What do you all do to close a deal over the phone - National or regional

by Gatsby
93 replies
Hi everyone, first want to say thanks to everyone for making such a great place to learn from. I know this is my first post, but I have had some experience in sales - though I thinks its a bit old fashioned and I wanted to get some feedback on my new plan based on what I have been learning here.

I have closed sales in person doing things like selling web sites in the past, but nothing like what is described in this forum. I want to be able to close over the phone, and am just getting into the possibility of it.

For one, I just moved from a rural area to a more metropolitan area with far more potential (so I am really excited and eager). Second, I came across using mikogo for an online presentation and that got me thinking of doing the following; so take this all as a question about what you all think or do about closing a sale over the phone when it comes to essential web design and SEO sort of work.

I am usually trying for SEO for 500-1500 down and then 150 to 250 a month but I have only got people interested in web design ( I have one client and two interested with proposals).

I plan on making a sales plan to contact at minimum 300 people a week in a 3 hour driving radius, in case I need to meet in person. (I have not done this kind of campaign before, so this is still a test run for a week or two).

I am going to limit myself to going after one niche at a time and am using online resources to locate city names and search google for targets.

I have a small list that I want to qualify their need/want/afford criteria when I talk to the first contact.

1. Do you have a need for SEO
2. Do you want SEO
3. Can you afford SEO (see my price range above

I will start to move this towards a close by saying:
Do you have some time now or can we schedule a meeting Wednesday or Thursday?

I will start to move towards the idea of closing with a contract with:
Ok great, in order to move forward I'd like to set you up with an account (then confirm their contact information and any other decision makers)

I plan on telling them I will get started and send out a contract (email) which they can print out and mail back, after which I will bill them through the mail. I can save the credit card stuff for later, this is why I am starting out where things are close enough to drive out there.

At this time, I would be happy to just get 10 clients signed up, and then change my strategy for the next level.

If you have read this far - hey thanks. Now, could anyone give me some feedback if I am headed in the right direction or are there any critical things you are doing when your main goal is closing web development and SEO over the phone?

Right off, for anyone responding to this - I really appreciate and thank you for any kind of input you can give.
#close #deal #national #phone #regional
  • Profile picture of the author cjt1971
    I'm not sure, but I think IAmNameless has posted a few times about the general idea of how to do it. If I remember correctly he mentioned closing mentality vs appointment mentality. Also a lot of the John Durham threads deal with phone closing and the 3 closes out of 10 pitches percentages. I'll try to find some of those and they may be in the thread I started.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6516622].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Gatsby
      Originally Posted by cjt1971 View Post

      I'm not sure, but I think IAmNameless has posted a few times about the general idea of how to do it. If I remember correctly he mentioned closing mentality vs appointment mentality. Also a lot of the John Durham threads deal with phone closing and the 3 closes out of 10 pitches percentages. I'll try to find some of those and they may be in the thread I started.
      Thanks CJ, yeah I am still here checking things out and John Durham and IAmNameless are coming up quite a bit - really interesting taking in what they are laying out.

      I think the closing vs appointment is very close to what I am getting at. Like I have laid out above is going to the appointment thing; I will be trying to move more towards a closing type, but probably not until I can start a payment system online or over the phone. Either way, who doesn't want to close more efficiently (is that a mental trap or just me making excuses?)

      I appreciate the pointers - will lookup what I can about the 3/10

      Thanks
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6516644].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author scottgallagher
    First, let me say welcome and glad you're posting!

    Although sales experience isn't necessary, it's a critical piece of experience I believe you bring to the table for this business. While Sales is the one of two ways to really climb the corporate latter, second to none, it's imo the single greatest skill to bring to the success of this business, at least when working with local businesses.

    I don't like come on here and offer something that is promotional, however I genuinely feel you may gain value from the hour of this video that is genuine passion sharing my experiences.

    I have 20 years of B2B sales experience and 7 years building a local internet marketing agency, among a couple of other businesses. This video is simply me trying to share my experiences crammed into an hour. Obviously I can't share everything I have in an hour, so I do my best at painting the whole picture.

    Fortunately you'll be able to relate your sales experiences to the services I'm discussing.

    Here's a backdoor link to this presentation. It's not on any fancy page, or any page for that matter, no opt-in or stuff. It's a direct download. Skip the 5 min pitch at the end if you chose.

    Selling Internet Marketing Services to Local Businesses: A Plan for $10k/mth Recurring

    If you enjoyed this video, go ahead and opt-in, we'll send you some more stuff gratis.
    Signature
    Father, Entrepreneur, Author, Adranalist
    I teach entrepreneurs to build a sustainable Internet Marketing Agency with real value. I have many free resources and paid training programs available

    -->My Training Website
    -->My Agency Website
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6516862].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Gatsby
      Thanks for the info Scott. I am getting your video to come down WOW 500+ megs. I went ahead and got your report; great looking information. I am about to give my plan a shot tomorrow - if I get up early enough for the gym and a brisk workout; I'll be bright and early. I will check out your video and look forward to adding some of the results I go through tomorrow. Again, thanks for the remarks everyone. Here's to new beginnings and wishing everyone killer success!

      Originally Posted by scottgallagher View Post

      First, let me say welcome and glad you're posting!

      Although sales experience isn't necessary, it's a critical piece of experience I believe you bring to the table for this business...
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6516962].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author alfid
    Closing over the phone can be tougher than in person. However, I suppose if you have samples of your work you can send via e-mail or if you can video chat that could enhance your sales experience too.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6517089].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      Originally Posted by alfid View Post

      Closing over the phone can be tougher than in person. However, I suppose if you have samples of your work you can send via e-mail or if you can video chat that could enhance your sales experience too.
      That is just not true. So why say it?

      Just because you find it harder, does not mean it is.
      It just means you don't know what your doing.
      Signature

      Selling Ain't for Sissies
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6517892].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author EnzoBlaque
      Originally Posted by alfid View Post

      Closing over the phone can be tougher than in person. However, I suppose if you have samples of your work you can send via e-mail or if you can video chat that could enhance your sales experience too.
      This is 100% true in any instance. It all come down to what you are trying to close over the phone. An appointment, or an actual sale.

      I wouldn't ever advise you to close a sale over the phone, simply because I know I wouldn't agree to hand over money on the basis of what someone has told me during a cold call.

      There shouldn't really be any resistance, on your prospects side, to agreeing to an appointment. Unless indeed you reached them via a cold call, which always decreases the probability of you closing.

      My advice to you would be to learn ways in which you can warm up your cold calls. Remember - If a prospect comes to you instead of the opposite, you will find yourself being 10 times more able to convert
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6518357].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author scottgallagher
    @Gatsby - sorry about the size. had a little talk with my video guy. It's at 720p, that's why. We don't need that quality! We've got the file size down now and soon will have it uploaded with same link.

    @kenmichaels - based on what claim do you think that closing on the telephone yields the same results as in person? To me this simple statistic about our ability to influence human behavior puts little value on your claim. it seems rather rude to suggest that someone is ignorant about their opinion, when you provide no supporting evidence. Here's some proof that it's possible you are in fact the ignorant one here.

    Take for example Albert Mehrabian's 1967 study about influencing human behavior....which is now a widely accepted breakdown in corporate America.

    7-38-55 -- says that with 100 basis points to influence human behavior, such as demonstrate value and allow them to make a decision, 7% of our ability is in the words we chose, 38% is our tone and 55% is our physiology.

    Therefore, over the telephone you have lost a major portion, 55% of your influential ability on others. With less influence, naturally your conversion numbers drop.

    Not to mention is exactly what I've personally experienced over 20 years of doing this -- selling to SMB's.

    Although face-to-face yields a higher conversion, you can put more telephone leads into a manageable sales funnel, potentially resulting in greater profits at the end of the day.

    The top line feeds egos, the bottom line feeds the bank account!
    Signature
    Father, Entrepreneur, Author, Adranalist
    I teach entrepreneurs to build a sustainable Internet Marketing Agency with real value. I have many free resources and paid training programs available

    -->My Training Website
    -->My Agency Website
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6520455].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      Originally Posted by scottgallagher View Post

      @kenmichaels - based on what claim do you think that closing on the telephone yields the same results as in person? To me this simple statistic about our ability to influence human behavior puts little value on your claim. it seems rather rude to suggest that someone is ignorant about their opinion, when you provide no supporting evidence. Here's some proof that it's possible you are in fact the ignorant one here.
      Well good for you, obviously you know how to read and quote people...awesome

      i know know how to sell , on the phone, face to face, out of a card board box on the side of a freeway if i had to.

      your quotes mean absolutely nothing compared to real world results.

      Originally Posted by scottgallagher View Post

      Not to mention is exactly what I've personally experienced over 20 years of doing this -- selling to SMB's.
      well then i guess you suck at it too, sorry about that bro, we cant all be closers.
      Signature

      Selling Ain't for Sissies
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6520571].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author thehazard
        @kenmichaels, so what are some effective methods of closing over the phone that have worked for you?
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521115].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
          Originally Posted by thehazard View Post

          @kenmichaels, so what are some effective methods of closing over the phone that have worked for you?
          here are 2 links, in one i mention how to close websites

          This one has a HUGE amount of fantastic information
          from some of the best salesmen in this forum

          i only post in the offline section and the basement.
          in the basement its just idle chit chat, in the off line section
          i only talk about sales ... telephone sales specific, so if
          you click on my stats, then you can follow my posts

          most of them will be about how i do sales. if you have any specif
          questions ill be more then happy to answer them

          just ask in the thread you have questions about, or start a new thread
          i don't want to continue feeding the trolls in this one.
          Signature

          Selling Ain't for Sissies
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521430].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author scottgallagher
    @kenmichaels - fair enough. Sorry to bother you. There is no need to degrade because I'm simply trying to offer a different perspective.

    I wish you the best Ken.
    Signature
    Father, Entrepreneur, Author, Adranalist
    I teach entrepreneurs to build a sustainable Internet Marketing Agency with real value. I have many free resources and paid training programs available

    -->My Training Website
    -->My Agency Website
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6520968].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      Originally Posted by scottgallagher View Post

      @kenmichaels - fair enough. Sorry to bother you. There is no need to degrade because I'm simply trying to offer a different perspective.

      I wish you the best Ken.
      if that's true, telling me i am ignorant, was not the way to go about it.
      Signature

      Selling Ain't for Sissies
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521008].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
      Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

      This is 100% true in any instance. It all come down to what you are trying to close over the phone. An appointment, or an actual sale.

      I wouldn't ever advise you to close a sale over the phone, simply because I know I wouldn't agree to hand over money on the basis of what someone has told me during a cold call.

      There shouldn't really be any resistance, on your prospects side, to agreeing to an appointment. Unless indeed you reached them via a cold call, which always decreases the probability of you closing.

      My advice to you would be to learn ways in which you can warm up your cold calls. Remember - If a prospect comes to you instead of the opposite, you will find yourself being 10 times more able to convert
      You're just incompetent, that's all there really is to it. I don't give a flying you know what if you don't pay someone over the phone, why on earth would I care what you do? You aren't my market.... you aren't qualified...

      Guys... it's not about WHO DOESN'T want to receive calls... it doesn't matter who WON'T pay over the phone.. the ONLY thing that matters is the ones that do, and there are plenty out there.

      While you guys are busy setting appointments, I'm busy CLOSING! You take your little meetings and presentations, while I'll continue one call closing. I'm not confined to one geographical area... I can call locally, 100 miles away, 1,000 miles away, I can even call your mom, girlfriend, and your girlfriend's parents. While you're asking for a meeting, I'm getting bank account information over the phone.

      Now lets show how inefficient your are being compared to closing over the phone.

      You call around asking for appointments, lets say it takes you 8 hours, and you get 3 appointments set up for the next day.

      Those 3 appointments are going to probably take up half your day and you may not walk away with a check... maybe itll take a week for you to get your money.

      While you're setting up appointments in those 8 hours, I have already made a sale, maybe 2... maybe more.... next day, I made another sale, while you're giving a presentation to someone you don't know if they are interested or not.

      Wouldn't recommend closing over the phone? Cool, keep being inefficient while I'll keep being efficient, proactive, and killing it.

      Kenmichaels is absolutely correct... you just aren't good at it.


      Originally Posted by scottgallagher View Post


      @kenmichaels - based on what claim do you think that closing on the telephone yields the same results as in person? To me this simple statistic about our ability to influence human behavior puts little value on your claim. it seems rather rude to suggest that someone is ignorant about their opinion, when you provide no supporting evidence. Here's some proof that it's possible you are in fact the ignorant one here.

      Take for example Albert Mehrabian's 1967 study about influencing human behavior....which is now a widely accepted breakdown in corporate America.

      7-38-55 -- says that with 100 basis points to influence human behavior, such as demonstrate value and allow them to make a decision, 7% of our ability is in the words we chose, 38% is our tone and 55% is our physiology.

      Therefore, over the telephone you have lost a major portion, 55% of your influential ability on others. With less influence, naturally your conversion numbers drop.

      Not to mention is exactly what I've personally experienced over 20 years of doing this -- selling to SMB's.

      Although face-to-face yields a higher conversion, you can put more telephone leads into a manageable sales funnel, potentially resulting in greater profits at the end of the day.

      The top line feeds egos, the bottom line feeds the bank account!
      Cool stuff... but we all know the only numbers that matter, are our own.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521111].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author EnzoBlaque
        Ignorance at it's best. It seems to me that you know very little. Out of ALL prospecting methods cold calling has the LOWEST return. Everyone in the marketing industry knows this.

        Some people will create pathetic excuses to continue their cold calling such as; "you only need to close one out of every 100 calls".. I say that is the most ridiculous thing anyone can ever say.

        I receive numerous cold calls weekly, and I can personally tell you that cold calling is intrusive, annoying, disrespectful of everyone's time and downright bothersome.

        You can only make so many cold calls in a day, meaning your potential is now finite rather than infinite. Why would I limit my success to the amount of time I have to make some phone calls? Cold calling makes time work against you rather than for you.

        Don't let your ignorance and laziness stop you from discovering the millions of other prospecting methods out there.

        Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

        You're just incompetent, that's all there really is to it. I don't give a flying you know what if you don't pay someone over the phone, why on earth would I care what you do? You aren't my market.... you aren't qualified...
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521221].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
          Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

          Ignorance at it's best. It seems to me that you know very little. Out of ALL prospecting methods cold calling has the LOWEST return. Everyone in the marketing industry knows this.

          Some people will create pathetic excuses to continue their cold calling such as; "you only need to close one out of every 100 calls".. I say that is the most ridiculous thing anyone can ever say.

          I receive numerous cold calls weekly, and I can personally tell you that cold calling is intrusive, annoying, disrespectful of everyone's time and downright bothersome.

          You can only make so many cold calls in a day, meaning your potential is now finite rather than infinite. Why would I limit my success to the amount of time I have to make some phone calls? Cold calling makes time work against you rather than for you.

          Don't let your ignorance and laziness stop you from discovering the millions of other prospecting methods out there.
          I like how you throw out the words ignorant and laziness... see, that isn't what I would use to describe you, I'm thinking more like idiotic, moronic, and along those lines, but now that we have our name calling out of the way let me dispute your other insulting assumptions that are based on absolutely nothing but the convoluted thoughts you conjured up.

          Conversions and efficiency are completely different. 1 call out of 100 with cold calling, and 1 out of 4 by appointments, is irrelevant. I don't give a hot damn what your conversion is face to face when I can make a sale in an hour, every hour, with cold calling. Can you do the same with appointments?

          I don't know what it's like in the UK, maybe you're too uptight or scared of success to pick up the phone and interrupt someone with their fish and chips or tea and crumpets but here in the US we prefer to do what it takes to succeed.

          I don't care if you find it annoying, intrusive, or disrespectful... you aren't my market. My market doesn't mind... It is down right STUPID and IDIOTIC to say that you would find it annoying to have someone call you and able to solve a problem you have. If you're that narrow minded then you have no business, IN BUSINESS!!!!

          Now lets get to the point where you say I'm close minded about any other forms of marketing.... ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?!? My marketing is more complete than most businesses could even fathom. Cold calling, mass email marketing, social media marketing, SEO, a network of hundreds of websites all ranking for different keywords and feeding into my funnel, direct mailing, pay per click advertising, niche related forum posting, networking meetings and groups... NOW I AM LAZY??? Listen here... I work on average 14-16 hours a day, every day of the week. Why do I do that? BECAUSE I WANT TO SUCCEED.

          I want success so much and I love business so much that I am constantly thinking about how to make it grow. Ask any member on here that has me on their skype or who calls me regularly asking for advice, input or ideas... my mind is constantly working. When I eat, I'm eating while working... when I take a ****, a shower, or go to sleep, I do all that while thinking and formulating plans to grow my business. What do you do? Discredit a form of marketing that Is PROVEN to work and EXPLODE businesses?

          A roofing company that is a client of mine is pulling in over 1 mill a month from cold calling residential. Doesn't work?

          ATT makes millions from cold calling, every month.

          Carnival cruises makes a fortune from cold calling... charter communications makes a killing from cold calling. Edward Jones and other financial groups get their client base by cold calling... INEFFICIENT? Please....

          Lowest return?? That is simply untrue.. you're confusing ROI and conversions.... every marketer should know the difference.

          Don't come at me talking about me being ignorant and lazy... my worst form of bringing in clients is probably better than your best area.

          If I'm lazy... Regions Online Banking | Awesome Screenshot that's pretty good for a lazy man.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521392].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author EnzoBlaque
            Not interested in your ramble. Cold calling is just a glorified form of begging. You'd have to be insane and ignorant to have the beliefs that you do.

            Do doctors call you at random times to ask if you happen to be sick and therefore in need of an appointment? Do dentists call you unexpectedly to ask if you have a toothache and therefore need dental services? Do auto mechanics call you without warning to say, "Let's choose a mutually agreeable time for you to bring your car in so we can examine it and determine if you are in need of our services?" Of course not. Why? Because that would be ridiculous.

            Cold calling is nothing but a lazy man's excuse.

            If you actually engaged your brain, you'd realise that you can reach a much wider audience through other methods that will induce prospects to call you instead of you calling them first. Then, and only then, will your value in the eyes of the prospect go up exponentially.

            Many ignorant people, such as yourself, don't even think it's possible to do anything other than cold call to generate leads. Not only do they fail to look for alternatives to cold calling, they reject outright the idea that alternatives even exist, let alone the fact that alternatives to cold calling happen to be far more effective.

            Its good that you are eager to make some sales. Thats a good thing. My advice to you would be to buy some marketing books, get educated on the subject and then implement some tactics.


            Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

            I like how you throw out the words ignorant and laziness... see, that isn't what I would use to describe you, I'm thinking more like idiotic, moronic, and along those lines, but now that we have our name calling out of the way let me dispute your other insulting assumptions that are based on absolutely nothing but the convoluted thoughts you conjured up.

            Conversions and efficiency are completely different. 1 call out of 100 with cold calling, and 1 out of 4 by appointments, is irrelevant. I don't give a hot damn what your conversion is face to face when I can make a sale in an hour, every hour, with cold calling. Can you do the same with appointments?

            I don't know what it's like in the UK, maybe you're too uptight or scared of success to pick up the phone and interrupt someone with their fish and chips or tea and crumpets but here in the US we prefer to do what it takes to succeed.

            I don't care if you find it annoying, intrusive, or disrespectful... you aren't my market. My market doesn't mind... It is down right STUPID and IDIOTIC to say that you would find it annoying to have someone call you and able to solve a problem you have. If you're that narrow minded then you have no business, IN BUSINESS!!!!

            Now lets get to the point where you say I'm close minded about any other forms of marketing.... ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?!? My marketing is more complete than most businesses could even fathom. Cold calling, mass email marketing, social media marketing, SEO, a network of hundreds of websites all ranking for different keywords and feeding into my funnel, direct mailing, pay per click advertising, niche related forum posting, networking meetings and groups... NOW I AM LAZY??? Listen here... I work on average 14-16 hours a day, every day of the week. Why do I do that? BECAUSE I WANT TO SUCCEED.

            I want success so much and I love business so much that I am constantly thinking about how to make it grow. Ask any member on here that has me on their skype or who calls me regularly asking for advice, input or ideas... my mind is constantly working. When I eat, I'm eating while working... when I take a ****, a shower, or go to sleep, I do all that while thinking and formulating plans to grow my business. What do you do? Discredit a form of marketing that Is PROVEN to work and EXPLODE businesses?

            A roofing company that is a client of mine is pulling in over 1 mill a month from cold calling residential. Doesn't work?

            ATT makes millions from cold calling, every month.

            Carnival cruises makes a fortune from cold calling... charter communications makes a killing from cold calling. Edward Jones and other financial groups get their client base by cold calling... INEFFICIENT? Please....

            Lowest return?? That is simply untrue.. you're confusing ROI and conversions.... every marketer should know the difference.

            Don't come at me talking about me being ignorant and lazy... my worst form of bringing in clients is probably better than your best area.

            If I'm lazy... Regions Online Banking | Awesome Screenshot that's pretty good for a lazy man.
            Signature
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521926].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
              Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

              Not interested in your ramble. Cold calling is just a glorified form of begging. You'd have to be insane and ignorant to have the beliefs that you do.

              Do doctors call you at random times to ask if you happen to be sick and therefore in need of an appointment? Do dentists call you unexpectedly to ask if you have a toothache and therefore need dental services? Do auto mechanics call you without warning to say, “Let’s choose a mutually agreeable time for you to bring your car in so we can examine it and determine if you are in need of our services?” Of course not. Why? Because that would be ridiculous.

              Cold calling is nothing but a lazy man's excuse.

              If you actually engaged your brain, you'd realise that you can reach a much wider audience through other methods that will induce prospects to call you instead of you calling them first. Then, and only then, will your value in the eyes of the prospect go up exponentially.

              Many ignorant people, such as yourself, don't even think it’s possible to do anything other than cold call to generate leads. Not only do they fail to look for alternatives to cold calling, they reject outright the idea that alternatives even exist, let alone the fact that alternatives to cold calling happen to be far more effective.

              Its good that you are eager to make some sales. Thats a good thing. My advice to you would be to buy some marketing books, get educated on the subject and then implement some tactics.
              Read what I said.... FFS you ignored everything I posted. Great way to show YOUR ignorance sir....

              You didn't even read what you quoted.
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521931].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
              Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

              Not interested in your ramble. Cold calling is just a glorified form of begging. You'd have to be insane and ignorant to have the beliefs that you do.
              I am insane.... I'm so insane that I get the results I want any day, every day of the week. Do you? I have the proof to back it up... do you? I'm ignorant I'm insane and I'm better at getting results than you can ever imagine. The experience and tips I have, far outweigh any marketing text book.
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521945].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author EnzoBlaque
                Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

                I am insane.... I'm so insane that I get the results I want any day, every day of the week. Do you? I have the proof to back it up... do you? I'm ignorant I'm insane and I'm better at getting results than you can ever imagine.
                Insanity at its finest.^

                I'm just letting you know that cold calling is so unethical, that it has even been 'outlawed' in several places around the world. (Just like many beggars have been banned from soliciting in subways) NO other form of marketing has ever been forbidden by law. - Why do you think that is?

                It is common knowledge that in selling, you must never appear desperate. once you look desperate - it's over. cold calling destroys your status as a business equal, you automatically appear inferior to your competitors.

                This may be okay for some, but I'll never reduce myself to cold calling. Simply because I have the correct tools, to have clients come to me. I dont need to resort to begging.
                Signature
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521996].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
                  Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

                  cold calling destroys your status as a business equal, you automatically appear inferior to your competitors.
                  Congrats, that is the most inaccurate, asinine thing i have seen anyone one post in here.... ever
                  Signature

                  Selling Ain't for Sissies
                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522036].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author EnzoBlaque
                    Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

                    Congrats, that is the most inaccurate, asinine thing i have seen anyone one post in here.... ever
                    You obviously know nothing about business.

                    If you did you would know full and well that the chances of closing a cold call is 10:1. And considering that people actually dedicate their whole day towards trying to close a cold call, it isn't at all strange to me that I see numerous threads with people wondering why cold calling isn't working out for them.

                    I know, as does anyone else with half a brain, that you can gain 100's of clients through other, more ethical, methods.

                    My prospects 'willingly' contact me. I dont have to implement sleazy tactics for a pathetic little two sales a day. Which is what you must be making, since you seem to swear by cold calling
                    Signature
                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522107].message }}
                    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
                      Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

                      You obviously know nothing about business.

                      If you did you would know full and well that the chances of closing a cold call is 10:1. And considering that people actually dedicate their whole day towards trying to close a cold call, it isn't at all strange to me that I see numerous threads with people wondering why cold calling isn't working out for them.

                      I know, as does anyone else with half a brain, that you can gain 100's of clients through other, more ethical, methods.

                      My prospects 'willingly' contact me. I dont have to implement sleazy tacticsfor a pathetic little two sales a day. Which is what you must be making, since you seem to swear by cold calling

                      You cant bait me, the way you can some.

                      You are a nothing but a complete waste of peoples time.

                      Enjoy your delusions of grandeur.
                      Signature

                      Selling Ain't for Sissies
                      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522169].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
                    Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

                    Congrats, that is the most inaccurate, asinine thing i have seen anyone one post in here.... ever
                    There are a FEW people here trying to push that exact same statement Ken, I see you fighting in the war bro... You will get to recognize a few, no matter what name they are under.

                    They have vested egos in thinking that, and if they were to actually believe that an 8 dollar telemarketer could eat their lunch and send them home crying to mama, then it would destroy all the false things they have come to believe about themselves.
                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6526558].message }}
                    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
                      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

                      You will get to recognize a few, no matter what name they are under.
                      Yea, its pretty easy to spot, they think they are being smart by changing the way they structure their posts.

                      Obviously, they don't know about pattern recognition, and that in fact
                      the more they try to hide it, the more apparent it becomes.

                      there is one poster in here, i am sure has like 10 accounts that i recognize
                      and to top it off, he posts like he is male in all of them, but he slipped a few times
                      and structured his sentences like a woman does ... So i believe he is really a she
                      ...well that or an effeminate guy trying play butch
                      Signature

                      Selling Ain't for Sissies
                      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6530796].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author Gatsby
                  So anyway -

                  Thanks Iamnameless - I have been reading throughout all the other posts on this forum and so far you are one of the few that actually answered my question the best. I especially like the idea of having a check and contract mailed back.

                  I forgot where I read this, but someone wrote "Tell them you will send the contract, then I won't bill you till the contract arrives in the mail..." So, sort of a small difference with variable outcomes, ask for the check with the contract, or contract first and then do the classic invoicing stuff.

                  I have a buddy who runs a very large web firm, they specialize in restaurant franchisees, and he and I actually went over some phone closes, which are very similar to any other kind of "fill out the form" method that finishes with "Now will you be using a company card? Will that be visa, master....Ok just read me the numbers from left to right" that kind of thing. I have a way of sending out an electronic invoice for credit, but no other way - which is why I have been thinking over all this lately is the idea of spreading out my range by at least 300 miles as I see how it goes.
                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522085].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author eskimoto
                  holy words my friend. Cold calling is the lowest form of marketing.

                  How they can even say who their target market is if they are just calling people of they yellow pages. They are happy to bother 100 people a day just to get one lead. Sad

                  Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

                  Insanity at its finest.^

                  I'm just letting you know that cold calling is so unethical, that it has even been 'outlawed' in several places around the world. (Just like many beggars have been banned from soliciting in subways) NO other form of marketing has ever been forbidden by law. - Why do you think that is?

                  It is common knowledge that in selling, you must never appear desperate. once you look desperate - it's over. cold calling destroys your status as a business equal, you automatically appear inferior to your competitors.

                  This may be okay for some, but I'll never reduce myself to cold calling. Simply because I have the correct tools, to have clients come to me. I dont need to resort to begging.
                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6610724].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
                    Originally Posted by eskimoto View Post

                    holy words my friend. Cold calling is the lowest form of marketing.

                    How they can even say who their target market is if they are just calling people of they yellow pages. They are happy to bother 100 people a day just to get one lead. Sad
                    One lead can be worth 1-10 grand per day. Do you make that? As if the answer really proves anything.
                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6610830].message }}
                    • Profile picture of the author eskimoto
                      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

                      One lead can be worth 1-10 grand per day. Do you make that? As if the answer really proves anything.

                      i dont care how much one could earn doing call calling. i just thing its sleazy and intrusive, no one wants it, everyone hates it...

                      i dint realise how big problem it was until my gf has started her small, local business...since then we are getting about 10 cold call a day, i had to donwload a call blocker for our smartfones, the blacklist is now longer then the contact lists on our phones combined!

                      i wont even mention all the old people that got tricked into changing their insurance or pensions...


                      if you say you can make loads of cash cold calling the i believe you but its hard for me to accept that these days people would even consider giving personal or bank details over the phone, especially business people....


                      an one more thing, why are you guys so agressive everytimes someone challenges cold calling?
                      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6613101].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
          Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

          Ignorance at it's best. It seems to me that you know very little. Out of ALL prospecting methods cold calling has the LOWEST return. Everyone in the marketing industry knows this.
          .
          Well i had some things to say about that statement.. but i see IAN beat me to the draw... and he pretty well covered what needed to be said.
          Signature

          Selling Ain't for Sissies
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6521447].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
          Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

          IOut of ALL prospecting methods cold calling has the LOWEST return. Everyone in the marketing industry knows this.
          its funny you should say that. because in this post you say, and i quote

          "Calling is the best way, but not the only option."

          I just looked at some of your posts, its very clear that your just
          a troll looking to stir things up.

          IAM, don't waste your breath, this ass jack just wants to cause trouble
          he doesn't even believe what he is saying, he just wants a reaction.
          Signature

          Selling Ain't for Sissies
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522020].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author EnzoBlaque
            Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

            its funny you should say that. because in this post you say, and i quote

            "Calling is the best way, but not the only option."

            I just looked at some of your posts, its very clear that your just
            a troll looking to stir things up.

            IAM, don't waste your breath, this ass jack just wants to cause trouble
            he doesn't even believe what he is saying, he just wants a reaction.
            Indeed which is what i've said here today. It is not the only way. You and you pal seem to be ignorant to this fact.

            Now you can fly to your butt buddy's rescue if you please. It isn't going to make cold calling anymore usefull.

            Successful marketing boils down to this - having 100's of clients ringing your phone, ready to buy. Not ringing 100 people force feeding them some lame sales script in the hope of them humouring you. That is a complete waste of time.

            Instead of thinking, "Ok, this may be interesting," here's what most prospects actually think when they receive a cold call: "Great. You don't know me and I don't know you. You have no idea what my goals are. You don't even know if we need what you're selling, and in spite of all that, you've decided to waste my time anyway with this call." - Guaranteed.

            Ask yourself, how many people have accepted your advances through a cold call. And how many people have slammed down their phone, at the mere sound of salesman on the line.
            Signature
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522076].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Prince Vegeta
        Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

        You're just incompetent, that's all there really is to it. I don't give a flying you know what if you don't pay someone over the phone, why on earth would I care what you do? You aren't my market.... you aren't qualified...

        Guys... it's not about WHO DOESN'T want to receive calls... it doesn't matter who WON'T pay over the phone.. the ONLY thing that matters is the ones that do, and there are plenty out there.

        While you guys are busy setting appointments, I'm busy CLOSING! You take your little meetings and presentations, while I'll continue one call closing. I'm not confined to one geographical area... I can call locally, 100 miles away, 1,000 miles away, I can even call your mom, girlfriend, and your girlfriend's parents. While you're asking for a meeting, I'm getting bank account information over the phone.

        Now lets show how inefficient your are being compared to closing over the phone.

        You call around asking for appointments, lets say it takes you 8 hours, and you get 3 appointments set up for the next day.

        Those 3 appointments are going to probably take up half your day and you may not walk away with a check... maybe itll take a week for you to get your money.

        While you're setting up appointments in those 8 hours, I have already made a sale, maybe 2... maybe more.... next day, I made another sale, while you're giving a presentation to someone you don't know if they are interested or not.

        Wouldn't recommend closing over the phone? Cool, keep being inefficient while I'll keep being efficient, proactive, and killing it.

        Kenmichaels is absolutely correct... you just aren't good at it.




        Cool stuff... but we all know the only numbers that matter, are our own.
        Hah you've got to be my favorite poster on these boards, but anyway, how are you accepting payments over the phone? I was leaning towards Square, but after reading a few posts on here about their $1,000 limit per keyed in transaction, I may need to find an alternative.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6613482].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author EvanDnl
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522145].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Gatsby
      Originally Posted by EvanDnl View Post

      This is a question I have asked myself many times. I never could close a deal through the phone before. This is really a useful post and surely it will come in handy for all of us.
      Thanks EvanDnl;

      The main thing that is getting me is the appointment vs close now mentality. For instance, I first am expanding my territory out for a 3 hour drive - certainly no big deal. But, what I am getting at in my head somewhere is that when they get onto meeting in person, I am just going to say "Yeah I don't do that..." hell I could come up with an excuse "I'm saving the planet..." but I am feeling more and more that in person is a sort of excuse for me to not work as hard.

      I know that will be interpreted this way or that; but it is starting to make sense to me now. Especially when my jobs are being compared to yp or some whorehouse system of churn and burn. I am all for meeting in person, but I have been getting much more into qualifying before any meetings are set.

      That is another thing, that has been pushing me to close on the phone. If I am willing to go the extra ten steps to make sure I have a qualified sale on my hands, then why not just shoot another question in there "Tell you what bob - how about I shoot you a pdf of the agreement, then send that back and I will start this whole thing up ASAP when it arrives...."?

      I mean does that make sense or are the two elves in my head just blowing sunshine up my ass?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522185].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
    Originally Posted by Ken_Caudill View Post

    There are three things you need to do to close a sale on the telephone or anywhere else.

    1. Qualify
    2. Qualify
    3. Qualify
    I just want to change what you said a smidgen.

    First let me agree, of course hot leads over cold... nobody could ever argue that.

    now the change.

    1. Pre-Qualify
    2. Pre-Qualify
    3. Pre-Qualify
    Signature

    Selling Ain't for Sissies
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522220].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Gatsby
      Now I can see me or anyone else muddying up the difference between qualify and pre-qualify. So I am going to throw out a example and see if these jib.

      Before I get in too deep with a call, on many occasions I will just shoot this at a business owner...."This is going to end up being around 1500 - is that in your price range?"

      I am doing that as an invitation for them to get the hell off the phone so I can move on, rather than jack-jaw all day about why he...well you know, the one hundred reasons he has to avoid his work and your callbacks later.

      Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

      I just want to change what you said a smidgen.

      First let me agree, of course hot leads over cold... nobody could ever argue that.

      now the change.

      1. Pre-Qualify
      2. Pre-Qualify
      3. Pre-Qualify
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522313].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      Originally Posted by Ken_Caudill View Post

      Nonsense. What, get ready to qualify what you're going to qualify?

      Please.

      no man, pre qualify means making sure they have

      1) the money for what your selling
      2) the need or desire for what you want
      3) the ability or authorization to commit

      before you spend 30 minutes pitching them

      it only takes a few minutes while your warming up the prospect ( cold )
      before the pitch, actually, if in the pre qualify part
      you find out they aren't the decision maker,don't have the need ,
      or don't have the money ... you abort...
      Signature

      Selling Ain't for Sissies
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522358].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author EnzoBlaque
        Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

        it only takes a few minutes while your warming up the prospect ( cold )
        before the pitch, actually, if in the pre qualify part
        you find out they aren't the decision maker,don't have the need ,
        or don't have the money ... you abort...
        So what you are suggesting here is that; it is somehow possible to warm up a cold call, DURING a cold call? Makes no sense what so ever.
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522391].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
          Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

          So what you are suggesting here is that; it is somehow possible to warm up a cold call, DURING a cold call? Make no sense what so ever.
          I told you, you cant bait me.

          But i can definitely tell you. that based on that statement alone.
          your not a salesman.

          And i am not suggesting, I am telling, and if you don't know how to do something that BASIC
          then you have absolutely no right to be trying to tell anyone, anything about sales.
          Signature

          Selling Ain't for Sissies
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522430].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author EnzoBlaque
            Hmm. Your quick to throw out school yard insults, and even quicker to dodge questions.

            Fact is you know nothing about marketing. I mean, your the guy who just said that he warms up cold calls, during cold calls. Need i say more?

            I'll leave you to it.

            Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

            I told you, you cant bait me.

            But i can definitely tell you. that based on that statement alone.
            your not a salesman.

            I don't even think your rate as an order taker....

            your probably "that guy" that has been fired from every sales job he ever had.

            you prob never even made it through training, becuase you were so busy telling the trainer how to do his job, or how many sales books you read... actually
            you were probably the fool saying how everybody was wrong...
            and never even made it to "employee: status
            Signature
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522450].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
              Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

              Hmm. Your quick to throw out school yard insults, and even quicker to dodge questions.

              Fact is you know nothing about marketing. I mean, your the guy who just said that he warms up cold calls, during cold calls. Need i say more?

              I'll leave you to it.
              what insults?

              and your right, i DID say i warm up cold calls during cold calls,
              how hard is that to grasp? ...

              Its not hard to understand, i am pretty sure i was clear about it...
              but its easy to see, your post are nothing but bait.

              You say i know nothing about marketing... well maybe it looks that way in your limited experience.

              but the truth is, your sales skills are so plebeian you might as well have said "hey
              i hawk newspaper on a street corner."


              now that was a school yard insult... the only insult so far.

              Look i love healthy debate about different sales techniques, but your not debating anything, you are steam rolling your dumb assed perceptions as fact

              there are only 3 possibility

              you were never taught properly

              your are an idiot

              your a troll


              i told you, you can not bait me.

              i do not have a vested interest in this forum

              i hang out here because i happen to like a couple of people and enjoy the convo with them

              i can tell you exactly what i think, and get banned for a few days... no biggie to me

              i can also, do the worst thing possible to you... and that is ignore your ignorant ass..

              and that is what i am going to do. starting now

              so cya, i would tell you it was a nice discussion, and wish you luck, but that would be a lie.
              So in the light of honesty,

              GFYSL
              Signature

              Selling Ain't for Sissies
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522486].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Gatsby
              @IAmNameless - thanks for the props, and for some of the positive verbiage - I like your points and how you keep a chin up.


              @Enzo you are not making sense - and you are veering the discussion

              All cold calls are efforts to warm up

              For a British person, you are making literary mistakes over and over - I am rather appalled and dismayed; what would the queen think.

              @Ken - thanks for the notes, I am taking down a ton here
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522505].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
    Well, this thread has proven to me that a lot of people don't really know anything about sales.

    Gatsby, I apologize that your thread has been hijacked, but I give my hats off to you for being a student of the industry. It's great to see a new member here really willing to get into the trenches and starting your own business. A lot of people hate cold calling because they suck at it... other people hate it because it's intimidating. Usually people don't resort to it until they're desperate because they do everything else wrong too! Good job on getting a good start!

    Some people will try to advise you on how to do things one way and others will pull you in another direction. You need to develop BS sensors to decide what is true and what is theory and hype.

    In business, and in life, you have to decide if you're a winner or a loser. Everything equals out, in order for you to be a winner, someone else has to be a loser. Do you want to reach out and TAKE what is YOURS? OR do you want to WAIT for something to be GIVEN to you? I don't know about you... but the last time I checked, winners don't wait around for what they want. Actually... winner's don't want... they need... they need because the drive to success is so strong that it is no longer a want, it is a NEED. Do you NEED success or do you WANT it?

    That being said... one adjustment I think you should make Gatsby, open up with web design if you have to. More people understand the importance of a website than they do SEO. Business owners don't know what SEO is, but they know what more leads means! If you can open up and sell them on web design, you have them for hosting/maitenance, as well as SEO, SMM, SEM, ORM...etc. You will become their go to guy.. Selling 10 people websites, can end up meaning 10K+/mo for SEO.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522382].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Murdock Lois
    A lot of thought provoking posts here. I always knew cold leads were a difficult sale.. This thread put a lot of things into perspective for me
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6522558].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Crew Chief
      WOW!

      This thread certainly took a turn for the worse. That said, if you are wise, you can glean some great nuggets from it in spite of the attempted detour and apparent sabotage.

      Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

      Well, this thread has proven to me that a lot of people don't really know anything about sales.
      I would amplify that statement by saying this; they don't know JACK about sales. Order taking yes! Customer service, yes! But not sales and particularly, not about inside sales.

      No offense EnzoBlaque but your statement is acutely hilarious. So much so that the likes of Zig Ziglar and Tom Hopkins would ROTL, if they read it.

      Originally Posted by EnzoBlaque View Post

      So what you are suggesting here is that; it is somehow possible to warm up a cold call, DURING a cold call? Makes no sense what so ever.
      So what you're saying is, if a guys sees a girl who is on her way to work, that he has never seen before and vice-a-versa and decides to approach her [A.K.A., Cold calling] he should not [Pre-qualify] her?

      In other words, determine if she is married, engaged, living with a guy, a nun, a misandrinist, on the other team, a fierce member of NOW or a switch hitter?

      The reality is, he is going to pre-qualify her unless he is an inconsiderate jerk, a male chauvinist pig, a stalker or a flat out bum.

      Pre-qualification is a basic tenement of the sales funnel unless the person is merely taking orders.

      When a person walks into a car dealership the first goal of the car salesman is to pre-qualify that person. If a person walks into a Mercedes dealership but can only afford a used Nissan Versa, the salesperson who does not pre-qualify them is going to be furious if they go all the way through the process only to find out at the end that the person cannot afford the Mercedes-Benz CL 600 that the salesperson has just spent three hours selling them.

      For all those considering inside sales, do yourself a huge favor, listen to the people who know what the heck they are talking about!

      Signature
      Tools, Strategies and Tactics Used By Savvy Internet Marketers and SEO Pros:

      SEO G.O.L.D. = Genuine Overall Link Diversity
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6524737].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author mrbueno
        Wow! Personally, I'd be ashamed of myself if I were either one of the name calling guys in this thread.

        Here is how I see this, without bias. Sales is not a hard and fast set of rules to follow. There are different techniques that work of different people.

        As a professional, I use every tool at my disposal in the most ethical ways to maximize my growth. Cold calling, direct mail, old media, new media, it just doesn't matter. If it works, I use it.

        Cold calling is no more begging than any other form of advertising is. While Doctors might not cold call homes, they do cold call hospitals to get approved to do rounds and admitting privileges.

        Cold calling is a terrific way for startups to get clients with very little financial investment. It is hard work, but when done properly it pays off. It also gives people a chance to really hone their skills.

        One call closes do happen, but relying on that is not the best way to grow a business. While the low hanging fruit willing to signup over the phone is great, think of all the work you are missing if you don't follow up with all those warmer contacts that weren't willing to spend this minute.

        Some people are extremely well suited to telephone sales and do great with cold calling. Others need some help on the phone, but in person they light up a room.

        We close deals in one call, we use appointment setting calls to close deals that don't close in a call, we use direct mail to build brand awareness as well. Referral based sales is huge for us as well.

        At the end of the day, we are doing what is right for our business. You are doing what is right for yours, but there is never need for me to call you a childish name to state my case.

        Best of luck.

        Senior Good
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6525120].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Gatsby
          Apparently we are going to run the gamut here on what phone sales or other forms present what kind of valor or none.

          I have noticed it is difficult to bring up closing, it is the end after the means of course. I think what is difficult, is the whole end is setup by every idea and actionable variable you perform before the close. In other words, this is a cause and effect discussion for some - maybe the technically minded are fixed on the "if-then-else" steps.

          So, we start with the ultimate end $1500 deposit and $350 a month for support and ongoing maintenance - what has to happen to reach this goal (sales wise)?

          Gather leads
          phone calls -> to CRM/funnel
          gatekeeper managment-> to CRM/funnel
          DM/ADM (Actual DM)
          - pre-qualify
          --Time to talk?
          --need
          --want
          --afford
          - Elicit Needs/Wants/Status(affordable or not - decision maker or not)
          - Reception - Inception
          - Account Details
          - Contract/Payment


          Now, I know I need to get to the payment, and to get there I need to understand a few things, so the buyer can FEEL comfort and trust. Why am I worried about what he knows, rather than he feels? Because if he is talking to me, he is interested. All others I kicked off the phone with "Do you have time?" If they have no time, they have no money - and they may have a harder time paying me three months from now.

          Next, I want to kick them off the phone if they run at this -

          "Do you use your web site?" - if they want to talk, that is fine - but if they run off the phone at this question, they are likely not involved even though they are wasting money on a scam site or a crappy 1995er style frontpage template their brother in law is using. Why would they magically realize they need to pay you and respect you suddenly after all that? Don't take on uphill battles

          By the way, there are web contracts out there for 30k, and these people are standing in between you and that contract.

          "What kind of performance do you expect from your online presence?"

          Same as above really, both are establishing need and want. If they have had any kind of success in the past with web sites, then they know they need it.

          "This is going to cost anywhere from 1500-3600 per web site, sir, is that something you are comfortable with."

          That one is, "Let's cut the ****....are you in business or have you been daydreaming about chapter 7 at dinner?"

          They are either going to be honest, "That is out of my league" or you will hear something in their voice "I only pay $85" a month. That last one, you have their attention - they will want to know why the difference. They already know, they can feel it, they see their site looks like crap. They know that yp, 1on1, intuit, and all the rest are litterally ripping them off month to month. They just want to know what you have to say.

          ----


          So, I just typed all that out, to get back to why people are so sensitive about phone sales, walkins, etc. Why people seem to lean towards one or the other, rather than take in the whole thing as "human communication". They are scared they will lose the next one, and the next one.

          I can already tell just by reading these posts, who has no attachment to the outcome and who is obsessing. I can lose any sale, anytime, I don't care. I love to have the money, I love to have a client - but if I have to deal with bull**** I could have avoided; totally worth it.

          Closing on the phone is something I have avoided in the past for that same reason, and I can get appointments lined up five a day all damn week. But I want to hammer it out, as I have done phone closes for other companies in the past, but never my own.

          Also, I will know who read all of this - because all that above is my "plan of action" not the "how Gatsby does this". So anyone responding with "So you say....You think you know....You don't know ****" is just showing that they are not getting the point of this as a growth and exchange of information tool. I am not selling ebooks, I want to connect with others and see what we can accomplish right here and now.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6525878].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author NewAge29
            Originally Posted by Gatsby View Post

            Apparently we are going to run the gamut here on what phone sales or other forms present what kind of valor or none.

            I have noticed it is difficult to bring up closing, it is the end after the means of course. I think what is difficult, is the whole end is setup by every idea and actionable variable you perform before the close. In other words, this is a cause and effect discussion for some - maybe the technically minded are fixed on the "if-then-else" steps.

            So, we start with the ultimate end $1500 deposit and $350 a month for support and ongoing maintenance - what has to happen to reach this goal (sales wise)?

            Gather leads
            phone calls -> to CRM/funnel
            gatekeeper managment-> to CRM/funnel
            DM/ADM (Actual DM)
            - pre-qualify
            --Time to talk?
            --need
            --want
            --afford
            - Elicit Needs/Wants/Status(affordable or not - decision maker or not)
            - Reception - Inception
            - Account Details
            - Contract/Payment


            Now, I know I need to get to the payment, and to get there I need to understand a few things, so the buyer can FEEL comfort and trust. Why am I worried about what he knows, rather than he feels? Because if he is talking to me, he is interested. All others I kicked off the phone with "Do you have time?" If they have no time, they have no money - and they may have a harder time paying me three months from now.

            Next, I want to kick them off the phone if they run at this -

            "Do you use your web site?" - if they want to talk, that is fine - but if they run off the phone at this question, they are likely not involved even though they are wasting money on a scam site or a crappy 1995er style frontpage template their brother in law is using. Why would they magically realize they need to pay you and respect you suddenly after all that? Don't take on uphill battles

            By the way, there are web contracts out there for 30k, and these people are standing in between you and that contract.

            "What kind of performance do you expect from your online presence?"

            Same as above really, both are establishing need and want. If they have had any kind of success in the past with web sites, then they know they need it.

            "This is going to cost anywhere from 1500-3600 per web site, sir, is that something you are comfortable with."

            That one is, "Let's cut the ****....are you in business or have you been daydreaming about chapter 7 at dinner?"

            They are either going to be honest, "That is out of my league" or you will hear something in their voice "I only pay $85" a month. That last one, you have their attention - they will want to know why the difference. They already know, they can feel it, they see their site looks like crap. They know that yp, 1on1, intuit, and all the rest are litterally ripping them off month to month. They just want to know what you have to say.

            ----


            So, I just typed all that out, to get back to why people are so sensitive about phone sales, walkins, etc. Why people seem to lean towards one or the other, rather than take in the whole thing as "human communication". They are scared they will lose the next one, and the next one.

            I can already tell just by reading these posts, who has no attachment to the outcome and who is obsessing. I can lose any sale, anytime, I don't care. I love to have the money, I love to have a client - but if I have to deal with bull**** I could have avoided; totally worth it.

            Closing on the phone is something I have avoided in the past for that same reason, and I can get appointments lined up five a day all damn week. But I want to hammer it out, as I have done phone closes for other companies in the past, but never my own.

            Also, I will know who read all of this - because all that above is my "plan of action" not the "how Gatsby does this". So anyone responding with "So you say....You think you know....You don't know ****" is just showing that they are not getting the point of this as a growth and exchange of information tool. I am not selling ebooks, I want to connect with others and see what we can accomplish right here and now.
            Hey Gatsby. Even though this thread is half garbage, I'll jump in and give you some things to think about. I was trained by the best of the best (google Stratton Oakmont) but of course my 15+ years of telephone sales and over 100 Million dollars in deals closed without ever meeting a client will be challenged.

            Anyway, the thing I want to stress most is your bullet points. Want/Need should be established BEFORE you call. Affordability should be established BEFORE the call. Authority (decision maker) should be established BEFORE the call.

            If you aren't speaking with someone who meets all three of the above you're wasting your time. Remember that Affordability is not what they are willing to pay...it's what they can afford. For example, if I am pitching a (whatever) to a prospect I'm going to be damn sure he can afford it before I make that dial. He may not be willing to pay what I am charging but if I'm calling them, they have access to the money.

            When addressing their willingness to pay, it's your job as a salesperson to demonstrate the value behind what you are asking. If they aren't willing to pay $X for (whatever) but they have the money, you didn't do your job as a salesperson.

            I'll give you an example. Let's say I'm going into a call with a guy who's worth about $5 Million Dollars and he has $3 Million currently in the market. I call him and present him with (pick a stock). His objection is "I do my investing online for $7 per trade". The issue is not the money. The issue is that I didn't build up my value enough.

            For closing, if you do your job right, it should be the easiest part of the call. Your goal is to expose objections during the process and get them out of the way quickly and easily...and most of this happens during the presentation and introduction phase of the call. Once you come to the actual close, if you've done your job correctly and the prospect is qualified (which you should know before the call is made), you should simply be able to ask for the payment and that's it.



            Now for all the cold call doubters out there...Sales is about two things -
            First, "touch" Second, "Reach".

            The internet (you could lump D/M in there as well) has the most reach and the least amount of touch. Therefore it has the worst closing percentage.

            The phone has decent reach and some touch - closing ratio is decent.

            In person has high touch and extremely low reach - closing ratio is the best.

            These are not opinions, they are FACTS! Looking at the facts above, the best place to spend your time prospecting is on the PHONE. The reason for this simply is because you are "medium" in everything.

            I really hope that the new people in here read this thread all the way through and don't get corrupted by some people who posted here.

            Listen - THE FASTEST AND EASIEST WAY TO MAKE MORE MONEY THAN YOU EVER THOUGHT POSSIBLE IS BY DIALING THE PHONE. End of story!
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6526059].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author NewAge29
            Originally Posted by Gatsby View Post

            Why would they magically realize they need to pay you and respect you suddenly after all that? Don't take on uphill battles
            They'll "magically" realize that because you're a great salesperson, you believe in yourself, your services and you KNOW that what you are offering is going to help them beyond their imagination. If YOU don't truly believe any of that, stop selling what you are selling.

            And YES, take on uphill battles. Uphill battles are the ones who will eventually make you the most money and send you more deals.

            You should read the book "How I Raised Myself From Failure To Success In Selling" by Frank Bettger. It's like a dollar on Amazon and will basically answer every question you have been asking. It was required reading for me when I first started.
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6526090].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Murdock Lois
              Originally Posted by NewAge29 View Post

              They'll "magically" realize that because you're a great salesperson, you believe in yourself, your services and you KNOW that what you are offering is going to help them beyond their imagination. If YOU don't truly believe any of that, stop selling what you are selling.

              And YES, take on uphill battles. Uphill battles are the ones who will eventually make you the most money and send you more deals.

              You should read the book "How I Raised Myself From Failure To Success In Selling" by Frank Bettger. It's like a dollar on Amazon and will basically answer every question you have been asking. It was required reading for me when I first started.
              A quick Google search of 'cold calling outlawed' should put things into perspective for you.

              There are two main types of communication that take place in selling situations:
              conflict and cooperation

              Conflict takes place as the result of the vast majority of sales processes and especially
              as the result of those taught in traditional sales training, which usually goes as follows:
              The salesperson initiates the sales process through a cold call. Because the prospect
              does not expect or anticipate the call, sales resistance automatically exists and the
              salesperson is forced to overcome it. This is conflict. When the first appointment takes
              place, the prospect again has his defenses up in anticipation of a pushy sales pitch.
              As a result, frivolous objections are thrown out that the salesperson must overcome.
              More conflict.

              Now let’s take a look at a sale where the state of mind is not conflict but cooperation:
              The prospect learns of the salesperson’s offering through the salesperson’s thoughtful,
              organized self-marketing plan. The prospect contacts the salesperson and asks for a
              meeting, to which the salesperson of course agrees. Cooperation. During the first
              appointment, the prospect willingly explains the need that exists and the salesperson
              listens and takes down all pertinent information. They mutually agree to a time to
              review a solution. Cooperation. The day for the proposal appointment arrives and the
              prospect is excited to finally learn of a way to solve his problem. The salesperson
              presents it and the prospect agrees that it looks great. More cooperation.

              Never fear, I'll soon release a report explaining my methods and templates of the exact
              Ads I use to generate tens of sales per day.
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6526143].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author NewAge29
                Originally Posted by Murdock Lois View Post

                A quick Google search of 'cold calling outlawed' should put things into perspective for you.

                There are two main types of communication that take place in selling situations:
                conflict and cooperation

                Conflict takes place as the result of the vast majority of sales processes and especially
                as the result of those taught in traditional sales training, which usually goes as follows:
                The salesperson initiates the sales process through a cold call. Because the prospect
                does not expect or anticipate the call, sales resistance automatically exists and the
                salesperson is forced to overcome it. This is conflict. When the first appointment takes
                place, the prospect again has his defenses up in anticipation of a pushy sales pitch.
                As a result, frivolous objections are thrown out that the salesperson must overcome.
                More conflict.

                Now let’s take a look at a sale where the state of mind is not conflict but cooperation:
                The prospect learns of the salesperson’s offering through the salesperson’s thoughtful,
                organized self-marketing plan. The prospect contacts the salesperson and asks for a
                meeting, to which the salesperson of course agrees. Cooperation. During the first
                appointment, the prospect willingly explains the need that exists and the salesperson
                listens and takes down all pertinent information. They mutually agree to a time to
                review a solution. Cooperation. The day for the proposal appointment arrives and the
                prospect is excited to finally learn of a way to solve his problem. The salesperson
                presents it and the prospect agrees that it looks great. More cooperation.

                Never fear, I'll soon release a report explaining my methods and templates of the exact
                Ads I use to generate tens of sales per day.

                You, the warrior forum member, are 100% correct.

                Every major financial, telecom, newspaper, magazine, and countless other industries are wrong.

                The phone has been the best selling and prospecting tool for businesses since it was invented. That hasn't and won't change any time soon. The reason for this is the amount of "touch" and the amount of "reach" you get with it. When you have some touch (voice, tone, pace, words spoken) and you have some reach (700 calls per day is not out of the ordinary) and you can consistently have a 10% closing ratio, there's no need for much else.


                I'm sorry but the WSO you bought was wrong. You can realize it now or you can realize it later...doesn't matter to me, but try your best not to hurt the new people who are looking to build a book of business and make some real money.
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6526267].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author kcom
    @EnzoBlaque, you are fairly new to this forum, so maybe I will point this out to you. IAmNameless has been here quite a while and has given back to this forum over and over again with "real-world" examples helping out dozens of warriors. So, even if you were right (which you are not) you would still look like and idiot, for bashing someone whose words and advice have stood the test of time and scrutiny long before you even discovered this forum. It is too bad that you had to run-off at the mouth and bash someone like that. At the very least, you should have bashed someone with a little less credibility, perhaps yourself.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6527546].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Adrian Browning
      Banned
      [DELETED]
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6528358].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
        Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

        You after some brownie points brother? I think Enzo brought up some quality issues, and backed them up. I'm new here, so what? What does that mean? My learning didn't begin and surely will not end here. I seem to know alot more about sales than the guys who's bandwagon you're jumping on because, reading through, I can see a lot of inaccurate information being put out there by these "credible" people.

        I for one champion many sales techniques. Why? Because they all produce sales. But what I don't do is put all my dollars and time into one jar - an ineffective jar at that. I'm forever open to new info, and I'll give thanks to Enzo for opening my eyes here. I'm sure many others will also.
        I think you missed a few posts where he completely ignored responses and refused to respond to what other people would say. He made accusations that were completely false, and even with messages he "quoted" he never read, showed that he was just a troll.

        I think the evidence is apparent to everybody what works... Ultimately, it doesn't come down to theory.. it comes to your bank account... I took a screenshot of mine to show real world experience what cold calling can do. Where is his? Where is yours?

        He accused people of being lazy for not doing other marketing than cold calling. Cold calling is probably the most exhaustive form of marketing but it was pure ignorance to claim that we don't use other techniques. If you think something NEW was brought up by him saying to use other marketing techniques, that isn't cutting edge bro... that's marketing.

        If you THINK you know more about sales than me... good for you, you just might! I don't know much about sales, I never had a job as a salesman, I never had training. ALL I can show is REAL world experience on my own, not theory. If you know more about sales than me, that isn't very impressive bro LOL. I don't get into complex stuff, I don't understand a lot of what people talk about and I don't understand why people over complicate something that is really a VERY easy thing.

        What would you rather have? More knowledge about sales on a message board? Or more sales? You can KNOW more ABOUT sales than me or anyone else, but if you aren't MAKING more sales, then it doesn't matter, does it?
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6529010].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Adrian Browning
          Banned
          [DELETED]
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6529183].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
            Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

            For someone who has been on this forum for so long how about you show some maturity. You jump on the defense every time somebody brings forth anything other than what you believe in. Yes I read through the posts, and all I see is you resorting to name calling and other antics just because you were in the wrong.

            Also, since when did a "screenshot"constitute real word experience? Anyone can pull a screenshot from google and do some quick photoshop work on it. Doesn't make you any more special than the next guy,

            My sales team uses a 'marketing mix'. That includes everything from cold calling, to DM. I have known for a long time that having my team pursuing clients through cold calls produces less results than all of our other techniques. All this thread has done is reaffirm my decision to exclude cold calling from my marketing strategy.
            I had a long response typed up for you... and I figure, why even waste the gold I was about to share on someone incapable of using common sense, accusing me of lying, and someone who obviously hasn't read the entire thread?

            My wallet is evidence enough of what works. Is cold calling all I do? No... I do more than you could probably imagine.. and that's okay. Do what you want, exclude cold calling, I'm not in business to help you become a competitor on my level, why should I?

            BTW... regarding the screenshot, it is through awesome screen shot, you can download the firefox extension and see for yourself how it works. It captures your browser only, you don't have an option to photoshop anything and upload it, it captures exactly what is in your browser. My name is on there, my email, and my phone number if you want to confirm that it is mine, you can email me and I'll respond, we can also screen share on skype, but I will need to charge you $100 for wasting 5 minutes of my time.
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6529816].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Murdock Lois
              Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

              I had a long response typed up for you... and I figure, why even waste the gold I was about to share on someone incapable of using common sense, accusing me of lying, and someone who obviously hasn't read the entire thread?

              My wallet is evidence enough of what works. Is cold calling all I do? No... I do more than you could probably imagine.. and that's okay. Do what you want, exclude cold calling, I'm not in business to help you become a competitor on my level, why should I?

              BTW... regarding the screenshot, it is through awesome screen shot, you can download the firefox extension and see for yourself how it works. It captures your browser only, you don't have an option to photoshop anything and upload it, it captures exactly what is in your browser. My name is on there, my email, and my phone number if you want to confirm that it is mine, you can email me and I'll respond, we can also screen share on skype, but I will need to charge you $100 for wasting 5 minutes of my time.
              You seem to be stirring up a lot of arguments around here. That isn't needed.
              Everyone is entitled to discuss what works when making money and what doesn't.
              You should be ashamed of yourself, disguising incorrect theory as truth and
              making disparaging comments towards people.
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6530031].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
                Originally Posted by Murdock Lois View Post

                You seem to be stirring up a lot of arguments around here. That isn't needed.
                Everyone is entitled to discuss what works when making money and what doesn't.
                You should be ashamed of yourself, making disparaging comments towards people.
                Another person that doesn't read the entire thread. When someone flat out calls you inexperienced, lazy and ignorant, I think you would be entitled to defend yourself.

                You say everyone is entitled, then why am I not entitled? When did I EVER say that someone was wrong for believing a certain marketing tactic works? Get your facts straight... what this community DOESN'T need is more misinformation being spread. Everything I say is backed with facts, and proof. If someone wants to say cold calling doesn't work or isn't a valuable marketing tactic, show proof. I showed my proof that it DOES work.

                You should be ashamed of yourself. Instead of coming in to just hop on the bandwagon, offer value. I have offered plenty of value here, you guys want to jump on my back when I have given this community a LOT.

                Just because I address things immediately and don't sugar coat a single thing, doesn't mean that I'm in the wrong. You'll probably take this entire response the wrong way instead of actually seeing that it is 100% accurate and you jumped the gun.
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6530214].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author Murdock Lois
                  Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

                  Another person that doesn't read the entire thread. When someone flat out calls you inexperienced, lazy and ignorant, I think you would be entitled to defend yourself.
                  But, these are the qualities that you have shown me and everyone else.
                  I think you have embarrassed yourself enough as it is. We have all been
                  wrong at one point or another. Just accept it, and let the thread die.
                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6530257].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author kcom
                    First IamNameless is not wrong on this thread
                    Second He has never shown himself to be lazy or ignorant, he may have other weakness but those are not them.

                    The reason I am sticking up for him, he has provided a lot of valuable information to this forum, something you know nothing of. Your the one whose ignorance is showing.



                    Originally Posted by Murdock Lois View Post

                    But, these are the qualities that you have shown me and everyone else.
                    I think you have embarrassed yourself enough as it is. We have all been
                    wrong at one point or another. Just accept it, and let the thread die.
                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6530394].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
                    Originally Posted by Murdock Lois View Post

                    But, these are the qualities that you have shown me and everyone else.
                    I think you have embarrassed yourself enough as it is. We have all been
                    wrong at one point or another. Just accept it, and let the thread die.
                    I don't get embarrassed, especially when I'm right. Isn't it time for you to log into your other account by now?
                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6530701].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author John Durham
            Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

            For someone who has been on this forum for so long how about you show some maturity. You jump on the defense every time somebody brings forth anything other than what you believe in. Yes I read through the posts, and all I see is you resorting to name calling and other antics just because you were in the wrong.
            Why arent you smart enough to post in relevant threads?

            When the question is on how to cold call why are you such an ignorant marketer that you are posting stuff that clearly is not relevant to the topic of interest. Giving unsolicted advice that no one asked for?

            Why arent you that smart if we are supposed to be taking your advice?

            You cant even sell "you". Here's how you know people are buying you: "They will ask for your opinion" and you wont have to force yourself on threads that are clearly not relevant.

            So tell us, what can you teach us about marketing, if you cant even figure out where to post, and how to get people interested enough to even ask for your opinion at all?

            Thanks. Makes common horse sense.
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6530817].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Adrian Browning
              Banned
              [DELETED]
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6531251].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author John Durham
                Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

                You say I post stuff that isn't relevant to the topic, yet here you are doing the same thing. Quite hypocritical. You guys seem to want to exploit good people to promote your laughable telemarketing forum at every chance you can get. I'm sure that's against the rules here.

                With your supposed experience, why degrade yourself by jumping into every petty argument on this forum to throw in your 2cents. Don't you have a business to run? You claim to make hundred's of sales a day yet your constantly on this forum sliming your way from thread to thread.
                .
                Is this what they mean by the pot calling the kettle black?

                Keep comin out...

                You wont get the honor of riding the coat tails of my hard earned reputation...Guys if you pretend he doesnt exist he will go away. lol
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6531454].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author eskimoto
          jeez...u must be really into dick measuring...

          Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

          I think you missed a few posts where he completely ignored responses and refused to respond to what other people would say. He made accusations that were completely false, and even with messages he "quoted" he never read, showed that he was just a troll.

          I think the evidence is apparent to everybody what works... Ultimately, it doesn't come down to theory.. it comes to your bank account... I took a screenshot of mine to show real world experience what cold calling can do. Where is his? Where is yours?

          He accused people of being lazy for not doing other marketing than cold calling. Cold calling is probably the most exhaustive form of marketing but it was pure ignorance to claim that we don't use other techniques. If you think something NEW was brought up by him saying to use other marketing techniques, that isn't cutting edge bro... that's marketing.

          If you THINK you know more about sales than me... good for you, you just might! I don't know much about sales, I never had a job as a salesman, I never had training. ALL I can show is REAL world experience on my own, not theory. If you know more about sales than me, that isn't very impressive bro LOL. I don't get into complex stuff, I don't understand a lot of what people talk about and I don't understand why people over complicate something that is really a VERY easy thing.

          What would you rather have? More knowledge about sales on a message board? Or more sales? You can KNOW more ABOUT sales than me or anyone else, but if you aren't MAKING more sales, then it doesn't matter, does it?
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6610820].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Vladi Vasilev
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6528905].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
      Originally Posted by Vladi Vasilev View Post

      And now let's get back to the question which was:
      What do you all do to close a deal over the phone - National or regional

      I hire somebody (or get a service) to do that stuff for me, cause it's just dumb to call people. It works, but it's dumb.

      Other than that, It's all about positioning when it comes to cold calling.
      It's dumb to make money.... right? Useful... but dumb.

      SMH
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6528948].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Gatsby
      Originally Posted by Vladi Vasilev View Post


      I hire somebody (or get a service) to do that stuff for me, cause it's just dumb to call people. It works, but it's dumb.

      Other than that, It's all about positioning when it comes to cold calling.
      I think the way you put that hits on a very strong point. While many will see your use of the word dumb, as "dumb". However, the way your whole post is laid out I get a feeling you are being sincere.

      I think for many, we need to be able to shout out the window "This is just plain STUPID!!!"

      Admitting that it feels dumb, looks dumb etc. walks like a duck, acts like a duck - must be a duck; is important. Because if it feels dumb, then you are probably doing it a dumb way. Looks as if you see the valor in cold calling, as you have spent the valuable money to hire someone else to perform this laborious task. So, not completely dumb is it?

      But just like the first way to hand a problem with drugs is to admit what they actually do (they make you feel good, that's why people do them). Getting outspoken that cold calling can be daunting for some, certainly a time and energy sink for anyone and a daily task no matter who you are - is a great way to start. I am really thinking about anyone reading all the way through this post up to here. I started out using the phone in soliciting applications over the phone when I was a teenager - I was also terrified to pick up the phone to call for a pizza; just shy I guess. I took that job because I needed it, and something inside me was saying, simply "This can work". So, I know what it feels like at ALL levels.

      At all those levels, and several jobs later (I am getting up in years apparently). I would say there are about ten thousand things you can do wrong with phone sales. Which, more to the point is why this thread seems to have become a hot bed of pissing matches lol.

      Now, the question was - what do you all do to close? Interesting point, I have heard mostly "Why we decide to use a phone". So I will lay out a point of entry into the "close phase". There is a point where you know you have the prospect "hooked", what do you do to move them towards a contract and how do you get that contract confirmed. For those that like a media example - here would be a popular scene.

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6529660].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author NewAge29
      Originally Posted by Vladi Vasilev View Post

      I hire somebody (or get a service) to do that stuff for me, cause it's just dumb to call people. It works, but it's dumb.
      Coming from someone who's been on the phone for 8 to 10 hours per day for almost 15 years, it's kind of funny that I totally agree with you.

      Calling some random person and trying to sell them something is DUMB. But I think that's part of what makes cold calling such a successful form of selling. You can basically pull someone off the street, hand him a pitch, hand him a few hundred leads and just say "dial and read". They won't be the best right from the start but I've never seen a telemarketer last more than 2 days and not make a sale.

      DUMB but also simple and extremely profitable.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6537658].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author kcom
    @Adrian - I am not after Brownie points at all, I could completely care less. What my post was about was that one has taken the time over the last 18 months, provided quality, informative posts to help others. The other just joined last month, starts to knock others but spouts all theory, nothing was detailed about his own marketing plan. His posts had potential but nothing to back them up. Can a newbie contribute? Absolutely! Does Enzo have something to give this forum? Probably! Did he go about this the right way? Nope.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6529094].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author kaja292
    I am also interested to know abt this, after reading all topics got some knowledge
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6530084].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Vladi Vasilev
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6532968].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Zen Productions
      Holy Flaming Tacos!!! This thread is hilarious!

      I say let people who think cold calling is (dumb, scammy, erotic, idiotic, a grave offense to human rights) let them be. They are missing out and I'm happy, more money for me

      @Gatsby hey man I literally had the same question last week and John made a good point to me which is to basically increase your calls a day and ask for the sale (i'm generalizing because i'm kinda lazy when it comes to writing posts). I'm now starting to see results with my first sale this morning completely through the phone (this was a guy I called last week), namesless is right if they don't want to buy right then keep them in your funnel and don't let them go without paying you.

      @euro(dude) and the others who think cold calling is a scam or unethical...HAHAHAHA (i'm laughing at you).

      If you think thats unethical I could poke holes through your advertising methods in a heartbeat then...READY? Lets break them down.

      Commercials: I hate that I have to watch a 5 min commercial just to watch a 2 min video of a cat running into a wall on youtube (don't judge me!). How unethical...

      Flyers: I hate how you totally pollute and destroy the city sidewalks where trash is everywhere....you jerk!

      Deep Customer Research: I hate how big corporations like Wal-Mart and Target basically track everything I have ever bought in their stores so they can "guess" on what part of my life is coming next to send me coupons about it.
      Ex: Target knows when women are pregnant before they do!! http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/ma...pagewanted=all

      What? We are being spied on in stores....how unethical!!

      Bottom line: None of this stuff is really that unethical, in fact looking at the things I just listed cold calling is THE LEAST unethical thing you can do to grow your business.

      Disclaimer: I use youtube ads, I use flyers, and I try as hard as I can to do deep psychological research on my customers and I cold call. I'm the biggest unethical jerk in the world, for my next job I'm aiming for the dictatorship in Somalia.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6534381].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by Vladi Vasilev View Post

      Thank you all,

      I don't think everybody got my point right, but no worries.
      I understand.
      Ain't gonna repeat though.

      Have an awesome day bro's

      P.S Don't really get all the aggression.

      Who is this guy? I dont know. Do you know? His opinion weighs about a tenth of a gram to me at this point.

      Hey Adrian, have you told them how you make 2 million dollars per week yet?

      lol

      For that matter Who is Murdock Lois, that we should care what he says?

      I'll tell you who, he is one of the swarm of people with a post count under 50 who have recently come here all with the same message attacking cold calling- suspicious? I think so.

      You will notice that even the SENIOR warriors like Michael Hiles and Ken Caudill who dont really dig cold calling, at least give it the credit it deserves when asked....these guys here though are so deadset that it isnt even intelligent , rational, or objective- its all pointed.

      Even the seniors who dont like it, still give it proper credit. So what does this tell you about this swarm of low post count people who have suddenly uprised out of nowhere, not saying "I dont care for it" but rather saying "its bad"....

      At least I agree with this guys words in red:

      Originally Posted by NewAge29 View Post

      Coming from someone who's been on the phone for 8 to 10 hours per day for almost 15 years, it's kind of funny that I totally agree with you.

      Calling some random person and trying to sell them something is DUMB. But I think that's part of what makes cold calling such a successful form of selling. You can basically pull someone off the street, hand him a pitch, hand him a few hundred leads and just say "dial and read". They won't be the best right from the start but I've never seen a telemarketer last more than 2 days and not make a sale.

      DUMB but also simple and extremely profitable.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6609377].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author scottgallagher
    Let's all be positive and try and agree on something.... Referrals are the best source of leads! .....
    Signature
    Father, Entrepreneur, Author, Adranalist
    I teach entrepreneurs to build a sustainable Internet Marketing Agency with real value. I have many free resources and paid training programs available

    -->My Training Website
    -->My Agency Website
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6534945].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Murdock Lois
      Originally Posted by scottgallagher View Post

      Let's all be positive and try and agree on something.... Referrals are the best source of leads! .....
      Without doubt. However, for referrals to play a big part in your business
      a pretty solid client base must first be established. People that always come
      back to you will always pass on the good word to their own network and
      bring even more business your way.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6535955].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author lanceg
    I've been reading through many of the cold-calling threads (lots of good stuff)...can't help but notice that it seems to be the same 3 or 4 trolls showing up over and over again saying that cold-calling doesn't work. Why then, if they feel that way, do they keep showing up in cold-calling threads? Are you trying to save others from the horrible fate of making a lot of phone calls?

    For those who truly believe cold-calling on the phone doesn't work or isn't efficient, why aren't you creating your own threads and detailing what DOES work for you? Why spend most of your time trolling threads that have nothing to do with your own business model? As stated before, either add something of value or stfu. But I guess that's the problem...you don't have anything of value to offer, so instead you resort to spending your time trolling other threads and saying "that doesn't work" or "that's stupid".

    Enzoblacque was even saying it was unethical and illegal to cold-call...the absolutely stupidity of that statement destroyed any credibility he might have had now or in the future. He went "full-on retard" with that one.

    All this thread has done is reaffirm my decision to exclude cold calling from my marketing strategy.
    lmao...okay Adrian. Fine...that'll teach us. Feel free to exclude us from your opinions on cold-calling as well. If you don't like it and/or don't believe it works...fine. If you feel other forms of marketing bring in better results from less work...okay. Create your own thread and share what DOES work for you...in detail. Something tells me you won't though.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6535382].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author austin1
    Greeting's to everyone!!

    Wow! What a lively discussion.

    I appreciate all the passion form both sides of the fence.

    I am a professional Sales Coach and have been highly trained. I have been helping thousands of sales people for over 30 years.

    I would like to offer a few suggestions that may help in this discussion as well as for future issues we all face.

    1. How we disagree with a person is just as important or more so than whether we are correct in our thinking Honoring the other person should come first.
    2. If we stoop to the level of bad language or degrading the other person, how will that help you win your point? Who would listen?
    3. In reality, one sales rule is to "Never defend". We have all learned that we really can't change people unless they want to change.
    4. There is a verse that says "Don't throw pearls to the swine" If you have "golden nuggets" and another cannot absorb them. Move on quickly for both of your sake.

    5. On a practical level about cold calls.

    A. It is good to make cold calls for several reasons. One, being you can start right now. Also, it helps you refine your 30 second commercial, the more you say it. This is how many sales people have to start out.
    B. Cold calls are normally for setting the appointment after you have qualified or disqualified the prospect. If you do need to "sell" over the phone, then after bonding and re-pore has been established, then the sales process could start.
    C. I never do the closing, I let the prospect close themselves with a series of questions.
    D. Cold calls are NOT the best use of our time once we learn how to generate leads. Most of us believe that we are good or great "closing" and you are worth much more doing that, rather than "finding the person to sell to.
    I hire people to open doors for me if I want to use the phone.
    I would much rather have people calling me than "finding people"

    I could write more on this but I think you get the points.

    1. Don't bother arguing, state your belief once. You will quickly see the kind of person you are talking to and and then guard your time.
    2. Cold calls make us better and appreciate those who make them for us
    3. Learn how to market yourself and get referrals so you do what you are best at, closing business, not "finding people"
    4. Finally, ask yourself after a conversation- "Did we both win and learn something"?
    If you don't see it going in that direction, thank them for their time and move on.

    I hope this helps and my best to everyone of you. Increase your professional level today.

    Austin
    Signature

    Austin Helsel
    Social Media Sales Consultant
    www.SmartWayMarketing.com
    717-330-1850

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6536277].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Vladi Vasilev
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6539305].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by Vladi Vasilev View Post

      Thank you! This is exactly what I meant up there.

      To tell you the truth, I was getting worried a bit about this forum. Being the number one marketing forum, there are too many who talk weird stuff around here.

      You proved me there were smart people in here, so thank you again.
      I think it was sarcasm vlad. lol However true. But Im glad you are now convinced that there are some smart people at the greatest marketing forum in the world.

      Next time you will be "smart" enough to know when someone is being politely and diplomatically sarcastic..Goes along with that 4000 post thing.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6610838].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Mav91890
    madmanking is just spamming wf, someone please remove his posts.
    Signature

    “The only thing standing between you and your goal is the bullshit story you keep telling yourself as to why you can't achieve it.” ― Jordan Belfort

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6539313].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author J Tanner
    Well all the Warriors who are trying to sell get the same advice, cold call, no you have to do direct mail, not direct mail you have to use social media sites, no I got my clients from walking around in a chicken suit.
    How does anyone ever become successful in offline which all the conflicting advice out there?
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6540745].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      Originally Posted by J Tanner View Post

      How does anyone ever become successful in offline which all the conflicting advice out there?
      Easy, they stop listening to everybody, and they start doing something.

      It doesn't really matter what "the something" is, as long as its something,

      and then they learn from there own successes and failures.
      Signature

      Selling Ain't for Sissies
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6540768].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Sue Bruce
        Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

        Easy, they stop listening to everybody, and they start doing something.

        It doesn't really matter what "the something" is, as long as its something,

        and then they learn from there own successes and failures.
        Here, here, if only more people would listen to that and take heed, we wouldnt have all these "desperate" threads and posts.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6613949].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author thehazard
      Originally Posted by J Tanner View Post

      Well all the Warriors who are trying to sell get the same advice, cold call, no you have to do direct mail, not direct mail you have to use social media sites, no I got my clients from walking around in a chicken suit.
      How does anyone ever become successful in offline which all the conflicting advice out there?
      I cold call in a chicken suit. 2 birds, one stone.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6579364].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author thehazard
    I find it interesting that so many people bash cold calling yet are afraid to have a conversation with the prospect or gatekeeper. These people are our potential friends and business partners right? Also, how can you pre determine A:Want, B: Need C: Budget without talking to them first? Wouldnt you need to have at least a quick qualifying session in order to find out?
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6579358].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author kvnkane
    wow, so many spammers/trolls in this thread. if any noobs are looking at this thread thinking that cold calling doesnt work or whatever then try it. my first day of calling earned me over £500 which isnt bad for one days work.

    also john, Ken, Iamnameless are great warriors always looking to help out
    Signature

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6610187].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Nah, Iam- You believe the girls too much- they ALL say that. lol
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6611303].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author eskimoto
    i am not saying you cant make any money via cold calling, at the end of the day there is enough naive people on this planet to make any shady business profitable.

    no, i do not make that much money per day or per lead.

    the real question is, what are we happy to do to make money. i am not happy to call people at random and bother them with some sales pitch for some lame mobile webiste clone. I ha e never really experience the devil of called calling until my gf started her business. Before as a resifential person i would have got maybe one or two calls a month trying to move my insurance or sell me a mobile phone plan. But since we have started this business we are getting about 5-7 calls a day. It is annoying beyon imagination. Almost all of them are trying to sell me seo, websites, or move us to a different electricty supplier. We had one seo company calling us 5 times day for a week...until i have downloaded a call blocker on all our phones...our black list is now longer than the number of contacts in our phones combined

    i am not saying you guys sre not making any cash, all i am saying is that it is beyond my imagination how you can bother 100 people a day just to get one prospect. This is 100 annoyd people just to get one punter.


    Originally Posted by John Durham

    Quote:

    One lead can be worth 1-10 grand per day. Do you make that? As if the answer really proves anything.



    Posted from Warrior Forum Reader for Android
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6613027].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author henry Argueta
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6613291].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by henry Argueta View Post

      i saw a really good thread which is about closing web design sales.
      basically you get their attention to see if they are interested on getting a website. if they are interested just get their email address and create a mock up for them so they see the what you can do for them. they will like that you spend the time to create that for them. and if you do a good job well you will most likely have the sale. you won't get the sale the day, but you will for sure the next once they gotten the chance to take a look at the mock-up you created for them.
      I would not advise that approach unless you are VERY good at sales, good enough to do them in writing, and have a high conversion, also you better have hot web design skills... because you arent selling them on the reasons they need to buy, only the design itself.

      Personally I dont fancy designing 5 websites for the possibility of selling NONE of them. Thats spinning your wheels.

      As for some for the other approaches mentioned here:

      I do agree that it takes a different kind of talent to do online sales or direct marketing, all of which I do- and they may say cold calling is for "dumb" people (I think "entry level" would be a better word).

      So what qualifies as "entry level"- to me its a person who isnt making money.

      So we need this teaching so entry level people can make money.

      Im going to tell you the truth, I dont believe Adrians claims, but I think he is brilliant, and I think that if you are willing to go through the time it takes to learn direct marketing, and have a few thousand dollars to burn in the process... then, truly its advantageous in some ways, but I will also tell you that the likely hood of a person making money with it within their first 90 days is very low... even if you had Adrians exact letter, you still have to have his sales ability and be able to sell in meetings and to call ins...

      Even if you had the exact letter he uses, you would still lack his organized culmination of elements, such as web sites and other facets of presentation.

      3rdly, you have to be "believable" and that wont happen until you learn how to sell.

      Lastly,

      The statistics speak for themselves, there may be more passive ways to generate customers and some do, but if you look at the REALITY there are VERY few who master them. I agree that once these strategies are mastered they are valuable, but if you look at the stats around here, not too many people are seasoned enough to master them in a short time frame...

      Maybe one in 100 who really try hard...BUT....Telemarketing can have even the most simple minded person in business and making ten thousand dollars per month within 7-30 days.

      And more like one out of 3 people who really follow through and succeed, as opposed to one in 100

      So, if you are a newby, which is who us cold callers are mainly talking to, then which is the smartest way for you to invest your learning curve and get to making money fast?

      Dont believe me, believe the success stories you read here. They mean something, my words could mean ANYTHING, but you cant argue with the facts..

      So, I will give these guys a little credit. I dont trust Adrian as far as I can throw him, but he is Smart- just that he is also seasoned- and most of you arent.

      BTW Vlad, the guru slayer...

      How much are you getting for websites in Bulgaria, I have done alot of business with your country, in fact about $50-$60,000 actually with a wholesale distributor there who use to buy liquidatioin loads from me, which I closed at my kitchen table with NO PHONE AT ALL, just the internet...

      Anyway, I know the economy is a little different there- "how much are you closing for?"

      How many deals have you closed?

      Personally I cant count mine, they are very literally in the thousands. I stopped counting my closes and keeping score 10 years ago...

      Are you making hundreds of sales, or have you in the past, because you speak as an authority, as if you are a person who has made hundreds of sales with years of experience, is that a fact?

      Inquiring minds want to know.

      In closing,

      I gave you guys the props you are due, no more no less. Yes your strategy is cool, and its the pot of gold everyone is looking for...but statistically 100 times more people fail with it than telemarketing- ALOT more.

      So how do you define intelligence?

      Is it a person who tries to do things they arent prepared for and wastes months on end learning when they need to be making cash, or is it a person who takes the simplest method possible and gets some cash in their pocket?

      Fact is, anyone intelligent, is going to take the talent they have that they can work with "NOW" and make something happen fast if they need cash, and a dumb A$$ (in my book) is going to follow bells and whistles and get into territory that theres no way they could be seasoned enough to grasp in a short period, fail and go chase another bell or whistle.

      Intelligent people choose their battles wisely according to what they have to work with. Most people dont have the seasoning to pull off what Adrian talks about, even if they had the knowledge, but telemarketing can be learned easily, get you seasoned to recognize a close when you see it, and position you to where you can afford to learn these other methods.

      Its just like "classified ads" with Don Lapre, there is no doubt they work, but only one in 5,000 people that bought his program were able to make it work for THEM.

      If you want to devote months or years to that mastery go for it. I could pull it off because Im seasoned... but YOU , the newby, are going to have to learn alot about copywriting, and marketing, and even phone sales and face to face sales before it will work for YOU.

      My suggestion, get yourself up to about 10k per month with cold calling which is almost guaranteed money in the bag, then approach stuff like this.

      Again, dont believe me, believe the number of success stories you see from telemarketing, and if you look around the offline forum there are a TON of people who tried everything, and nothing else worked till they tried telemarketing.

      There are exceptions, and Im sure they will pop up in this thread, but thats the RULE.

      Dont hate me, I didnt make the rules. I just observe them.

      Hope this helps someone.
      \
      -JD.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6613694].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author mak25
        Originally Posted by John Durham View Post


        Intelligent people choose their battles wisely according to what they have to work with. Most people dont have the seasoning to pull off what Adrian talks about, even if they had the knowledge, but telemarketing can be learned easily, get you seasoned to recognize a close when you see it, and position you to where you can afford to learn these other methods.
        Truer words were never spoken.
        If your pockets are thin, your desire great, there really is no better way
        to start your journey.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6617225].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author itzpaul
    @Gatsby - Good luck! Hope you get those customers.

    I'm starting as well and I'm looking to find some clients. Currently, testing out direct mail but am going to look into cold calling again.

    @scottgallagher - thanks for the link to the file!

    @iAmNameLess - Great tip, I understand what your saying and will definitely think about trying this out and doing the whole one call close.

    @EnzoBlaque - Definitely, agree with you. There are really multiple ways to prospect for clients. What one client may due, another won't. Either, way there are clients coming from everywher. Just a matter, of being there.


    - Great nuggets on the forum but a lot of c**k fighting! lol hilarious tho!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6655316].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author henry Argueta
    well i just read this entire thread and if could be a judge of all the arguemnets
    that went on on here i think iamnamenless john durham and ken schooled everyone.
    lol..this was a hallarious thread, im serious i was watching george looez stand up comedy and this thread made me laugh more than george lopez did
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6656624].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author chucktrukk
    scott, Thanks for the video.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[6794274].message }}

Trending Topics