Brokering export deals - JD's method

87 replies
Hello Warriors,

Has anyone had success with John Durham's alibaba gold method? John you mentioned you would entertain questions about it on this forum. I needed clarification on a few points. From John or anyone else that has done something similar, or anyone who feels like they can contribute. Basically for those that don't know, you call manufacturers and try to find ones that have distressed merchandise and find buyers for them.

I am not sure about whether I am getting good leads. I am paying someone on odesk to get leads from manta but am not sure if its being done right.

How do you only get manufacturers and not local mom and pop stores?

I end up being sent to a lot of automated systems (i.e. "For customer service press 1...) Any tips on this?

I am getting contact names of CEOs mostly. Should I get some other persons contact info?

Basically, I think my main sticking point so far is figuring out how to get good leads from Manta and how to go about it. Like which filters to use, etc.

If anyone who tried it has any questions, feel free to ask them here, I don't mind as long as its relevant.
#brokering #deals #export #method
  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Howdy Stranger!

    Im not exactly sure how manta works, its been awhile, but if you use info usa you can specify manufacturers

    My favorite one is the one that all the manufacturers themselves use though "The thomas Registry".

    There is an online version of the registry that you can google but it isnt even 5% as comprehensive as the one that you can get at most city libraries. It comes in about 20 volumes, you just choose the niche you want. They will not let you take it home from the library but you can copy pages from it on the copier there.

    That is what I have always done because its just better, more comprehensive and more concentrated. The online one has more than just manufacturers.

    If you cant access the thomas registry then focus your lists specifically on manufacturers. Like I said, I dont know how manta works but most will let you specify manufacturers only.

    If you get an automated system just hang up, what you gain in waiting on them, you lose in time. Just move to the next number till you get a human.

    Usually you will want to talk to the warehouse manager to see what kind of surplus they have and he will send you to the appropriate person after you have that question answered. He knows about the throw away merchandise because he is the one who has to worry about all the warehouse space its taking up.

    I hope this answers your specific questions, if there are any more please feel free.

    -John

    Ps. There are a few guys around her who got deals, one made 15k on his first transaction working about an hour a day over 6-8 weeks. He was from Russia, made a deal with a Canadien manufacturer and sold the load to China. So geography is not an issue with this.

    I dont know who all from that class that had successes is active here, but maybe they will chime in if they see this. I have about 5 reports, but Im sure there are more around here, most people dont report after a success for some reason and I find out months later.

    -John
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  • Profile picture of the author stranger11
    Should I just ask for the warehouse manager, or is their contact information usually included in the thomas registry?
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Sometimes its in the registry... but if not; just say to the secretary that you are with a liquidation company who purchases large inventories of closeouts and you were wondering if you could speak to the warehouse manager.

    The Warehouse manager will transfer you too...usually to a sales director (try to get the vice pres instead) but before you end up getting sent to a sales representative, make sure you have confirmed with the warehouse guy that there is a ton of liquidation (throw away) merchandise taking up space... or else the sales manager might try to sluff it off on you at wholesale prices instead of liquidation price.

    Its good if he understands that you know there is a problem, and you will offer to get it off his hands for pennies on the dollar as opposed to him throwing it out because he cant sell it back to his market. But if he thinks you dont know its salvage or throwaway...he may try to sell it to you at wholesale. No deal, you want pennies on the dollar, and you know he has a space problem and has to get rid of it... or throw it out.

    Anytime possible try to get that information before being passed on.

    Presidents and vice presidents are easier to deal with, and want to rid themselves of the problem more than commission hungry sales managers, so make a sales director your last resort. Tell the warehouse manager "usually the vice president is the person we deal with", if you can put me through.

    Also, sometimes the secretary herself will be familiar with liquidation brokers and their purpose and will pass you right to the person in charge of that.

    Greet the person you are passed on to by saying you work with a market of people who are interested in buying out large quantities of discontinued product inventories, usually truckloads at a time, and you think you can help him move it, that your clients pay in advance..., and that you may even be able to clear it all out in one sale...he will perk up and listen.

    Then go to that market (such as Alibaba), after you get him to agree, and make an offer to it.

    Remember: "A deal well bought is already half sold". You wont get anywhere pushing wholesale prices for discontinued merchandise, and neither do these companies.

    Eventually they realize that they practically have to give it away and not be proud if they want to quit paying all the costs for warehousing it and make room for new product lines. They HAVE to get rid of it. Many of them end up just throwing it out in the local dump or LITERALLY giving it away.

    The process Im describing is how products get into one dollar stores. Brokers like you buy it from desperate manufacturers who have to get rid of it, and they sell it to places like that, just marking it up a few pennies per unit.

    My average sale, out of close to 50 loads, each containing around 20k units (wallpaper rolls mostly), was about 30 cents per unit on a $20.00 retail product and I was able to mark it up ten or fifteen cents per unit and sell (broker) it off in bulk loads.

    But if you dont get that good deal it isnt worth your time. The manufacturer has to be desperate with a warehouse full of liquidation merchandise, which almost ALL of them have at some point throughout the year.

    Again; the higher up you go, the better deal you get.

    I usually try to get to the vice president. It isnt that hard if you are coming in saying "I have buyers who will take your salvage inventory off your hands".

    This will be easy to assimilate if you understand what a HUGE problem excess merchandise is for many manufacturers.

    First of all it has already been written off as a loss, they could make money even if they only sold it for 1 cent per unit. Thats the truth. If you make it easy for them to get rid of without a bunch of headache, higher ups are open to that, rather than throwing it out.

    Some of them have up to a million units at a time left over each year, and it costs them alot of money to continue warehousing.

    Also you have to understand that , just like shelf space is valuable in a retail store, floor space is valuable in a warehouse. Not to mention the cost of the employees who have to look after it.

    "A deal well bought is half sold".

    I once even got once got some loads for 10 cents per unit (retail value $19.99). I was able to turn that around in 24 hours by listing it at 15 cents per unit.

    I dont remember the EXACT number of units, I believe it was around 60-100k... but I made exactly $7500 commission in 24 hours and had it in my bank within just a day or two. Was my quickest turn around time ever.

    Usual turn around time can be 3-6 weeks, and commissions can be alot higher.

    This takes about 1hour -per day of work after you have your manufacturers set up. Cold calling for manufacturing deals can take 3-5 hours per day till you get a few deals... maybe 20-30 hours of calling.

    These desperate manufacturers are common.

    -John
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    • Profile picture of the author wb_man
      hi john,

      i'm not familiar with the industry but how many manufacturing companies are there in the U.S.? possible to run out of companies to contact?

      if you want to do some type of work (contract/commission) for them, who is the best person to talk to? the owner? or does he let the president/director handle all the marketing/contract-based work?

      how did they pay you? check? paypal? wire transfer?

      thanks for sharing. it's late here, will reread your posts in the morning.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author EricGuimond
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Gimme one more day on this guys, I feel the need to be really comprehensive here. Just stopping by to say I didnt forget about it. This may deserve another report. I dont know. At least a long thread, because the instructions need to be in more of a chronological order for people to grasp it. This is BIG business, it needs to be explained more clearly.

      Hi John,

      I saw a few of your posts about this method, is the original course still for sale? Would really like to get my hands on it if possible.


      Thanks for all the info on forum as usal!

      -Eric
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      • Profile picture of the author John Durham
        Originally Posted by EricGuimond View Post

        Hi John,

        I saw a few of your posts about this method, is the original course still for sale? Would really like to get my hands on it if possible.


        Thanks for all the info on forum as usal!

        -Eric
        No I took it off sale because most people didnt "get" it, and they made fun of me for the personal stories I told in it, so I felt it wasnt appreciated. I may do it over now that I understand all of the things people didnt "get" which I didnt anticipate the first time around. Some people had success with it, but I think it raised more questions for alot of others than answers. Now I am familiar with their questions...so I could do it in a more prepared way.

        Its easy to do actually, but its not as easy to "explain" as selling web pages, because people have a tendency to believe there must be more to doing deals like this, so they arent satisfied with simple answers. The way I do it is pretty simple... But it does need to be re explained in way that wont have me answering a gazzillion 20 mile long emails every time a person purchases it. lol

        Most people here are a little bit familiar with selling offline marketing products, so its easier to explain that, because they usually at least have some points of reference that help them understand what you are saying, however, when they come into this industry, most dont have those pre conceived points of reference , so as simple as it is, you have to be more thorough in explaining.

        Originally Posted by mharris4431 View Post

        How does one handle freight on large transactions like this? Are shipping costs a hindrance on large deals...especially when shipping overseas?
        Freight is figured into your quotes, and yes, to OTHER people, its an issue, but not to YOU because you know how to "buy" and thus you offset the cost.
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  • Profile picture of the author mharris4431
    How does one handle freight on large transactions like this? Are shipping costs a hindrance on large deals...especially when shipping overseas?
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  • Profile picture of the author stranger11
    Apparently Thomas registry stopped making hard copies. Can you confirm this? I live in Canada so I think I will only have access to the online version, and after doing a few searches it seems limited.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by stranger11 View Post

      Apparently Thomas registry stopped making hard copies. Can you confirm this? I live in Canada so I think I will only have access to the online version, and after doing a few searches it seems limited.
      Hi Stranger,

      I was actually at the library myself doing research in 2011 and they had a whole 20 volumes, which I used to copy pages and make my own calls... So at least up to that date they were making hard copies, or had them available in the library. What source did you get "They stopped making them" from?

      In any event, the thomas registry isnt the only source. I did take some time to check out manta and other commercial list companies like info usa... and there are thousands of manufacturers listed there as well. So there are literally hundreds of sources for manufacturers lists.

      On another note, retail stores also have liquidation merchandise at the end of the year, particularly in the secondary markets (stores such as best buy, dollar general's, for example who buy closeouts to stock their stores, thus they dont have buy back agreements with manufacturers because they dont generally buy first line merchandise), also large wholesale distributors have it.

      So manufacturers, while they are the source I myself have almost always used, with the exception of a couple of retail chains and other brokers, arent the only kind of business that has excess inventory at the end of the year.

      One of the guys from my last class found a half million units of something from a wholesaler, who had purchased a bunch of product and couldnt sell it.... so wholesalers have this problem alot too. The guy was about to throw it out because he needed his warehouse back, so he had moved as much of it as possible into these extra semi trailers he had on his lot, and still didnt clear his warehouse, he also needed to use his semi trailers and was desperate to empty those too.

      If a wholesaler lets too much build up for a couple of years it starts being a real issue for them.

      While on that particular note, alot of the business I have done has been through other brokers. For example stumbled upon other liquidators initially in my quest to learn where to sell the merchandise I had located, and ended up making deals with some to help me move my merchandise, allowing them to create their own markup, and also ended up selling some of THEIR merchandise.

      Example:

      I emailed a particular liquidation company asking them if they wanted to buy a load of wallpaper, and they ended up listing my wallpaper on their site, marking it up a quarter and selling a few loads down the road; they also asked me if I could help sell some loads of Sherwin Williams paint they had since I was working with home decor products, so I kept them in mind and later down the road I came across a customer who was interested in that and sold them a couple of loads of paint, marking up that liquidators price a little for my own profit. Also did this with a company who sold loads of "furniture" (Tables, chairs, lamps, statues...) and sold a few loads of that.

      So there are many opportunities, if you work it, to sell for all kinds of organizations, and make all kinds of deals. Other brokers and liquidation houses are almost always open to giving you a commission to help sell their own products...

      Originally Posted by stranger11 View Post

      I think I will only have access to the online version, and after doing a few searches it seems limited.
      Yes i noted that in my first post. The online version is limited it seems. Learned that from the experience of trying to use it myself in the beginning.

      Originally Posted by wb_man View Post

      hi john,

      i'm not familiar with the industry but how many manufacturing companies are there in the U.S.? possible to run out of companies to contact?

      if you want to do some type of work (contract/commission) for them, who is the best person to talk to? the owner? or does he let the president/director handle all the marketing/contract-based work?

      how did they pay you? check? paypal? wire transfer?

      thanks for sharing. it's late here, will reread your posts in the morning.
      Hi Wb_man,

      Generally you are going to want to talk to a president. I ask for different people at different times, alot of times I feel like I want to talk to a warehouse manager first, and then I have that person forward me to the person "in charge of handling the excess inventory", however alot of times the secretary herself will want to know why you are calling. She many times will recognize you as a liquidator and direct you to the correct person, as many companies have a protocol for dealing with liquidators and they are familiar with the concept. While the concept will be new and welcome to many companies, most companies deal with several liquidators, as many as possible that they can have in their Rolodex is good.

      As far as how many manufacturers are in the USA?

      I just checked manta, and there are almost 700,000 toy manufacturers in the USA alone according to them.

      *Now Im sure some of those listings are inaccurate, and you ALWAYS that have to assume, in order to have realistic expectations about success, that your lists aren't always going to be perfect....

      So, bearing that in mind, lets REALLY low ball it and say that manta is wrong and there are really only 50,000 toy manufacturers in the USA; thats only ONE niche... I dont think there is much chance you are going to run out of manufacturers to call.

      Originally Posted by mharris4431 View Post

      How does one handle freight on large transactions like this? Are shipping costs a hindrance on large deals...especially when shipping overseas?
      Hi Mharris,

      There are several shipping terms you will want to become familiar with. I myself learned them as I went along and my customers taught them to me knowing I was green in the beginning.

      One of them is "FOB QUOTE" (Freight On Board)

      A freight on board quote means the customer wants to know how much it will cost to:

      A: Buy the load
      B: Have it picked up and loaded on the trailer
      C: Ground shipped to the port of delivery.
      D: Loaded onto the vessel
      E: Shipped to the port of destination.

      A "Door to Door" quote also includes the arrangement of having the load picked up at the port of destination and driven to the buyers warehouse, which is less common, usually the buyer will arrange to have it picked up at the port of destination themselves.

      So...

      This sounds complicated but really what you do is just go to your seller and say "my buyer wants an FOB quote" and that seller will create a proforma invoice which includes shipping for you to present to your buyer that includes FOB.

      In rare cases, with smaller retailers who dont do alot of shipping you may have to actually arrange the shipping yourself, which is one reason why many brokers also choose to become freight forwarders so they can also make commission off the shipping deals. But having to deal with shipping yourself isnt as common because most large companies already have protocol in place for that.

      Hope I have answered everyones questions.

      -John
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      • Profile picture of the author wb_man
        hi john,

        thanks for answering my questions. i'm not too familiar with this alibaba broker method of yours since i just read about it recently. so i will do more research and some trial & error before asking any more questions.

        Originally Posted by John Durham


        Hope I have answered everyones questions.

        -John
        did you forget about this question?

        Originally Posted by wb_man

        how did they pay you? check? paypal? wire transfer
        what is the best way for manufacturers to pay you when using this method? since you're getting high commission fees (ex: $7.5k, $15k), would there be a problem going to the bank and depositing such a big, fat check ? also you have to wait to get it in the mail then wait for it to clear so that takes longer time.

        i'm still young so have never received a payment with that amount so just trying to know the best way to do it.

        also, how do you do your taxes on your commission earnings?
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          Originally Posted by wb_man View Post

          hi john,

          thanks for answering my questions. i'm not too familiar with this alibaba broker method of yours since i just read about recently. so i will do more research and some trial & error before any more questions.



          did you forget about this question?



          what is the best way for manufacturers to pay you when using this method? since you're getting high commission fees (ex: $7.5k, $15k), would there be a problem going to the bank and depositing such a big, fat check ? also you have to wait to get it in the mail then wait for it to clear so that takes longer time.

          i'm still young so have never received a payment with that amount so just trying to know the best way to do it.

          also, how do you do your taxes on your commission earnings?
          @ WB _man

          Sorry about that.

          Where "commission payment" is concerned:

          Usually I have gotten paid by wire transfer, although I have also been mailed a check once. You can do either. Most manufacturers will pay you immediately upon the closing of the sale. and you can specify that in the deal you make with them if you want; others have a protocol for payouts, and they only make them on the 15th of the month and the 30th. So you could potentially wait until two weeks after the close of your sale to be paid but that has, again, only happened once with me. Usually I have gotten paid within a few days. I have been paid as quick as twenty four hours to a couple of weeks after a sale closed.

          As far as taxes are concerned:

          You file them just like you would any other taxes you owe. Simply include them in your earnings statement when you go to your tax preparer. Tell them you made "X" dollars on this deal... and they file it just like they would any other earnings. Using your check stubs or bank statements...Nothing special or different about that. They will ask you what your overhead was and figure that in... Same ole same ole.

          Being that you are young and havent paid taxes before I would advise you that its no big deal, your tax preparer will talk you right through it. Its just like paying taxes for any other business.

          -JD
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  • Profile picture of the author stranger11
    I started cold calling, I only have an hour or two 3 times a week after working full time, which should be enough to get started. Would you recommend Jim Straw's Finders Fee course?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by stranger11 View Post

      I started cold calling, I only have an hour or two 3 times a week after working full time, which should be enough to get started. Would you recommend Jim Straw's Finders Fee course?
      Yes. Jim Straw actually agreed with me on this concept wholeheartedly, to the point of even helping me promote the idea when I started teaching it... Jim's teaching offers even more ways to expand your knowledge on this subject. My method is effective but narrow by comparison.

      I like teaching narrow focused concepts because they keep blinders on people and keep them focused on a fine point to help them reach goals, as does Jim teaching, however his lifetime body of work is very broad on this subject, and all the other subtopics that surround it.

      Jim Straw was far more successful at these things than I can ever even dream of being in two lifetimes, he was a master at this subject, teaching it, and all it entails.

      Jim knew the entire industry like the back of his hand and made millions of dollars per year at it, whereas I just stumbled onto a single working system by accident, and made a few hundred thousand in sales.

      While I know that specific system, Im not a master of the industry as a whole. He was also one of the greatest direct sales and advertising people in history.

      In short Jim Straw was the most masterful wholesaler on the planet next to Sam Walton (maybe) , and I think he knew alot of things that Sam didnt even know about marketing in general. He devoted his life to marketing, and was as good as they get.

      I recommend any advice you can get from him, far above my own.

      On your other question:

      3 concentrated hours of dialing per week should be plenty. It may take your first couple of hours to start feeling the groove but the first time you run across a willing participant it will feel awesome and it will all suddenly "click". After that, calling on this will be a JOY, unlike any other cold calling.

      Hope this helps.

      -John
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  • Profile picture of the author stranger11
    Wow, you must be a big fan. What about the other WSO about this by some guy named maksym. He has instructional videos too. I guess it wouldn't hurt since its cheap.

    Made some more calls today. Getting more comfortable now, and people are more responsive, still nothing though.
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    • Profile picture of the author maksym
      Originally Posted by stranger11 View Post

      Wow, you must be a big fan. What about the other WSO about this by some guy named maksym. He has instructional videos too. I guess it wouldn't hurt since its cheap.

      Made some more calls today. Getting more comfortable now, and people are more responsive, still nothing though.
      Hi Stranger11
      thanks for mentioned me as well. Well... brokering business was real part of my life for couple years. And that's why I created product where I putted all my knowledge and experience. This brokering business is really great to work in and have huuuuuuge possibilities.

      regards
      Maksym
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  • Profile picture of the author brik2500
    John I heard you talk about this before...looks awesome! I will look for more information in this thread and elsewhere.

    BEST
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by brik2500 View Post

      John I heard you talk about this before...
      It's a good plan... I have several strategies that I could fall back on if needed. Thats the beauty of trying, trying and trying again ... You stumble onto stuff that works! This is very doable.
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      • Profile picture of the author EricGuimond
        Well due to recomendtion in thread I just bought Jim Straw's finders fee course.

        Definately a good read an packed with valuable informtion. Opened my eyes to alot of opportunities, almost like a kid in a candy store, not sure were to start!

        He pretty much covers all aspects of the business in general terms and provides alot of usefull resources. Seems getting started this way would take a while to build up a buyer/seller list to be fully profitable, but as he says the book needs to be read atleast 3 times before you understand it fully, so doing it now.

        Im going to take action on method and try to dedicate around 3 hours per day to test it out, looks very promissing!

        Now if only I could buy JD's course to kick things of with a specific method, along side what I learned from Mr. Straw's book, would be a killer combo

        -Eric
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Eric, mine is a bit more singularly focused...will send you a pm with a link.
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    • Profile picture of the author EricGuimond
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Eric, mine is a bit more singularly focused...will send you a pm with a link.
      Hi John,

      Great thanks alot!

      Yes, I was hoping for a more singularly focused method to get the hang of it and replicate to other styles latter on.

      -Eric
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    I hope you enjoy it.

    It will give you a pretty clear direction of how I myself started and how you can start as well, if you can bear a couple of personal stories.

    Like I pm'd you. I will be glad to help clarify here on the forum any areas where you need help along the way. As you can see above, I dont really hold back and try to give comprehensive answers.

    I really intend to rewrite this one at some point and make it even better, but this will def give you a direction to start in and enough information to make a deal.

    Hope you enjoy.

    -John

    Ps. Jim liked it... so I must have done something right. As stated, I myself have made hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of deals with the very system it teaches... Exactly the way I did it.
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    • Profile picture of the author EricGuimond
      Hi John,

      Thanks for PM, I didnt reply yet due to low post count but I think if I buy a membership I can PM so will do that shortly.

      I read over your book twice, really enjoyed it.

      Im spending the next week preparing to try out system. I have quite a bit of sales experience but none really for cold calling so plan to spend most of week cold calling for my offline services business as practice and then start for this method.

      Stranger11 - Sorry didnt mean to hijack your thread, after I try method I will update on here, hopefully info will help.

      -Eric

      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      I hope you enjoy it.

      It will give you a pretty clear direction of how I myself started and how you can start as well, if you can bear a couple of personal stories.

      Like I pm'd you. I will be glad to help clarify here on the forum any areas where you need help along the way. As you can see above, I dont really hold back and try to give comprehensive answers.

      I really intend to rewrite this one at some point and make it even better, but this will def give you a direction to start in and enough information to make a deal.

      Hope you enjoy.

      -John

      Ps. Jim liked it... so I must have done something right. As stated, I myself have made hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of deals with the very system it teaches... Exactly the way I did it.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Good luck. If you need any help along the way just ask. I think you will find that it doesnt take much cold calling comparatively to locate excess inventory stocklots.

    If you had a scraper like Ken Michaels offers, which will give you their email addys too, Im not even sure it would even take cold calling, but cold calling is how I did it, and so thats all I can share legitimately.

    You are not calling to "sell", you are calling to help get some inventory off their hands so the response is alot different than cold calling. They tend to me more receptive and you get through more secretaries.
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  • Profile picture of the author stranger11
    John - Look forward to the second edition

    maksym - I bought your WSO since its cheap. Its more general compared to JD's method, but the videos do go step-by-step for people who don't know about Alibaba. I still have to go through it all

    Eric- No worries. I made this thread so that anyone who has questions can ask and we can bounce ideas off of each other, so ask away. There aren't too many places that are discussing this type of thing, either because they want to keep it a secret, or because it requires you to think outside the box.

    I had to deal with some other stuff recently and stopped calling, but I think I will start again. Good idea about the emails, JD.
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    • Profile picture of the author kumar
      Hi John,

      Since the broker would be dealing with liquidated products, wouldn't
      it be necessary for the goods to be quality checked?

      Do the buyers insist on getting samples or products QC-ed by a 3rd party quality control institute?
      Do you get involved in that?

      Also sent you a PM.

      Thanks!
      Signature

      Life is not a sprint, its a marathon. A bad start does not really matter too much

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  • Profile picture of the author jslim
    Hi Stranger 11,
    this is in response to the email you sent me. My experience with closeouts consists of calling businesses and asking for any liquidations they might have. I also call liquidators and ask them if they are looking for a particular item. For instance, my first deal I made with motorcycle helmets. I actualy called a liquidator and proposed to him a deal I had on suits. He was not interested but I asked him if he was looking for anything in particular. He said he wanted motorcycle helmets. I went on manta.com and searched for motorcyle helmets but only companies who had over a million dollar sales volume. (It's on the left sidebar). I got some sweet deals from 3 companies and sold 3 truck loads to my liquidator from 2 of the companies. As for LinkedIn, what I do is put in my profile that I am a liquidator then join groups that are about closeouts, wholesale, liquidations etc and then promote my offers in these groups. It's free and you can get a lot of leads plus it increases your visibility. I love LinkedIn and I highly recommend it. Hope this helps.

    Best Regards,
    Jonathan
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  • Profile picture of the author stranger11
    jslim,

    Do you use JD's script? I have been using the one in his ebook, but was wondering if there is more to it. I guess the script does not matter much, since it does not require much convincing, they can either work with you or they can't.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by stranger11 View Post

      I guess the script does not matter much, since it does not require much convincing, they can either work with you or they can't.
      Thats the truth. If they have distressed inventory then they definitely want to talk to you, and if they dont they just dont. You are spot on here. The only thing that matters to them is that you know where buyers are.

      I've really been debating on doing another report on this but not sure its worth it. Have one half finished, if I thought there was a ton of interest I would go ahead and finish it and release, because my mailbox blows up with questions on this, and they usually come in a volume of like 6-8 questions per email and require long answers...
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      • Profile picture of the author EricGuimond
        I'm planning on starting to call soon, I practised cold calling for my business first and ended up being slamed with work between that and other advertisements.

        As for script, I just sold quite a few services using a crappy script I put together on my limited knowledge of cold calling so I'm sure JD's script will getttt errr doneee. Look forward to testing it out now!

        Will update once I'ved tried it out for a week or so.

        -Eric
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          Originally Posted by EricGuimond View Post

          I'm planning on starting to call soon, I practised cold calling for my business first and ended up being slamed with work between that and other advertisements.

          As for script, I just sold quite a few services using a crappy script I put together on my limited knowledge of cold calling so I'm sure JD's script will getttt errr doneee. Look forward to testing it out now!

          Will update once I'ved tried it out for a week or so.

          -Eric
          Good deal Eric, Im sure you will find the same thing everyone else has found; that it works!

          May the force be with you.
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      • Profile picture of the author stranger11
        JD,

        If you are getting that many PMs there is definitely interest. However, there may be more PMs after you release the report.

        If you decide to go ahead with it, the main things I would like to see are:
        1-who to contact, getting leads, types of manufacturers or liquidators or wholesalers to contact, with specific keywords the way they should be searched, niches to target
        2-A basic script. The last report it was more of a do this, say this, but maybe a more formal one, with just a simple way of explaining what you are offering. I kind of modified yours to make it more to the point.
        3-I guess since you are getting so many questions, find some common ones and address those.

        If you choose not to finish the report, that's fine too, it's really on us to make the calls. The rest can be learned on a trial and error basis.

        Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

        I've really been debating on doing another report on this but not sure its worth it. Have one half finished, if I thought there was a ton of interest I would go ahead and finish it and release, because my mailbox blows up with questions on this, and they usually come in a volume of like 6-8 questions per email and require long answers...
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          Originally Posted by stranger11 View Post

          JD,

          If you are getting that many PMs there is definitely interest. However, there may be more PMs after you release the report.

          If you decide to go ahead with it, the main things I would like to see are:
          1-who to contact, getting leads, types of manufacturers or liquidators or wholesalers to contact, with specific keywords the way they should be searched, niches to target
          2-A basic script. The last report it was more of a do this, say this, but maybe a more formal one, with just a simple way of explaining what you are offering. I kind of modified yours to make it more to the point.
          3-I guess since you are getting so many questions, find some common ones and address those.

          If you choose not to finish the report, that's fine too, it's really on us to make the calls. The rest can be learned on a trial and error basis.
          Thats the reason I was considering doing another one. The last report lays out a more straight forward focused system than alot of others do on the subject, but I mixed all my personal sales stories in it, and examples of email trails from customers... it was a little hard for some to follow because it wasnt as bulleted as I should have made it... Thanks for the input.

          Also it only highlighted the main approach I use... I talked about my own backward supply vs. demand approach, however I have used the regular approach of supply vs demand also, and that seems to make more sense to people, and is easier for them to pick up.

          I feel like I should have elaborated a bit on regular first line product brokering relationships as well, aside from strictly "liquidation" deals.

          1: The system absolutely works, in a simple way.
          2: I think the long way I went around explaining it was a bit confusing for some.

          Been meaning to get around to this. I guess there is no time like the present. Since the last one I have answered a hundred questions, so I feel like I can fill in the missing pieces better now, knowing what questions people had afterward, which may reduce the PMs. lol

          Again, thanks for the input.

          -John

          Ps. Its not that the concept is rocket science, it's just that when it came out, it was a new idea to people at the WF, unlike the common "Offline" web sales...

          Any more input you have would be valued.
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          • Profile picture of the author wesb
            If you choose to do another report please keep me i mind. I will pm you my email address to add to your list just in case. Thanks.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    John could you please PM me with a link to your WSO? I have always had an interest in this biz model and i am enjoying this thread. Thanks!
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      John could you please PM me with a link to your WSO? I have always had an interest in this biz model and i am enjoying this thread. Thanks!
      Gimme a few days, Im going to rewrite a new version. Sure, will PM when I get it finished. Thanks for the interest.
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      • Profile picture of the author Tim Bazley
        Hi John

        Can you PM me when it's ready too.

        By the way, when doing these brokering deals, who deals with the shipping, inport/export legalities, Waybills and all that stuff?

        Thanks

        Tim
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          Originally Posted by Tim Bazley View Post

          Hi John

          Can you PM me when it's ready too.

          By the way, when doing these brokering deals, who deals with the shipping, inport/export legalities, Waybills and all that stuff?

          Thanks

          Tim
          Sure Tim,

          To answer your question,

          Usually the shipping is included in the price quote, for example; if you have a few containers (ie; truckloads) of product that you represent, and a potential buyer is interested in possibly buying it (Let's say they are from China) they will ask you for say an "FOB Quote to the Tin Jian Port".

          What they are asking for is a quote that includes the price of shipping from port to port, in other words, the seller eats the cost of getting buyers product loaded onto the container, and to the port of departure, and the buyer pays the cost from the port of departure to the port of destination.

          This is the most common type of arrangement. This isnt nearly as complicated as it sounds, because its customary for these costs to be included in quotes, they are basically just asking for a total price including shipping.

          So, if the shipping cost comes to $2,400 for the buyer, and the purchase price of the inventory is $24,000 , then the quote will simply be for $26,400.

          As, far as the logistics...

          In most cases the seller is use to doing large deals...and they already have a shipper they work work with regularly, so when a potential buyer asks you for an FOB quote, you simply email your seller and say "My customer would like an FOB quote to Tin Jian"... Your seller will then submit to you a proforma invoice, via email, that includes the cost of shipping in the price, which you submit to your buyer for consideration via email.

          In other cases the buyer usually has their own shipper they deal with, however in RARE cases you will have to get the shipping quote for the buyer, in which case you simply contact a shipping company near your sellers warehouse and get a quote.

          An example of one of those rare cases, where you have to make the shipping arrangements yourself...is if you are liquidating say a retail store that is going out of business...one that isnt a chain, just an independent business owner with one store...

          He is use to dealing only with local customers. This kind of seller never ships any bulk quantities overseas under usual circumstances, and so he may not have these shipping protocols or networks in place, and so you may have to make the shipping arrangements yourself.

          Just to hit another point here.

          You can locate your sellers via either cold calling or email... However, usually, if you dealt with them via cold calling, when making the initial brokering deal, they will want to mostly email or text after that... because there isnt any sense in tying each other up on the phone all day.

          Small independent biz owners like that personal contact (As in when you are selling web design...) , but most larger ones who sell bulk quantities internationally, want efficiency, and they like short sweet interactions.

          Most "buyers", also prefer email throughout the entire process, and you may never have to talk to them on the phone in many (Most) cases. They tend to prefer email because its sometimes difficult to understand each others dialect on the phone, dealing with different countries... They also like short sweet lines, using simple words, because, in many cases, it's less for them to have to translate.

          Also the kind of buyers you will be dealing with are usually familiar with, and do the bulk of their business these days through trade sites on the internet, which has become the common way of doing this... and so everyone is pretty much accustomed to doing these things online.

          Usually after your initial contact with your seller, where you establish whether or not he has distressed inventory he needs to sell, and strike a deal to broker his goods for him, there isnt much phone calling after that, more alot of one or two line emails... in most cases.

          They arent usually very elaborate emails.

          You have to consider that most of your sellers are working off of blackberries and smart phones these days... So you just send them short emails, like "My buyer wants an FOB Quote to Tin Jian"

          Or , "My buyer says he is ready to purchase, but wants to see a manifest first".

          Doing these deals is alot of email back and forth. Usually you are working with several potential buyers at a time. So being brief is best so you arent blowing your seller away with 3-4 long elaborate emails per day.

          Another example:
          "My buyer wants to know what kind of boxes the product will arrive in...".

          The seller may text you back, or email and simply say "Plastic Gaylord containers on wooden skids".

          If you get short emails from your seller, it doesnt mean they are irritated....it's just how they do business in this arena, one or two line answers... The best thing you can do is to follow suit and fashion your emails the same way, short and concise.

          Unlike the offline sales world where we are real elaborate alot of times with our emails, these buyers and sellers are bigger ballers, and they like short sweet lines that are to the point and just directly answer their questions.

          Your seller appreciates you being brief... and he understands that he may have to submit several quotes and there may be some negotiating, that's just [part of the game when people are spending tens of thousands of dollar (negotiation), but he doesnt want a big parade, just short concise questions and answers.

          This is good for everyone, especially you.

          Back to shipping.... It's no big deal usually, except the rare case where you have to hunt down the quote yourself...even then its no big deal, you just call a shipper and get a quote, or email one.

          Hope this helps,

          -John

          Ps. As far as, import/export legalities, Waybills and all that stuff...

          Usually the shipper is familiar with "customs" related issues, thats what they do for a living professionally, and they handle most of the customs related things, on the buyers end they usually have their own customs agents as well. As far as import/export legalities.... Most serious buyers and sellers already know what they need to do and have their networks and protocols in place. You wont have to worry about customs issues a whole lot...its basically just relaying back and forth between the buyer and seller what each others needs are...

          Example: It may be customary for a country to only accept product on plastic pallets, or only accept wooden pallets if they are fumigated.

          Usually the seller, if he frequently sells overseas... is going to have fumigated pallets already in preparation for this, or he will relay to the shipper that the load needs to be fumigated... (usually the shipper will ask him if the load needs to be fumigated)... And the shipper includes that fumigation cost in his price quote.

          You dont have to deal with customs issues as a broker, those are things the buyer and seller handle. All you do is relay messages between the buyer and seller.

          -John
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Hey john i was able to get a hold of your old report and its a great read that i plan on going over a second and third time soon. And i appreciate how responsove you are it means alot to those like me trying to get going. My questions are: what are some suggestions for projecting the look of a professional and reputable company? Alibaba is also well known for scammers any tips on weeding them out? I know you said the email trails you keep protects you and your commission against any issues but what keeps either party from cutting you out the next time around since they obviously now each others contact info if payment and shipping info is exchanged between them?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Hey john i was able to get a hold of your old report and its a great read that i plan on going over a second and third time soon. And i appreciate how responsove you are it means alot to those like me trying to get going. My questions are A: what are some suggestions for projecting a professional and reputable company? Alibaba is also well known for scammers any tips on weeding them out? I know you said the email trails you keep protects you and your commission against any issues but what keeps either party from cutting you out the next time around since they obviously now each others contact infonif payment and shipping info is exchanged between them?
      Will come back and answer this in a little while, not ignoring...
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Your awesome thanks.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Yo john dont forget about my questions!
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    @ eniggma

    There are several points I could cover here on the “looking credible” issue.

    The first thing to say is that I have been a "gold" member at Alibaba.com, and I have been “verified” member, and I have been an “unverified” member. This is something I have done off and on for years now.

    I can honestly say that I have made more sales as a "verifed" or "unverified" member than I did as a "gold" member, which is supposed to provide all the credibility… In fact I made my FIRST few sales as an "unverified" one, then became a gold member, and it didn’t produce any more sales than being unverified did…so when it expired I kept on selling without the esteemed "gold" member tag.

    Thats something that trade sites care more about selling you than the buyers actually care about.

    I myself have about 5 Alibaba.com accounts that I have used to test different ways of doing things over the years. A couple of times, I even talked to my supplier and put accounts up in their name, in order to represent their product line with a credible image… and not appear as a broker, but rather as a company rep. You can do that too.

    If you are concerned about looking legit, then that’s one way to approach it, but I can tell you it wont matter much to the buyer either way. In my experience …. it always comes down to the deal itself.

    Im highly tempted to go into two chapters of discussion with you here about the culture of the industry so that you understand… it’s hard not to, so I will try to barely touch on it….

    You have to understand that the kind of buyers who buy secondary market merchandise overseas are many times in a position where they cant become regular first line distributors for the sellers you represent… they cant be as picky about who they buy from for various reasons,one of them being that companies who have product they may want to carry already have exclusive contracts with dealers in their region on first line product and they simply cant get into a regular distributorship relationship for contractual reasons.

    You dont really need to understand all of this from a functional perspective, more a personal comfort one, but I will still try to explain.

    There are monopolies on first line distributor contracts in various places, and boundaries that sellers can’t cross regarding their first line (new) product.

    Also, most of the buyers operate on a discount business model in the secondary market, which is what this is, and buying directly from manufacturers at full wholesale doesn’t fit into what they do, so they are accustom to buying deals through brokers and old school liquidators in overalls, who look like they spend half their life digging through dusty warehouses, and who “do”. Lol Despite the fact that many of them are millionaires.

    As far as coming across as glamorous…

    It’s hard to imagine but, some of the buyers in these various countries that you will be dealing with, might be making a $50,000 dollar deal with you over the internet on behalf of their company, but the actual person you are negotiating with lot of the time, personally makes about the same income in a months time that a “just over minimum wage” person in America makes in a weeks time. They aren’t concerned about how glamorous you come across, they just want you to be direct and answer their questions about the inventory for sale.

    It’s a different ball game.

    Appearances mean very little to them, more the FACTS of the deal. They think in terms of "numbers" , not appearances.

    As far as being perceived as ‘trustworthy”, which is your real question here, they know that in the end, the money they wire is going to the bank account of an established manufacturer, or distributor, not you personally, so that is a non issue. Those are details they consider at the end of the negotiation just before they write a check, and there are several points along the way that will help them determine if you are being real or not, and you ARE, so thats also a non issue.

    Buyers who can spend 50k aren’t stupid. The numbers either work for them or not. Most other countries dont look at the schmoozing aspect of business the way we do in America, its all about the deal itself.

    On the OTHER hand..., in cases where they ARE directly wiring the money to your company name (which wont happen unless you bought the stocklot yourself own it/and warehouse it, which you wont, because you are brokering, not spending money), you probably have an EIN number verifying that you are an actual vendor and they check you out through THAT.

    Other times, they negotiate payment arrangements so that the contracts are all signed... but they dont actually release the full amount of money until their truckload arrives at the port of departure and is accounted for before being loaded onto a vessel. they know how to make sure they are getting their product...

    If they cant verify you, then they create payment arrangements that protect themselves, and there are even escrow options, but that is not usually the case. Normally you will get paid when the deal is agreed upon, because they know the money is not going to you, its going to an established seller.

    In our case, as brokers, they will always be writing the check out to an established corporation that they can easily verify. For example, I use to broker product for “Brewster Wallcoverings” a major wallpaper manufacturer… The buyers didn’t care if I was operating from a spare bedroom..., the important fact was that, they were writing the check to The Brewster Corporation and entering a contract with THEM , not me. My own deal was with BREWSTER , not the buyer.

    Now, as far as ”cutting out the middle man”.

    This is an industry largely built on the old fashion “Good faith” system. I have never had a problem with this myself. Basically the sellers VALUE you, they don’t want to make deals around your back because you do good work for them and they don’t want to burn bridges or draw legal heat to themselves.

    On the "buyers" end, most of them don’t want to blow a good connection. Generally, as a first time buyer, they are just as concerned about being well perceived, as a buyer, as you are concerned about being well perceived as a broker. Again, it wont take long to see that, it’s an industry culture thing.

    The buyers, like yourself, are trying to create relationships, and dont want to run the risk of being perceived by the seller as a scammy thieving business person... by trying to go around you, and potentially blowing one of the best connections they have made in a long time.

    As uncommon as it is though, in the case of what we are doing here, you are much more likely to run across a bad buyer than a bad seller.

    The buyers are more crafty than the sellers. The sellers arent trying to make profit, they are just trying to dump a headache thats been written off, however to the buyers its a big deal for them to be able to buy, and they are more likely to get a scheming idea than a seller is.

    As far as the “sellers”, this product has been written off on their taxes already as a loss, and if it weren’t for you they would just throw it away in many cases, by the hundreds of thousands of units, and that would cost them money instead of MAKING it.

    You are helping them make lemons into lemonade, or “money” out of something they would have otherwise thrown away, because they are desperate to free up their warehouse space, and every day it sits there, the product costs them more money... Thus they value you as a part of their network, once you show that you can make a sale, and they hope to deal with you for years to come.

    Example:

    How likely is it that a customer is going to try to by pass a new car dealership and go around them directly to the manufacturer so they can get a better deal?

    and if they did...

    How likely is it that the manufacturer is going to blow their relationship with the car local dealerships by making a pittance one off discounted sale to some secondary market individual buyer?

    How much does a manufacturer of cars really care about a $30,000 sale?

    Not much.

    They aren’t going to break protocol; they are rather going to refer you to a local dealer- one of their constituents. Likewise, these manufacturers are generally not going to make deals behind their constituents backs, and that’s what you are. You are worth more to them as a long time relationship, than any unknown foreign wholesaler who cant even buy first line product is.

    These little 50k deals mean nothing to them in the grand scheme…they just want the dead product out of their warehouse, and will need your service again next year. They don’t want to blow the relationship over what is a small deal to them.

    On another note, although in over 50 sales I have not come across one… I suppose there are bad faith sellers out there, and there are contracts you can negotiate if that is a big concern for you, which I will save for a report and not a post.

    For now... I will give you an example of a time when that worried me.

    Once my commission check was late, and I asked a friend who was more experienced “Do you think the seller is taking my money and running?” , and his reply was “ Look, if you go into a cage with a banana as a gift (customer) and try to make friends with a fifteen hundred pound gorilla (manufacturer), the gorilla can either take your banana and then rip your head off, or he can decide that you are the banana man and be your friend, in which case, now you have a 1500 gorilla as a friend”

    He closed that statement with saying “It’s not likely that a manufacturer like that with a rep is going to take the money and run and rip you off…. But if he does, that’s the risk you took for trying to get in the cage with a 1500 pound gorilla” lol.

    In the end, they paid me, they just had a protocol for what time of the month they sent out checks, and I was somewhere in the middle of the cycle. The check came a week later.

    Again, there are contracts that can protect you, and I will write about those in the report but as you can see , this is turning into a book itself so I’m not going to write them here, its getting too long.

    There are pro’s and cons to them…

    (BTW, by saying that "this is getting too long", I'm not put off by answering your questions, I'm just frustrated with myself, because I want to keep writing, once I start...lol . Trying to stuff the subject matter of several chapters into a single post is not generally a good idea, and sometimes does more to confuse than help with the understanding.)

    I have dealt with liquidators who use them (contracts), but I myself have never found them to be necessary, plus you miss alot of good deals by demanding them because sellers usually work with more than one liquidator, especially on the really good big deals, and they arent going to let a single individual liquidator potentially tie up their product for months, in the event that they dont sell it, when they could have 4 different liquidators piecing it out load by load the whole time...

    It’s the culture of the liquidation industry to operate on good faith, however some liquidators demand contracts, and ask the seller to give them exclusivity on the whole stocklot, in order to avoid buyers going around them under different company names, but most sellers will tell you to take a hike instead of sign something like that, unless you have a track record of being able to clear out their warehouse in a reasonable time frame in the past.

    Exclusivity agreements with sellers (ie; locking up the whole inventory so that only you can sell it) is the only way to protect yourself from one of your buyer prospects going around you and approaching your seller directly under a different company name , so that neither you or the seller know that it was your prospect. However, it is rare that that would ever happen for the aforementioned reasons.

    In 50 or more deals, I have never run into a problem with a seller knowingly dealing with a buyer behind my back, in fact once a buyer tried it, and the seller forwarded them to me and said “Deal with John”.

    As far as the scam stigma attached to trade sites, its no more than you would find on ebay or any other place where large bodies of buyers and sellers are pooled together... Just like on ebay, you have to watch for the signs. There is over 146 million dollars per DAY exchanging hands on just one trade site alone...and a million buyers and sellers. Per capita the percentage of scammers isnt any different than anywhere else, its just that they are bigger , so it seems that way.

    Hope this helps,
    John

    Originally Posted by kumar View Post

    Hi John,

    Since the broker would be dealing with liquidated products, wouldn't
    it be necessary for the goods to be quality checked?

    Do the buyers insist on getting samples or products QC-ed by a 3rd party quality control institute?
    Do you get involved in that?

    Also sent you a PM.

    Thanks!
    Kumar, sorry I missed you. Sometimes buyers ask for samples, and there are several ways to handle that. I use to get samples ahead of time from my sellers so I could have them prepared at my house to send, but then later I just switched to a system of having the sellers secretary do it, that way the seller pays for the shipping, plus they already have protocols in place whereby fed ex guys stop by their office once a day for pickups, so it's less hassle for them than it is for me, they already have systems in place for it.

    Usually online samples suffice for prospects, and whats more important to them is usually seeing a product inventory sheet which your seller provides you with, if there is one. Other times you may represent "As is /Assorted" loads, which dont have an exact manifest (inventory sheet) , those are cheaper, kind of like grab bag loads... the buyer has a general idea of whats there in those cases, but not necessarily a precise one.

    For example I have sold a few loads of wallpaper like that, and one load of furniture... I knew what general kind of furniture was in the load, but not the specific amounts of each particular line or the precise details. Again, these are sold at grab bag prices.

    Sometimes the buyers will ask for samples yes, and again, there are several ways to handle that. It doesnt matter that it will take an extra week or two to close your sale with a particular individual when you have to send samples first, because generally you are negotiating with multiple buyers simultaneously and it all comes out in the wash.

    I actually have a rebuttal I use when Im urgent to close a sale and a guy tries to hang me up for two weeks wanting to see physical samples first, and a couple of times have been able to close sales on the spot with it, and by pass the whole process of waiting for them to get back to me after seeing physical samples. That can be a hassle because international mail can get lost for weeks on end.

    -John
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  • Profile picture of the author stranger11
    I am really glad I stared this thread, awesome discussion here.

    I am in touch with a few people now by email. What is the next step if they want to move large amounts? What questions so I ask? Do I just send them the list of questions written in the report?

    Also how do I confirm that this is a liquidation deal instead of wholesale since I am not familiar with the prices? I don't want to try to sell wholesale deals because there are already tons of those around.
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    • Profile picture of the author stranger11
      John,

      Is there any place where we can learn more about abbreviations and jargon for these deals. What is FTY, someone is pricing in $ CNF, what is EXP?

      Also, can you answer these questions from my previous post?

      Originally Posted by stranger11 View Post

      I am really glad I stared this thread, awesome discussion here.

      I am in touch with a few people now by email. What is the next step if they want to move large amounts? What questions so I ask? Do I just send them the list of questions written in the report?

      Also how do I confirm that this is a liquidation deal instead of wholesale since I am not familiar with the prices? I don't want to try to sell wholesale deals because there are already tons of those around.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Great thread and great answers. Thanks John and I'll keep ya posted. I'm gona spend all this week reading over everything again and making sure I got the concept and stuff down. Then head to my local library which is right around the corner and find the registry and copy some pages. Then start cold calling next week baby!
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Hey could you elaborate a little more on niche selection like what types of stuff do you go for, what not to go for as far as distressed stuff?

    I assume you could potentially make a full time income with one thing, in your case wallpaper so any ideas on how to find and focus on distressed items with that potential?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Hey could you elaborate a little more on niche selection like what types of stuff do you go for, what not to go for as far as distressed stuff?

      I assume you could potentially make a full time income with one thing, in your case wallpaper so any ideas on how to find and focus on distressed items with that potential?
      I will try to address these kind of things in a report eniggma.

      On another note...

      You can also bypass all of this stuff and just make money offering to create trade site accounts for other people.

      Having been in this for awhile I know that trade sites generate more leads for business owners than average websites do, and business owners will pay you to set up trade site accounts and lead generating trade site listings for them.

      Not neccesarily attorneys and that sort of thing, but "manufacturers, wholesalers, distributors..."

      Yet, another way to make money with this is to simply poll buyers in any given niche and get their email addresses, creating a newsletter so that you can mail out offers every week to them... There was a girl once who sold me a few truckloads of product for my freinds retail store that I managed..., in fact Im still on her list. She sold home decor loads, and still does, via an email newsletter.

      She picked up my email addy on Alibaba, and asked me if she could email me some info on some loads she had available.

      Every week she sends out an email on the new product she has availaible. Seeing her idea, I had a thought at that time to start my own email list, but I didnt know how she did it without getting sent to spam, because most AR systems require optins... But nowadays there are alot of options for starting an email list without having to have someone optin themselves, and you can create email lists without your customer having to go to a site and optin.

      Lets say you pick a niche like "T-Shirts" , there are a thousand t-shirt buyers out there on these trade sites, it's easy enough to ask them "Hey can I email you some specs on a load I have available that might interest you?" And put them into your list. from then on you can email them every time you have a new offer on tshirts or whatever...

      There really are alot of ways you can approach this, and before anyone asks; "YES" I have made money (Over $1,000) for setting up an Alibaba site for another company before.... Just for setting up their account, and yes it does generate leads for them to this very day.

      I think there is more money making potential in actually being the broker for their product (also more work), but you CAN make money just setting up Trade site accounts for them as well... And you WILL generate more leads for them, FASTER than you could generate by building a site for them from scratch.

      I suppose that you could also use that success to upsell them more design services down the road if you pursue it, because they ARE going to be impressed when leads start coming in for them virtually over night, and they will absolutely think you are an online authority because of it.

      If you set up a trade site account for someone, it would be next to impossible for them not to start generating leads from it immediately, whereas it may take weeks or months for a "website" to start generating leads. These sites will start generating them within a week easily, in any decent niche where there is reasonable demand, regardless of the competition.

      There's just a couple more ideas for anyone reading.

      -John
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Thx again for your response man.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Hey john any idea if you think you'll write that report on the details of niche selection. I really dont want to get hung up on this but at the same time I dont want to go after a niche that's a waste of time? Could you provide just a few more basic guidelines here?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Hey john any idea if you think you'll write that report on the details of niche selection. I really dont want to get hung up on this but at the same time I dont want to go after a niche that's a waste of time? Could you provide just a few more basic guidelines here?
      Well, my own way of doing it in the past has changed a bit, and people didnt really "get" the way I did it, but I understand where you are coming from

      Think of niche selection like this:

      When you go to a dollar store, or a discount store of any kind, you are going to see five different brands of garden hoses, and 4 different brands of silverware, and lawn care tools, and plush toys, and garbage bags, and steering wheel covers... There are literally a thousand products or maybe even 10,000 products in a "discount" store.

      Unlike a "retail" store, those stores are selling "secondary market product", most of which was bought in large quantities of hundreds of thousands of units, from manufacturers liquidations.

      How else do you think a dollar store would be able to sell a product for one dollar, that you can see sells in "retail" stores for $10.00?

      It's because it is distressed inventory from last year that some manufacturer or distributors has left over and they had to dump it for 5 cents per unit in order to clear their warehouse, so the dollar store got a good deal from them on last years excess inventory, probably the dollar store paid more like 15 cents per unit, and the broker who located the stocklot (YOU) probably negotiated it for 5 cents per unit with the manufacturer.

      Thats how $10.00 retail products end up in a dollar store selling for $1.00

      Someone sold them those stocklots, it is likely a person like yourself who located a distressed inventory and is marketing it to secondary market buyers like the distributors who stock those stores.

      As you can see , there are literally tens , if not hundreds of thousands of these kinds of products in discount stores all over the world, so there is no shortage of them to find.

      So , if you go into any discount store, and look around you will see the perfect niches all around you in the thousands.

      On another note, you can also go to a trade site and see what people are making buying requests for... When you see somjething in demand, then you know there are alot of people interested in it.

      Doesnt matter if there are a ton of suppliers, because you know how to "buy" lower, and give them a better deal than everyone else.

      This may sound like a contradiction to what I taught in the first report admittedly , but that wasnt easily understood by alot of people, so Im going a different route of explaining this time.

      My own way of doing it in the past was to sell what you can get cheaply, on the basis of price, sort of a reverse of supply verses demand... Selling on the basis of price will make you sales alone. "distressed" inventory would indicate that the supply was bigger than the demand... however, when you add the price arbitrage factor, the demand suddenly becomes higher.

      However, we are going to explain it in the regular terms of supply and demand this time, because that makes more sense to people, and works just as well , if not better.

      To explain the way I explained it in the first report, in a word...

      Sam Walton said that nobody is interested in "leg warmers" anymore at even $1.00 per pair, if you put them in a retail store. But if you can sell them ten pairs for a dollar, in a discount store, and they do it just because it looks like a good deal alone.

      They dont get much smarter than Sam Walton was.

      On a more "bulk sales" note, leg warmers may still seem useless in this day and age, but if you can buy them at one cent per pair just to help some warehouse unload them, someone out there will buy them from you at two cents per pair... in bulk quantities.

      So there are various ways to approach it.

      For most people who dont understand the concept that wholesalers often buy useless products many times on "price" motivation alone (which they will come to understand through experience) I would go with the first way, just so you can grasp it more easily...because that will motivate you to action.

      Go look around in some discount stores...you will see that there is literally an endless supply of good niches to pursue, almost all discount store products were sold to them by liquidators or brokers...

      Literally anything that is produced and sold in high quantities. Any manufacturer that caters to large quantity buyers, will have excess at the end of the year that they are desperate to unload for pennies on the dollar.

      Hope this helps.

      Glad YOU asked, before some troll tried to come and bait me. Now we have that out of the way.

      John
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      • Profile picture of the author kumar
        Originally Posted by John Durham View Post


        So , if you go into any discount store, and look around you will see the perfect niches all around you in the thousands.

        On another note, you can also go to a trade site and see what people are making buying requests for... When you see somjething in demand, then you know there are alot of people interested in it.

        Doesnt matter if there are a ton of suppliers, because you know how to "buy" lower, and give them a better deal than everyone else.

        John
        John,

        That makes a better deal only if the buyer is indeed looking for liquidated stuff, isn't it?

        I am assuming that a lot of liquidated goods consist of products that were shelf pulled or customer returned and are thus inferior in quality or value to stuff that is available in primary markets.

        If that's the case, do you only target buyers who explicitly mention they are looking for closeouts and liquidation products?
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          Originally Posted by kumar View Post

          John,

          That makes a better deal only if the buyer is indeed looking for liquidated stuff, isn't it?

          I am assuming that a lot of liquidated goods consist of products that were shelf pulled or customer returned and are thus inferior in quality or value to stuff that is available in primary markets.

          If that's the case, do you only target buyers who explicitly mention they are looking for closeouts and liquidation products?
          Your market is primarily wholesale distributors, and independent discount retailers with small chains, or even large corporate discount retailers, which is what MANY of the buyers on trade sites are.

          You dont necessarily need to know what they are in order to approach them , as long as their listings say they buy the kind of product you are selling, but just for some education:

          Secondary market closeout buyers (the kind Im referring to as wholesale distributors) specialize in buying closeout merchandise at just over liquidation prices, so that they can distribute it to the network of discount stores, and outlets that they serve, or to stock their own small chains.

          To understand how big that market is, lets just look at one single discount store alone... How many products does a variety store usually have in it?

          A thousand different products maybe?

          Those are all things they have to "buy", so, somewhere down the line, that represents up to a thousand different salesman or "sources" selling them products, either directly or indirectly.

          However, there are also first line product buyers you can market to as well on trade sites. Most of the listings arent going to say "we are looking for closeouts", but still if they are looking for your product , then approach them, because even first line retailers sometimes buy closeouts, and not all closeout buyers specify that word in their listings.

          So yes, this idea is mostly focused on the secondary market, however you can also set up deals with manufacturers and wholesalers to work on getting them first line accounts too.

          Many of the people you will talk to are going to say, "I dont have distressed inventory but I will let you represent my first line product and pay you commission to find people who want to become regular distributors".

          So basically you become an official independent rep for those kind of sellers, you just may not be on Salary like the rest of their sales staff. However, you have a better chance of creating a million dollar per year guaranteed recurring kind of deal than you do with secondary merchandise.

          Thats another route you can go.

          I like dealing with secondary merchandise because you can mark it up and make whatever kind of commission you want to....instead of being stuck at say 15% commission or whatever.

          As far as damaged inventory or shelf pulls, its acceptable in the secondary market when they buy closeouts that up to five percent of the load or whatever may be skewed somehow... Thats the nature of it, because a percentage of it , as you said , is usually going to be store returns, and a percentage of THOSE are for reasons like the product somehow being faulty.

          That is generally acceptable.

          In fact "some" buyers will ask you "What is the reason the product is being liquidated - Buy backs? Store returns? Overuns?

          They know that store returns may mean a small percentage of defective products... but again, generally that is acceptable as long as it isnt 20 percent of the load or something.

          Good questions.

          -John
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      • Profile picture of the author Tim Bazley
        Thanks John for your very detailed reply to my last question.

        Just one more thing...how do you protect yourself and your sellers from scamming / theiving buyers?

        I presume no manufacturer would ship before receiving cleared funds. I'm talking more about having your time wasted by such people.

        Thanks again,

        Tim
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          Originally Posted by Tim Bazley View Post

          Thanks John for your very detailed reply to my last question.

          Just one more thing...how do you protect yourself and your sellers from scamming / theiving buyers?

          I presume no manufacturer would ship before receiving cleared funds. I'm talking more about having your time wasted by such people.

          Thanks again,

          Tim
          Hi Tim,

          There are always going to be tire kickers... and you have to pay close attention ( I hate to say it) when you are dealing with Nigeriens, although I once sold 17 loads to a Nigerien buyer, so there are good Nigerien buyers too... but most people are in this to build lasting relationships, so they arent going to try and go around you for the most part.

          A seller is not likely to go straight to a buyer around you, because, what if your buyer is honest and tells you about it?

          They dont want to appear dishonest to a potential buyer and blow their sale.

          A buyer is also not likely to go to a seller for the same reason, it's too big a risk...

          In general, when a guy takes a low blow at you, he runs the risk of making his own character look worse than yours, and he also insults the audience that he caters to, by showing that he presumes they have the same low character.

          The characters that run manufacturing corporations are generally smart enough to know that.

          However, for more detail, I answered this question thoroughly here. It may help you to get a bigger picture:

          http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...ml#post7827317

          -John
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Cool man thx. I just left a dollar store with my family to get some stuff and took extra notice of everything on the shelves. I was also looking on big lots website and looked over some buyer requests for the niche I picked. Thx for confirming I'm on the right track.

    Im gona make a supplier list tonight and plan to start calling tomorrow.

    Do you only deal with china as a buyer or other countries as well?

    Also how do you determine what's a good price to set based on the market and what's the minimum order amount and profit margin thats worth it to you?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Cool man thx. I just left a dollar store with my family to get some stuff and took extra notice of everything on the shelves. I was also looking on big lots website and looked over some buyer requests for the niche I picked. Thx for confirming I'm on the right track.

      Im gona make a supplier list tonight and plan to start calling tomorrow.

      Do you only deal with china as a buyer or other countries as well?

      Also how do you determine what's a good price to set based on the market and what's the minimum order amount and profit margin thats worth it to you?
      Its not so much about "margin" or "percentage" to me when it comes to "selling", more about the actuall amount of money i want to make on the mark up, but I try to "buy" (for lack of a better word, because I dont really spend money) at around 30% - 50% of the manufacturers cost, that way there is lots of room to play with pricing when I go to sell it...

      The manufacturers cost is the price that the manufacturer sells it to a wholesaler for in loose terms.

      If you understand the position these manufacturers are in, then its easy to see why they would do that.

      I have sold to several different countries, I really like Chinese buyers the best though. They buy ALOT of stuff, anbd they are usually not tire kickers, when they say they are interested they are usually really serious! still, all countires do it. I even sold 17 loads to Nigeria once.

      Alot of the time, it depends on where the offer is being shipped from, if itas too far away from a given country, then their shipping cost can be as high as the load itself so that doubles their price really. China buys alot from America though, that doesnt mean the BROKER has to be from America though.

      We had one warrior after the last report who was from Russia I believe and brokered a load from Canada and sold it to China (And made a $15,000 commission btw) ... So it doesnt really matter where you are from, more where the load itself is coming from, and how that relates to the buyer as far as shipping cost, as to which countries are most likely to buy from you.

      On another note: I had a rare occasion to talk about this email strategy which Im going to cover more in depth in a report... right here on this other thread, I think it would highly interest anyone reading this:

      http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...ml#post7799900

      -John
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    That is a great of gathering up the buyers first so to speak before hand. Sounds like great marketing 101 to me, find the market first .

    What do you think would be an easier way to start her method or yours?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      That is a great of gathering up the buyers first so to speak before hand. Sounds like great marketing 101 to me, find the market first .

      What do you think would be an easier way to start her method or yours?
      Well both her method and mine have a ton of similarities, the only difference is that she collect email addys instead of just responding to buyers with quotes, but it would be wise to do both.

      You couldnt really learn her method without understanding mine, because it entails more than just collecting email addresses, you have to know how to negotiate deals with sellers which is the meat of this.

      It requires an overall understanding of the industry. In the future I would focus more on the email addys though.

      At the time when I started getting her emails I was actually Enquiring on alibaba about furniture loads, so I found her through her AB listing, she didnt find me... She asked to send me an email of her deals, but I didnt realize I was going to be on a weekly list (didnt mind). This was years ago.

      At the time I thought it was a brilliant idea, but didnt see how to realistically get all those people on a list without getting sent to the spam box, and didnt see it as being well received on AB to ask everyone to opt in...Now , however, there are several programs that allow you to do that , so the possibilities look alot better, and much more easily doable.

      Besides , I was also in the middle of negotiating a bunch of deals at that time, and didnt have the extra focus to try it out.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Ok cool thx. So is looking on alibaba for how many buyer requests there are for a certain item a determining factor at all? Like how much weight do you put on it? Also how specific do you get with niches, for examples do you go after tools or down to just power tools, or even down farther to just rubber mallets? Ugh I can feel niche selection becoming a hang up, must fight it!
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Ok cool thx. So is looking on alibaba for how many buyer requests there are for a certain item a determining factor at all? Like how much weight do you put on it? Also how specific do you get with niches, for examples do you go after tools or down to just power tools, or even down farther to just rubber mallets? Ugh I can feel niche selection becoming a hang up, must fight it!
      Lol, you are going to have me writing my whole report on this thread...

      If I was in a market that buys gardening supplies then I would focus on ALL gardening supplies... For instance, I started out selling Wallpaper, but that same market was into ALL home decor, so I moved to also doing loads of house paint, and valences, and household decor, nic nacs... picture frames... Wall decor...

      Dont let niche selction become a hang up. Yes I feel that where there are alot of buyers that is a good niche as long as you have a good supplier or two or three... and you can sell the same products for less than everyone else can.

      Particularly retail store type product... I mean you could also sell office fuirniture from office complexes that are liquidating, or manufacturing machinery from manufacturing plants that are shutting down....but your repeat, and larger quantity buyers are in the retail market.

      You could even sell recycled paper to paper mills, but I tend to think retail is the best market, or construction products... like sheet rock, bricks... that sort of thing.

      General contractors tend to need large loads of things like shower enclosures... Dont get hung up on niches, just apply common sense.

      -JD
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Ok man, I will nail this. I am leaning towards mens apparel.
    I am trying to corral my ideas by making sure I can find it in a discount store though.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    If I may ask what drew you to selling wallpaper first?
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Does the process or phone script change much if you decide to go after first line stuff? I would imagine it makes it a lot easier to line up suppliers at the risk of a lower commission. But then you are directly competing with overseas folks now right? You would have to have slim margins to compete and still make money. A recurring deal does sound nice though.

    Could you provide an example of what you would include in an alibaba ad?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Does the process or phone script change much if you decide to go after first line stuff?
      Not much. generally I go after the liquidation stuff, and one out of every 5-6 actual 'qualified contacts" will OFFER it to you, and tell you that you can represent their first line product but that they dont have liquidation merchandise.

      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      I would imagine it makes it a lot easier to line up suppliers at the risk of a lower commission. But then you are directly competing with overseas folks now right? You would have to have slim margins to compete and still make money. A recurring deal does sound nice though.
      Thats the issue, you have slim margins to compete with, and your price usp isnt as strong, for instance; Chinese manufacturers have alot nicer wallpaper than American ones do... so if you cant sell on price its a little harder to compete. Most of my customers buy on price (as long as the product meets their basic specifications).

      When you are selling at the same prices as everyone else you are dealing with much harder competition. The opportunity becomes less unique, now you are in the rat race, instead of side stepping it...Most of these salesman for major distributors set up one or two major contracts per year only, so you may go alot longer between deals.

      A "one off ", $50,000 purchase, with an option to purchase more at the customers leisure, is an easier sell than trying to lock someone into a five year contract to spend 2 million dollars per year.

      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Could you provide an example of what you would include in an alibaba ad?
      Well alot of it depends on what you are selling. Your ads to sell should mimmick the buyers ads who are looking to buy, they are looking for something with certain specs, and your ad should reflect those...or basically describe what you are selling.

      Being too elaborate and playing with words is frowned upon. These arent opportunity seekers....they dont buy on emotion, they buy on specs...

      Hang a sec, I will go grab Becky's email from the other thread and craft it into a typical ad that you might place on a trade site.


      Okay, here is an example of an email I received from her:

      Guys and Gals,

      Have a couple of loads of overstock merchandise from Home Decorators Collection. This merchandise is coming from Monticello, AR 71655. The manifest is attached.

      I'm selling this load at 10% of retail - heck of a deal for merchandise that was not damaged nor customer returns. The load amounts to two full loads - 24 pallets each load. It can be split into two separate loads if need be. However, they need this merchandise moved very quickly.

      Payment is due prior to shipping. If you need quotes on shipping costs, I can provide that for you as well or you can provide/arrange for your own shipping.

      If you are interested, please contact me as soon as possible. Would like to see these loads moved before the end of the week.

      Thanks so much,

      Becky


      Notice how she says "They" need to move the loads quickly, as opposed to "I". She is a broker.

      Her email, is actually almost a perfect example of an ad, you could take it and stick it on a trade site and it would be almost perfect. The only difference is that its a bit more personal in feeling, because she is sending it to her regular list of subscribers.

      You dont want alot of personality in the ads, just specs that describe what you have and what you want to do with it. The ads are more cut and dry, because these arent end consumers, they are big buyers who make big buying decisions, based on specs and demographics, and they just want the facts. They dont appreciate your trying to color things up and cloud their judgement... Generally they KNOW what they are looking at , if you just list the specs they need to see.

      Here is how I would word that in an ad:

      2 40' ctrs,of overstock furniture/home decor merchandise. Nice modern designs.

      FOB: Monticello, AR 71655. Manifest attached.


      Sales price: 10% of retail -

      Not damaged/ No customer returns.

      24 pallets each load. Can be split into 20' ctrs if needed.

      Looking to move merchandise quickly.


      Payment is due prior to shipping. If you need quotes on shipping costs, I can provide that for you as well or you can provide/arrange for your own shipping.

      First come, first serve. If you are interested, please contact me as soon as possible.

      -John
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      • Profile picture of the author warrior55
        Vow John,

        You are such a storehouse of knowledge and experience !!

        Thanks for all your contribution to this thread and forum in general!
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    I made several calls today and left messages. It made me think about how I should introduce myself like are there certain things that need to be in place business wise first before trying to work with these people?

    I appreciate your answers by the way man anyone that studys this thread and takes action can make a good living and i want to do that.

    Like I said Ive made several calls today on breaks and my lunch time at work. I want you to know I am taking action on the stuff I ask you and your responses.

    I'm not just sitting here thinking of crap to ask you and then do nothing with it.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      I made several calls today and left messages. It made me think about how I should introduce myself like are there certain things that need to be in place business wise first before trying to work with these people?

      I appreciate your answers by the way man anyone that studys this thread and takes action can make a good living and i want to do that.

      Like I said Ive made several calls today on breaks and my lunch time at work. I want you to know I am taking action on the stuff I ask you and your responses.

      I'm not just sitting thinking of crap to ask you while I sit here and do nothing with it.
      I will send you a review copy of the report, which will contain a couple of pitches, for free my friend, since you have shown so much interest.

      Some companies, are going to want you to have an EIN number, but most understand the nature of the brokering industry and dont mind dealing with independents as long as they can bring in customers.

      For instance, speaking of mens apparel , "MACY's" has a protocol for supplying liquidators and closeout buyers, because they consistently have millions of units left over at the end of each quarter... so for them it's worthwhile to have a full blown system in place for it, but you have to have a registered business and EIN number to work with them, which isnt hard to get.

      With a company like MACY's you are going to get the product for below wholesale at "closeout" prices, but not for "Pennies" like alot of others, because the brand has a certain stigma attached to it.

      Again, most of them will work with any little guy that has a customer, however some of them do require that you are a registered business with an EIN number.

      Thats the only thing you might ever need "in place" that I can think of. But even then, you dont "need" it. There are too many companies that will work with you as an individual, and never ask for that, although eventually you DO want to register your business, even if you are just a web designer.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Thx a lot man. I will register a biz name and EIN asap. In the meantime ill keep calling. I'll let you know if I get stuck anywhere else in the process.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Hey i read somewhere I think either in your report or your old thread from 2010 that there was a forum setup for this, your "students" I guess? This forum still available?
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    • Profile picture of the author eniggma
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Hey i read somewhere I think either in your report or your old thread from 2010 that there was a forum setup for this, your "students" I guess? This forum still available?
      John I would also like to know what keeps you motivated when cold calling. :/
      Made several calls over last few days and all I've been getting is voicemails or no's.

      I have no telemarketing background so pardon my lack of patience and perserverance. Not saying I'm quitting or anything but some motivational thoughts would do nicely right now.
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  • Profile picture of the author b5willi
    Hey John! I love this thread and all the questions you answered and I would like to get a review copy if possible you rock!!!
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Writing them at the moment eniggma, what you really need is a good calling method. This works like a clock so there isnt any reason you should be experiencing difficulties unless its just for lack of a good pitch, because you are calling as a "buyer". I dont think anyone who has ever tried cold calling on this has suffered from lack of response. You just need a more straight forward method of going about it, which, again, I am working on right this moment. should be a piece of cake compared to cold calling for web design or offline services. In the meantime I dont have enough specifics on what you are saying, how many numbers you are dialing, or who you are targeting to give back specific advice. In any event, Im going to hook you up, so hang in there for a minute.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Thx a lot bro. Really wana make this biz model work. Guess I'm gona need some hand holding thru to my first successful deal. :/
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  • Profile picture of the author stranger11
    John can you also include a basic email script?

    For the people wondering about niche selection, you can't really go wrong. Every manufacturer needs this service. It not really niche dependent.
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    • Profile picture of the author eniggma
      Originally Posted by stranger11 View Post

      John can you also include a basic email script?

      For the people wondering about niche selection, you can't really go wrong. Every manufacturer needs this service. It not really niche dependent.
      Hey there have you had any success finding a supplier? If so what was your script?
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    John any video you can add to the writeup would be a big help as well. Plus maybe a supplier or 2 that you've used in the past or that you know works with brokers would be huge too.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      John any video you can add to the writeup would be a big help as well. Plus maybe a supplier or 2 that you've used in the past or that you know works with brokers would be huge too.

      You want me to list my own suppliers and give their contact info to hundreds of people?

      Now I know you're messin with me. Lol.

      As far as the cold calling, it really shouldnt take much perseverance, you should run into someone who wants to talk to you in one out of ten calls.

      Honestly, the appeal of this is that suppliers are tooooo easy to find.
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    I'm joking. Knew youd love that. But really though the script I think is my biggest hurdle now. What I'm saying is most likely the issue. Looking forward to your writeup.

    Have you ever used liquidation and closeout sites like viatrading.com? What's your thoughts on those?

    Also do these suppliers sort of set the inventory asife when they agree to work with you? What stops the scenario of you posting an ad on alibaba and you work for a month to get a buyer just to go back to the supplier who says they sold the stocklot.

    Also how long should you wait to hear a response on average once you post your offering on Alibaba?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      I'm joking. Knew youd love that. But really though the script I think is my biggest hurdle now. What I'm saying is most likely the issue. Looking forward to your writeup.

      Have you ever used liquidation and closeout sites like viatrading.com? What's your thoughts on those?

      Also do these suppliers sort of set the inventory asife when they agree to work with you? What stops the scenario of you posting an ad on alibaba and you work for a month to get a buyer just to go back to the supplier who says they sold the stocklot.

      Also how long should you wait to hear a response on average once you post your offering on Alibaba?
      Checked out via trading.com, some of their prices look like liquidation prices "At first glance" , ie;


      Assorted Zalan Cosmetics

      New Overstock
      500/Case
      $0.25/Unit
      $125.00/Case

      It looks like maybe a $2.50 retail product, so they are selling it to you at about 10 cents on the retail dollar. That is not a liquidation price...Although you may be able to work with it...not because of the price/value ratio...but more because of the price/quantity ratio...

      In other words, its a good opportunity for someone to get alot of stuff at a cheap total cost, even though its not really a true liquidation kind of price per unit by most liquidators standards... because at .25 per unit, there isnt alot of room for you to mark it up...no stocklot buyer is going to give you 50 cents per unit for a $2.50 retail product... I have sold $20.00 retail products at fifty cents per unit and about them as low as 15 per unit cents directly from the manufacturer....

      In the above scenario, they probably got them for 5 cents per unit (at a real liquidation price), which is good news because it says that there are plenty of deals out there that you could find for yourself. The price of .25 is what you would want to sell it for on a trade site, having marked it up 20 cents for your own profit, and you would want to sell like 50,000 units at a time.

      I like this product because it's small, and you could probably fit that many units in just one truckload alone, and people tend to buy by the "load" in this industry.

      Another example:

      This below looks like a straight "closeout" price which is just below wholesale usually , not a true liquidation price like you would buy it for, ie;


      Assorted Boots & Slippers

      Shelf Pulls
      100/Bin
      $6.00/Pair
      $600.00/Bin

      You would never sell a load of these as closeouts at this price because it says 'assorted" which means there isnt an exact manifest, which means its kind of a grab bag deal... but even if there WERE an exact manifest, this price seems more in the wholesale category... They are advertising them as $600 per pair...

      Let's be generous and say that the shoes retail for $50.00 per pair, they are selling them for about ten cents on the retail dollar. A liquidator is more likely to give you ten cents on the WHOLESALE dollar.

      They appear to be in large gaylord containers which you can stack 3 high to a pallet and your average forty foot load has about 26 pallets on it

      At $1800 per pallet a 40' load would cost $46,800.00

      Thats BEFORE shipping, which would add another $2400 for an average overseas customer... and I dont see an over seas excess inventory buyer giving your more than $15,000 for an assorted load of shoes with no exact manifest- IF THAT.

      You would have to buy them at under a dollar per pair to really be in the liquidation zone.

      So, no, these arent really liquidation prices, these are liquidators selling the products to wholesalers at maybe just below wholesale prices.

      There are a couple of interesting points to make about this though.

      1: They have hundreds of products on their site, which they themselves are making a profit (mark up ) on, so you know THEY are probably buying them at liquidation prices, and selling them to ebayers and online discount sellers....and so what does that tell you?

      There is a ton of merchandise stocklots out there to be found, which can be bought way cheaper than the prices you see here. The market is huge!

      The second thing I wanted to say about it is this...

      2: They probably wouldnt let you "broker" them. I think you would probably have to purchase the inventory flat out, because you arent getting it direct from manufacturers, these are probably closeout sellers probably who BUY from liquidators (such as yourself).

      You can see from this site though, that there is a ton of deals to be found.

      You dont really want to buy and sell by the case though, you want to BROKER off multiple truckloads...

      Hope this helps,
      John

      Ps.

      A: Manufacturers are always going to try and rush you and tell you they have other buyers looking. Usually thats not the case.

      B: You work closely enough with them that you know how many loads are there at anygiven time, so there arent too many surprises like "Ooops, I already sold it".

      C: If they DID suddenly sell it, then your customer will know you mean business next time and move with more urgency

      D: You should start getting responses fairly immediately once you put your listings on Alibaba especially if you opt to "send out a buyers notice" everytime you list something new.
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      • Profile picture of the author John Durham
        To give an example, here is an invoice I sent a customer in 2009, attached to the bottom of this post. I dont mind putting it here because I dont work with this seller anymore, niether the buyer...

        However I think I was getting it for around 15 cents per unit, and sold it at around 30 cents per unit Dont remember exact per unit figures, but something like that-you can do the math), this was a $24.00 retail product... I do remember that my commission on this was close to 8k (you dont count the shipping cost).

        Anyway, There is nothing on this document that anyone could use to scam anyone so I dont mind sharing it, if someone contacts one of these companies, all they will find out is that Im legit anyway (As if it were the first time anyone ever checked out my credentials and references before :rolleyes: ).

        THIS is a true liquidation deal. There are THOUSANDS of them out there.

        Bank acct numbers blocked out...

        Beijing K-Fashion Trading Co Final Proforma-1.xls

        By the way, Blonder still sells closeouts, but I dont mess with them anymore because Lillis is gone now, and their new VP over this stuff is too proud with his prices. Last time I checked he had some person over liquidation inventory that did not understand the industry at all...by now they are probably filled up to the ceiling with distressed product, because that person really doesnt have a clue.

        I have cleared out their entire warehouse twice, back when they had a VP that understood excess inventory problems and wanted to get rid of it like a sane VP. The people in charge last time I checked will NEVER sell it doing it the way they do.

        Yes, this is a real buyer too.

        Ps. Duh, just looked again, the invoice says I sold it at .50 per unit, so I guess, yes , there is a per unit price here, I probably got it for $0.25- $0.30 cents or so- again, it's a $24.00 per unit retail product.
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        • Profile picture of the author wesb
          Nice Post John! You are really putting it out there. Thanks for the info.
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          • Profile picture of the author John Durham
            Originally Posted by wesb View Post

            Nice Post John! You are really putting it out there. Thanks for the info.
            No prob

            Tired of people saying I'm not legit, so I took a risk. Figured I'd give the "stalkers" something productive to do.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    This is a great opportunity to illustrate something else while Im at it.

    The above sale, was a Chinese customer, who purchased part of a stocklot I found in Cleveland Ohio I believe.

    When you find a seller with inventory to unload, you will ask them for a copy of the "manifest" , or "Inventory sheet" so you can show your potential buyers.

    He will email it to you, or have his secretary do it.

    You may require 3 or 4 different buyers to clear out his entire inventory because some buyers only want a couple of loads or one...

    What happened above is that

    A: I was sent the below manifest from the seller.
    B: When I found a potential buyer, I sent them a copy via email
    C: She went through the manifest and picked what she wanted out of the available stock.
    D: As you can see on the invoice she picked various things.

    Thats how most buyers buy...

    I believe what I just found (below) is the original manifest I was sent on the sale you see in above post...if you are really that interested you could match them up, but in any event this is an example of what you seller will send you...and inventory sheet of all available liquidation merchandise, that your customers look at to decide what they want.

    Copy of Closeout Inventory as of 072508.xls

    A: You Find Seller
    B: Seller Sends you a manifest of available product
    C: You use manifest to email potential buyers so they can look at whats available and choose their loads.

    Might as well make the most of the illustration.

    Very Simple, even though it sounds complex, it's not. Just a bunch of emailing really. I have never once talked to that customer on the phone, although I have sold her several inventories over time. 100% through email. Found her on Alibaba.com, found the seller by cold calling a manufacturers directory.

    I sold his warehouse out twice to several customers, and I only talked to him on the phone ONCE! That was my prospecting call, the rest was email. we communicated that way for two years straight. No phone calls.

    My work here is complete. Hopefully I have delivered value and something for you to look forward to.

    -John
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Yea great stuff man. Im gona read through it a couple times to make sure i got it in. Got an ETA on the guide youre working on?
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Yea great stuff man. Im gona read through it a couple times to make sure i got it in. Got an ETA on the guide youre working on?
      Yeah, a rough idea, but if I gave it here, someone would call me self promotional and get my thread banned.

      -John
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  • Profile picture of the author eniggma
    Feel free to PM me an ETA then if that's ok.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by eniggma View Post

      Feel free to PM me an ETA then if that's ok.
      Cool, Im actually not going to be responding onthis thread anymore though eniggma, although you are free to ask anything you want on the other, and I truly dont mind. The reason is because this thread got started on some questions that represent something in the middle of the process and I dont think readers are really getting the basic idea from it, as my answers have been reactive rather than proactive, and so this stuff isnt in a chronological order that would really give a person the idea.

      Hence I will be answering on this other thread, because it is more of the right order to help a person understand the basics: http://www.warriorforum.com/offline-...-could-do.html

      Thanks,
      John
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