Why most of your are failing and will continue to fail....

51 replies
...Until you stop doing the stupid shit perpetuated by the masses here.

I see it time and time again. Dejected action takers coming to this forum baffled about why promises of the WSO's which pumped them up with obnoxious copy of the amazing life they were going to be living after they bought the WSO and easy money started rolling in for nothing, didn't work.

''Get this 20 page, NO FLUFF Guide, follow the 3 step process that even a 5 year old could do, and you'll be making 1000's in the next week. No Special Skills needed. You don't even need to know how to send an Email''.

Not only that, but they are written by people who's only marketing skill is selling snake oil products on this forum to desperate opportunity seekers who still fall the lure of easy riches.

The problem with learning from amateurs who pretend they're experts is that the don't know any good prospecting methods or fundamental marketing principles.

SO they teach the thing that is causing all of the failure. That is: contact anyone who runs a business rather than only those people who actually want or need what you sell, and making sure you're only approaching them.

The default prospecting method, the done thing here, is to gather or scrape a list of business owners in your area in any niche, numbering in the hundreds, and then phone them all to try to find someone to bite.

This is like setting up an Google Adwords campaign to sell ladies high heel shoes but not selecting keywords exactly relevant to what you are selling, and then getting scrape box to generate a list of 10,000 different keywords in all kinds of niches to try to appeal to as many people as possible in order to try to find the few that bite.

This is one of the most retarded things you could do in the age of the internet. There are methods where you can build a list of prospects in large quantities, and if course sellers here had any brains or integrity that would be the basic starting point that would be taught to people - along with the other equally important fundamental of having a product people actually want.

You nee prospecting methods that make sure you already know you are talking and pitching to people who want or have a need for what you have. Don't waste time showing Google ads for kitchen knifes to hundred unrelated niches a day. Focus only on people who meet your criteria as people who are likely to buy from you because they'll already shown interest, need, desire or clearly have the problems you provide solutions for.

The sad thing is, these guys always mentions things they are doing with their ''offline clients''. If they are out there practising the shite they teach here, I feel sorry for their clients.

How simple is focusing on understanding what you sell, who will most likely buy it, and what are the full lists of reasons they would buy, what they're attributes are, and where to find them, and then investing some brain power to ensure when you are building a list of suspects, (if you really have do it that way and can't spend $30-50 building a list through ads), they have the ideal problem that would make them interested to at least check out what you offer.
#continue #fail #failing
  • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
    Something I see is advice given by people that don't do what they are teaching. It's obvious to some.

    I'm not really an online marketing guy. So I can be fooled by some ideas that just don't work. Not many ideas, but some.

    But sales ideas? I can spot a BS technique from a mile off. So can several of us here.

    That doesn't mean that only I have good ideas, or that I know it all. It does mean that non-salespeople..that try to give sales advice, stick out like a sore thumb.

    And outrageous sales figures also stick out.
    Signature

    Warrior HeySal is fighting for her life. You can help.
    Click Here: https://www.gofundme.com/heysal

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9514321].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Underground
    Yeah, once you put in the work to actually get the expertise (which isn't even a consideration or driver for most people in the biz-opp world) in something, you can see who lacks them.

    If this place was a sales forum, you'd be surrounded by sales people with no clue or real understanding of selling but teaching or peddling those bad habits, and a forum full of admirable. motivated by naive people going out there and trying it and getting nowhere.

    I know posts like this will strike a chord with 1 or 2 out of hundreds, because very few realize that going into business servicing other businesses requires real expertise of some sort, not just something to sell bought from a 7 page document they'd bought the day before and all they need to do is repeat a few magic words everyday to people with no understanding of the why behind it. Web design seem to be the thing of choice here that people think will make them an easy 500 a day if they just phone a hundred random people a day and pitch them for some reason).
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9514371].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Underground
    I guess it would be better to simplify what I mean for those who might dismiss the important point as a rant.

    Claude is a masterful sales person. He didn't need to do anything complicated when he was face to face selling. He went to the people who, being homeowners, were the people, on the whole, most likely to buy his stuff. Quickly weeded out those with no interest, need or desire, and then presented to those who were interested in finding out more. And he had to know his audience, what their needs, concerns and buying criteria so a presentation that got the sale.

    So simple. Yet, if he got his sales training and education here in WSO, he'd be advised to just approach anyone one the street, or any kind of premises like shops, schools, museums, theatres and ask them if they wanted a vacuum cleaner. How foolish would that be.

    Time to get back to sanity and get real, and properly learn whatever it is you're going to go into, so you stop doing dumb shit other clueless people have conned you to go and do.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9514630].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author kj1010
      A lot of people on the forum just keep buying the new shiny object and don't really put what they have purchased not action. I

      think that some of the sellers know and count on this so they keep putting out similar stuff with a new fancy name.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9522098].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author celente
        Originally Posted by kj1010 View Post

        A lot of people on the forum just keep buying the new shiny object and don't really put what they have purchased not action. I

        think that some of the sellers know and count on this so they keep putting out similar stuff with a new fancy name.
        well, I think we can all admit we have been there.

        Back in the early 2000 I actually bought 2 WSO That changed my life. The thing was, I was buying the same WSO, (which I think are just average....yes....all of them) but it was just I needed to get off my ass and TAKE ACTION!

        As they say ACTION....BREEDS....RESULTS! and soon after I stopped playing computer games, and starting building a list and driving traffic I went from $30 days, to over $300 a day. And now I work a few hours a day and do $10k $12K a month in profits.

        You virtually learn how to work SMARTER not HARDER! once you do this, you can create the income and the lifestyle you have always wanted .
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9522109].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
    There are very few people on here that are serious about themselves, and their business. The majority of people here are hobbyists with the dream of working for themselves someday but lack the motivation and drive that it takes to just make a living.

    WSO sellers capitalize on this.... The majority are geared for the hobbyists that would be thrilled with one client.

    Vague, recycled and regurgitated advice is what annoys me....

    "Take action", they say will make everything work out... No. Action is not good enough.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9514835].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
    This is why the, you don't have to know how to do it to sell it proponents really piss me off. Not to mention your rant about selling, don't get me started on that subject!

    How on earth can you actually sell it if you don't at least have a understanding of what and how you are going to execute it.

    How the HELL are you going to know if the person your hiring knows
    their shit and can deliver what your client deserves?

    Simple, You can't!

    I see it from people in certain Facebook groups who bought my GPScraper software THREE YEARS ago and they are posting on Facebook
    asking how to do the most simple of tasks! Like WTF!

    I remember my first days selling roofing. I couldn't close jack crap! Then I opened the books and actually learned about product, installation methods enough so that I could install a roof by myself. That's when I started getting sales when I was in front of the prospects.

    Of course I learned more and more about sales as I progressed but even my sales ability wasn't enough in many cases until I LEARNED about my product and the construction process!
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9514836].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author FreedomBlogger
    I agree with you on this one!

    Most "Gurus" out there don't really like teaching the right knowledge, and perhaps is because they don't know better or they just dont want to do the right thing.

    There is a misunderstanding in most trainings today - they tell you to just drive a lot of traffic to your sites. Just promote it all over the internet!

    Big mistake! .. you can't just send any type of traffic to an offer online!

    There are different types of traffic, different niches, and they all require a specific funnel and offer.

    There is cold and warm traffic. They use different types of funnels - if you are sending cold traffic to a funnel made for warm traffic - what type of conversions do you think you would have?

    There is a lot more to just "sending traffic to a page online" ...

    Anyways .. this is a good topic man!!

    Keep up the great work!

    Cheers!
    Signature
    At the beginning, I thought making money online with a blog was super super hard. Not anymore. Learn the art of making money online blogging - step by step - HERE.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9514857].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      It's a lesson in buyer behaviour.

      Leaving ethics and morality out of the equation,
      the sellers have latched onto a market that just keeps buying
      multiple products on making money.

      See how markets work?

      There are rabid buyers who can't get enough.

      You can use this awareness to target repeat buyers
      and still do it without compromising your ethics.

      Best,
      Doctor E. Vile
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9514972].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author zoro
    If these Guru's are making so much money as they claim, why bother putting a WSO together and selling it for $17 ? then having to answer stupid questions on their thread ... lol. Yes, you guessed it, they make money from selling WSO's and building their list, not from what they teach.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9514994].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author John D
      We can all sit here and blame the product creators or the "Gurus" for selling products that either are not effective, or only gets the buyer halfway there. However, the real issue is that product sellers and especially the Guru's know that most buyers DO NOT take action on what the product lays out.

      This is why information product creators have an endless stream of customers, because only 1% of buyers ever take action on the information. Whether that information is any good or not is another issue. I've been guilty of this myself in the past. I have many products that I've bought and downloaded, but never fully put into action or only took action on it for a week or two.

      Now, I know better...and now I do better.;-)
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9515034].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
        You are exactly right but one can't blame a product vendor for taking advantage of this information can we?

        I know for a fact that even my own stuff I sell this is true but it doesn't mean I shouldn't offer anything in the future like I'm cheating people out of their money if they buy and then let the report or product collect dust on their hard drive, right?

        After they buy it, it's 1000% on them to use the information or not. We can't go and visit all their homes and make sure they use the information to its fullest potential. LOL

        Originally Posted by John D View Post

        We can all sit here and blame the product creators or the "Gurus" for selling products that either are not effective, or only gets the buyer halfway there. However, the real issue is that product sellers and especially the Guru's know that most buyers DO NOT take action on what the product lays out.

        This is why information product creators have an endless stream of customers, because only 1% of buyers ever take action on the information. Whether that information is any good or not is another issue. I've been guilty of this myself in the past. I have many products that I've bought and downloaded, but never fully put into action or only took action on it for a week or two.

        Now, I know better...and now I do better.;-)
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9516643].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
      Originally Posted by zoro View Post

      If these Guru's are making so much money as they claim, why bother putting a WSO together and selling it for $17 ? then having to answer stupid questions on their thread ... lol. Yes, you guessed it, they make money from selling WSO's and building their list, not from what they teach.
      Well... the thing that I think about is that releasing a WSO isn't really a bad idea because the work is on the front end while you can make money on the back end... you can also release your WSO through clickbank afterwards, while charging double or triple and it is income that can stream in for months and months if not years and years.

      The problem is when people are releasing the same old material or theory instead of hard experience. Some WSO sellers are so deceptive up front it's the whole, you have to buy this to find out whats in it... lol.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9516140].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
      You are correct in most likely a lot of cases. However I do know several people who do have successful agencies who also produced WSO's.

      In fact I know one person who has over 300 SEO clients and has built such a following through his WSO's that he no longer releases products or services on the forum, they just go to his list now.

      I think if we see a purported "OFFLINER" consistently releasing WSO's that's a probable sign that they aren't whom they claim to be, "IF" they claim to have lots of clients.

      So I think it's unfair to paint them all with the same brush.

      Originally Posted by zoro View Post

      If these Guru's are making so much money as they claim, why bother putting a WSO together and selling it for $17 ? then having to answer stupid questions on their thread ... lol. Yes, you guessed it, they make money from selling WSO's and building their list, not from what they teach.
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9516627].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by zoro View Post

      If these Guru's are making so much money as they claim, why bother putting a WSO together and selling it for $17 ? then having to answer stupid questions on their thread ... lol. Yes, you guessed it, they make money from selling WSO's and building their list, not from what they teach.
      I can only speak for myself. I don't sell WSOs, but I write books and sell information packages. Why should I do that? I have a successful retail store. I have a successful speaking business. Why would I take the time to write books that I sell on Amazon?

      Here's why;

      After a few decades of learning, I have a need to share what I know. I think that lost knowledge is a sin.

      I enjoy writing. It keeps the mental gears moving. It's solitary work, which I enjoy. And I'm good at it, which makes it more fun.

      It's a form of bragging. Who am I going to brag to about all I've done? My wife? She's not impressed. My customers? Nope. Never tell your customers how much you make when they buy from you. They won't think it's funny. My employees? Nope. Why am I not paying them more? Why not share?

      My relatives? No. Every time one calls, the first thing they want to know is "How are the book sales going? It must be nice." The thought makes me grit my teeth.

      But if you show someone a certain path to making serious money, a path they haven't seen before...and you already followed that exact path yourself....it's great for the ego.

      And not sharing how you did it is Greedy. Small. Stingy.

      Would I sell a WSO? Probably not. Not because I think it's wrong. But because the membership here isn't my market.

      Think of all the best selling authors that were multi-millionaires before they wrote a book. Do they need a little more money,for months of additional effort? (Writing a full sized book is time consuming work)

      Why would they write a book, if they are already successful?

      Welllllll.....because they want to share what they know. And they are used to getting paid for their efforts.
      Signature

      Warrior HeySal is fighting for her life. You can help.
      Click Here: https://www.gofundme.com/heysal

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9521411].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author RichBeck
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        I can only speak for myself. I don't sell WSOs, but I write books and sell information packages. Why should I do that? I have a successful retail store. I have a successful speaking business. Why would I take the time to write books that I sell on Amazon?

        Here's why;

        After a few decades of learning, I have a need to share what I know. I think that lost knowledge is a sin.

        I enjoy writing. It keeps the mental gears moving. It's solitary work, which I enjoy. And I'm good at it, which makes it more fun.

        It's a form of bragging. Who am I going to brag to about all I've done? My wife? She's not impressed. My customers? Nope. Never tell your customers how much you make when they buy from you. They won't think it's funny. My employees? Nope. Why am I not paying them more? Why not share?

        My relatives? No. Every time one calls, the first thing they want to know is "How are the book sales going? It must be nice." The thought makes me grit my teeth.

        But if you show someone a certain path to making serious money, a path they haven't seen before...and you already followed that exact path yourself....it's great for the ego.

        And not sharing how you did it is Greedy. Small. Stingy.

        Would I sell a WSO? Probably not. Not because I think it's wrong. But because the membership here isn't my market.

        Think of all the best selling authors that were multi-millionaires before they wrote a book. Do they need a little more money,for months of additional effort? (Writing a full sized book is time consuming work)

        Why would they write a book, if they are already successful?

        Welllllll.....because they want to share what they know. And they are used to getting paid for their efforts.
        Claude,

        I agree with you on the lost knowledge is a sin....

        As for the bragging, you can definitely brag to the wife.... She'll say, "Tell me all about it... while you're taking out the trash." :-)

        All The Best,

        Rich Beck BCIP, MCSD, MCIS
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9521485].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author zoro
        Claude, I don't know why you referenced me, but perhaps my post was not clear. What I was trying to say is that in my experience 90% of WSO sellers don't do what they preach. They re-write or re-hash, or have an idea, and turn it into a WSO. That's how they make their money and that's how they grow their list. If they were really making all that money as they claim, why bother wasting time with doing a WSO.?

        Unlike yourself, who writes books for a living.

        Hope that makes it a bit clearer.

        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        I can only speak for myself. I don't sell WSOs, but I write books and sell information packages. Why should I do that? I have a successful retail store. I have a successful speaking business. Why would I take the time to write books that I sell on Amazon?

        Here's why;

        After a few decades of learning, I have a need to share what I know. I think that lost knowledge is a sin.

        I enjoy writing. It keeps the mental gears moving. It's solitary work, which I enjoy. And I'm good at it, which makes it more fun.

        It's a form of bragging. Who am I going to brag to about all I've done? My wife? She's not impressed. My customers? Nope. Never tell your customers how much you make when they buy from you. They won't think it's funny. My employees? Nope. Why am I not paying them more? Why not share?

        My relatives? No. Every time one calls, the first thing they want to know is "How are the book sales going? It must be nice." The thought makes me grit my teeth.

        But if you show someone a certain path to making serious money, a path they haven't seen before...and you already followed that exact path yourself....it's great for the ego.

        And not sharing how you did it is Greedy. Small. Stingy.

        Would I sell a WSO? Probably not. Not because I think it's wrong. But because the membership here isn't my market.

        Think of all the best selling authors that were multi-millionaires before they wrote a book. Do they need a little more money,for months of additional effort? (Writing a full sized book is time consuming work)

        Why would they write a book, if they are already successful?

        Welllllll.....because they want to share what they know. And they are used to getting paid for their efforts.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9521659].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by zoro View Post

          Claude, I don't know why you referenced me, but perhaps my post was not clear. What I was trying to say is that in my experience 90% of WSO sellers don't do what they preach. They re-write or re-hash, or have an idea, and turn it into a WSO. That's how they make their money and that's how they grow their list. If they were really making all that money as they claim, why bother wasting time with doing a WSO.?

          Unlike yourself, who writes books for a living.

          Hope that makes it a bit clearer.
          I can't speak for most of them, but I have read a few WSOs from people that have enviable incomes from other sources. Ron Rule wrote a WSO on how to sell PPC services to non-profits, that I told him he should teach in a seminar for $2,000...or sell exclusive areas for much more. This is information he gained by actually doing, what he teaches. But it's around here somewhere for maybe $20.

          Some WSOs sell sell actual product that you can resell. Why would the producer keep it to themselves? It won't hurt anyone if more people sell the same thing.

          Granted, I have also bought WSOs that are obviously just rehashed material the the producer has never tested.

          But I do hear variations of "If you're so successful, why do need to sell books (CDs, WSOs, information products)?"

          Why do casinos sell gambling books? More money.
          Signature

          Warrior HeySal is fighting for her life. You can help.
          Click Here: https://www.gofundme.com/heysal

          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9522088].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author anwar001
      Originally Posted by zoro View Post

      If these Guru's are making so much money as they claim, why bother putting a WSO together and selling it for $17 ? then having to answer stupid questions on their thread ... lol. Yes, you guessed it, they make money from selling WSO's and building their list, not from what they teach.
      I don't understand this philosophy. If everyone starts thinking this way there wouldn't be any writers nor would anyone teach what they knew to anyone in whichever field they are. So knowledge would not pass on and might die with the person.

      Of course, as in any field, there are experienced people launching WSO's and there are people who just want to make a quick buck and launch a WSO even if they really haven't tried what they are preaching.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9522086].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author quadagon
    This is a great thread and some great points raised. I am not experienced enough on the forum to talk aboit wso nd users but feel its a common practice and trait in humans. Notice the relationship between number of diet books owned and waistsize.

    For my real world business i have a mantra that my marketing should appeal to my ideal customers and repel those who aren't. If a prospect can't afford, use or benefit from my services then i don't want to waste their time or mine. My entire sales process is based on this principal.

    I have saying which i keep repeating you can't sell steak to vegans.

    From my limited time on here i think there are people who would benefit more from reading Brian Tracy than investing in any offers.

    I think the main issue i see (with my clients as well) is wanting to be at the end of the learning curve and not put the leg work in to find out about your ideal customer, how they benefit, why they should buy the product or service and why they should ultimately buy from you.

    True selling is a skill that takes time and is often fuelled by failure.

    Sorry i started to get in a one then. Wait till i get on will you f**k me selling or how sending emails isn't relationship marketing.
    Signature
    I've got 99 problems but a niche ain't one
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9515224].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Underground
    Some great replies here.

    I'm going post something in a few weeks one my testing and implementation is complete about how to get this basic first step squared away so people can really understand in a highly targeted way what problems their target market have, specifically, and how they can find them and reach them. With that they can craft the most compelling services and value propositions and actually set them selves up with a chance of getting somewhere.

    Once they realize that even with a service like web-design, there could a 100 prospects looking for a company and each one with a different need and at a different stage, they'd hopefully stop following moronic advice and build a laser focused sale and marketing campaign based on the strongest of foundations.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9521142].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Action Man
    Originally Posted by Underground View Post

    ...Until you stop doing the stupid shit perpetuated by the masses here.

    I see it time and time again. Dejected action takers coming to this forum baffled about why promises of the WSO's which pumped them up with obnoxious copy of the amazing life they were going to be living after they bought the WSO and easy money started rolling in for nothing, didn't work.

    ''Get this 20 page, NO FLUFF Guide, follow the 3 step process that even a 5 year old could do, and you'll be making 1000's in the next week. No Special Skills needed. You don't even need to know how to send an Email''.

    Not only that, but they are written by people who's only marketing skill is selling snake oil products on this forum to desperate opportunity seekers who still fall the lure of easy riches.

    The problem with learning from amateurs who pretend they're experts is that the don't know any good prospecting methods or fundamental marketing principles.

    SO they teach the thing that is causing all of the failure. That is: contact anyone who runs a business rather than only those people who actually want or need what you sell, and making sure you're only approaching them.

    The default prospecting method, the done thing here, is to gather or scrape a list of business owners in your area in any niche, numbering in the hundreds, and then phone them all to try to find someone to bite.

    This is like setting up an Google Adwords campaign to sell ladies high heel shoes but not selecting keywords exactly relevant to what you are selling, and then getting scrape box to generate a list of 10,000 different keywords in all kinds of niches to try to appeal to as many people as possible in order to try to find the few that bite.

    This is one of the most retarded things you could do in the age of the internet. There are methods where you can build a list of prospects in large quantities, and if course sellers here had any brains or integrity that would be the basic starting point that would be taught to people - along with the other equally important fundamental of having a product people actually want.

    You nee prospecting methods that make sure you already know you are talking and pitching to people who want or have a need for what you have. Don't waste time showing Google ads for kitchen knifes to hundred unrelated niches a day. Focus only on people who meet your criteria as people who are likely to buy from you because they'll already shown interest, need, desire or clearly have the problems you provide solutions for.

    The sad thing is, these guys always mentions things they are doing with their ''offline clients''. If they are out there practising the shite they teach here, I feel sorry for their clients.

    How simple is focusing on understanding what you sell, who will most likely buy it, and what are the full lists of reasons they would buy, what they're attributes are, and where to find them, and then investing some brain power to ensure when you are building a list of suspects, (if you really have do it that way and can't spend $30-50 building a list through ads), they have the ideal problem that would make them interested to at least check out what you offer.
    you need some sleep, I can sell leaves to anyone that likes them

    Hey get into the inspiration niche, its top notch

    Jim
    Signature

    "Love conquers all things except poverty and toothache" (Mae West)

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9521507].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Underground
      Originally Posted by Action Man View Post

      you need some sleep, I can sell leaves to anyone that likes them

      Hey get into the inspiration niche, its top notch

      Jim

      OK, here's my best attempt at deciphering what you said, maybe I'm wrong:

      ''If I want to sell shit that sets people up for failure, I will, as long as they like it. Inspiration's a good niche to get into for selling nothing but hype''.

      Did you mean something else?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9521559].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author socialentry
    I do know for a fact that the prospecting methods that were once commonly promoted in the WF work because there's at least several telemarketing rooms in my city who do just that via autodialers for internet marketing.

    Even with close personal coaching, the new salespeople sometimes fail. The attrition rate in call centers is very high and it is a revolving door kind of business.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9522185].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Underground
      Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

      I do know for a fact that the prospecting methods that were once commonly promoted in the WF work because there's at least several telemarketing rooms in my city who do just that via autodialers for internet marketing.

      Even with close personal coaching, the new salespeople sometimes fail. The attrition rate in call centers is very high and it is a revolving door kind of business.
      Smh. Yes they ''work''. Street robbery works as a way of making fast money for people who use it. You can catch a few fish here and there. Is it the best way of making money fast?

      Imaging phoning 1000 people who all have shown interest. Opted in for something. All target prospects. Or who you have identified as having the exact specific problem with the degree of severity you know would get them interested.

      Now, imagine phoning 1000 where only 10-50 have an interest and your working through the 1000 to get to the few who might buy. What a waste of time. And the result would be far inferior.

      A solo business owner can't afford to waste all that time phoning people on the assumption they could be interested because they own a business.

      The Dogma is strong here with this backward idea of just phoning hundreds of random business owners a day is the way to go because you can catch a few fish.

      That's a hustler mentality, not one of a smart entrepreneur. Like I said, the advice of the majority is going to lead people who want to build real wealth to fail, by pushing them to become telemarketers/telesales pro's wasting a great part of the week phoning people who are never going to buy.

      The pattern of doing things the most boneheaded way is so ingrained amongst the old school types. Maybe it's because they didn't learn to evolve their skills and get with the times.

      You could build a targeted list of highly targeted, pre-educated leads numbering in the high 4 figures in a couple of weeks for quicker and cheaper then creating a boiler room.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9523149].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
        Isn't it clear that the those who promoted just cold calling X number of businesses without any type of criteria set forth before calling where the same people who stood to gain something from it being the self proclaimed, "telemarketing" expert/s.

        Don't get me wrong though, I've cold called and still do on occasion but not before identifying the business as one that is a targeted prospect to begin with. Otherwise like you said, it's a waste of time just blinding churning then numbers hoping to dial up a prospective business owner who wants and needs what you offer of the day is.

        Originally Posted by Underground View Post

        SMH!. Yes they ''work''. Street robbery works as a way of making fast money for people who use it. You can catch a few fish here and there. Is it the best way of making money fast?

        Imaging phoning 1000 people who all have shown interest. Opted in for something. All target prospects. Or who you have identified as having the exact specific problem with the degree of severity you know would get them interested.

        Now, imagine phoning 1000 where only 10-50 have an interest and your working through the 1000 to get to the few who might by. What a waste of time. And the result would be far inferior.

        A solo business owner can't afford to waste all that time phoning people on the assumption they could be interested because they own a business.

        The Dogma is strong here with this backward idea of just phoning hundreds of random business owners a day is the way to go because you can catch a few fish.

        That's a hustler mentality, not one of a smart entrepreneur. Like I said, the advice of the majority is going to lead people who want to build real wealth to fail, by pushing them to become telemarketers/telesales pro's wasting a great part of the week phoning people who are never going to buy.

        The pattern of doing things the most boneheaded way is so ingrained amongst the old school types. Maybe it's because they didn't learn to evolve their skills and get with the times.

        You could build a targeted list of highly targeted, pre-educated leads numbering in the high 4 figures in a couple of weeks for quicker and cheaper then creating a boiler room.
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9523585].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
          Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

          Isn't it clear that the those who promoted just cold calling X number of businesses without any type of criteria set forth before calling where the same people who stood to gain something from it being the self proclaimed, "telemarketing" expert/s.

          Don't get me wrong though, I've cold called and still do on occasion but not before identifying the business as one that is a targeted prospect to begin with. Otherwise like you said, it's a waste of time just blinding churning then numbers hoping to dial up a prospective business owner who wants and needs what you offer of the day is.
          I dunno, I have called with great success with just a scraped list of numbers. I'm no telemarketing expert but in any list of 100, I can generate some very good leads. Of course I did a bit of pre call research though.

          On a large scale, it's very difficult to create a targeted list if you have a sales team that goes through thousands of numbers each day. At that point it really is volume that is key. It's one case where quantity is better than quality. Now if you're able to generate thousands of qualified leads, then there's no need to cold call... and if you can generate a very targeted list, of thousands each day then do it.... I can't do either. lol.

          For an individual working at home who is the sales staff, then definitely make it more targeted, there's no reason not to.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9523737].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Underground
          Originally Posted by Rus Sells View Post

          Isn't it clear that the those who promoted just cold calling X number of businesses without any type of criteria set forth before calling where the same people who stood to gain something from it being the self proclaimed, "telemarketing" expert/s.

          Don't get me wrong though, I've cold called and still do on occasion but not before identifying the business as one that is a targeted prospect to begin with. Otherwise like you said, it's a waste of time just blinding churning then numbers hoping to dial up a prospective business owner who wants and needs what you offer of the day is.
          Haha, yeah they did. Relentlessly preaching it as the only true way to ensure sales kept coming in, until it became gospel here.

          1000 pumped up believers thinking their dreams of financial freedom are about to come true just by phoning 100 businesses a day and talking to them after picking 'webdesign' as a service.

          It's a rites of passage for many people here, including me, to have tried it out. LOL.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9524164].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author kemdev
            Originally Posted by Underground View Post

            Haha, yeah they did. Relentlessly preaching it as the only true way to ensure sales kept coming in, until it became gospel here.

            1000 pumped up believers thinking their dreams of financial freedom are about to come true just by phoning 100 businesses a day and talking to them after picking 'webdesign' as a service.

            It's a rites of passage for many people here, including me, to have tried it out. LOL.
            Truth be told, it doesn't take a lot of calls to make a decent living selling web design. That is, if you're packaging it correctly. And if you're at least "somewhat" consistent with your approach.

            I was one of those "pumped up believers" who started a business through cold-calling. I have an extremely modest operation but have been able to do what 99.9% here are incapable of doing: live off my business. Truth be told I've probably only made ~800 or so completely cold calls in the last two years, but it's been enough to keep me food on the table. And those calls were virtually my only means of getting clients.

            But to the point of the thread...

            It's the culture and mindset of "Internet marketing" as a whole that's to blame.

            I came here a few years ago, wide-eyed and absolutely certain that big money was to be made at the click of a mouse. I bought courses, WSOs, memberships - whatever. Read a lot, absorbed a lot of information. Very quickly you get 'baptized' into this culture of salseletters and email lists and big product launches. You start recognizing celebrity names in the marketplace and hanging on every piece of 'content' they deliver. The distractions are endless and it becomes very obvious (later on, once you start thinking for yourself) that all of this isn't so much about building a business... it's hobbyist activity. It's the equivalent of buying trading cards or collecting stamps.

            And it's all self-perpetuating. Because most of the 'mainstream' stuff is all about how to make money... marketing to other marketers. I'm a good example of this.

            The first real money I ever made was selling WSOs. I had all of this knowledge and an ability to write cohesive thoughts. I could put together a basic website. I could write copy. And in seemed like the easiest way to make money at the time - hell, everyone sells WSOs!

            Did I have any real expertise? No. But that didn't stop thousands of people from buying my shit and saying how awesome and life-changing it was. I put out a handful of WSOs about various topics for maybe two years. I was literally in High School making thousands of dollars doing this stuff, bragging to all of my friends about how much money I was making with "Internet marketing."

            To this day people from school still ask me if I do that "online marketing stuff." Now that I have a legitimate business working with real people, the question makes me cringe every time. But hey, I was young and made myself some money. In a marketplace like this, that becomes a justified point.

            The point is... you won't get anywhere until you realize that the overwhelming majority of this marketplace, these WSOs, product launches, email lists, and that type of training is complete bullshit.

            I'm not saying you won't learn something. But accumulating knowledge is not the same as applying yourself. You have to think for yourself. You have to find out what to do along the way because I can promise you, nothing ever goes 100% as planned. Step-by-step plans don't make any sense once you have an unexpected detour or the road ahead is blocked.

            To everyone out there trying to make it doing this stuff and who is wrapped up in this WSOs buying culture... ask yourself if the last piece of information you bought genuinely helped you. What about the one before that? And before that? What about the first one you ever bought? It promised to solve all of your problems, didn't it? If you're not successful yet, why are you still doing the same things, buying the same crap as before?

            Think about it.
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9524431].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Underground
              Originally Posted by kemdev View Post

              Truth be told, it doesn't take a lot of calls to make a decent living selling web design. That is, if you're packaging it correctly. And if you're at least "somewhat" consistent with your approach.

              I was one of those "pumped up believers" who started a business through cold-calling. I have an extremely modest operation but have been able to do what 99.9% here are incapable of doing: live off my business. Truth be told I've probably only made ~800 or so completely cold calls in the last two years, but it's been enough to keep me food on the table. And those calls were virtually my only means of getting clients.
              My grammar was poor in that post you quoted. I meant to say it was touted so strongly to ensure sales kept coming in - for the guy selling the approach and pumping people up with no sales skills or no decent product. Packaging things correctly and making sure you were selling something decent was never part of the equation. It was ''pick anything and get out there''. Most people went out and started foisting the most amateur, basic looking websites on people.

              Consistently contacting people looking for those times when you just fall into conversation naturally and then can get them interest in the junk you're selling works better than not doing it, for sure. And you can make a living doing that to keep food on the table.

              But can you scale up and see consistent business growth locked in that telemarketing pattern. No. Not unless you open a boiler room who just phoned random business lists all. But that wouldn't be the best way to do it. It would be the way a fool would do things in this day and age.
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9524637].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author mjbmedia
              Originally Posted by kemdev View Post

              I'm not saying you won't learn something. But accumulating knowledge is not the same as applying yourself. You have to think for yourself. You have to find out what to do along the way because I can promise you, nothing ever goes 100% as planned. Step-by-step plans don't make any sense once you have an unexpected detour or the road ahead is blocked.

              To everyone out there trying to make it doing this stuff and who is wrapped up in this WSOs buying culture... ask yourself if the last piece of information you bought genuinely helped you. What about the one before that? And before that? What about the first one you ever bought? It promised to solve all of your problems, didn't it? If you're not successful yet, why are you still doing the same things, buying the same crap as before?
              well said Kem

              I love the sales calls step by steps that always give the prospect as giving the PERFECT response to each and every step of the call. Like theyre always going to give just the right answer and never throw in a curve ball or say no when its obvious the answer is yes.
              Of course I know every possible response cant possibly be covered but at least they could be a tad more realistic to be more valuable (I know some are valuable and Im not knocking anyone just in general)
              Signature

              Mike

              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9525600].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author belfasthammer
    Very good points raised. As a newbie and as new as it gets to the IM stuff I have in my short time bought a fair amount of WSO's and guru video courses.. Everything goes around in cycles and it seems like it is selling information and often encouraging others to repackage and sell on. As a reasonably educated (Masters degree)person those that claim the simplicity of the information are often wrong, Through illness I arrived from a high paying job to here and the hope I had of making a new life has quickly diminished. Not afraid of hard work and not naive but still cant see an honest,upfront business where I can make a decent living without crashing my now depleted bank account.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9522728].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Navyskater23
    Underground you nailed it right on the head! I completely agree it's a million times more effective to sell to a hungry audience that needs what you have rather than shooting in the dark hoping to get lucky.

    HECK! If they really need what you have then you don't even need to sell to them. All you have to do is put it right out in front of them.
    Signature
    Want Free Traffic To Your Websites or Videos?
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9522766].message }}
    • Hi everyone,

      There are a lot of great replies to this thread which we mostly agree with. We almost never buy any "WSO's" or any "Get Rich Quick" B.S products or offers because almost all of them are crap. The people selling them are only after your money and as already mentioned, they know only 1% will even try using the product?

      We have said it before and will say it again. Making a life changing online income is a skill. That skill is LEARNABLE!

      Anybody who seriously wants to reach that ideal internet marketing lifestyle should get it into their heads that achieving that goal will take time and money. Forget those "How a High School Dropout went from $75,000 in debt to Earning $347,986.63 in 9 days" B.S. headlines because if that was true, (it rarely is?), they spent many years and a lot of money before that happened?

      There are no secrets to making money on the internet. The actual process is quite straight forward.
      1. Find a profitable niche.
      2. Build a list within that niche of prospects actually searching for a solution to that specific problem and find the solution for them.
      3. Recommend more related products to them after building a relationship with them first.

      That in a very simplified form is all there is to it. No fancy software or product can replace training and education as the very first step to success. All beginners and newbies should join an online membership training website such as the very best, the Chris Farrell Membership, where we started many years ago. Today we research and review the good ones and warn not to go near the bad that suck away your money.

      He teaches the right way to eventually make money online instead of all those "give me your money to get rich overnight fool" types. If getting rich on the internet was that easy we would all be millionaires by now!

      Regards,

      Stephen & Jennifer.

      Publishers of the truth about making money online and exposing the scams.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9522865].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Underground
        Originally Posted by Stephen and Jennifer View Post

        Hi everyone,

        There are a lot of great replies to this thread which we mostly agree with. We almost never buy any "WSO's" or any "Get Rich Quick" B.S products or offers because almost all of them are crap. The people selling them are only after your money and as already mentioned, they know only 1% will even try using the product?

        We have said it before and will say it again. Making a life changing online income is a skill. That skill is LEARNABLE!

        Anybody who seriously wants to reach that ideal internet marketing lifestyle should get it into their heads that achieving that goal will take time and money. Forget those "How a High School Dropout went from $75,000 in debt to Earning $347,986.63 in 9 days" B.S. headlines because if that was true, (it rarely is?), they spent many years and a lot of money before that happened?

        There are no secrets to making money on the internet. The actual process is quite straight forward.
        1. Find a profitable niche.
        2. Build a list within that niche of prospects actually searching for a solution to that specific problem and find the solution for them.
        3. Recommend more related products to them after building a relationship with them first.

        That in a very simplified form is all there is to it. No fancy software or product can replace training and education as the very first step to success. All beginners and newbies should join an online membership training website such as the very best, the Chris Farrell Membership, where we started many years ago. Today we research and review the good ones and warn not to go near the bad that suck away your money.

        He teaches the right way to eventually make money online instead of all those "give me your money to get rich overnight fool" types. If getting rich on the internet was that easy we would all be millionaires by now!

        Regards,

        Stephen & Jennifer.

        Publishers of the truth about making money online and exposing the scams.
        This is true, and Farrell is great. It's skill and expertise.

        My Mum wants to open a ecommerce store selling children's toys and stuff.

        There are four steps. Get suppliers who will handle shipping and delivery. Build your site. Drive traffic to site. Have a customer care system in place.

        But if you want to start one, you'll soon find yourself looking at a massive learning curve to acquire the knowledge and skills to build a profitable ecommerce brand with a loyal audience of repeat buyers.

        There are many other ways to make money online than affiliate reviews, that's the only thing I would query, and that understanding how the web works from a business perspective in order to be able to profit from the potential to reach millions or people across the globe in an instant is not limited to finding a niche and selling your own info products or others products, but is far more than that.


        To Belfast Hammer, I would advise looking into ecommerce, and checking out Ezra Firestones Brown Box Formula on that.. The amount of people buying on line has doubled in the last few years and is set to continue that growth. Avoid getting into selling infoproducts till you've gone out there and really mastered something. Be for real, and you'll one day get to the stage where you've learned the skills needed. He is someone who was actually an expert who has made millions first, and is the real deal. He'll teach one of the most lucrative and viable business models you're likely to find.

        Hit me with a PM if you want more info.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9523225].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author quadagon
    @ Iamnameless this really depends on where you are getting your data. I've bought lists for FTSE 100 companies who run big sales teams and have shown that a targeted approach is still a possibility (and more importantly preferable and profitable).

    The leads were cold but having done customer analysis to see what characteristics their existing customers have we built an avatar to take to the data companies. Previously their approach was to list of business with no criteria.

    By taking the time to create the avatar and do blind a/b testing with the call centre staff the difference in leads, quotes and sales was dramatic. Safe to say they've never gone back.

    So it can be done but it takes a bit more time.


    Eric
    Signature
    I've got 99 problems but a niche ain't one
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9524131].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Underground
      Originally Posted by quadagon View Post

      @ Iamnameless this really depends on where you are getting your data. I've bought lists for FTSE 100 companies who run big sales teams and have shown that a targeted approach is still a possibility (and more importantly preferable and profitable).

      The leads were cold but having done customer analysis to see what characteristics their existing customers have we built an avatar to take to the data companies. Previously their approach was to list of business with no criteria.

      By taking the time to create the avatar and do blind a/b testing with the call centre staff the difference in leads, quotes and sales was dramatic. Safe to say they've never gone back.

      So it can be done but it takes a bit more time.


      Eric

      It appears to take more time at the beginning. One has you not entering the market until you have given yourself the best chance of success, and this takes a bit of prep time.

      But proper preparation actually saves time. You'll be phoning up to 4 times less people or more for much better results.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9524139].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
    I'm not saying you won't learn something. But accumulating knowledge is not the same as applying yourself. You have to think for yourself. You have to find out what to do along the way because I can promise you, nothing ever goes 100% as planned. Step-by-step plans don't make any sense once you have an unexpected detour or the road ahead is blocked.
    Isn't that what separates the proverbial men from the boys?

    It's the things that crop up in that awesome step by step plan and how we are able to handle and overcome them that test's our metal.

    Thinking for yourself is the principle thing. Thinking critically is just as important too.

    With that said, undoubtedly there are products sold here that people can learn from but like you said, knowledge is not the same as applying yourself.
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9524536].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Underground
    The word spoon-feeding springs to mind. That's what many want. It's easy to figure out and outline the steps required to be able to achieve a goal you set out for yourself and the vision you have for your business. Putting in that work to learn the skills and expertise to bring that to life and into existence despite all the obstacles that would stop that, well that takes a certain attitude of self-responsibility, determination, commitment and dogged persistence that may even look mad to outsiders who just don't have that trait. Simply because it's so uncommon in general.


    No amount of info-courses are going to be able to provide a person with that drive. Particularly not for clowns who can't or won't think for themselves.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9524570].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author quadagon
    Hey underground you might like this, i was consulting for a large insurance company and presented them with an idea of funnelling 3.5% of the outbound b2b budget into a linkedin program. They refused for several reasons including roi.

    This is a company so stuck in the old ways of doing things that they pay for adverts at bus stops. This advert consists of 300 words. In the meeting i asked them

    so is our target audience wealthy business people who take the bus to work?

    Just shows how mentality can stick.
    Signature
    I've got 99 problems but a niche ain't one
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9524769].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author savidge4
      Originally Posted by quadagon View Post

      so is our target audience wealthy business people who take the bus to work.
      No its the guys in the Mercedes Benz driving by looking at the people at the bus stop and laughing at them...
      Signature
      Tools, Content, and Strategies to Develop Your Online Commerce Business - Coming Soon
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9524903].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Underground
      Originally Posted by quadagon View Post

      Hey underground you might like this, i was consulting for a large insurance company and presented them with an idea of funnelling 3.5% of the outbound b2b budget into a linkedin program. They refused for several reasons including roi.

      This is a company so stuck in the old ways of doing things that they pay for adverts at bus stops. This advert consists of 300 words. In the meeting i asked them

      so is our target audience wealthy business people who take the bus to work?

      Just shows how mentality can stick.
      What was their reasoning for that in response. Some people/companies would just prefer to stay in their comfort zone, I guess, no matter how stupid.

      We often things other people can see things just as logically as we can but that's not the case.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9525624].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Action Man
    sorry

    with your negativity, I don't think you are succeeding either, no offense

    try the inspiration niche, It might build you up.

    you make sweeping statements-- but lots of people here are making thousands, why focus on the folks that take no action?

    it works for me, I make it work, I have made money from every wso I have read

    regards

    Jim
    Signature

    "Love conquers all things except poverty and toothache" (Mae West)

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9525519].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author mjbmedia
      Originally Posted by Action Man View Post

      sorry

      with your negativity, I don't think you are succeeding either, no offense

      try the inspiration niche, It might build you up.

      you make sweeping statements-- but lots of people here are making thousands, why focus on the folks that take no action?

      it works for me, I make it work, I have made money from every wso I have read

      regards

      Jim
      Jim what side are you voting for this week?
      Signature

      Mike

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9525593].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Underground
      Originally Posted by Action Man View Post

      sorry

      with your negativity, I don't think you are succeeding either, no offense

      try the inspiration niche, It might build you up.

      you make sweeping statements-- but lots of people here are making thousands, why focus on the folks that take no action?

      it works for me, I make it work, I have made money from every wso I have read

      regards

      Jim


      One of the silliest, illogical, nonsensical set of replies I've seen in a long-time. Basically you're trying to justify or rationalize selling junk to people. Yes, they make thousands. By ripping of newcomers, pumping them up with fantasies and putting them on the wrong path.

      I don't need ''inspiration''. That alone would never be enough. You need the right knowledge and you need to learn the right skills and expertise. Then inspiration might be useful.

      I'll never understand the petty-minded people who come on threads and ignore everything important but seize on something trivial and personal, and miss the big point.


      The 'cult of positive thinking' you subscribe to is why there are threads left, right and centre of people in a right mess and completely stuck and frustrated, up the creek without a paddle.

      You're a conman. You're rationalizing selling, hyped-up junk advice as being inspiration.

      Some people here...
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9525641].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
        Originally Posted by Underground View Post

        You're a conman. You're rationalizing selling, hyped-up junk advice as being inspiration.

        Some people here...
        Is Tony Robbins a con man?

        I do agree that a lot of inspiration/positive thinking BS is a con though.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9527548].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Underground
          Originally Posted by iAmNameLess View Post

          Is Tony Robbins a con man?

          I do agree that a lot of inspiration/positive thinking BS is a con though.
          No, I wouldn't say Robbin's is a con-man. Or people like Jim Rohn. Or Brendon Burchard.

          People who write WSO's to 'inspire' people to take action and then give them dud info, they're con people. Maybe unwittingly, but they're still no less full of it.

          If I got into the inspiration niche tomorrow, as advised on this thread, when I haven't even arrived yet at where I'm heading, then I'd be a con man.

          I'd be writing stuff with no background, no story, no real life universal experiences and nothing other then getting a few people hyped up for while we've some feel good nonsense.

          If I got into after coming from a highly disadvantaged background, and clawed my way to the top and was leading a life most people can only envy, then I'd have something legitimate and concrete to get people inspired about and could teach real things based on experience. Then I'd be genuine and get into it and try to inspire others to get over the hurdles and what's stopping them.


          Most 'Warriors' will get into that 'niche' after beginning their journey by clicking some get rich quick ad years ago, going through loads of WSO's looking for opportunities to make easy money, get more serious and knowledgeable , find a decent course that instructs them to 'find a hot niche' and then start cornering that niche and setting yourself up as expert and create a lot of content you can sell. They might make a few dollars from that, but have nothing legitimately inspiring based on experience to offer.

          That won't stop these frauds hyping their junk up as is they do and misleading people.

          The biz op world is mostly filled with abject amateurs a bit further down the biz op path then others and fleecing newcomers and misleading them for their own gain.

          Don't underestimate how many of these people would fail to recognize that that is what they are doing because they've come to believe their own hype and rationalizations about what they do, and think they're actually providing value.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9529250].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author JTV
    A lot of great ideas and good discussion here. I've noticed this with some customers as well... They enter SMS marketing expecting a goldmine immediately, because they "read it somewhere". It's not as simple as that... You have to really put in effort, and what you put in, you get out. Put in crap - get crap. Put in gold - get more gold.

    I think there's something to be mentioned about human nature. Perhaps there is a reason why 20% of the population control 80% of the wealth. Not just Paretto's rule. But something more innate - a drive that you learn or internalize, a drive to be successful. Some just want to be successful, but not nearly enough.
    Signature

    ULTRA SMS SCRIPT - A Powerful and Complete Text Message Marketing Platform

    Whether you’re promoting your own business, or offering SMS marketing services to your clients, we give you maximum impact at minimal cost
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9528476].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author quadagon
    @Underground, fear generally no one else is doing it and they don't trust their staff to have internet access. I've learnt to pick and chose my battles. However that said they run an affiliate program i aim to take advantage of to highlight the growth potential - and make a few quid in the progress.

    Eric.
    Signature
    I've got 99 problems but a niche ain't one
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9529295].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    You raise a valid point about prospecting and selling. And I assume you were specifically talking about WSOs aimed at people trying to start offering internet marketing services to offline businesses.

    When I first started selling internet marketing services to businesses, I did make the mistake of trying to help people who had no idea what it took to market their own business. They wanted to take home 100K for $100.00. One in particular was just an ass, whom I fired after I was tired of him and found out he was suing a big name marketer in his field. (He was a just a so-so musician trying to make it big on his own. He did not get it that his music was not chart topping stuff.)

    If you are a small operation that is just starting out, you do have to qualify, work with realistic business people who can pay a realistic amount for what they are trying to do.

    And, recognize the difference between suspects and prospects and actual paying clients. It's very easy, when you are starting out, to get all excited about suspects and prospects. And easy to forget that suspects and prospects don't actually pay your bills. And, may take a long time to become clients - or never become clients.

    I hope this thread does get WSO buyers to recognize the differences between WSOs offered by the ones who offer valuable and timely information, versus the I'm-just-a-WSO-seller-cause-I-can.

    I have no problem with the people who go from doing to coaching - like Perry Marshall and Rich Schefren and Claude W. Those folks have mastered their general field and getting better and going deeper into all aspects of the business to help others become more effective.

    On a related note, about marketing to your ideal customer or client, I am probably going to stop or limit my use of a certain online travel agency for my hotel. They are doing a ton of advertising on major TV, which should be good. But, it isn't. Their advertising implies that every hotel on their site is dreamy. I am getting guests from that site who are expecting a five star hotel for our two or three star pricing.

    The hotel I manage is nice and clean and all, but it was built a long time ago and is just a two, maybe three, star level and I work hard to price accordingly and offer a good value for what we are.

    Their advertising creates a mismatch and unrealistic expectations, and the guests who come to us through that site seem to feel let down and get mad at us.

    I've used the online travel agencies to get more business, but my next move is to get more direct bookings with people who are more matched to who we are.

    Dan

    PS - Don't miss opportunities either. I once responded to a Craigslist as for a small writing project. Because it seemed like a small project, I did not pursue it. Looking back - and I think she had the funds - her whole web presence/marketing funnel needed to be improved. More like a $15,000 project, at minimum.
    Signature

    "If you think you're the smartest person in the room, then you're probably in the wrong room."

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9529676].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author MWatson
    Love this! Amazing point.





    Cheers,
    Mark
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9529719].message }}

Trending Topics