Are you creating REAL value? Create Real Value, Create Real Wealth (aka How I Make All My Money Now)

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Sure, we all hear about creating value etc... as part of the marketing vocabulary.

But what does it REALLY mean?

In the past, I've talked about things like understanding what services you provide to business as outsourced marketing consultants (that's what you really are), and especially understanding where those services fall in the overall food chain of business flow.

The function of any and all aspects of internet marketing... from website design, graphic design, to SEO, to PPC campaign management, to mobile, to QR codes... the whole kit and kaboodle serves one purpose and one purpose alone - creating prospect leads.

Very few "offline" businesses will ever close a deal or a sale via the web. Sure, there's a few niche e-com players in every market who sells via a shopping cart, but in reality the monster players like Amazon have forever changed retail product.

That leaves niches, hospitality, and services... which are almost all "offline sales closes" for the end business customer.

So where am I going with all this?

Okay, so you want to make money. You're in business to make money and most of us want to make a LOT of money.

Right?

As a service provider yourself, you have some limitations. The biggest one of all is -- scalability.

Let's assume you're cooking along at a pretty decent pace. Maybe you're even doing $100K a month in gross sales.

Not bad. Life is decent, the business is growing, cash in the bank.

But what separates you from the "big guys"?

This is where it's healthy to look outside of the internet marketing industry and back to traditional business to understand how to grow a service company in general. It also helps to understand the challenges in scalability.

First and foremost, the number one challenge of ANY service company... accounting, medical, janitorial, and especially technical is this:

Balancing your service delivery "bench" with your sales.

It is never, ever a 1:1 proposition - meaning, you never exactly have the right number of resources at the right time for every sale.

Many of you have probably already experienced this, especially if you're actually creating websites for people or delivering some sort of end product.

This translates into a bigass problem for cashflow. It's more of an issue if you're hiring any dedicated staff in-house, but it's also an issue for outsourcing. That's because your outsourced resources are also trying to balance their own income with work besides the projects you're sending to them. So they're not always right there on demand when you kick off a project with a client. Now you have to keep a stable of resources around. This gets into dedicated service delivery and/or project management, which isn't the focus of this post but might be a good discussion in the future.

The net result in any market is this... if you're creating a services company of any kind, you must grow it on a continual basis to stay ahead of cash and to stay ahead of comeptition in your market. This requires more and more sales, and consumes cash like a mad beast.

I realize this discussion is getting to the outer edges of the average Warrior Forum member, and that's okay. Because the real point here isn't to talk about growing your services company - rather, to SHIFT YOUR THINKING OVERALL.

SHIFT YOUR THINKING!!!!!!!

I've grown service companies in the tech sector for many years. For those who don't know my background, I started my first web dev company in 1994, when most people didn't even know what the internet was. My challenge was educating people about the internet itself, and how it was going to change business over the next few years. I managed to grow that company to several million dollars in sales, and merge it with a much larger direct marketing company where I learned how to blend what I did on the web side with traditional marketing inside of literally thousands of businesses across many different industries.

After I ended my relationship and took my payday, I danced down the road with a much different perspective on "selling websites". As the market got more and more competitive, the prices and profitability tanked as more and more players got in. Much like you've seen over the years in other internet-related things. Now it's mobile.

I realized it was much, much easier to take my knowledge about marketing and the web, and use that skill as leverage in literally acquiring and growing small companies.

The same stuff you do every day... creating websites, driving traffic... that's what I do too. I just do it with a different perspective.

No longer do I have to "sell websites" or worry about building a bench while ensuring that I have cash to feed the beast. That's too stressful when there's an easier way.

Why should I spend all my days trying to convince some business owner to buy my services, day in and day out?

Because, in essence, I'm trying to convince a customer to grow their own business. That's the net result of what I do with all this web stuff.

No way man. There's a much bigger horizon here.

The Big Reveal...

So I found a small business that needed to grow and accepted my message about using the internet to do this and do that.

But instead of SELLING them my services (after all, I already had someone who believed in me and my ability to create new sales opportunity sitting in front of me), I pitched the owner on the idea of creating an actual partnership with that business where I owned a stake in the new "brand".

The company continued to provide products and services in their own market. Let those guys continue to do what they do, they're the experts in their profession.

My focus (and justification for being in the deal) was to create a rocketship growth curve in new business for them by simply leveraging all of my skills in what I already knew how to do extremely well.

The value I was creating for that business is so great, it justified a seat at the ownership table. After all, their existing marketing and sales weren't growing at the pace I was able to bring to the table with my ninja prowess.

So what happened?

Well. Let me tell you. It's really, really easy to convince investors to put money into an established business in a traditional industry with a massive sales growth engine.

The business was able to acquire a couple of more strategic companies that complimented their core offering by using my gameplan and the new story.

Within a year, I took a little company from $2 million in sales in their industry to over $10 million in sales by simply growing the core marketing funnel (lots and lots of new leads) and then leveraging that growth projection into investment money for the partnership to buy up a couple more small companies. The added sales and growth strategy went from plodding along at a respectable 10-15% annual growth to 500% growth in a year.

That kind of action gets people talking - and gets you into a lot of other deals.

Nowdays, it's all about deal flow.

Screw trying to convince some small company to buy my marketing services.

You want to work with me, then we will sit down and map an acquisition strategy as a high growth player.

And we're not talking about giant corporate deals with public companies and MBAs running amok. We're talking about companies the size of most of your existing customers. No, these are the very people you're spending your days trying to sell a $5,000 web project.

The difference is the perspective. The ideas. Understanding business from your CUSTOMER'S perspective, not your own.

How much work will you have to do to put $1-2 million net into your pocket in 1-2 years?

Can you do it as a service provider?

Sure you can.

But it's far easier to simply find the right business owner who wants to grow their own company (DUH! All of them), and who will listen to your story and enter into a new partnership agreement with you to spin up a new brand company that acts as the marketing engine.

They keep doing what they're doing. They don't even have to give you ownership in their existing company. They just agree to run all their marketing and sales through the new brand company and grow the whole pie under that shell.

You just make good on the very promise that you were going to make anyway, bring in more sales.

Are your gears turning yet?



I realize this isn't the "norm" for this forum. I realize this might be perceived as being "over everyone's heads" because... well... I don't really know why. I might even be called out for being "arrogant" or some other emotional belch by others in this forum.

But, it's genuinely not rocket science.

I never went to grad school. I'm not an Ivy League business graduate. And I was doing this in my EARLY 20s! Sure, you can't come across like some idiotic dolt. But if you're out selling to business clients on a professional basis, you're already polished enough (or you should be anyway). You already know all about the "things you do", which is why you're sitting there to begin with pitching the owner.

This is simply a slight shift in perspective and understanding the REAL meaning of creating REAL value... like shareholder equity value. It's understanding and realizing the true value of what I create as a result of the things I do.

And THAT my friends, THAT is what creates REAL WEALTH!
#create #creating #real #wealth
  • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
    Michael,
    Are you talking about a new company is formed to be the marketing arm

    or the new company becomes a new competitor?

    Best,
    Ewen
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

      Michael,
      Are you talking about a new company is formed to be the marketing arm

      or the new company becomes a new competitor?

      Best,
      Ewen

      The new company becomes the marketing entity owned equally (or not so equally) by the marketing talent and the traditional company, which in essence becomes a subcontractor or OEM (in the event it's a product company) to the new marketing company.

      Unless, of course, you can negotiate an ownership stake in the existing company based on a buy-in calculated off of "future net value", which is a more complex (and more difficult to sell) discussion.

      If you get that deep into the discussion, you're probably going to hit the homerun either way. It's all up for negotiation.

      I've done it both ways, but the first time out of the box I just proposed creating a new company that became the marketing company. That company ends up effectively becoming the outsourced marketing and sales provider for the core company. It keeps a margin on every deal, covers marketing costs, etc... and the actual work or product fulfillment passes through to your partner.

      On the outset, someone may say, "That's not all that attractive because the margins on a sale is only a smaller percentage of the overall deal."

      Who cares. You're controlling the customer flow now AND as the new company develops, that's where the additional acquisitions can roll under. Once you start controlling the customer, you can start adding more products and services that you have a direct ownership stake in past the initial partner - who will make out like a bandit because they'll still own their existing company lock stock and barrel - but also get a majority stake in the marketing company AND a stake in all the subsequent acquisitons.

      So if a person only ends up with say, and effective 5-10% stake in a $10-20 million dollar company, cry me a river.
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      • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
        Gotcha!

        For your guy, it's like double dipping into a much bigger pie.

        He now "owns" you.

        That's his prize.

        Our largest telco here spun off their maintenance
        arm and relisted it on the stock exchange.

        So it was like alchemy, creating something
        out of nothing which made people a lot of money.

        So a person who has broad marketing smarts,
        those which can be used to grow...

        Number of leads
        Increase conversion
        Increase average dollar sale
        Increase frequency of purchases
        Increase margins

        Would be best to leverage those skills
        by partnering in a existing high growth
        possibility company.

        Sounds a very solid strategy.

        Thanks Michael.

        Best,
        Ewen
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  • Profile picture of the author dave147
    Great post Michael and great to have you back
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  • Profile picture of the author Rocket Media
    So in layman's terms you work as an independent contractor (being very general here bare with me) under a new business name brand... for a company.

    In essence... you are going to fund all of the marketing/design/advertising/sales funnel creation instead of getting paid up front for it.

    He's right about this not being rocket science guys. Yet the average "non-warrior" would look at you like you're a NO-NO-NO-NO-NO-NO-NO- chimpanzee with a rainbow birthday hat on if you tried to talk to them about this.

    Anybody with 10 grand and some general marketing knowledge could become a millionaire in under a year if they put the work in with this. It's no joke that offline business is where the moneys at.

    There's no risk for the business owner either. If they trust you and they don't think that you'll totally ruin the business by putting an internet presence up there should be no reason for them to decline you. the ones who decline you are the ones you don't want to work with anyways.

    Get 5 deals like this in the crock pot and you might be a very wealthy and valuable person in a year. with your 10 grand or your current income you can spend it all on outsourcing and testing adwords/facebook ads/etc. to build the businesses.

    The golden aspect is that you don't have to worry about dealing with your own customers and making "changes" and shit. You'll be the one in control and they'll love you..
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    • Profile picture of the author James English
      It's been laid out pretty clearly, but my brain is a bit foggy today so I am just wanting to clarify a few things.

      I setup a marketing company with split ownership between me and the business owner.

      So, if all marketing is run through the new business, is the funding for the marketing coming from anywhere? Or am I in charge of that?

      I think I am missing the big picture here. Is this any different than offering free services to a business in exchange for a percentage of any profits earned through said service?

      Not putting down the idea, I am genuinely just trying to understand a bit better
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    Right now, the partner company is already has a marketing and sales budget of some sort. They're spending SOMETHING on customer acquisition.

    That could be used for priming the pump if you don't have the cash to live on until the sales start flowing through the new entity.

    Additionally, there's also the whole "other people's money" aspect.

    Like I said before, it's really, really easy to sell an outside cash investor on participating in this kind of structure - especially if they're deep enough to also participate in the other acquisitions.

    In some instances, the initial partner company could tell you right off the top of their head who would be likely acquisition partners in such a deal, so you could even start those conversations from day one.

    In my most recent instance, I started working with a technology company who was experiencing a sales slump. They were in some older business lines that had shifted. They didn't have a solid marketing and sales model to help them transition into new opportunities - but they did have a stable cash flow in the $4 million range.

    The owners were financial guys and technical guys, so no deep marketing and sales talent.

    We identified a new business direction they wanted to go in with a specific technology area. We acquired a small services company in that direction as the initial consulting team... I'm talking about a 3 man shop here. Not big.

    Then we identified a couple of product companies in the same niche.

    Etc...

    They funded the initial marketing setup... that was $100K in my pocket from day one.

    They also were deep enough to provide the seed funding for the initial acquisitions around this strategy, but we did bring in some outside investment (like $500K) as well. Each of the owners of the existing companies continue to own a stake in their deals, as well as get a salary, bennies, etc...

    The synergy is still centered around the lead gen effort on the marketing front end.

    The opportunity to do this is so huge, and it's literally untapped from the standpoint of doing this kind of rollup. Literally any industry segment can be a play.

    Not every company will be a fit to do this though. It's still playing the sales numbers game - but it does get a little more strategic.

    You will find the level of conversation changing if you start talking about this kind of business. People will take you very, very serious.

    It's all up for grabs in this kind of deal. Everything is negotiable.

    The point to my post was simply to spark your thought processes and shifting your perspective to a very different application of the very same skills. (That's what I've ALWAYS tried to do here at the Warrior Forum)

    OH... and for the telemarketing guys... keep in mind that it's not just the internet marketing/lead gen side that's up for grabs here. Sales is right in the mix. The new company can have a nice boiler room as well.
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  • Profile picture of the author ttrance
    this is a great idea, actually one I was actively thinking about. However, instead of partnering up with a company I was thinking to find companies on the verge of backruptcy and to perhaps purchase the failing company and work the magic, or come up with some crazy deal since that company is going down without help anyways...

    For example: I have this annoying roofer calling me and he keeps trying to convince me to do marketing for him basically for free. Website basically for free, and he would be willing to go as far as to pay me $100 for every sale that he closes!!! I obviously laughed at the offer. I told him this is a joke and good luck! Soo he basically told me last month that in the last 3 months he has done maybe 1 job... So a guy like that --- He basically has no choice! I come in and tell him, ok you want me to work with you? I want to become a partner in the company!

    Problem is as mentioned in the post above - I need to initially fork out all the money for the work until he starts getting work and the bank account starts filling.. Only then can I reimburse myself I suppose... Another good point is that since you sign an official agreement with them, they can't not pay you, since you are a partner in the company!!!!

    For marketing people and small tight firms, this is definetly the best way to go. Especially now with economies crashing like crazy!!

    The only way this can end up not being so good in the future is if a majority of business owners realize whats up, and start paying for actual courses to learn this stuff themselves AND/OR they go out and hire a marketer and pay him a salary.

    I know 1 law firm that does this. He has a dedicated full time Internet Marketing guy who is actually pretty talented, and he does all the services we do for him. Lawyer keeps his business, and pays the marketer handsomely.
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by ttrance View Post

      this is a great idea, actually one I was actively thinking about. However, instead of partnering up with a company I was thinking to find companies on the verge of backruptcy and to perhaps purchase the failing company and work the magic, or come up with some crazy deal since that company is going down without help anyways...

      For example: I have this annoying roofer calling me and he keeps trying to convince me to do marketing for him basically for free. Website basically for free, and he would be willing to go as far as to pay me $100 for every sale that he closes!!! I obviously laughed at the offer. I told him this is a joke and good luck! Soo he basically told me last month that in the last 3 months he has done maybe 1 job... So a guy like that --- He basically has no choice! I come in and tell him, ok you want me to work with you? I want to become a partner in the company!

      Problem is as mentioned in the post above - I need to initially fork out all the money for the work until he starts getting work and the bank account starts filling.. Only then can I reimburse myself I suppose... Another good point is that since you sign an official agreement with them, they can't not pay you, since you are a partner in the company!!!!

      For marketing people and small tight firms, this is definetly the best way to go. Especially now with economies crashing like crazy!!

      The only way this can end up not being so good in the future is if a majority of business owners realize whats up, and start paying for actual courses to learn this stuff themselves AND/OR they go out and hire a marketer and pay him a salary.

      I know 1 law firm that does this. He has a dedicated full time Internet Marketing guy who is actually pretty talented, and he does all the services we do for him. Lawyer keeps his business, and pays the marketer handsomely.

      Sounds to me like you're going into the roofing business!

      Yes, distressed companies are always a much easier discussion. But then again, the same is true for anyone looking to hire a marketing consultant. If sales are great, there's no pain, therefore no need to change what is already working.
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      • Profile picture of the author ttrance
        Could very well be!!! I am not sure of the profit potential in the roofing industry, but this guy does already have the ability to work more than 1 job a day, and he said he can scale... Soooooo the question is coming up with a good number.

        Now i'm not currently working alone, I have 2 partners, so I would need to bring them up to par on this idea and now that you confirmed its working great for you this roofer will be our guinea pig!
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        • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
          Originally Posted by ttrance View Post

          Could very well be!!! I am not sure of the profit potential in the roofing industry, but this guy does already have the ability to work more than 1 job a day, and he said he can scale... Soooooo the question is coming up with a good number.

          Now i'm not currently working alone, I have 2 partners, so I would need to bring them up to par on this idea and now that you confirmed its working great for you this roofer will be our guinea pig!
          The upside with the distressed deal is... the guy doesn't have the leverage to hold you over the can on the deal and drive a hard bargain.

          AND... you can also use the framework to quickly scale past him (bring in another roofer) if he gets stupid on the delivery side.

          The OTHER financial benefit of a rollup (which the financial guys get) is the cost savings of consolidating back office infrastructure (accounting, HR, etc..). The individual cost centers for each company get dumped into a single, central department that services all the entities, which cranks up the profitability.
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        • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
          If you are the marketing guy and going after companies
          going into bankruptcy, then that can be a whole operations
          input as well.

          As they are likely having big issues in that department.

          Better and more marketing going into those places will only
          see the death of it faster!

          Best,
          Ewen
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          • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
            Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

            If you are the marketing guy and going after companies
            going into bankruptcy, then that can be a whole operations
            input as well.

            As they are likely having big issues in that department.

            Better and more marketing going into those places will only
            see the death of it faster!

            Best,
            Ewen

            Without question... and back to the original post discussion about balancing cash flow, the delivery side, etc...

            TOO MUCH SALES GROWTH CAN KILL A COMPANY AS FAST OR FASTER THAN NOT ENOUGH SALES!!!!!

            That's usually a much better problem to have though... and, you're the one in the driver's seat on the marketing throughput. You're also going to be closer to the customer on the sales side. You'll hear if there's a breakdown.
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            • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
              Originally Posted by MichaelHiles View Post

              Without question... and back to the original post discussion about balancing cash flow, the delivery side, etc...

              TOO MUCH SALES GROWTH CAN KILL A COMPANY AS FAST OR FASTER THAN NOT ENOUGH SALES!!!!!

              That's usually a much better problem to have though... and, you're the one in the driver's seat on the marketing throughput. You're also going to be closer to the customer on the sales side. You'll hear if there's a breakdown.
              This means you gotta have a top operations guy who
              is very nimble to bring on more operations capabilities
              and have the investors in your back pocket to fund
              the operations people and hard assets.

              The skill set here then becomes finding the right people
              to work the fast moving machine.

              Best,
              Ewen
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  • Profile picture of the author NewParadigm
    So you're saying creating a new marketing/sales co and the original company is now basically a contract manufacturer. How do you handle contract pricing for the product that is charged to your new entity?
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by NewParadigm View Post

      So you're saying creating a new marketing/sales co and the original company is now basically a contract manufacturer. How do you handle contract pricing for the product that is charged to your new entity?
      It's going to come down to the individual deal and specific numbers (margins). If your candidate partner is a contract fabricator (vs. a product OEM), there's a margin on a run. That's the starting point I'd guess.

      Never worked with a contract custom manufacturer though. Did this with a couple of different OEM product companies (pet fence containment and custom high end children's playhouses). But they had a set product line and didn't do contract work.

      That would be an interesting deal I'd love to see.
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  • Profile picture of the author ttrance
    have you entered a partnership yet only to find that it doesn't respond well to our methods?
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by ttrance View Post

      have you entered a partnership yet only to find that it doesn't respond well to our methods?
      No. But that's because I'm conservative on my due diligence on the front end of every deal. I take my time, I have to live with these people for a while.

      In general, I focus on one deal at a time. If you're doing it right, you won't have time to "play the field". You'll be wanting to maximize your own ownership value in the deal you've got.
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    Isn't the real challenge in ANY business finding and keeping talented people?

    They're the real reason for success.
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Originally Posted by MichaelHiles View Post

      Isn't the real challenge in ANY business finding and keeping talented people?

      They're the real reason for success.
      Now we are talking about the ladder to get to be a real entrepreneur.

      These steps are...
      employee
      self employee
      employer of others
      buy build and sell businesses
      package and sell stakes in a business

      You gotta do your apprenticeship on each rung of the ladder
      before you move up.

      Looks like you are at the second to the top Michael.

      I'm pointing out these levels for others so they know
      where they are at and not to be discouraged because everybody
      has to spend time at each level before moving up.

      Best,
      Ewen
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      • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
        Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

        Now we are talking about the ladder to get to be a real entrepreneur.

        These steps are...
        employee
        self employee
        employer of others
        buy build and sell businesses
        package and sell stakes in a business

        You gotta do your apprenticeship on each rung of the ladder
        Before you move up.

        Looks like you are at the second to the top Michael.

        I'm pointing these levels for others so they know
        where they are at and not to be discouraged because everybody
        Has to spend time at each level before moving up.

        Best,
        Ewen
        Yep, great breakdown. A person can progress quickly though.

        And I've been at the top, but I prefer the action at #2.

        Pure capital is "ok", but it's not enough pure problem solving for me on a personal basis (alliteration for the win). I just don't get the same satisfaction off of that level of value creation (just pure ROI return). Pitching private placement deals with cumulative convertible preferred debentures to high net worth guys is for the broker dealers. I'd rather put an honest day's work in. Besides, I'd never shower or shave if all I did was sit around and refresh the bank account page - and my wife wouldn't like me hanging out at the house all smelly all the time crimpin' her style.

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        • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
          I know of a guy who 100 % equity finances
          buy outs of 5 to 10 mill companies.

          He's an older guy and has his own set of rules for
          buying.

          They are in manufacturing or distribution,
          have employee general manager in place.

          Have 5 years of stability.

          He brings in investors who are much like him.

          They get first call on the revenue
          while in it for a couple of years.

          The return is usually a couple of points above
          bank rates.

          He doesn't want to be involved with the
          day to day management, so that's why he wants
          existing management in place.

          Just another variation on how deals are played out.

          Best,
          Ewen
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  • Thanks for the thread, Michael...great stuff.

    My question lies on the operations side. Do these companies you target typically have operations people in place, or do you have yourself a posse of like minded dudes taking over the country one deal at a time?

    And it sounds as if you target companies that understand the stakes. I guess...and this is a cop out question without being in the ring...my thought would be that a company would want to know what are you bringing to the table, and why should they invest say $100k in you/new company with no risk on your personal end? I understand the upside from growing the business and such, but it appears all the risk is on them.

    Am I missing something?

    And, you mention bringing other companies in under your umbrella company. Are they typically related companies? Seems like you mentioned custom doll houses or something...would another target be then a company that specializes in dolls?

    More questions! What then is your exit strategy in these deals? Does the other company typically buy you back out at some point? Do they keep their core business going and the typical buyer is another marketing expert or somebody?

    Love where this is at, and it meshes perfectly with what I'm doing right now. Just trying to grasp how it's all structured legally and financially. My wheels are turning!

    Seems like on a basic level, you could form a partnership with say 3 contractors/business...plumber, roofer, electrician...and just crush it in any given market.

    I come back to, though, other than your word/track record, what do you bring and why do they trust you???
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by CleanMountainLiving View Post

      Thanks for the thread, Michael...great stuff.

      My question lies on the operations side. Do these companies you target typically have operations people in place, or do you have yourself a posse of like minded dudes taking over the country one deal at a time?
      Yes, the target is a company in current operation.

      But at this stage, I also have a posse that I can tap if need be.

      And it sounds as if you target companies that understand the stakes.
      Yes. They have to also see the upside potential.

      I guess...and this is a cop out question without being in the ring...my thought would be that a company would want to know what are you bringing to the table, and why should they invest say $100k in you/new company with no risk on your personal end? I understand the upside from growing the business and such, but it appears all the risk is on them.

      Am I missing something?
      Not missing anything at all.

      For me, now it's all about track record. So I don't have to work quite so hard to convince someone of the potential of my deal.

      But it's Selling 101. If they understand the upside, and you're in front of them right now, you can just as easily walk from the deal and go do the same with some other company in the same sector - even a competitor.

      "You believe that I can bring this level of sales growth to your organization as a service provider or you believe I can bring this level of sales growth to your organization as a partner. My services aren't for sale, so you have the option to do this deal or walk. I understand, I will keep plugging away if you decide not to do it."

      And, you mention bringing other companies in under your umbrella company. Are they typically related companies? Seems like you mentioned custom doll houses or something...would another target be then a company that specializes in dolls?
      This was actually a custom playhouse company. The result was a merger with a large Rainbow Playset and outdoor equipment company.

      More questions! What then is your exit strategy in these deals? Does the other company typically buy you back out at some point? Do they keep their core business going and the typical buyer is another marketing expert or somebody?
      Acquisition by a larger company, or I will take an equity buyout on some trigger point. All negotiable.

      Love where this is at, and it meshes perfectly with what I'm doing right now. Just trying to grasp how it's all structured legally and financially. My wheels are turning!

      Seems like on a basic level, you could form a partnership with say 3 contractors/business...plumber, roofer, electrician...and just crush it in any given market.

      I come back to, though, other than your word/track record, what do you bring and why do they trust you???
      The sky is the limit. It's all up for grabs and no two deals are alike. So what works in one deal might not work in another. In general though, the positioning going in is that you're the linchpin on the growth acceleration. You bring the growth game to the table.

      You better deliver (aka Are you creating real value?).
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Great thread Michael. I wish you would expound more, because this isnt the type of thing one can easily assimilate in one bite, however if a person "were" to be able to put the pieces together I know its big business.

    I had a small company that I once sold to a larger company trying to add internet companies to its portfolio in an effort to go public, so I know that the idea of business "portfolios" is attractive to investors... I dont get alot of this kind of stuff and selling a company is pretty basic compared to what you are talking about with mergers, and conglomeration...

    You often hear me say "I dont get it", but after reading this thread I think its because you talk about it in bits and peices.

    A nice big fat thread that schooled us might be an eye opener.

    I know you and I debate at times, but Im open to growing if I "get" something...

    If I or anyone else doesnt "get it" though, then it cant help.

    I would love to have the lioght click on for me regarding the kind of things you are talking about here.

    Admittedly a little bit here or there of this kind of talk annoys me personally, because I know there is huge money in it, and I dont "get" it! lol

    Being a bottomless well of creativity, as we all are if we tap into it; if I could "get" this, and bring it all together, I could create business models all day long, out of thin air, just for this purpose of merging and conglomerating... Honestly its all Greek to me though.

    -JD
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Great thread Michael. I wish you would expound more, because this isnt the type of thing one can easily assimilate in one bite, however if a person "were" to be able to put the pieces together I know its big business.

      I had a small company that I once sold to a larger company trying to add internet companies to its portfolio in an effort to go public, so I know that the idea of business "portfolios" is attractive to investors... I dont get alot of this kind of stuff and selling a company is pretty basic compared to what you are talking about with mergers, and conglomeration...

      You often hear me say "I dont get it", but after reading this thread I think its because you talk about it in bits and peices.

      A nice big fat thread that schooled us might be an eye opener.

      I know you and I debate at times, but Im open to growing if I "get" something...

      If I or anyone else doesnt "get it" though, then it cant help.

      I would love to have the lioght click on for me regarding the kind of things you are talking about here.

      Admittedly a little bit here or there of this kind of talk annoys me personally, because I know there is huge money in it, and I dont "get" it! lol

      Being a bottomless well of creativity, as we all are if we tap into it; if I could "get" this, and bring it all together, I could create business models all day long, out of thin air, just for this purpose of merging and conglomerating... Honestly its all Greek to me though.

      -JD
      I guess this is where I would pitch you on my product. LOL :p

      John, dude you'll never assimilate it all. I'VE never assimilated it all after a whole bunch of deals and many years. It's a perpetual learning process because it's open ended.

      I'm inventing it as I go. No two deals are ever alike because you're dealing with unique markets, unique value propositions, unique financial situations, unique personalities and skill sets, etc...

      There's no paint by numbers really. It's more or less about having a basic understanding of the key fundamentals. But past that, it's all "mix and match". I learn every day - the key is just having the balls in your sack to just go out there and do it.

      When I first did it, I was literally a kid in my 20s. I didn't know that I wasn't supposed to be sitting in front of the CEO of General Electric Mortgage Insurance Corp and the CEO of Cintas on the back deck with glasses of Early Times and soda water pitching them on a deal before a Cincinnati Reds game. I just did it.

      I don't know how much fatter of a thread I can create. This is pretty much it. I mean, yeah, I guess that if you want to get into the meat and potatos of a hardcore business model and deal structure expose', I could create a workshop.

      But yes, you are correct. If you personally would ever "get it", being the go-getter you are, I have no doubt that you'd be a monster eventually on the cover of Inc. mag.
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      • Profile picture of the author John Durham
        Originally Posted by MichaelHiles View Post


        But yes, you are correct. If you personally would ever "get it", being the go-getter you are, I have no doubt that you'd be a monster eventually on the cover of Inc. mag.
        Im actually less of a go getter every year...and so hopefully as the adrenaline dwindles the "smarts" will pick up to compensate , which is why this is interesting... Its better to hit bigger deals that give you more mileage when you are forty three, because you just dont feel like being that aggressive young buck as much.:rolleyes:
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        • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
          Originally Posted by Timaay View Post

          Great stuff Michael. Can you talk a little more about finding and evaluating capital investment for the new high growth company?

          Are we talking about angel's here or something else? I'd be really interested in how you bring these funds into play.

          thank you.
          Wellllll, that's a giant discussion probably worthy of its own forum. In all of my instances, the funding to do the deals comes fom a small group of high net worth individuals and the exit strategies have always been me exercising my shareholder agreement to take a walk at a triggering event. (getting another round of funding/dilution... getting bought...)

          Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

          Im actually less of a go getter every year...and so hopefully as the adrenaline dwindles the "smarts" will pick up to compensate , which is why this is interesting... Its better to hit bigger deals that give you more mileage when you are forty three, because you just dont feel like being that aggressive young buck as much.:rolleyes:
          Do it. Now.
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          • Profile picture of the author Peter Lessard
            Fantastic post Michael! For two years my deals have all included share of gross/incentives and been geared more towards partnerships (in spirit) but I had not considered this structure and it is indeed the cure to the brick wall you are met with by asking for a piece of their existing business.

            A question if may? Maybe I have not had enough coffee yet but I am trying to imagine how this looks to the outside customers when you say create a new brand company.

            Example if I have a professional services firm that wants more calls/submit forms and they have a modest brand in their niche do I simply create a totally new site/brand/company and then customers essentially believe they are calling/dealing with an all new entity? Or do you funnel the leads to a "partner" organization?

            Funny thing is I get all the theory on it but I am having trouble imagining how the user experience/perception is changed.
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  • Profile picture of the author vndnbrgj
    Don't worry John, I don't get it either.

    So, you take a company.
    Let's say ABC Home Improvement.
    Have them bring you on as a partner, but part of the deal is to open another company...
    So they open a parent company... ABC Enterprises.
    ABC Enterprises now owns ABC Home Improvement.
    You have equity in ABC Enterprises, but not directly in the Home Improvement business.

    Now, you do marketing....
    This is where I get lost.

    You go on a buying spree?
    You buy an electric company, plumbing, hvac, painting, etc...???

    Now you have a conglomerate???
    ABC Enterprises now owns:
    ABC Home Improvement
    Bill's Electric
    Water Works Plumbing
    Neighborhood HVAC
    New Look Painting
    Etc...???

    Are you doing marketing for each division of the parent company?
    Or, just the parent company?
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    Life Begins At The End Of Your Comfort Zone
    - Neale Donald Wilson -
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    • First of all...Michael Hiles...Awesome and Thank You...

      And for JD and vdrbdvfbfv:

      I don't think the model is find a partner, do marketing, then buy a bunch of companies.

      The core is that you form a partnership with an existing company in the form of some new company/partnership/venture. The foundation of this is that you, as an internet marketing expert, bring new eyeballs to the already existing business through your expertise of driving traffic via the interwebs.

      Ideally, you have partnered with somebody that has all of the other elements of a functioning company in place...people to sell the goods/services, people to produce the goods/services, etc.

      So, your partnership has created value for the existing company in real dollars...increased gross sales of whatever.

      I believe the quote from the OP was something to the effect of a rocketship growth curve.

      So, just for the sake of numbers, you take a company that had a million in gross sales for the past 3 years, and with the ol' rocketship growth curve created by your specific expertise of creating value for a business, that company suddenly sees $2mil in sales the year you start working with them.

      Then the beauty of this is when you have a company with that kind of growth, and the reason behind that growth is documented and proven, then suddenly, if you look just a little, you can find investors who want to get behind that company in the form of capitol. For growth.

      And in the OP it is in the form of complimentary acquisitions.

      So, to use the Plumber example that is so popular on this here forum...

      You help a plumbing company double it's sales. Suddenly have some investment capital. To me, complimentary type businesses that might be ripe for inclusion would be maybe a septic company (installation, pump out, etc), maybe a small excavation company (think broken water pipes), how about a sprinkler/irrigation company.

      Sorry if I'm just rehashing what's already been figured out. And, Michael, if I've butchered it, well let me know, please.

      But, I believe the key takeaways are this...

      Rocketship Growth
      Are you Creating Real Value

      Love it!
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      • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
        What level of daily input do you have Michael?

        What key performance indicator reports cross your desk and how often?

        I read about luxury play houses were advertised in magazines like The Robb Report and those that go in charter and private jets.The hot button for the rich was not spending enough time with their kids so the play houses was an outlet to ease their guilt.

        Thanks,
        Ewen
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

          What level of daily input do you have Michael?

          What key performance indicator reports cross your desk and how often?

          I read about luxury play houses were advertised in magazines like The Robb Report and those that go in charter and private jets.The hot button for the rich was not spending enough time with their kids so the play houses was an outlet to ease their guilt.

          Thanks,
          Ewen
          The Robb Report kicks butt!
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        • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
          Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

          What level of daily input do you have Michael?

          What key performance indicator reports cross your desk and how often?

          I read about luxury play houses were advertised in magazines like The Robb Report and those that go in charter and private jets.The hot button for the rich was not spending enough time with their kids so the play houses was an outlet to ease their guilt.

          Thanks,
          Ewen
          I have different responsibilities. Operationally, I am 100% marketing and sales, and I am the strategic tastemaker identifying acquisition companies and partners (because that's pretty much a 100% marketing function). On the backside, I function as a coach and play Svengali to a certain degree. I'm quite content taking a minority stake while promoting others to the front of the line. I don't have to fight for stage time with other big egos (owners and C-level folks are usually large personalities). You can be famous, just sign the check H-I-L-E-S.

          Interesting you ask about KPIs - because our company is actually in the SharePoint space, which is a major technology stack in the business intelligence field. One major result of our work is business intelligence dashboard creation for clients.

          So my KPIs are based on several marketing and sales silos.

          On the marketing side, it's the usual internet marketing suspects right down the line.

          Number of subscribers, clicks, uniques, opt-ins, numbers of registrations to webinars, etc...

          On the sales side, it's also the usual suspects... current pipeline opportunities, average velocity to revenue, etc...

          We're B2B, so it's not really as much EPC related vs. more traditional Customer Acquisition Cost and LTV.
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      • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
        Originally Posted by CleanMountainLiving View Post

        First of all...Michael Hiles...Awesome and Thank You...

        And for JD and vdrbdvfbfv:

        I don't think the model is find a partner, do marketing, then buy a bunch of companies.

        The core is that you form a partnership with an existing company in the form of some new company/partnership/venture. The foundation of this is that you, as an internet marketing expert, bring new eyeballs to the already existing business through your expertise of driving traffic via the interwebs.

        Ideally, you have partnered with somebody that has all of the other elements of a functioning company in place...people to sell the goods/services, people to produce the goods/services, etc.

        So, your partnership has created value for the existing company in real dollars...increased gross sales of whatever.

        I believe the quote from the OP was something to the effect of a rocketship growth curve.

        So, just for the sake of numbers, you take a company that had a million in gross sales for the past 3 years, and with the ol' rocketship growth curve created by your specific expertise of creating value for a business, that company suddenly sees $2mil in sales the year you start working with them.

        Then the beauty of this is when you have a company with that kind of growth, and the reason behind that growth is documented and proven, then suddenly, if you look just a little, you can find investors who want to get behind that company in the form of capitol. For growth.

        And in the OP it is in the form of complimentary acquisitions.

        So, to use the Plumber example that is so popular on this here forum...

        You help a plumbing company double it's sales. Suddenly have some investment capital. To me, complimentary type businesses that might be ripe for inclusion would be maybe a septic company (installation, pump out, etc), maybe a small excavation company (think broken water pipes), how about a sprinkler/irrigation company.

        Sorry if I'm just rehashing what's already been figured out. And, Michael, if I've butchered it, well let me know, please.

        But, I believe the key takeaways are this...

        Rocketship Growth
        Are you Creating Real Value

        Love it!

        You nailed it down.

        Aside from creating the level one sales opportunity, the bigger value created is the rocketship growth curve in a business that investors drool over.

        The money isn't in the sales on a day to day basis. I mean... yeah, that's the core profitmaking that makes everything else happen - but the REAL WEALTH comes from the capital investment play that results from your work.

        Two layers of result from your work...

        1) you create killer sales, which make a high growth, profitable business
        2) you create a compelling capital investment opportunity that will accelerate the growth of the company past the organic sales

        A $1 million annual sales company that grows 10% per year will be $2 million in 7 years.

        A $1 million annual sales company that grows 50% per year, can attract additional investment capital to acquire 2-3 more $1 million companies and be worth $10 million in 3-4 years.

        See the difference?
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        • Profile picture of the author Timaay
          Originally Posted by MichaelHiles View Post

          You nailed it down.

          Aside from creating the level one sales opportunity, the bigger value created is the rocketship growth curve in a business that investors drool over.

          The money isn't in the sales on a day to day basis. I mean... yeah, that's the core profitmaking that makes everything else happen - but the REAL WEALTH comes from the capital investment play that results from your work.

          Two layers of result from your work...

          1) you create killer sales, which make a high growth, profitable business
          2) you create a compelling capital investment opportunity that will accelerate the growth of the company past the organic sales

          A $1 million annual sales company that grows 10% per year will be $2 million in 7 years.

          A $1 million annual sales company that grows 50% per year, can attract additional investment capital to acquire 2-3 more $1 million companies and be worth $10 million in 3-4 years.

          See the difference?
          Great stuff Michael. Can you talk a little more about finding and evaluating capital investment for the new high growth company?

          Are we talking about angel's here or something else? I'd be really interested in how you bring these funds into play.

          thank you.
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by vndnbrgj View Post

      Don't worry John, I don't get it either.

      So, you take a company.
      Let's say ABC Home Improvement.
      Have them bring you on as a partner, but part of the deal is to open another company...
      So they open a parent company... ABC Enterprises.
      ABC Enterprises now owns ABC Home Improvement.
      You have equity in ABC Enterprises, but not directly in the Home Improvement business.

      Now, you do marketing....
      This is where I get lost.

      You go on a buying spree?
      You buy an electric company, plumbing, hvac, painting, etc...???

      Now you have a conglomerate???
      ABC Enterprises now owns:
      ABC Home Improvement
      Bill's Electric
      Water Works Plumbing
      Neighborhood HVAC
      New Look Painting
      Etc...???

      Are you doing marketing for each division of the parent company?
      Or, just the parent company?
      You're marketing for the brand company. Although you COULD also do marketing for subsidiary companies as well - depends on the deal and their offerings in the market. But you'd generally be marketing that as a brand under the parent.

      Really though, you pretty much get it.

      Although you COULD get equity in the original business, but it's more difficult and a more complex conversation. All comes down to the partner and how they see the deal and how they want to grow their company based on their personal circumstances.
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  • Profile picture of the author mjbmedia
    Great thread Michael, so number one question for me is how/where/what etc

    What qualifications does a company has to have for you to even bother looking into it further ?

    Help us (me), take a quantum leap through what probably took you a while to figure out by trial and error to discover the 'best' companies to begin researching and then approaching.

    eg would it be ones that have just moved into a new field, ones that have just been acquired or made an acquisition of their own, ones that have just introduced some new heads of key departments etc etc?

    I have been attempting something similar though on a smaller scale with a local magazine publishing company to add value to their offers, their advertisers adverts and create engagement ,interaction and ultimately more sales via their ads

    Win for readers (ease of engagement and purchase from ads /content)
    win for advertisers (more interaction, lead gen, sales, ROI)
    win for publishing house, (more income from added value offers, better repeat sales from happier advertisiers, contented readership due to higher and more relevant engagement)
    win for me (100+ new clients from one relationship)

    Thing is, I am having trouble (genuine) getting the publishing house(s) to realise the value to them , mainly because they are blinkered and pig thick and of course Im clearly not quite communicating it to them in a way they are getting (and thats the real issue which Im trying to lower my aims totheir level!!) , so what seemed like a no brainer adding of value to me isnt resonating with them , i dont think they're seeing beyond their own involvement, their income from ads is the be all and end all to them.

    So back to my question, how would one ensure they were spending time on the 'right' companies , rather than as I have wasting time on muppets.

    Cheers from another Mike
    Signature

    Mike

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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by mjbmedia View Post

      Great thread Michael, so number one question for me is how/where/what etc

      What qualifications does a company has to have for you to even bother looking into it further ?

      Help us (me), take a quantum leap through what probably took you a while to figure out by trial and error to discover the 'best' companies to begin researching and then approaching.

      eg would it be ones that have just moved into a new field, ones that have just been acquired or made an acquisition of their own, ones that have just introduced some new heads of key departments etc etc?

      I have been attempting something similar though on a smaller scale with a local magazine publishing company to add value to their offers, their advertisers adverts and create engagement ,interaction and ultimately more sales via their ads

      Win for readers (ease of engagement and purchase from ads /content)
      win for advertisers (more interaction, lead gen, sales, ROI)
      win for publishing house, (more income from added value offers, better repeat sales from happier advertisiers, contented readership due to higher and more relevant engagement)
      win for me (100+ new clients from one relationship)

      Thing is, I am having trouble (genuine) getting the publishing house(s) to realise the value to them , mainly because they are blinkered and pig thick and of course Im clearly not quite communicating it to them in a way they are getting (and thats the real issue which Im trying to lower my aims totheir level!!) , so what seemed like a no brainer adding of value to me isnt resonating with them , i dont think they're seeing beyond their own involvement, their income from ads is the be all and end all to them.

      So back to my question, how would one ensure they were spending time on the 'right' companies , rather than as I have wasting time on muppets.

      Cheers from another Mike
      The number one thing I try to understand is also the fundamental in any marketing - what specific problem are you solving for what specific kind of person? The avatar. Understand the end customer.

      Then determine what that market looks like based on the company's current business model, and the management's ability to understand and manage the implications of shifting the marketing to a high growth, internet-based approach for inbound lead generation or sales.

      There's no surefire formula for success, but you get a feel for what a person can absorb on an individual basis.

      My first big deal, when I sold my web company... the CEO of the direct marketing company "got it" to a certain degree. But sadly, what he didn't get was the business strategy I was trying to engineer with the combination of his firm with my web group -- which was essentially the Groupon model... in 1999. He just focused on the front-end services sales to small business advertising clients.

      I saw a billion dollar play 10 years ahead of the market. Alas, I still harass him about missing that one with a "told you so".
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      • Profile picture of the author John Durham
        Originally Posted by MichaelHiles View Post


        There's no surefire formula for success, but you get a feel for what a person can absorb on an individual basis.
        This is one of those Golden facts that are so true...that most people will want to skim by and not understand...thus we have the 90/10 rule.

        In EVERY endeavor, you have to measure all the variables, sometimes in "real time", and they wont be the same for you as they were for the guy who wrote the information even though the steps are there, because YOU and your prospect are variables, and thats the part you have to be sensitive to, that your coach cant do for you.

        You have to be willing to develop your style and know yourself, and be willing to be sensitive to customers energy, and there is no system for that, only skill to be developed, and willingness to learn your own elements and how to work with them.
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      • Profile picture of the author mjbmedia
        Originally Posted by MichaelHiles View Post

        The number one thing I try to understand is also the fundamental in any marketing - what specific problem are you solving for what specific kind of person? The avatar. Understand the end customer.

        Then determine what that market looks like based on the company's current business model, and the management's ability to understand and manage the implications of shifting the marketing to a high growth, internet-based approach for inbound lead generation or sales.

        There's no surefire formula for success, but you get a feel for what a person can absorb on an individual basis.

        My first big deal, when I sold my web company... the CEO of the direct marketing company "got it" to a certain degree. But sadly, what he didn't get was the business strategy I was trying to engineer with the combination of his firm with my web group -- which was essentially the Groupon model... in 1999. He just focused on the front-end services sales to small business advertising clients.

        I saw a billion dollar play 10 years ahead of the market. Alas, I still harass him about missing that one with a "told you so".
        Thanks for the reply Michael

        So now you mainly work on word of mouth Im guessing, when you started off doing this angle, ie your first 5 clients doing this, what parameters did you use to ensure you were approaching the right companies that were more likely (not definite of course) to be warm to your approach and wanting to grow at that rate and to those heights as opposed to companies that arent serious about growth and are too blinkered to see the potential and want to embrace it?
        Signature

        Mike

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        • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
          Originally Posted by mjbmedia View Post

          Thanks for the reply Michael

          So now you mainly work on word of mouth Im guessing, when you started off doing this angle, ie your first 5 clients doing this, what parameters did you use to ensure you were approaching the right companies that were more likely (not definite of course) to be warm to your approach and wanting to grow at that rate and to those heights as opposed to companies that arent serious about growth and are too blinkered to see the potential and want to embrace it?
          It was pretty much always a networking thing for me from day one. I never actually set out with any sort of parameters. I knew I could create phenomenal value, and there aren't really any "rules" here. Just some business fundamentals.

          I just started having conversations with guys... friends of friends, etc... Sure, this led to a lot of trial and error... but guess what? It's STILL trial and error! There's no formula. There are so many levers and moving parts, you can do everything 100% right, and the business still fail for some other reason (although having sales and cashflow cures a whole lot of problems... but it can also mask other ones and create even more that weren't there before). There are never, ever any guarantees. But it's nice to work with established companies and a cashflow instead of trying to bootstrap services from nothing at all.

          If I were to turn it into a formula, I'd do my homework on a particular market that I understood at the end customer level. (which we already do when we research niches, right?)

          Then I'd work on creating the new company and brand ahead of time (which we already do in internet marketing, right?).

          Then position myself as a high growth opportunity player who is approaching potential partners with a gameplan vs. trying to convince someone to create all those things after the fact. (which in a way, you're already doing selling your offline marketing services of some form, right?)

          That alone will put you in the driver's seat as a peer/contemporary vs. some dude coming along with a wild idea and nothing to show. Spin up a brand site, get it going with the assumption that you WILL find a partner in that industry.

          Without being TOO cliche'... Mindset, Message, Marketing

          1. Mindset with a belief and complete confidence in yourself, your abilities, and the overwhelming value that you are bringing to the table as a linchpin. After all, there are lots of internet marketing and web guys, but not very many who are approaching the discussion with this kind of strategy in mind. If you're not completely and wholly confident and passionate about how you're going to blast this business into the stratosphere, you're not going to convince anyone of anything.

          2. Message... the compelling theme of what you're communicating in terms of the rapid growth opportunity you bring to the table for your partners.

          3. Marketing even at this grassroots level. It's a numbers game to engage all of the promotional steps you take to spread your message and find prospective partners to do your deal.
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  • Profile picture of the author FIP
    High quality post Michael - thankyou very much for sharing those insights.

    A question if you have time to answer it:

    How would you (if you could) approach this in the area of Life Coaching for example?

    Any ideas on approaching fellow coaches for example or other approaches?

    Cheers

    Craig
    Signature

    "If one advances confidently in the direction of his own dreams and endeavours to live the life which he has imagined - he will meet a success unexpected in common hours"
    -Thoreau

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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by FIP View Post

      High quality post Michael - thankyou very much for sharing those insights.

      A question if you have time to answer it:

      How would you (if you could) approach this in the area of Life Coaching for example?

      Any ideas on approaching fellow coaches for example or other approaches?

      Cheers

      Craig

      Well I don't see why it couldn't be done. It's just another service. I am assuming you'd be focusing on a specific kind of coaching.

      So by rolling up into your structure, what are you offering to a coach as an upside to just staying independent? You handle all the backend admin, you give them clients, etc...

      (this gets into the sales discussion of attracting those acquisition partners)

      I think you'd be fighting against the independent nature of coaches and why someone bails out of a corporate job to enter the coaching field.
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  • More Questions!

    First, operations side...I understand your core responsibilities are the online marketing related side of things...PPC, SEO, traffic, lead gen through all the possible ways, etc. Do you have a team, or your own company, already in place to do all the work. I know you, Michael Hiles, don't personally do it! Or do you have companies that you turn to in each case to handle all of that.

    And, again, it appears that you only partner with people/businesses that come to the table with the money to fund the investment in that part of your growth strategy....their $50k pays you a little upfront to buy groceries and also pays the ABC IM Company to handle everything.

    Also, on the additional company side...

    - Are you the sole stakeholder in the new company or do you partner with the target company?

    So, Joe the Plumber has a $1mil plumbing co. and you find each other and agree to form a new company that handles the inbound marketing for Joe the Plumber.

    Joe the Plumber brings $50k cash to the new company, and you guys become 50/50 partners in that company which gets, what 75% of revenue over the existing $1 mil, while Joe maintains 100% ownership in the plumbing co?

    Joe wins on every level because he still owns his growing plumbing co 100%, and is 50/50 x a growth company that has generated say $500k the first year, attracting private equity that will help double/triple/quadruple that over the next 3-4 years via the acquisition of targeted growth opportunities.

    So, additional companies are acquired through the new company that was created at the outset of the deal. And, Joe just keeps plumbing right along while you do your thing. Ideally though Joe becomes the operations gooroo for the acquired companies.

    And, so, the company that was created out of thin air by you with $50k of Joe's money from HIS existing business asset...

    Created growth and revenue that attracts additional private equity
    Acquires complimentary businesses that also benefit from rocketship growth

    And, in 3 years you have a company, maybe your stake is only 20% after private partners come in, and that company is now a $10mil company that basically only consists of the acquired companies...not necessarily Joe's original plumbing co, unless of course that was part of the deal up front.

    Still on the right track?

    And, I totally get that every deal is different....
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    I have a couple of in-house resources and then also outsource. So yeah, there's a team.

    Again, there's lots of ways to do the deals. At this point, I don't really need $$ to live on per se. We declare quarterly shareholder distributions.

    Probably one of the simplest ways to get the feet in the water is to just go find a small company who is up and coming or struggling and just become a partner owner with them. That's a simple deal and there's no shortage of guys looking for marketing and sales for "free". So forming a brand new company (you don't want to inherit their debt liability as a shareholder in their existing company) as a partnership 50/50 and running all the sales through that new company. If your marketing and sales chops are what you would proclaim to a prospective services client, you should be cranking new business pretty quickly to increase sales to support you on the salary side. If not, then back to the original question... are you creating real value with what you're doing? (put yo money where yo mouth at... so to speak)

    Just like the roofing guy in the previous post... he's desperate to find jobs. How desperate? Give up 1/2 his company since he doesn't have any $$ to hire?

    Lots of ways to skin the cat.

    BUT

    The main idea is understanding the tremendous value you bring to the table in terms of sales growth - especially in a poopy economy.

    This is why I am so critical of guys who sell themselves so short with $500 websites. Yes, that's an over-simplification - but you get the point. It's the same stuff... just all in how you package and sell it.


    As for the deal structure, the plumber guy is also an equity shareholder in the new company. So it's no lose for him. Depending on the deal and the business sector, Joe could remain the ops guy or you could bring in a hitter with outside money. You might inherit a better one from an acquisiton company (along with the possibility of acquiring other systems, etc...). Your investors might dictate their own guy... etc... etc...

    These are all subordinate issues to the real one... which is YOU ARE THE LINCHPIN THAT SPAWNS ALL THE POSSIBILITIES.
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  • Profile picture of the author Carl Donovan
    This is an absolutely BRILLIANT post, Michael. Thank you for setting the long-term wheels in motion.

    Carl
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  • Profile picture of the author Charles Harper
    As always, great post Michael.

    Funding options are plenteous these days, especially if one wants to go the Kickstarter, IndiGoGo route. Honestly, there are so many of them now, it is dazzling.

    CT
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    Well there has to be a very, very clear-cut communication strategy put into place as part of the overall marketing. But isn't that what we do as great marketing professionals?

    "Thank you for being such a valued client over the years. Because of your support as a customer, we've grown and continue to expand our capabilities as your vendor of choice. In order to accomodate our existing customers while also expanding our ability to bring new services, we've developed a new brand XYZ. We're still the same folks delivering the same great service that you've always enjoyed, and now we just look a little different. Thank you again for your support!"
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  • Profile picture of the author patadeperro
    Michael:

    Great thread, and I must say that I need a little bit more info, I have gotten into this kind of deals myself but as they say the devil is in the details, I have taken the path of being an independent marketing consultant better , because I think I have not done all the steps properly, so here are some of the challenges I have face and I will appreciate your input.

    I understood the idea of the new partnership, however how do you know when a new sale have been closed? specially when we are talking about big contracts (product/services that are not usually purchased online) when you start sending a lot of customers how do you know (or how do you track) the new sales? what happened to me is that I wasted more time tracking the new sales than doing marketing... in the long run I got tired and left.

    I am thinking that you control the lead generation process and the follow up, how do you fix the "closing" process? many times I was generating leads and the salesmen were unable to close them, or close as many as my team was closing, what happened here is that I was trying to fix many areas of the company and again... I stopped focusing on the marketing.

    Specially in your first partnership this is an important question to solve, how do you cover the marketing expenses? example: you need at least 10,000 budget for a lead generation campaign, now you are partner so how are you going to get this money from the "other" company? because if you don't get certain budget you wont make much difference in the sales, sure you can start generating 1 or 2 sales with any free advertising method you want, but in order to start generating 500, or 600 leads per month you need a bigger budget how have you solved this issue?

    Thanks in advance.
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    In my deals, the new company generates the leads, manages the process, closes and manages the sale and the customer relationship.

    Right now, I am involved in a company that does complex consulting for enterprise IT, which means the contracts are "on our paper". That means not only does the new company generate the leads and close the sales, but the delivery is done under the new company label as well (even though the partner company is doing the work). This means the contract also requires things like E&O insurance, etc.. which is why we keep a substantial portion of the markup as well. The parent brand company carries all the contractual risk. But since the partner company is getting all the work, the owners still get paid.

    As for covering expenses, the sky is the limit. The partner company can divert its existing budget, additional sales should create profit margin, incoming investment capital, etc... it's all up for grabs and wholly contingent upon your plan, your industry, and your partners. That's the nice thing about working with an established company as a partner - there's already an operating company with a budget. This opens up more options on funding sales growth. They'd have to invest the cash in the growth strategy as well - but the differences in HOW is very apparent in this kind of deal structure (and SHOULD be far more attractive).

    For a first deal, I'd try to bootstrap everything I possibly could so I didn't need to take a lot of capital out of the company until there's a system in place and it's cash flowing. This could require a second... {gasp} job, moonlight work, etc... to keep the wolves away from the door. But in the end, that's what puts you into a much better position on the ownership side. There's only so much cash and in the early stages of a company, that cash is necessary to continue building the system and keeping a reserve pool for operations.

    Hey, in some instances, I've simply been offered a very, very nice job by the company in lieu of this kind of deal. I've never taken that offer, but someone else might consider it depending upon their circumstances. After all, a nice $150K/year position with mad bonus to sit around and do what we're already doing with other people's money isn't so hateful - especially when you can do it so well that it leaves open lots of time for other stuff (and theoretically can still be done from anywhere besides a cubicle). Everyone's personal circumstance should be the guidepost here.
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  • Profile picture of the author Bruha
    Michael

    Thank you for this post. Where would I look to find more specifics on how to properly setup a company like this? Insurance. Taxes. Etc
    Signature

    Visit my website at www.ctbonlinemarketingllc.com to learn more about how to make money online!

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  • Profile picture of the author xInd
    Thank you very much for this post. I had already identified and took action for basically the same idea, this same shift in perspective, but some of the variables and pieces of the puzzle were different. This has given me great insight into how to amp up what I'm doing to the next level faster. Cheers.
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  • Profile picture of the author delmo
    Thanks Michael for starting this thread.
    I have some questions on how this works.

    First, how do you find a target company? How do you know they're in a sales slump, or have poor Internet marketing? Do you cold call and ask? Why will they reveal this info to you?

    Also, how do you know you can increase sales? How do you know you won't just be wasting everyone's time?

    How can a business's marketing budget handle building a new brand? Won't it cost significantly more than their budget?

    Ok, so we have ABC Medical Corp. It is a cardiology practice with $1 million in revenues.
    Your idea is to set up a separate company, so let's create XYZ Cardiac Inc.
    So, XYZ Cardiac Inc. becomes the entity which markets medical services, charges the client and collects payment from the health insurance company and pays ABC Medical Corp.as a contractor for the healthcare services provided?

    XYZ Cardiac Inc. generates $2 million in sales. Are the original $1 million in sales re-routed to the new company(assuming recurring revenues)? How much of this goes to ABC Medical Corp.? How do you decide?

    Let's say half goes to ABC Medical Corp., so $1 million. The original owners have 100% of the old company, plus 50% in XYZ Cardiac Inc., which has an additional $1 million in revenues. In essence, they have $1.5 million in total, right?

    How are the old operations and presence of ABC Medical Corp. adjusted? Does the old building and signage/awnings change to say XYZ Cardiac Inc.?
    What does the receptionist say, ABC or XYZ? The website, business cards, forms, etc.?

    Finally, can you outsource the marketing to an Internet Marketing specialist?

    Thanks, I know that's a lot to answer, LOL!!!
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    • Profile picture of the author hardyfella
      Great thread and great information.....

      A slightly different angle on this would be where (I am thinking of IT services)you would offer your services to a company for 'free' become their in house support as it were, but then you would the offer these services to companies in the same field.... I guess there are a lot less guarantees with this model....but I have seen where bigger companies have done this because they were spending so much outsourcing, bringing it in house and creating a new company/section made sense.

      Does it depend on what sales setup these companies have already as to who you approach. Ie do you get involved with what field sales are doing?

      Hope that makes sense, thanks Michael again awesome insight.....
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