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"Interview Method" Works! But Is There a Missing Puzzle?... (John Sprangler & Mark Sumptor Style)

by ej155
19 replies
For those who have a hard time getting conversations with business owners, one of the best ways to get started talking to them is the "Interview Method" talked about by John Sprangler. Mark Sumptor talks about the success also.

I've tried the "interview method" and found that it's quite easy to set calls to conduct a "phone interview" with the owners.

I have just done 2 this morning and have other appointments set.

My only concern so far is, I don't know how to lead in to closing them on my web design/SEO services for those who apparently needs help.

But again, I've only done 2 so far, so that's not representative.

The pitch for the interview is a free local online listing for businesses and I'll just interview them for about 15-20 minutes. 1 call went 36 minutes, the other almost an hour. So we're talking and they're talking about their challenges, their background, so they're opening up.

At the end just like John Sprangler suggested, I'd offer tips on how they can get ranked and promote themselves online, and they'd take down notes. But then I can't seem to bring up the fact about my services or close them without seeming "unnatural" because after all, it was an interview for their listing. And indeed I'm launching that directory in a few months once I have enough businesses.

So what do you guys think is the BEST way to LEAD THEM to wanting to get my SEO/Web Design services at the end? How would you "make the close"?

I know the close has to be developed throughout, and I'm talking to them addressing some of their pain about not enough advertising, not enough customers, and so on, but how would you make the transition at the end to go into a new conversation about your services and possibly ask for the money?

I know Mark Sumptor had done this repeately through the phone and make 10k+/month recurring. Just wondering if others are doing it and know what's the "secret sauce" in closing in this approach
#interview method #john #mark #missing #puzzle #sprangler #style #sumptor #works
  • Profile picture of the author KingOfContentMarketing
    I would have some angle going in like "Local Leaders" where you are interviewing local leaders in your town--maybe for a site you set up called AnytownLocalLeaders.com or something. Then post the interviews.

    I wouldn't make any pitch about your service outright. Make a real commitment to showcase real leaders in your town. After the interview, I would provide a leave behind with all of your contact information on it. Then say, "Thanks, Mary, this has been great. I am actively looking for local leaders like you to showcase on the site so here is the contact information at my company. Call me if you think of anyone."

    Local businesspeople will naturally ask about your company and that is your lead in. I still wouldn't make a sales pitch but tell them what you do.

    Over time you'll get huge credibility and tremendously raise your profile in town. Let reciprocation work it's magic and you'll get plenty of referrals and business.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    If you only talked to two people in over an hour an a half and didnt even get as far as qualifying them as interested prospects or not... I would say try a different method.

    You could have set 2 appointments with people who knew why you were coming and were interested in maybe being your actual customer in that time, by just telling the truth that you are actually "calling around hoping to drum up some interest in your services...".

    I would take the same hour and a half and run through 70 numbers instead of two, being upfront about why Im calling and not waste my tuime going the long way around... 2 numbers in an hour and a half is the REAAAALLY long way around, especially if , after all that time, you dont even know if they are interested in your services or not.
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    • Profile picture of the author TheBigBee
      I would A/B test a variety of pitches and premises:

      I think letting them know what it is you do up front can be really helpful. You can use a simple push-pull method, and DHV throughout the interview to get them to request your services by the end. Try this:
      I'd use the Jason Kanigan opener. Then...

      "I do online marketing for large (businesses of your type). I've been asked by members of the business community to figure out ways to help smaller businesses succeed online. The best way to help you guys is to collect information so that it can be shared amongst you. So I am conducting interviews with small business owners like yourself so I can write and publish some high quality content that you guys can use to your advantage. I'd like to set up an interview... How's X day?"

      If they are not interested in online marketing. They won't take the interview.

      Additionally, people want what they can't have. They've agreed to an interview with a "big shot." They're thinking; "hell value trade! I may get something out of this, and so will he." During the interview when you ask questions, try following up with yeah; "that reminds me of this one larger client (of your business type) I worked with man did we kill it on that campaign (cliff hanger) On to the next question. So use a combination of DHV (demonstrate high value) and cliff hangers to have them asking you; "how did that turn out for them?" by the end of the interview. Now they're interested. So you finish the story, and push rope them in... Pretend like you're learning as well; "I'm really new to working with smaller businesses, what do you guys typically budget for marketing" Or, you can ask qualifying questions in the interview - spaced out correctly.

      That's my two cents in Iraqi Dinar.
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  • Profile picture of the author misterme
    My hunch is it's going to work better for you to do the interview in person, not on the phone. I think you sitting there in the same room having them explain their marketing problems might create a better environment for you to bond with them by you making suggestions to resolve their problems. Maybe you can do it over the phone if you have the phone skills.
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    • Profile picture of the author ej155
      Originally Posted by misterme View Post

      My hunch is it's going to work better for you to do the interview in person, not on the phone. I think you sitting there in the same room having them explain their marketing problems might create a better environment for you to bond with them by you making suggestions to resolve their problems. Maybe you can do it over the phone if you have the phone skills.
      I totally agree also. The thing is I got 4 appointments set for today for the interview and it's hard to drive around town to 4 places to keep up. There's a guy on this forum called Mark Sumptor who initially did face to face meet ups and then turned it into phone interviews and made it work as well.

      Just thought I'd try and see what happens, but again, it's only my 2nd call so I can't be sure yet.
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      • Profile picture of the author misterme
        Originally Posted by ej155 View Post

        I have however got 2 clients by this brute force cold calling:

        Client 1 - $450/month SEO / around 2k website
        Client 2 - $1,500/month SEO / $1,300 website

        But after these 2, I can't seem to find anyone who can pay similar prices other than low ballers.

        That's why I'm wondering if this interview approach would be any better?
        I understand. But you do it in addition to what already works, not instead of. This is a mistake people make in my opinion: ignoring what works because it's not enough or coming in their preferred form instead of recognizing something's somewhat successful and just needs more development. So they abandon what works to attempt yet another new system.

        Here you got a couple of assignments and so you know calling works, it's really about getting those calls made.

        So if you know from doing it that, say it takes 1000 calls to yield 2 assignments where the average assignment is $800 month, you plug in those numbers to achieve goals.

        You might find it profitable to get someone to make those calls for you once you know what has to be said to get the gig.

        Originally Posted by ej155 View Post

        The thing is I got 4 appointments set for today for the interview and it's hard to drive around town to 4 places to keep up
        At the end of the day you'll be tired. But if you made good money, you'll gladly do it all over again the next day.

        You have to do SOMETHING. My God. A UPS driver has to make more stops than you and handle large packages in the rain. I used to drive a NYC taxi back in college and was on the road for 8 hours at a time hunting down fares throughout the night, making like $1.24 per ride. You're complaining about making 4 stops in one day that could make you $800 a month each.

        I was handling some of my current sales work online and averaging $132 per sale. So I decided I'd handle the sales in person. That requires driving, that requires time. It immediately resulted in average sales of $405. So I'm putting in more time and work, true, yet now I'm grossing 3 times as much.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Whatever happened to just telling the truth? Im looking for clients... You get alot more that way.
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    • Profile picture of the author ej155
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Whatever happened to just telling the truth? Im looking for clients... You get alot more that way.
      Hi John,

      First of all, let me say I'm very thankful for your telemarketing report Because I've been using that approach "the direct line" and getting appointments and made sales as well.

      As for this new interview approach, I thought I'd give it a try after seeing John Sprangler's thread. I am 100% truthful with them in telling them that I will give them an online local directory for free because I'm actually building one and will do SEO to rank that directory so they are actually getting free advertising on it. I'll set the site to be $99/month when I launch for businesses who want to join, but for those who do the interview in this pre-launch, it'll be free for them life-time.

      So there is nothing that I am hiding from them. They are getting exactly what I told them.

      Now with this opportunity while interviewing them, I was thinking if there are business owners who genuinely need help then why not help them with my service. It worked well for quite a few people on this forum, so I'd thought I give it a try.

      Lastly, the slight problem I have with the approach "just calling to drum up business" is that most of these people who show SOME interest are low ballers. They're looking for the cheapest thing in town, and they usually think anything above $500/month is too high.

      I have however got 2 clients by this brute force cold calling:

      Client 1 - $450/month SEO / around 2k website
      Client 2 - $1,500/month SEO / $1,300 website

      But after these 2, I can't seem to find anyone who can pay similar prices other than low ballers.

      That's why I'm wondering if this interview approach would be any better?
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    • Profile picture of the author TheBigBee
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Whatever happened to just telling the truth? Im looking for clients... You get alot more that way.
      Wow! I really like that! It forces them to ask a question... Nice.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      I wouldn't do the interview route unless you really needed the interview. For example, you also create CDs of the interview and include them as part of a package.

      And I would do the interviews unless the potential payoff id huge. ..several thousand dollars at least. Because you have to spend time in the interview..not pitching.

      Now that I've said all that, you need to get them to ask you about your services. That's the only way to segway into your pitch.

      At the end of some group presentations I'll ask "Does anyone have a question?"

      And I ask right after I said something about recommending that they get a service to do what I do. (and after me talking about my successful clients all the way through). Now, the natural question is "Well, what would you charge to d the work for me?"

      But you have to finish the recorded interview before you talk about having them hire someone (Not mentioning yourself) to do the work.

      You can't start pitching in, what they see as part of the actual interview.

      I've done it a few times with CEOs I wanted to hire me for a speaking gig. It works well, and then I have the recorded interview to help promote me as a speaker.

      But you have to get them to ask you about it. You can't bring up that you want to work for them.

      You just leave openings where the natural question is "How would you do this for me?" and "How much would you charge to do this work for me?"

      Figure it out.

      TheBigBee had a few good ideas that fit in here too. But don't ask the "I'm really new to working with smaller businesses, what do you guys typically budget for marketing" question. It's a dead give a way.
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      • Profile picture of the author ej155
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        I wouldn't do the interview route unless you really needed the interview. For example, you also create CDs of the interview and include them as part of a package.

        And I would do the interviews unless the potential payoff id huge. ..several thousand dollars at least. Because you have to spend time in the interview..not pitching.

        Now that I've said all that, you need to get them to ask you about your services. That's the only way to segway into your pitch.

        At the end of some group presentations I'll ask "Does anyone have a question?"

        And I ask right after I said something about recommending that they get a service to do what I do. (and after me talking about my successful clients all the way through). Now, the natural question is "Well, what would you charge to d the work for me?"

        But you have to finish the recorded interview before you talk about having them hire someone (Not mentioning yourself) to do the work.

        You can't start pitching in, what they see as part of the actual interview.

        I've done it a few times with CEOs I wanted to hire me for a speaking gig. It works well, and then I have the recorded interview to help promote me as a speaker.

        But you have to get them to ask you about it. You can't bring up that you want to work for them.

        You just leave openings where the natural question is "How would you do this for me?" and "How much would you charge to do this work for me?"

        Figure it out.

        TheBigBee had a few good ideas that fit in here too. But don't ask the "I'm really new to working with smaller businesses, what do you guys typically budget for marketing" question. It's a dead give a way.
        This is awesome Claude.

        What kind of questions or comments would you "sprinkle" throughout the interview to make them realize they NEED or WANT your service to help them?

        Because honestly, most of these businesses NEED our help, they're site is bad, they're not ranked online to get more business... but the PROBLEM is they don't even realize it and think they're fine...

        Btw, where is that video where you were pitching at a seminar and you had to delete a bunch of stuff because the guy in front of you did a bunch of what you did? Would like to watch that and learn more on how you make your delivery!
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by ej155 View Post

          This is awesome Claude.

          What kind of questions or comments would you "sprinkle" throughout the interview to make them realize they NEED or WANT your service to help them?

          Because honestly, most of these businesses NEED our help, they're site is bad, they're not ranked online to get more business... but the PROBLEM is they don't even realize it and think they're fine...

          Btw, where is that video where you were pitching at a seminar and you had to delete a bunch of stuff because the guy in front of you did a bunch of what you did? Would like to watch that and learn more on how you make your delivery!
          Thank you. But you need to do most of this work. I can only offer a few suggestions.
          1) It doesn't matter who needs your services. Nobody needs most of what they buy. But they have to see a hole in what they are currently doing.
          2) Like John says, don't quote price right away. You have to build value, ask questions, make he offer sound custom made for them, make it sound hard to do, talk about the rewards they should see. After they feel you are worth more than you are going to quote, you give them a quote, not before.

          Anyway, a couple suggestions.

          "Most fast growing companies have really taken a hold of online marketing. What are you doing in that area to get new customers?"

          They will tend to tell you, in their answer, what they know and think about online marketing.

          "Some of the CEOs I interview talk about Facebook and Twitter, what are your ideas about that?"

          You really just want them thinking about online marketing.

          "Many of my corporate clients like the results they get from (video/Facebook/mobile sites/online lead generation). What are your thoughts on that?"

          You want them to start seeing that they don't have everything handled, and that other CEOs do.

          At the beginning of the call (before the actual interview) say "As soon as the interview is over, I'll say goodbye, but don't hang up. I'll stay on the line to ask a couple more questions and you can ask me a question or two if you like OK?"

          "Do you have a question I can answer for you about anything we talked about?"
          That's about as heavy as you can go. Just keep mentioning that your clients are asking about this or that. Or your clients are getting great results with this or that, what is the interviewee's experience?

          But, these are generally pretty sharp people. If they don't ask about your services after they interview, it's because thy aren't interested. That's why I would use the interview itself for a secondary purpose.

          Personally, for smaller sales (Under a few thousand dollars) I wouldn't use this approach. It's just too labor intensive.

          Unless;
          1) These are big companies that will pay a lot for your services
          2) You have another reason for getting the interviews (like you are writing a book or creating a product)
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Im glad to see you have had some success with my approach in the telemarketing report. I wouldnt exactly call it "brute force", its actually the opposite of that, as you are just turning numbers over for interest, and not rebutting...

    Also I dont see how it would affect prices. That has more to do with what you are asking for, and how much value you are building, as well as what type of clients you are targeting.

    However, if you feel you need to try a different approach then go for it...Im just giving my two cents that I dont see the advantage...

    Good luck with it.

    -John

    Ps. The reason you had success with my approach is because its based on sound principles and a hundred thousand calls worth of experience.
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    • Profile picture of the author ej155
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Im glad to see you have had some success with my approach in the telemarketing report. I wouldnt exactly call it "brute force", its actually the opposite of that, as you are just turning numbers over for interest, and not rebutting...

      Also I dont see how it would affect prices. That has more to do with what you are asking for, and how much value you are building, as well as what type of clients you are targeting.

      However, if you feel you need to try a different approach then go for it...Im just giving my two cents that I dont see the advantage...

      Good luck with it.

      -John
      Thank you so much for your insights John!! You're always very giving in the forum and I've learned a LOT from you, and I'm sure many warriors know it too!! So thanks again!

      Would you expand on what you mean in terms of qualifying for the higher paying clients and building value?

      Typically, my line is something like: "Hi, I'm just giving you a call to see if you have thought of redesigining your website or promoting it on Google to get more business." Most obviously say no, but about 1-3 out of 100 calls would show SOME interest and say "yes I have thought of it".

      Then that's when I ask for the appointment.

      But I always also say my prices start at around $600/month because I don't want to come out and the guy doesn't even have $300. That had happened to me before. Drove 30 minutes to a Starbucks, and the guy said he doesn't even have $300/month to market himself.

      So that's when the problem happens. They always think the price is too high. And I understand there's no time to build value on the phone, I'm just giving them where my services start in terms of pricing.

      So with that in mind, what is the best startegy in this "direct prospecting"?

      With this goal:

      1) Set appointments
      2) But only set with ones who have ability to pay my minimum services starting at $600/month?
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    • Profile picture of the author AndrewCavanagh
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Also I dont see how it would affect prices.
      I hate to say it but how you approach a prospect
      definitely can effect the prices you can charge.

      A prospect who is referred to you or chooses to contact
      you after multiple contacts where they're educated on the
      value of your service is likely to pay you a lot more money
      than someone you personally cold call on the phone.

      That's because the process of building the value of your
      service and your credibility has gone on for some time before they
      contact you and they're choosing to contact you...a clear
      buying signal.

      Different approaches have different value in different ways.

      Most cold callers could be making a whole lot more money
      if they worked with skilled marketers to generate far more
      qualified and even pre-educated leads.

      The contact method is not the only thing that leads to
      potentially higher fees though...the type of business,
      the checks they're used to paying out, the money you
      can potentially make them, how cashed up they are are
      just a few of the factors that can make a difference in how
      much you can charge.

      Just focusing on approaching businesses who can
      conceivably pay you in the tens of thousands of dollars can
      help radically change the amount you can charge.



      In response to the original post.

      The biggest challenge with the interview approach is what
      you're finding...it can be a challenge to get the business owner
      to see you as a consultant when you're the person who
      interviews them.

      Talking about who you are and what you do repeatedly helps.

      And yes, as you're finding it's very easy to book appointments...
      a very high percentage of business owners are happy to do an
      interview about themselves with you...even if you email them
      first you'll get a good response.

      Kindest regards,
      Andrew Cavanagh
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Well, the first mistake is quoting a price before you have built value.

    Unless you are building value and pitching your services on the call...then you shouldnt price quote, because $300 per month sounds like alot if you havent made them really want the service first... or showed them any value.

    However , if you have had a chance to pitch them, tell them about all these valuable services you offer, and have them salivating to get started...then you have justification for quoting such a price.

    If someone calls me and tells me they are wanting me to spend $300 per month, Im going to turn them down everytime... The last thing I need is another $300 per month going out for no good reason.

    However, MANY times, I will spend that anyway if they pitch me first and show me that they are offering $1,000 per month worth of value for that, and make me feel like I would really benefit from it, and that its worth the money.

    You will turn off every person you talk to if you quote a monthly fixed rate in the hundreds without making them want it first. I would definitely save that for my pitch.?

    There are various ways to qualify in the appointment setting script, but I dont bother much with them because buyers are liars, and what they say to you in the appointment setting pitch is no indication of what they are really going to do at the close of your presentation.

    Someone could tell you they have a 10k per month advertising budget, and you get there, and they think $100 per month is too high.

    The best qualification if you want to do bigger deals is to know what niche you are calling, what kind of businesses, and what is customary for them to spend, what kind of revenue they generate... you do this in your list making process.

    There are going to be alot of people try to complicate this and tell you to ask twenty qualifying questions in your appointment setting process, but in my experience, the ones who tell you everything you want to hear in that part of the process are the least likely to do anything when you actually go to close them.

    Just know who you are calling in the first place. And dont quote price unless you are giving a full phone pitch because you have to build the value first.

    I have had alot of people in my time say "can we just get to the price"...and I avoid it at all costs. In my mind I say "You arent going to just get my price without me showing you what my service is worth first". Thats not fair. If you havent had a chance to build value in their mind first, almost ANY price is too much. Unless you are so utterly cheap it;s unbelievable.

    That would be like me calling people saying right off the bat "You want a $97 per month web listing?" They are all going to say no.

    But if I pitch them and show them the value of my service first, before quoting price, then $97 might seem like a no brainer by the time they see all that this listing offers.

    Car dealers know this. They arent about to quote you ANYTHING as far as terms, until you have driven the car and see how good it feels, and you have already made your mind up 80% that you want it.

    It's sales.

    Hope this helps.

    -John

    Ps. I do commend you on your success thus far. It already has put you ahead of the pack, and in the top percentile of people who desire to be offliners!

    Keep it up and dont let me discourage you with the critique. Im trying to help.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    @ ej155

    I would say just keep doing more of whatever you did to get the first two clients.

    When you say you got the first two clients that way, and now you cant get any more... there could be a few different reasons...But one mistake we fall into often (I know I do it repeatedly) is that we get something working then we want to fix stuff that isnt broke, or we let change creep in unaware.

    There is a law of numbers...out of 100 calls a certain percentage will end up being your average number for whatever it is you are doing. Let's say its 4%.

    So, 4 out of 100 people respond to your offer for an appointment, when you repeat a certain action, a certain way, a certain number of times, to a certain type of prospect (even if that certain type is the "general population"). That is your number, considering what you are doing and how.

    HOWEVER.... That doesnt mean you are going to find that percentage in the first 100 numbers or the first two hundred every time.... You may make 100 calls one day and only get one appointment... then on your second hundred you get 2, then on your third hundred you get another two, then on your fourth hundred you get 5.

    You are averaging about 2.5 appointments per hundred calls, or whatever.

    One day you may have gotten lucky and had you numbers come up in the first 100 calls, whereas on other days they wont come up in the first 100. Sometimes you even make a sale on your FIRST call. That's always nice.

    What we do alot of times though, is to think something is broken when that happens...so,

    We start making drastic changes
    We start dialing less numbers

    We start trying to fix something that isnt broken, till suddenly we forget what we were doing that worked for us.

    I would keep doing what worked for me, and just make very subtle changes to get a more desired result, but not try to totally re invent the wheel, because the wheel is pretty successful.

    The other way is to keep doing what you were doing but try to add some inbound leads with it that are prequalified... that DOES give you a bit of a different kind of positioning.

    I would start supplementing what already works for me with some other avenues, but I wouldnt change the thing that already works.

    It didnt stop working. Chances are something crept into your pitch that you werent aware was creeping in, and something changed.

    Maybe Im wrong, Im definitely open to hearing more and trying to help.

    You will love this, because I use to do it to people all the time.

    Someone would say the pitch wasnt working anymore for them...and I would say "you arent doing it verbatim anymore", and they would swear they were.

    I would have them stand up in front of the room and try to read the pitch line for line... and we would all learn from this together.

    They would miss or add words in every other line even READING it.

    They couldnt even READ it anymore...because they had become familiar with it, and starting making the points without using the verbatim proven words, and it changed...So why couldnt they read it verbatim?

    The mind thinks faster than the eyes read. They had gotten so use to the pitch that they were saying it differently even when they were asked to slowly read it line for line...in front of people. Even when trying to prove a point that they could do it.

    So, ask yourself what changes have crept in that are different than what you were originally saying that worked for you?

    Maybe you are losing some enthusiasm, or maybe you were emphasizing something that you arent emphasizing now.

    Figure out what you were doing that worked, and get back to it, then tweak whatever needs tweaking to get your price up. Looks to me like those two deals were pretty good rates. Making deliberate calculated tweaks for the sake of experiment is one thing; it's the silent undetected changes in what works that kill us.

    -John
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  • Profile picture of the author ej155
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    • Profile picture of the author ej155
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      "You arent going to just get my price without me showing you what my service is worth first". Thats not fair. If you havent had a chance to build value in their mind first, almost ANY price is too much.

      Keep it up and dont let me discourage you with the critique. Im trying to help.
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Figure out what you were doing that worked, and get back to it, then tweak whatever needs tweaking to get your price up. Looks to me like those two deals were pretty good rates. Making deliberate calculated tweaks for the sake of experiment is one thing; it's the silent undetected changes in what works that kill us.

      -John
      I think that's actually one of the things that I "changed". The 1st two sales I got the appointment WITHOUT quoting them my "starting price"... come to think of it, maybe I should just go with the appointment first and qualify them by their industry whether they have a high transaction value.

      You're not discouraging me at all, but giving me great tips to go further in this business, always appreciate your insights!!! Thanks again John!!


      Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

      "Most fast growing companies have really taken a hold of online marketing. What are you doing in that area to get new customers?"

      "Some of the CEOs I interview talk about Facebook and Twitter, what are your ideas about that?"

      "Many of my corporate clients like the results they get from (video/Facebook/mobile sites/online lead generation). What are your thoughts on that?"
      Claude, don't know how you come up with these ideas and statements as you do in other threads, but they are great!! I'm going to try to incorporate these ideas in my interview to "steer" the conversation in a better way! Always love your insights on many threads!

      Have read a big portion of your book Selling Local Advertising which is great with many PRACTICAL tips! Have also read Spin Selling a bit and How to Master the Art of Selling a bit also, but I think my main problem is still "how to build value" and "make them want it" throughout the call/presentation so the close is easy at the end. Any other suggestions or resources for that?


      Originally Posted by misterme View Post

      I used to drive a NYC taxi back in college and was on the road for 8 hours at a time hunting down fares throughout the night, making like $1.24 per ride. You're complaining about making 4 stops in one day that could make you $800 a month each.

      I was handling some of my current sales work online and averaging $132 per sale. So I decided I'd handle the sales in person. That requires driving, that requires time. It immediately resulted in average sales of $405. So I'm putting in more time and work, true, yet now I'm grossing 3 times as much.
      Driving the whole night to make $1.24/ride? Thanks for putting things into perspective for me.

      In fact, I end up meeting my "last interview" today in person with the guy and can totally see the difference between a phone and face to face interview.

      It's so sad how this guy got TOTALLY ripped off by Yellowpages and another big telephone company here in Canada. He signed a contract for 12 months paying $5,000/month to YP and BIG TEL COMP to do his "website and marketing and get them on 1st page", and his site is HORRENDOUS as he knows and he's not getting the traffic, not on 1st page on some major keywords, he's out 5k/month can you imagine?!

      Sometimes there are these business owners that really need our help but unless they can see the VALUE or TRUST that we can actually deliver, they maybe stuck with something ridiculous...
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      • Profile picture of the author RenegadeSC
        Hey Guys,

        Mark Sumpter here. I just stumbled onto this thread because like many of you, I follow John Durham closely. I love his report and if I'm away from the WF for more than a day or two, I look for the latest "golden nuggets" John has posted.

        So after reading the above comments, I thought I would clarify some of the confusion about the interview technique.

        First, don't over complicate the technique because it works...well.

        When I first read John Durham's report, the one thing that I never lost sight of was keeping it simple. Simple, Simple, Simple. That's because his advice is based in sound principles that are simple. So those of you that have my WSO, you'll note that I did all the interviews in person. I did it for two reasons:

        1. It builds rapport like no other. While direct mail takes several weeks and many contacts to get a reply, I can accomplish that in on setting and now I have their phone number, direct email address and CELL number to follow up if they don't bite on the first offer.

        2. I can read their body language as I'm interviewing them. In my previous life I worked in law enforcement. I've conducted many interrogations. During "Interrogation" school, I quickly learned that interrogations aren't interrogations....they are interviews. You ask a series of questions and you listen to their response but you also WATCH their body language. The body give clues about when they are ready to confess...or strong denials that they are not the one.

        Best example I can give you is to look up Bill Clinton's Interview with federal investigators during his impeachment hearing. Note the empty Pepsi can he kept sipping from every time he was asked an incriminating question. His body language tells you every time he lied.

        My point is this - if you are sitting in front of the business owner and you ask the first five questions (which build rapport), they will be comfortable with you. Even when they say up front ,"I ain't buying anything from you" (which by the way, I left with a $3200 check from that guy after using this technique).

        Then when you lead them to the last question, watch them take a sip from the empty Pepsi can. They know their website looks like shit. They know the have no social media presence. They know they have no way of tracking their marketing.

        This is the huge transition to p

        Load them up with how they fix it ALL. Tell them to take notes and show them, from their own computer, how screwed up their website is. When you do it from their computer, they know you aren't some computer whiz fooling them with your badass technology because they are stroking the keyboard and seeing their crappy results first hand.

        Then they take the ultimate sip by leaning back in their chair, looking at you and saying, "Do you know someone who can fix all this?"

        There's your sign...

        No one has ever showed them in person, how to fix what's wrong. You just became the expert.

        Here are the most common ones I hear:

        "Do you know someone who can fix all this?"

        "My dumb brother-in-law obviously doesn't know this stuff otherwise he would have done it"

        "Can you just do it for me?"

        And my favorite :"You got me...how much?"

        Bottom line...if you haven't mastered that transition in person, it is extremely hard to master it over the phone.

        I have since conducted hundreds of these interviews before I moved to doing them over the phone and closing them on gotomeeting.

        Baby steps...

        Get in front of the own a few times. I remember the first time it happened...when he closed himself by taking a deep sigh and asking if I would just it all for him.

        Some of you might be thinking...that heck with driving from business to business if they aren't buying upfront. But if you follow up by sending them something physically that helps like, "Facebook Secrets Exposed" or "10 Things Your Website Should Have".

        You already have their ear because you already told them what was wrong for FREE. You are their expert.

        As @Joe Ditzel (bad golfer) mentioned, have an angle. I use the directory method, but you can use anything. All you're doing is playing on their ego so they can talk about how cool they are in front of you.

        The interview is just a foot in the door...and it works.

        @misterme hit the nail right on the head...it works better if you do it in person.

        As for the interview itself? I don't record them, I take notes. Remember don't complicate the method. The interviews purpose is to build rapport...have a conversation.

        I hope this helps

        Mark

        P.S. Durham, you're the man...keep posting. We all need it!
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