Can There Be A Sticky That Answers Some Questions That Are Asked Over And Over Again?

by nik0 Banned
71 replies
  • SEO
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I don't know how many threads I've seen come by the last few days all asking the same or similar question:

"Why is my site not ranking anymore"

A quick look at their sites backlink profile quickly reveals a big spam fest of low quality web directories, blog comments, social bookmarking using primarly their main target keywords as anchor text.

Clearly a Penguin issue in at least 9 out of 10 cases so perhaps someone can write a sticky post that addresses the several Google updates and the characteristics that match with these updates.

Real quickly summarized:
  • Panda (thin / low quality pages)
  • Penguin (spammy / low quality links)
#answers #asked #questions #sticky
  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    We had tried that in the past once. It didn't help.
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  • Profile picture of the author SEO-Dave
    A lot of people tend to be very lazy, rather than searching for an answer they ask the same question that's been answered 1,000 times before.

    Funniest thing about this is when you consider pretty much everything discussed here will be answered on a variety of websites in greater detail with case studies/proof etc... that can be quickly found using Google.

    It's simply laziness, rather than searching for something like "What is Anchor Text" they ask in a comment or a forum thread "What is Anchor Text?". On my sites I'll even get comments asking the question that's answered in the article they are commenting on! Seriously, did they not read the article!!!

    I don't understand people who do this, my first port of call when I don't know something is Google, I only ask for help on forums etc... when I can't find the answer after extensive searches.

    I'll hazard a guess (didn't check) had Nik0 searched the forum there would be other threads about this.

    Decided to check, guess this is why stickies were dropped?

    http://www.warriorforum.com/search-e...ckies-all.html

    David
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    No Dave, that is not why the stickies were dropped. They were combined into one thread with links pointing to them after that post. Cleaned it up nicely.

    They were removed because nobody read them and users just continued to post stupid crap.
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    The last sticky for noobs was outdated info. and/or irrelevant info. like Adsense.

    It doesn't matter If a relevant sticky even existed, when people post on forums they want their answers customized to their own questions instead of generic answers. Also the forum search is mostly useless.

    When the old SEO forum sticky existed, the same questions still kept being asked, over & over...

    Before Freelancer bought Warrior Forum the mods had a Merge tool to merge all the same subject threads which was extremely useful anytime a new Google algo. rolled out. Request to have the mod/merge tool fixed were always ignored (shocking).

    Besides... could you imagine a mile long sticky that covered the basics for each Google algo update, talk about outdated confusion. Since there's no dedicated sub-forum mods the sticky would never be maintained.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
    Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

    Clearly a Penguin issue in at least 9 out of 10 cases so perhaps someone can write a sticky post that addresses the several Google updates and the characteristics that match with these updates.
    Two truths to keep things real

    1) Theres a large group of people that don't care about Penguin. They want and need all those things to work because they have no intentions of ever doing anything more. A lot of them are kids. the rest of them are just chasing the dream - buy this hit go and make money. Sheesh Angela baccklinks are still being promoted along with a get a high PR link on Wordpress,com

    2) Even before they become outdated someone or even group will disagree with the sticky. A really good sticky would need to teach probably using graphics etc. Who wants to spend the time on it when less than that sells a s a WSO? Especially since some of the old guard will cry self promotional if a sig is there.

    What happened to your case study by the way? As you know we don't agree on much but I thought it looked okay.
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

      What happened to your case study by the way? As you know we don't agree on much but I thought it looked okay.
      They removed the thread (for whatever reason), now I do the case study on my own site, see sig link.

      Still waiting for site content though, domain is indexed and ranking at #70 for it's domain name, that's about it so far.

      Oh yeah and those 12 dropped domains are indexed now and 4 of them link already to the empty site.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

        They removed the thread (for whatever reason),
        Probably reported as promotional. As far as I know no case study has ever been done under the newer rules. I heralded that they were allowed again but bleh...no way I am going to take the time and energy to do something like that when it may not last more than a few minutes.

        As a matter of fact I think that fear that someone might benefit from starting a thread has killed a lot of the value this section had years ago.
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      • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
        Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

        They removed the thread (for whatever reason), now I do the case study on my own site, see sig link.
        I can guess.

        It wasn't really any kind of case study. It was a follow me thread. Technically too, if they are going to keep the existing rules on case studies which is entirely up to them, it needs to be posted once complete, not as it goes.

        To be honest, just my opinion, but seeing how long it takes to rank one website isn't really a study on anything. The site could rank great. It could bomb miserably. Either way it is one example which is tough to draw any definitive conclusions from.

        I'm not making a judgement on it. I'm sure plenty of people will still read it and check it out as you go.

        If they start allowing those follow-me threads on a forum this large, we all know how bad it will get and the kind of junk that would get posted.
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        • Profile picture of the author yukon
          Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

          I can guess.

          It wasn't really any kind of case study. It was a follow me thread. Technically too, if they are going to keep the existing rules on case studies which is entirely up to them, it needs to be posted once complete, not as it goes.

          To be honest, just my opinion, but seeing how long it takes to rank one website isn't really a study on anything. The site could rank great. It could bomb miserably. Either way it is one example which is tough to draw any definitive conclusions from.

          I'm not making a judgement on it. I'm sure plenty of people will still read it and check it out as you go.

          If they start allowing those follow-me threads on a forum this large, we all know how bad it will get and the kind of junk that would get posted.
          Someone should post a sticky that defines what a case study is/isn't.
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          • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
            Originally Posted by yukon View Post

            Someone should post a sticky that defines what a case study is/isn't.
            the sticky there does not define what a case study is/isn't. It merely states which case study will be allowed at the time it was posted. Two different things

            Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

            Also, I don't know why someone didn't answer your question asking if they wanted to revisit the rules about follow me threads. A simple yes or no is all that was needed.
            I suspect for the same reason past mods didn't answer questions or suggestions one of which I posted two years or so ago - busy/missed it.
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            • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
              Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

              the sticky there does not define what a case study is/isn't. It merely states which case study will be allowed at the time it was posted. Two different things
              Rule number 6 kind of defines it...

              6. Case studies involve testing some method, theory, or idea. Maybe you want to test how different AdSense ad boxes work in different layouts. Maybe you want to test the impact of driving a specific anchor text percentage through the roof. What happens to site if you build nothing but footer links? Can you rank a site with just image links? Those are fine. Case studies should not be tutorials. That is not to say tutorials have no place. Just that they are not a case study for our purposes. Again, case studies should be an experiment to prove or disprove some methodology.

              Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

              I suspect for the same reason past mods didn't answer questions or suggestions one of which I posted two years or so ago - busy/missed it.
              Yeah, I honestly have no idea whose responsibility it was to answer the Suggestion Forum under the old management. Senior mods, Allen, etc. No idea. The whole Suggestion Forum has been mostly a waste of time since it was created, IMO.
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              • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
                Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

                Rule number 6 kind of defines it...
                No it doesn't. You are missing my point. No posts here DEFINES anything. No poster has or had that power. It was just a statement of policy here at that time. For example a case study CAN be also a tutorial. They are all the time in many settings. Case studies do not have to be scientific tests.

                The only question is if present management totally adopts your standard for here. Thats not clear which is why I answered Yukon as I did.

                One thing is clear though, as the case study of the history of those rules have shown - It hasn't created a single case study so practically speaking it didn't change the status of case studies before it.
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                • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
                  Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

                  No it doesn't. You are missing my point. No posts here DEFINES anything. No poster has or had that power. It was just a statement of policy here at that time. For example a case study CAN be also tutorial. They are all the time in many settings. Case studies do not have to be scientific tests.

                  The only question is if present management totally adopts your standard for here. Thats not clear which is why I answered Yukon as I did.

                  One thing is clear though, as the case study of the history of those rules have shown - It hasn't created a single case study so practically speaking it didn't change the status of case studies before it.
                  Okay, to be more specific, it defined what was allowed as a case study here. Tutorials were decided to not be case studies. Here it was defined as experiments to test some sort of theory or tactic. You can argue the definition of a case study to the general world all you want, but it really doesn't matter here.

                  The present management has adopted all of the old rules here except the ones that they have already changed. Will they decide to change rules about case studies here in the future? Nobody knows.

                  I wouldn't expect them to comment on each and every rule individually to say that, "Yes this is still a rule." They stated that basically, unless they have changed it, it's still a rule.

                  I agree that the case study rules are pretty restrictive. At the same time, this is the largest IM forum on the planet. Without restrictive rules, I think those of us who understand SEO would be highly disappointed with what is posted as a case study. I know a lot of people do not like the rule about having to share the sites involved, but without that rule, nothing could be verified and the way this particular sub-forum is, it would just turn into long threads of arguments. Nobody would believe half the stuff.

                  I suspect it would get highly nasty.

                  In all honesty, I think case studies are better suited for smaller, more specialized audiences.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
                    Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

                    Okay, to be more specific, it defined what was allowed as a case study here.
                    Which to be specific has nothing to do with my point.

                    You can argue the definition of a case study to the general world all you want, but it really doesn't matter here.
                    Thats the point why Nik0 asked Mike and you know he did because you said they didn't answer. To put it blunt your opinion or definition no longer matters squat here unless they agree fully to it. Leave it to a mod to define for here and now. So until then someone saying that they define what a case study is for all time means nothing.

                    Heres the rub. I've heard nothing but criticism of there being no forum specific mods who understand SEO so either there are and the criticisms were wrong OR the post was reported and removed for being promotional which doesn't necessarily imply an adoption of rules on case studies. To say that mods understood that issue but not SEO is incoherent so its one or the other.

                    . Without restrictive rules, I think those of us who understand SEO would be highly disappointed with what is posted as a case study..
                    Heres the thing and getting back to the subject of the OP. Case studies not being allowed are fine and dandy. I discussed this because of the wider issue. Rather than new users or spam what has been killing this forum for a long time (years) is some of those restrictive rules. A I have stated elsewhere posts that even smelled from half a mile away as self promotion have been deleted so arbitrarily few people who could add some things of great substance or lead such threads do so because they never knew if it was even worth the time since the thread could very well be deleted. over the last two years I have had some deleted that were head scratchers. shucks even removing sig isn't enough in some cases.

                    So newbies stop posting their new questions what would replace it?
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            • Profile picture of the author yukon
              Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

              the sticky there does not define what a case study is/isn't. It merely states which case study will be allowed at the time it was posted. Two different things
              Does it really matter, he still didn't bother reading it. The thread was a follow me thread which is clearly pointed out in the sticky.

              Hand holding cost an extra $5.
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              • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
                Originally Posted by yukon View Post

                Does it really matter, he still didn't bother reading it. The thread was a follow me thread which is clearly pointed out in the sticky.

                Hand holding cost an extra $5.
                He read it (as he indicated in his question in the other section which Mike referred to). he just didn't know whether it was still a rule seeing as it was written by ex mods who are no longer in a position to state policy.

                By your own rule you owe me ten dollars. need the Paypal addy?

                or if you need time to pay because you owe a lot for back seat modding let me know. We can do it by subscription.
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                • Profile picture of the author yukon
                  Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

                  He read it (as he indicated in his question in the other section which Mike referred to). he just didn't know whether it was still a rule seeing as it was written by ex mods who are no longer in a position to state policy.

                  By your own rule you owe me ten dollars. need the Paypal addy?

                  or if you need time to pay because you owe a lot for back seat modding let me know. We can do it by subscription.



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              • Profile picture of the author nik0
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                Originally Posted by yukon View Post

                Does it really matter, he still didn't bother reading it. The thread was a follow me thread which is clearly pointed out in the sticky.

                Hand holding cost an extra $5.
                New management, perhaps new rules right?

                I don't know of any other forum then the WF where follow me threads are not allowed.
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        • Profile picture of the author nik0
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          Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

          I can guess.

          It wasn't really any kind of case study. It was a follow me thread. Technically too, if they are going to keep the existing rules on case studies which is entirely up to them, it needs to be posted once complete, not as it goes.

          To be honest, just my opinion, but seeing how long it takes to rank one website isn't really a study on anything. The site could rank great. It could bomb miserably. Either way it is one example which is tough to draw any definitive conclusions from.

          I'm not making a judgement on it. I'm sure plenty of people will still read it and check it out as you go.

          If they start allowing those follow-me threads on a forum this large, we all know how bad it will get and the kind of junk that would get posted.
          Yeah it's no case study in the true sense of the word, but at least it was a decent one in progress. Much better then spam your way to the top in 30 days like most do and then come up with half details about what they did exactly and only vague claims like: yeah I started up GSA blablabla.

          Still I like follow me threads either to write them or follow them (depending on who writes them and the details of it).

          But I get your point sure, some time ago there was a guy who suddenly went from like $40/day to $400/day with Amazon.and all he said was: Yeah I made some changes.... without any further details like he found same magic trick. Few months later he PM's me for link building and that he's on such a tight budget. I say what happened with your $400/day site? Yeah it tanked, oh and you didn't save any money while it lasted with your $12k/month. Too much bullshit going on for sure and before you know it it turns into some WSO.

          On top of that it wouldn't be very hard to manipulate a case study with hidden redirects and what not so yeah it can never be 100 percent reliable.

          Yesterday I went through a case study from Matt Anton btw, the guy with the big mouth about his robot vacuum site, ranked with a ton of spam. He did a test, blast 500 bookmarks to every single page of his site and his traffic doubled. Maybe it did I don't know, but now it ain't ranking anymore and he didn't just blast bookmarks, he also did a ton of forum posts (these were pretty damn effectively back in the days) but he didn't make any mention about that so there you go again.
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      • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
        Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

        They removed the thread (for whatever reason), now I do the case study on my own site, see sig link.
        Also, I don't know why someone didn't answer your question asking if they wanted to revisit the rules about follow me threads. A simple yes or no is all that was needed.
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    Mike,

    Just because Nik0's thread was unanswered did not mean the old rules were out the window.

    Whatever though.

    I'm sick of your attacks. I'm sick of your arguments.

    I deleted the thread. You guys post whatever the hell you want.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

      I'm sick of your attacks. I'm sick of your arguments.
      Whatever Mike. I'm sick of all the comments in these threads about modding and how the new ones are not doing it right or trying to still speak for them. You take that as an attack be my guest.

      P.S. You had no business deleting the thread which was posted as a mod just to throw a hissy fit because someone questioned whether it was still policy. None of us know and thats what we were discussing among other things raised by the OP.
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      • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        Whatever Mike. I'm sick of all the comments in these threads about modding and how the new ones are not doing it right or trying to still speak for them. You take that as an attack be my guest.
        I didn't say a thing about mods. I said that nik0's thread did not follow posted rules and that management has said all former rules are in effect in the forum and subforums, unless they explicitly have stated otherwise. For example, they have changed some of the rules around WSO's.

        That was likely why it was deleted.

        By the way, their new policy is to PM members when they delete/move threads. Any speculation about why it was deleted, really doesn't matter. I would imagine nik0 got a message and knows why it was deleted.

        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        P.S. You had no business deleting the thread which was posted as a mod just to throw a hissy fit because someone questioned whether it was still policy. None of us know and thats what we were discussing among other things raised by the OP.
        Everyone knew it was still policy. As I said, they stated that all rules were still in effect. You were the only one questioning it.

        But as you said...

        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        To put it blunt your opinion or definition no longer matters squat here unless they agree fully to it. Leave it to a mod to define for here and now. So until then someone saying that they define what a case study is for all time means nothing.
        So there... It's gone. My opinion or definition doesn't matter, as you said.

        If they want to, they can easily undelete the rules or copy and paste them and post them on their own. Or even write all new ones.

        Until then define case studies however you want.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
          Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

          I didn't say a thing about mods.
          Mike spare me. I am not the one who makes up false accusations. Whats this? Congratulations?

          Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

          I don't know why someone didn't answer your question asking if they wanted to revisit the rules about follow me threads. A simple yes or no is all that was needed.
          Questioning why a mod didn't answer or no? Not the only thread I am talking about. " These"is plural.

          Everyone knew it was still policy. As I said, they stated that all rules were still in effect. You were the only one questioning it.
          Load of hueey. NIk0 asked in another thread and even in this one you stated you didn't know or are you redefining the meaning of "only one"? Furthermore everyone knows certain things are more lenient so no we don't know. Shucks just a week ago you were claiming there was greater latitude and we were freer now to talk directly about people - no announcement of a change in sight so why didn't you assume there was no change?

          So there... It's gone. My opinion or definition doesn't matter, as you said.
          .
          Whatever you want to do - don't matter me none. I stated nothing but the simple fact that you are not a mod anymore and that we needed to hear what the policy was going forward because no past policy DEFINES what a case study is separate from that as Yukon implied. Its telling you get so bent out of shape at just the idea that perhaps you are not the final word but it is what it is.
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          • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            Mike spare me. I am not the one who makes up false accusations. Whats this? Congratulations?

            Questioning why a mod didn't answer or no? Not the only thread I am talking about. " These"is plural.
            I didn't say a thing about mods. I said I had no idea why he didn't get an answer. I did not say, "I don't know why a mod didn't answer you."

            I don't think its the mods job to answer those threads, nor do they have the authority to do so, unless something has changed behind the scenes.

            And like I also said, which you conveniently left out, I think the whole suggestion forum has been pretty much a waste of time since its creation, which was about 18 months before the forum was sold.

            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            Load of hueey. NIk0 asked in another thread and even in this one you stated you didn't know or are you redefining the meaning of "only one"?
            Come on. Nik0 didn't post that because he didn't know what the rules were. He was posting it to see if he could get away with it. He's always pushed the boundaries here. Not with anything heinous or anything like that, but I think he would even admit that.

            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            Shucks just a week ago you were claiming there was greater latitude and we were freer now to talk directly about people - no announcement of a change in sight so why didn't you assume there was no change?
            What I was pointing out to you, as you were crying foul about that thread about Charles Floate, was a change in temperament, not a change in the rules. Big difference.

            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            Whatever you want to do - don't matter me none. I stated nothing but the simple fact that you are not a mod anymore and that we needed to hear what the policy was going forward because no past policy DEFINES what a case study is separate from that as Yukon implied. Its telling you get so bent out of shape at just the idea that perhaps you are not the final word but it is what it is.
            Like I said, there was no need for any comment on the policy going forward. The rules were stated to be the same going forward when they bought this place with the exceptions of rules they announced changes about. The only changes I'm aware of is rules around the War Room and WSO's.

            I'm not one bit bent out of shape about not being the final word on this or any other topic around here. Heck, I wasn't even the final word on those rules. I had to get approval for them to be posted and they had to be edited from my first draft.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              What I was pointing out to you, as you were crying foul about that thread about Charles Floate, was a change in temperament, not a change in the rules. Big difference.
              Thats probably the single most out outrageous splitting of a non existent hair I have ever read on WF. If a change in "temperament" allows for an action not allowed before then its a change in rules. The difference exists only in your mind.. I realize that blows up your point that all rule changes have been announced but trying the two step and shimmy won't work.


              Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

              I didn't say a thing about mods. I said I had no idea why he didn't get an answer. I did not say, "I don't know why a mod didn't answer you."
              So you didn't use the word mod just referred to them as needing to have given a simple answer yes or no and that they didn't so that means you made no comment in regard to them....ummm....alrighty then

              P.S I consider anyone with mod permissions who edits or removes posts as a mod. But lets get back on track of this thread
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              • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
                Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

                Thats probably the single most out outrageous splitting of a non existent hair I have ever read on WF. If a change in "temperament" allows for an action not allowed before then its a change in rules. The difference exists only in your mind.. I realize that blows up your point that all rule changes have been announced but trying the two step and shimmy won't work.
                Pretty sure there is no rule against posting a news story, but whatever. You know everything like you keep trying to tell people.

                Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

                So you didn't use the word mod just referred to them as needing to have given a simple answer yes or no and that they didn't so that means you made no comment in regard to them....ummm....alrighty then

                P.S I consider anyone with mod permissions who edits or removes posts as a mod. But lets get back on track of this thread

                If I didn't say mods, then I wasn't referring to mods.

                In my mind, it is management's obligation to answer posts in the suggestion forum. That's who I was referring to. Not the mods.

                You are the one that keeps trying to start these fights about the mods. This conversation has nothing to do with new or old mods. No idea why you want to keep stirring the pot about that.
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                • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
                  Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

                  Pretty sure there is no rule against posting a news story, but whatever. You know everything like you keep trying to tell people.
                  Hey you gave new management as an excuse for that thread (which was like half about a news story and the rest personal garbage) not me and no I don;t know everything guess not being a mod didn't swell my head that way.

                  You are the one that keeps trying to start these fights about the mods. This conversation has nothing to do with new or old mods. No idea why you want to keep stirring the pot about that.
                  More nonsense . Last thread there was a discussion about mods it was deleted couldn't be five days ago. Yukon has had multiple threads laughing at mods and you both have been back seat modding for awhile now. Try and pin that on me and I'll file it away under the same nonsense you Pmed me with
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  • Profile picture of the author Kevin Maguire
    Dennis,

    If there where no noob question threads started over and over, then where would you get your client leads from?



    All forums are like this and that's just life.

    You must not forget, that not every thread is started with the actual intention of information seeking. Some people might see a very well established forum like this, and feel a little intimidated. Making posts is how they become involved within the community, a twisted social element to it perhaps. But it works none the less.

    Look at the "Italian Stallion" aka SuO Dave.

    He came in kicking up all kinds of dust, and he was met with all kinds of abuse. Not everyone wants to make such a big splash, when 99% of the time they bellyflop.

    So instead they revert to creating boring threads like, "100k FB Likes and still no Google Ranking"
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Kevin Maguire View Post

      Dennis,

      If there where no noob question threads started over and over, then where would you get your client leads from?



      All forums are like this and that's just life.

      You must not forget, that not every thread is started with the actual intention of information seeking. Some people might see a very well established forum like this, and feel a little intimidated. Making posts is how they become involved within the community, a twisted social element to it perhaps. But it works none the less.

      Look at the "Italian Stallion" aka SuO Dave.

      He came in kicking up all kinds of dust, and he was met with all kinds of abuse. Not everyone wants to make such a big splash, when 99% of the time they bellyflop.

      So instead they revert to creating boring threads like, "100k FB Likes and still no Google Ranking"
      Well I really don't get my leads from these type of people, trust me, nor would I want to, many people always think I'm over promotional but when you think of what I write I'm not the most professional window for my service am I?

      Why? Cause I simply don't care, I write what I want to write. This forum posting is just a hobby of mine and if it brings in some additional bucks it's all well. You only have to look at other succesful sellers here that never participate in this sub forum. Still they do great in terms of sales by just bumping their threads. SEO sub forum is really not as targeted traffic as you would expect as most are hobbyists who like to do it their selves so if I would sell a WSO like: Make $10k/month Ranking Sites Quick And Easy it would be a lot more targeted.
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      • Profile picture of the author nik0
        Banned
        Mods PM'd me only once when I cursed someone asking not to do that again.

        Didn't receive any PM about the case study / follow me thread.

        Obvious I'm aware of the old rules but kinda lame they can't write their own policy, but whatever.
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        • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
          Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

          Mods PM'd me only once when I cursed someone asking not to do that again.

          Didn't receive any PM about the case study / follow me thread.

          Obvious I'm aware of the old rules but kinda lame they can't write their own policy, but whatever.
          I saw a few other people post that they are getting PM's when stuff is deleted/moved. Maybe it is only certain type of posts then. I don't know.
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          • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
            Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

            Yeah it's no case study in the true sense of the word, but at least it was a decent one in progress. Much better then spam your way to the top in 30 days like most do and then come up with half details about what they did exactly and only vague claims like: yeah I started up GSA blablabla.

            Still I like follow me threads either to write them or follow them (depending on who writes them and the details of it).

            But I get your point sure, some time ago there was a guy who suddenly went from like $40/day to $400/day with Amazon.and all he said was: Yeah I made some changes.... without any further details like he found same magic trick. Few months later he PM's me for link building and that he's on such a tight budget. I say what happened with your $400/day site? Yeah it tanked, oh and you didn't save any money while it lasted with your $12k/month. Too much bullshit going on for sure and before you know it it turns into some WSO.

            On top of that it wouldn't be very hard to manipulate a case study with hidden redirects and what not so yeah it can never be 100 percent reliable.

            Yesterday I went through a case study from Matt Anton btw, the guy with the big mouth about his robot vacuum site, ranked with a ton of spam. He did a test, blast 500 bookmarks to every single page of his site and his traffic doubled. Maybe it did I don't know, but now it ain't ranking anymore and he didn't just blast bookmarks, he also did a ton of forum posts (these were pretty damn effectively back in the days) but he didn't make any mention about that so there you go again.
            Lol... And that person that went from $40/day to $400/day probably actually went from $40/month to $400/month. If they even ever made that much.

            Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

            New management, perhaps new rules right?

            I don't know of any other forum then the WF where follow me threads are not allowed.
            That is true, but none of those other forums are nearly as big as WF either. If they were as big, they might choose to adopt similar rules.

            Personally, my concern with allowing follow me type threads is just the amount of people who could easily be led into ideas that do not work at all. It's not hard for someone to sound like they know what they are doing and lead new marketers astray.

            I get PM's and emails all the time from people saying they saw some webinar or read some post from so and so and have been following what they taught and have seen no progress and made no money. When they actually tell me about what it is they are doing, it's either just a horrible idea that will never work or outdated crap from 10 years ago.
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            • Profile picture of the author nik0
              Banned
              Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

              Personally, my concern with allowing follow me type threads is just the amount of people who could easily be led into ideas that do not work at all. It's not hard for someone to sound like they know what they are doing and lead new marketers astray.
              Ok but when you think of it, now I moved the case study to my own blog, where I am the moderator, if someone writes something I don't like I could just remove his comment.

              On a public forum there is no option to do that so the over obvious follow me / case study threads would get flamed anyway.

              They could also say if there is too much vague info / nonsense that the thread gets locked or removed. I've been pretty clear in the thread though I didn't reveal all details right away as I wanted to give it some time to see if it would be deleted or not.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
          Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

          Mods PM'd me only once when I cursed someone asking not to do that again.

          Didn't receive any PM about the case study / follow me thread.

          Obvious I'm aware of the old rules but kinda lame they can't write their own policy, but whatever.
          Dude I'd be willing to put down money that it was reported as a promotional thread not axed because some mod was invoking the case study rules. I might lose it but it would be a good bet.

          The real thing with self promotion is how do you define it. I am not going to lie - you have had some pretty obvious ones but heres the thing. It need not be obvious. Like I have said before I have seen thread disappear I still scratch my head over with the only rational explanation is the mod thought - well he might be posting this to promote.

          However by that criteria ANYTHING about SEO from a SEO might be for that and meanwhile ANYONE who believes in sigs enough to buy an image sig (or even choose appealing sig text links) has an intent to show it.

          I've had some ideas - workshop kind of stuff but flip it. I know theres a fifty fifty chance I spend hours putting it together and it could be deleted under self promotional with zero links or words about any service of mine in the thread.

          I'm fine with it but again - if starting sharing thread is promotional then whats left than to have newbies ask questions?
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          • Profile picture of the author nik0
            Banned
            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            Dude I'd be willing to put down money that it was reported as a promotional thread not axed because some mod was invoking the case study rules. I might lose it but it would be a good bet.

            The real thing with self promotion is how do you define it. I am not going to lie - you have had some pretty obvious ones but heres the thing. It need not be obvious. Like I have said before I have seen thread disappear I still scratch my head over with the only rational explanation is the mod thought - well he might be posting this to promote.

            However by that criteria ANYTHING about SEO from a SEO might be for that and meanwhile ANYONE who believes in sigs enough to buy an image sig (or even choose appealing sig text links) has an intent to show it.

            I've had some ideas - workshop kind of stuff but flip it. I know theres a fifty fifty chance I spend hours putting it together and it could be deleted under self promotional with zero links or words about any service of mine in the thread.

            I'm fine with it but again - if starting sharing thread is promotional then whats left than to have newbies ask questions?
            This whole self promotional thing is as double as it can be.

            I don't care if people believe it or not, but I always use the exact same method to rank my own sites as i do for my clients so of course my services relates for the full 100 percent to what I talk about.

            Does that make it self promotional? Appearantly yes but when I apply every single thing that I preach to my own sites it's not solely for promotion purposes but more so cause I believe it works. It would be very hard for an SEO service provider in an SEO forum not to be self promotional. Look at Stallion who links out to his site in almost every single post cause he believes that his methods are the best and thus HIS site would be the best resource.

            I don't classify that as being overly self promotional, just believing in what you do.

            Heck you do the same thing talking down on public blog networks and your sig matches the perfect alternative so from that point of view we would all be self promotional.

            Now compare that to the WSO section, bunch of retards asking how to make money online with sig links make $250/day in 5 days time.
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            • Profile picture of the author Kevin Maguire
              Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

              This whole self promotional thing is as double as it can be.

              I don't care if people believe it or not, but I always use the exact same method to rank my own sites as i do for my clients so of course my services relates for the full 100 percent to what I talk about.

              Does that make it self promotional? Appearantly yes but when I apply every single thing that I preach to my own sites it's not solely for promotion purposes but more so cause I believe it works. It would be very hard for an SEO service provider in an SEO forum not to be self promotional. Look at Stallion who links out to his site in almost every single post cause he believes that his methods are the best and thus HIS site would be the best resource.

              I don't classify that as being overly self promotional, just believing in what you do.

              Heck you do the same thing talking down on public blog networks and your sig matches the perfect alternative so from that point of view we would all be self promotional.

              Now compare that to the WSO section, bunch of retards asking how to make money online with sig links make $250/day in 5 days time.
              I always took a hard line against the obvious self promotions that go on. We won't name any names but most people around here are familiar with the occasional WSO seller popping their heads in.

              I've gone apeshit sometimes flaming them. sometimes a little too far tbh.

              But in your case, I've usually given you a pass of sorts. I weight the added value you do give as an active member of this section. Against the occasional self promo looking post.

              Maybe others have the exact same motives you do, and maybe they are more subtle in their approach. It's really a case of added value.

              Any pms I get for seo providers, I've always referred them to you or Mike.
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              • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
                Originally Posted by Kevin Maguire View Post

                I always took a hard line against the obvious self promotions that go on. We won't name any names but most people around here are familiar with the occasional WSO seller popping their heads in.

                I've gone apeshit sometimes flaming them. sometimes a little too far tbh.
                Well to be clear heres what should forever be out

                A Study/thread all about your service or about ranking with using it. Thats an ad. plain and simple. Go buy a WSO.

                A Study/thread that refers back to your website - again thats an ad

                Judging by threads that have disappeared in the past - anything that might end up with someone saying - "hmm he really knows his stuff in this area - let me click his sig" - might get the ax (to be fair it didn't always but the possibility was/is a deterrent). This came really from the fakery that WF wasn't about making money for the owner bought so deeply by some that they felt someone selling something in a sig was inferior to someone selling nothing and the stupidest charge made so often that essentially implied marketing was suspect on a marketing forum.

                One of the things I like about Freelancer buying WF was it took that pretense away. A corporation IS about making money and on a marketing forum thats not something bad thats something to learn from. I say the same thing here I said in another thread which was about the war room. Want to bring back up quality stop trying to make sure no one derives any marketing benefit whatsoever from taking the time and effort to post quality threads. You wouldn't get anyone to do a WAMA if it had no benefit to them or had a 50/50 chance of getting deleted.
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            • Profile picture of the author SEO-Dave
              Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

              Look at Stallion who links out to his site in almost every single post cause he believes that his methods are the best and thus HIS site would be the best resource.

              I don't classify that as being overly self promotional, just believing in what you do.
              When I started to post regularly because the forum is nofollow (passes no SEO benefit) assumed there wouldn't be a problem linking to relevant resources on my site. Was wrong :-)

              Pretty much everything I've wrote here could have been dealt with via a link to one of my tutorials or comments with a simple covered that in great detail with images and examples at this URL(s). Just wrote something about how shite Yoast is, have half a dozen articles discussing how rubbish and SEO damaging Yoast is, but didn't link to one of them which means the reader of the forum misses out on an in-depth analysis why I believe something.

              Based on past experience of having one hand tied behind my back on newsgroups, forums, Facebook groups I'll get bored here soon and move back to only posting on my sites until I feel the need to argue with others again.

              It's a shame as I like arguing with people who disagree with me, makes you think about your view point and question any entrenched beliefs you have. Very easy to fall into the trap of believing you are always right which limits growth.

              See, no links to my site :-)

              David
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              • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
                Originally Posted by SEO-Dave View Post

                When I started to post regularly because the forum is nofollow (passes no SEO benefit) assumed there wouldn't be a problem linking to relevant resources on my site. Was wrong :-)
                OF course you were wrong. Linking back to your site IS promotional and trying to steal traffic. Not even debatable.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by Kevin Maguire View Post

      Dennis,

      If there where no noob question threads started over and over, then where would you get your client leads from?



      All forums are like this and that's just life.
      Heres the real question though - whats the alternative? Its not like I see senior members starting good threads. How come? questions or general observations are easier and safer.

      shucks starting a good thread can be a lot of work and if you actually do that and teach something or lead something your thread may be deleted or critiqued based on as we have seen here defended "intent".

      First Problem with rules based on intent is they are arbitrary and often wrong.

      Second problem is that they pretend that everybody here is not here for commercial intent. So far I don't seen many people here talking SEO for charities.

      I haven't seen any really good thread here for years. You have to go back to Terry Kyles thread which was a follow me thread, threads with the Laclear's where people were complaining about tone but taking notes like crazy or this other one where BMR (yeah that far back) was compared to others.

      Heres the thing. None of those threads would make it under the modding of the last year or two. so newbies stop asking questions then whats left thats good. Maybe the video posted earlier by yukon is the answer to that question
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      • Profile picture of the author Kevin Maguire
        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        So far I don't seen many people here talking SEO for charities.
        See my Sig

        There is an agenda behind most things, I had one but totally forgot what it was in all the fun I've had being "social"..

        I have as much commercial intent here as the man in the moon.

        I've never really shared anything, if it's worth sharing to begin with.

        I enjoy reading a few members postings.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
          Originally Posted by Kevin Maguire View Post

          See my Sig




          I see an ad for a VPS in your sig

          I have as much commercial intent here as the man in the moon.
          So you just here to learn and practice SEO for kicks and giggles? Nope.
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          • Profile picture of the author Kevin Maguire
            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            I see an ad for a VPS in your sig

            So you just here to learn and practice SEO for kicks and giggles? Nope.
            LOLZ.. Damn forgot that was there. Not even mine anymore. I do have below that a link to the Tim Pears needs a new kidney" WSO thread.

            I've learned nothing really here. One or two interesting twists and insights to existing knowledge but no revelations.

            Yukon taught me a lot about Video SEO, just by following him on the topic. Yourself and MikeA have given me some good insight into "ESN's"...

            GoY is spending more time around, and hes great craic...

            But this forum has moved miles away from being a learning center. There's been a huge dilution of skilled SEO. Those who I would rate anyway, and I've never rated anyone called Laclear.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              Originally Posted by Kevin Maguire View Post

              I've learned nothing really here. One or two interesting twists and insights to existing knowledge but no revelations.
              .
              You'll see less of that too if the old guard have their way. Everyone is always pointing out that if people happen to get exposure by starting threads then they will get free promo without paying ads but the flip side of that is seldom ever mentioned

              - why in the world would anyone share anything new or interesting of great value in a forum for free when they could sell it in a WSO? Theres a balance of course but to say well as long as someone MIGHT benefit from sharing in the forums by getting exposure then its to be discouraged is just counter productive.

              its basically telling marketers on a marketing forum that they should forget any idea of marketing and approach the forums 100% as a charity (but selling link sig image space counters that anyway).

              I guess one solution would be to create a whole Warrior room section with forums (Seo among them) since its not frowned in there to have any intent at any kind of exposure. I bet that SEO section would beat this one within a month. Sure you might see things questionable but thats what you have a community for
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      • Profile picture of the author Kevin Maguire
        Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

        Well I really don't get my leads from these type of people, trust me, nor would I want to,
        That was a total joke D. Only seeing now your posts being moved, I see it might not have sounded too funny.

        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        BMR (yeah that far back)
        I moved with a very old school group for years. We had a bunch of domains within almost all of the PBNs around, had a bunch of large ESNs. The vast majority survived the hits, but over time the group fell apart. Each moving off into bigger and better things. That's what happens in this game, like waves crashing on the shore. We are the beach pools who keep hanging around.

        Most of the old guard here really undervalue their ability. Some of you are 2 years ahead of the competition. Being 2 years ahead you should know by then that, sharing is no longer caring when it comes to some things.
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        • Profile picture of the author nik0
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Kevin Maguire View Post

          That was a total joke D. Only seeing now your posts being moved, I see it might not have sounded too funny.
          Most jokes contain a certain sense of truth and it didn't piss me off or anything though.

          You know I used to sell a package for $19 for a while? It was called secret sauce while in fact it was just a PAD submission. Sold like crazy, and it was crazy effective to rank so called micro-niche sites that were optimized for long tails with say 1k exact searches.

          That was about 2 years ago I think and it stopped working after 6 months if I remember correctly.

          Now that type of services do attract a shit load of noobs.

          But that's why I always get a bit tired of this self promotional nonsense. If people are looking to buy a sewing machine they ain't gonna check out sewing machine forums, instead they head over to Amazon, a review site or a classified ads site, with SEO the same thing, most run directly to the for sales sections. I say it again but that's why you don't see most link providers participating here, There is simply no need for it and it's far from as profitable as most think. When I add up all the hours I spend in this sub forum I could have done much more profitable things with my time. But I like posting, for me it's a hobby. The more you see me post, the more actively I work on my business, when you don't see me post much I am in complete party mode WF is just a good distraction in between mostly boring work.

          Only in the beginning when I created an account I really saw it as a job to increase my post and thanks count to not make it appear like I just started brand new. Many were later surprised that I was only 3 months a member based on my post count of 1000+ or something.
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    Well, there certainly is no perfect solution.

    I never thought they should have been totally banned. Wasn't up to me though.

    That being said, they certainly can turn into lightening rods for childish fighting and total blatant self-promotion. The self-promotion on a forum like this is a problem because the more people I can direct to my own site to buy something, the less likely I am to buy an ad.
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    You can argue about self-promotion all you want, but you know if it was your forum you wouldn't want people trying to funnel traffic away from it to their own site. If a person leaves the forum, they are less likely to buy a product here.

    You can say you have better answers to questions on your own site, but those are people I would want to stay here even more. Someone who has a question or problem might find a product that gives them a solution in the sales section and buys something here.

    Of course, since the search function has been broken for months, good luck to them finding anything they want to search for, but you get what I mean.
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

      You can say you have better answers to questions on your own site, but those are people I would want to stay here even more. Someone who has a question or problem might find a product that gives them a solution in the sales section and buys something here.
      If we go that road I have an even better idea.

      Only allow sig links to promote paid sales threads.
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      • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
        Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

        If we go that road I have an even better idea.

        Only allow sig links to promote paid sales threads.
        I get that, and I'm sure it is something management has considered, both old and new. The problem is you need a balance between attracting users and generating sales.

        I'm sure signature links are an enticement to some people to join and participate here.
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        • Profile picture of the author nik0
          Banned
          Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

          I get that, and I'm sure it is something management has considered, both old and new. The problem is you need a balance between attracting users and generating sales.

          I'm sure signature links are an enticement to some people to join and participate here.
          They wouldn't have to forbid any other in-post links.

          Make the sig links dofollow, that builds a nice amount of relevancy as most like to post in threads that are closely related to their service anyway and nofollow the in-post links and perhaps take measures against the one who over do it (probably too hard to build something in like max 1 in post link per 50 posts.).

          That way the sales threads start to rank better in Google as well and thus it attracts more organic traffic.

          Another benefit is that people's services can be judged/reviewed by people, which is impossible on external sites.

          I just came up with this idea cause today I bought 2 WSO's and they were completely useless to me and both advertised in the banners on this forum, they were just $10 so I didn't care much, just bought out of curiosity. If I bought them through a sales thread I would definitely have left a review though.
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          • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
            Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

            They wouldn't have to forbid any other in-post links.

            Make the sig links dofollow, that builds a nice amount of relevancy as most like to post in threads that are closely related to their service anyway and nofollow the in-post links and perhaps take measures against the one who over do it (probably too hard to build something in like max 1 in post link per 50 posts.).
            Considering the search function has been broken on and off for 4 months or so, yeah coding something like that is probably not going to happen.

            Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

            I just came up with this idea cause today I bought 2 WSO's and they were completely useless to me and both advertised in the banners on this forum, they were just $10 so I didn't care much, just bought out of curiosity. If I bought them through a sales thread I would definitely have left a review though.
            You should leave honest reviews in those threads. I think too many people buy stuff that is junk, and figure it was only a few bucks so why bother leaving a review. If more honest reviews were left throughout the WSO section, it would raise the quality of products being offered.

            It's your choice Dennis. You bought the products. But if people keep letting marketers get away with offering total junk, it will never get better.

            And it's not just you. It's been going on in that section for years.
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            • Profile picture of the author nik0
              Banned
              Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

              You should leave honest reviews in those threads. I think too many people buy stuff that is junk, and figure it was only a few bucks so why bother leaving a review. If more honest reviews were left throughout the WSO section, it would raise the quality of products being offered.

              It's your choice Dennis. You bought the products. But if people keep letting marketers get away with offering total junk, it will never get better.

              And it's not just you. It's been going on in that section for years.
              You misunderstand me, it was advertised through banners at the top of the page and the link lead to an external site so no way to leave a review.
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              • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
                Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

                You misunderstand me, it was advertised through banners at the top of the page and the link lead to an external site so no way to leave a review.
                My fault. You're right. I missed that.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

        If we go that road I have an even better idea.

        Only allow sig links to promote paid sales threads.
        Nothing better about that idea. For those who pay for ads in their sig they want it to go where they want it to go. Plus there are a lot of people that don't want to be associated with WSOs
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        • Profile picture of the author nik0
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

          Nothing better about that idea. For those who pay for ads in their sig they want it to go where they want it to go. Plus there are a lot of people that don't want to be associated with WSOs
          There's something to say about that for sure.

          They could make an exception for people who pay for their sig, yeah it's getting a bit messy now lol.
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    • Profile picture of the author SEO-Dave
      Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

      You can argue about self-promotion all you want, but you know if it was your forum you wouldn't want people trying to funnel traffic away from it to their own site. If a person leaves the forum, they are less likely to buy a product here.

      You can say you have better answers to questions on your own site, but those are people I would want to stay here even more. Someone who has a question or problem might find a product that gives them a solution in the sales section and buys something here.

      Of course, since the search function has been broken for months, good luck to them finding anything they want to search for, but you get what I mean.
      I agree with the business perspective of reducing users leaving the forum, however if a forum is to thrive it needs people with expert levels of knowledge to answer questions.

      To attract that sort of person requires giving them something in return.

      Some are happy with no direct benefit a simple thank you from users they help is enough, others expect paying direct with cash.

      Guess it depends how badly a forum wants/needs users with expert knowledge. I'm currently testing how effective giving away free SEO advice here converts to sales of Stallion Responsive (not sure yet, not enough data) while enjoying arguing over SEO techniques that work/don't work.

      My agenda is clear, I want to convert forum members to paying customers, some of the rules makes this harder, but not impossible.

      Also plan to test the $100 a day banner ads here, one sale a day would be worthwhile.

      I find on most forums the level of SEO knowledge is appalling from the regulars. I've seen it here with regulars arguing over SEO techniques that haven't worked in over 5 years. For example anyone who thinks they are in anyway an SEO expert that believes nofollow doesn't cause SEO damage shouldn't be allowed near a website owned by a serious business.

      Even when presented with the evidence they blindly stick to their entrenched out of date views because it suits their agenda.

      I also know being confrontational with regulars is generally not the way to gain friends, can't help myself, I enjoy a heated debate.

      David
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      • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
        Originally Posted by SEO-Dave View Post

        I agree with the business perspective of reducing users leaving the forum, however if a forum is to thrive it needs people with expert levels of knowledge to answer questions.

        Guess it depends how badly a forum wants/needs users with expert knowledge.
        Well, they've grown to the largest internet marketing forum on the planet doing it the way they have done it, so I suppose their strategy works.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Originally Posted by SEO-Dave View Post

        . I'm currently testing how effective giving away free SEO advice here converts to sales of Stallion Responsive (not sure yet, not enough data) while enjoying arguing over SEO techniques that work/don't work.

        My agenda is clear, I want to convert forum members to paying customers, some of the rules makes this harder, but not impossible.
        Your theme is garbage and you offer no expertise on SEO (and yep thats the other part to this - members should be allowed to say certain things as a way of pointing out the junk - make everyone know they better come strong or go home) and if you go to themeforest it might dawn on you why that (the theme part) is so.

        I''ll give MikeF this - you are like the poster child for what he is concerned would happen but on the other hand you are a dead giveaway the way you keep mentioning your nonsense theme so theres that.
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        • Profile picture of the author SEO-Dave
          Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

          Your theme is garbage and you offer no expertise on SEO (and yep thats the other part to this - members should be allowed to say certain things as a way of pointing out the junk - make everyone know they better come strong or go home) and if you go to themeforest it might dawn on you why that (the theme part) is so.

          I''ll give MikeF this - you are like the poster child for what he is concerned would happen but on the other hand you are a dead giveaway the way you keep mentioning your nonsense theme so theres that.
          And that's what occurs when you disagree with the entrenched views of those who have been on a forum for years and think they are experts because they post a lot.

          PageSpeed Insights

          You have a very nice looking site with shite on-page SEO. A theme with nice features does not mean it's an SEO theme, no one serious about SEO would argue a flashy website is better optimized than a less flashy design.

          Your on-site SEO is a joke

          site:dropkickseo.com

          Don't tell me, you aren't actually doing SEO on your own sites :-)

          Revolutionary SEO ROFLOL

          David
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          • Profile picture of the author jinx1221
            Originally Posted by SEO-Dave View Post

            Don't tell me, you aren't actually doing SEO on your own sites :-)

            Revolutionary SEO ROFLOL
            Might surprise you to realize that some people don't On-Site Seo for the mere fact that they aren't necessarily Seo'ing their site - their customer base and future prospects aren't being looked for or obtained in the Serps.. but you should know a bit about that point of view, according to your blatant admission about why you post long winded mini-wso's here to begin with, shouldn't you, Stallion

            Originally Posted by SEO-Dave View Post

            My agenda is clear, I want to convert forum members to paying customers, some of the rules makes this harder, but not impossible.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              Originally Posted by jinx1221 View Post

              but you should know a bit about that point of view, according to your blatant admission about why you post long winded mini-wso's here to begin with, shouldn't you, Stallion
              You know what? I am going to give Mike points on his self promotion argument. I still think we should differentiate in some tangible way and not throw everybody under the bus by the same stroke - but like I said old Dave is the poster child for the argument and he came along to remind me how silly some people can self promote.

              Still.... Pretty stupid to come on a forum and say you are here simply on a mission to redirect traffic to your own site and willing to work around the rules to make it happen. He is honest but not too bright.
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              • Profile picture of the author SEO-Dave
                Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

                Still.... Pretty stupid to come on a forum and say you are here simply on a mission to redirect traffic to your own site and willing to work around the rules to make it happen. He is honest but not too bright.
                Didn't say simply to redirect traffic, said to test the effectiveness of converting giving free SEO advice whilst having fun debating SEO techniques. I do enjoy heated debates a LOT.

                Next test will be see how paid traffic here converts. I'll even write something about it on my site, discussing how many sales I got from both, will be interesting to test.

                So you participate on a forum generating over 9,000 responses because of your purely altruistic nature. You should change your name to Mother Teresa.

                You'll generate loads of interest from forum users and some will buy something from you. It's called self promotion and if you didn't benefit from your time here you wouldn't spend so much of it posting thousands of posts all of which have links to your poorly SEO'd site via the sig.

                I guess you don't have what it takes to generate Google SERPs related to SEO services. I understand, there's a lot of competition in the SEO niche, you've got around having to rank in Google to generate leads by filling this forum with over 9,000 responses.

                Note: I admire your approach, if you can make a living this way, good for you, but be honest about it.

                David
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                • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
                  Originally Posted by SEO-Dave View Post

                  You'll generate loads of interest from forum users and some will buy something from you.
                  Ummm really????...I gots to try that sometime. Bubba and I could finally buy that shrimp boat. Jenny would like that... a lot.

                  I guess you don't have what it takes to generate Google SERPs related to SEO services. I understand, there's a lot of competition in the SEO niche, you've got around having to rank in Google to generate leads by filling this forum with over 9,000 responses.
                  Okay since you are CLEARLY not intelligent to figure it out by yourself. Let me help you out - Because we say we don't do SEO for our WF facing sites doesn't mean thats all the sites we have.


                  Note: I admire your approach, if you can make a living this way, good for you, but be honest about it.
                  Some of us have made a bit here building a rep helping people. I don't know why we didn't think to tell everyone we were just here to get the forum's traffic. Besides the fact that

                  A) it wasn't our only goal
                  B) it would just be a stupid way to promote.

                  But please continue with the test. You are doing so well building your rep.

                  I do enjoy heated debates a LOT.
                  hehhehehe.....Its like the poor guy has never read around to know who he's talking to.....

                  Let me know when you warm up.
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          • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
            Originally Posted by SEO-Dave View Post

            And that's what occurs when you disagree with the entrenched views of those who have been on a forum for years and think they are experts because they post a lot.

            PageSpeed Insights

            You have a very nice looking site with shite on-page SEO. A theme with nice features does not mean it's an SEO theme, no one serious about SEO would argue a flashy website is better optimized than a less flashy design.

            Your on-site SEO is a joke

            site:dropkickseo.com

            Don't tell me, you aren't actually doing SEO on your own sites :-)

            Revolutionary SEO ROFLOL

            David
            That has become your answer to every argument. Run sites through Google's pagespeed insights tool.

            It's getting a little old.

            Most of the sites people keep in their signatures they would never consider doing SEO on. I'm not going to leave something in the open on an SEO forum for people to reverse engineer. That would be dumb.
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          • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
            Originally Posted by SEO-Dave View Post

            You have a very nice looking site with shite on-page SEO. A theme with nice features does not mean it's an SEO theme, no one serious about SEO would argue a flashy website is better optimized than a less flashy design.
            I'd give this kid the newbie of the month award but he's not even original

            Thanks for demonstrating how clueless you are. It backs up my point.

            Its a well known fact I have stated several times over the years that

            I DO ABSOLUTELY NO SEO TO MY WF FACING SITES

            ROFL.....Only newbs would try to rank SEO related terms with WF facing sites where everyone tries to look up their links

            Reverse engineering. look it up one day. Like I said you are not the first to think they had me on my WF sites (three since I have been here and none SEOed).

            Welcome to the hall of shame.
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  • Profile picture of the author jezter6
    SEO forums are probably destined to fail out of principle based on most of what was said here.

    Between the people creating new accounts and asking basic stupid questions just to get their link in there (and yes, I think most of these "newbie" threads are either manual or bot spam), the obvious and not so obvious self promotion, and people not wanting to reveal working methods for fear of people abusing it...what actual conversation can there be?
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    • Profile picture of the author jinx1221
      Originally Posted by jezter6 View Post

      SEO forums are probably destined to fail out of principle based on most of what was said here.

      Between the people creating new accounts and asking basic stupid questions just to get their link in there (and yes, I think most of these "newbie" threads are either manual or bot spam), the obvious and not so obvious self promotion, and people not wanting to reveal working methods for fear of people abusing it...what actual conversation can there be?
      It's the uneducated that think they're going to get some sort of Seo value out of their keyword ridden sig links (maybe no way around that, unless they go all paid sigbox links) Don't mind much about, you know, promoting your site or ebook or whatever, but like, bestpurplepantyhose.com. Really?

      The ones that get me are the ones that offer "Professional Seo" services in their sigbox, asking questions like "I just bought Spambot pro and Keywordspy, and want to provide Seo services". Umm, nothing too much to say about those except, what the actual f*ck?
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