14 replies
Hey guys,

I have a good understanding of html and css and want to learn php.

I have done a lot of research and I keep reading that it is best to learn JavaScript first, I thought they were fairly similar.

What would you advise?

Thank you
#confused #php
  • Profile picture of the author Damien Roche
    They are not similar. It is generally advised to work your way through the layers in a logical order:

    HTML >> CSS >> Javascript >> PHP >> SQL >> Linux

    It is suggested you understand those other technologies because PHP is predominantly a web language, and so you'll very likely encounter the above frequently. This is a *massive* journey. I'm not sure what you're end goal is, whether to be competent enough to tweak websites, or if you plan to make a career out of it, but there is a mountain of information to cover.

    There is a clear divide between the above technologies, this is split into Frontend Engineer (Design, HTML, CSS, Javascript), and Backend Engineer (PHP, SQL, Linux). If you want to be a full-stack web developer, then climb from frontend to backend.

    Try Learn to code | Codecademy if you want to dive in.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mkj
      I wanted to do the same some time back and worked my way through html and css but javascript? What an headache. Bought some expensive books on the subject but it was just a waste of money as far as I was concerned. Whenever I need some javascript for something or other I just do a search for it in Google and I always find code that is already compiled. Unless you use javascript every day as a website designer or something I can't see how it will stick in your head for long. It sure didn't with me.

      Php, SQL and Linux have been far more interesting and useful to me. I suppose it all comes down to what you want to do with your knowledge? If you are not using it daily there is no way on earth you will remember most of it so my eventual method was just try and learn stuff that will definitely come in handy.
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  • Profile picture of the author wayfarer
    To be honest, trying to progress from HTML and CSS to PHP or even JavaScript can be very difficult and tedious if you don't have prior programming experience. This is because, lessons learned from HTML and CSS have little to nothing in common with PHP and JavaScript, logically speaking. In practice of course, these things are used together often, in web projects, but the logic it takes to say, mark up an HTML document, won't help you understand, say, the order to loop through data sets when generating HTML tables with PHP.

    For sure, you need to understand HTML and CSS before learning JavaScript or PHP, which is why it is so difficult for some people to learn either. In my opinion, it is better to learn another, general purpose programming language, before attempting either. You don't have to become an expert in whatever you learn first, just learn the basics, get good enough so that you have memorized core fundamentals. You'll find this will help you comprehend the generally more complex task of mixing style, markup (CSS, HTML) with logical languages.

    Why don't you try learning the basics of C first? PHP is based around its syntax, and so are a slew of other languages. Most programming languages are, in fact, "C Family" languages.
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    • Profile picture of the author Damien Roche
      Originally Posted by wayfarer View Post

      To be honest, trying to progress from HTML and CSS to PHP or even JavaScript can be very difficult and tedious if you don't have prior programming experience. This is because, lessons learned from HTML and CSS have little to nothing in common with PHP and JavaScript, logically speaking. In practice of course, these things are used together often, in web projects, but the logic it takes to say, mark up an HTML document, won't help you understand, say, the order to loop through data sets when generating HTML tables with PHP.

      For sure, you need to understand HTML and CSS before learning JavaScript or PHP, which is why it is so difficult for some people to learn either. In my opinion, it is better to learn another, general purpose programming language, before attempting either. You don't have to become an expert in whatever you learn first, just learn the basics, get good enough so that you have memorized core fundamentals. You'll find this will help you comprehend the generally more complex task of mixing style, markup (CSS, HTML) with logical languages.

      Why don't you try learning the basics of C first? PHP is based around its syntax, and so are a slew of other languages. Most programming languages are, in fact, "C Family" languages.
      When I say logically, what I mean is logical connection from one to other, as in HTML and CSS go hand in hand with JS. You move from static HTML/CSS to vibrant markup that you can change on-the-fly using JS. Then, you can begin to use AJAX as a doorway into backend programming. This is, of course, a general approach. I just find it as a great way to be introduced to the follwing language. I can't speak for everybody's learning style, this is simply what worked for me.

      On C, my only objection there would be that C is a statically typed language. Why bother? If your goal is web development, you will surrounded by dynamically typed languages like PHP, Ruby, Python, etc., so why add another layer of difficulty in switching from static to dynamic? Sure, you can go either way fairly easily when you're experienced, but you're not going to be writing websites in C. And practice being the golden ticket to understanding, why learn a language you can't use for your ultimate purpose right away?
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  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Carton
    Thank you everyone.

    You have definitely cleared some confusion.

    I have already learnt some basics of JavaScript in w3schools.com and I found it very interesting. I think I will start there, then move onto the more advanced languages.

    Thanks again
    Daniel Carton.
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  • Profile picture of the author wayfarer
    Well, it's easier to move from a statically typed language to a dynamic one than it is to do the reverse, so it's always a good idea to have 1 or 2 static languages under your belt. C is even more difficult than other static languages in fact, since you have to do your own memory management if you are going to do anything dynamic with sets of data. If you can learn to do this, something as relatively easy as PHP will be a breeze.

    But my point was really, general programming, without the complication of learning web development at the same time, will make the ultimate learning of doing dynamic web development much easier. My first languages were BASIC and Pascal, and this was hugely helpful later in life.
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  • Profile picture of the author festi9
    HTML 5 >> CSS 3 >> Javascript >> PHP >> SQL

    this is the manner you can proceed
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  • Profile picture of the author ericlewis107
    In my opinion, you should learn JavaScript first. Because PHP files can contain text, HTML, JavaScript code, and PHP code. So you must have the knowledge of HTML and JavaScript. It will help you!
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    • Profile picture of the author capitalalchemy
      Daniel,

      I am learning to code as well and it's really not difficult at all. I'm learning through Eli the computer guy's videos and they are solid!
      PHP Programming - YouTube
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  • Profile picture of the author oldschoolwarrior
    I started my knowledge of php, by hacking free php scripts for my own sites and doing installs here on the forum.

    By hacking, I mean modifying to better suite my site, or adding custom things.
    After enough of that I decided to learn more about it, and most of my knowledge came from PHP Tutorial - Introduction

    Now I consider myself a pretty good programmer. Best of both worlds, I understand the need, the marketing, and the coding
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  • Profile picture of the author abraham26
    Learn HTML,CSS and PHP. JS is too hard, let it later.
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    • Profile picture of the author dad2four
      Agreed Abraham, you can get done most of what you want to accomplish withough using Java Script.

      Even CSS is not necessary as long as you keep it simple.
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      • Profile picture of the author Damien Roche
        Originally Posted by dad2four View Post

        Agreed Abraham, you can get done most of what you want to accomplish withough using Java Script.

        Even CSS is not necessary as long as you keep it simple.
        Please explain how CSS is not necessary? HTML and CSS and the *only* two necessary components of the frontend of a website. CSS might not be required, but try disable styles on any website you visit..
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  • Profile picture of the author Andrew H
    Even CSS is not necessary as long as you keep it simple.
    I can't stop laughing.
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    "You shouldn't come here and set yourself up as the resident wizard of oz."
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