[UPDATE] Mr. Business owner, if you aren't tracking you might as well be wiping your ass...

49 replies
I don't see this mentioned on our section of the forums often if ever so I wanted to talk about it a little more.

I know most of us offer stuff like web site design and its probably the main core service we offer however...

One thing that I talk to business owners about is tracking and how tracking is a foundational principle to understanding the effectiveness of any online marketing they are doing.

I explain that truth be told they are potentially wasting money if they aren't tracking and testing.

For example I picked up a client just a couple of weeks ago by not even trying!

Here's the scenario:

I was reviewing a landing page for a client of mine and on this occasion I decided to compare my clients landing page to ppc landing pages of his competitors.

So here I am on Google checking out landing pages and I have to tell you small businesses need some understanding in this area yesterday!

The client I just picked up had a landing page that broke so many rules I had to pick up the phone and call!

Here's sort of how it went down so you get the gist of it.

I called up and of course I got the gate keeper. When she asked me what it was about I said, you guys have a MAJOR issues with your Google ad. Who's the person to talk to, I'd just like to point out a couple of things he can consider changing, "ON HIS OWN".

I get put through to the owner and I just say, I was working on a landing page for my one of my clients and decided to do some comparisons to other current landing pages and I came across yours, when I watched you in the video you came across very sincere and professional so I thought I should help you out by letting you know that you've got serious issues with your PPC landing page design so you are throwing away a lot of your PPC budget.

I'd like to give you a couple of changes you can make on your own to get better conversions. I'd like to show you using screen share, its private and secure. Just have something to take notes with, that's it's. Its up to you to take the advice or not, its not my ad budget being wasted.

The owner asked me how long would it take and I said, give me 15 minutes. He responded by saying he was about to go into a meeting with the sales force and asked if he could call me back afterwards.

Normally if I were trying to actually sell him something I would have responded differently but in this case because I didn't give a shit about actually selling him something I said, sure call me back!

He called me back and we did a screen share and I pointed out some things that are obvious to folks like us, such as page bleed and his video was showing related videos when it finished and a few other things.

By now you might be asking what does this have to do with tracking?

Well once I gave him the suggested changes I asked him if they SCREEN every call coming in, and if they know which calls came directly from the PPC ad. I already know they don't because, well we all know they don't!

So I explained to him the power of #1 call tracking and #2 analytics, and since these types of tools and services are available because of technology it only makes sense to use them to increase the performance of every single ad dollar spent.

The next words out of his mouth were. How do I get that stuff?

My next words were, well truth be told I can help you with that but I wasn't calling to try and sell it to you. Personally I don't need your business I was only calling to just give you a couple of pointers on your landing page.

The owner then just point blank asked me, well if you set it up for me how much do you charge.

I replied that I charge set up fee of $500 and monthly after that $60 per month and it included a private log in where he can get seo data, PPC data and listen to all the calls coming in as they are recorded.

So what happened next?

I faxed over the agreement with a credit card authorization form and we did the deal.

Now here's the kicker about this whole thing!

8 weeks ago he hired an in house employee to do the seo and online marketing because he felt he'd been ripped off by other SEO providers. NOT by the money he was paying but because of a lack of results!

When he told me about hiring his SEO guy I praised him on such a wise decision and that if he has any questions to just call me and I'd consult for him at my hourly rate at $250 an hour but that it was up to him and his seo guy to decide to follow the advice or not.

Well he didn't seem phased by my hourly consulting fee but didn't express any interest either so I just left it at that.

So it's a couple of days later and I've got them all set up, tested the call tracking, made sure the seo guy got it put on the PPC landing page, etc. etc.

Out of the blue the employee says, by the way the owner has authorized two hours of consulting time with you and I wanted to go over our Wordpress site with you for that time is that cool?

Of course that's cool! So we are doing it this Monday after the 4th!

The moral of this story is that I was truly wanting to help by taking a few minutes away from my existing work to just help him out. And educate him on one of the first and very important things he should be doing and that was analytics and tracking.
#business #money #owner #tracking #wiping
  • Profile picture of the author globalpro
    As always, great stuff.
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  • Profile picture of the author euraffiliates
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
    This is the way! Not giving a damn whether someone buys or not...not going in with the desperation to sell...having your mind on how you can HELP the prospect...charging healthy fees so that they VALUE and ACT ON your expertise.

    If you, dear reader, did this 10 times a day and got yourself into great conversations like this one, don't you agree that you'd get at least one good client out of it within a week?

    And how much money is that, compared to what you're making now?
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    • Profile picture of the author Aaron Doud
      Originally Posted by Jason Kanigan View Post

      This is the way! Not giving a damn whether someone buys or not...not going in with the desperation to sell...having your mind on how you can HELP the prospect...charging healthy fees so that they VALUE and ACT ON your expertise.

      If you, dear reader, did this 10 times a day and got yourself into great conversations like this one, don't you agree that you'd get at least one good client out of it within a week?

      And how much money is that, compared to what you're making now?
      Agree this is pure gold for those who can understand how it worked and why.

      Rus provided great value for free. The call wasn't about sales. And even when you call to actually sell you can provide free value. That value is what gets you into a conversation. It makes the person on the other end of the line respect you and want to work with you.

      The part I love about this is the fact that this is one of the best examples of a cold sales call we have ever had posted here and it wasn't ever meant to be a sales call.
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    • Originally Posted by Jason Kanigan View Post

      This is the way! Not giving a damn whether someone buys or not...not going in with the desperation to sell...having your mind on how you can HELP the prospect...charging healthy fees so that they VALUE and ACT ON your expertise.

      If you, dear reader, did this 10 times a day and got yourself into great conversations like this one, don't you agree that you'd get at least one good client out of it within a week?

      And how much money is that, compared to what you're making now?

      I would have to say that nine out of ten times when I don't even WANT to sell the prospect sitting in front of me, for whatever reason... They get a lot more open to the idea of buying!

      I think this is because of the low-pressure, but at the same time, if we used this tactic along with some solid pre-closing, in theory... We wouldn't even have to CLOSE the sale, the prospect would instead close himself and ASK for the order! Funny how that works huh?
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      • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
        Originally Posted by JohnJMJKEnterprises View Post

        I would have to say that nine out of ten times when I don't even WANT to sell the prospect sitting in front of me, for whatever reason... They get a lot more open to the idea of buying!

        I think this is because of the low-pressure, but at the same time, if we used this tactic along with some solid pre-closing, in theory... We wouldn't even have to CLOSE the sale, the prospect would instead close himself and ASK for the order! Funny how that works huh?
        Ahh...now you are on to something!
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  • Profile picture of the author misterme
    Good stuff, Russ. Are you going to try that approach again a more times to test it for empirical stats or are you going back to however you were soliciting before?
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  • Profile picture of the author bluecoyotemedia
    Folks

    this is the kind of feedback- REAL up to the minute street experience that should be praised here.!!!!! and it's people like Rus that add value from real experience

    not these regurgitating poops that only repeat what they read and try to pawn it off as there own with the added oh BTW I am offering a wso on this very topic.

    in fact there are maybe a few dozen guys here that we should set up a separate private mastermind group.

    why??

    because I believe this gold is valuable.. and should not be wasted on the masses who won't do anything with the information anyway.

    you guys know what I am talking about..

    the glen garry leads.

    what a great way to prospect!!! and I would guarantee just applying this method with an air of confidence like "I don't need your business I just wanted to help you out" will increase your sales closure tremendously!!!

    it has too, these business people all need our help.. its just they get tainted from all the garbage out in the marketplace trying to extract money from them.

    thank you Rus

    Eddie

    PS. BTW notice on Rus post NO SALES sig..

    PPS. You know I think we should call our new private group the Bilderburg Warrior Group


    Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

    I don't see this mentioned on our section of the forums often if ever so I wanted to talk about it a little more.

    I know most of us offer stuff like web site design and its probably the main core service we offer however...

    One thing that I talk to business owners about is tracking and how tracking is a foundational principle to understanding the effectiveness of any online marketing they are doing.

    I explain that truth be told they are potentially wasting money if they aren't tracking and testing.

    For example I picked up a client just a couple of weeks ago by not even trying!

    Here's the scenario:

    I was reviewing a landing page for a client of mine and on this occasion I decided to compare my clients landing page to ppc landing pages of his competitors.

    So here I am on Google checking out landing pages and I have to tell you small businesses need some understanding in this area yesterday!

    The client I just picked up had a landing page that broke so many rules I had to pick up the phone and call!

    Here's sort of how it went down so you get the gist of it.

    I called up and of course I got the gate keeper. When she asked me what it was about I said, you guys have a MAJOR issues with your Google ad. Who's the person to talk to, I'd just like to point out a couple of things he can consider changing, "ON HIS OWN".

    I get put through to the owner and I just say, I was working on a landing page for my one of my clients and decided to do some comparisons to other current landing pages and I came across yours, when I watched you in the video you came across very sincere and professional so I thought I should help you out by letting you know that you've got serious issues with your PPC landing page design so you are throwing away a lot of your PPC budget.

    I'd like to give you a couple of changes you can make on your own to get better conversions. I'd like to show you using screen share, its private and secure. Just have something to take notes with, that's it's. Its up to you to take the advice or not, its not my ad budget being wasted.

    The owner asked me how long would it take and I said, give me 15 minutes. He responded by saying he was about to go into a meeting with the sales force and asked if he could call me back afterwards.

    Normally if I were trying to actually sell him something I would have responded differently but in this case because I didn't give a shit about actually selling him something I said, sure call me back!

    He called me back and we did a screen share and I pointed out some things that are obvious to folks like us, such as page bleed and his video was showing related videos when it finished and a few other things.

    By now you might be asking what does this have to do with tracking?

    Well once I gave him the suggested changes I asked him if they SCREEN every call coming in, and if they know which calls came directly from the PPC ad. I already know they don't because, well we all know they don't!

    So I explained to him the power of #1 call tracking and #2 analytics, and since these types of tools and services are available because of technology it only makes sense to use them to increase the performance of every single ad dollar spent.

    The next words out of his mouth were. How do I get that stuff?

    My next words were, well truth be told I can help you with that but I wasn't calling to try and sell it to you. Personally I don't need your business I was only calling to just give you a couple of pointers on your landing page.

    The owner then just point blank asked me, well if you set it up for me how much do you charge.

    I replied that I charge set up fee of $500 and monthly after that $60 per month and it included a private log in where he can get seo data, PPC data and listen to all the calls coming in as they are recorded.

    So what happened next?

    I faxed over the agreement with a credit card authorization form and we did the deal.

    Now here's the kicker about this whole thing!

    8 weeks ago he hired an in house employee to do the seo and online marketing because he felt he'd been ripped off by other SEO providers. NOT by the money he was paying but because of a lack of results!

    When he told me about hiring his SEO guy I praised him on such a wise decision and that if he has any questions to just call me and I'd consult for him at my hourly rate at $250 an hour but that it was up to him and his seo guy to decide to follow the advice or not.

    Well he didn't seem phased by my hourly consulting fee but didn't express any interest either so I just left it at that.

    So it's a couple of days later and I've got them all set up, tested the call tracking, made sure the seo guy got it put on the PPC landing page, etc. etc.

    Out of the blue the employee says, by the way the owner has authorized two hours of consulting time with you and I wanted to go over our Wordpress site with you for that time is that cool?

    Of course that's cool! So we are doing it this Monday after the 4th!

    The moral of this story is that I was truly wanting to help by taking a few minutes away from my existing work to just help him out. And educate him on one of the first and very important things he should be doing and that was analytics and tracking.
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  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    In a way, too much is made of "selling".

    This post distills the "sales process" down to how simple it really is: having knowledge, maybe passion, and having a simple conversation with an actual prospect (qualified because he's already spending on marketing).
    Signature

    "If you think you're the smartest person in the room, then you're probably in the wrong room."

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    • Profile picture of the author umc
      You will get all you want in life, if you help enough other people get what they want. - Ziglar

      Rus just proved it again. Nice post. I hope to one day figure out my way of doing much the same in the marketing realm.
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  • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
    You know... I just thought about this after reading your post, and I wonder what my conversion rate is when I call people and don't really care if they buy or not. I look back and remember all the times I had similar situations where I couldn't care less if they bought or not and most ended up begging to buy. Then I think about the tougher sales where I REALLY wanted them to buy, and they either dropped off or took forever to close. I don't think that is the point of your post, but pretty eye opening for me.

    Awesome story.
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  • Profile picture of the author DaniMc
    That's a great story Rus. I have noticed the same types of things happening.

    The fact is...when I take a SINCERE interest in someones business, I find they take a sincere interest in mine.

    Something tells me this person will be a long-term source of income, referrals, and good vibes.

    For me...the good vibes is just as important as the money.
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    Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.
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  • Profile picture of the author euraffiliates
    Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

    The moral of this story is that I was truly wanting to help by taking a few minutes away from my existing work to just help him out. And educate him on one of the first and very important things he should be doing and that was analytics and tracking.
    Thanks Rus.

    In my experience, I have seen most of my customers who try to manage PPC by their selves or by an average in-house employee, never bother about tracking a campaign. They simply run the campaign and wait for a luck.

    In fact they spend a lot of time in viewing the sales figures again and again. Just like a novice stock trader or gambler does. But if they track performance of individual campaigns and simply allocate larger budget on those that yield high ROI and reduce campaign budget of those are making loss, a lot of money could be saved.

    But really it does not take a lot of effort or money to setup, track and measure the ROI of marketing campaigns. What it requires, in my opinion, an analytic mind and patience to maintain it.

    Lutfal
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  • Profile picture of the author JonBird
    Thanks Rus... great story and advice. Not sure who said this orginally but... If You Can't Measure It, You Can't Manage It
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    • Profile picture of the author mojo1
      I did this very thing with one of the Val Pak mailer advertisers a year ago. I called up the owner to tell him his advertising was off. It didn't include his website address or phone number on the mailer and I know for a fact they have one.

      I told him that I just had to call because in our apartment community, these Val Paks are hanging out of the garbage and littering the postal area and that he wasting untolds amounts of money by not getting all of his message right when someone does actually read his coupon.

      The guy wanted to an appointment with me immediately because he appreciated the call.
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  • Profile picture of the author JustinDT
    Banned
    Awesome post. I try to model my business off of the helping mentality, not so much the selling part. It's worked out well for me so it's glad to see someone else doing it
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    • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
      You guys get a MULTIQUOTE for saying such nice things about me!

      THANKS!

      Originally Posted by globalpro View Post

      As always, great stuff.
      Originally Posted by Jason Kanigan View Post

      This is the way! Not giving a damn whether someone buys or not...not going in with the desperation to sell...having your mind on how you can HELP the prospect...charging healthy fees so that they VALUE and ACT ON your expertise.

      If you, dear reader, did this 10 times a day and got yourself into great conversations like this one, don't you agree that you'd get at least one good client out of it within a week?

      And how much money is that, compared to what you're making now?
      Originally Posted by Aaron Doud View Post

      Agree this is pure gold for those who can understand how it worked and why.

      Rus provided great value for free. The call wasn't about sales. And even when you call to actually sell you can provide free value. That value is what gets you into a conversation. It makes the person on the other end of the line respect you and want to work with you.

      The part I love about this is the fact that this is one of the best examples of a cold sales call we have ever had posted here and it wasn't ever meant to be a sales call.
      Originally Posted by misterme View Post

      Good stuff, Russ. Are you going to try that approach again a more times to test it for empirical stats or are you going back to however you were soliciting before?
      Originally Posted by bluecoyotemedia View Post

      Folks

      this is the kind of feedback- REAL up to the minute street experience that should be praised here.!!!!! and it's people like Rus that add value from real experience

      not these regurgitating poops that only repeat what they read and try to pawn it off as there own with the added oh BTW I am offering a wso on this very topic.

      in fact there are maybe a few dozen guys here that we should set up a separate private mastermind group.

      why??

      because I believe this gold is valuable.. and should not be wasted on the masses who won't do anything with the information anyway.

      you guys know what I am talking about..

      the glen garry leads.

      what a great way to prospect!!! and I would guarantee just applying this method with an air of confidence like "I don't need your business I just wanted to help you out" will increase your sales closure tremendously!!!

      it has too, these business people all need our help.. its just they get tainted from all the garbage out in the marketplace trying to extract money from them.

      thank you Rus

      Eddie

      PS. BTW notice on Rus post NO SALES sig..

      PPS. You know I think we should call our new private group the Bilderburg Warrior Group
      Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

      In a way, too much is made of "selling".

      This post distills the "sales process" down to how simple it really is: having knowledge, maybe passion, and having a simple conversation with an actual prospect (qualified because he's already spending on marketing).
      Originally Posted by umc View Post

      You will get all you want in life, if you help enough other people get what they want. - Ziglar

      Rus just proved it again. Nice post. I hope to one day figure out my way of doing much the same in the marketing realm.
      Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

      You know... I just thought about this after reading your post, and I wonder what my conversion rate is when I call people and don't really care if they buy or not. I look back and remember all the times I had similar situations where I couldn't care less if they bought or not and most ended up begging to buy. Then I think about the tougher sales where I REALLY wanted them to buy, and they either dropped off or took forever to close. I don't think that is the point of your post, but pretty eye opening for me.

      Awesome story.
      Originally Posted by Dan McCoy View Post

      That's a great story Rus. I have noticed the same types of things happening.

      The fact is...when I take a SINCERE interest in someones business, I find they take a sincere interest in mine.

      Something tells me this person will be a long-term source of income, referrals, and good vibes.

      For me...the good vibes is just as important as the money.
      Originally Posted by JonBird View Post

      Thanks Rus... great story and advice. Not sure who said this orginally but... If You Can't Measure It, You Can't Manage It
      Originally Posted by JustinDT View Post

      Awesome post. I try to model my business off of the helping mentality, not so much the selling part. It's worked out well for me so it's glad to see someone else doing it
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  • Profile picture of the author flnz400
    Awesome post Rus! My oldest clients who are still with me today were acquired in this manner... Back when I was only an affiliate, I'd help people I saw in need, and consequently always had interested parties.

    Two questions: what service did you use for screen share, and what service did you use for call tracking?
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    • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
      I used join.me and I have my own system set up for tracking.

      Originally Posted by flnz400 View Post

      Awesome post Rus! My oldest clients who are still with me today were acquired in this manner... Back when I was only an affiliate, I'd help people I saw in need, and consequently always had interested parties.

      Two questions: what service did you use for screen share, and what service did you use for call tracking?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[8249655].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    It's sort of like sports and letting muscle memory do the work.
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    "If you think you're the smartest person in the room, then you're probably in the wrong room."

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    • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
      I'm not making this connection. expound please.

      Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

      It's sort of like sports and letting muscle memory do the work.
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      • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
        Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

        I'm not making this connection. expound please.
        Sorry. I was a bit out there and brief.

        I think what you described in the post is the same as being "in the zone" in a sport. You're playing very well and it seems automatic because you've played that sport often enough that your body knows what to do.

        Take tennis for example. When you're "in the zone", the brain focuses on the ball and the body sort of automatically moves you to the right spot and you make a good hit and so on. You don't think about all the head trash such as where your body is for the hit, how your grip is, and twist this way for a backhand, or try to hit the ball over there...

        You just kind of let go and let all the practice and experience and muscle memory take over.

        So, because you described this:

        ---------"Normally if I were trying to actually sell him something I would have responded differently but in this case because I didn't give a shit about actually selling him something I said, sure call me back!"--------

        I think you were "in the zone" and automatically responded the right way from your passion and experience about marketing effectively. You did not think about the "sales process" and "he said this, so I should say this" and "I should control the process" and "do a close" and so on.

        You just did and said the right things, and did not give a second thought to the "proper sales techniques" that can make the whole process too stressful.

        I hope this makes sense.

        Dan
        Signature

        "If you think you're the smartest person in the room, then you're probably in the wrong room."

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        • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
          Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

          Sorry. I was a bit out there and brief.

          I think what you described in the post is the same as being "in the zone" in a sport. You're playing very well and it seems automatic because you've played that sport often enough that your body knows what to do.

          Take tennis for example. When you're "in the zone", the brain focuses on the ball and the body sort of automatically moves you to the right spot and you make a good hit and so on. You don't think about all the head trash such as where your body is for the hit, how your grip is, and twist this way for a backhand, or try to hit the ball over there...

          You just kind of let go and let all the practice and experience and muscle memory take over.

          So, because you described this:

          ---------"Normally if I were trying to actually sell him something I would have responded differently but in this case because I didn't give a shit about actually selling him something I said, sure call me back!"--------

          I think you were "in the zone" and automatically responded the right way from your passion and experience about marketing effectively. You did not think about the "sales process" and "he said this, so I should say this" and "I should control the process" and "do a close" and so on.

          You just did and said the right things, and did not give a second thought to the "proper sales techniques" that can make the whole process too stressful.

          I hope this makes sense.

          Dan
          Dan,
          Great description.

          When you can do that consistently, that is when you join the top 10%

          Its what separates the men from the boys.
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  • Profile picture of the author tadpole88
    Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

    I replied that I charge set up fee of $500 and monthly after that $60 per month and it included a private log in where he can get seo data, PPC data and listen to all the calls coming in as they are recorded.
    So you just set him up with GA and provided a login to GA or did you use some other system like piwik and private login for the analytics?
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    • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
      They already had their own GA account, I have a MMC account so I can manage other GA accounts, then integrated it with my agencies reporting portal.

      Originally Posted by tadpole88 View Post

      So you just set him up with GA and provided a login to GA or did you use some other system like piwik and private login for the analytics?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[8267463].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author humbledmarket
    Banned
    Wow great story, sure inspiring to many! Glad to hear it worked out that well for you.
    How did the call go?

    I'm guessing they're a pretty big firm to hire a full time SEO Consultant how did you manage to get through the gate keeper so easily?
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    • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
      I told the gatekeeper the truth, their google paid ad landing page took forever to load and has some serious issues, causing the owner money.

      Originally Posted by humbledmarket View Post

      Wow great story, sure inspiring to many! Glad to hear it worked out that well for you.
      How did the call go?

      I'm guessing they're a pretty big firm to hire a full time SEO Consultant how did you manage to get through the gate keeper so easily?
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      • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
        Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

        I told the gatekeeper the truth, their google paid ad landing page took forever to load and has some serious issues, causing the owner money.
        And whether trained or not, this gatekeeper had enough sense to put you through to the decision maker.
        Signature

        "If you think you're the smartest person in the room, then you're probably in the wrong room."

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  • Profile picture of the author xlfutur1
    Great post. Must be a karma thing because whenever I have used this approach it always pays off. I have answered CL ads in the past with only recommendations and advice on what to watch out for when hiring someone for what they are looking for. I've gotten some pretty good gigs by not even mentioning that I wanted them to hire me.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      I think the reasons Rus got the sale are;
      1) There were no barriers in the prospect's mind as you were talking to them. Sales presentations nearly always set up barriers for the prospect to protect themselves from sharks/time wasters/mistakes.

      2) There is some reciprocity at work here. Some people look for ways to repay a favor. That's not the reason the prospect bought...but it gives them a nudge in that direction.

      3) The tone of voice, cadence, choice of words, even breathing are different when you are actually giving information instead of pitching (or needing the business)...and people are tuned to sell the difference.

      4) The prospect really did want what Rus was suggesting, and the solution presented was absolutely specific to him.

      5) The approach was brilliant.

      6) You gave the guy a very slight take-a-way (the kind that actually works). I could feel the pulling in your direction, just reading your account.

      7) You mentioned that you had clients, that you were currently working with one, and you were busy. That means...you are in demand, and you accept clients. I don't know if anyone saw that, but it's really the first technique used, and a good one. Maybe it wasn't meant as a technique...but it was a good one, nonetheless.


      I'm giving this some more thought. It's that good.

      Thanks for posting, Rus.
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      • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
        I did something similar last week.

        Here's the email I sent...

        Good morning Marti,

        I've noticed your website for business coaching
        has gone off the natural listings on Google.

        Did some background checks and found the reason why it has happened.

        I'd like to show you those findings.

        How's your calendar looking?

        Best,
        Ewen

        ------------------------------------------------------------------------

        Got a reply from him the same day with 2 time options and we set up a time for a meeting.

        I've found a problem with a best selling sales trainer
        with her online sales funnel and contacted her about it.

        Told her how to fix it and have gone back to her since
        with a contact I thought would help her in her business.

        You might call it depositing goodwill.

        Best,
        Ewen
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      • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post


        I'm giving this some more thought. It's that good.

        Thanks for posting, Rus.
        Claude, without going too deep into this,
        I see it as a primal response all humans have...
        being alert to danger.

        Bring the otherwise unknown danger to a persons attention,
        and they thank you.

        Bit like alerting a guy his fly is down in public.

        Then you can alert the person to the consequences of not taking immediate action.

        A bit like telling kids to do something and wont do it until
        you tell them there will be no tv for the next week.

        Bam, they do what you want.

        Alerting people to danger and the consequences of not taking action
        is a deadly combination.

        Best,
        Ewen
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      • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        I think the reasons Rus got the sale are;


        7) You mentioned that you had clients, that you were currently working with one, and you were busy. That means...you are in demand, and you accept clients. I don't know if anyone saw that, but it's really the first technique used, and a good one. Maybe it wasn't meant as a technique...but it was a good one, nonetheless.


        I'm giving this some more thought. It's that good.

        Thanks for posting, Rus.
        It wasn't meant as a technique, the truth is just like I posted originally.

        Was working on an existing clients landing page, I decided out of the blue to compare it against other landing pages in my clients niche.

        Found the crappy landing page and made the call. It was that bad. lol
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  • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
    Here's an update to this new client.


    Preamble: Pay attention here, this is how you should be taking care of your clients. Also there's a question at the end of this post. For those who comment and don't answer the question I'll know you were to lazy to answer or you didn't really read my post. LOL

    Had the two hour consult Monday as I've already stated.

    Logged in Wednesday to listen to some calls from inside the call tracking system.

    So, I listened to only two calls but they were just the right ones to hear. I'm only sharing about the really bad one here.

    Person called up wanting some information about a possible defective product on a home he was considering purchasing. OK I know my clients niche very well and I understand this person isn't the best qualified lead, however!

    The sales manager had taken the call and he was a total jack wad and unprofessional. He answered questions with uhuh, instead of yes and or no. His tone came across like he was being interrupted and annoyed by the call.

    Just a total shitty experience for the actual caller.

    So there's NO excuse to treat any one in this manner and I KNOW that the owner of the company doesn't want his people acting this way towards prospective customers.

    So I call up his employee who does the SEO and tell him to listen to the call and to let the owner listen to it himself. Even the SEO guy was like, WHAT after he listened to it.

    So the owner hasn't heard the call yet because he's been at another location so I'm calling him today to ensure he hears it.

    I'll update again to let you all know his reaction.


    Here's the point, it only took me a couple of minutes to screen a couple of the calls being tracked. I identified a pretty serious problem that's related to attitude and professionalism.

    Now it's my duty to inform my client. It's a DUTY!

    You have to "Get/Understand/Comprehend" that once you have a client and money exchanges hands you are bound by what's called good faith and fair dealing towards your client.

    It doesn't matter if its in your contract or not, these are implied naturally and truth be told you can be held legally accountable for not acting this way towards your clients. Especially in the case of the story I am sharing with you because I know about it.

    The HUGE upside to acting this way is that your client will recognize that you are acting in their best interest's and that will lead to what? Any one?
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    • Profile picture of the author jimbo13
      Hmm. A few referrals.

      Personally I would approach owner and arrange for some basic sales training for his staff too.

      Half a day on site should do wonders.

      I would be using a 3rd party for that because I would then want access to that 3rd Parties customers via endorsed letter.

      But that is just me.

      Dan

      PS: I only answered to congratulate you upon using the term 'jack wad' really.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

      The sales manager had taken the call and he was a total jack wad and unprofessional. He answered questions with uhuh, instead of yes and or no. His tone came across like he was being interrupted and annoyed by the call.

      Just a total shitty experience for the actual caller.
      Before I mentioned that the sales manager was a moron, I would ask a few question about the sales managers and what kind of job they are doing.

      If your client says "That Bobbie, I made him sales manager because my daughter married him, and the business is going to be passed on to him when I retire. Great kid, and a freaking genius!".... maybe I wouldn't bring it up.

      You can go down streets filled with landmines...just don't run.
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      • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
        Hey Claude,

        Of course how I communicated it here isn't how I'll address with it with the owner.

        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        Before I mentioned that the sales manager was a moron, I would ask a few question about the sales managers and what kind of job they are doing.

        If your client says "That Bobbie, I made him sales manager because my daughter married him, and the business is going to be passed on to him when I retire. Great kid, and a freaking genius!".... maybe I wouldn't bring it up.

        You can go down streets filled with landmines...just don't run.
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    • Profile picture of the author qu4rk
      Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

      The HUGE upside to acting this way is that your client will recognize that you are acting in their best interest's and that will lead to what? Any one?
      It leads to one thing. TRUST! The foundation for all business transactions.
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    • Rus,

      Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

      The HUGE upside to acting this way is that your client will recognize that you are acting in their best interest's and that will lead to what? Any one?
      This is actually a double edged sword situation. I've been down this path before only to find myself uncovering something the owner knew about and didn't want anyone to know about it. Yeah I lost a client, but I didn't lose my business like he did or spend time in a federal prison as he is currently doing.

      I would hope it would lead the owner beyond trust to complete dependence and allowing you to possibly invest in his company and receive some profit sharing along with the services you provide.

      As to informing the client my approach would simply be "here are a few calls and I'd like to get some feedback to understand more of your operation".

      I wouldn't necessarily focus on just the bad calls. Present a mixture. Why? 2 reasons.

      1st Sometimes managers are getting burned out and owners don't or won't see it. So the manager is working under high levels of stress or the owner is overworking him while underpaying him and it's starting to show in the calls they take.

      2nd Reviewing an average of 10-20 calls gives the owner a bigger picture of his employee's phone etiquette - whether they are talking to or at the customer, do they sound distracted, are they also speaking to someone else while on the phone, are they eating & so on.

      Also it would cost the business owner more money to replace a manager then to possibly put him/her through some remedial training or switching them to a different position within the company.
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      • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
        You make some valid points however we can't worry that things we find that aren't good in a clients business ends up being something they don't want to hear about, and it seems the case you are talking about isn't something that one would find common amongst their clients. hehe

        Your approach to addressing the problem is what I would normally say actually, but in this situation I'm an expert in the clients space already and I know he wouldn't want his company represented in this way.

        The man is on target to pay 10k in July for PPC ads on Google. He hired me because I pointed out that he doesn't even know when the phone rings if its actually generated from an ad or from the organics listing. So he realized he could be more effective in tracking his ad spend versus his calls versus his sales.

        I haven't had a chance to talk to him about the call yet but I think I will this Monday and I plan on relating a story about a guy I trained years ago to be a salesman who took a lead that sat in the office for 3 weeks because it wasn't in the best area of town and no one else wanted it. Turns out he said screw it, I'll go talk to the guy. Well the lead no one wanted was also the head maintenance man for Boy's Town and he ended up with a 2 million dollar project after doing the guys 2500 job.

        Originally Posted by ThePromotionalGuy View Post

        Rus,

        This is actually a double edged sword situation. I've been down this path before only to find myself uncovering something the owner knew about and didn't want anyone to know about it. Yeah I lost a client, but I didn't lose my business like he did or spend time in a federal prison as he is currently doing.

        I would hope it would lead the owner beyond trust to complete dependence and allowing you to possibly invest in his company and receive some profit sharing along with the services you provide.

        As to informing the client my approach would simply be "here are a few calls and I'd like to get some feedback to understand more of your operation".

        I wouldn't necessarily focus on just the bad calls. Present a mixture. Why? 2 reasons.

        1st Sometimes managers are getting burned out and owners don't or won't see it. So the manager is working under high levels of stress or the owner is overworking him while underpaying him and it's starting to show in the calls they take.

        2nd Reviewing an average of 10-20 calls gives the owner a bigger picture of his employee's phone etiquette - whether they are talking to or at the customer, do they sound distracted, are they also speaking to someone else while on the phone, are they eating & so on.

        Also it would cost the business owner more money to replace a manager then to possibly put him/her through some remedial training or switching them to a different position within the company.
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        • Rus,

          I do agree we can't worry about what we find. You are hired to peel back the layers of lost revenue makers and present your findings.

          You know maybe the in house guy took the initiative and beat you to it.

          Which leads to another thought. In the past I've had to retrain management and employees. Lets say the owner hears the call and doesn't like what he hears and then turns to you and asks how can he correct this. What would be your next move in a situation like this?
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          • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
            I let the in house guy hear the call first. The thing about this situation is that when the deal was being done I had to fax over the credit card authorization form and the agreement. It was made attention in the owners first and last name.

            The sales manager intercepted it and actually called me demanding to know who I was, what the documents are for and we out right unprofessional and rude.

            I handled it maturely even though he was being very aggressive with me.

            Later I asked the seo employee what the deal was with the sales manager and he confirmed that the person is wound a little to tightly if you get the drift.

            So when I speak to the owner I'll let him know my experience with him and because I put my big boy pants on when I work I let his behavior slide without mentioning it to him.

            BUT.... He's also acting this way with potential customers on the phone and that has to be brought to his attention, my experience just helps confirm that its not an isolated thing but likely recurring.

            AND...

            That because he's paying money to track his inbound calls this is a prime example of not ensuring that the two receptionist's answer the phones because they've been trained on knowing when a call is coming from their paid advertising or not.

            He can decide on how he wants to fix it but I'd try retraining first and if the employee doesn't catch it then I'd let them go.

            On an aside, if a company has a clear vision that's communicated in the mission statement it enabled them to hire people who socially and morally line up with the core principles of the company. Thus creating the desired culture which is derived from the vision.

            It become the compass in which all employees measure their behavior against.

            Originally Posted by ThePromotionalGuy View Post

            Rus,

            I do agree we can't worry about what we find. You are hired to peel back the layers of lost revenue makers and present your findings.

            You know maybe the in house guy took the initiative and beat you to it.

            Which leads to another thought. In the past I've had to retrain management and employees. Lets say the owner hears the call and doesn't like what he hears and then turns to you and asks how can he correct this. What would be your next move in a situation like this?
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  • Profile picture of the author mjbmedia
    lead to recommendations, more business directly from them, better reputation for you, enhanced TRUST leading to total openness re their business and its other issues which you can then fill or oversee the filling of.

    You're so true, these web designers, mobile marketers, SEO bods etc who do the one thing for the client, set up a monthly retainer and then do sweet FA else for that client even when it directly involves their supposed area of expertise, they aren't marketers, they aren't business people, they're just little sh*ts.
    Liability issues are something way under discussed not just here but pretty much everywhere
    Signature

    Mike

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  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    This thread has gone from great example to providing the framework for writing a book about building an offline consulting business.

    Also, there are pointers here for the younger service providers (such as web designers) to get the business savvy and experience needed to become consultants. Or, for others lured into offline consulting.

    Haven't heard 'jack wad' for a while.

    Dan
    Signature

    "If you think you're the smartest person in the room, then you're probably in the wrong room."

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  • Profile picture of the author DaniMc
    He should immediately fire the sales manager and then play the recording for his other staff - letting them know it is unacceptable to be unprofessional to the client in any way.

    He probably will not do that, though. I am regularly surprised with what some people allow to happen in their business.

    Oh yeah: Acting in their best interest leads to long-term trust and repeat business. Someone already said referrals.
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    Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mary Stevens
    Nice read with good valid points. Few people actually can tell you where their business is coming from. How do you know where to advertise if you don't know whats working? Funny how as IM guys/gals the first thing we think about is tracking..lol
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  • Profile picture of the author sandysoro
    signed up for 8:30 but never was able to hear or see.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
    It's been some time so here's an update:

    I last communicated about listening to the call that came from a PPC ad that the company sales manager took. Read my posts to catch up, I'm not explaining the whole story again. = )

    Turn out that the owner ended up having a meeting with said manager and they had a come to Jesus meeting. He still works there but from what I gather after talking to the owner, he retrained the employee and is monitoring his performance now.

    Other news:

    I've gotten to know the in house seo guy quite well now and he's been working hard on the things I pointed out in my initial seo consultation.

    The company web site is stuck on page 4 on Google.
    The owner had been paying a local SEO firm for 14 months for SEO which was for back links only. 2k per month by the way. He didn't get any real results in the rankings and ended up canceling. Hence the in house SEO employee.

    End of story is that they recently received the unnatural link warning in their Google web master tools account.

    The client has now transitioned from call tracking and seo reporting to negotiating a recovery SEO plan with me that will include monthly SEO for no less then a 12 month contract.
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    • Profile picture of the author lababa
      Very nice post and very informative. Thank you very much for this jewel.


      Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

      It's been some time so here's an update:

      I last communicated about listening to the call that came from a PPC ad that the company sales manager took. Read my posts to catch up, I'm not explaining the whole story again. = )

      Turn out that the owner ended up having a meeting with said manager and they had a come to Jesus meeting. He still works there but from what I gather after talking to the owner, he retrained the employee and is monitoring his performance now.

      Other news:

      I've gotten to know the in house seo guy quite well now and he's been working hard on the things I pointed out in my initial seo consultation.

      The company web site is stuck on page 4 on Google.
      The owner had been paying a local SEO firm for 14 months for SEO which was for back links only. 2k per month by the way. He didn't get any real results in the rankings and ended up canceling. Hence the in house SEO employee.

      End of story is that they recently received the unnatural link warning in their Google web master tools account.

      The client has now transitioned from call tracking and seo reporting to negotiating a recovery SEO plan with me that will include monthly SEO for no less then a 12 month contract.
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  • Profile picture of the author NewParadigm
    Holy Camoly! Delivering real value to a customer while speaking his language. Well done!

    Tracking effectiveness of marketing $$ is a huge largely unfilled opportunity. With digital advertising growth, will be much easier to track, but someone will need to bridge the gap with businesses =>big oppty
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    In a moment of decision the best thing you can do is the right thing. The worst thing you can do is nothing. ~ Theodore Roosevelt

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