gross.

          Never give them leverage.

          I once apologized to a telemarketer for something and the greatest manager I ever met in my life, said to me "Never apologize. These people look up to you. You can Never Be wrong. You will blow the image".

          Through the years I've learned the reasons he was right, mostly through becoming gullible and learning the hard lessons of it..."

          And I learned how to never be wrong eventually.

          Want the secret?

          "Keep It Simple".

          Give people a simple plan and dont stray from it. Stick to the basics and the basic principles. Its more duplicable, and they are never wrong.

          When you hire someone its important to lead them immediately...not the other way around.

          Give them a basic task that produces a predictable result that you "know", and let them have at it. Thats their job to do what you set out before them.

          Some of my biggest failures early on were from a lack of understanding how to delegate.


          Ps. You dont have to have a nasty streak to take control Jay, just be the man with the plan that leads people to VICTORY!

          Then everyone else will say it for you "Dont question Jay, he's always right! Just do what he says and you'll succeed...", and your straightforwardness will have been in Love.

          If you love the guys in your room who get higher pay, then make newbies work hard to earn their position in that group, your stars will respect you, and newbies will respect their position in the group and strive for it.

          Just like the "insanity" work out they will say "Im hardcore and I earned it"- and you will say "You're damn right you're hardcore!" and they will beam with pride and take a commission check home to their young wife and 3 kids and say "Im hardcore honey! And I earned this commission because Im a finely tuned MACHINE at what I do!"

          Lol....dont get me started.

          I used to hold signs up when someone would quit because they couldnt take the pressure...

          They would walk out the door, and then on the next daily quarterly meeting I would hold their name up on a sheet of paper... and say "Dennis Williamson...?"

          And the whole room would yell "NOT-HARD-CORE!", and we would throw the name in the trash... and hollar for a second or two like warriors.

          Then I'd say "You know what to do. Now let's rock!", and turn on AC/DC "Back in Black" (our theme song) in the back ground and the phones would start humming.

          (ah the glory days).

          It let them know they were high caliber pro's and not just anybody could be them.


          Ps Jay,

          The owner of that center managed "me" remotely. I just had to text him 4 times a day the numbers and at shifts end.

          I saw him for maybe an hour or two per week when he would drive up in a new vette or on a 30k custom built harley.

          I also text him morning roll call, so he could make his daily projections (he knew his numbers) which were always exceeded almost.
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          • Profile picture of the author Jay Rhome
            Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

            Most people dont "come on" with bad intentions, they develop over time.
            That I don't mind as much. I respect ambition. And human nature makes it quite possible some relations might sour over time. If I can't find a way to give you what you want, you can leave. Just be honest about it. Anyway, you can't contact the clients you found for one year, there's a NDA, etc. And while you were here you built an asset, so we both got what we wanted for a while.

            It's the guy coming in with idea of stealing the contracts and agreements, modus operandi, price ranges, you know, all that took so much tinkering to build, this is the guy I'm worried about. There's so little protection against that if he takes this and run, and you don't find what company you can sue...

            For instance if I had a room of telemarketers they would be convinced that I had 80% over head. No way I would let them know they were making me a ton of profit.
            I hear you. I won't lie, but I don't have to tell!

            Ps. You dont have to have a nasty streak to take control Jay, just be the man with the plan that leads people to VICTORY!
            I'm a nice guy with an hostile streak I'm usually nice by default, but if someone takes that for weakness, or tries to push me over, I can be quite the enemy you don't want. In other words, I don't have the daily meanness to drive callers and reps the hard way, but I won't be won over by wimpy complaints and demands either. I'm a hard, but nice guy.

            As I come from being an entrepreneur, or self-employed, or have worked in commission only sales job, I like my freedom... and I give it as well. Yet I fully realize I need to be pushed and be held accountable to produce more, and people in general certainly need to be driven. It's not just my strong point and I know that. I can do it for a while though I'm pretty sure, but still not as good as good managers can.

            The owner of that center managed "me" remotely. I just had to text him 4 times a day the numbers and at shifts end.

            I saw him for maybe an hour or two per week when he would drive up in a new vette or on a 30k custom built harley.

            I also text him morning roll call, so he could make his daily projections (he knew his numbers) which were always exceeded almost.
            Can I ask how did he keep you in? Since you're good and you know you can make more on your own, how did he find the right carrot to keep you?
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