Run, Don't Walk From These Red Flags

15 replies
The good thing about bad prospects is they often throw up red flags:

5 Signs that Your Prospect is Giving You Too Much Bullsh*t
#flags #red #run #walk
  • Profile picture of the author Joshua Lowenthal
    I can say I agree with the article.

    It really just ends up getting on your nerves the way SOME and I truly believe they are an extreme minority...

    BUT there are people out there that no level of professionalism, creativity, honestly, integrity, hard work, blood, sweat, and tears will ever make them satisfied and happy.

    Nevermind giving them the best customer service around!

    It happens :thumbs up: just keep on keeping on and try to help em out.
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  • Profile picture of the author Norbi
    The one that I don't agree with is:
    ----
    2. Bargaining. Namely, asking for a price reduction with no corresponding reduction in services, terms, value, or relationship. (Asking for a price concession "just because" is a classic form of prospect bullsh*t!)
    ----

    Especially if you are dealing with cultures that have haggling instilled into their brains, you are going to face these customers. I know I was taught to always ask for a discount, because you never know what you can get. The worst I should hear is "No, sorry." -- and the best case, "Actually, you know what..."

    And at that point, you have two options -- either a) stand the high ground, show your value and benefits or b) accept the haggling.

    Either way, I am not sure why they are saying to run from a haggler. That means you have a client that is interested in your products -- and what are you going to do? Just walk? No, you should close their ass for a price you feel comfortable for.
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  • Profile picture of the author Aaron Doud
    These are interesting. I don't know if I would run from them. Let me touch on each.

    1. Agreeing to sign on and then backing off at the last minute or the next day to ask for references, birth certificates, blood tests, or guarantees.

    IMO this means you didn't get in front of all the decision makers. "Mr. Customer yesterday you were ready to go. I pride myself on answering all questions and apologize that I didn't find out that these were important questions to you. May I ask what brought up these questions? "

    I suspect with most people they will bring up that (the wife, the co-owner, their son, their consultant, their friend, etc) brought these up.

    "Would you like me to meet with you & _____ so we can answer all of these and any other questions _____ has?"

    I'd say 9/10 you will keep the sale doing this.

    2. Bargaining. Namely, asking for a price reduction with no corresponding reduction in services, terms, value, or relationship. (Asking for a price concession "just because" is a classic form of prospect bullsh*t!)


    Or it could be a cultural thing. Or it could be that in their mind what you sell is like a car and something you negotiate on. And they have a reason. Aka "I want to pay the lowest price and not get screwed over" The biggest thing this #2 tells me is this author has never sold in the real world. If you have sold cars, appliances, or other larch ticket B2C items you know that when someone starts talking price they are sold. Hell if you sold well you know they are sold on the price so you just need to make sure you show them they are making the right decision.

    This isn't something you run from it is something you run towards. "Mr Customer it sounds like you are ready to move forward other than price, is that correct? Great, now can I ask you why you feel this is too expensive?"

    Literally half the time if you have sold well they will admit to you it is not over priced. Now depending on how your pricing works you either hold to price or toss like a few hundred bucks (based on a pricing of several thousand bucks) at them. They feel they won and you can move on. But whatever you do you have to do it consistently. If you hold always hold and be ready to walk. If you always go down in price always go down and hold at that number. You don't want him talking to his friend and finding out you held but gave his friend $500 off. I've had this happen before thansk to inconsistent sales managers and it is an integrity nightmare.

    3. Undervaluing your services, track record, and expertise. "I could do this myself, I just don't have time..." or "We've outsourced this to several vendors and have never been happy..." (Run, my friend, run!)

    Has this author sold anything. "I could do this myself, but don't have the time..." is a buying signal. Stroke the ego and close that dude. "Mr. Customer I am glad you understand what I do and how much time it takes. I understand why you don't have time to do it. When you run a successful business you need to focus on the business. Which is where experts come in, don't you agree? Great let's talk about how we can help you implement ______ for you and allow you to focus your attentions on your business."

    As for multiple vendors this is the classic bad buying experience story that once again anyone in large ticket B2C selling knows is a buying signal. They are basically saying "Aaron you seem like someone I can trust and I've been screwed over before." Ask them about the story. Agree they were screwed over (as long as they were). If not apologize for the fact they (the other company) didn't handle customer service well. Example from my real selling. "I'm really sorry they didn't explain how the 12 year roof warranty works. (explain how it works) That make sense, doesn't it? (they say yes). Now let me explain how proper maintenance can avoid roof seal leaks. (explain) Hopefully what I said explained it ok. My RV Techs will go over it in more detail when you pick up your new camper. And o course remember you can call us at any time and we can help you will any questions you have."

    The key is you show them you will be difference and your customer service will be the difference. I'd say 99/100 times the problem was lack of customer service from the other vendors (heads up to the low ballers here). This is an easy objection and one of many what I call buying objections. They only bring these up when they are seriously considering buying. Depending on where in the process you are you can close now. But I've had it happen early after the greeting and rapport building. That tells me they trust me and now it is just a matter of showing them that trust is founded. I can't think of a time where this happened that I didn't sell a camper.

    4. Telling you upfront, "We're notoriously difficult to work with / a control freak / a perfectionist / highly demanding - but don't take it personally." (This means they've been fired by other service providers in the past and they're prepping you for the same eventuality while playing BOTH sides of good cop / bad cop. Nice!)


    Holy **** another buying signal. I'm seriously starting to wonder if this guy is a writer or a sales professional. I'm guessing writer. Now rather or not you should sell them something is something you will have to judge. This can go either way but normally the ones who say this IMO are not that bad. It's the ones who never say it but "show it" that you avoid. Learn the difference.

    5. Using terms of false affection like "Big Guy'" and "My dear" or false compliments like "You are a great salesperson!" (Obviously, if you were a great salesperson, you would not be wasting your time with this narcissistic sociopath nightmare client from hell, would you?)

    Ok seriously this guy has issues with people showing obvious signs they like him? Some people will always use words like dear. Get used to it.

    As for compliments like, "You are a great salesman", in my experience these are honest as they normally have met crappy sales people (sorry brother but the vast majority in the sales profession suck and have been trained wrong). Take the compliment, explain that you are doing nothing special as this is your job, and thank them for the compliment. "Thank you for that compliment. I pride myself on providing the best experience possible. I appreciate the kind words and I am glad I have made this a positive experience for you so far. Now...." And lead back to the sale. The vast majority of people who say this are being honest and truly mean it as a compliment. And how is a compliment to you showing them as a sociopath(it's actually the opposite) or a narcissist (once again the opposite).

    Seems clear this author is neither a Sales Professional nor a Psychologist. And the truly great Sales Professionals are a bit of both.

    I can only assume he goes for lay downs and IMO a lot of lay downs turn into nightmares more than anything he told me to run away from. That or he just wants his competition to run away from these people so he can sell them.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mwind076
      Originally Posted by Aaron Doud View Post

      These are interesting. I don't know if I would run from them. Let me touch on each.

      I can only assume he goes for lay downs and IMO a lot of lay downs turn into nightmares more than anything he told me to run away from. That or he just wants his competition to run away from these people so he can sell them.
      In my opinion, his list is right on. I think you interpreted it that he can't sell to these people, or won't ever get them to buy...which if that were the case, your answers would be correct. The article isn't about his ability to sell, or the difficulty in selling to these types of clients, it's about his desire to have to put up with their unprofessional tactics.

      However, I read the article as "run from these a$&hole clients, there are other clients out there that aren't difficult, annoying, nit-picking etc (even before they purchase)." The bottom line is that, if a client does these things BEFORE signing on the dotted line, you are in for a world of BS the entire time you are linked to them. I don't know about you, but I have enough other clients that I don't have to put up with that, or want to.
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      • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
        Originally Posted by Mwind076 View Post

        In my opinion, his list is right on. I think you interpreted it that he can't sell to these people, or won't ever get them to buy...which if that were the case, your answers would be correct. The article isn't about his ability to sell, or the difficulty in selling to these types of clients, it's about his desire to have to put up with their unprofessional tactics.

        However, I read the article as "run from these a$&hole clients, there are other clients out there that aren't difficult, annoying, nit-picking etc (even before they purchase)." The bottom line is that, if a client does these things BEFORE signing on the dotted line, you are in for a world of BS the entire time you are linked to them. I don't know about you, but I have enough other clients that I don't have to put up with that, or want to.
        arron is spot on.

        Aaron, if you ever want to relocate to FL. I will pay your way.
        I will also provide great benefits and 50% more then your making now.

        Actually I believe you would make MORE.

        it is an open offer.
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        • Profile picture of the author Aaron Doud
          Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

          arron is spot on.

          Aaron, if you ever want to relocate to FL. I will pay your way.
          I will also provide great benefits and 50% more then your making now.

          Actually I believe you would make MORE.

          it is an open offer.
          I'll keep the offer in mind. I think in the long run I will end up in Florida at least part of the year if not full time.

          Thank you for the compliment. It made me smile when I read it earlier on my iPhone but i was not in a position to reply at that time.
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Guys; I thought the list was useful, although I manage clients like this without too much trouble.
            Except for 1. Agreeing to sign on and then backing off at the last minute or the next day to ask for references, birth certificates, blood tests, or guarantees.. I have no patience for this, and drop them. I don't even try to save the deal. You either honor your deals or you don't, in my opinion.
            But the others? If I grab them by the nose and twist real hard, they usually fall back in line.


            But the video! You guys have got to watch this! It's brilliant.

            The Vendor Client relationship - in real world situations - YouTube

            Ken: You never made me an offer like that. Now I'm seething with jealousy.
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            • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
              Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

              Guys; I thought the list was useful, although I manage clients like this without too much trouble.
              Except for 1. Agreeing to sign on and then backing off at the last minute or the next day to ask for references, birth certificates, blood tests, or guarantees.. I have no patience for this, and drop them. I don't even try to save the deal. You either honor your deals or you don't, in my opinion.
              But the others? If I grab them by the nose and twist real hard, they usually fall back in line.


              But the video! You guys have got to watch this! It's brilliant.

              The Vendor Client relationship - in real world situations - YouTube

              Ken: You never made me an offer like that. Now I'm seething with jealousy.
              Brotha, even if I did offer you that. You would never take it.

              We both know better.

              ( am i wrong? )


              However. If you ever come to FL. You have a place to stay for as long as you want.
              AND i will do my best to show off ...lol .. really I will
              I will intro you to the crew ... and make sales on the spot,

              and then challenge you

              its in my blood bro. You might actually be better then me.
              I cant have that.

              So I will do everything in my power to prove I am better .... even if i am wrong.
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              Selling Ain't for Sissies
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    • Profile picture of the author bluecoyotemedia
      Aaron

      this is because YOU have real experience selling as opposed to these internet guys that write articles.

      These guys position themselves as experts when they simply have no selling experience whatsoever.

      Then they get a following of the behind computer don't want to see prospects face to face IMers and they all agree.

      all the points that you cover are actually common sense practical sales knowledge so its not like they are inside tricks or anything.

      thanks for sharing your REAL experience.

      Eddie

      PS. I recently sold my 93 black anniversary vette..







      Originally Posted by Aaron Doud View Post

      These are interesting. I don't know if I would run from them. Let me touch on each.

      1. Agreeing to sign on and then backing off at the last minute or the next day to ask for references, birth certificates, blood tests, or guarantees.

      IMO this means you didn't get in front of all the decision makers. "Mr. Customer yesterday you were ready to go. I pride myself on answering all questions and apologize that I didn't find out that these were important questions to you. May I ask what brought up these questions? "

      I suspect with most people they will bring up that (the wife, the co-owner, their son, their consultant, their friend, etc) brought these up.

      "Would you like me to meet with you & _____ so we can answer all of these and any other questions _____ has?"

      I'd say 9/10 you will keep the sale doing this.

      2. Bargaining. Namely, asking for a price reduction with no corresponding reduction in services, terms, value, or relationship. (Asking for a price concession "just because" is a classic form of prospect bullsh*t!)


      Or it could be a cultural thing. Or it could be that in their mind what you sell is like a car and something you negotiate on. And they have a reason. Aka "I want to pay the lowest price and not get screwed over" The biggest thing this #2 tells me is this author has never sold in the real world. If you have sold cars, appliances, or other larch ticket B2C items you know that when someone starts talking price they are sold. Hell if you sold well you know they are sold on the price so you just need to make sure you show them they are making the right decision.

      This isn't something you run from it is something you run towards. "Mr Customer it sounds like you are ready to move forward other than price, is that correct? Great, now can I ask you why you feel this is too expensive?"

      Literally half the time if you have sold well they will admit to you it is not over priced. Now depending on how your pricing works you either hold to price or toss like a few hundred bucks (based on a pricing of several thousand bucks) at them. They feel they won and you can move on. But whatever you do you have to do it consistently. If you hold always hold and be ready to walk. If you always go down in price always go down and hold at that number. You don't want him talking to his friend and finding out you held but gave his friend $500 off. I've had this happen before thansk to inconsistent sales managers and it is an integrity nightmare.

      3. Undervaluing your services, track record, and expertise. "I could do this myself, I just don't have time..." or "We've outsourced this to several vendors and have never been happy..." (Run, my friend, run!)

      Has this author sold anything. "I could do this myself, but don't have the time..." is a buying signal. Stroke the ego and close that dude. "Mr. Customer I am glad you understand what I do and how much time it takes. I understand why you don't have time to do it. When you run a successful business you need to focus on the business. Which is where experts come in, don't you agree? Great let's talk about how we can help you implement ______ for you and allow you to focus your attentions on your business."

      As for multiple vendors this is the classic bad buying experience story that once again anyone in large ticket B2C selling knows is a buying signal. They are basically saying "Aaron you seem like someone I can trust and I've been screwed over before." Ask them about the story. Agree they were screwed over (as long as they were). If not apologize for the fact they (the other company) didn't handle customer service well. Example from my real selling. "I'm really sorry they didn't explain how the 12 year roof warranty works. (explain how it works) That make sense, doesn't it? (they say yes). Now let me explain how proper maintenance can avoid roof seal leaks. (explain) Hopefully what I said explained it ok. My RV Techs will go over it in more detail when you pick up your new camper. And o course remember you can call us at any time and we can help you will any questions you have."

      The key is you show them you will be difference and your customer service will be the difference. I'd say 99/100 times the problem was lack of customer service from the other vendors (heads up to the low ballers here). This is an easy objection and one of many what I call buying objections. They only bring these up when they are seriously considering buying. Depending on where in the process you are you can close now. But I've had it happen early after the greeting and rapport building. That tells me they trust me and now it is just a matter of showing them that trust is founded. I can't think of a time where this happened that I didn't sell a camper.

      4. Telling you upfront, "We're notoriously difficult to work with / a control freak / a perfectionist / highly demanding - but don't take it personally." (This means they've been fired by other service providers in the past and they're prepping you for the same eventuality while playing BOTH sides of good cop / bad cop. Nice!)


      Holy **** another buying signal. I'm seriously starting to wonder if this guy is a writer or a sales professional. I'm guessing writer. Now rather or not you should sell them something is something you will have to judge. This can go either way but normally the ones who say this IMO are not that bad. It's the ones who never say it but "show it" that you avoid. Learn the difference.

      5. Using terms of false affection like "Big Guy'" and "My dear" or false compliments like "You are a great salesperson!" (Obviously, if you were a great salesperson, you would not be wasting your time with this narcissistic sociopath nightmare client from hell, would you?)

      Ok seriously this guy has issues with people showing obvious signs they like him? Some people will always use words like dear. Get used to it.

      As for compliments like, "You are a great salesman", in my experience these are honest as they normally have met crappy sales people (sorry brother but the vast majority in the sales profession suck and have been trained wrong). Take the compliment, explain that you are doing nothing special as this is your job, and thank them for the compliment. "Thank you for that compliment. I pride myself on providing the best experience possible. I appreciate the kind words and I am glad I have made this a positive experience for you so far. Now...." And lead back to the sale. The vast majority of people who say this are being honest and truly mean it as a compliment. And how is a compliment to you showing them as a sociopath(it's actually the opposite) or a narcissist (once again the opposite).

      Seems clear this author is neither a Sales Professional nor a Psychologist. And the truly great Sales Professionals are a bit of both.

      I can only assume he goes for lay downs and IMO a lot of lay downs turn into nightmares more than anything he told me to run away from. That or he just wants his competition to run away from these people so he can sell them.
      Signature

      Skunkworks: noun. informal.

      A clandestine group operating without any external intervention or oversight. Such groups achieve significant breakthroughs rarely discussed in public because they operate "outside the box".
      https://short-stuff.com/-Mjk0fDExOA==

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  • Profile picture of the author Mwind076
    I agreed that he was right...for the way he interpreted the article. It all depends on WHO reads it and how they interpreted it, and what kind of client they are out to work with. For us, we don't want to work with everyone that comes our way, and many other business owners feel the same way. It's all up to how much money you want/need and what you want to put up with to get it.
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  • Profile picture of the author saturdaygig
    Good list. #5 chimes with me, I really dislike when people start calling me 'mate' from the off.
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  • Profile picture of the author Aaron Doud
    Eddie,

    I love my C6 but miss my C4. My next purchase will be a 94 or 95 ZR-1. And that will be a keeper. Not selling that until I am old and have to.

    So what Vette will you be going after next? Was the 93 your only Vette? I can't remember.
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    • Profile picture of the author bluecoyotemedia
      Originally Posted by Aaron Doud View Post

      Eddie,

      I love my C6 but miss my C4. My next purchase will be a 94 or 95 ZR-1. And that will be a keeper. Not selling that until I am old and have to.

      So what Vette will you be going after next? Was the 93 your only Vette? I can't remember.

      Aaron

      My very first vette was when it first came out with the new design in 1984. it was fireengine red and boy it was a cool car. like all first gen cars it did have its issues. lights screwing up crossfire injection.

      so after 6 years I sold it and bought another cream puff 84 white coupe in 89 of which I relocated to texas for a year and Texas has some great constructed streets so it was a cool ride

      move back to NY in 89 and unbeknownst to me there was a stipulation that I could not carry a loan out of state..

      so the bank came and repoed the car

      I was working at a health club and my floor manager came in screamin eddie.. someone is stealing your vette

      so with a few bodybuilder personal trianers we all piled out of the gym and landed on the flat bed.. it was a site LOL

      called the cops and I almost got thrown in jail

      but the bank took it

      this was a pivotal point I made in my life that I will never carry any debt. where someone can take it away

      so I worked my ass off and bought a 1988 triple white anniversary

      wow!!! this car attracted so many ladies it was a blast

      sold it in 1992 and bought a 1993 black anniversary 40th coup and I bought it for cash

      this had been my last vette since i used it just on sundays and the rest of the week I drove a 1981 beat up 318 bmw

      fast forward 2001 I relocated to costa rica and shipped the car here in mint condition with less than 10,000 miles

      sad to say I finally came to realization that costa rica is a wonderful place but the roads here just dont cut it and finally sold the car a few months ago with 15 266 original miles

      brand new

      those vettes had lots of memories.. Eileen veltergen was her name and she loved the vette amde her crazy

      I had seen the same reaction with alot of girls back then

      now I am into mercedes gelandewagen https://www.google.com/search?q=merc...=2133&bih=1052

      but those were fond memories

      sorry for the ramble

      Eddie
      Signature

      Skunkworks: noun. informal.

      A clandestine group operating without any external intervention or oversight. Such groups achieve significant breakthroughs rarely discussed in public because they operate "outside the box".
      https://short-stuff.com/-Mjk0fDExOA==

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  • Profile picture of the author Aaron Doud
    Cars are supposed to bring memories and feelings like that. Loved the stories.
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