Has anyone noticed the strange vibe going on in the Offline Subforum Lately?

68 replies
I have noticed the past week or so that cold calling threads are not so prevalent on the front page, and you know what else I have noticed...alot of diverse bells and whistles "How to..." and alot of "Heres how you can...", and alot of "My new amazing system" or "idea", kind of stuff, but what I HAVENT noticed, is the 4-5 threads on the front page that usually say "I just got my first sale".

Suddenly, out of the blue, people who you dont even recognize from this part of the forum popping up with long threads about how they are faling with cold calling...Which a month ago, we know was creating a new success story virtually every single day.

Its a cycle, and its a deliberate attack on what we have been teaching- Myself, Iamnameless, David Miller, Ken Michaels , Jason Kanigan... the people who really have created alot of success stories here with newby's.... It started weeks ago with Adrian Browning and the attack has grown to where you cant even recognize half the names on the front page who are posting all these crazy ideas.

I say this to make a point.

You arent seeing a ton of success stories daily as of late.

Now given the nature of this, after this post is made it would not surprise me if they started popping up. But has anyone else noticed this link?

Personally, I use to argue with every fruitless idea I saw promoted here but lately I have been kicking back just watching and going to visit the different rabbit holes (ooops I mean "threads" and just chatting or participating...now we have people doing all kinds of strange plans... and if you really watch there is no real focus....and if you pay attention, there is also alot of dreaming and talking and not alot of success stories popping up.

This is subject to argument, and you may not even respond, but mark my words down and come back later and tell me I was right, because I have been selling thousands of offline customers for fifteen years and have seen a TON of trends, and when cold calling is placed low on the priority list, this is what you end up with- A bunch of people in all kinds of diverse unfocused threads chasing down rabbit holes.

Its not the same as it was and there is no sense of focused offline power.Just mostly alot of "experimentation" threads.

Im not going to fight the trend personally because I cant keep spending my life trying to do that... but I will continue to kick back and observe the same truth that has held fast over every cycle and trend, and eventually people will be hunting the cold calling teachers back down saying "Oh my God I chased bells and whistles for six months and nothing worked until a bore down and cold called", there will be exceptions... but watch the cycle, the rule will be that this place is run amuck like it is at this very moment, lose its focus, and nobody will be making significant sales again.

For anyone who doesnt want to follow that trend- dig up some cold calling threads and despite the vehement arguments you will get from people pushing bells and whistles, the difference between the threads will be clear, and the power for the most part is in cold calling.

Now I fully expect a bunch of people with less than three hundred posts to start digging up cold calling failure threads and bumping them to the top...as I said, its a cycle, and when you have been offlining for fifteen years you have seen the cycle time and time again- When people get worn out with bells and whistles, they cold call and suddenly succeed.

Just a mental note. I have alot of personal time investment in the offline subforum here, and feel like one of its fathers... so I observe.

Let the trends continue to phase themselves back to the true principles after the people are worn out and disapointed, but cold calling is where its at....and I think if you go down reading all the strange thread titles and unfocused diverse stuff on the front page... it will be clear to you, that when the non cold calling crowd came in overtaking the offline forum, the focused powerful success "left".

Most of the people you see pop up saying otherwise will have low post count...watch that trend too. No, its not a coincidence.

Hopefully there will still be some good teachers who are ready to pick up the pieces when everyone is crying that they have wasted months on end, and didnt get the solution. Personally I will be busy buidling my offline business...I have done most of my work here...its funny to see how when the power leaves the scavengers come. lol But maybe thats just my take.

-JD
#calling #cold #link #noticed #rate #sucess
  • Profile picture of the author payoman
    I was considering making a post about doing over 7k sales this month (best month yet), but just thought it would be kinda bragging, not very helpful.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by payoman View Post

      I was considering making a post about doing over 7k sales this month (best month yet), but just thought it would be kinda bragging, not very helpful.
      It actually builds faith. But yeah you are a superstar, you have inspired alot of people in the past couple of months with your success. BTW, I got your email I would imagine being an inspiration is just a side benefit to your success as a cold calling Original Phone Gangster!

      May be an afterthought for you, but your inspiration has been significant for more than a few people lately.

      I guess I get tired of the feeling of always having to guard the sanctity of all of our hard work here... so Im just calling it out and showing people the polarity and instead of arguing, Im putting my words in writing so they can pull them up later and say I was right.
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  • Profile picture of the author BrandonMHowe
    John,

    Yes... I've noticed it myself.

    I even stopped lurking due to the hate, nonsense, and
    lack of the "real time" calling threads that were actually
    productive and helpful for the forum.


    Payoman,

    I've been wondering how things were going for you...

    Glad to hear all's going pretty well!

    I posted in a very old thread of yours, behind Ken
    Michaels... I was surprised you never came back to the
    thread to update or report on how you were doing.

    So, what's working best for you, Payoman?

    How did you bring in the 7g's??
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    @ Brandon, you may even have noticed that I myself dont even lurk much here lately, its just a bunch of disorientation with no focus....I have gained some posts in the main discussion area as a result of that boredom though....and this one is beginning to look about the same. It will change, but the cycle has to run its course. Until then....

    The most interesting thread I have participated in here this week was about manufacturing and distributing of all things....lol

    As I said, just visiting the various rabbit holes...
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    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      you may even have noticed that I myself dont even lurk much here lately, its just a bunch of disorientation with no focus....I
      Ditto.

      I hope your right and it is just a cycle.

      If not, instead of the self imposed hiatus, i am probably going to be gone for good.

      I love this forum, and have met some great people, i would hate
      to see it go down the crapper.
      Signature

      Selling Ain't for Sissies!
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  • Profile picture of the author wally247
    There may be a bunch of us gearing up for action...and our success post is still a few days in the future.
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  • Profile picture of the author abbot
    Banned
    I have spent about 6 months on this forum. I see the problem...Everyone is SO focused on WHAT WORKS BEST they completely forget about the taking action part. They sit on a forum all day and post threads saying they failed at cold calling expecting someone to rub their back and give them a glass of milk...

    Reality check to them...this is business....and to survive you can't complain when something does not work. They treat this forum like their mommy. When they make 49 dials and don't make a sale they come crying to the forum asking for help and WHY THIS IS NOT WORKING. To me...it's a good thing. Because while they are sobbing, I'm makin' sales over the phone, and filling my days up with appt's.
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    • Profile picture of the author nyk24
      Great post John....I have been reading your posts for the past 3 months or so with interest.

      I believe the type of posts on here are like fashion trends one minute everyone's thinking about cold calling the next minute people are talking about directories or email marketing etc etc.

      In the uk (generally speaking) folks like to moan about stuff more than they like to share in their business success...whether that's coz we don't want to boast, are scared of competition or feel we have worked too hard to then come on here and share our success stories???


      Originally Posted by abbot View Post

      I have spent about 6 months on this forum. I see the problem...Everyone is SO focused on WHAT WORKS BEST they completely forget about the taking action part. They sit on a forum all day and post threads saying they failed at cold calling expecting someone to rub their back and give them a glass of milk...

      Reality check to them...this is business....and to survive you can't complain when something does not work. They treat this forum like their mommy. When they make 49 dials and don't make a sale they come crying to the forum asking for help and WHY THIS IS NOT WORKING. To me...it's a good thing. Because while they are sobbing, I'm makin' sales over the phone, and filling my days up with appt's.
      @abbot I agree with you in part some folks on here are only trying to replicate the theory behind a lot of others' success stories on here but not taking the real action.

      A lot of failed cold callers I think have in part failed not because they are rubbish on the phone but because they do not persist with the calls and give up too quickly....a lack of self motivation perhaps?

      Some of the success stories we hear about have been from folks who have been motivated by their dire financial state. If you are at rock bottom you are more likely to give it your all.

      Another failure is people trying to either over complicate things when putting a sales pitch together or on the other side of the coin thinking that a one push button software and a few calls will get them clients.

      Then you have the, "it will never work crowd" if you think it won't work then guess what? It probably won't because your heart wasn't in it.

      I am no sucessful big shot marketerer but I have realised a few things these last few months from a lot of the wiser warriors on here and my own sucess and failures.

      My advice to anyone who want it is this:

      1. Whatever service you offer make sure you can actually produce the goods whether its seo,wordpress site, mobile etc etc that a client needs.

      2. Persistance....If at first you don't succeed try try try again

      3. KISS....Keep It Simple Stupid - Explain yourself in layman terms

      4. Emotional.....People are scared to pick up the phone, scared of rejection and business owners are scared of risking even small amounts of money on marketing their business.

      5. Be the 1%.....If 1% of people go out their and find the buyers even in a recession there's at least 1% of businesses wise enough to know they need our help.

      6. If you see a fellow warrior doing well copy him but improve on his method- tweak it to suit you. Big business copy each other all the time!

      I could go on all day telling people what to do and how to do it but unless you take action and keep trying you will never suceed.

      On a more upbeat note I have found a method that gets clients however I haven't yet perfected my service (as mentioned in point 1.) so it makes my method redundant until I can nail down the technical details.

      Don't worry I will post my method hopefully when I have the technical details sorted soon
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  • Profile picture of the author payoman
    How I made the 7g's? The short answer : Cold calling.

    Man...I averaged it out and I found that for every 170 dials, I pulled in about $1200. So as John says, roughly 1 in 100 (when you factor out all the voicemails/disconnects) calls results in a close.

    But another thing was callbacks. I had 2 guys call me back from previous cold calling rounds (about 2 months ago), one went ahead with a job, the other chickened out unfortunately. That was $1500 there.

    But Iamnamless had a great thread about diversifying your lead generation. I do almost exclusively cold calls (I have VA's sending emails out for website redesign, but nothing from that yet), and picked up a job from a random email I sent out once.

    Bear in mind that the 7g's wasn't all paid upfront, in that month. Some haven't even deposited yet. Basically, I do calls during the month, work on the deals throughout the month (followups with written quotes etc) and the deals don't really get closed for a week or so, so by the end of the month I did something like 5g of the sales in the last week or so.

    EDIT : Just realised I am kind of jacking John's thread lol! Sorry mate, I'll do a 'Monthly Summary' post with some stats to let you get back on track, look out for it guys haha
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by payoman View Post

      How I made the 7g's? The short answer : Cold calling.

      Man...I averaged it out and I found that for every 170 dials, I pulled in about $1200. So as John says, roughly 1 in 100 (when you factor out all the voicemails/disconnects) calls results in a close.

      But another thing was callbacks. I had 2 guys call me back from previous cold calling rounds (about 2 months ago), one went ahead with a job, the other chickened out unfortunately. That was $1500 there.

      But Iamnamless had a great thread about diversifying your lead generation. I do almost exclusively cold calls (I have VA's sending emails out for website redesign, but nothing from that yet), and picked up a job from a random email I sent out once.

      Bear in mind that the 7g's wasn't all paid upfront, in that month. Some haven't even deposited yet. Basically, I do calls during the month, work on the deals throughout the month (followups with written quotes etc) and the deals don't really get closed for a week or so, so by the end of the month I did something like 5g of the sales in the last week or so.

      EDIT : Just realised I am kind of jacking John's thread lol! Sorry mate, I'll do a 'Monthly Summary' post with some stats to let you get back on track, look out for it guys haha
      Payoman, my thread is your thread...Hijack it man!
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  • Profile picture of the author Marvin Johnston
    John, you have an interesting perspective on the threads. I've been MIA so to speak as I had another project that took up all of my time for the past 5 months or so. And on returning, I was a bit surprised to see all the threads on cold calling using telemarketing.

    And I have to admit the threads and success stories are giving me second thoughts on my strong bias against telemarketing ... okay, okay ... call that bias fear .

    Marvin
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  • Profile picture of the author fastviper
    Cold calling is working fine for me....
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  • Profile picture of the author HAdrian1239
    Cold calling so works, but there's a lot of people who don't want to believe it, and it's "hard" and "stressful" and requires "work" so they'd rather not do it.

    I got myself out of a "oh crap, you're going to be living in a box" situation using cold calling. Did I meet the original goals I had set for myself? No, but that's because those goals required focus I didn't have when I started.

    BUT, the fact that I saved my bacon when I needed to... gave me the motivation to focus like I had originally wanted to, plus I'm moved now (What I needed the "save my bacon" money for) and I'm hitting the phones again this week, I still don't feel super confident, but that's my issue, it's not anything to do with talking to business owners so... we'll see what happens...

    I wish people would just take action, and stop with the whole cycle of over analyzing and trashing on proven methods.... but that's just me. I've missed the cold calling threads, and the success threads that have been replaced by other things....
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  • Profile picture of the author StephS
    I've got a ridiculously low number of posts - less than 15, been here since 2008, off and on. I'm also ridiculously shy, which accounts for why I read so much, but never post. Anyway, there are those of us with low post counts that have no intention of coming into this subforum to knock cold calling. When I first began visiting the offline forum a few weeks ago, I was surprised to see so many threads on cold calling - actually avoided them for a while, because I don't care for cold calling at all. I believed so much of what I heard which was that cold calling was ineffective, inefficient, and a terrible way to position yourself. Then I finally began reading some of these threads, out of pure curiosity, and boy did these threads change my mind! I haven't started cold calling yet, but I plan to start (once I decide what service I'm going to offer) because I need to drum up some business ASAP - and from what I've learned here, cold calling is a very effective way of doing just that. And I plan to use other marketing methods as well, but I think I would be foolish not to incorporate cold calls into the mix.

    And yes, I've been purposely searching out older threads lately, because it's been hard finding anything on the first page of this subforum that I really want to read about. So you're not alone in noticing that there has been a change lately.

    Anyway, thank you John for all that you contribute. I swear without you I wouldn't even CONSIDER picking up the phone and cold calling anyone - but after what I've learned from you it doesn't seem as hard as I remember. Now I've just got to fit it in with my full-time job in cubicle hell, followed by my favorite full-time job as a mom. That's a different story altogether...
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  • Profile picture of the author Croque
    Wow! conspiracy theories now John :rolleyes: ?

    Nothing is going on, everything is like it always been. Like someone else mentioned, the forum goes in cycles. In two weeks everything will go back to what you consider normal.

    Move along people, nothing to see here.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by Croque View Post

      Wow! conspiracy theories now John :rolleyes: ?

      Nothing is going on, everything is like it always been. Like someone else mentioned, the forum goes in cycles. In two weeks everything will go back to what you consider normal.

      Move along people, nothing to see here.
      To say that people do not form groups to attack ideas would be incorrect, so unless you have a reason to believe that the word conspiracy was created for no reason and is invalid... then why wouldnt you suppose it could happen here?

      Not to be a conspiracy thinker but if I knew who you were I would may have more reason to lean toward your counsel on the subject. A group of our teachers were CLEARLY attacked by another group weeks ago which led to my webdesigner confirmed to me that someone hacked my site, only days later... (forum and totally destroyed it...), and we had to put it back together.

      To say that stuff doesnt happen in forums would say that these groups didnt exist and its clear that entire websites of them with thousands of members DO, I have personally been warned by them and attacked several times right after the warnings... and so its clear to me, but maybe not so clear to you, that they are not myth.

      When you realize that my forum made 100k last year, and that was taking from someone elses market, you would not underestimate what is at stake, and it may be more believable.

      It would take more than a roll of the eyes (which you have in effect offered here) to dismiss this.
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      • I've been a regular reader of Offline for ~2 years. I have very little to offer the forum as I do relatively little offline work at the moment, but it's probably one of my favourite forums to read on a regular basis due to the huge diversity of methods and ideas - e.g. Bob Ross's megacards (deleted!), and also particularly the stuff on cold calling from John, and the others he named.

        I would never, in a million years, have even considered cold calling before reading those posts, transcripts and setup tips.

        I still don't have any plans to cold call, but I do see it as far more feasible than I would have thought a couple of years ago.

        Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

        Its a cycle, and its a deliberate attack on what we have been teaching
        I'm far from convinced that this is a deliberate attack. In fact, the only thing resembling an attack I can see is your reference to those promoting non-cold-calling methods as "pushing bells and whistles". That's a derogatory way to refer to other methodologies that are every bit as legitimate as cold-calling.

        Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

        Not to be a conspiracy thinker but if I knew who you were I would may have more reason to lean toward your counsel on the subject.
        I can't speak for the previous poster, but you can find out who I am quite easily.

        Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

        A group of our teachers were CLEARLY attacked by another group weeks ago which led to my webdesigner confirmed to me that someone hacked my site, only days later... (forum and totally destroyed it...), and we had to put it back together.
        I'm sorry that someone took that action against your site. If you need help with getting the website fixed or secured, I'm happy to lend a hand.

        I think there is plenty of room in the Offline forum for cold-calling and the multitude of other approaches, and for most businesses I think a multi-pronged marketing effort is the best bet.
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  • Profile picture of the author Adrian Browning
    Banned
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

      There seems to be a misconception that this is the "Cold Callers Forum" instead of the "Offline Marketing" forum. People are 100% entitled to come here and post whatever they want, as long as it's related to their Offline businesses.

      These threads by people who have become disenchanted and are failing due to Cold Calling should not be cast aside and dismissed as "conspiracies".. These are real people with real issues that need to be addressed.

      If someone has experienced success using Direct Mail, Flyers, Postcards etc.. They have every right to come here and let everyone else know how they did it.

      This isnt exclusively titled the "Cold Callers Section".. So If you happen to see a few threads detailing a successful direct mail campaign, or a Flyer campaign that produced tremendous ROI you shouldn't then create your own thread describing it as a "strange vibe".

      Everyone has the absolute right to use whatever method works for them.
      I dont believe anyone mentioned direct mail specifically. Bob ross is a genius and so is bruce ruby. However Adrian it doesnt shock me that you show up at this particular juncture.
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  • Profile picture of the author sloanjim
    OK John...they're out to get you.....Phewwww.......

    Can you read my psot about this "daily grind of cold calling"?

    My big question is WHY? Why would any good biz need to constantly cold call for new bizz? In fact, the more often a bizz had to cold call for new bizz would set alarm bells off for me. It would tell me they cannot retain customers.....

    Talk about adaily grind to death. Why not set up a much more passive business? 10 clients at $1k per month profit.

    Or do you just enjoy doing it that much it's not about the busienss set up any more?
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    • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
      Originally Posted by sloanjim View Post

      OK John...they're out to get you.....Phewwww.......

      Can you read my psot about this "daily grind of cold calling"?

      My big question is WHY? Why would any good biz need to constantly cold call for new bizz? In fact, the more often a bizz had to cold call for new bizz would set alarm bells off for me. It would tell me they cannot retain customers.....

      Talk about adaily grind to death. Why not set up a much more passive business? 10 clients at $1k per month profit.

      Or do you just enjoy doing it that much it's not about the busienss set up any more?
      You're right, but you're not. I don't mean that in a bad way, but why be happy with mediocrity? Why be happy with a certain amount of monthly income? That is why I'm in business for myself, so I don't have a ceiling, or a limit. The sky is the limit, and then some!

      You can easily set up a passive business. BUT... some people don't want a passive business, some people want to grow their business to multi millions.
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  • Profile picture of the author sloanjim
    Sadly I agree:

    There seems to be a misconception that this is the "Cold Callers Forum" instead of the "Offline Marketing" forum. People are 100% entitled to come here and post whatever they want, as long as it's related to their Offline businesses.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
    Yup, there are personal attacks going on...don't know why, don't know who these haters are. I don't know these people personally. It's very strange. I've been here less and less.

    Glad someone else noticed it, John, and it's not "just me."

    I know we've given tons of value away completely free and helped many, many people.
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  • Profile picture of the author Khemosabi
    It's hard to imagine that anyone considers this the "cold calling forum". Perhaps you do, but for the wrong (obvious) reasons.
    Fact remains, there is a definite change of vibe that has been going on in this forum, I think some of the posts on this thread just proved John's point...(ironic eh?)
    There are many that dedicate a lot of their time trying to help, not all are cold callers. The cold calling encouragement is meant for beginners as a way to get started, get over that wall, and get busy. It's a super learning tool for all offliners.
    Because of this negative vibe, those that need the help and encouragement, aren't getting it...period. If the respected warriors no longer want to show up, HELP, and encourage, what do you suppose happens to this community?
    I myself am motivated by the day I can come here and help others, and I respect those that encourage rather than discourage.
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  • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
    I think it's sad and despicable how low some people have to go in order to validate their own existence.

    The funniest part about all this, is when the attacks come out, they're so WRONG and misinformed but they don't care.

    John does more than telemarketing, Jason does more than telemarketing, they're EXPERIENCED MARKETERS. Every experienced marketer has their favorite ways of marketing. Bob Ross does a lot of direct mailing, but I'm sure Bob does MORE than direct mailing when it comes to getting his clients.

    I'm SO SICK of seeing the BS attacks coming out by people with a hidden agenda so they can go create a squidoo lens or a hub or a blog somewhere else and just talk trash on everybody.

    Nobody here that is a marketing expert will dismiss the power of multiple forms of marketing put together.

    1.) It is idiotic to say that the phone will HURT your business.
    2.) It is complete idiocy to say that telemarketing doesn't work
    3.) Telemarketers even understand the power of other forms of marketing so stop making it seem like we're idiots about other forms of marketing, we probably do MORE than you do.

    Question... why is it that you people that hide behind fake screen names and post hateful comments on other websites about us, think that every form of marketing EXCEPT cold calling and telemarketing is okay?

    It's kind of funny... One guy that creates the fake screen names and talks trash, is peddling his cold calling doesn't work course and membership. Another guy has a fake name, fake pic, and no proof of ever making a single sale. It's getting old.

    Nobody is saying this forum is all about cold calling. There is a lot of gold in the forum, but cold calling gets attention mostly because the experienced people know it's strength and the power and how easy it is to get sales from it. It also gets a lot of attention because there are people with their own agenda outside this forum that blast people who believe it works. Every thread about it turns into a flame war. That's why it seems to dominate the forum at times.

    Isn't this place about learning and teaching? Just because someone sucks at telemarketing, that doesn't entitle you to all of a sudden be a guru on all things offline marketing, because you're not. You're a joke.

    Some people just really look stupid when they start trashing people. I think we all learn new things here. I'm sure John, Jason, Bob Ross, Chris Rivers, ken michaels, and countless others have learned new things when being here. Maybe it's another form of marketing, maybe it's another angle, and maybe it's how to deal with people who don't have the courage to bring things up under their real names instead of hiding in miscellaneous articles and blogs.

    Not everybody needs to be a telemarketer, and not everyone needs to be an expert in your favorite form of marketing. That doesn't make it okay to come on here to put people down that WANT TO LEARN about that form of marketing.

    Have fun writing on your squidoo, stalking certain WF personalities that you're secretly crushing on.
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  • Thank you for this John - I am a newbie (on the Warrior forum). I have loads of great things about it and I was a bit dissappointed by some of the the threads that were on here at the top (to be honest a lot of hoots and whistles and loads of people basically bragging about their big fat shiny **** (Fill in the blank!) :0)

    So after reading this post I went back a little and saw the difference in the value given. So, thanks for pointing that out ! I was beginning to think that the stories of warrior forum where just Myths LOL

    Thanks for reigniting my faith ...

    (right I am off to do some more reading now)

    TY
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    • I like to come here and feel good. read about ideas to do better, help people, and hear about people succeeding.

      I hope this is a phase.

      reminds me of being in an old TM room where the morale is low.

      sales guys standing around the water cooler professing how good they are by going negative, how they have a better way, and not being constructive.

      When I was in these situations....I hated it, and the incentive was to go back to my desk, jump on the phone because hearing decision makers reject me was a better alternative.

      I don't have the "Image problem" with the phone.

      it's one of the best business tools!
      if you can sell over the phone you can do anything else!
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  • Profile picture of the author Justin Lavoie
    I must admit I hate cold calling mainly because I hate receiving these types of call. I hate it with all of my heart, so much that I would probably never do business with them ever, but thats just me, thats how I am.

    Also, I HATE begging. I just dont. I can't. I prefer the other way , people begging for my services and it's alot easier for me to go this way.

    I do understand however that cold calling can be a very effective way of getting your first customers, but again, I can't stand being the sheep at the other end of the line. I would do it if I had no choice but for a couple of days, no more.

    Like Adrian said, it's not a business if you have to cold call every week, it's a god damn job. You can outsource it, yes, but again I just can't stand to put my name on this kind of marketing. I consider these calls pure harrassment.

    I prefer emails (easy conversion if you know what you're doing) and meeting people face to face.

    Sooooo, that being said, dont take this post as an attack on cold callers. We all have our ways of doing things. I dont think we have to call this a conspiracy however.

    *waving white flag*
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    • Originally Posted by Justin Lavoie View Post

      I must admit I hate cold calling mainly because I hate receiving these types of call. I hate it with all of my heart, so much that I would probably never do business with them ever, but thats just me, thats how I am.

      Also, I HATE begging. I just dont. I can't. I prefer the other way , people begging for my services and it's alot easier for me to go this way.

      I do understand however that cold calling can be a very effective way of getting your first customers, but again, I can't stand being the sheep at the other end of the line. I would do it if I had no choice but for a couple of days, no more.

      Like Adrian said, it's not a business if you have to cold call every week, it's a god damn job. You can outsource it, yes, but again I just can't stand to put my name on this kind of marketing. I consider these calls pure harrassment.

      I prefer emails (easy conversion if you know what you're doing) and meeting people face to face.

      Sooooo, that being said, dont take this post as an attack on cold callers. We all have our ways of doing things. I dont think we have to call this a conspiracy however.

      *waving white flag*

      Is this what you mean John?
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  • Profile picture of the author Khemosabi
    @Adrian
    I just read one of your post on another topic. You actually used the word "retarded". What's next?
    Just the fact that you feel the need to attack anyone for anything, shows your merit. BUT WAIT, there's great news for you!!! Now, when anyone you're looking to do business with does a simple search on your name (or one of your names), all of the threads from this great forum come up first page! WOO HOO!
    Did you forget how big this forum was?? OOPS.
    Here's your personal link to Marketing 101 <---it's not real, and if you missed the irony, well, I'll wait.
    Point is, we can all see that bad publicity is better than no publicity, gosh, I took the time to search your name (two minutes of my life I'll never get back), but fact remains I did it.
    So there you go Andy, there's your fifteen minutes of fame.
    Anyone on this forum discouraging someone from TRYING, is like taking food off of their table.
    Signature


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    • Profile picture of the author Adrian Browning
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      • Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

        Pal, I own an investment group, advertising agency and recruitment firm.. Not 'part-own' i run this organisation.. So spare me the tomfoolery.

        My clients hate cold callers just as much as I do.. why? Because they are insensitive of people's time, intrusive, disruptive, invasive.. I could really go on.. So, again, spare me.. I don't need lectures from you.

        And I have not "discouraged people from trying".. Infact all I have done is 'encourage' people to expand their methods and mode of operation to include other much more rewarding marketing techniques.

        I've discussed the fabulous ROI that Direct Marketing produces for me each and every week.. I've brought forward the successes of my Flyer campaigns, and my high converting direct mail pieces..

        Sure, I operate at a larger scale and employ other more expensive forms of marketing.. But I started my entire operation off of simple cost effective methods that anyone can use.. Not once did I resort to joining the shady world that is cold calling.

        my clients hate this:

        using the phone? not good
        direct mail - who wants junk mail??
        radio spots - I want the music!!!
        billboards - man, there everywhere!!!
        flyers - geez, on my car, my doorknob, on the street, whats next?????

        Online Marketing - during the early 1990's it was "don't commercialize it!"

        and my favorite - the internet will eliminate the middleman, broker, and salesperson.

        these are invasive, disruptive, intrusive....

        P.S. - thanks adrian, I just remembered something that happened years ago with an investment broker (see in your post you own an investment group) I met with years ago. what a story! what a great lesson
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        • Profile picture of the author Adrian Browning
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          • Quote:
            Originally Posted by kirbymarketingconcierge

            my clients hate this:

            using the phone? not good
            direct mail - who wants junk mail??
            radio spots - I want the music!!!
            billboards - man, there everywhere!!!
            flyers - geez, on my car, my doorknob, on the street, whats next?????

            Online Marketing - during the early 1990's it was "don't commercialize it!"

            and my favorite - the internet will eliminate the middleman, broker, and salesperson.

            these are invasive, disruptive, intrusive....


            Adrian Browning
            Offline Warrior

            Okay.. Well here's the thing about these forms of marketing that you have listed. They are ALL an EXPECTED part of simple every day life...

            As humans, we are exposed to 3000 ads on a daily basis.

            We listen to the radio "KNOWING" that at one point or another we will be presented with an advert.. Hell, as humans some of us watch TV and sit through ALL of the commercials just to find out about the latest product before anyone else.. We travel everyday and come across hundreds of billboards.. we 'expect' that.

            But one thing that I can tell you is that humans only purchase telephones for a few reasons.. 1. To keep in contact with friends and family, 2. To receive and make business calls.. We dont 'EXPECT' to have some random cold caller bombard our telephone only to forcefully try to sell us..

            People hate to be sold to, but they love to buy.

            In one post i referred to Cold Calling as "primitive". And I stand by that statement. Because cold calling lacks that 'expected' factor.. it requires absolutely no intelligence to pick up the phone and beg someone for money.. So imagine what image you are creating for your brand when you engage in this act.

            Sure some people don't like flyers, or direct mail.. But the DIFFERENCE between these methods and Cold Calling, is the simple fact that there is no 'Hard-Sell'..There are no sleazy tactics.. If someone isn't interested they simply don't take action.. If they are, they 'choose' to get in contact... and i would much rather have hundreds of people begging me for my services, rather than the other way round.

            I know I can reach 1000's of people every single week through flyers, direct mail, radio, television.. etc.. and generate a healthy amount of sales..

            Can you do the same by cold calling?


            From Kirby

            were now at the "watercooler" (from previous post).

            have to go.

            have a great week!
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      • Profile picture of the author bhuff85
        Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

        I've discussed the fabulous ROI that Direct Marketing produces for me each and every week.. I've brought forward the successes of my Flyer campaigns, and my high converting direct mail pieces..
        ...And it's cool to share and discuss techniques that have worked for you. That's what this forum is all about - to share and learn from others.

        What is isn't all about, however, is hijacking threads where others are sharing THEIR success with certain methods THEY do that work for THEM, only to trash talk why "their methods suck" and why YOUR'S is "better".

        You think cold calling is invasive and disrupting? What about going into threads, only to completely derail them by talking down on other methods that were successful for others, just because you got "better results" doing something different?

        Hypocritical, isn't it?

        I'm glad direct marketing works for you just like I'm glad cold calling works for another. Heck, I'm happy when I hear anyone having success with something. It's great to see people go from zero to hero, too.

        Millions of people out there make money doing things I would never do, but I don't try to convince them why my methods are better than theirs just because I had success with them.

        I'll end it like this:

        - Millions of people are still out there cold calling, generating new business and earning money every single day

        - Millions of people are still out there doing direct marketing, generating new business and earning money every single day


        You can throw out all of the numbers in the world if you want, but it doesn't matter - people will still continue doing what they excel at and knows will make THEM the most money and get THEM the most return. Point, blank, period.
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        • Profile picture of the author Adrian Browning
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          • Profile picture of the author bhuff85
            Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

            I feel that it is very necessary to let people know that cold calling only converts at 1%.. Hot dog dealers produce higher conversion rates than that.
            And if someone is converting at 10% or more, then what?

            Look - we can toss out numbers all day, but there are so many things to take into consideration that will impact your conversion over the next guy. Everyone is going to have mixed results.

            A hot dog dealer in the middle of a low-traffc highway is going to be lucky to get any conversions, while the guy who posts up in the middle of a food festival with thousands of people is selling so much he can barely keep up with demand.

            Regardless of your marketing method, it's all about positioning and qualifying your prospects. Do that and your conversion ratio is considerably higher.
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      • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
        Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

        I own an investment group, advertising agency and recruitment firm..
        Whats the name of your company? and where are you located?.

        I am always looking for investment opportunity.

        No joke.
        Signature

        Selling Ain't for Sissies!
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        • Profile picture of the author sandalwood
          Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

          Whats the name of your company? and where are you located?.

          I am always looking for investment opportunity.

          No joke.
          I hope you aren't staying awake at night waiting for an answer...

          BTW. I put my investment group in my sig so people can see it really exists...

          Just saying...

          Tom
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          Get 30% or More Retirement Income If you are serious about your retirement, you'll love this product.

          The Money Ferret Finance Article Directory
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          • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
            Maybe the WAY its called out needs to be changed, but not the action.
            Indeed. There are times when rudeness is productive, but they're not as common as the times when it's just rude.

            Generally speaking, people get too angry, too fast, and take too long to get over it. That's usually a sign they're confusing issues with personalities, which is rarely a good thing. A little civility can go a long way...


            Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
    So....hmm. The way I teach calling is ethical, there aren't any traditional closes, and we look for FIT. IE. we do not try to push the square peg into the round hole. We don't assume what we offer is right for our prospect. Or that they are right for us.

    So does JD, when he says "Look for your guy."

    No sleaze, no pushiness. Just real conversations. That's how calling can be.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
    There are just as many if not more people "failing" (ie. Not Doing Well) at other kinds of marketing...this is the subform to discuss offline methods. We can go to the main forum to look at all the people "failing" at Internet Marketing.

    This is like saying "Whenever I go to the hospital, all I see is sick and injured people."
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    • Profile picture of the author Adrian Browning
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      • Profile picture of the author JohnDavid
        As suggested, maybe you should give the time and energy that the cold calling masters have on this forum. So far all I see is bashing on a method that undoubtedly works, and works with amazing consistency.

        There are more success threads regarding Warriors getting new clients via cold calling than any other method.

        Show us your way, and maybe we will see some threads of success using your methods. I hope that is the case.




        Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

        Yes, I understand that..

        But like your signature, this whole sub-forum is 'dominated' by the topic of cold calling.

        When I first came here i actually had to double backwards and make sure that the title was infact "Offline Marketing Forum" instead of "The Cold Caller's Nest"..

        I was under the impression that I could come here and find ways to improve my own business.. but since that isn't the case, I have decided to inform other struggling marketers how I got to where I am today.. and it sure as anything wasn't by cold calling.



        Ha.. I nearly fell of my chair.. That was a good one.

        What cold caller do you know converting at 10%.. ?

        Unless that person is selling to his own family members, then that figure attached to a cold caller's conversion rate is nothing more than a funny joke.
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        • Profile picture of the author Adrian Browning
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          • Profile picture of the author bhuff85
            Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

            But if you are interested in my take on how to generate customers in this industry.. Then my very own report is coming soon.
            Hmm....THAT wasn't an easy one to see coming, was it?

            /sarcasm
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      • Profile picture of the author bhuff85
        Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

        this whole sub-forum is 'littered' with the topic of cold calling.
        I'll even admit that I thought the same thing awhile back. Still, I enjoyed reading about how their methods and how each person approached it - but that's me.

        Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

        I have decided to inform other struggling marketers how I got to where I am today.. and it sure as anything wasn't by cold calling.
        So you're saying that you want to "help struggling marketers" by sharing your methods, but I clearly don't see any threads created by you that share anything of yours to "help others".

        Ha...and I nearly fell out of my chair, too!

        The people in this forum who are cold calling are here asking for advice - experienced cold callers here are givng it to them. That's how things usually (and should) work.

        Looking back, I can't say I recall those same guys going into a direct mail thread and jamming it up with hoopla about why they should follow their rules instead.

        You haven't done much to contribute to the wealth of this forum. If you truly wanted to help other struggling marketers as you say you do, you would spend less time bashing methods that you don't find useful and more time contributing.
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  • Profile picture of the author rolltide
    Adrian sure does have a lot to say. Why don't you contribute your "systems" to help everyone else instead of bashing everyone? Just a thought.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Firstly, I didnt refer to any specific method as bells and whistles, no intelligent person would get that from my post...unless they were "paranoid"... however, even despite my NOT naming any particular strategy the major player in the attack I referred to is all over this thread now , a person who DID insult a strategy, calling specific people scammy and ignorant and dumb, .... I was shocked that the mods didnt throw him ouit for his language alone...VERY unbecoming.

    Anyway this guy WAS referring to a method specifically probably 100 times in a week using very unbecoming words, and its interesting to me that if you can read this thread rationally, HE is the one saying "I" am talking about direct mailing, and I never mentioned it, and he's calling ME paranoid...

    He talks about a specific method he pushes being as referred to here, that I never even mentioned in this thread. Certainly people can read??

    Think about that one.

    Some of my favorite marketers here do direct mailing and teach it....never mentioned it... I even endorse some to my list.

    Now some of the people here on this thread who are offended , one in particular, is the most unscrupulous black hearted marketer, who is Adrian Browning in my opinion only, I have ever run across in my life. seriously, and I cant believe he even still here Period, but after all his name calling, watch me get banned for calling hi9m that now.

    There are even people with thread titles that include his name here, because he is so renown for down talking what we do with words so ugly its hardly imagineable. If it was up to me, I would boot him soo fast it wouldnt even be a question just based on the character he has displayed ALONE. And for anyone reading this he has called my name SPECIFICALLY and used choice words on me NUMEROUS times here in VERY damaging ways.... So if I get booted for saying what I think back, then so be it.


    You guys have at it.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    By the way adrian you never ever answered the question that a GAZILLION people asked you directly on your attacking thread.... Because you told us that you make 70 million dollars per year with direct mailing and that we were all just ignorant...but you avoided the question that 10 people were asking...

    So are you really making 70 million per year, are you LYING or are you still just hiding under the wf radar trying to sweep that under the rug and hoping it gets forgotten?

    I ask again for the 100th time, and if you cant answer then dont ask me why I believe some cant be trusted, and try to pass it off as paranoia.

    Originally Posted by Adrian Browning View Post

    Well who ever said they were "my" methods? Direct marketing has been around for years..

    But since you asked, here's a few threads made by just a few people who have found success using the methods that I champion:

    Probably the easiest, most enjoyable way to start offline consulting
    Flyer and CPA
    WARNING: This little ad trick blows the competition out of the water!
    Just Picked Up A MEGA Contract! Want To Know How?
    How I'm Making Money with Offline CPA Drop Cards
    Direct Mail for you IM'ers.
    $67,500 In 3 Months The Easy Way From Customer Re-Activation

    and that is JUST a few..

    But if you are interested in my take on how to generate customers in this industry.. Then my very own report is coming soon.

    I have received hundreds of PMs, so I feel it is only right that I release the exact steps
    I took to form my own million $ organisation.
    Wow you can dig up threads on the stuff you "champion" faster than I can say the word conspiracy. How did you get so fast at that? Wow.

    You recieve hundreds of PMS ? LOL!

    Im not calling you a liar on this, but last time I checked your post count doesnt even accomodate for you to recieve hundreds of PMS yet... Maybe its been awhile since I checked and Im wrong but... Im not saying you are a liar here- just THINKING it- Can we get hundreds of PMS with 62 posts? When we arent a War room member?

    Does that constitute as a "lie", or have we redefined that...? Again, maybe you have to be "super inteliigent" to figure out that works...thats probably why Im missing it.

    Does that take time away from enjoying your 70 million dollars per year....from the stuff YOU champion?

    Did you train even one person in this list?

    Bob Ross is a Genius, Ewen is good too.... but I dont see you as being anywhere near as credible or in their leagues.

    Anyway, Im buying a copy of your report because I want to know how to make SEVENTY MILLION DOLLARS per year like you Adrian. (ROLLL EYES).

    Shocking that you would be here selling reports when you make 70 mil per year.... I guess you just want to help people like you said.... Good on you Adrian.

    If I was super intelligent like, you are, and not so dumb and ignorant,,,,then maybe I could read the words "direct maling" in my OP. I guess us dumb people just arent smart enough to see those words in my post. Or maybe Im just not "paranoid" enough to read those words in my post...because I just dont see them. ???

    Does anyone else see those words in my post or is Adrian just paranoid that Im talking about what he champions and makes seventy mil per year from, and that hundreds of people are already PMing him begging him to write about...??

    I guess Im wrong for thinking he has an agenda...

    As for any other person who read the words "direct mail" in my OP, can you kindly point them out to me? I must be going blind....
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  • Profile picture of the author focusedlife
    @Payoman - Do you do manual dials or you using a system?
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  • Profile picture of the author vndnbrgj
    I do cold calling for appointment setting.
    One out of ten lands an appointment.
    One out of four appointments gets closed.
    This is on a bad day.
    My average deal is worth $36k
    40 contacts with a decision maker results in a deal.

    Cold calling isn't all I do. I also combine it with other methods, such as direct mail.
    My issue is my clients need my service, they just don't know the right way to go about it.
    So, my cold calls are welcomed.... not by everyone or else I would land more appointments.
    But those I speak to are thankful for me calling them.
    Cold calling, just like most methods, work when worked properly.

    How do you feel about warm-calling then Adrian?
    I call referrals
    I call to follow up on my mailings
    They never asked me to call... am I still being intrusive?
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    @ vndnbrgj

    He is going to ignore our true questions now. Its a pattern, he will come back babbling about every thing but the direct questions we asked...We may have to ask them on his WSO thread to get an answer.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      John,
      He is going to ignore our true questions now. Its a pattern, he will come back babbling about every thing but the direct questions we asked...We may have to ask them on his WSO thread to get an answer.
      That's a line you didn't want to cross.

      It is one thing to respond to a person's history of disliking, and even disparaging, a marketing tactic. It is something quite different to encourage people to plan an attack in advance on a sales thread, based on things that may not even be relevant to the product in question.

      Tread carefully, folks. And do not forget the distinction between discussion areas and paid advertising sections. The rules for each are separate, and very different.


      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        John,That's a line you didn't want to cross.

        It is one thing to respond to a person's history of disliking, and even disparaging, a marketing tactic. It is something quite different to encourage people to plan an attack in advance on a sales thread, based on things that may not even be relevant to the product in question.

        Tread carefully, folks. And do not forget the distinction between discussion areas and paid advertising sections. The rules for each are separate, and very different.


        Paul
        Paul, I respect your wisdom and how you handle so many situations but I don't think John is REALLY encouraging that.

        I think it was just a point he was trying to make about Adrian offering insight and talking trash on a ton of posts but never truly answering direct questions about his claims. I think anyone that releases a WSO (or threatens to lol) should be expecting to back up any claims they have regarding the product.
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        • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
          I think anyone that releases a WSO (or threatens to lol) should be expecting to back up any claims they have regarding the product.
          I agree with that. But John Durham, and anyone else who's made comments about Adrian in this thread, should not be among the people asking those questions in any sales thread Adrian posts. Not after the comment John made earlier.


          Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author John Durham
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        John,That's a line you didn't want to cross.

        It is one thing to respond to a person's history of disliking, and even disparaging, a marketing tactic. It is something quite different to encourage people to plan an attack in advance on a sales thread, based on things that may not even be relevant to the product in question.

        Tread carefully, folks. And do not forget the distinction between discussion areas and paid advertising sections. The rules for each are separate, and very different.


        Paul
        Sorry Paul, this dude has been attacking me hard very OVERTLY, and I let it get the best of me.... I am not encouraging anyone to attack his thread. Sorry.

        I will ask this though. If he claims to make 70 million per year and says Im dumb ignorant and unintelligent.... is it okay for me to ask him before I buy his wso if his claims are true?

        I know you are highly intelligent yourself and you can see my personal motivation here... so I cant hide it from you... This guy hurt me, and he did it unfairly... and I just want to know if I can retaliate "fairly"?

        Im a warrior Paul you cant just come smack me around and not get smacked back no matter how nice I am.
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        • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
          John,
          I will ask this though. If he claims to make 70 million per year and says Im dumb ignorant and unintelligent.... is it okay for me to ask him before I buy his wso if his claims are true?
          You don't get to comment in any sales thread of his at all. Too many legitimate concerns would be raised by your earlier response.

          Adrian was banned at one point for his nastiness. He says he's calmed down the personal tone. If that's true, I recommend everyone else involved drop the personal stuff and go back to the issues.


          Paul
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  • I feel like a guy who just walked in on a domestic.

    I'm still not convinced there's any conspiracy here, but individual naysayers are aplenty - every methodology and business vertical will have them.
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  • Profile picture of the author mak25
    Originally Posted by John Durham View Post


    As for any other person who read the words "direct mail" in my OP, can you kindly point them out to me? I must be going blind....
    Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

    I have noticed the past week or so that cold calling threads are not so prevalent on the front page, and you know what else I have noticed...alot of diverse bells and whistles "How to..." and alot of "Heres how you can...", and alot of "My new amazing system" or "idea", kind of stuff, but what I HAVENT noticed, is the 4-5 threads on the front page that usually say "I just got my first sale". Direct Mail

    Suddenly, out of the blue, people who you dont even recognize from this part of the forum popping up with long threads about how they are faling with cold calling...Which a month ago, we know was creating a new success story virtually every single day. Direct Mail

    Its a cycle, and its a deliberate attack on what we have been teaching- Myself, Iamnameless, David Miller, Ken Michaels , Jason Kanigan... the people who really have created alot of success stories here with newby's.... It started weeks ago with Adrian Browning and the attack has grown to where you cant even recognize half the names on the front page who are posting all these crazy ideas. Direct Mail

    I say this to make a point. Direct Mail

    You arent seeing a ton of success stories daily as of late. Direct Mail

    Now given the nature of this, after this post is made it would not surprise me if they started popping up. But has anyone else noticed this link? Direct Mail

    Personally, I use to argue with every fruitless idea I saw promoted here but lately I have been kicking back just watching and going to visit the different rabbit holes (ooops I mean "threads" and just chatting or participating...now we have people doing all kinds of strange plans... and if you really watch there is no real focus....and if you pay attention, there is also alot of dreaming and talking and not alot of success stories popping up. Direct Mail

    This is subject to argument, and you may not even respond, but mark my words down and come back later and tell me I was right, because I have been selling thousands of offline customers for fifteen years and have seen a TON of trends, and when cold calling is placed low on the priority list, this is what you end up with- A bunch of people in all kinds of diverse unfocused threads chasing down rabbit holes. Direct Mail

    Its not the same as it was and there is no sense of focused offline power.Just mostly alot of "experimentation" threads.

    Im not going to fight the trend personally because I cant keep spending my life trying to do that... but I will continue to kick back and observe the same truth that has held fast over every cycle and trend, and eventually people will be hunting the cold calling teachers back down saying "Oh my God I chased bells and whistles for six months and nothing worked until a bore down and cold called", there will be exceptions... but watch the cycle, the rule will be that this place is run amuck like it is at this very moment, lose its focus, and nobody will be making significant sales again. Direct Mail

    For anyone who doesnt want to follow that trend- dig up some cold calling threads and despite the vehement arguments you will get from people pushing bells and whistles, the difference between the threads will be clear, and the power for the most part is in cold calling. Direct Mail

    Now I fully expect a bunch of people with less than three hundred posts to start digging up cold calling failure threads and bumping them to the top...as I said, its a cycle, and when you have been offlining for fifteen years you have seen the cycle time and time again- When people get worn out with bells and whistles, they cold call and suddenly succeed.

    Just a mental note. I have alot of personal time investment in the offline subforum here, and feel like one of its fathers... so I observe. Direct Mail

    Let the trends continue to phase themselves back to the true principles after the people are worn out and disapointed, but cold calling is where its at....and I think if you go down reading all the strange thread titles and unfocused diverse stuff on the front page... it will be clear to you, that when the non cold calling crowd came in overtaking the offline forum, the focused powerful success "left". Direct Mail

    Most of the people you see pop up saying otherwise will have low post count...watch that trend too. No, its not a coincidence. Direct Mail

    Hopefully there will still be some good teachers who are ready to pick up the pieces when everyone is crying that they have wasted months on end, and didnt get the solution. Personally I will be busy buidling my offline business...I have done most of my work here...its funny to see how when the power leaves the scavengers come. lol But maybe thats just my take. Direct Mail

    -JD

    C'mon John, how did you miss that?

    Maybe you were tired?
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Paul,

    I will comply without any further questions or hesitance. Sorry I grieved you . I know all you need is one more rebel rouser and maybe this time Im guilty. My apologies. I too will calm down.

    In truth Adrians tone has changed a bit, I thought it was a ploy, but it seems that its genuine from having been corrected by you and he is complying. Maybe Im holding onto a grudge I shouldnt.

    -John
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  • Profile picture of the author Jeff Burritt
    Banned
    Social marketing is all the rage, but in the end, no one wants to talk to a computer. Conversing with another human being is, was, and always will be THE THING to deals, love, and everything related.

    Just giving praise for the OP. Yes, back to business.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      John,
      In truth Adrians tone has changed a bit
      You were once a bit of a flamethrower, too, as I recall. People can change their approaches to things.

      You've heard the expression, "Your past does not have to be your future." How much more true is it that someone else's past doesn't have to control your actions today?


      Paul
      Signature
      .
      Stop by Paul's Pub - my little hangout on Facebook.

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      • Profile picture of the author John Durham
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        John,You were once a bit of a flamethrower, too, as I recall. People can change their approaches to things.

        You've heard the expression, "You're past does not have to be your future." How much more true is it that someone else's past doesn't have to control your actions today?


        Paul
        Paul,

        Indeed. And all it took was one free vacation from Mr. Myers to change my tone. So I hope Adrian grows from it as well. I honestly thought he had just gotten more covert, but its not hard to understand how that could create a genuine change.

        John
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Roncone
    Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

    Its a cycle, and its a deliberate attack on what we have been teaching- Myself, Iamnameless, David Miller, Ken Michaels , Jason Kanigan... the people who really have created alot of success stories here with newby's.... It started weeks ago with Adrian Browning and the attack has grown to where you cant even recognize half the names on the front page who are posting all these crazy ideas.

    ...

    Now I fully expect a bunch of people with less than three hundred posts to start digging up cold calling failure threads and bumping them to the top...as I said, its a cycle, and when you have been offlining for fifteen years you have seen the cycle time and time again- When people get worn out with bells and whistles, they cold call and suddenly succeed.
    -JD
    You know, it's funny, though the topic at hand isn't a funny subject by any means.

    But I believe I was JUST reading a thread by you (John) the other day about how forums go through cycles, and sure enough here proof "in the pudding" so to say.

    I find it one of the most curious things in the world, when I hear something new and then suddenly see the perfect example very soon afterward.

    Mostly because it ensures that the information will then never leave my brain (call me a weirdo). So welcome, John, to the permanent files of my brain.

    I really do hope this forum completes its cycle, I rather enjoy reading threads by you all which actually contain information and not just a bunch of random conjecture.

    Best,
    -Mike
    Signature

    Founder & Web Strategist at Grae Web Strategies

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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by Mike Roncone View Post

      You know, it's funny, though the topic at hand isn't a funny subject by any means.

      But I believe I was JUST reading a thread by you (John) the other day about how forums go through cycles, and sure enough here proof "in the pudding" so to say.

      I find it one of the most curious things in the world, when I hear something new and then suddenly see the perfect example very soon afterward.

      Mostly because it ensures that the information will then never leave my brain (call me a weirdo). So welcome, John, to the permanent files of my brain.

      I really do hope this forum completes its cycle, I rather enjoy reading threads by you all which actually contain information and not just a bunch of random conjecture.

      Best,
      -Mike
      Mike,

      Synchronicity. Who knows what life is preparing you for right now. I admire that you pay attention to it. I do too. Many times I have plans, and ignore the synchronicity going on around me that is trying to prepare the way for the true direction life is taking regardless of my plans. Its always easier to go with the grain.

      When I started teaching telemarketing here, it was not my plan at all....I was trying to get AWAY from it in truth...and there was all kinds of synchronicity saying it was the natural fit for me... One day I recognized it, and the struggles went away and the fire came back when I quit swimming up stream and went with the flow.

      Pay attention to synchronicity. You may not always understand where its going, but when you get there it helps you understand why and how you got where you are, and it helps you to RECOGNIZE when you have arrived where you need to be.

      -John
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  • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
    regardless of what people think or need say to be diplomatic,

    BS is still BS.

    and when BS is paramount, it needs to be called out.

    Maybe the WAY its called out needs to be changed, but not the action.
    Signature

    Selling Ain't for Sissies!
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    I have run out of thanks Ken and Tom. lol

    I gotta stop laughing, its bad karma.
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  • Profile picture of the author nfb1204
    Does anyone have or know a good WSO cold calling script to use?
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  • Profile picture of the author digichik
    I have noticed these people who insist on spreading negativity. What I don't quite understand is, why they are given any attention? In many other forums the positive contributors just refuse to feed the trolls. Perhaps that could work in this wonderful forum as well.
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