Impossible to make money with Adwords?

by keyon
16 replies
  • PPC/SEM
  • |
I realize some people must be making good profits with an Adwords program, but I've never got the numbers to add up in my favor. On my site, conversions are pretty consistent. If I can get 100-150 reasonably interested visitors to my site, I'll get one sale. That's never really changed over the last 10 years.

To get 100 people to my site through Adwords, I need pay about 50 cents per click. If I get one sale, that sale will cost me $50. To make it worth my time, I would need average orders on my site to be around $75-$100. Right now they are closer to $30.

So is that the deal? You can't really make any money with Adwords unless you're getting $100 orders?
#adwords #impossible #make #money
  • If you get just one percent or less of visitors to buy from you, it will be hard to make any kind of profit, unless what you sell has very high margins.

    The first thing I'd look at is why your conversion rate is less than one percent. You are either not getting quality traffic or if you do, you are not convincing them to buy.

    Here's an example. I have a client selling parts, let's say they are car parts. Having recently (finally) getting access to his analytics, I see there are many organic visitors having simply searched on "ford". Those are not very high quality traffic, the search intent is vague. So, as may be your case, the conversion rate is very low. The solution is to try and remove those kinds of queries from showing organic listings and only those we want. In other words, we want those searching more specifically such as "ford focus brakes" for example.

    The same is true for PPC. Maybe you'd get as much or more traffic by precisely targeting your keywords that you are not organically. Those 100 clicks at $50 you get may convert at 3% or more. That would be profitable, no?

    Note that you are probably assuming something. That 50 cents, where did you take it from? From the Google keyword tool? Note that is an estimate based on average ad quality and is only a suggestion. You will not be paying that amount, particularly with high quality ads.

    I would pay close attention to your data. My guess is that the "ford" keywords are the vast majority of your traffic while the "ford focus brakes" has much lower traffic but are most of your sales. Figure out your conversion rate from the latter. Then start a campaign to supplement your organic results. That is how many are profiting using Adwords and other ad networks, even with small orders.
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    • Profile picture of the author keyon
      Originally Posted by LucidWebMarketing View Post

      Those 100 clicks at $50 you get may convert at 3% or more. That would be profitable, no? .
      I'd be thrilled with 3%. I guess I didn't realize anyone is getting that kind of conversion. I've heard many people say they usually see 1/2 to 1 percent. Maybe they're making the same mistakes I am.

      Originally Posted by LucidWebMarketing View Post

      That 50 cents, where did you take it from?
      I have an Adwords account set up, and I ran a couple display ads for a couple days just to see what would happen. I set my max CPC at 50 cents, but I was under the impression that most of my clicks would come in below that. They didn't.

      Originally Posted by LucidWebMarketing View Post

      I would pay close attention to your data. My guess is that the "ford" keywords are the vast majority of your traffic while the "ford focus brakes" has much lower traffic but are most of your sales.
      I think this may in fact be the problem. I need to learn more about selecting keywords.

      THANKS FOR YOUR HELP!!!
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      • Originally Posted by keyon View Post

        I'd be thrilled with 3%. I guess I didn't realize anyone is getting that kind of conversion. I've heard many people say they usually see 1/2 to 1 percent. Maybe they're making the same mistakes I am.
        Admittedly I used 3% out in the air not to make you feel bad. My main client gets more than 5% and a dozen groups are over 10%, the higher over 20%.

        You seemed to have based your 1% or less on your organic results. Like I said, take a much closer, granular look and you will very likely find that you get much higher rates on targeted terms. So the trick is to get more quality traffic and remove the lesser quality traffic.

        That's easier done on PPC since you have more control on the terms you show ads on. Also control on your ad. Given all that, don't think you'll get a 1% conversion rate with Adwords since you may be going on false assumptions.

        Display may not be the right approach. I use display very little. So that may be a mistake. As Don said too, don't expect similar results with display as you do from search. You can if done right get good results from display meaning there's good and bad ways to use display, if you want to use display but search is definitely the first thing to do, attract those actually looking for your product.

        @jaskaran826, I would not consider Google a monopoly. There are plenty of other search engines which means they are not a monopoly. The definition is the total (or near total) control of a product or service.

        Now, they do have a very large portion of the market. So kudos to them to have achieved that. Basically, Google is a very innovative company in my opinion and everybody else is just trying to keep up.

        I also challenge your claim of them "making changes that destroy businesses". Google is not in the business of building other businesses through the search engine or destroy them for that matter. They run their business the way they see fit. Yes, all those depending on them may suffer but they have to change themselves and adapt. They surely are not making changes to be ruthless and destroy businesses.
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        • Profile picture of the author keyon
          Originally Posted by LucidWebMarketing View Post

          but search is definitely the first thing to do, attract those actually looking for your product.
          I'd like to do a search campaign, but my product is fairly unique and unheard of...and not something that people would search for with specific keywords. That leaves me with using more broad terms (for the niche my product is related to), which then creates the problem of paying high CPC with poor conversions.

          It's sort of like me inventing the "frisbee" and then trying to run an Adwords campaign -- for a product that no one knows about. Sure, I could buy keywords like "outdoor toys" and "sporting goods," but this would cost me a fortune.

          I'm not sure how to make Adwords for search work for me in this regard.
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          • Profile picture of the author dburk
            Originally Posted by keyon View Post

            I'd like to do a search campaign, but my product is fairly unique and unheard of...and not something that people would search for with specific keywords. That leaves me with using more broad terms (for the niche my product is related to), which then creates the problem of paying high CPC with poor conversions.

            It's sort of like me inventing the "frisbee" and then trying to run an Adwords campaign -- for a product that no one knows about. Sure, I could buy keywords like "outdoor toys" and "sporting goods," but this would cost me a fortune.

            I'm not sure how to make Adwords for search work for me in this regard.

            Sounds like an AdWords Video Ad campaign would work very well for your product.

            The Frisbee started off as a fad by college students tossing Frisbie Pie Co. pie pans. A couple guys got the idea to make a better flying plastic version and then sold the idea to Wham-O the toy company behind the Hula-hoop. Wham-O re-branded it as the "Frisbee" flying disc and created a TV commercial portraying it as a sport. The TV commercials are what introduced the product to the world and the rest is history.

            Here's the first TV commercial for the Frisbee:


            Wham-O is also famous for airing the first ever 90 second TV commercial (featuring the Frisbee), the longest commercials up to that point had been only 60 seconds. That same commercial was also the first commercial with an all music sound track. (An idea that led to the now popular concept we call a "Music Video")


            60 years later, the Frisbee "fad" is still going strong:


            Nothing gets a new product idea across quiet as well as a video ad that demonstrates the product in use. Have you produced a video ad yet? It might be worth considering.
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            • Profile picture of the author keyon
              Originally Posted by dburk View Post

              Nothing gets a new product idea across quiet as well as a video ad that demonstrates the product in use. Have you produced a video ad yet? It might be worth considering.
              Got that covered. I agree, a video really does the trick. I have Youtube videos for all my products, and I embed them on my website pages.

              Haven't really looked into creating Youtube video ads.
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          • Originally Posted by keyon View Post

            I'd like to do a search campaign, but my product is fairly unique and unheard of...and not something that people would search for with specific keywords.
            Then you need to do an awareness campaign on the display/content network.

            While you could do a search campaign and bid on keywords you suggested for selling the frisbee in a world where nobody has ever heard of it, it's too generic and could cost a fortune. The best of the two you suggested is outdoor toys. I would not use sporting goods.

            However, there surely are sites about outdoor activities and games. Many may monetize with ads. Target them as people visiting those sites are your market. Make them aware of your frisbee. These can be banners, text ads and even video as Don suggests.
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  • Profile picture of the author XSV1
    It's going to vary based on what you are selling and the whole business model, is it a one time sale or a recurring revenue product, etc, etc. The more saturated a product is, the harder it will be for a smaller budget player to compete against the big boys. If it's not profitable the way it is now, are there ways for you to adjust the product offering to make it profitable? Do you track if you are getting repeat buyers?
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  • Profile picture of the author dburk
    Hi keyon,

    As Lucid pointed out, a conversion rate average below 1% points to a targeting issue, and perhaps a landing page optimization opportunity.

    While the average conversion rate varies from one niche to the next the overall average conversion rate for eCommerce websites that advertise on AdWords is about 4.5%. Granted it is much lower for some industries and higher for others.

    With products priced under $100 you can typically reach about a 5% conversion rate in most niches, there are some exceptions naturally. With a $30 product you should be able to get closer 6% or 7% in most niches.

    Keep in mind those are averages across a range of product types, and not all types of products will be near the average rates. For example if your product type is marketed with large variations of grades, colors, patterns or materials, you will see much lower conversion rates typically than a product that has few variations. That is because people do a lot more shopping around to find their personal preference. Conversely, if there are no variants of the product type on the market you will typically see a much higher conversion rate.

    Also be aware that direct sales campaigns on the Search network will typically convert at a much higher rate than a branding and awareness campaign on the Display network.

    Banded Search terms nearly always convert at a much higher rate than generic search terms, and as such we typically separate those branded keywords into a separate campaign,

    Remarketing campaigns on the Display Network tend to convert way better than a branding and awareness campaign on the same network. However you need to drive traffic to your website to build an audience to retarget. That is why your need to develop a strategy that uses different types of campaigns, in combination, to get the best possible results from your marketing.

    The bottom line is that is that not all campaign types, and certainly not all keywords will have the same conversion rates, nor will they have the same cost. Those keywords that trigger ads for search terms the convert really well will tend to cost a lot more than those keywords that don't convert as well. Don't look at your data in aggregate, instead segment everything and optimize each and every segment.

    HTH,
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    • Profile picture of the author keyon
      Thanks so much, Don!
      I'm feeling much better now about the possibility of improving my conversions. Might take me awhile to understand the finer points of Adwords CPC (seems to be endless variations and options to choose from). I've got a remarketing campaign set up (in addition to my first display ad campaign), which will be interesting to follow after I finish an email campaign slated for later this week.
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  • Profile picture of the author dburk
    Hi keyon,

    Here's youtube video that shows you how to setup a Video Ad campaign in AdWords using your Youtube videos:


    To get more statistics and to run video remarketing campaigns you can link your Youtube channel to your AdWords account.
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    • Profile picture of the author keyon
      Thanks...I'd like to explore advertising on YouTube at some point in the future. But wow....talk about wading into deep, dark water. I've already blown a couple hundred dollars experimenting with display ads. Can't imagine how much money I would go through trying to figure out YouTube advertising. It might have to come later.
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      • Profile picture of the author dburk
        Originally Posted by keyon View Post

        Thanks...I'd like to explore advertising on YouTube at some point in the future. But wow....talk about wading into deep, dark water. I've already blown a couple hundred dollars experimenting with display ads. Can't imagine how much money I would go through trying to figure out YouTube advertising. It might have to come later.
        Hi keyon,

        I will attempt to shine a little light into the "deep, dark water".

        I understand how you feel. No one likes to blow "hundreds of dollars experimenting". So that begs the question "why do we experiment at all?"

        If experimenting does not bring value why do it?

        Let me ask this simple question, did your experiments in display ads bring you anything of value? If not, why not?

        When done well, experimenting usually brings something of value. However, experimenting can be highly inefficient,especially if your experiment is not designed to bring a useful insight.

        Marketing experiments are but one step in a process.Marketing is a process that involves multiple steps. If you do not follow through on all he essential steps of a process you will not get much value from your marketing efforts.

        The goals of marketing are different from the goals of selling. In sales, the primary objective is to get a sale. The goal of marketing is to gain a useful insight. If you do not use the insights gained from your marketing experiments then, yes, you have "blown" that investment.

        What were you testing in your experiments?

        Did you get the data you were after?

        Did the data provide a useful insight that you were able to apply to your marketing campaigns?

        I suggest that you stop "blowing" time and money on experimenting and start investing money in experiments that bring value. At least then you will gain something of value.

        Whenever we test display ads at my agency we always have a specific element that we have selected to test. For example, we might test several different value propositions to see which each segment responds to the most favorably. Our goal is to learn why people buy, and how to use that knowledge within our campaigns. That insight is often worth far more than the small investment it took to gain it.

        Before making any investments, I suggest that you set a primary business goal, then select a strategy designed to achieve that specific goal. Setup your tracking and monitoring to measure the key metrics that measure your progress toward that specific goal.

        Once you have your specific goal, strategy, and metrics selected. You will have a much clearer idea on which elements to test in your marketing experiments that will bring you the most valuable insights.

        Please try to remember that marketing goals should center on gaining insights that improve performance. Sales goals are different from marketing goals and typically center on a specific number of units sold, total revenue, or average order value. You should set both sales goals as well as marketing goals, but keep in mind the differences of those separate goals.

        Currently, is seems your strategy is to use Display Ads to get people to your website where they can view your Youtube videos, right?

        Why not test the videos directly?

        Video ads are probably the most efficient way to build awareness because you can tell more of your story within a video ad. It seems to me that video ads will reduce the number of steps your audience must take to hear your message.

        More importantly, by testing Video Ads you will quickly learn which of your Youtube videos are helping your marketing the most and which are not. You will be able to learn which market segment responds the best to a particular video and perhaps why. That insight could then be used to create better video ads, and perhaps better display ads.

        True, there is a sharp learning curve to master any type of digital advertising, so you want to be sure you are focusing in the channel that has the best chance for success, if that is video ads, or display ads, it seems like a good thing to run a short test to verify.
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        • Profile picture of the author keyon
          Originally Posted by dburk View Post

          Let me ask this simple question, did your experiments in display ads bring you anything of value? If not, why not?
          Thanks, Don. You've given me lots to think about. You're right, I haven't really "blown" the money. I ran the ads for a few days, spent about $250, and then paused the campaigns. Now I have a ton of data to look over, which will hopefully give me some insight. I can immediately see that I need to choose my keywords more carefully. For example, the broad terms (which were the most expensive) brought me tons of traffic, but no sales. The more narrow keywords still brought a decent amount of traffic, but at a fraction of the cost -- some as low as $0.04/click. Still not happy with conversions, but if I can get traffic for less than $0.10/click, I've got some room to experiment with converting visitors.
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          • Profile picture of the author dburk
            Originally Posted by keyon View Post

            Thanks, Don. You've given me lots to think about. You're right, I haven't really "blown" the money. I ran the ads for a few days, spent about $250, and then paused the campaigns. Now I have a ton of data to look over, which will hopefully give me some insight. I can immediately see that I need to choose my keywords more carefully. For example, the broad terms (which were the most expensive) brought me tons of traffic, but no sales. The more narrow keywords still brought a decent amount of traffic, but at a fraction of the cost -- some as low as $0.04/click. Still not happy with conversions, but if I can get traffic for less than $0.10/click, I've got some room to experiment with converting visitors.
            That's great! You are starting to sound like a real marketer.

            The only failed marketing experiment is the one that fails to give you actionable data. Sounds as if you have gained some useful data there, and if you follow through you may get your money's worth from that initial data. I hope you do.
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  • Profile picture of the author asmaralee
    I did get a very good ROI from my campaigns at Adwords. However Google suspended my account because I was trying to make money and not providing good value. So better be careful!
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